Give me one good reason not to descend into hedonism and try to fulfill my life to the fullest (in a way that doesn't hurt anyone)
>>1269061
Convert to Islam.
>>1269067
No.
Why would I do that?
>(in a way that doesn't hurt anyone)
You're doing it right. The moment you start hurting anyone it must stop.
>>1269073
It is the truth.
>>1269076
Thats extremely debatable.
Because hedonism makes you miserable.
>>1269150
Have you ever been a hedonist?
>>1269162
In parts.
But that is not necessary to know this.
>>1269182
>In parts.
You weren't living to your full hedonist potential then.
>But that is not necessary to know this.
how do you then?
>>1269197
Very hedonistic people are miserable, anon.
And you can get new knowledge by studying
>>1269061
Because you'll forever be chasing the next high as the previous one wears thin.
That doesn't apply just to drugs - it applies to everything in your life that is completely centered on self-pleasure.
If, on the other hand, you try to build something, or be part of something larger than yourself, beyond yourself and your own life, you can have some hope at life long fulfillment, rather than forever chasing the hole in your heart.
That doesn't necessarily mean Christianity or any religion, mind ye. It just means recognizing that there's a world outside of yourself, and you are part of it. This species isn't suited to solitary pursuits nor endless selfish hedonism, and either will eventually wear you down. It's a simple survival mechanism of the collective for all social mammals.
Or you can take the aesthetic route... I can't personally attest to that, but I've known some happy buddhists.
By all the gods though, I wish I could quickly find this equivalent quote by someone other than CK.
Define descending into hedonism. The pop-culture depiction of it doesn't work (the hedonic treadmill screws it up), but generally doing what pleases is more or less the standard way of going about life.
>>1269248
>but generally doing what pleases is more or less the standard way of going about life.
this is hedonism as I understand it.
>>1269231
>Very hedonistic people are miserable, anon.
Source?
>>1269238
>If, on the other hand, you try to build something, or be part of something larger than yourself, beyond yourself and your own life, you can have some hope at life long fulfillment, rather than forever chasing the hole in your heart.
isn't that just chasing long term happiness?
there's a branch of hedonism called Epicureanism which is basically that.
>>1269263
>this is hedonism as I understand it.
Then I have no argument against it. It's kind of the only way you can go about life, since our brains are very much a carrot/stick arrangement of reward and punishment.
>>1269263
>isn't that just chasing long term happiness?
Chasing the long term goal always beats chasing the short, in the long term.
Okay, the saying falls when it comes to breathing and the like, but generally speaking, this remains true regardless of the nature or scale of the pursuit, provided you don't toss anything supernatural in.
Just, don't live your life as if you're going to be dead by the time you're 25, as despite all your efforts at said, you probably won't be.
>hedonism
>in a way that doesn't hurt anyone
get ready to become a vegan bro
>>1269352
Animals aren't people.
>>1269263
Epicureanism is not hedonistic, you are very much mistaken my friend.
>>1269360
so you don't care about hurting other life forms?
>>1269361
but it is though.
He just says that it isn't "Pure" Hedonism because it ops for something more tangible.
>>1269361
Although Epicureanism is a form of hedonism insofar as it declares pleasure to be its sole intrinsic goal, the concept that the absence of pain and fear constitutes the greatest pleasure, and its advocacy of a simple life, make it very different from "hedonism" as it is colloquially understood.
Whether you live your life indulging the flesh, or restricting the flesh, you're living by the flesh. Like an animal.
>>1269402
>Like an animal.
We are animals. Get over it.
>>1269402
it's like post-hedonism or something
>>1269416
>So sad you believe liars, and not God.
If there was a christian version of a fedora, I'd post it here.
There isn't though, so have this anyways.
There is no reason. Everyone is a hedonist at heart. Most deny it.
>>1269409
We're social mammals, meaning we can live for the collective as well as ourselves. Comes with that whole empathy instinct we evolved to form tribes so long ago. The reasoning ability, similarly evolved, lets us choose the long term gain over the short and better see the consequences of our actions further into the future.
We maybe animals, but we aren't simple beasts. We're horribly complex ones.
>>1269444
we are collectively hedonistic however.
Just because we have to work and wait in long term because we want everyone to be as grossly happy as us doesn't mean we aren't hedonist.
In fact thats one of the most hedonistic things I can thing of.
>>1269456
Problem is, under that definition, everything is hedonist, and it kinda loses its meaning, equating the greater good with the lesser.
...Granted, I suspect that's what a lot of folks advocating hedonism have done - though, obviously, not all of them.
liberalism is a mental illness
>>1269475
Well, the goal in Hedonism at its core is to make everyone happy.
thats why it doesn't seem to mean anything, because everyone except the deranged or sour wants that.
>>1269482
Enjoy your equal rights bub.
Be thankful someone of a different religion/race/ethnicity/worldview doesn't have the same ideology as you or the power to make it happen in your nation.
>>1269482
"Liberalism" - and I'm assuming we're going with the American definition of the word based on the comment - is, in many ways, about as anti-hedonistic as you can get. While notorious for promoting personal liberties, it also promotes socialism and the general welfare at the cost of the individual, a hefty investment in selflessness, as opposed to American "conservatism" which denies the value of social welfare while demanding individual social conformity, and promoting "me and mine" over the collective to such a degree that even Anton LaVey approved.
Not that the terms have been doublespeak twisted into absolute meaninglessness in that vernacular, beyond each meaning "anything I don't like" for team red or blue.
>>1269523
T.kaczynski
And equal rights are retarded. People are not equal.
>>1269592
>it also promotes socialism and the general welfare at the cost of the individual
Fuck off retard, you think people who are well off advocate this nonsense or that those that do won't benefit from it by making people wholly dependent on them?
>>1269442
And likewise people look at masochists as though there's something wrong with them.
>>1269596
>pepol are NOT equal!
>muh genetics say so!
There is barely any genetic difference that is in any way pronounced or dramatic enough in humans to matter an none that say some humans have more mental or physical abilities than others.
The most we have is skin color and teeth.
>inb4 lel skin deep
It is retard, bones don't mean fuckin' nothin'
>>1269622
Oh Christ, anon, you're tampering with pol and the full might of its shitposting
>>1269622
I wasn't making a genetic argument, but your claim that genetics are not significant is ridiculous.
Keep worshiping tabula rasa.
>>1269652
>but your claim that genetics are not significant is ridiculous.
You're understanding of basic biology is whats ridiculous.
and what argument were you claiming then Mr.Animal Farm?
Change the "fullest" to "having at least some pleasure every day", otherwise you will fall on the same hole as psychoactive drug's users, and will become depressive.
Becoming a regimented hedonist was the best thing I've done to overcome existential crisis and depression.
>>1269606
If that's what you call a "promotion", I'd hate to see what you call a refutation, as I can't think of a whole lotta things more insidiously evil than that.
>>1269596
Of course people are not equal - otherwise you wouldn't need equal rights.
>>1269061
It would anger Allah.
>>1269835
Who fucking cares
>>1269263
This is not hedonism.
Hedonism = pleasure is the greatest good.
If you change the definition of hedonism to this, even Stoicism or Ascetic monks are hedonists.
>>1270022
>Hedonism = pleasure is the greatest good.
How does my statement contradict that?
if pleasure is the greatest good then the goal is to make everyone happy.
>>1270045
Happiness and pleasure are not the same thing.
See most Rockstars.
>>1270077
if the generate each other then yeah pretty much.
>>1270123
Then, your definition of hedonism is not as ample as before.
>>1270135
I mean, I guess. but if you read the thread you would have know that already.
>>1269835
Devil's usually pissed off all the time anyways.
>>1269061
Only decent reason not to that I can come up with is if you think it's likely you'll fail and just suffer, in which case maybe you should just end it now.
Otherwise I can't think of anything, you've got the right idea mate.
>>1269061
>(in a way that doesn't hurt anyone)
boring
>>1270123
That's a big "if," that also fails to consider long vs. short term
>>1270369
Short term pleasure creates short term happiness.
Long term pleasure creates long term happiness.
and Vise Versa
Hedonic treadmill
>>1270388
See: Epicureanism
>>1269061
your future
i mean, it's pretty cool to do whatever i want specially when all i want is to feel pleasure, but we were built in a way that if we do the same pleasurable thing over and over again your brain starts to get bored and you'll have to do new shit
so ultimately, boredom will be your worst enemy and will be always around you to take all your pleasure away
on the other hand you can make sacrifices and do what you think will be good in the long run, passing by some moments of displeasure but reaping the rewards in the long run (so far i haven't been able to do this yet but that seems to be the winning formula in life)
>>1269409
Define animal and why you would use a very baseline label which ignores many defining features of a species and from which humans are typically excluded. Is your reason edgy anti-human sentiment stemming from the fact that you're a worthless piece of shit, causing you to resent your entire essence rather than just yourself as an individual?
>>1269076
if you're going to follow a religion, atleast pick something where the end result isn't you blowing yourself up
>>1269061
The problem with Hedonists is that they end up too fixated on one aspect: like people who only ever eat sweets and can never appreciate flavours beyond it.
They're like children with underdevolped palates, desu
