Is it true that it's al-Ghazali who damaged Islam beyond repair?
>>837860
From what I understand, he certainly had a hand with the turn toward mysticism. However, it's a trend for any intellectual movements in decay, so even if he didn't exist, someone else would probably occupy similar role as a critic of Islamic 'rationalist' philosophy.
He was notorious for accusing philosophers as heretic/atheists. That kind of legacy, of being suspicious toward philosophy schools, still exists even now in the form of baseless prejudices.
>influenced Aquinas
>influenced Kant
He damaged the world beyond repair desu
>>837911
Yeah, because of those faggots, philosophy/theology became pure autism.
>>837860
No, that was Muhammed
>>837860
You can't destroy something when you make it greater. Al-ghazali's works are by far some the best of Islamic thought and all rational methods worldwide
Al-Wahhab
>>838080
>I know nothing about the islamic thought history but I must be edgy
>>837860
>tfw when you know nothing about him
That would be acceptable if I wasn't a Muslim.
>>838179
>back to the roots
>by destroying heritage things Muhammad and co. had no problems with.
Wahhabism is the biggest innovation out there, fancy dressed as "back to the roots" movement.
>>838179
>How to spot tranny fucking saud.
>>838095
>Not Ibn Rushd
>>838175
Don't feel bad because he was a sufi most of his works are hidden due to the new literalist way of thinking
>>838189
Not gonna lie I have no idea he existed as I've only studied Ghazali, Arabi, Nawawi
why is he so based
>>838189
Good book or introduction to him. Monopsychism sounds awesome
>>838201
His ideas were mostly against Al-Ghazali's
>Whereas al-Ghazali believed that any individual act of a natural phenomenon occurred only because God willed it to happen, Ibn Rushd insisted phenomena followed natural laws that God created.
He was ahead of his time imo
>>838229
I can see why he isn't as well known. Personally I agree with Ghazali's reasoning because even though the natural laws exist the energy to activate them must be in constant motion and for certain events to occur seemingly at random feels rather simplified than for the energy to be guided by God's will
>>838236
It seems like he countered by ghazali by saying God indirectly interferes rather then directly
>>838179
Wahhabis have the same mentality as Yazid, definitely not the grass roots of Islam.
>>838183
Actually it's not. They have some claim with bringing things back to the original roots considering before them and even today a good number of Muslims are Sufis who would do things forbidden in standard fiqh
No.
That was Britain and France's doing during and just after WW1.
Before their perfidious actions in the middle east. Islam was rather chill compared to today.
Though the European imperial ambitions turned Wahhabi Muslims from the rednecks of the Middle East into the driving force.
>>837860
Is that another name for Mohammad? If not, then no.
Nope.
Pic related is who you are looking for.
>>837893
>tfw I just wrongly quoted him as being persecuted for rationalist philosophy in the paper I just submitted an hour ago
Thought the Almoravids was the conservative guy for banning his works
>>838236
??
Averroes is more well known than Ghazali, and then some.
>>838179
>Wahhabism.
بدعة في لباس شريعة
>>837860
Who was the one responsible for stating that the Qu'ran is literally the Word of God, instead of simply inspired, and those that strays, interprets, or suggests differently is an apostate? It was that moment when the possibility of Islam going through reformation, like Judaism or Christianity, was ruined.
>>838419
Not quite western cultural encroachment has also had the effect of making Muslims fight back against the west
>>838673
Not here he isn't
>>838840
That's Abu Hanbal, he was a brilliant linguist and honestly one of the brightest theological scholars of all time
Step aside, plebs
..
>>838840
It's the combination of mainstream Muslim scholars who made the Mu'tazila decline into oblivion from the 10th Century onwards.
The Mu'tazila was the one chance Islam had for a reformation into a religion of reason, a chance that would have even anticipated not only the Reformation and Maimonides, but even the great schisms in Christianity.
The Kalam cosmological argument comes from on of their schools, by the way.
Instead, Islam would eventually have another Reformation, in 18th Century: Wahhabism, which restored 7th Century morals, legalism and fundamentalism.
ISIS, and Saudi Arabia where the holiest places of Islam are located, are Wahhabists/Salafis.
>>838673
>Averroes is more well known than Ghazali in the West
FTFY
>>839895
A return to Mu'tazilism might follow the current literalist chaos.
>>837860
Damaged? Hell, no. He was incisive and brilliant. A critique guided by logic. Yes, he was quite hard to Hellenistic influence on Saracen philosophy, but this was an exposed position to debate, not an imposition on anyone's head.
At the same time, even incurring many misconceptions and fallacies, much of his work had great and beneficial importance to the development of philosophy and law.
>>839725
Dammaged Islam how? He was based AF.
>>838179
>Literal Wahhabists on my /his/
We need to build a firewall and have ISIS pay for it
>>839895
>Mutazili
Fuck off and choke on Sagans dick.
>>840915
How's that Saudi dick taste? Wouldn't want the King to not be able to maximize bis profits, so you best keep slurping it down!
>>837860
It was Abu Bakr to be honest
>>838179
>An abrahamic religion
>A religion stemming from and building upon Christianity and Judaism
>muh greek and persion influence
You literally can't have Islam without Greek and Persian influence. The two religions that Islam would not have existed without both borrow from these and others.
>>840606
he doesnt know what hes talking about. he even spelt the name wrong.
>>838286
Aren't the Yazidis the ones who believe in Malak Taus and aren't even Muslim?
>>838698
>fad in dress law
A fad masquerading as authentic?
Is it "a fad in the dress of law" and Arabic has no articles?
>>840915
>sagan
Try CK2 famalam.
>>841378
>and aren't even Muslim?
Yeah, if you believe Takfiri fucking shits.
>>841438
And Wikipedia.
Do Yazidis even follow the Koran or Muhammad?
>>837911
Ghazali is interesting insofar as his ideas can be traced forward to Hume. Basically Ghazali originates the whole idea that causation must involve necessary entailment between cause and effect, which we can't actually find in the world, leads him to say that the only thing that could be a cause is God insofar as he is omniscient and anything that he wills must necessarily happen- and thus anything apart from his will will be disrupted by his will and cannot be necessary. Malebranche picks this line up, and Hume adopts the modal condition on causation from Malebranche, but decides that instead of there being no cause but God, there is simply no causation at all.
>>841467
His descendents claimed to, but in reality they were the same people the prophet tried to convert from their barbarism
>>841944
>His descendents
Whose descendants?
>>841959
Yazid
>>841965
Yazid was a caliph, not the founder of Yazidism.
>>838189
>tfw he's the most neglected philosopher in the Islamic World
>tfw only Europe gave a shit about him because of his commentaries on Aristotle
>>838179
When you think of the period ibn-Taymiyah lived in, it's kinda understandable why he would think the way he did:
>Mongols destroying the Abbasid caliphate and Khawarizm
>Crusaders attacking the Levant
>Shiites welcoming and helping the Mongols
I don't get why his thoughts are still relevant today though
>>838210
pic is ibn-Sina
>Is it true that it's al-Ghazali who damaged Islam beyond repair?
>Is it true that it's ibn Taymiyya who damaged Islam beyond repair?
>Is it true that it's al-Ash'ari who damaged Islam beyond repair?
While all of them disagree with each other, all regarded as foundation of my country traditional islam.
>>838179
out of curiosity, what Greek and Persian influences?
>>838179
>free without any greeks and persian shitters influence
wasn't ghazali a persian?
>>842536
>all regarded as foundation of my country traditional islam.
Which is?
>>842673
Most sunni countries
>>838179
>t. angry Arab who still thinks the west is crusading against him
Mohammad is a pig.
>>843238
He's an autist pedo that keeps sperging on /int/ and /pol/, wonder how the FBI didn't pick him up yet
If I wanted to learn about Muslim/Islam history, where would be a good place to start? The Quran?
>>841387
Translation: Bid'ah dressed as Shariah.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bid%E2%80%98ah
>>843299
Please tell me that's not the Iranian samrafag.
>>844263
not the Quran.
A History of the Modern Middle East - Cleveland
In the Shadow of the Sword - Holland
for entry level knowledge and backstory
then look for specific stuff on the major eras, Moham, Rashidun, Uma, Abbasid, Ottoman
>>844263
9/11 Memorial.
>>840637
how bout we just drop a few bombs and give some aid to Syria
>>838179
Wahabism/Salafism is literally dogshit, m8. Nothing but a political vehicle for Saudi trannyfuckers
>>838179
good post
>>844263
I would recommend Muhammad and the Believers by Fred Donner as a good entry to the beginning of Islam, and The Unmaking of the Middle East by Jeremy Salt on what lead to the current events of the middle east.
>>844497
>In the Shadow of the Sword - Holland
Hasn't this book been criticized by historians for not being accurate?
>>841323
filthy dumb shiite scum
>>837921
Have you even read Kant or Aquinas?
>>838179
>Islam
>No Persian influence
It comes from Judaism, and that was heavily influenced by Zoroastrianism, Persia's original religion.
>>844263
For the history during the time of revelation
There's a new textbook called 'Revelation: the story of prophet Muhammad'
It basically puts together all the major English siirah books, both Muslim and non-Muslim into one book
Would recommend
It doesn't talk about anything after the prophet dies though, obviously
>>838179
>persian shitters influence
>ghazali is persian.
>>837893
Not sure if mysticism is something to be criticised.
Sufism and Islamic mysticism in general actually encourages self-improvement and philosophical debate rather than the Wahhabist idea of OBEY OR DIE.
>>845836
Yes.
>>838179
ibn tamiyyah and wahab were jews
salafism = jews
>you both do niqab
>you both stone adulterers
>you both kill apostates
>you both believe god has a figure
no better than the shias
