Does Napoleon III deserve all that bashing he's getting?
He seems to presided over the very last period during which France was considered Europe's preeminent power. He also did much to improve the economy.
Also, I've heard that he's the archetype of modern depictions of the Devil from the way in which he was depicted on numerous caricatures.
>>756979
He lost the war against Prussia so he deserves bashing in that way.
>>756979
>much to improve the economy
He pursued free trade policies with Britain that actually hurt France and benefitted Britain, because he had this fear of getting napoleon'd like his uncle did.
>Europe's preeminent power
This is debatable, France may have certainly been considered Europe's preeminent power after the Crimean War but that was a problem of perception rather than reality, France never really recovered from Napoleon 1's wars.
He played his hand poorly in Italy, poorly in Germany and ultimately poorly in France.
Shit leader.
>>756997
I know that it might sound like crazy conspiracy theory, but wasn't the war just a trap on him by the Republicans? Many wise heads, including Napoleon himself, knew that France was woefully unprepared to face the modernized Prussian army. Yet his hand was pretty much forced by mob emotions, for which the Republicans were largely responsible. It was easy for them to argue for war, since it was Napoleon who would bear the whole responsibility.
>>757040
Isn't that against him since his form of government, resting on populism and plebiscites, was always unstable?
>>757040
It definitely wasn't a trap by Republicans, Bismarck provoked a war and Napoleon played into his hands for a variety of reasons. Incompetence and not being able to lose face infront of the French people being the two.
He could have fought a war when Prussia was fighting Austria, but he didn't take the opportunity because >incompetent.
>>757052
Napoleon III's government was fairly stable but overall a failure.
>>757076
I mean that it was always prone to this sort of thing? It could easily be forced to do something stupid because it depended on upholding an image of Napoleon III.
>>757052
>resting on populism and plebiscites, was always unstable?
He just won a crucial vote on his constitutional reform. Why would he risk everything?
There's a portion of Kissinger's 'Diplomacy' where he gives Napoleon III a good assfucking with no lube.
>He seems to presided over the very last period during which France was considered Europe's preeminent power
Thats the problem.
>>757102
France's declining position had little to do with politics, lots to do with demography. No matter what we think about Napoleon III, he didn't have control over how the French people fucked.
If anything, during his rule France punched above her weight.
>>757130
>If anything, during his rule France punched above her weight.
He had the power to prevent the unification of Germany and botched it by not interveening in the Austro-Prussian War. That was a huge cock up
France is Europe's preeminent power right now and since WW2, it's just that it doesn't mean much anymore.
He was actually alright except for his disastrous handling of the Franco-Prussian war and Sedan in particular. He failed to prevent the loss of French territory and most of all the creation of Germany, which fucked up Europe forever.
>>757152
Austria was considered the stronger German state and more likely contender for unification. The Prussian victory was an utter shock for everyone.
>>757184
It really shouldn't have been, Austria had been effectively neutered by France since the 30 Years War, and by the Seven Years War at the latest it had become clear that Prussia had become the main threat.
In fact France's biggest mistake was siding with Prussia instead of Austria in the War of Austrian Succession already. But by then France had been fighting Austria for so long that it had become a tradition.
>>756979
wasn't he the guy who lost to Mexico?
>>757196
>It really shouldn't have been,
It was, and it was understandable. Just 15 years before, in 1850, Austria completely humiliated Prussia in the Punctation of Olmütz.
>>757196
>by the Seven Years War at the latest it had become clear that Prussia had become the main threat.
Prussia only became a significant power alongside Austria, France etc after 1815.
>>757655
I'm not talking about being a major power in Europe, but about being the dominant power within Germany. After the Seven Years War Prussia was clearly the top player in Germany, and had arguably surpassed France in influence in Germany. The top player in Germany means the power most likely to unite Germany under its rule, which means the future main power of Europe.
This was actually already clear after the War of Austrian Succession, and it's after that war that France realised it had made a horrible mistake by allying with Prussia, which is why it fought against Prussia in the following Seven Years War. But by then it was already too late, and Prussia (with the continuous support of Britain) was set on the 150 year long path of rivaling and eventually surpassing France in power.
>>757655
>>757825
Nope.
Post-Napoleonic Prussia was considered a faded power, well past her prime. No one denied that it achieved a status of a major player during the reign of Frederick II the Great. Yet, Prussia was so incredibly trashed by Napoleon during the war of Fourth Coalition that it lost its position as a major power. True, that war so undermined the reputation of German soldiers that they were considered inferior to all others. Even during the American Civil War that reputation was still present to an extent.
The Prussian victory in the Prussian-Austrian war was an absolute shock for everyone. It was widely believed that Prussian would be no match to Austria's multiple bellicose nations.
>>757171
>France is Europe's preeminent power right now and since WW2
Get back to striking, Pierre.
>>757897
>Post-Napoleonic Prussia was considered a faded power
What the fuck are you talking about, the Napoleonic Wars ended with Prussia doubling its territory, acquiring the vital regions of the Rhineland, Westphalia, and Saxony, and sprawling all across Germany.
>>757921
Delusional Nigel detected.
Don't worry, I'm sure Boris Johnson will make Britain great again.
>>757928
Not to mention Britain and Austria shitting themselves something fierce that they entertained the notion of allying themselves with a Post Napoleonic France during the Saxon-Polish Crisis/100 days.
>>757934
>Implying I meant Britain.
It was Russia, then Germany, and now it's still Germany. B-but muh invasion of Europe. Germany still owns you, and the rest of the EU, Frog, whether you like it or not.
>>757963
Germany doesn't even supply their own army with guns, let alone 'own' anyone else.
France's got a top rate army, ladcuntm8
>>757963
Germany doesn't even have a military and can't even be counted as a sovereign country. All it does is throw money around hoping that will make them popular.
>>757985
This, gents.
This sums Germany up pretty much perfectly well.
Interesting documentary about the battle of Sedan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEQaJ1XEBeg
Too bad there is no english version of it
