Why were the Irish reduced to Nigger tier by the English but not the Scots or Welsh?
>>352052
Because Ireland was the only part of the UK that the English couldn't cvck into accepting British identity.
So the English in frustration that Ireland didn't want to be part of their club made lots of memes about how they're savages.
>>352062
This. Britbongs still can't live with getting shut down even after all this time.
Ireland never became a centralized political entity like Scotland did.
Brian Boru was planning to consolidate his High Kingship which would've gone in that direction, but he was killed.
>>352062
"Savages" is like the go-to word for Brits to use against people they don't like.
>>353188
One from Scotland
IIRC (and i probably don't) highland Scots are Celtic (speak a Gaelic dialect dont they?) and lowland Scots are Germanic (speak the different language, Lowland Scots or just Scots)
>>352052
>wales
They banned thier language
Banned thwm getting together at all
Built castles all over, and stole land from local lords.
They saw them as nigger tier
Its just the welsh have grown docile and dont give a fuck now.
Scotland even had an independance refrendum, polls in wales indicate less than 2% support for any kind of independence.
>>353298
Not quite, as far as we can tell the Scots migrated from Ireland, and the native Britons in Scotland were the Picts.
Later Scandinavian invasions forced them together in defensive union as the kingdom of Alba, and after a good while Scotland won out as the popular name for several disputed reasons; for instance that the mythology surrounding Scota was a useful counter-narrative to the English claim to rule all of the Britons because it suggested that the Scots were not Britons.
>>353298
The Scots language is just a corrupted adopted English, the Scots were not Germanic
>>355490
Kek
>>355490
Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch.
Actual Welsh village name
Ireland was one of the good places after the fall of Rome.
>>355610
that was before the chinese colonisation lmao
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-31489002
>>352052
But they are, lad.
They are.
>>355617
I'm gonna need a reason why you say that.
>>355617
We, therefore, following in the footsteps of the late venerable Pope Adrian, and in expectation also of seeing the fruits of our own earnest wishes on this head, ratify and confirm the permission of the said Pope granted you in reference to the dominion of the kingdom of Ireland; (reserving to Blessed Peter and the holy Roman Church, as in England, so also in Ireland, the annual payment of one penny for every house;) to the end that the filthy practices of that land may be abolished, and the barbarous nation which is called by the Christian name, may through your clemency attain unto some decency of manners; and that when the Church of that country which has been hitherto in a disordered state, shall have been reduced to better order, that people may by your means possess for the future the reality as well as the name of the Christian profession.
>>355628
>>355629
Monasticism: "Irish Christian scholars excelled in the study of Latin and Greek learning and Christian theology. In the monastic culture that followed the Christianisation of Ireland, Latin and Greek learning was preserved in Ireland during the Early Middle Ages in contrast to elsewhere in Europe, where the Dark Ages followed the decline of the Roman Empire.
The arts of manuscript illumination, metalworking and sculpture flourished and produced treasures such as the Book of Kells, ornate jewellery and the many carved stone crosses[38] that still dot the island today. A mission founded in 563 on Iona by the Irish monk Saint Columba began a tradition of Irish missionary work that spread Celtic Christianity and learning to Scotland, England and the Frankish Empire on Continental Europe after the fall of Rome.[39] These missions continued until the late Middle Ages, establishing monasteries and centres of learning, producing scholars such as Sedulius Scottus and Johannes Eriugena and exerting much influence in Europe."
>>353425
In the South we're apathetic as fuck, with a few nationalists emerging every now and then during the Six Nations, but in the North, or if you speak Welsh as a first language, we're definitely more patriotic.
It's just we've been keked for so long we've got stockholm syndrome
>>355521
Lowland Scots are. They have descent from the Angles of Lothian as well as the Saxons who fled to southern Scotland (along with Edgar Atheling and his sister who married the Scottish king) after the Norman Conquest. Northern Scots in the Hebrides and Orkneys have Scandinavian blood due to the Vikings. So there's a good element of Germanic blood in the Scots population.
>>355676
Yes, admittedly I oversimplified the diversity of peoples that made up Scotland.
The Scottish people as they came to be known were ultimately made up of scandinavians, normans, scots, flemish, english, and others but the cultural and political development was dominated by the celtic Scots and the Picts.
>>355654
Take comfort that England cares more about Arthur, a figure made-up from Brythonic legends and vague Romano-Briton history than any actual Anglo-Saxon king. Nobody knows about Penda, Offa, or Aethelstan I bet in an English classroom.
>>355695
>Flemish
How evident is this? I know the Scottish kings after David invited Flemings to set-up towns.
Also you have a considerable Brythonic lineage when Scotland annexed much of Strathclyde as well as Breton families invited by King David.
>>355712
they came in among the Normans during the conquest, and later in various waves for various reasons.
There are a surprising number of Flemish surnames in Scotland to this day
>>355696
Yeah that's true. As far as I can remember my pre-exam history lessons consisted of:
>WWI & WWII
>Norman Conquest
>Wales during middle ages
>Wales being cvcked by Edward
>Owain 'plz let me be free' Glyndwr
>Being cvcked by the English for half a millennium after
>Welsh Not
>>355741
God damn I hate Glyndwr, both of the history teachers at my school were Welsh and thought an entire term on this failure was good time spent
>>355765
I forgot to add, we were also forced to watch a Welsh documentary in which Glyndwr was described as "the biggest threat to the English state since the Conquest"
simply awful
>>355765
>>355769
Not Welsh but I think Owain is overrated. The Welsh prince Lwellyn ap Gruffyrd repelled Henry II successfully. Even got him in an ambush that nearly killed the Angevin king.
The problem with Cyrmry is that your lands were poor to deal with the greater resources of the Normans, Plantagenets, and Tudors. Maybe if you had a mutual defense pact with Scotland, you might have been able to stave off until you'd join on your own terms like Scotland did.
>>355769
I kind of like him, but that's probably just my patriotic Welsh side. Yeah, he's kinda boring to study though, Llewelyn was more interesting, at least he got a huge climactic battle where he got decimated.
All that happened with Glyndwr is everyone decided to fuck off:
>They met the English army just ten miles from Worcester. The armies took up battle positions daily and viewed each other from a mile without any major action for eight days. Then, for reasons that have never become clear, the English retreated, and so did the French shortly afterwards.
>>355790
I'm not Welsh but Wales never really had much of a hope of central political authority until it was far too late, the country might look good on a map but it's easier to go from Dover to York than it was to get just from Powys and Ceredigon
>>355805
Nothing about Welsh political history is particularly interesting to me to be honest, what really interests me is Welsh identity despite it, the poetry circuits and "rhymers and wasters," and scholars like Gerald of Wales and Bishop Davies are just great.
>>355840
I think the culture and identity are more interesting than the politics, definitely. There's definitely this sense of longing and loss, and it seems to be more prevalent from people who can't speak the language from what I've seen.
Like a quote from a poem by R.S. Thomas:
There is no present in Wales,
And no future;
There is only the past,
>>355840
Gerald of Wales is a bit of a cunt to be honest
they needed the Scots to invent everything and win every war.
>>352052
from what i know the irish were always pretty much useless drunks with very unreliable leaders.
and scottish are also drunk fucks but their courage and competence usually lets them win the day...
>>355610
LITERALLY named to attract tourists
>>355790
>The problem with Cyrmry is that your lands were poor to deal with the greater resources of the Normans, Plantagenets, and Tudors.
>Henry Tudor
>Not Welsh
Ok
>>355628
Lots of reasons, really. Ireland had lots of monasteries, which provided education to the children of local chiefs.
Greek and Latin were preserved in Ireland, in fact, there's a good book called "How the Irish Saved Civilization"
It goes into a lot of detail about how Irish monks spread education and Christianity throughout Europe during the Hiberno-Scot mission.
Shows what Ireland can achieve without a foot on it's back, keeping it down
>>355654
Death to the Sais!
Return the Lloegyr!
>>355696
>Mentions famous Anglo-Saxon kings.
>Doesn't mention Alfred the Great
This Dane srs?
>>353425
the irony is that the welsh have the most people speaking their native language and the strongest national identity, despute being the most integrated celtic community beyond cornwall. the taffs don't need gaeltachts, because welsh has remained viable as a language despite annexation.
the taffs have shown that the tree that bends is stronger than the tree that breaks.
full respect to the mountain sheepfuckers.
>>356504
The Irish weren't united into a single polity before conquest from Britain. That's about it.
Drinking problems are part of anglo culture (why else would they have prohibition?), and they're found in post-colonial societies (check everywhere that was colonized), and it's the Catholic drug of choice (I don't know, man, it just is), so Ireland gets it from three sides.
>>355696
>No Oswald "Lamguin" of Northumbria
>>356545
Because they started teaching other subjects in primary schools through Welsh. And not too long ago, either.
In Ireland primary school teachers have to be fluent in Irish, so they could just be told to start teaching through Irish at the start of any semester. Except that they actually aren't fluent in Irish, they just got high marks in Irish exams. They can't hold a conversation in Irish, or explain any other subjects through it, they can just instruct Irish as a second language.
It really is just a matter of there being no will to teach Irish at the cabinet level. It's one part knowing that the Irish primary school teachers don't know Irish, without wanting to expose this nonsense; and one part elitism, it costs money to learn Irish properly, but not knowing makes you less Irish.
I know there are lots of people who can speak Welsh, but why would you? It's like listening to someone constantly belching and then injecting an 'errr' between every few words.
>>356583
Welsh is nice. Irish is nicer imo but I'm biased.
>>356583
They're a race of Ricks.
>>356611
Rick is totally a Welshman. Everyone says 'Sanchez' is his last name but it's probably spelt 'Lleycyriswelydd'
>>355654
This depresses me.
>>356621
Fucking top kek
>>356536
Alfred the Great is practically the one Anglo-Saxon king that modern-day England probably remembers.
Canute the Great was an awesome king of England despite being a Dane.
Irish are Catholic
>>357165
They're Catholic because of the Normans though senpai
>>359022
>They're Catholic because of the Normans though senpai
This is disgustingly inaccurate. The "Celtic Church" was in communion with Rome. It was Catholic.
>>356566
you can teach primary school subjects in welsh - and converse in welsh - if you speak it at home or amongst your friends and neighbours.
you need communities that still converse in a language to utilise and revive that language as a form of communication.
otherwise it's just a pointless waste of time which is maintained simply to genuflect before nationalist idols and myths about >muh heritage
the people who tend to want to revive languages don't appear to be terribly interested in the primary purpose of language: communication. it's just a way to culturaly isolate their tribe from neighbours they deem to be hostile.
t: saffer who grew up in south africa, ireland and lives in devon, and has had to put up with this bullshit from afrikaans, irish and cornish special snowflakes.
>>359131
The Pope backed the Norman invasion of Ireland.
>>353298
Pretty much yeah, though there's only about 50000 gaidhlig speakers left now, I'm one of them. It's similar to Irish gaelic, though they're not really mutually intelligible.
>>359438
>you need communities
these exist though
t. Irish speaker
>>359495
yeah. in 3 villages in cork and sligo.
you guys tried to revive irish and failed. you're not finland. the language you're trying to remove is not as irrelevant as the language you're trying to revive.
time to stop throwing good money after bad, bru.
>>359518
>cork and sligo
Have you ever even been to ireland?
>>355654
>It's just we've been keked for so long we've got stockholm syndrome
except the fact that england pays the welsh neetbux to keep its economy afloat. its coal industry is moribund and other than that and tourism wales has nothing going for it economically
>>359522
i went to school there. at a shitty all boys CBS.
luckily, being a dirty foreigner, i didn't have to do irish. no one liked having to do it, and no one watched the irish TV. it was purely a tool of nationalist indoctrination, an adjunct to all the kathleen ni houlihan, padraig pearse, wolfe tone, >muh famine, >muh coffin ships, >muh ebil cromwell, >muh emergency where we sent a telegram to hitler nonsense.
>>359107
>Irish being anywhere near Anglo-Scot tier
t. Ulsterfag
>>359542
>i went to school there. at a shitty all boys CBS.
Sounds shitty
>no one liked having to do it, and no one watched the irish TV.
Nobody liked it in my school either but I don't get what your point is. The nationalist shit was probably because you were in a cbs. Irish class for me was just like english.
>>359553
my original point is that welsh survived as a means for communication, and is therefore worth preserving and funding on that basis.
irish stopped being a means of communication long ago, beyond the gaeltachts. continuing to try to revive it through mandatory lessons in schools and an entire TV channel that covers the entire country (rather than an S4C type solution like you see in Wales) is a waste of time.
irish is now a vehicle for nationalist consciousness. if it wasn't, sinn fein wouldn't use it in the dail and other fora quite so much.
i suppose if irish people are happy to spend so lavishly on a means of communication that they don't even use, then that's their decision. personally, i think it's a waste of money. may as well spend money keeping telegraph lines open and try to revive the telegram.
>>359549
This.
>>356518
Henry VII was half-Welsh and was only using them for his goals. The Union gave equal rights to Welsh, but at the cost of losing their culture and language.
Because the English straight up conquered Ireland militarily, and did a very poor job of it, whereas they successfully conquered Wales and only annexed Scotland.
>>352052
Welsh were treated worse than anyone but the current British royalty like to pretend they are Welsh so it doesn't look good to have stories of them killing Welsh people.
>>359580
And my point was that Irish is still a means of communication, even outside the gaeltacht. I don't think it should be mandatory in schools either.
Irish is no more a nationalist tool than any other aspect of culture, it's predominantly expanding among the educated middle class and parents of young children, who are far from your average sinn féin voter.
It's also not that expensive at all really. A bilingual road sign costs the same as a monolingual one for example, and TG4 spends more on licensing english language programmes than producing Irish ones.
>>359803
i'm afraid we shall have to agree to disagree, friend.
>>352682
I'm a Roman Catholic Irish from Dublin and I can confirm this.
The Irish are lovely, friendly people, with a legacy of great writers and poets - but there's something juvenile and childish about they way we behave. It's sounds unattractive, but it's actually a lovely outlook: one of weirdly dark optimism and enthusiasm.
>>359841
Fair enough. I'll add that I live outside the gaeltacht and I rarely go a week without hearing Irish. it's pretty common but people don't listen for it.
>>359703
England didn't really annex Scotland as such. The Scottish King inherited the English throne after the death of Queen Elizabeth I in 1600ish, and then the two parliaments were united a hundred years later with the act of Union.
>>359887
Didn't the last census show an increase in Irish speakers for the first time in God knows how long? I wonder if we'll see that trend continue in the next one.
>>353298
>>353188
Ireland and Scotland used to be known as one country (Ireland "Scotia Major", Scotland "Scotia Minor"), and there was various kingdoms that had territory in Scotland and Ireland both.
Ireland and Scotland split when the English invaded. Scotland didn't get involved as it didn't directly concern them, and led to short-term benefits due to England not wanting them interfering.
The last Scottish King to really attempt to revive a Scottish-Irish Union was Robert the Bruce (whose brother went to Ulster to try and rally the Irish, but was defeated by the English/pro-English Irish clans).
>>356504
More like the Irish hated each other more than they hated the English.
Even when the English laid claim to all of Ireland, and the Ulstermen came south, some of the Ui Neills and Ui Domhnalls sided with the English for control over the clan titles (being "The O'Neill" and "The O'Donnell").
>>359859
>It's sounds unattractive, but it's actually a lovely outlook: one of weirdly dark optimism and enthusiasm.
"Well fuck it, things can't get any worse so we might as well try".
>>356532
bendigedig
>>360562
What is he holding?
>>359530
All this after they made millions off the welsh in the industrial revolution.
Seems fair to me.
>>360785
this anon
>>360865
Call me a newfag, stupid, whatever, but whats that?
>>360897
Nah man, it's kinda obscure I guess. It's the feathers of the Prince of Wales.
Ich Dien isn't actually Welsh, it's German, means I serve. I'm not too keen on it as a symbol tb h
>>360917
Oh, alright then.
Thanks for the info, friend.
You're making it sound like the Irish and Scots are equal people, which is wrong. The Irish are still looked down upon in Scotland because they're extremely shitty, stupid and non-industrious people.
>>360965
I would love to see an iq breakdown within the uk, for the countries inside it.
>>360965
yes, and the scots in Ireland are model citizens.
>>355790
>Maybe if you had a mutual defense pact with Scotland
Glyndwr tried that. The Scots were all for it, but a spy got word of the plan and their prince was kidnapped to keep them out of it. Ironically said prince grew up to become James I of England.
