Enlighten me about Anarcho-Feminism friends. In a classless society where the merits of the individual are key would women not have a severe disadvantage due to their physical inferiority? Let's say it blunty, what prevents men from overpowering women when they feel like it with little repercussions because they don't have the strenght to fight back.
To me it seems like women have more benefits living in a law state than an anarchist one. Atleast here their rights are protected by society and the law.
>>1163408
>what prevents men from overpowering women
A culture which shuns unnecessary violence, of course.
And don't expect women (or anyone who's in any way marginalized by the status quo) to be defended by the law; it's fairly obvious that laws have been selectively enforced for as long as there have been laws.
>>1163408
Anarchism isn't lawless chaos.
It's a responsibility for people to look out for each other, which includes protecting from rapists and such. And since in the absence of prisons or anything of the sort every crime would probably be met with the death penalty or other such street justice.
To give an example, if you rape someone then her friends and male relatives would probably murder you and this would be received as justified by the community thus protecting them from revenge killings.
guns
>>1163408
>Enlighten me about Anarcho-Feminism friends
Another bullshit ideology that doesn't work or tries to apply laws in a lawless society.
>Anarcho-Feminism
It misses the word "trans" in it somewhere to go full meme overkill.
>>1163408
Like anarchism it is non-sustainable and a flawed concept from the beginning due to not accounting for the faults of human nature.
>>1163552
>HEW MON NAYCHUR
Best /his/ meme.
>>1163484
>somewhere to go full meme overkill.
Queer anarchism is a thing
>>1163552
>>1163582
I am still waiting for the argument
The necessary goal of any anarchist movement isn't simply to dissolve power structures but to ingrain ideas into a culture so deeply that a state isn't needed to uphold and enforce them. In this case, the idea is "Free Association and the equality of the sexes are the most important concepts"
The problem is, once you don't have a State, you can't control which ideas gain primacy. Among any group of people living in an anarchic state, you'd have little anarcho-capitalistic societies, anarcho-communist societies, green, vegan, whathaveyou. It's also highly likely that eventually one of those societies would grow into a 'State', because you don't have a system to enforce the importance of anarchism anymore.
The best solution that anarchists could hope for is an anarchist society that is maintained 'from the outside'. A no-mans-land that has no State, but if a State were to arise in one, an outside actor would come through and abolish it.
>>1163605
>in an anarchic state
I meant anarchic situation. You know what I mean.
>>1163603
There was nothing substantial for me to argue against.
>>1163613
Capitalism is proof that blank slate is totally correct.
In a relatively short span of time the material conditions of capitalism have totally warped everything that could have been called human nature during feudalism. It's very apparant that "human nature" is dictated by material conditions rather than vice versa on that basis.
>>1163582
So that's why most communist countries turn out to be a totalitarian shit holes?
>>1163661
Communist were, and are, fucking class and the only reason you wouldn't enjoy living there is if you're a normie.
>>1163634
The plebs are still plebbing around just like they were during feudalism. Except now instead of toiling in the fields and getting scared of thunder they flip burgers at Wendy's and post horseshit on Facebook.
>>1163670
>and are, fucking class and the only reason you wouldn't enjoy living there is if you're a normie.
So if I believe in God and want to own property and want to make a mark on this Earth I'm a normalfag?
>>1163675
They're totally different though and this is best represented in the downfall of religion in advanced economies.
In feudalism your life was given meaning my god, in capitalism accumulating material wealth simply is the meaning.
>>1163661
>most leninist countries
ftfy
>>1163698
>feudalism: pleb wakes up, goes to work until 9 PM, goes back home, fucks his wife, goes to sleep
>capitalism: pleb wakes up, goes to work until 9 PM, goes back home, fucks his wife, goes to sleep
World of difference right there.
>>1163680
>believe in God
You could and can believe in god in communist countries.
>want to own property
Yes, fuck that. If that is important to you then communism isn't for you.
>want to make a mark on this Earth I'm a normalfag?
1. Yes, that's the height of normalfaggotry. Or at best internalized normalfaggotry.
2. Lots of people in communist countries did make their make on the Earth. It's hard to say that for instance Yuri Gargarin hasn't left a mark.
>>1163726
>You could and can believe in god in communist countries.
Poland would like a word with you, heretic.
>Yes, fuck that. If that is important to you then communism isn't for you.
Then why you trying to shill communism if you want it.
>1. Yes, that's the height of normalfaggotry. Or at best internalized normalfaggotry.
So wanting to feel important is a bad thing?
>>1163726
>Yuri Gargarin made a mark on earth
>on earth
Now I know you're trolling.
>>1163661
>thread is about anarchism
>some liberal starts talking about Marxism-Leninism
>>1163749
He sure made a mark on earth when his carcass splattered on a field near Kirzhach.
>>1163634
You're retarded. Here's why
A consistent foundation of human nature exists in all societies. The differences are caused not by a changing nature, but by different worldviews. Nature and nurture both play a role: nature is a powerful, mindless beast, and nurture is a weak but intentional man leading it.
Feudal people knew human nature through the bible. Man is inherently sinful; the 7 deadly sins are easy to fall into and require the grace of God to escape. To them human nature was evil, Pious virtues were good, ergo they tried to suppress their nature. This spiritually driven suppression of their nature accounts for a lot of their society.
The changes in human action that have occurred alongside modernization have been cause by our lack of a belief system, which is a belief system in itself. Without a metaphysics to elevate us beyond our nature, it is nature itself that is elevated. Without an elevating metaphysics, we revert back to our more animal nature: sex isn't something "precious" or "holy," it is an animal function that is fun- do it more. Family isn't the most important thing in life- be single, or have a small family, and work your ass off for the capitalist system.
Human nature exists, nurture can only move it so far. The changes that occurred during industrialization and accelerated after the 50's happened so quickly because our new worldview didn't force us to be better than our nature, but allowed us to act as animals.
>>1163725
I like how you've shifted the goalposts from human nature to human lifestyle. Which is still wrong since feudal serfs had a relatively short working week compared to modern day proletariat and much of the year would be time off.
But to the point in capitalism you're working to accrue material wealth, that's it. You are working to get more money to support yourself and blind consumerism is heavily encouraged to support the economy. The system also punishes you for not making more given how difficult it is to survive independently on minimum wage.
This would simply be alien to a serf, once you're a serf you're a serf and your only ambitions are to pray, have sex and eat well.
>>1163768
>anarchism
>working
Look at Spain, see how well that worked, it fell flat on it's ass and lost to Franco.
>>1163788
> You are working to get more money to support yourself
Same in feudalism you just need to replace exchange medium for raw goods.
>>1163567
Shit's cash tho, tbqhfamalam
>>1163788
Beacuse we have the option to do so now. Most people prefer working their asses off and buy more shit instead of working less. It's inherent in humans to like having new shit.
>>1163745
Last I checked a lot of people did believe in god in Poland.
>Then why you trying to shill communism if you want it.
Because you tried to say that communism was shit, it was not. It was the comfiest thing ever.
>So wanting to feel important is a bad thing?
For you.
The desire to feel important is only going to make your life harder than it should be. Sure, you could say the hardship is worth it for the reward but the reward of feeling important doesn't need to matter. If you didn't internalize the attitude that importance is something to be desired you would have been just as happy living a low profile life.
You can either continue to struggle to feel important in hopes to eventually satisfy the desire, or you can learn to let go of such concerns and achieve the same satisfaction effortlessly.
>>1163786
It's kinda nice how you're just conveniently ignoring that there were societies before feudal ones and concurrent with euro christian feudal societies that didn't see the world through a christian lens. Were they all animals too? Why the fuck should we return to a belief system that claims human nature as inherently bad when we know this to be false?
I dunno about you, but If I had to and actually could sincerely make myself believe in a religion I'd pick something like the religio romana or asartru before I'd pick any given abrahamic faith.
>>1163792
Anarchism in Spain was a meme. They were just a bunch of red necks taking some land. They were very few and made a very small% of the republican army
>>1163828
>Last I checked a lot of people did believe in god in Poland.
Yet they were shot, bullied the Catholic Church for having members be a part of it.
>It was the comfiest thing ever.
No it's not, communism doesn't fucking work, it's a corrupt system.
>The desire to feel important is only going to make your life harder than it should be.
So? Life's already hard enough and I want to make my mark on it.
>>1163828
>that communism was shit, it was not
Tell that to all the dissenters that got murdered.
2016
>defending gommies.
If anyone on here started defending nazism they would be laughed out the fucking door, but the left wing authoritarian ideology gets defenders that don't get ruthlessly mocked.
>>1163745
>You could and can believe in god in communist countries.
I know it's going to get the whole "not real communism" thing but China tolerates religious practice/belief, to an extent.
>>1163891
>I know it's going to get the whole "not real communism" thing but China tolerates religious practice/belief, to an extent.
But they don't let the Bishop do his job, so it doesn't really work.
>>1163888
I do my best to ruthlessly mock any commies on here.
Are there commies around?
I got a little more time to kill, and a full reaction image folder.
>>1163841
I used Christian society as an example, not the be all end all. Our society has destroyed its metaphysics, but previous societies simply had different metaphysics. The Greeks elevated man's greatness, and shrugged away his weaknesses. They followed a morality similar to Nietzsche's master morality- strength, wisdom and other virtues are good, weakness is bad. Slavery is justified, the free men of a city should be warrior scholars. Not a Christian worldview, but not a modern world view either. Pretty badass worldview if you're a warrior-scholar, though.
As for human nature not being inherently bad, you have to define bad. If bad means "feels bad," you're right- following human nature feels quite good, its hedonistic in the extreme.
But if by bad you mean "can't sustain a society in the long term," then human nature is bad. Societies are not natural, and cannot be sustained by promiscuous sex and infertility. The "repressive" guidelines of the bible were hard to follow, but they created strong societies.
I'm of the opinion that human happiness and sustainability should both be taken into account. Pure elevation of human nature cares nothing for sustainability, so I can't support a worldview that does that
>>1163852
>Yet they were shot, bullied the Catholic Church for having members be a part of it.
You mean besides the collaboration of the clergy with the state?
I'd also like to say as an aside that whilst that kind of thing certainly did happen especially earlier into communist rule, it isn't a communist exclusive trait. Exactly that happened here in Northern Ireland for being Catholic, just from a theistic capitalist government rather than an atheistic communist one.
>No it's not, communism doesn't fucking work, it's a corrupt system.
Capitalism is already a corrupt system, as a matter of fact it rewards total moral destitution rather than punishes it. All to exploit you for all you're worth like an animal for sale.
Communism, as in the most crude Leninist form of it, can be corrupt as well. But if you make your peace with it then you can enjoy great contentment without having to worry about the problems of capitalist life.
>So? Life's already hard enough and I want to make my mark on it.
I'm just saying, you're only making your life harder by wishing for such things.
I can see the appeal in glory or whatever, but I personally would say basking in glory is the lesser reward compared to contentment. As Jesus was keen to teach.
>>1163888
>If anyone on here started defending nazism they would be laughed out the fucking door
Where do you think you are?
>>1163906
>You mean besides the collaboration of the clergy with the state?
Which is immoral.
>Exactly that happened here in Northern Ireland for being Catholic, just from a theistic capitalist government
And protestants are scum of the earth, your point?
>Capitalism is already a corrupt system, as a matter of fact it rewards total moral destitution rather than punishes it. All to exploit you for all you're worth like an animal for sale.
Capitalism is about selling your shit. How you do it doesn't matter. How is it bad for trying to sell shit.
>I can see the appeal in glory or whatever, but I personally would say basking in glory is the lesser reward compared to contentment.
But what if I'm not content with what's going on? I should do nothing? I shouldn't make a difference?
>>1163465
You're walking a really fine line between "street justice" and lawless chaos.
>>1163927
>Which is immoral.
From your view I suppose it is.
>And protestants are scum of the earth, your point?
My point is that communism doesn't necessarily entail religious persecution anymore than capitalism ensures religious freedom.
>Capitalism is about selling your shit. How you do it doesn't matter. How is it bad for trying to sell shit.
Because it grades people as inferior for having less marketable skills and attributes, when you base a society entirely around what can make the most money it's a very depressing society.
You shouldn't be demonized for being poor anymore than you should be exalted for being so morally corrupt as to fire your employees for striking. If Christianity is true then a system like this is for certain the end times.
>But what if I'm not content with what's going on? I should do nothing? I shouldn't make a difference?
Should you do what's right? Yes.
Should you seek glory just for the sake of it? No.
>>1163971
>From your view I suppose it is.
Are you saying that the state has every right to lord over the Church?
>My point is that communism doesn't necessarily entail religious persecution anymore than capitalism ensures religious freedom.
But you silly fucking goose, it wasn't about capitalism, it was about Anglos being autistic and having an impotent king that couldn't make a heir. Fuck the CoE.
>Because it grades people as inferior for having less marketable skills and attributes, when you base a society entirely around what can make the most money it's a very depressing society.
So I should be the one to burden there pain? Am I Christ? Am I suppose to be the fucking lamb for them?
>exalted for being so morally corrupt as to fire your employees for striking
So it's my fault the workers don't fucking work?
>If Christianity is true then a system like this is for certain the end times.
And communism is better? Jesus would want you to voluntarily give your goods to the poor, not force you to give half your wealth so Johnny "broke who can't work in the factories" Doe can live.
>Should you seek glory just for the sake of it? No.
So I can't seek glory and try to make myself better?
![BwC7jl4CcAEz1fz[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/oPgn2g8.jpg "BwC7jl4CcAEz1fz[1].jpg")
>>1163788
What's the difference between eating well and mindless consumerism?
>pic related
>>1164007
>Are you saying that the state has every right to lord over the Church?
No, I'm saying the church would have no reason not to.
>But you silly fucking goose, it wasn't about capitalism, it was about Anglos being autistic and having an impotent king that couldn't make a heir. Fuck the CoE.
It was about capitalism, this was happening like 30 years ago.
>So I should be the one to burden there pain? Am I Christ? Am I suppose to be the fucking lamb for them?
You're not burdening their pain. The injustice of the bourgeois system of private property ending would end their pain with it.
>So it's my fault the workers don't fucking work?
No, it's their boss' fault that they felt the need to strike to begin with.
>And communism is better? Jesus would want you to voluntarily give your goods to the poor, not force you to give half your wealth so Johnny "broke who can't work in the factories" Doe can live.
Yes communism is better. Communism is exactly like the system described in Acts of the Apostles.
And looking down on the poor like that is not very humble.
>So I can't seek glory and try to make myself better?
You can, I'm just saying gloryhounding is a fools endeavour.
As for making yourself better you can and should do that, but that isn't making your mark on the Earth like you said earlier.
>>1164129
>No, I'm saying the church would have no reason not to.
Because the dirty communists were trying to strangle the Catholic Church there.
>It was about capitalism, this was happening like 30 years ago.
The troubles? No, it was about the rights of the people who lived there before and the dirty Anglos that came over.
>The injustice of the bourgeois system of private property ending would end their pain with it.
So that means I must suffer with them because they're fucking idiots.
>No, it's their boss' fault that they felt the need to strike to begin with.
And it's the workers fault for not revolting and killing the boss.
>Communism is exactly like the system described in Acts of the Apostles.
Where the FUCK is that tripfag who posts biblical quotes to prove you wrong. Because that's wrong. Communism is godless. You must willingly give to the poor, not be forced. It must come from the heart, not from necessity. That is what Christ preached.
>As for making yourself better you can and should do that, but that isn't making your mark on the Earth like you said earlier.
Then I wanna be the best and make my mark on the Earth.
>>1164164
>Because the dirty communists were trying to strangle the Catholic Church there.
By collaborating with it? I don't think so.
>The troubles?
I know.
But conflicts like that are an inherent outgrowth of the envy and hate stoked by capitalism. It's just like the blacks in America, or Muslims in Lebanon, or any other number of conflicts.
When one the ruling class is decidedly of one ethnic group, and one ethnic group is decidedly of one class it's very easy to learn to hate and despise them for their ethnicity than it is to recognize the true class structure of society.
>suffer with them because they're fucking idiots.
Living a content life isn't suffering, it's simply living like a man should.
That's also a very un-humble way to talk about your fellow man. There's nothing wrong with being an idiot, and society shouldn't treat you as inferior for being one.
>And it's the workers fault for not revolting and killing the boss.
I agree, kill them all and let God sort them out.
The sooner the proletariat realize this the sooner society can move forward.
>You must willingly give to the poor, not be forced. It must come from the heart, not from necessity. That is what Christ preached.
God also preached righteous justice in the name of His word.
The sins of the bourgeoisie have gotten to be absolutely out of control, the only solution is to destroy them and let God punish them with eternal damnation for their crimes against humanity. Just as the Israelites recognized the justice in annihilating the nations that subjugated them, so too is it righteous for the proletariat to annihilate the bourgeoisie and distribute the wealth as Jesus would want.
If capitalism is truly the end times, then communism is clearly the Kingdom of God as prophecized.
>Then I wanna be the best and make my mark on the Earth.
You can do it if you like, all I'm saying is you're setting yourself up for a fall.
>>1164237
>By collaborating with it? I don't think so.
Collaborating with godless people who won't further your gains is wrong.
>But conflicts like that are an inherent outgrowth of the envy and hate stoked by capitalism
But it wasn't. It's like the fights you see on /his/ with protestants and Catholics at each others throats.
>Living a content life isn't suffering, it's simply living like a man should.
But I am not content with a content life. Why should I be bogged down by the fucking system.
>The sooner the proletariat realize this the sooner society can move forward.
No you idiot, it must turn into a trust system, the boss provides work and the workers provide profits and not kill.
>God also preached righteous justice in the name of His word.
Communism is a GODLESS SYSTEM. It makes you worship the fucking state. You know what faggot Karl Marx said, don't you deny it. Don't you sit here and tell me I'm in the wrong for not trusting a whore of a system that thinks religion is an opium for the masses.
>You can do it if you like, all I'm saying is you're setting yourself up for a fall.
Proofs?
>>1163464
This is the most retarded statement ive ever read
>>1163408
It's femenist bullcrap about how governments are male inventions, nothing more.
>>1164275
>Collaborating with godless people who won't further your gains is wrong.
If you quantify whether something is right or wrong based on potential gains then you must be some kind of Ferengi.
>But it wasn't. It's like the fights you see on /his/ with protestants and Catholics at each others throats.
It was, I live there.
It had nothing to do with actually being Catholic or protestant and everything to do with the fact that the entire system was weighted towards protestants by design.
>But I am not content with a content life. Why should I be bogged down by the fucking system.
Because it is the humble thing to do. To learn how to enjoy contentment.
And you're already bogged down by the system, I highely doubt you're part of the tiny minority that actually benefits from the capitalist mode of production i.e people who don't work and just harvest profits from the abstract notion of private property.
>No you idiot, it must turn into a trust system, the boss provides work and the workers provide profits and not kill.
The boss doesn't provide work, he provides access to """his""" """"property"""" that he has arbitrarily claimed.
This concept of private property is totally unnecessary, and if rising up to kill the bourgeoisie wholesale is what it takes to end it then so so be it.
>Communism is a GODLESS SYSTEM. It makes you worship the fucking state. You know what faggot Karl Marx said, don't you deny it. Don't you sit here and tell me I'm in the wrong for not trusting a whore of a system that thinks religion is an opium for the masses.
1. Communism is stateless.
2. I assume you're imagining the crude form of socialism which is Leninism, and you're right it is godless on the count that it is secular. However a state being secular isn't a bad thing.
3. You fundamentally misunderstand that Marx quote, and it is going to take another post to explain why.
>>1164333
Here is why.
When Marx says religion is the opiate of the masses he isn't insulting religion. At the time (and to this day in fact) opiates mainly painkillers and thus is where religion comes in. The brutal exploitation of society causes great suffering for people, thus they turn to religion in order to assuge their misery.
>>1163899
>>Societies are not natural, and cannot be sustained by promiscuous sex
This is false as evidenced by the open and obvious existence of this sort of stuff in countless societies regardless of whether or not those societies were rising or declining. Rome was decadent by these standards all throughout it's history. So were the greek states. And honestly? So was a lot of christian europe.
>>infertility
Is caused by economic and legal factors.
>>The "repressive" guidelines of the bible were hard to follow, but they created strong societies.
This would be more persuasive if it weren't for the simple fact that most of christian society has had massive amounts of prostitution, some of it even sponsored by churches. Muslims liked fucking other men or little boys. Plenty of hedonism there.
>>1164333
>If you quantify whether something is right or wrong based on potential gains then you must be some kind of Ferengi.
No, it's called trying to convert people.
>It had nothing to do with actually being Catholic or protestant and everything to do with the fact that the entire system was weighted towards protestants by design.
So then it's the fucking protestants fault for being goddamn autists.
>Because it is the humble thing to do. To learn how to enjoy contentment.
And live a boring life? No, I can achieve great things and letting myself die knowing that barely anyone knows who I am, or what my actions were is horseshit.
>The boss doesn't provide work, he provides access to """his""" """"property"""" that he has arbitrarily claimed.
Property is property, you want work, you play ball in his house under his rules.
>assume you're imagining the crude form of socialism which is Leninism, and you're right it is godless on the count that it is secular. However a state being secular isn't a bad thing.
But it is, secular states have done nothing but rot the foundations of the west.
>>1164350
>The brutal exploitation of society causes great suffering for people, thus they turn to religion in order to assuge their misery.
So that means we need to get rid of the suffering? So then where does religion come in? Where is it when it can come in, and try to inspire and make themselves better?
>>1163895
Read the thread, we got a commie in here.
>>1164373
>No, it's called trying to convert people.
The population was already 100% Christian essentially when the communists showed up, and atheism never really took off in Poland like it did in other communist countries.
>So then it's the fucking protestants fault for being goddamn autists.
Not for being protestant, for being greedy bourgeoisie who didn't like the idea of not being privileged fucks.
>And live a boring life? No, I can achieve great things and letting myself die knowing that barely anyone knows who I am, or what my actions were is horseshit.
Being content doesn't mean being bored, on the contrary it means enjoying yourself. But equally implies appreciating the more humble aspects of life.
Having a good time, and doing right by others does not make your actions horseshit. Even though a lot of people would have never heard your time everyone who matters to you would remember you long after death which actually important as opposed to being acknowledged by strangers in the future.
>Property is property, you want work, you play ball in his house under his rules.
It isn't, property is a spook. Thus why communism is necessary to end it.
>But it is, secular states have done nothing but rot the foundations of the west.
They haven't, the USA has been secular for hundreds of years now but the degeneration of society only started to happen with industrialization. Capitalism is the true blight on all society, it commodifies all culture into something to be marketed, degrades all people into assets to be bid on and reduces all peoples to simple markets.
Religious freedom isn't the enemy to culture. Capitalism is.
>So that means we need to get rid of the suffering? So then . . .
1. In a sense.
2. Religion comes to the people who feel they need it. If in a society free of suffering religion would be more a matter of personal truth and fulfillment since the only thing left to do is enrich yourself.
>>1164429
>The population was already 100% Christian essentially when the communists showed up, and atheism never really took off in Poland like it did in other communist countries.
Because it was Catholic, and the Catholic Church would support them.
>Not for being protestant, for being greedy bourgeoisie who didn't like the idea of not being privileged fucks.
So protestants.
>Being content doesn't mean being bored, on the contrary it means enjoying yourself. But equally implies appreciating the more humble aspects of life.
So I shouldn't become a politician, or a leader? You know, doing something?
>It isn't, property is a spook. Thus why communism is necessary to end it.
Communism is a spook in it's own right.
>They haven't, the USA has been secular for hundreds of years now but the degeneration of society only started to happen with industrialization
You mean during the enlightenment. In which bullshit ideals like communism started.
>2. Religion comes to the people who feel they need it. If in a society free of suffering religion would be more a matter of personal truth and fulfillment since the only thing left to do is enrich yourself.
But no one would go. Because they have no qualms.
>>1164463
>So protestants.
Every ruling class does this to minorities.
>So I shouldn't become a politician, or a leader? You know, doing something?
Being humble doesn't preclude being active.
>Communism is a spook in it's own right.
It is, but not all spooks are negative.
>You mean during the enlightenment. In which bullshit ideals like communism started.
I don't, the enlightenment was more or less the pinnacle of western culture as we know it. Not to mention communism only emerged long after the enlightenment.
>But no one would go. Because they have no qualms.
Do you really believe the only reason you follow religion is to assuge your material suffering?
>every single advance in women's rights has been achieved thanks to the power of the State
>the countries with greater rights for women are the countries with largest states (see Sweden, or see how women's rights declined in former communist countries like East Germany, Russia and even China after the Mao era)
It's obvious that women depend on the state for the advancement of their political interests. It's not surprising, considering that it's also in the interest of the central government authority to use those at the bottom of society to break the power of independent power centres. The relation between women and statism is organic and mutually benefitial and that's why anarcho-feminism is a joke.
>>1163792
The anarchists (and the republicans as a whole) lost to a superior military power, yes. That says nothing about how effective anarchism is for maintaining a society; the most you could reasonably argue is that it isn't the best way to win a war.
>>1164314
It's true. I don't care if you disagree with anarchism but don't pretend it's something it's not.
>>1163578
>Queer Anarchism is a thing
I suppose to the 5 people in the world who are actually queer Anarchists, yes.
>>1164479
>Every ruling class does this to minorities.
And I only care about the minorities that related to me.
>Being humble doesn't preclude being active.
But you're implying I should be content with my life here.
>It is, but not all spooks are negative.
No no, you can't have your cake and eat it too.
>I don't, the enlightenment was more or less the pinnacle of western culture as we know it. Not to mention communism only emerged long after the enlightenment.
The enlightenment is the most degenerate era, a horrible stage of events that fucks everyone over.
>>1163408
>Enlighten me about Anarcho-Feminism friends
The most retarded combination of two retarded ideologies.
Just add Nazism to this to make it even more retarded
>>1164527
>And I only care about the minorities that related to me.
They're all related to you, they're all human.
>But you're implying I should be content with my life here.
Yes, you can be content with your life but still have ambitions. Especially in terms of politics.
>No no, you can't have your cake and eat it too.
Why not? What's wrong with recognizing social constructs, and further distinguishing between positive ones and negative ones?
You don't have to go the full Stirner to recognize how things like private property are unnecessary, and certainly not sacrosanct.
>The enlightenment is the most degenerate era, a horrible stage of events that fucks everyone over.
What exactly did the enlightenment do wrong?
>>1164553
>They're all related to you, they're all human.
No, they aren't. They aren't my fucking tribe, my fucking people.
>Yes, you can be content with your life but still have ambitions. Especially in terms of politics.
So then why am I in the wrong over wanting to have power?
>You don't have to go the full Stirner to recognize how things like private property are unnecessary, and certainly not sacrosanct.
But you gotta, or you're a fucking spook.
>What exactly did the enlightenment do wrong?
Ruin the west, corrupted it, ruin the Catholic Church, help spur protestant heresies.
>>1163552
An anarchic society might exist governed just by natural law. But natural law is not kind to feminism
>>1164572
>No, they aren't. They aren't my fucking tribe, my fucking people.
All are equal before God, friend.
>So then why am I in the wrong over wanting to have power?
Because you're seeking power for the wrong reasons.
Gloryhounding and viewing power as an end in itself are not good reasons to want it, to empower everyone is a good reason.
>But you gotta, or you're a fucking spook.
As I said something being a spook isn't necessarily a bad thing, but in the case of private property in particular the spooky nature of it undermines any appeals to its existence. Because it doesn't exist.
>Ruin the west, corrupted it, ruin the Catholic Church, help spur protestant heresies.
That isn't being exact.
>>1164605
>All are equal before God, friend.
So am I God? No, God is above me, and he see's us as equals like a man would see a flock of birds.
>Gloryhounding and viewing power as an end in itself are not good reasons to want it, to empower everyone is a good reason.
But what if I want it to make myself feel like I'm worth something can end my narcissism.
>Because it doesn't exist.
But it does, that land I own is mine because I proved it is mine because I used the strength to prove it.
>That isn't being exact.
The whole fucking act spurred more Protestants to make more false bullshit and ruin the west.
>>1163465
It's literally lawlessness you dumb teenager.
>>1164626
>So am I God? No, God is above me, and he see's us as equals like a man would see a flock of birds.
No, but we ought follow God's teachings and treat each other equally without resorting to tribalism.
>But what if I want it to make myself feel like I'm worth something can end my narcissism.
I'd suggest it would be easier to simply learn to be content.
>But it does, that land I own is mine because I proved it is mine because I used the strength to prove it.
No, you claimed it is yours and the state uses force to uphold that claim. If some aliens showed up, wiped out the armed forces, then refused to recognize your property all that ideological justification would mean nothing.
>The whole fucking act spurred more Protestants to make more false bullshit and ruin the west.
That's not being exact either.
I don't get why reactionaries hate the enlightenment so much, it's not like pre-enlightenment society was particularly good.
>>1164669
>No, but we ought follow God's teachings and treat each other equally without resorting to tribalism.
Again, my tribe over yours, they follow God, I follow God.
>I'd suggest it would be easier to simply learn to be content.
That's not going to please my narcissism.
>No, you claimed it is yours and the state uses force to uphold that claim. If some aliens showed up, wiped out the armed forces, then refused to recognize your property all that ideological justification would mean nothing.
Then I would fight tooth and nail for my fucking property. Fuck them I paid money.
>I don't get why reactionaries hate the enlightenment so much, it's not like pre-enlightenment society was particularly good.
It's only better because protestantism autism didn't keep spreading.
>>1164690
>Again, my tribe over yours, they follow God, I follow God.
I'm not sure what you mean.
>That's not going to please my narcissism.
No, but it's about being less of a narcissist.
>Then I would fight tooth and nail for my fucking property. Fuck them I paid money.
And this means what exactly?
You paid abstract coupons in exchange for state enforcement of your abstract claim to property. This is about as meaningful as kids claiming a particular swing.
>It's only better because protestantism autism didn't keep spreading.
Protestants are OK guys.
>>1163408
>be an anarchist
>have a flag for the institution I affiliate myself with
>>1164722
>I'm not sure what you mean.
They follow God, I follow God. That's it, that's the only line there is. We are different but they follow the same God I do, but that doesn't make us equals.
>No, but it's about being less of a narcissist.
That's not happening.
>And this means what exactly?
Trying to defend my property while shooting and probably dying while aliens do weird shit to me.
>Protestants are OK guys.
>caused > > > become even more decentralized
>caused Europe to split even more
>has done nothing but cause more and more shit to ruin it
>>1163465
>her friends and male relatives would probably murder you and this would be received as justified by the community thus protecting them from revenge killings
Literally lynch mobs
>little repercussions
why?
>>1165549
literally rapists
this isn't liberal feminism
>>1163465
Jesus Christ, how does the moral concept of A JUSTIFIED FUCKING WITCH HUNT not terrify anarchists?
What things would you had to have seen in order to look at this and think this is totally okay?
>>1163408
Imagine if a person with mild aspergers had sex with a 300 pound women who wears hardly any clothes so she can sweat and they made a kid. That kid has mild aspergers and is 400 pounds due to genetics. That's Anarcho-Feminism.
>>1164314
Ironically, a statement calling another statement the most retarded thing he's ever read is the most retarded thing I've ever read.
>>1163408
Ahem. It's spelled "Anarcha-Feminism"
>>1165590
Point is neutral arbiters at least try to protect others from the miscarriage of justice. Who knows if the woman in question is lying? "Listening and (blindly) believing" leads to bullying at best and killing innocents without trial in more cases than acceptable
>>1165615
>That kid has mild aspergers and is 400 pounds due to genetics.
how fucking bad does your metabolism have to be for it to be the main cause of you weighing 400lbs and not being a lazy fuck?
>>1165633
>Anarcha
This shit always made me laugh. Fucking feminists, man.
>>1164736
>anarchists aren't allowed to have symbols
Who makes these rules?
>>1163670
You NEETs would suffer with the compulsory labour.
>>1163698
The meaning is left to the individual to decide thanks.
>>1165695
rape apologists everyone
>>1163891
Tbh China isn't that communist, they gave that up when it left millions dead. Now they are stick with an authoritarian one party state, a bunch of rhetoric and an essentially mixed economy.
>>1163971
It's only wrong sometimes to fire your employees for striking. Reagan did the right thing (even if it was in the public sector).
>>1163670
lefty/pol/ you are as terrible as regular /pol/
>>implying communist nations are the same as capitalist countries with welfare systems.
No.
>>1164164
>Ulster-Scots
>Anglos
We should have given the Catholics rights earlier anyway. Would have avoided the shitshow that was the troubles.
Is there such a thing as Cuckold Anarchism?
>>1163450
>laws have been selectively enforced
Right, because men walk free after raping, killing, hitting women.
>>1163465
>"Anarchism isn't lawless chaos."
>proceeds to describe lawless chaos
>>1163670
>impying commie and anarcho babies could survive in any sort of communist dictatorship for a week
>>1166829
All of it.
Also, captcha was 420.
>>1166712
>rape apologists everyone
I know you're memeing, but it's astonishing feminists actually believe anyone who questions for the sake of veracity automatically defend rape.
>>1163450
Why do people still believe women are an oppressed or marginalized class in modern society?
>>1163450
Is that the catchphrase for every anarcho-x/communist-x movement?
"I know it wouldn't work right now, we just have to create a culture where everything works so that my ideology will work"
>>1166728
Ulster-Scots are mostly descended from Northern Englanders and Lowland Scots, it's a very anglo-centric culture
A Brief History of Sex and Feminism in the 20th Century America.
In the early 20th century, Sigmund Freud posited that sexual repression causes a plethora of social and mental ills, prompting his advocacy for liberation through sexual freedom. The concept was further developed by other intellectuals, with Wilhelm Reich being an important one who also worked on ideas for sexualizing the clergy to destroy the influence of the Christian Church, which he saw as an "International antisexual organization" and one of the pillars of "fascism".
Porn had been produced since the advent of film (see "stag films"), but if they weren't destroyed due to human error (especially with regards to the flammability of celluloid), the police routinely confiscated reels or interrupted performers, and with no official distribution outlet, most of them never saw the light of day.
Enter Hugh Hefner, who began pushing lascivious material wholly supported by wealthy Jewish businessmen in the '50s. Marilyn Monroe herself converted to Judaism to please the powers-that-be and she was on the cover of the first Playboy. Jews and Protestants were, to some extent, allied during this period and are still today for different reasons.
In the '60s, Hollywood producers put tits into movies (incidentally, a Holocaust movie), and opened the floodgates to filmed pornography. Within a couple of years you have hardcore porn all across US cinemas as "freedom" while the Catholic church had completely lost its cultural clout in putting a stop to Judeo-Protestant influence. At the same time, you have the more general sexual liberation movement, largely led by Jewish men, certainly inspired by psychoanalysis, but also involving someone like Kinsey (a Protestant) and the Rockefellers (also Protestants). No women here.
Stavvers (aka the ugly brit who made bread from her own vaginal yeast infection) is an anarcho-feminist. That pretty much says it all
Feminist opposition to porn started to develop throughout the 60s and 70s, spearheaded by Jewish women (Brownmiller, Dworkin, Steinem, and continuing to this day with Jewish women like Ariel Levy, Gail Dines and others). Th earliest known feminist analysis of pornography posits that it fundamentally degrades to women, reducing them to objects, and serves no greater purpose than to be "propaganda of patriarchy," inflicting harm on society at large. Radical feminists like Dworkin, Jeffreys and MacKinnon echoed this theme in opposition to the sexual revolution and formed the bulwark against it.
As the "war on sex" raged on, postmodernism started flourishing, with men like Foucault, Lacan, Derrida and more. By the 80s, this movement would inspire certain women to challenge the views on sexuality, pornography, prostitution and transsexuality that dominated feminism at the time. They were seen as "conservative," outdated and ultimately contradictory, but most of all, "sex negative" feminism was a lost cause, because pornography had already won the culture war. So they developed a deconstruction of these original feminist ideas that was more compatible with capitalism and male sexual desires expressed through pornography. This ushered in what came to be known as the third wave (starting in the 90s), which is the ideological inverse of the second wave and actively promotes pornography and sexualization as liberation. The third wave was warmly welcomed by pornographers and other elites and was thusly promoted.
In a way, third wave feminism is the final form of feminism. If you see men supporting any kind of feminism, it is typically this one. The Jewish intellectuals were curiously mute when their older sisters, aunts and mothers were saying that pornography should be banned. For recent examples other than Soros, consider Noah Berlatsky who writes for Playboy and told Meghan Murphy, a white radical feminist, that she is wrong and stupid to daring to question a naked black tranny in Playboy as the epitome of social progress.
Many young feminist women today are profoundly confused about feminism and the world in general. They are seemingly unaware that contemporary feminism and the feminism of 50 years ago are mutually exclusive, despite both being founded on the notion of female superiority. As a result, they may at times promote contradictory positions. To some extent, and given the postmodern origins of certain aspects of third-wave ideology, this seems also to be intentional. The more nonsensical, contradictory and confusing, the more revolutionary it is. Everything has to be destroyed, even those things that are already in conflict among themselves.
>>1165612
It's not a witch hunt, it's mob-rule.
Freud had the foresight to suppose that maybe, just maybe, sexual repression is necessary for the development of high culture. He noted that free sexual play was permitted among primitive people, and that those people lacked many of the neuroses found in civilized societies. He thought maybe neuroses could be prevented if parents were not so strictly repressive of sexual play between children, then he pondered "Well, maybe the prohibition is necessary for cultural development."
By the end of our lives perhaps, we'll see how the thesis plays out. The naive thrill-seekers who thought the WASPs were just being puritan out of hatred and we all needed to be liberated from their oppression will discover in a few generations after radical sexual freedom is implemented that the general culture will decay to a savage level.
The effect will be very gradual, but by the time we are seniors, the damage will be visible. The only options will then be to just abandon the idea of civilization or drastically implement authoritarian controls. Speech will be suppressed. Women will lose many current "rights". Those involved in sex professionally will be put to the new system's justice.
>>1166703
The idea of compulsory labour doesn't bother me, but being treated as inferior based on the money you make does.
>>1166723
That's not what I implied at all.
I'm just of the opinion that the Eastern bloc looks like the comfiest shit ever and the greatest tragedy to befall our times is Western normies bullied them into collapsing.
>>1167343
You ever lived in the eastern block or are you just memeing?
>>1167335
>It's not a witch hunt, it's mob-rule.
Just because you switch the terms to something more favorable doesn't make its subtext less nefarious.
So if I understand correctly, all branches of anarchism are in the end literally the same, the only differences are how people hope it will play out?
>>1167352
>So if I understand correctly, all branches of anarchism are in the end literally the same, the only differences are how people hope it will play out?
Anarchism is nothing more than the ultimate fusion of libertarianism and socialism.
>>1167347
No, but I've been reading a lot of books on it and it sounds like paradise.
You get a job, a house and the state will support you until your dying day. You never have to face the dread of capitalist society.
I suppose I can see why a lot of people wouldn't like it though.
>>1167348
Lynch-mobbing rapists isn't a witch-hunt, it's just law.
>>1163465
>if you rape someone then her friends and male relatives would probably murder you
When, after my band of 20 other rapists and thieves have murdered them and taken their stuff?
>>1167364
There will always be less thieves and rapists than normal people.
If you form a big gang you would for certain just annihilated to the last man.
>>1167357
It collapsed when I was like only 6 years old but I remember that there was jack shit you could actually buy, constant shortage of goods. 40 years before that the government even had to artificially destroy the purchasing power of the people to kill demand.
In all honesty if you want something like that, just kill someone and go to jail.
>free housing
>free food
>free healthcare
>severely restricted access to goods
>resctricted access to information
>enforced equality
>you can't leave
Prison is 100% like Ostblok socialism.
>>1167366
But normal people are afraid of violence and easy to cuck. That's literally how states formed in the first place.
>>1167376
Yeah but in jail you might get buttraped.
In the eastern bloc there was cops all over the place so it safe as well.
Eastern bloc communism was also infinitely comfier than jail.
>>1167357
I get all of those in my country as well without having to go full commie
>>1167384
In the eastern block you got buttraped by those cops.
>>1167378
They aren't naturally afraid of violence, it just has to be beaten out of them by society.
>>1167384
>comfier
Absolutely not. Nothing comfy about it whatsoever.
>>1167384
Move to a non-shithole and go to jail
>>1167388
On the count that most cops are heterosexual I wouldn't worry about getting buttraped too much.
Not to mention cops can still abuse you with impunity in capitalism.
>>1167390
A band of specialized soldiers who live off looting will fight more efficiently than than a bunch of farmers. And the fact still stands that normal people get cucked and that's how societies form, if not by looters and robbers then by the "protectors".
>>1167396
Figurative buttrape. You got beaten and shit a lot.
>>1167393
What isn't comfy about it?
>Free house
>Free job
>Lots of stuff to do unlike in prison
>>1167403
That definitely happens in capitalism.
Especially if you're some kind of ethnic minority.
>>1167402
Yes but now that we have guns and bombs it's a lot harder to cuck people by force.
>>1167406
>house
More like a shithole commieblock apartment you had to wait 5 years for. Heavy preferential treatment for nomenklatura kids as well.
>job
Most people ended up with a shitty dead end job and if you didn't have a clean class profile you got fucked and wasn't allowed to go to college and stuff.
>>1167408
Ethnics can go fuck themselves.
>>1167417
>Yes but now that we have guns and bombs it's a lot harder to cuck people by force.
Any retard can fire a gun or lob a grenade, but it takes skill to build and deploy weapons efficiently.
>>1167422
>More like a shithole commieblock apartment you had to wait 5 years for. Heavy preferential treatment for nomenklatura kids as well.
Commieblock apartments are comfy.
>Most people ended up with a shitty dead end job and if you didn't have a clean class profile you got fucked and wasn't allowed to go to college and stuff.
Don't give a fuck, you could still survive independently on the shittiest job.
>>1167417
Debatable, perhaps if everyone is handed guns, given training, and a constant stream of ammo. Otherwise it would just be the one who owns the most guns when the government falls (criminals and former military). Also a fun thing about guns and bombs is that one person using guerrilla tactics could cuck an entire village.
>>1167427
Which is why the USA, for all their equipment and training, get repeatedly raped by guerillas?
>>1167423
Edgy.
>>1167432
>Commieblock apartments are comfy.
I doubt you ever lived in one. They're horrible.
>>1167438
When did that happen? Vietcong was beaten to shit and completely eradicated in the Vietnam war if you mean that.
>>1167446
They're very austere, but that justs adds to the comfy factor.
>>1167374
>Truly interesting. Thank you.
>However, feminism, as an ideology, has always been ou will always be used by capitalism. Read Edward Barnays, he reveals how he used his uncle's theory - his uncle being Freud - and feminism to advertise cigarettes for women.
Talking about this article? I read it, too. It's quite fascinating, actually:
http://markmanson.net/insecurity
One thing I failed to touch on is the unusual dynamic of the conflict and unity between "sex positive" and "sex negative" feminism. So called "sex positive" feminists defend the right of sluts to be moral vacuums, but they rarely, if ever, defend a "stud" or sexually active male with many conquests. "Sex negative" feminists say men degrade women by turning them into sex objects, so they never condemn a girl for being a slut and, for all intents and purposes, the slut fits into "sex negative" feminism's victimhood narrative. The idea they are moral prudes is bullshit. They are against a women being a slut to make men like her, they hate the power the female sex drive might give to men.
One group degrade the sexual desires, demoralize and take power away from males, the other gives power to any female regardless of how much of a worthless cunt she is. Together they form feminist, who's objective is taking away power from man and give it to women. The confusion comes from the preconceived notion feminism actually tries to treat both sexes equally; it doesn't. It tries to completely undermine one while completely favors the othe
>>1167453
*other
>>1167450
How would you know if you never lived in one? You're literally just imagining things.
>>1167449
The war in Afghanistan is still happening.
>>1167458
I can't remember a single instance of the US getting raped by guerillas there.
>>1167456
Here in the UK we have our own commieblocks.
>>1167461
It is taking them almost 20 years to beat the Taliban.
That is shocking in itself.
>>1167467
Pray tell how many provinces does Taliban currently control?
>>1167450
>shit insulation
>hearing your neighbor taking a shit while you're eating
>neighbors waking you up by having a fucking session at 4 AM
>rust, mold, shit
It's about as comfy as a medieval dungeon.
>>1167472
Quite a few.
>>1167438
>Which is why the USA, for all their equipment and training, get repeatedly raped by guerillas?
The US Army recruits those with nothing to lose, so it doesn't take a genius to point out the quality of the average soldier scrapes rock bottom. It takes a decent general and officers beneath him to actually strategize and fight the war efficiently.
If anything, you're supporting my point that anyone can fire a gun or lob a grenade.
>>1167361
What if it's a trans-woman? THat is transphobic violence
>>1167483
>causing shit somewhere = controlling it
Nope. That's like saying IRA controls or controlled Northern Ireland.
>>1167483
The Taliban is not actually a single centralised organisation united in one ideology like the Vietkong was. It is mostly local populace fighting outside influence (including other Afghans), the Taliban will never be defeated because it barely exists to begin iwth
>>1167366
Brigands, bandits and what have you were typically not defeated by the people they terrorised
>>1163465
what if they never raped her and she just said they did
>>1167511
Once you get the local warlord in your pocket, you virtually control the zone.
>>1167616
It does not matter as no one will be able to physically overpower you or a real criminal and only real criminals and maybe you have a weapon.
>>1167453
Nope.
I'm talking about his book, "Propaganda".
>>1167357
>I've been reading a lot of books on it and it sounds like paradise
Great fucking job. Yugoslavia was the most free of the communist/socialist countries and for the first few decades, any sort of opposition to the rule was punished by imprisonment (for the first decade by death in a random hole in the woods). Don't talk about shit you don't understand. My grandfather was a partisan and he was questioned by the secret police because my grandmother read a religious book. If he wasn't a partisan, there would be consequences.
>>1167384
Do you really think a cop would care what happened to you? Even today, cops in post-communist countries don't give a shit. It's corrupt as hell.
>>1163408
I don't know. Men are seriously strong (I phrase it like that because the alternative is "I'm weak").
I'm really glad laws exist.
>>1163408
>classless society
>merits of the individual are key
choose one
>>1168725
>I'm really glad laws exist.
Statist scum,
>>1163408
it's just some retarded idea that attention whoring women came up with because just plain anarchy wasn't good enough for them
>>1163408
>anarcho feminism
>every lawless society in human history became patriarchal
hmmmm
>>1167458
So now we're using the Taliban as an example of "normal people defending themselves from marauding rape-warbands?" Because that's how things got onto the subject of guerilla warfare.
The Taliban are a perfect example of the opposite - they impose control over the "normal people" and do what they want because they're violent bullies. If you were some Afghan dirt farmer and Ahmed Talib wants your car and your daughters, you're shit out of luck. Peace is imposed when somebody is the biggest bully and can deter others from misbehaving by monopolizing force. Things like constitutions, ideally, prohibit that bully from abusing that power.
