Who does /his/ prefer and why? Genoats seemed to be better traders/merchants but the Venetians had a much more lasting influence on the area.
Map of Genoa (dark reds)
Map of Venice (reds)
>>1323324
I'm neutral but which one lasted longer
Made a strawpoll for this:
http://www.strawpoll.me/10560441
>>1323339
Venice, undoubtedly. They both died on 1797 when Napoleon conquered them.
R of Venice: 1100 years
R of Genoa: 792 years
>liking any of the Spaghetti Jews
Hansa is love
Hansa is life
>>1323350
Then Venice is objectively better
>>1323359
Get out Germanboo REEEEEEEEEEE
>>1323348
>http://www.strawpoll.me/10560441
Noice.
If Milan had managed to hold on to Genoa (or conquer it early on) things would have been quite interesting.
>>1323324
Genoa has a better colour scheme in medieval 2
>>1323359
The Hanseatic states were like a colder, wetter, duller and uglier version of Venice, Genoa, Pisa and Amalfi. I would have never chosen to live there over any of the Italian ones.
>>1323361
Not really. Genoa managed to beat Venice in many of their trading rivalries, even in the eastern Med. where Venice theoretically had an advantage.
Older map, pre-Genoa foundation.
>Emirate of Sicily
This triggers the Sicilian
>>1323392
What really gets me is the duchy of salerno in the middle of the Byzantine territory
>>1323401
I think the key was holding on to the Gulf of Squillace (the one facing the Ionian sea). Also, they were a Byzantine vassal for a while.
>>1323348
>http://www.strawpoll.me/10560441
>Not a single vote for Genoa.
Poor sods.
>people who voted Genoa
Good goys
Good books to read on Genoa? They seem interesting
Genoa is criminally underrated both regarding history and tourism
but we're fine with that, in the end we're still an actual city while Venice has become Disneyland
>>1324025
As the post above says, Genoa is much less famous and popular touristically than Venice so it receives much less attention, meaning there are probably fewer books on it. It was one of the two most important maritime republics though, so you should find material. Post it here if you do!
>>1324079
Didn't you guys build a huge elevated motorway through the city? I've only seen Genoa in pictures but it seems a little less "pretty" than Venice. More of a real city though, AFAIK you have proper industry etc. still there.
>>1323324
Genoa was the only country that out jewed the Venetians.
Those fuckers literally sold maps of Europe and other such information to the mongols/
>>1324124
it is a "real" city, was part of the industrial triangle, heavy industry and all that
Of course it's gone now, but the city it's still fairly rich. Architecture in the old centre is goat tho
>>1324161
the golden age of Jewnoa was the 17th century, they basically were Spain's bank
everything went wrong when Savoy/Sardinia took the town after the napoleonic wars
>>1324177
I have a folder of historical photos on my pc, too bad I'm on the phone. Not even in Jewnoa atm
>>1324180
So that's where all that Spanish silver went!
>>1324197
they used to say that american silver dies in Spain and gets buried in Genoa
>>1324210
You were the Lichtenstein/Switzerland/Panama/Singapore of the time! I already know you prefer Genoa to Venice as a city, but which do you think was the cooler republic? Localism aside
Venice:
+really cool concept for a city in general, almost seems like something out of a fantasy novel
+takes "maritime trade power" to it's logical extreme; tiny islands in a naturally fortified lagoon with canals as internal roadways
+warrior/mercenary culture second only to the Swiss
+master craftsmen, high levels of ingenuity and large focus on technology; used crossbows cuz they're more mechanical than regular bows
+turned a swampy, mosquito infested, malaria ridden lagoon into the richest city in western Europe
+republican, large focus on liberty and personal freedom in comparison to other places; no galley slaves
+fiercely independent and a major player in mainland Italian politics
+defenders of Christendom, masters at kebab removal, won the battle of Lepanto
+longer lasting legacy, still probably top 3 most popular cities in Europe
+Venetial arsenal could build a galley in one day
+just look at it on google maps and try to tell me it doesn't look awesome
-never managed to conquer Milan and unify all of the Po river valley into a united confederacy
-sometimes uses underhanded means to accomplish goals to a seemingly greater extent than other countries
-general lack of moral scruples beyond their republican ideals; "cash is king"
---tricked the Franks into sacking Constantinople
Genoa
+general border theme in Crimea matches Italy, nice map aesthetics
+removed moderate amounts of kebab
+reasonably free and technologically advanced in comparison to countries that aren't republics
+merchant republics are cool in general
-culture, city design, concept/mythology etc isn't really any more unique or interesting than any other Italian city state
-defines their whole identity through their rivalry with Venice, this and the fact that they were large are the only really noteworthy/memorable things
-couldn't translate trade wealth into relevance in mainland Italian politics
-cucked by France
-no significant lasting legacy or relevance
+didn't sack Constantinople
>>1324214
There's no doubt that Venice has been historically and culturally more relevant, banter aside. Genoa quickly fell under the influence of other states, such as Milan, Spain, France. Being an artificial island-city has its perks
>>1324226
>defines their whole identity through their rivalry with Venice
this is wrong, the rivalry was mainly during the 1400s
What about Novgorod, guys?
>>1324240
Also Genoa sent Giovannin Giustiniani, the only notable foreign commander to help with the Siege of Constantinople against the Turks, whereas Venice did diddlysquat.
>>1324245
Porridge-tier
genoa sold its St. George flag to England to protect their transport fleets during the crusades
Didn't one of the Dorias nearly fuck up Lepanto because they were still obsessed with MUH GENOESE GLORY FUCK THE VENETIANS? Also seeing them not actually be able to put Venice away during Chioggia is fucking hilarious. All that they had achieved over the last centuries went to nothing in one battle.
>>1323359
>Hanseatic League
As opposed to Kraut Jews?
>>1324226
>-cucked by France
How? Other than selling Corsica?
>>1323324
Venice because red is my favourite color.
>>1324226
but venice got cucked by the ottomans
>>1324226
Didn't sack Constantinople should be a -
>>1324245
I didn't care about it until I was told they had an amazing % of literacy. The drawings of that kid (Omfim or something) are cool too.
>>1325000
Dunno but Andrea Doria was a complete shithead.
We all know that the spaniards with Don Juan were the ones adding great leadership in Lepanto, despite the fact that the victory would've been impossible without the italians.
>>1324226
Shouldn't another + for Venice be that it was a city founded by explicitly Roman refugees, a city which was founded by Trojan refugees?
