Assume that your ancestors used to be monarchs. Do you have any right to feel proud about it ? Or you feel ashamed for being such a worthless creature despite your origin ?
Literally the definition of "nobility" was inherent superiority.
So yes you would and should feel proud.
Not that it matters.
>>769162
fuck off /pol/ and no you shouldn't be proud about stuff other people did just because they looked like you or were born inside the same borders as you. You have only the right to feel proud about what you made yourself
>>769185
Not once did he mention race or nationalism. Wtf is with you people and your /pol/ bogeyman?
>>769217
>posting pic related
>not /pol/tard
how new are you?
>>769225
>getting buttblasted over a barbosa image
>>769225
Barbossa transcends boards
>>769244
>shitposting in the history section of a Laotion underwater basket weaving forum
>>769162
I wouldn't really feel either proud or ashamed. It certainly doens't have any bearing on my life whether they were kings or commoners.
Honestly, I think I would just kind of go "cool", maybe tell some of my friends if there's an opening for it.
>muh ancestors
is retarded
>>769225
Barbosa is an /int/ meme dipshit.
My clan members used to be great landlords for generations, till the Communism came and swipe all of that, i feel like i'm a fallen prince now.
>>769162
It depends on the stock I'm from and the residual wealth or bonuses involved. If there's no hemophilia and you get good looks based off your ancestors getting the hottest women, that's cool. If you get connections, money, houses/land from it, that is also awesome. If your line was full of weak or poor rulers and you receive no tangible benefits, i'd rather just be a pleb.
>>769185
Please continue to defend the board by posting in threads you think are bad and taking them down a level. We need more like you.
>>769283
so damm accurate, is more often than not idiots who do this.
>guy has not read a book in his life
>start talkin about goethe
>muhheritage.jpg
This is literally everyone on /pol. It's gotten so bad I hope it reaches a critical mass.
Exhibit A:
>My 23andMe demographics show I have 2 6.5% Basque ancestry. Can someone fill me in how based they were and what they achieved?
Exhibit B:
>Post your family's crest (proceeds to Google last name and crest simultaneously).
Exhibit C:
>I'm not a [insert religion here] but I support it anyways because my ancestors were of that religion hence it's tied to our culture (muh Deus vult).
Exhibit D:
>I'm an American and my great great great great grandparents were German Catholics from Bavaria. What are some good cultural anecdotes I can see to help me revisit my people?
Literally culture otherkins. Culturekins.
>>769394
>finding ways to drag in /pol/
This is worse than /k/ Jesus. Also theres nothing wrong if thats what your ancestors did, if thats your heritage you literally cannot change it, all you can do is accept it.
Also stop treating /pol/ like an interest board, it is in every way /new/ and the retarded subjects and titles you see are just there to get your attention. Its 4chans political news outlet and its about as offensive and attention whoring as you would think, Newfag.
And I thought /his/ was getting better.
This /pol/ boogeyman shit needs to stop
>>769423
This board is literally not /pol/ with dates. We don't want shitposts here.
>>769457
Raise the level of the conversation or sage. We don't want shitposts... so we will respond to them with shitposts.
>>769457
Not him but, The only shitposting I've seen here so far is the /pol/ boogeyman shitposters.
aka "you"
t. /int/ user who decided to check out /his/
>>769478
You can and will never discern them which is the root of a problem that will never be solved. This is what I wanted to point out.
>>769162
You should feel ashamed of your ancestors for exploiting people through the immoral system that is monarchy.
>>769162
Most of my ancestors were farmers and fishermen.
Except for my great-grandfather on my mother's side who was a scholar that decided to become a teacher.
If I am truly descended from nobility, then the line would have been stretched so thin that it is no longer applicable to call myself as such
knowledge helps us navigate environments but i wouldn't say its something to be noteworthily proud of but theres never any harm in feeling good. the more sustainably long term the better.
They were.
I don't feel a shit.
>>769162
Literally everyone descends from some sort of monarch.
For some perspective, 35 million people descend from 24 Mayflower settlers from 1620. Multiple people in that group of 24 have traceable noble heritage. I guarantee you their children and grandchildren all fucked each other, causing all 35 million people descending from them to have noble blood. This is just one objective example in a sea of thousands. Only a portion of dirt colored people in the southern hemisphere who descend solely from tribal societies don't have noble blood.
>>770338
So everyone wuz kangz now ?
>descendant of scottish nobility
>Work at fedex trying to pay my fucking bills
Thanks England
>family lost shitloads of land and pretty important titles in the 20th century when the monarchy was abolished and the state fucked nobility in the ass
>just get to keep the name and some contacts which are used to accumulate some wealth
My ancestry is mostly a story to tell but I guess I can't deny the financial benefits. Also I don't think you should be proud but thankful for all the shit they have done that contributed to your wellbeing today.
>>769162
Would feel pretty proud, yes.
>>769185
That's retarded, you know that
The moment you stop being proud of your people, your country ceases to exist
And yes, you have the right to. Why would you not? You are their descendant. You share their blood, you live in places they built, enjoying the benefits they gave you because you were their children. It's pretty much a duty to be proud of the people who gave their life for you.
>>769162
It means I am statistically more likely to have genetics associated with rising to power, it doesn't mean I should feel proud, but it can help me decide on the best career path.
It would be cool, certainly, but I wouldn't be proud of it.
>>770897
Pride is idiotic, and not because you shouldn't be amazed at what came before you and what it left behind or you shouldn't love the works of your "ancestors"- but because you have no merit in the matter and, as >>769368 points out, more often than not what you're doing is plundering others' achievement to mask yourself and your lack of accomplishments (the you, here, is impersonal - I don't know and don't care about your situation, just making a wider point).
And before someone tries to invalidate my opinion by saying shit like durr, you have no culture, I'm Italian, I live in Venice, I study philosophy. When I wake up in the morning I see St. Mark square. When I wander around the countryside, I find Roman ruins. When I study, I read Kant and Aristotle and Caesar. I love all of these things, I love the idea of these being my "spiritual lineage". To be merely proud of them is a betrayal - what you do is live up to it, create something someone sometime will look at the same way you look at this wonderful cultural ancestry.
>>770946
And let me add, just to spite people in this thread more, that this is the reason why I'm a Leftist - because we try to create, while the Right (in its loosest sense) merely wants to preserve.
>>769162
>liking monarchy
SIC SEMPER TYRANNUS
>>770946
>what you do is live up to it, create something someone sometime will look at the same way you look at this wonderful cultural ancestry.
So you do feel pride about it, since it galvanized you into aspiring to be the same as your ancestors.
You seem to think pride is inherently evil, which it is not. Pride pushes you to reach for the same heights your ancestors did.
>but because you have no merit in the matter and, as >>769368 points out, more often than not what you're doing is plundering others' achievement to mask yourself and your lack of accomplishments
But you do. You are the children of the people who built it. You are the one maintaining what they left behind. They gave you this heritage to cherish and inspire you.
Pride is "the love of one's own excellence". Why should a people not be proud of what it has left behind?
>>770987
I don't think pride is inherently evil - I think it's limited - better, I think that which passes for pride around here (and in multiple instances I was witness irl), the mere act of acknowledging one's ancestry and be content with that, is limited and limiting.
The way I see it, and that's my philosophical "belief", any human being is made up of the narrations (and everything is a narration or is narrated to be experienced) that happened to converge in him, by chace or choice. I AM those things I am proud (because I do feel pride, but it's not where I "stop") - that's where you start. Then you go on to create something else. We are agreeing, it seems to me, in this respect - what I wanted to express, with my post, was my utter hatred of those who are JUST proud, which is mere survival. If pride pushes you onward, lets you become a Creator (in a Nietzschean way), then I'm all for it. If it's an excuse, you are worthless.
And I'll just address your last question - as you may have gathered from my ramblings, I see the individual as the basis of Being: this means I can welcome pride on an individual basis but I find it meaningless and artificial when it's forcibly extended to "a people", as you said, but I feel much the same in every respect so that's ideology, while still a valid (I feel) answer.
[spoiler]I'm happy to be having this civil conversation about this topic - it's kind of bridging the stupidly aphasic void between contrasting ideologies that, in the end, may still be able to communicate and agree on something. That is, because I assume your political views are different from mine - if this assumption is wrong, do forgive me.[/spoiler]
>>771049
Then we agree. But I think even in the people who limit themselves, pride is a symptom and not the cause. I don't believe it can be misplaced, unless it is false pride, of course.
> but I find it meaningless and artificial when it's forcibly extended to "a people"
I disagree. It's a great way for people to be united that to feel pride in the same things. While a few if any single person can take pride in something, a people, a culture can, because they are the same as the people who did it.
>That is, because I assume your political views are different from mine - if this assumption is wrong, do forgive me.
I assumed you were some sort of liberal?
I don't have any forged political opinion, but I tend to be authoritarian. In an englightened despotism sort of way.
>>769162
Assume your ancestors had a similar skin color to you. Do you have any right to feel pride in their achievements and denigrate others for them?
Blame whites for starting this shit, not the dumb black folks looking desperately for something to improve the quality of their shitty past. They're more correct than the average /pol/tard.
>>771086
>pride is a symptom and not the cause
Care to elaborate?
>It's a great way for people to be united that to feel pride in the same things
I'd like to ask, as it is one of my main philosophical interests - why base this "covenant" on being a people?
By that I mean: I do think it's great to share pride with other people, to live with these people and by common effort create something greater than each one of us on its own could - but why base this on a mere "accident of geography" or birth? I may think this because, when I look around me, I see those who'd be supposed to share my "spiritual ancestry" and most of them I find undeserving, lazy, worthless fucks who don't give a shit about that which makes up their own identity (meant as I tried to explain above) - while I've met people, from outside both my culture and nation, who shared my love and passion (I'm mainly referring to philosophy, but the same discourse can be had, I believe, for every component of one's identity) far more strongly.
Wouldn't it be better, utopically so, if you will, to be able to create a people anew - a people born of kindred spirits, of shared ideals? A sort of new tribalism, if you like.
>I assumed you were some sort of liberal?
Eh, nah. A Leftie, yeah, but trust me when I say that people outside the anglosphere find this kind of "activism" revolting, soulless and downright hypocritical.
>>771120
>Do you have any right to feel pride in their achievements
Yes.
>and denigrate others for them?
That's not pride.
>Blame whites for starting this shit, not the dumb black folks looking desperately for something to improve the quality of their shitty past. They're more correct than the average /pol/tard.
The thing is that africans do have things of worth in their past, but they don't even know about them. They'd rather talk about how Egyptians may have been black when they are not even related to them, instead of shit like Musa 1 of Mali.
>>771133
What I mean is that people who have pride and pride only, in a negative way as you described earlier, use pride to pretend they did something because they could not themselves. Pride is not at fault here, except for being used as a filler.
>Wouldn't it be better, utopically so, if you will, to be able to create a people anew - a people born of kindred spirits, of shared ideals? A sort of new tribalism, if you like.
I don't know, but it's sort of happening right now in the EU. I hate it, because it erases existing cultures, languages, and ways of life.
>>771158
>I don't know, but it's sort of happening right now in the EU. I hate it, because it erases existing cultures, languages, and ways of life.
Well, not really. It's not happening or at least, not how I'd like it or how I described it - what I would like to see is the possibility for someone to autonomously choose which "tribe" to live in. You could choose to stay with people who speak your language and live in your nation or you could have another ideal you think of as more important and then choose to live it with people from other nations. If cultures are being lost (and I'm against that as everybody I know is) I think it's more due to the reification/commodification of beliefs and cultures operated by state politics (of any creed).
A solution, at least for me, is to take matters into our own hands and become more autonomous, separated from the state. For example, the autonomous movement I'm a part of organizes, every three days or so, some kind of homegrown vegetable market. You grow your shit, you bring it there, you barter with people. It's a small-scale example, but that's how you keep your culture (I live in a traditionally agriculture-based part of Italy) alive, not by making it a thing or a set of beliefs, but by living it yourself - or having at least the possibility, were you to choose so.
>>771143
Strawman. Most realize those empires existed.
Also, Egyptians were never white. Even Macedonian Greeks weren't white. The concept of white wasn't invented until at least 1000 years after that.
Again, blame whites for this shit. We fucked up bad and never want to own it.
>>769162
If they were good monarchs I'd feel proud
>>769394
>/pol/
>not /int/
Is this some kind of new shitposting?
>>771232
>the concept of white
Concepts are irrelevant you commie fuck, biologically all Europeans and West Eurasians are the same closely related subgroup of humans
>>771267
No they aren't. The handful of scientists that say that are dwarfed by scientists who disagree.
Sorry. You got ownd like 50 years ago. It's time to find some other hill to die on. Maybe hating "free stuff" or "women?" Your /pol/ brethren love those old chestnuts.
>>769162
I don't feel proud, but I do find it to be an interesting bit of trivia.
Brian Boru, High King of Ireland, if you're curious. So it hardly counts as a kingship anyway.
Most here would be peasants working their asses off so that a few nobles could do nothing all day and party all night.
It's funny how when people imagine the middle ages they never see themselves as the peasant.
>>771507
You realize how fucking big your family tree would be by the time you reach the middle ages is right? The chances of you not having royalty in your past would be minuscule.
>>770954
LMAO FUCKING CULTURAL MARXIST WHY YOU WAN'T TO DESTROY MUH HERITAGE DUMB COMMIE LOOK AT NORTH KOREA.
I can trace my lineage back to Scottish kings and I think it's neat. I don't know if I feel pride over it, but I think it's interesting.
>>771267
Biologically all humans are really closely related but I bet you don't like people to start with "muh human race"
>>771257
Be thankful, sure. Being proud is still retarded.
>>769162
Neither. The only pride or shame I have ever felt is out of what I myself have done with my life. However I might have been inspired to know something like that, just like how I'm inspired to make my parents proud because of what they have accomplished in their lives.
I wouldn't be ashamed. Power was granted to most monarch by right of the birth. If I got no power that means that monarchs done this job to secure position of their dynasty.
>>772478
Look at the following posts dipshit
I don't want to fuck up noone's heritage
No because there is a high chance that your family did inbreeding in order to keep the throne for themselves
>>769168
Except in reality those nobs were destroyed and didn't advance, so...the superioty must be a lie. should you feel proud about a lie?
>>772545
about as closely related as a shit tzu and a great dane
>>769162
I wouldn't say so. Monarchs as a whole weren't particulary great. There were great monarchs but the majority were not.
You didn't become a monarch because you were the best person for the job; you became one because you popped out of the right twat at the right time. Why should I feel any pride (or shame at alleged comparative worthlessness) because one or more of my ancestors was some likely inbred chucklefuck who happened to win the birth lottery? If I were descended from Charles II of Spain, would that be a legacy that should fill me with pride, or inspire me to live up to?
>>772916
>muh inbreeding
>all these retards who say this can cite is Charles II
okay
>>773064
The majority of monarchs were just average. Nothing great, but nothing bad either.
>If I were descended from Charles II of Spain, would that be a legacy that should fill me with pride, or inspire me to live up to?
His reign was actually better than you'd expect so sure
>>773011
As far as I'm aware the genetic differences between dog breeds are far greater than the genetic differences between races of humans.
>>773115
I wasn't saying most were terrible, I was just saying most weren't great and there's no reason to take pride in being descended from them.
>>773119
You're correct. Their phenotypes are also very different. The retard's correct comparison would be a brown lab versus a white lab.
>>772916
>inbreeding 15 generations ago matters today
>>773658
You're right, it doesn't matter. Being descended from monarchy means nothing unless it's a royal family that still exists and provides some actual tangible benefit. Anyone who makes any sort of big deal (or really gives a shit at all) over some ancestor of theirs having been royalty is dumb tbqh.
>>769162
royal families have absolutely no valour and they stopped having it almost 1500 years from now
also, the purchasability of noble titles didn't really help their cause
>be xuande
>surname is liu
>we wuz emperors n shiet
>call up my bros
>get on the horse were invading luoyang
>go join up with the 18 lords
>im a scion of house han n shiet
>guard laughs at me
shiet
