I feel a distinct change in attitude regarding this character on the board recently. I was away for a couple weeks but I remember everyone hated this fucker for being just another of Jeph Loeb's weird son-inserts and everyone was hoping Richard was coming back soon. Now everyone seems to be on his dick, what changed the collective consensus?
Jeph Loeb stopped writing him.
>>84070109
It's been that way for more than a few weeks. I hate him too, but it's been like for a long time.
>>84070109
Fuck Richard. Post ANAD Trinity.
>>84070109
>>84070193
>It's been that way for more than a few weeks.
No it hasn't. There was a thread last week about how much Sam is being put through the grinder and the chucklefucks that never read his comic before realized he had some pathos. Then there were storytimes. Now everyone has quit sperging any time he's brought up.
>>84070109
Pity is not the same as love.
People just feel bad for him, which is pretty understandable especially considering how poorly his "friends" treat him.
>>84070356
The kid grew on me.
Also, the writer said that his part in Civil War 2 is about "isolation".
You tell me if I don't looking forward for more suffering
>>84070413
>the writer said that his part in Civil War 2 is about "isolation".
I'm ready.
>>84070109
Dick Rider fans realized that Sam isn't the enemy
The enemy is Bendis and Miles Morales
>>84070444
>and Miles Morales
Why? Kamala has been more antagonistic to Sam than Miles has.
>>84070444
Sam is what Bendis and the rest of Marvel is using so Richard can't come back. He is still an impossible obstacle Richard has to jump in order to come back.
Despite being much better than him and having the numbers to prove it, Richard still can't beat Sam and come back.
>>84070109
There was a storytime of it. People actually read it.
He's a great character, a nice fresh look at a teenage hero inheriting a mantle. He's actually brave and kick-ass.
>>84070518
How much of the Dick Riderfagging is just nostolgia goggles? I read Annihilation and some of his solo afterward. It wasn't very good.
>>84070522
And still a kid, and get treated like oneand act like one
That's mostly why I prefer him more than Miles and Kamala
>>84070571
I read all of Sam's first volume and it's offensively bad. I have no interest with the current run since Sean Ryan is not a good writer and Marvel still won't budge on letting Richard come back in any form.
I really don't get why anyone likes Sam Loeb.
>>84070571
It's all a sub category of D&Afags
>>84070518
Why do you faggots love Dick so much? He had two hype moments in one fucking run a decade ago, and even during that run was boring as sin and only served as straight man to Quill.
>>84070661
Okay but that didn't answer my question.
>>84070576
>Those responses
Fuck those cunts.
I hope Sam goes columbine on the entire Marvel universe.
>>84070702
That's two whole more moments than Jeph Loeb's dead son will ever get.
Sam has had 5 years to do something, and has nothing to show for it. Instead, Marvel has wasted time and money in a hilariously sad effort to make him popular.
>>84070741
I don't see how having the world and everyone in it shit on him is an effort to make him popular.
>>84070741
And Dick Rider existed for 30 years before Annihilation made him "cool".
>>84070763
>Video games
>Cartoon
>Toys
>In every main book for every event since his introduction
Marvel has been trying since day one with this character and nothing has worked. It's time for them to give up. Not all characters work out, Sam is just one of them.
>it's a salty Richardfags thread
>>84070109
I was kinda ambivalent towards Sam originally: I never read his title, and only saw him playing a small roll in the titles I read.
Then some kind anon storytimed the first 22 or so issues of his book, and I came around to like Sam: it genuinely feels like he's just some kid in over his head, trying to do his best even though he has no idea what he's doing. He doesn't have Mile's confidence, or Kamala's exurberance... he's trying to live up to some picture he has in his head of his dad and ends up making a lot of mistakes along the way. The fact that his awkwardness ends up showing through his masked identity is kind of endearing too.
>>84070797
>Sam has been in a video game
>Flash Venom still hasn't
Fuck.
>>84070787
Marvel never game him a serious push in those years. They were fine to let him be a C-Lister. Nobody payed attention to any cosmic character back then.
>>84070576
I'm suddenly glad that the Terrigen Mists are killing muties
>>84070797
What's so bad about Sam's character exactly?
>>84070831
Because Samurai Girl thought she was talking to Speedball?
>>84070854
>Annoying
>Stupid
>Forced
>His existence is an alarmingly retarded retconned
>Is the sole reason Richard will never come back
>Incredibly boring stories
>>84070866
Who was that anyway? Armor?
>>84070490
Because he's black and popular.
>>84070109
I was indifferent towards him, but then I read the storytimes. I can't hate a kid that tries his best, but get treated like shit by everyone
>>84070895
Probably. I don't know any other Asian long-haired mutant girl.
Well, Psylocke, but she's adult.
>>84070412
To be fair, half of Sam's appeal is that he asks for half of the shit he gets due to his unrelenting teenage stupidity and/or awkwardness.
He's not just a buttmonkey because the writers needed an underdog so the universe is conspiring against him, the bad shit and occasional scorn from his friends come from his natural flaws of letting his powers or his mouth move faster than his head.
>>84070884
>Annoying
>Forced
>His existence is an alarmingly retarded retconned
>Is the sole reason Richard will never come back
I'm asking about Sam's character, anon. His actual personality and role in the story. I don't give a shit about your butthurt meta reasons
>Stupid
Yeah, he's a pretty stupid kid. Why is that such a bad thing?
>boring stories
I didn't think they were boring. What makes them boring to you?
>>84070930
Maybe he wouldn't be such a retard if he actually had somebody to look up tolike Miles and Kamala do.
>>84070940
>Yeah, he's a pretty stupid kid. Why is that such a bad thing?
Ask GLfags and what they think of Hal's intellect.
>>84070940
>Stupid
>Yeah, he's a pretty stupid kid. Why is that such a bad thing?
Replacing characters stupid kids is just bad. Typically, nobody likes them and they just bog down the story. Sam is no exception
>>boring stories
>I didn't think they were boring. What makes them boring to you?
The first issues are typical Jeph Loeb insanity. Nothing happens in the Wells issues until his OC shows up and even then, it's still boring. Then the Duggan issues happen, and despite still being boring and nobody being interested in them, Marvel figures "fuck it, were not replacing the writer anymore."
>>84070971
I thought people liked Hal being stupid.
>>84070971
It's hilarious.
>>84070971
It's great. That and his willpower feats are the biggest reasons I love Hal.
>>84070987
Indeed
>>84070972
>Typically, nobody likes them
Says who exactly? There are tons of stories out there about stupid teenagers. Not every superhero needs to be a big genius.
>they just bog down the story
How's Sam do that?
>Nothing happens
What the fuck do you mean nothing happens? The Wells issues had a whole infinity story arc. How is that nothing?
>>84071044
>Says who exactly? There are tons of stories out there about stupid teenagers. Not every superhero needs to be a big genius.
Nearly everybody. How many people do you know that liked Anakin from Phantom Menace?
>How's Sam do that?
He offers nothing to the Marvel universe and had added nothing despite showing up so much. The only time his comic was slightly bearable was when Bet Ray Bill showed up, and that was just because of Beta Ray Bill. Him having to interact with Sam was a drag.
>The third thing
The entire time he just argues with his mom about being a super hero. Then he flies off and meets Justice and Speed Ball. This took 4 issues. Then the girl with heterochromia shows up and Sam beats her in 2 pages.
>>84070967
Yeah plus he got his family that worried him.
I like that Sam's family is aware of his double identity and his mom tries her best to be supportive.
It's very Blue Beetle
>>84070204
Fuck Miles, Kamala is OK but she's a bitch to Sam, Sam is eternal suffering, honestly they make a bad trio.
>>84070661
i stoped at the carnage part, it was so fuking retarded
>>84070109
>people shit on character/book for stupid reasons
>read it and find out it's not shit
It's more likely than you think.
>>84071184
But people will find out it's shit if they read it.
>>84070702
I read his old run, Annihilation, his post Annihulation stuff, New Warriors and I liked the character his good and his bad.
Sam I like too although his current writer is a bit boring with the plots and has a boner for mole man, also the "MUH LOST DAD IN SPACE" shit has being going on since his comic started which is over fucking kill at this point, just fucking kill Jesse Alexander already.
That said Duggan and Wells made me like Sam.
>>84071091
>How many people do you know that liked Anakin from Phantom Menace?
Because he was an whiny asshole not because he wasn't smart.
>He offers nothing to the Marvel universe and had added nothing despite showing up so much.
What the fuck has that got to do with his stories. Who gives a flying fuck about "what he adds to the marvel universe"? That's the last fucking thing on my mind when I'm reading a comic. Jesus christ.
>The entire time he just argues with his mom about being a super hero. Then he flies off and meets Justice and Speed Ball. This took 4 issues.
It was a two issue arc dumbass. Again how is meeting his predecessor's teammates and fight off a bad guy "nothing".
Only reason Sam exists it's because DnA killed Richard and left the Nova position available and Loeb took advantage of that to make a character in memory of his son.
>>84071167
The follow up to Carnage Man was great
>>84071167
>it was so fuking retarded
What why? His fight with Carnage was fucking great.
>>84071191
You think?
Whenever I see someone that don't like it, because he only read the first part, then he said he lose interest without reading it again.
>>84071271
If that's even true, and I doubt it, what the fuck does that have to do with whether or not Kid Nova is a good character?
>>84071348
Welcome to /co/
Always take every opinion here as a grain salt.In fact, if someone says it's shit, it is a recommendation for you to read it
>>84071155
What trio? You know that Sam never join the conversation, right?
>>84071372
Tell me all about the great qualities of Unbeatable Squirrel Girl, Mighty Thor, and Civil War 2
>>84070144
why is there even a thread beyond this post
>>84070884
>Is the sole reason Richard will never come back
Considering there's two Spider-Men, two Ms. Marvels, and a new Quasar literally being mentored by Wendell, I'd say you're pretty fucking delusional there m8.
What exactly is there left to tell about Dick's story? Fucking Christ, this board loves to complain about how death is never permanent in comics and about "muh status quo" yet every time they kill someone off faggots like you never stop whining about bringing them back.
You can't even bring up the SJW card because Sam isn't any kind of obvious minority.
>>84071387
>Unbeatable Squirrel Girl
Comfy and fun.
>Mighty Thor
Muscle Aryan goddess.
>Civil War 2
We all love heroes punching each other out.If I was joking.
>>84071387
>Unbeatable Squirrel Girl
if you can ignore the art, Ryan North is actually an okay writer.
>Mighty Thor
if you can ignore the words, Russel Dauterman is actually a decent artist.
>Civil War 2
again, ignore the words and you get pretty art from Olivier Coipel and David Marquez.
Its a shame that Marquez has essentially tied his career to Bendis, because dude puts out solid work.
>>84071436
>and a new Quasar literally being mentored by Wendell
For what purpose?
>>84071436
they specifically did an arc in Guardians of the Galaxy addressing the possibility of Rider's return and it was a resounding NO
>>84071297
its just that carnage is supposed to be a killing machine and to be honest i was scare wen he learned sams name, but wen carnage goes to met sam he just act all "hur dur im the villan of the month"
>>84071466
>For what purpose?
Who fucking knows. He she even shown up again?
>>84071481
not yet, but to be fair she only premiered like 2 months ago.
>>84071481
Nope. But you know, event happened like yesterday, there's time.
>>84071436
I don't care about Sam's race. He would have been shit regardless. Plus, since Marvel has said numerous times over the past several years there can only be one Nova, it doesn't look good for him. That and Marvel treats Richard like shit in what few mentions he gets.
There's plenty left to tell for every character. I don't see why Richard should be an exclusion just because Jeph Loeb is fucking crazy.
>>84070109
i dont think feling sorry for someone equals like him
>>84071505
>Plus, since Marvel has said numerous times over the past several years there can only be one Nova, it doesn't look good for him.
Remember "If we have a crossover with the Ultimate universe we've officially run out of ideas"?
>>84071262
Wells wrote for 5 issues, you fucking moron. Sam does nothing but argue with his mom for most of it, meets Spock, meets those other 2, and the fights the boring OC. All of that could have been done in 2 issues, but Wells dragged it out for 5.
>>84071532
Wells arc was a set-up for the New Warriors book that followed.
>>84071529
Give me a real reason to hope again to see Richard. He's met all the requirements he should need to come back and get rid of his successor, but Marvel still won't do it.
It's his 40th anniversary this year and he gotten a single mention. I don't see him ever coming back.
>>84071532
>Wells wrote for 5 issues, you fucking moron.
Meeting the New Warriors and fighting Thanos' goons happened in a span of 2 out of his 5 issues you complete jackass. Again how all that shit "nothing happened"
The issue with Spock was great by the way,
>>84071480
It's fucking Carnage, unless you're a serial killing racist redneck stereotype with an IQ lower than pond scum there's not much reason to care if Carnage is portrayed in a totally superficial way.
>>84071532
2 of Wells issues were Infinity tie-ins.
>>84071547
And that boom got cancelled in no time. Plus, Sam was barely in it.
>>84071564
I don't give a shit.
>>84071571
First issue was Thanos sending the girl to earth while Sam does nothing with Justice and Speedball. Then the next issue is mostly him doing more of nothing with those guys until he fights the girl, which last for 2 pages.
>>84070109
Pity
>>84071580
I know you don't. You just care about some awful character that's a pathetic laughing stock of failure
>>84071547
Funny thing is that even in the New Warriors Sam mostly absent from that.Like he didn't even need to be in there at all;_;
>>84071587
>which last for 2 pages.
You keep fucking saying that but I'm looking at the issue right now and its a long ass fight because Sam is dealing with his broken helmet. A detail you seemed to miss in your oh so comprehensive summary. You're full of shit dude.
![latest[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/eOWKS0m.jpg "latest[1].jpg")
>>84071570
dude calm your tits im just saying waths the poin in using a menasing character if you are gona make him act like a cartoon badie
>>84071652
Helmet wasn't broken you fucking dunce. She told him to not put it on.
The second he puts it on, they fight for 3 and talk for one.
>>84071710
Either way. It wasn't a two page confrontation.
>>84071730
You're right. It was 3. That's WAY longer than I thought it was.
I'm sorry I don't remember garbage perfectly 3 years after reading it.
>>84071767
And why are you not counting the fighting they did without his helmet. You're such a fucking bullshiter.
>"They did nothing in that arc for 5 issues!"
>it was 2 issues
>"Uh They did nothing in that arc for 2 issues"
>he met his predecessor's team mates and fought badguys
>"That fight only lasted for 2 pages"
>saving the family and beating the baddy took up most of the issue
>"doesn't count cause he wasn't wearing his helmet."
It's clear you're talking out of your ass. I'm going to bed.
>>84071670
All the more reason, they had actual menacing villians in Ultimate Marvel and the superhero deathtoll climbed up to 50%, andthat made sense given that it wasn't cartooney storytelling there, how the hell does it make any sense at all that there's this serious mass murderer monster with alien knife blood who's running around NOT killing large numbers of superheroes?
>>84070576
Its almost like they knew we hated him initially, so they made him a punching bag. I love me a timid punching bag.
>>84071822
The Wells issues were the same shit for 5 issues until some deviant art tier OC shows up for a laughably short fight.
If you absolutely insist on counting the pages where he didn't have his helmet, then it's 2 more pages.
I'll be glad to tell you more tomorrow for why Sam and his book sucks ass.
>>84071882
When his arm gets chopped off and he dies, maybe I'll like him. Maybe.
There really isn't a reason they can't just come up with some story to bring Rich back and have both of them running around. Besides editorial hating him.
It's the Nova CORPS and it'd be cool to see.
>>84070109
Dick Riderfags decided to be slightly less cancerous.
>>84071896
Why?
Why would you be "glad" to try to make him hate it as much as you do?
He's someone who's enjoying something meant to be enjoyed.
You're someone who hates something and for some reason wants other people to not enjoy it either.
So the obvious question is : WHY?
>>84071436
Rich had all the momentum in the world, cosmic marvel waa going strong and they cut it short and changed his death into meaning basically nothing.
>>84071905
Wow what an edgy teen
>>84070971
It fits perfectly with Hal in the same way it fits with Sam...
>>84071988
No, I just Sam to go through the same bullshit Richard did
>>84072089
Not that guy, but I don't think it's possible for him to leave his family and all
>>84071944
Clearly because he is a edgy, resentful faggot...
>>84070704
>>84070831
Eh, they went out with him anyway.
>>84072163
Only because Beast said so.
>>84070490
Not since he proved his loyalty in that comic where the Vision goes ape.
>>84072089
Sam with no other options engaged Kluh to protect Arizona. He had already saved his family so he could have just hid, but he went back.
He got knocked all the way to France and could have died. He survived and could have just hid, but he went back. Suffering from a concussion and broken arm, with nothing but his wits and will he succeeded in his mission.
>>84072241
How old is he again?
>>84072252
15ish.
>>84071987
What momentum? Heaven fucking forbid a character actually get some kind of a conclusion in comics.
>>84071987
So they Game of Thronesd him?
I've read none of either Dickrider or Kid Nova, but the concept of Sam as a kind of stupid teenage butt monkey sounds pretty Fun. What's Richard's hook?
>>84072352
White male.
>>84072352
Development. That's his appeal. There is a consistent character arc right from Annihilation to Imperative. Also, as a whole, he is what got many into the cosmic aspect of the Marvel Universe.
But, I think it goes beyond that. I think that Richard is appealing because he represents what Marvel used to be. A company that told stories and used their continuity to the fullest. They told stories instead of some of the click bait equivalents that they do now. They gave things that fans old and new could enjoy.
Marvel did not have the popularity or was as concerned with synergy as they are now.
I mean, don't get me wrong, I can get and even respect giving minority groups a chance to be superheroes. After all, I'm not /pol/... But I don't want filibusters on how minority groups are constantly oppressed or speeches on how "I'm Jewish".
>>84072352
>What's Richard's hook?
Same thing as Sam but without the "muh father is dead" drama.
I'm just surprised fuckin' Nova of all things can elicit passion in fans either way. It's the closest thing published comics have to the Grey Lantern Corps.
>>84072737
Because the selling point of the Nova books isn't the world. It's not about the Corp or the concept, its the characters.
>>84072440
Fair enough, but... honestly, I don't see how bringing him back to life would help either of those.
If he's already had a good character arc and a meaningful death, bringing him back would just torture things out. And he'd get involved in all these stupid events and ratings stunts again.
>>84071384
That's what I'm saying there is no trio hemce why it's bad, it's Miles and Kamala with Sam as the guy that's just there.
>>84072375
Sam might as well be one too, if it wasn't for his brown mom and sister I could have sworn he was white.
>>84072089
Written by Bendis? He's getting there.
Although he got killed off panel in a shitty way in Guardians of Knowhere even though that was an alt universe.
>>84071882
Yeah, read him the way he was while under Loeb and see him in the USM cartoon and he's a totally different character.
Duggan started writing him as a punching bag and then it carried out.
Kind of liked it in New Warriors though, Kaine being an asshole to him was fun and I kind of wanted them to develop a relationship out of it with Kaine ending up caring for him in his own way but you know...
>>84072763
Not the other anon but they rendered Rider's sacrifice worthless by bringing back the villain he died to stop.
>>84070109
Anon storytimed Nova and people actually read the comic.
>>84072763
>If he's already had a good character arc and a meaningful death, bringing him back would just torture things out.
Claremont pls.
>>84072868
Thanos was going to come back one way or another but the way he did was shitty and his character has been shit ever since anyway.
>>84072352
Dumb Spider-Man
>>84072965
Yeah I don't really get what's going on with Thanos as of late. Marvel seems to want to use him to promote for the movies but the way they do just makes him seem less competent a threat. Of course most moviegoers don't or won't read the comics, but the point is they're wearing out their tires spinning in circles before they even have the greenlight.
They could have at least waited for a year before Infinity War to start pushing him. He's done about as much as the Collector in the MCU and he's not popping up as aggressively.As an aside I'd really like it if they mirrored the scene in Thanos Quest by having Thanos and the Collector negotiate in a civil manner and show familiarity with each other. I feel his character needs some contrast in the MCU, so far he just seems like a big bumbling asshole instead of the careful planner TQ made him out to be
>>84070109
A writer who wasn't Loeb took over and was good.
Same reason Red Hulk became okay too.
>>84070144
First post sums it up.
I still can't stand him on principle, because he's another of Jeph Loeb's weird dead son-inserts, but the writing improved markedly - as it would have had to - once he was given to someone other than Loeb.
>>84070490
>Why? Kamala has been more antagonistic to Sam than Miles has.
Yes, but her antagonism makes sense, and she's a good character in her own right. Antagonistic or not, they have an interesting relationship.
Miles is a big fat nothing character who occupies space better spent on Sam and Kamala.
>>84073050
>>84072276
Heh I understood this reference
>>84070144
>implying Loeb's run was bad
The storytime proved the majority of /co/ loved it.
>>84071461
>i-if you ignore the shitty parts i-its good
Pathetic. Also, Ryan North is garbage.
>>84071827
I miss Ultimate Marvel, someone should storytime it.
>>84073076
>they have an interesting relationship.
Like 99% of their interactions have been "Sam says or does something, literally anything, and Kamala calls him a jerk for it."
>space better spent on Sam
So we can see him suffer? Sam brings nothing to the table besides his own suffering, I'd take Miles' nothing character over "watch Sam get shit on for the 800th time"
>>84073391
>The storytime proved the majority of /co/ loved it.
What does that have to do with the quality of it? /co/ can't even decide whether BvS is bad or not, so why does it's opinion mean anything to you?
>>84073439
Few weeks back
>>84070109
because he suffers. i want to hug him.
his suffering made him cute
>>84074018
I was just saying the everyone shat on it without reading it and when they did they liked it.Also no one actually likes BvS, they just know what will trigger people
>>84074046
You're kidding, what kind of mad man does ten plus years of comics?
>>84070277
Pretty much this.
>>84072756
Plus a metric shit ton of nostalgia.
>>84070144
Wrong-o. It was Loeb's best work since... whatever he last did for DC... oh, his Superman/Batman run. A return to form for him. Basically wrote teen Hal Jordan and slapped his dead son's name on it.
>>84070109
I loved him since before it was cool, I think it is a great character. I just want for him to have Richard as his mentor.
>>84070109
Starbrand would have been a better green lantern counter
Or Quasar
>>84070109
The CW2 happened and brought to light how misstreated he is by everyone except Miles, kinda, and that bought hm lot of simpathy points.
>>84070109
Someone did a storytime, and that resulted in all the people who were just hating Sam because it's what /co/ told them to do realising that they actually liked his comic and his character.
The much maligned Loeb run, which everyone around here would scream was some horrible abomination, was actually pretty decent and only 5 issues.
>>84070518
>Sam is what Bendis and the rest of Marvel is using so Richard can't come back
First off, they don't need a reason to not bring him back. Even if Sam didn't exist, they could just as easily never bring him back because they have no obligation to. Second off, Bendis has never even written Sam.
>>84074589
>Nova Force makes Dick Rider able to communicate to Sam like the Force or some shit.
ANYTHING is better than Sam basically being left alone, it's depressing as hell.
>>84074091
Originally he was just going to do Ultimate Spider-Man, but then he got into it.
>>84071481
No, but she's probably going to get an ongoing as part of Marvel NOW 2.
>>84073715
>I'll take nothing over something
And that's why your opinion is meaningless
>>84070518
There's no conceivable reason why there can't be two Novas when there's two Caps, two Spiderguys, 3 Spider Women. That's on Marvel editorial, not Sam. And Dick's numbers were always low, just like Sam's, even under DnA.
>>84070109
There are like 5 people "waiting" for Rich to be brought back. The rest of us don't give a shit.
>>84070490
I think it's cause Miles just gets a lot of support and recognition for doing jack shit while Sam has done actually heroic shit but gets no respect.
>>84070816
>Marvel never game him a serious push in those years
Are you fucking kidding me? Ok kid. Let me tell you something.
Nova was pushed as FUCK. They wanted so hard for him to be their new Spider-man but no one gave a fuck about him. They gave him a big push in the 70s and it failed. They tried again in the 90s and it failed.
I like Rich. I like the New Warriors. But the Rich "fans" that didn't even know he existed until Annihilation and pretend that his DnA run is some kind of holy perfect run (when the last third of it was garbage, and like GotG, suffers from basically just being an event tie-in book) and how they've been lifelong Rich fans.
"Richfags," though you don't even deserve to call yourselves that, bitch about Sam being "pushed" and "forced"? So was Rich. Richfags complaining that Sam showed up in event after event? Over half of your precious DnA run is event tie-ins.
I'd LOVE for Rich to come back, but knowing that it would bring any of you petulant retards an ounce of satisfaction makes me hope they don't because I guarantee it wouldn't change your constant bitching. It would just go "it's so unfair, why won't they bring Rich back" to "it's so unfair, why isn't Rich's new run 10/10! Those bastards are trying to destroy Rich by writing him poorly." Because that's what'd fucking happen. If Rich were to be brought back, it'd almost certainly be either as a supporting character to Sam or on Bendis' Guardians and y'all have made it abundantly clear that those are the two things that you'd rather skin yourselves than read.
>>84070816
First off Marvel gave Rich several chances and all of them flopped.
Second, Rich wasn't even really a Cosmic character until Annihilation.
Third, the 70s-90s (the period we're discussing) were a time when many Cosmic characters flourished. Even the original GOTG, now even more literal who's than Quill's team, ran for THREE TIMES LONGER than ANY book Richard has ever headlined.
Rich has always been a low-seller and Riderfags have always been wishy-washy fucks. Stop talking out of your ass.
>>84073715
Kamela and Sam just got offf the wrong foot, what with him causing collateral damage to a historical landmark in her neighborhood. I do think it's bullshit how she and sam have legit chemistry but gets laid to the wayside in favor of her no-chemistry friendship with Miles.
>>84071597
>some awful character that's a pathetic laughing stock of failure
Sooooo are we talking about Sam or Rich here?
>>84074730
Don't forget they actually pushing Miles hard with the guest appearance on every marvel comics.
>>84071896
>The Wells issues were the same shit for 5 issues until some deviant art tier OC shows up for a laughably short fight.
She showed up at the end of the second issue, third issue was devoted to fighting her, which took up most of the issue.
>>84072440
>There is a consistent character arc right from Annihilation to Imperative
OK, so that's 3 years of his existence. What about the 30 years before that where he had 3 solo ongoings and appearances in the majority of the New Warriors?
>>84073060
But that happened 3 years ago.
>>84074532
Nova Corps are literally GL Corps. A force of space cops who manipulate energy. Starbrand is Earth's antivirus. Quasar's just some fuck.
>>84074773
The funny part is, if you read the letters pages from the 90s attempts, you realize that Richard-humans have always acted this way. He lives and disappears, no one cares an no one buys. They bring him back in New Warriors? Suddenly fans come crawling out of the woodwork bitching about "NOT MUH NOVA." So Marvel gives him another solo, and what happens? None of his fans buy it.
It's no wonder Brevoort picks on these guys.
>>84074644
>I'd take shit over nothing
Good for you.
>>84074794
Miles and Kamala have way more chemistry than Sam and Kamala
>>84074915
>Quasar's just some fuck.
Quasar is the Protector of the Universe.
>>84070204
Miles is boring.
Kamala's turned into a bitch.
Sam is the only sympathetic one of the trio, and that's just because he can play the pity card 24/7.
>>84074957
Right, but my point is that he's less of a GL analogue than Nova.
>>84074926
You're still picking shit anon.
>>84074946
Marvel pls. Kamela and Mikes have absolutely nothing but forced friendship.
>>84075018
Samalafag pls. Your ship is toxic.
>>84074946
Disagree. Kamela and Miles act like friends but it all comes across as a s shallow attempt to pair up two popular characters.
>>84074992
Yeah, that's fair. Rich's origin is literally a straight rip-off of Hal's, except as a teenager.
For that matter, Sam is a bit of a Kyle Rayner rip-off.
What i dont get is why after 40 issues we are back with "where is my dad" plot ?
That might be the reason why Sam books is selling so bad
>>84075035
Sam x Carol is best ship
>>84075063
Didn't you know?Your dad is actually a clone, it's all a ruse all along
>>84075063
Yeah, that's what caused me to drop his book. I really liked the Wells and Duggan runs, but then when Ryan's just immediately went back to retreading the whole "dad lost in space" plotline, it caused me to tune the fuck out.
>>84075042
And it's still more chemistry than Sam and Kamala, who barely even tolerate each other.
>>84075050
That's what confuses me most. Historically Nova characters are rather bland and sell poorly, and the Nova Corps has only ever been developed enough to give some pathos to whichever character it's about to get blown to kingdom come in the name of. Since the Corps first appeared, nay, were first mentioned, they've been a bunch of jobbers and bitches. In fact that almost makes me think that they were always intended to be a bit of a parody instead of a serious knockoff.
So why all the love? Why don't the diehards pack it up and move to DC where the space cops get more focus and attention? I don't get it.
>>84075124
She hates him because deep down she cares. And he cares enough about her to risk being kicked off of the Avengers, while Miles just shuts up and avoids the whole situation.
>>84075134
That's pretty much true of the GL corps since the end of Johns' run too. Hell even during his run a bunch of cool Lanterns were killed (still salty about Kreon). It really pisses me off. I want a GL anthology again damnit.
>>84075134
Because they played Nova in UMvC3 and their first introduction to cosmic comics was his ongoing thanks to that modern cosmic reading list we'd be peddling nonstop back in the day.
>>84075087
Yeah i know that but that only set is back to "where is my dad" plot.
>>84075050
>Sam is a bit of a Kyle Rayner rip-off.
Mary Sue? :^)
>>84075171
>She hates him because deep down she cares.
That's bull shit and you know it, she never even speaks to him unless it's to call him a jerk, otherwise she ignores him.
Like when that science fair blew up, Miles and Kamala ignore Sam completely when he shows up, I don't think they said a single word to him, they just sorta stair at each other.
>>84075124
>>84070518
>2 Spider-Men
>2 Captain America
I don' think spic Cancer-kid is an obstacle to get Rich back anymore, maybe he'll keep him off the spothlight but that'd be it.
>>84075018
The only forced one in that trio is Sam.
>>84075171
>She hates him because deep down she cares.
I dare you to actually post any panel indicating this.
There's fucking none and you know it.
Kamala just a bitch to Sam.
>>84070703
What kind of answer did you expect?
Being a pedantic faggot and using buzzwords to talk shit about one of /co/'s most cockrode books won't get you anything else but a bait reaction image at best.
>>84075346
>Kamala just a bitch to Sam.
Other writers don't know how to handle Kamala, she's not bitch in her comic.
>>84075333
This. Take Sam away, and that group would change nothing.
Should've just quit avenger and do more space thing.
>>84075333
Only in the sense that Marvel keep forcing him to be alone and suffering.
>>84075368
>it would change nothing
It would change my interest. Sam is the only person in this "Trinity" that's actually worth a damn.
>>84075406
Exactly.
>>84075305
Actually, it's 3 Spider-men and 3 Captain Americas.
>>84075266
Bait, but...
One of a Mary-Sue's defining traits is that they are loved arbitrarily. Sam earns the respect (and scorn) of his peers through his actions.
>>84075474
Of course it's bait, unsubtle as it is.
Yeah, I know that being loved is main trait of Mary Sues but you know how it is these days, everyone forgets that part of definition.
>>84074821
I'm talking about the one who had video games, a cartoon, toys, and in every event for the last 5 years with only 15k sales to show for it.
People hate Loeb's Sam and the hate comes from Bendis/editorial with how they treated Richard's death.
>>84075577
But Guardians 18-20 didn't come out until over a year after Loeb's run had ended.
>>84075645
Richard being treated like shit started a long time before that
>>84075661
How?
>>84075665
Basically "Fuck him, he's never coming back. Please support Sam Loeb, guys."
>>84075683
Shitting on obnoxious Richfags isn't the same as shitting on Rich.
>>84075683
But wasn't he dead for a while, before Sam even existed?
>>84075665
Well anon, it all started when Marvel (rightly) identified Quill and his GOTG as having greater franchise/movie potential...
>>84075699
Maybe don't treat them and the character they like as shit and they won't get angry.
>>84075713
Considering Marvel says Thanos Imperative is when he died, he was dead for about year along with StarLord and Thanos.
>>84075699
Name me one group of characterfags who aren't obnoxious.
inb4 Maggotfags
>>84075713
He was killed off in Thanos Imperative in 2010. Sam's Nova run started in 2013, but his first appearance was in early 2012 in an AvX prologue issue.
>>84075753
Daredevil fans seem mostly pretty alright, though they've had the luck of having a pretty level of quality.
>>84075742
No one is treating your precious Nova waifu like shit tho.
>>84075773
Right. Them and Frankfags are pretty cool, now that I think of it.
Probably because no legacy and teams.
>>84075821
You sure about that?
>>84075753
FFfags are chill.
>>84074823
Writers actually want use him it's not pushing
>>84075753
Anyone who's a fan of alien GLs. Charliefags too. Alanfags almost exclusively. Guyfags most of the time, though sometimes they get really obnoxious about being the "cool third option".
>>84075848
>Richfags beg Bendis and Brevoort every day for 2+ years for them to show what happened to Rich instead of the canned "he died a hero saving his friends and the universe" responce they got
>Bendis finally caves and gives them what they want
>they only bitch harder
Richfags deserve everything they get. I feel bad for Rich that he's saddled with such a cancerous fanbase.
>>84075902
>Ask for a small semblance of continuity from Marvel
>"Just accept he's never coming back. Now buy the Space Adventures of Sam Loeb"
>This is a good answer for absolutely nobody
>Marvel eventually does this
>Marvel STILL forces Sam and won't cancel him
>>84076011
>>84075124
>>84075042
Sam and Kamala relationship is way more interesting than Miles and Kamala. I don't mean in the "Oooh will they or won't they fuck" kinda way that Miles and Kamala and a number of heroes have, I mean the 2 heroes who work together and act like friends but knock heads on a number of issues. Hell it reminds me a lot of Green Arrows relationships with a number of heroes like GL, Flash and Hawkman.
It feels like a much more real relationship/friendship to me
>>84076042
She treats him like shit for no reason and I'm sure Sam feels the same way towards her now.
>>84076011
>>84076019
>Fuck that I'm going home
>pic related
>>84076071
She treats him like shit because she was a hypocrite and it snowballed from there on both sides, although she was in the wrong.
Sams a dumb teen who probably still wants to fuck her because hormones but knows she's a bitch
>>84076042
>and act like friends but knock heads on a number of issues.
Except they never act like friends. Ever.
>>84075952
Could you have any more of a persecution complex?
What the fuck did you think happened? DnA made it pretty clear that Rich died and he wasn't with Pete and Drax when they came back.
What the fuck did you think Bendis was gonna do? The man is a fucking hack and if you bother him about shit constantly he's eventually gonna take a big ol shit on you. He's been shitting on Quill for years now. If you hadn't fucking pestered him about it DnA would have the last word on Rich's fate and that's much more respectable and commendable than dragging him back from the dead to parade his corpse around in meme clothing like Quill.
NEWSFLASH: RICH ISN'T COMING BACK BECAUSE HE DOESN'T FUCKING SELL. PERIOD. EVEN IF SAM GETS CANCELLED AND DIES RICH STILL ISN'T COMING BACK BECAUSE CLEARLY NOBODY LIKES NOVA. PERIOD. THE MORE YOU BOTHER MARVEL ABOUT IT THE MORE THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE FUN OF YOU.
I keep being reminded of the crappy not-likeable character on Ultimate Spider-man
>>84076229
Richard never left the top 100 during all of Vol 4, meanwhile Sam is selling at 15k and rarely got about 19k during Vol 5.
Sam will never match Richard's popularity, and that's not even hard to do.
>>84076224
Except when Sam defended her when the avengera kicked her off the team then went and checked on her.
>>84076302
Woah I didn't even know this, but fuck that bitch.Need the sauce anon, give me something to read
>>84076302
Because he knew Vision was fucking with everyone.
That's not a show of friendship, that's common decency.
>>84076286
I have never posited that Sam sells better than Rich or even remotely well, only that Sam is not the cause of these delusional Riderfag's problems.
>>84076346
ANAD avengers 3 or 4
>>84076391
Fuck off. The only reason DnA was forced to kill Rich off in the first place was so that Loeb could have his precious dead son take over the role. The cancerverse was symbolic of the cancer that killed Sam Loeb and how it was forcing DnA to kill cosmic to accommodate him.
>>84076251
None of the characters on Ultimate Spider-man are representative of their actual selves. I mean shit, look at their portrayals of Luke Cage and Iron Fist.
>>84076470
Please tell me you're joking.
>>84076470
Holy shit, I legitimately can't tell if this is bait or not.
>>84076503
It's pretty obvious that Rich was supposed to be the leader of the Annihilators, and the only reason they brought back Quasar was to fill that role after editorial forced them to kill off Rich. Otherwise why would they bring back a literally who like Quasar when he was basically just a less interesting Rich that no one gave a fuck about.
And had it been Rich in the position of leader of the Annihilators instead of Quasar, then that book wouldn't have tanked as hard as it did which likely was intentional so they could justify giving the reigns of cosmic over to bendis after DnA "failed" (despite their failure being 100% the fault of editorial by forcing them to kill off the stars of Modern Cosmic then saddling Annihilators with shit artists.)
>>84076547
>complains about bringing back a literally who
You're a fucking NOVA fan mate, c'mon.
>>84076547
>Otherwise why would they bring back a literally who like Quasar when he was basically just a less interesting Rich that no one gave a fuck about
>despite their failure being 100% the fault of editorial by forcing them to kill off the stars of Modern Cosmic then saddling Annihilators with shit artists
You win anon, this is the best damn bait I've seen all month.
>>84076391
If Richard has to stay dead forever despite having sales miles better than Sam, then Sam should just get killed off too.
>>84074589
>Hello darkness, my old friend...
>>84076953
God how I wish Quill had stayed dead forever. You faggots don't even realize how good you've got it.
It's high time you moved on and found another boring character to project your equally boring personality onto.
>>84077325
You think death puts you beyond Bendis's grasp?
I don't even want Richard back by this point. I just want Sam gone.
>>84077516
>I don't even want Richard back by this point. I just want Sam gone.
I'm getting flashbacks to Halfags shitting on Kyle Rayner for the pettiest of reasons.
>>84077591
>H.E.A.T.
Never forget Halfags going full retard.
