If girls are not everything in life, then why does everything evolve around them?
Lifting evolves around lookin better or being stronger to be more attractive for woman, a better job with more money gives you more reasons to live with a woman etc.
How should i even cope with that shit, when i'm done with girls because of trust issues?
GO BE GAY SOMEWHERE ELSE
FUCK
WHAT IS WITH THESE THREADS
>evolve
FUCKING RETARDS
LEEEEEEEEEEAVE!!!
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Ultimately everything you do is for yourself. Lifting and eating healthy doesn't make women fit. Attaining money doesn't make women rich. It is you who receive the benefits of self improvement.
>>36419833
You clearly aren't done with girls if you can't form a single thought which they are not central to.
women are an integral part to the proliferation of your own genes, just as men are an integral part to the proliferation of women's genes.
But that doesn't mean the equation doesn't contain other parts. Status & property are in a lot of ways also connected to your physique and have a direct effect on your ability to proliferate your genes.
>>36419833
unless you are homosexual everything you do in life is aimed around getting the best mate
it's simple biology
Women continue the species. All normal men are born with an innate desire to please, protect, and attract women to aid this. Its so painfully obvious because even all the men who talk about how they are 'done' with women spend an inordinate amount of time talking about it.
Just accept it breh, a large amount of your life is going to revolve around women. It doesn't mean the thing you do have no other value or aren't impressive in their own right.
>lifting evolves around lookin better or being stronger to be more attractive for woman
no it doesn't
>a better job with more money gives you more reasons to live with a woman
no it doesn't
glad i could clear that up
Omg the people who worship these women are so fucking cucked. Sometimes I wish I was living in an earlier time period where it was acceptable to kill off the weak.
You lift for strength, lift for self improvement, lift for mental strength. You don't fucking lift to be accepted by humans who can't even keep simple emotions in check, let alone do much else of worth.
What can a women do that a man cannot do better, except push out a kid?
>>36419859
Anon is correct.
>>36419859
Guess so, but will i ever be "done" with girls? Probably not
>>36419975
Loving women to an unhealthy degree isn't a choice. It's a sexuality.
>>36420155
Probably not, why would you want to be? It isn't black and white.
Just accept that being a straight male some things you do will be motivated by sex. This isn't good or bad, it just is what it is. Obviously there's a balance to strike and currently you are putting too much value in what women think of you.
Don't try and be 'done' with girls. That's the domain of the poor sons of bitches in the MGTOW movement who externalise all their problems and will probably never be properly happy.
Just live your life for you. Take opportunities when they present themselves and try not to let past experience rule every judgement call you take. Sometimes you'll get hurt and that's okay. Try to learn something sensible from it and reflect on it rationally when the initial pain is gone.
Good luck anon.
>>36420342
I think only a minority of men are motivated by sex. Most healthy men experience a strong desire to engage in romantic relationships with women, not just have casual sexual encounters. Sex is easy and risk-free, the latter is dangerous and will destroy you.
>>36420354
I think it's short sighted to think men only have a single motivation. Their motivation for some things may be sex while also being motivated to do other things because they want a romantic relationship.
The latter will only destroy you if you are weak.
“If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.”
>>36419833
1. It does not
2. It does not
3. Learn to give your full trust only to those who have proven they are worthy of it, if you give it away to any girl you date then of course there will be issues
>>36420419
>The latter will only destroy you if you are weak.
If you were prone to strong romantic feelings, you'd know what I'm talking about. It's not cerebral; it's entirely emotional, and it dominates your reality.
Then it all comes crashing down because it's built on a fantasy. It's impossible for a couple to remain in that kind of love, it's impossible for those feelings to sustain as strongly as they have. It also gives you delusional opinions about the other person and a sense of righteousness, when in reality you're just a shitty fag and so is she.
It's like being forced by your brain to love dog shit unconditionally, and then 3 months later when it wears off you figure out that you've been devoting your life to dog shit.
You are stuck in your lower chakras at the moment, meditate on:
what makes you feel stable, and why it does
What makes you feel excited (emotionally and sexually) and why
What makes you feel connected to other people, and why
Lifting gives you health (increased circulation, faster metabolism, balanced hormones, stronger bones and others)
Money can buy you security and stability, the chance to go to sleep without having to worry about losing a job or suddenly going broke. Also a lot of fun stuff, not only material posessions but experiences, knowledge or power to influence the world.
Yes, biology made us so that we do care about women, and we will until our dicks stop working and shrivel up, but what OP said is simply not true.
>>36420484
Learn to get a sense of perspective then, emotions should never dominate your reality. You may find Cognitive Behavioural Therapy useful.
“If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.”
Don't brush this off with 'wah wah wah you've obviously never felt love liek I have' because honestly you aren't a special snowflake and you're then just seeking validation for your unhealthy behaviour.
>>36420576
I don't think you're assessing my point critically.
Am I looking for validation? Perhaps, but that isn't a particularly insightful comment. You're looking for validation, too. You don't require it (nor do I), but it'd be pleasant if you had it. You want your thoughts and ideas to be validated, just like literally any human alive.
Now, maybe you're saying that I'm unwilling to interact with your position. Well, I disagree. However, perhaps you're unwilling to do the same?
In any case, I don't think you've characterized my argument entirely fairly. I'm not making any grandiose statement other than "these emotions are not preferable, but they are strong and unavoidable".
It's the catch 22 of human existence that men have been writing about for as long as writing has existed. We have developed strong reactions to impel the species that aren't necessarily consistent with long-term happiness or reality. That is sad.
That's all.
>>36420342
>Just live your life for you. Take opportunities when they present themselves and try not to let past experience rule every judgement call you take. Sometimes you'll get hurt and that's okay. Try to learn something sensible from it and reflect on it rationally when the initial pain is gone.
The hardest thing about life
>>36420484
>It's impossible for a couple to remain in that kind of love, it's impossible for those feelings to sustain as strongly as they have
This, relationships do not last forever, especially not in this day and age and especially not in your teens or 20s.
People, men and woman alike, tend to settle down at like 30+ and change partners in their 20s a lot, eventhough they might seem faithfull and whatnot.
>>36420632
Not to mention, even if you ever do get married and actually like the person you're married to, all it would take is one young woman (or man, whatever) to come along and for you to experience that strong bonding reaction (limerence, the 'obsession' phase of early relationships) and the relationship is destroyed.
>>36420611
My entire point is that those emotions are avoidable. You need to teach yourself how to respond appropriately to them and how to recognise them.
I don't require validation for my thoughts in this. I'm just trying to help an anon who I will never meet.
>>36420648
Yup, it is how it is.
>>36419833
>why does everything evolve around them
maybe for you, but that's because you base too much of your self-worth on how well you can attract women. I'm staying /fit/ so I don't die young of a heart attack.
>a better job with more money gives you more reasons to live with a woman
no, a better job means I get to live more comfortably and enjoy myself more.
>when i'm done with girls because of trust issues
instead of writing girls off completely because your trust was probably broken by 1 maybe 2 girls in your life, you could, I don't know, see them as the flawed human beings that they are, just like all of us?
You think everything revolves around girls because that's all you see, and you shut out all other valid responses to why people want to be fit.
>>36420674
Whom.
In any case, if those emotions were avoidable, there would be no human species. Sounds like you've been drinking too much mind over matter kool-aid. Don't get me wrong, the idea that you're a brain in a jar merely interacting with reality in a second hand fashion can be somewhat liberating, but it doesn't override the fact that the systems in your brain have evolved to respond to your perception of reality (and cohere that perception concretely) fairly robustly.
>>36420693
I'm not trying to say it is black and white, emotions are turned on and off but we are capable of regulating them and learning to respond appropriately to emotional cues.
This is evident in studies about anger. Those people who use a punching bag to 'release' anger gradually become prone to more and more outbursts of anger for controlled stimuli. People who reflect and let anger pass become generally less angry. Controlling emotional response goes hand in hand with regulating those same emotions.
You seem to feel liberated by the idea of being a slave to our emotions and reactive instincts.
>>36420737
I think you're putting too much stock in the jargon you've absorbed through therapy. Not everything can be so neatly twisted around in some spectacular fashion as to expose the individual as a fraud who has plotted his reality around his convenience. This is the fiction of psychiatry, that everything can be neatly explained in such a manner.
That's all I have left to say, really. We'll agree to disagree on this subject.
>>36420780
>the fiction of psychiatry
you can't just throw something like that out and simultaneously try and slam the door on any further discussion.
How do you justify holding your feelings over verifiable research?
>>36420780
I had counselling as a teenager which was just talking therapy. They just listened. I've never had formal therapy.
My 'therapy' has come from self reflection, reading classic philosophy and seeing what has helped the people in my life including myself. I'm not trying to wrap it up in a neat bow. I'm telling you what you can achieve if you work towards creating healthy emotional habits.
>>36419852
>Alimony
>>36420877
>How do you justify holding your feelings over verifiable research?
I don't think the citations or example provided are consistent with the experience I'm describing. That poster has merely postulated 'emotions' as a binary and is making his point only via proxy. I don't accept such a statement or claim as anything near authoritative. We're talking about stronger emotions very close to the most primal element of biological existence; reproduction. Stuff like anger in comparison is tertiary.
>>36420878
I am of the opinion that, while your education might have helped you in some ways, it's merely been an exercise in learning how to be properly delusional. Eastern philosophy was literally built around this premise.
*tips fedora*
>>36420877
For some people it is easier to accept you are a slave to your emotions than accepting you can make it better. Once you admit to yourself you aren't a total slave to it you are committing to working towards changing. And that commitment to changing carries a risk of failure which makes things difficult for anyone.
>>36420917
>I am a special snowflake nobody has ever experienced the darkness I am feeling
>>36420995
Again, you mischaracterize my arguments. There's no point debating with someone who insults your intelligence. At least, unless they can walk the walk.
>no female contact my entire life
>girl talks to me
>fall in love
THESE EMOTIONS ARE UNCONTROLLABLE AND NO ONE UNDERSTANDS ME
>>36421006
Clearly you have an emotional intelligence worth insulting.
I hope you make it one day anon.
>>36420917
except anger is just another form of arousal, just like a feeling of sexual arousal.
There are deeper emotions behind the need to belong, and the comfort we get with someone we trust in whole-heartedly, which is a biological need, much like satisfying hunger or getting sleep.
Sexual arousal and reproduction is not as immediate of a need that you may think it is. You don't want to have sex with women because of reproduction, you do it because the act is pleasurable. We have contraception to stop reproduction.
This idea that we have sex just to reproduce is to ignore all societal influences on sex. Like, what's stopping you from having sex with a landwhale? Status, most likely, you don't want to be seen fucking a fatty, or an ugly chick.
We make rationalizations that fit our preferences after the fact.
>>36420995
For some people it is easier to accept you are a slave to your emotions than accepting you can make it better.
What you outlined in a previous post was the clinical therapeutic method of Cognitive Behavioural Therapy or CBT. Be mindful of your thought processes and how they affect your choices, and modify your behaviour.
Remember your ABCs. Affect, Behaviour, Cognition.
>>36421035
You're starting to tread more directly on the grounds of pseudoscience. The problem is that you're fundamentally misunderstanding evolutionary biology.
Yes, contraceptives exist. No, they do not rewrite our fundamental biological impetus. We exist as a species in the sole context of evolution impelled by reproduction. It undergirds our emotional desires, which form the backbone of our reality. Logic is a slave to emotions, not the other way around. This statement demonstrates my point:
>We make rationalizations that fit our preferences after the fact.
Condoms don't mean that reproduction at its root doesn't still undergird our behavior. It does, but in more complex and round about ways. People who are living life in complete absence of the possibility of reproduction haven't hacked or side-stepped evolution, they are merely playing their part and still dancing to the tune of millions year old biological instructions.
>>36421072
>>36421035
This anon is not me btw (I wrote>>36420737)
>>36421103
I know.
>>36421072
Also I should amend my statement and say that I don't think logic is exclusively a slave to emotions, but agree with the positive psychological view on a feedback loop/interaction between the two.
>>36421072
>You're starting to tread more directly on the grounds of pseudoscience
then uses biological determinism
You have it backwards my friend. Evolutionary, biological, and genetic drives are tertiary. You really should open up a Psychology textbook before you spout more pseudoscience.
>>36421155
>biological determinism
Literally a buzzword that nobody has ever believed.
The human species can be defined materially through the sum of environment + genetic interactions.
There are two camps: culture-only people (you), and hybrids with the correct view of reality (me, most scientists who are not you).
Social science lunatics typically fall, tragically, into the former category.
>>36421180
>>biological determinism
>Literally a buzzword that nobody has ever believed.
Just because you've never heard of it? It's one of the largest criticisms of biological theories of human behaviour, and as a result, biological models can only thus be regarded as tertiary compared to affect(primary), and social factors(secondary). You can fucking read this for yourself.
Don't just read Sam Harris and think you have all the answers, m8.
>>36421277
It's a buzzword that has always existed in critiques of the hybrid position levied by pseudoscientists (yourself, other believers in the blank slate).
Biological factors undergird and describe behavior. Society is shaped around that reality. To explain human behavior in any other way is completely irrational.
>>36421277
Not anon you've been talking to, but whenever I see "biological determinism" brought up its usually a strawman.
I do skew further towards nature though. The Blank Slate by Steven Pinker is a good read if you want to get a nature heavy opinion
>>36421320
Pinker also writes great essays on linguistics, if you're into that sort of thing.
>>36421294
How do you explain the people who have healthy self regulation of emotion then? And the people who have learned to regulate emotion response and have developed healthy cognitive habits in response to distressing stimulus?
It doesn't matter what you call it, humans have clearly demonstrated levels of cognition that allow us to control our emotional responses. In fact is seems to be a trait that is naturally selected for in most societies/civilisations.
>>36421339
That phenomenon is just another tool that the human species has adapted to promote one of its essential goals - not necessarily directly. For example, asceticism has long been a major part of Western and Eastern philosophy. How could it be that this seemingly anti-evolutionary force came about? The mistake is to believe that this behavior has no evolutionary precedent. You don't have to pass on your genes directly to make your contribution to the genetic code.
The hand grenade example:
I have 5 brothers. I inherited the "jump on the hand grenade gene". A hand grenade falls into the middle of my brothers and I. I jump on the grenade and die. Is that gene out of the gene pool?
No, it has a much greater chance of passing on because I just saved my brothers lives, and my brothers have many copies of many of the same genes I have. Through proxy, my genes have passed on.
>>36421294
Actual psych graduate here. you're fucking retarded, and you're like one of those morons in first year who feels the need to debate the prof.
>It's a buzzword that has always existed in critiques of the hybrid position levied by pseudo-scientists (yourself, other believers in the blank slate).
word salad to the highest degree tbqh.
I don't believe in the blank slate, that's why I said biological factors are tertiary, not non-existent.
>>36421320
I'll give it a read, but I know that his book seems to underplay the importance of learning and socialization in human behavior. Still, I'll check it out when I have the time.
>>36421370
You are putting far too much weight behind evolutionary theory.
The fact of the matter is that you are not a slave to emotion and no amount of debating and self convincing you do is going to make you happier. Start working on improving your mental health instead of investing effort trying to convince yourself it isn't possible.
>>36421380
>did a psych degree
>calls other retarded
frogmeme.jpg
>>36421380
You have a lot to learn from reading the book that anon recommended.
>>36421429
>didn't do a psych degree
>thinks they know more than someone who studied it for 4 years
Oh you wannabe autodidacts
>>36421480
>thinks undergraduate studies mean anything
The average IQ of a Psychology undergraduate is barely above 100.
>>36419833
but everything doesn't revolve around them anon
>lifting revolves around lookin better and being stronger to be more attractive to women
then you're lifting for the wrong reasons
>better job with more money gives you more reasons to live with a woman
nope. gives you more money to buy a big house, pay bills, buy a fast car and get huge. women just cost you money
the only reason you should ever be with a woman is if you want to procreate, but even then she'll probably take them from you
>>36421514
>then you're lifting for the wrong reasons
Am i?
Why do i lift, when from a biological standpoint, men are the stronger humans and thus attract woman through it?
>>36421503
And where did you learn Psychology? /pol/? wikipedia?
Fucking Dunning-Kreuger in full force here now.
>>36421535
you should lift for yourself and only for yourself. athletes don't train for others, they train for themselves. body builders and powerlifters do it for themselves. people being attracted to that is just a side effect of something that stands out more than just a mere lump of flesh and bones
>>36421554
Where did you learn psychology? Arizona State University? Community college?
>>36421585
Carleton University. Studied law, criminology and psych.
>>36421622
>>70% acceptance rate
Laughing patricians.jpeg
I knew someone who went to a decent school wouldn't be so dumb as to make those posts.
>>36421644
and other than wikipedia, where did you go for your psych knowledge?
>>36419833
>evolve around them
in your idiocy you actually managed to touch upon human sexuality and evolution. Human evolution has largely been a product of sexual selection so in some sort of retarded blunder your point still stands, humans evolved this level of intelligence to compete with other males for mates or (more likely) to convince women to mate with them
>>36421554
Bro if you're throwing out appeals to authority I immediately begin to doubt the content of your argument.
The nurture, gender is a choice, women-are-forced-into-femininity-by-society-not-their-biology crowd is losing ground by the day. Biology plays a huge role, society tends to be molded and shaped by biology. I'm sorry to tell you but a lot of your characteristics were not worked for but were given to you when your dad nutted in your mom.
>>36421675
I read and have an above average IQ. Not to mention, I studied a proximal field at an actual selective university and regularly interacted with professors and students at the graduate level.
>>36421180
Determinism is real though. But just because determinism is real, it doesn't mean you don't have free will or someone can predict the future.
Bio majors don't realize this because they can't into math, but chaos (that is small changes in initial conditions lead to unbounded changes in system changes) means the future is necessarily unpredictable beyond a certain horizon.
By deterministic, math folks just mean there aren't any explicit unknowables that you can only account for via probability. It doesn't mean imply anything about predictability or even repeatability
>>36421694
I agree with you, but that's not what biological determinism means.
At least, I see no reason to disagree with that position on determinism, but it's a position that partially relies on induction.
>>36421675
>Psych has one of the lowest replicability rates of any (psuedo)-scientific field.
>Its the "I'm a girl who wants to pretend I'm in stem" major.
>Average IQ of 104
>All the psych books in the world don't have the life lessons of 1 wise old man
>>36421480
I was only memeing you friend
>>36420498
Some more guidance on this, friend ? I came up with several logical answers to each of these yet I can't find something that would connect with me emotionally.
Also, kind of on topic : why do people do proactive stuff? Usually I'm in a consumption mode and it's hard for me to actually create something. Recently I've started learning to write fiction yet I feel some kind of block in me that stops me from doing stuff. Usually I write for a little bit and it's kind of fun but for some reason I start to feel anxious and stop for a day.
>>36421841
Variety is the spice of life.
>>36419833
>If girls are not everything in life
They're not. The biological imperative to reproduce, however, is and grils just happen to be a major part of that.
>>36421910
But this whole thread reads like "yes lift for yourself but females are attracted by it"
>>36421964
>females are attracted by it
not all of them are. but in the end the attention from women should be a welcome byproduct of something much more important than what a woman thinks of you
>>36420280
I can be sexually attracted to a women and at the same time realize she is venom and not want anything to do with her.
>>36421964
>yes lift for yourself but females are attracted by it
this is spouted by delusional faggots. Everything we do, including self-improvement, is ultimately for these two (three, depending on how you look at it) things: to survive and to procreate (or to ensure that your genes survive to another generation).
This is why people who are "asexual" are either legitimately not right in the head or have deluded themselves into thinking that they are asexual because of their lack of success in working towards the imperative to reproduce (hurr I'm asexual is just a rationalization at this point)
This is why, outside of using it as a tactic to make sure your genetics survive and not that of another males, homosexuality is no bueno (see that insect which goes n-no homo and gets fucked by another male insect so that the former can inseminate the female because the other male already came in him)
t. armchair psychologist
>>36419833
this is what happens when you lift for girls:
when you get one, your body goes to shit cause your motivation is gone
now fuck off to /soc/.
>>36422527
lifting to be attractive to girls is not the same as attractive to get A girl
Being desirable to the opposite sex (or the same if you swing that way) is natural. Wanting to be wanted in general is a natural thing.
>>36422562
the motivation should be yourself
who cares what cunts think? if you arent doing it cause you want to, just quit now.
>but if I lift, girls will like me!
thats the attitude that is stupid
>>36422584
lifting for self improvement is lifting to be desirable in general. You do not exist in a vacuum. Deny it as you might you know you're lifting to be desirable.
>>36422610
girls should be a perk
the main motivation should be the mirror, for yourself. otherwise you become the fat guy with the fat gf (girls do this too).
>>36419833
im gay. i dont do the 'faghag' shit cuz women suck.
so not everything revolves around them
>getting this butt hurt over women
they're objects dude. Treat them like it. You're a man. Your life comes first.
>>36419833
It's at the very base of our animal brains dude.
Same reason food taste good.
>>36419833
>tfw gay
>>36422757
id ask if you should be in class right now, but after sandy hook i imagine you just got suspended for bringing in an edge that sharp.
>>36419833
10% of humanity is gay, so not even 100% of men revolve around girls.
but you know what 100% of humans do partake in? food. SO EVERYTHING IN LIFE IS FOOD
>>36419833
Why don't you lift and get back at the chicks that made fun of you. Its what I did and I fucked her fat tumblr friend too. Don't worry about that shit. Just live your life. Literally be grateful you live in a world where woman are pretty dumb. They're made that way so you can fuck them and pass your genes.
those are all opinions of yours tho, shitty opinions but still you can change them
>>36419833
>Not living the eudaimonic life and lifting for one's self
>>36423041
Not him, but there's a lot of truth in that image.
>tfw you came to terms with dying alone
Everything became much better after that.
I had some shitty experiences with women...
Including but not limited to basically begging for sex (I didn't get laid for the first time until 19)
A false rape charge
Letting women cuck me out of money because I thought it would "convince" them
Needless to say, I was also very fat. Well, I can understand not being attracted to a fat person. That part I always understood, but I've never understood how someone could take advantage of my situation. Either way, I've taken responsibility for the part that is my fault (being a fat ass) and lost a lot of weight.
Now, I'm stronger than most and in better shape than most people. A lot of women attempt to get my attention, they want to date, fuck, etc., but I tell them that I'm not interested and in reality I'm not. I have no interest in ever putting myself in a situation where I don't have complete emotional control.
I lift because it make me attractive and sought after, but that's all I want. I just want to be desired and have that absolute control.
>>36419833
Dude, girls are actually individuals, you fucking spastic. You don't have to universally get a long with "girls" find somebody that makes you HAPPY anon.
>>36423834
still trying to make it there... think I'm getting close.
>>36423832
Not him, but there isn't. It's kind of opposite from a truth. Women don't want a perfomance, yet it's what they are getting most of the time. Sure, they will explore your weakness in the nastyest way possible yet this way you will see it, acknowledge it and grow out of it.
Yes, healthy women want to be seduced, but healthy men want to seduce so there is no problem here aside from perverted ways the society tries to make everybody equal.
And I don't really see all that much appreciation on this board of true women's weaknesses such as being crazy, clingy or obese, or being called a whore. Or do you think being physically weak counts as a weakness for a woman?
