The United States has done some pretty terrible things. Every presidency seems to have something marring its legacy. What is the last great thing the United States has done? Talking about things spearheaded by either the government or a government agency, ie: the moon landing.
unforgivable
>>1415215
We continue to send the hungry niggas chicken sandwhiches with some waffle fries, maybe a coke to drink or something.
>>1415229
FO FREE
bitch iaint got no money
>>1415215
Slavery
Creation of the global positioning system.
>>1415215
We brought about the end of the Soviet Union by tag teaming them with John Paul II. Paul brought about civil unrest and we forced the Soviets into spending they couldn't keep up. Things have seriously perked up for the vast majority of Eastern Europe ever since. I know the commie fags on this board will decry this as a good thing, but it was.
>>1415237
WAFFLE FRIES
ye i nutted
Honestly if you look at it's contributions, other countries don't even exist. The United States operates on another level. Like, it's weekly finance industry decisions might be more internationally relevant than an entire decade of an African countries existence. Pretending this isn't the case is delusion.
Internet.
>>1415215
PEPFAR was pretty good.
saved a few million lives from AIDS.
>>1415215
We were the first modern country to prove that monarchy is useless in our age.
>>1415215
this man was the last great thing for our country
>>1418759
This T B H
>>1415215
We just negotiated the Trans Pacific Partnership.
That's a truly great thing and its recent.
Marshall plan was pretty cool desu. Inb4 muh self interests. Every country operates on its self interest.
>>1421106
Whats so great about it? Forcing GMO food on people and laying the groundwork for a future world ruled by corporations?
>>1421138
>muh gmos
M8 we have been genetically modifying food since we planted our first crops. We just got much more precise at it.
Now Monsanto's business practices and pesticides are a different story but nothing is inherently wrong with gmos.
>>1415215
Helping crush fascism was pretty good
>>1421138
It basically cucked China, pulling other countries away from them and towards the US economically and politically.
Yeah regular people are still getting fucked in the end, but in grander scales its a big win for the United States since those countries will probably improve their economies vastly because of it.
>>1421146
I agree that there is absolutely nothing inherently wrong with GMO's in theory, but in practice:
>monsanto
So you see, its just like communism in that its not going to turn out good.
The internet is very convenient
>>1415215
being the counterweight to the chinks and russkies
The USA and Russia seem to be the only two countries actively trying to prevent international terrorism.
>>1421214
But on the other hand, you could say their high handedness is the direct cause of international terrorism
>>1421218
This.
>>1421218
its one of the causes, but its not the only cause
>>1421214
the overall global prosperity of the pax americana has made it all worth it. so you have to break some eggs to make an omelet. fuck the eggs.
>>1415215
>The United States has done some pretty terrible things.
Every nation, state, kingdom, empire, principality or tribe in human histroy has, the US isn't exceptional in that regard and the constant screeching about how we must feel guilty about our past and can have no pride in our country is one of the main reasons it's hard to find good books on US history.
The other reason, of course, is the exact opposite problem.
>>1421218
You could, but you'd be wrong.
Saved the Yazidis?
>>1421218
>you could say their high handedness is the direct cause of international terrorism
Do you realize just how wrong that thought is?
>>1415215
Probably the national park system.
>>1421352
>America/Russia does shit in the middle east
>Terrorism starts sprouting up shortly after
Give me your best argument as to why the US and Russia aren't at all responsible for terrorism. I dare you, faggot.
>>1422026
Because nothing we do could possibly be wrong.
Don't try to reason with them.
Post yfw you realize the USA are the bad guys and should have lost ww2
>>1422119
We won the war, you salty Nazi.
>>1422066
>because nothing we do could possibly be wrong.
/his/ in a nutshell everyone.
>>1422026
Because international terrorism coming out of the Middle East began with the PLO in the 60s, and Islamic Radicalism dates back to the Muslim Brotherhood.
If you want to look into the origins of the current batch of fuckwits, the three countries you want to pay attention to are Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, and Iran.
All of these are countries that began to aggressively use political Islam to shore up their current governments, and then became involved in international terrorism against the west.
The US is responsible to the extent that we supported the governments of Saudi Arabia and Pakistan.
Before you point to Operation AJAX, I'd like to point out that the Shia clerics who unseated the Shah were the same people who unseated Mossadegh.
>>1415215
Health care reform. I for one couldn't afford health insurance if not for the ACA.
>>1422137
>Because international terrorism coming out of the Middle East began with the PLO in the 60s
Consequence of the creation of the state of israel, which the US strongly supported and continues supporting.
>and Islamic Radicalism dates back to the Muslim Brotherhood.
A response to, at the time, the British imperial rule. They mixed religion and other bullshit into the mix, but the presence of foreign powers is still an important factor.
>If you want to look into the origins of the current batch of fuckwits, the three countries you want to pay attention to are Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, and Iran.
All of these are countries that began to aggressively use political Islam to shore up their current governments, and then became involved in international terrorism against the west.
Isn't Saudi Arabia on good terms with the US, though? Also, I think you're forgetting about Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria, countries which have had a lot of foreign "interventions" in them. The most notorious terrorists groups are from these countries.
>Before you point to Operation AJAX, I'd like to point out that the Shia clerics who unseated the Shah were the same people who unseated Mossadegh.
I know little about the details of operation AJAX, so I shan't comment. Either way, my main point is that you cannot deny the influence of foreign powers on Terrorism in/from the middle east (i.e. USA, Russia, Britain, etc.).
>>1422503
>which the US strongly supported and continues supporting.
what the fuck, the US didn't support the heebs until the 60's or 70's.
>>1422503
>Consequence of the creation of the state of israel, which the US strongly supported and continues supporting
I don't know if you know this, but the US didn't give a shit about Israel until the Yom Kippur War.
>Isn't Saudi Arabia on good terms with the US, though? Also, I think you're forgetting about Afghanistan, Iraq and Syria, countries which have had a lot of foreign "interventions" in them. The most notorious terrorists groups are from these countries.
Saudi Arabia is fucked. We can't live with them, can't live without them. The royal family is split between moderates who just want to enjoy the oil money, and durka durka Islamists who want to fuck everything up. In a clan based system, where everyone is related to everyone, the moderates can't purge the radicals, or do much to keep them from engaging in terrorism.
Places like Afghanistan, Syria, and Iraq are simply the playgrounds for state sponsored terrorism. In the case of Syria and Iraq, they've become the site of proxy wars between the Sunni and Shia world. In the case of Afghanistan, it's mostly Pakistani aid that brought the Taliban to power and helped them to recover after 2001.
Western powers definitely influenced it, but that's because everyone influenced everyone.
I think that people want to believe that the countries that become the victims of terrorism deserve it, because it makes the world seem like a fairer, more rational place.
But the US was essentially isolationist during the Clinton administration, and went so far as to go to war on behalf of Muslims in Yugoslavia, but 9/11 happened anyway.
It's just unhelpful to see terrorism in terms of the excesses of the west when it's more of a reflection of the conditions in Arab countries.
>>1422555
You could be forgiven for thinking so given how much that Arabs have harped on about the US-Israeli relationship.
The truth being that Arab elites simply learned from Hitler that Jews are an amazing scapegoat.
They're everywhere, and they can survive anything.
You can blame them for literally anything, and they will never, ever go away.
A lot of Arab nationalism was cribbed directly from National Socialism, and the snackbars picked up the "Jews dominate USA durka durka snackbar" from there.
>>1422531
>I think that people want to believe that the countries that become the victims of terrorism deserve it, because it makes the world seem like a fairer, more rational place.
I agree. Terrorism is always the wrong answer, regardless of the cause.
But I believe that out of all the problems that come out of the middle east, most of them are due to foreign interference. Having Foreign soldiers/bureaucrats/whatever in your own country telling you how you should live is, to say the least, irritating and disrespectful.
Sure, there's the "cultural problem". But IMO that's slippery ground, especially since such subjects are filled with biases/prejudices. To tell the extent of such cultural problems is difficult, and how to "fix" it even more so, although everyone seems to think they know the answer and that everything's straight forward.
>>1422601
Basically, I think the root of terrorism is Middle Eastern countries using the West as a scapegoat for their failures, and the people who grow up on that deciding to get even.
It doesn't have a hell of a lot to do with the actual policies of the west
>>1422746
Define the Middle East's Failures.
Prevented China from being raped up by European nations like the middle east war at the end of WW2.
Helped with winning both world wars.
Has pretty much led the development on a number of key modern inventions, including computers, the internet, and the atomic bomb -- which depending on who you are, the last one is considered an evil thing (hey even the previous two could be viewed as such).
Hollywood.
Bringing democracy to Vietnam.
>>1422758
where to start
>>1422789
>end of WW2
meant to say WW1
>>1422758
Specifically, most of them have failed to provide economic opportunity or effective government services to their people.
Many of them have lost wars, or failed to provide physical security to their people.
This is certainly true for Pakistan. In the case of Saudi Arabia and Iran, the governments have utterly failed to include their citizens in the political process, which is justified on religious grounds.
Generally, political Islam has been the go-to legitimization method for Middle Eastern oligarchies, and a central part of that is resistance to the west, which is seen as a secularizing force.
>>1422820
During the nineteenth century, the middle east was mostly a bunch of different tribes, ruled by the ottomans/turks. After WW1, the British mostly took hold of the region (I think), but it was only after WW2 really where they had the opportunity to "grow". The problem though is that the middle east is a strategic point due to the oil, so the following 50-60 years were riddled with wars and strives, mostly caused indirectly or directly from foreign countries (US, Britain, China, Russia, etc.).
You say most of them have failed to provide good governments/physical security to their people, but foreign affairs and alliances make a big difference.
Just look at South Correa vs North Correa. Both were shit holes in the 50s. North Corea hasn't changed at all, meanwhile south Correa has a HDI of European countries.
>>1422905
>so the following 50-60 years were riddled with wars and strives, mostly caused indirectly or directly from foreign countries
This is the part I'm not sure that I buy.
I suspect that they simply failed to develop during their time under Ottoman rule, and so entered the 20th century with inadequate institutions.
It takes quite a bit of time and luck for people to start thinking in terms of countries rather than family, clan, or tribe.
There was certainly a great deal of fuckery during the Cold War, but it's worth pointing out that Al Qaeda came from Saudi Arabia, a country that was consistently under the protection and support of the west, and experienced very little unrest compared to the neighbors.
Pakistan was in a similar situation, under US protection against the Soviets, but the government of Zia al-Huq needed political support, and turned to the madrasas for help. In between that and Saudi oil money, the country is kebabed to shit.
The main source of resentment that fuels terrorism is the sense that the west encourages Muslim governments to be secular rather than theocratic.
>>1415216
>Every presidency seems to have something marring its legacy.
of course they are not gods
>>1419143
>could not even dodge a bullet
pretty sub par desu
>>1421106
it is a pretty shitty move against the japs and shity altogether
>>1422147
>tfw the ACA made health care so expensive that were I not a college student and getting it for free I wouldn't be able to get it all
I paid $150 a month for insurance before the ACA. Cheapest plans now are ~500 per month. Once I graduate I will be unable to afford health insurance. Just remember that what you hold as an accomplishment revoked the possibility of health insurance for a lot of people, including myself.
I think Teddy irrevocably fucked up our foreign policy.
