Is this worth a watch? I didn't like MoS that much. Is this movie an improvement over it's predecessor?
It's a little choppy. Wait until the ultimate edition, which comes out digitally on 6/28. The extra scenes really smooth it out and it's much better than the theatrical cut.
>>84007720
Not much, it was a little too long of a movie. I don't think the DVD will do any better since it's 30 minutes longer.
I liked it better than MoS. it's very much a direct sequel though so it's tonally similar.
Nothing can save emo superman.
Nothing can save autistic lex Luther
Nothing can save skinny wonder woman.
Nothing can save homeless flash
Nothing can save mudering batman.
Nothing can save us from Zach Snyder and his wife.
>>84007720
If you didn't like MoS, you'll hate BvS.
Truly one of the worst comic book movies ever made.
>>84007768
>>84007780
Three whole posts before the shills arrived.
Bravo /co/.
>>84007720
MoS at least pretends to resemble the way the characters act in the source material.
BvS, not so much.
>>84007792
>telling people not to buy something
>shills
Go back to english class you high-school dropout
>>84007720
>Is this movie an improvement over it's predecessor?
As a guy who thought MoS was OK not great.
NO.
This movie sucks horrendously.
X-men Wolverine Origins bad.
>>84007720
Oh yeah. Everything bad about MoS was fixed in Dawn of Justice.
>>84007807
Frankly I'd say it's the opposite for BvS. (Or let's say, BvS pretends even more so)
>Superman looking like he's more hopeful for the planet but not really.Just makes his ending a lot more dissatisfying.
>Batman is edgy, pretending to be very smart like the comics but in fact, not really.
>Lex Luthor pretends to be the genius like he is in the comics and human supremacist, but really, he's not.
List can go on really.
>>84007720
It's a great movie if you aren't autistic. If the fact that they gave Batman and Superman's mom the same name in 1939 bothers you you might not like it.
If you have some locked in narrow view of these characters can only be this you might not like it.
Im a normal well adjusted human who is used to elseworlds and I thought it was good. Not great but good. Just understand this is the beginning of these heroes becoming the heroes we know. They aren't starting out that way.
>>84007857
So if you didn't like the movie then you're autistic?
>>84007857
this
>>84007857
WHAT'S ELSEWORLDS?
I DON'T READ COMICS! Y-you nerd! Only NERDS like this movie!
>>84007792
>If he doesn't lie it he must be a shill xD
/x/ might be more your style
>>84007857
>It's a great movie if you aren't autistic.
>It's a great movie
>great movie
>great
Anon, what have you done? I'm samefagging from a previous post and I love Batfleck in the movie the most and blah blah blah, but this is just straight up a lame post.
>Not great but good
kek
>>84007720
>Is this worth a watch?
Yes it's a great movie, but you better wait a few days for the Ultimate cut, the real deal, and not the jew edition.
>>84007720
>>84007720
I actually liked it more than MoS, because Batfleck and Alfred are pretty delightful, and I personally thought Eisenberg was funny, thought most people hate him. But yeah, the Superman is consistent with MoS, so the only respite is that this movie has less of him.
>>84007909
Yeah, "great" is downplaying it. It was the best, most perfect, 10/10 masterpiece that ever graced anyone's eyes and ears. The beauty which may never be surpassed in the history of man.
>>84007909
>autism
>>84007947
You say that like The Holy Mountain doesn't exist.
>>84007869
Most complaints levied at the film seem to stem from autism
see
>>84007768
If you liked the holocaust during ww2 the. You will love BVS.
>>84007983
>watching le naked man's meme movie complete with troll ending
'no'
>>84007869
Yeah kind of. Some of the complaints are "I can't differentiate emotions" or "it's not the same as what I want." Look at some of the characteristics of autism, and compare it to the complaints of BvS.
>>84008022
Are you saying BvS doesn't exist?
>>84008030
>meme movie
What does that even mean?
>>84008017
You won't even face legit criticism of the film. Because this whole thread was made by a WB shill to push that shitty DVD that no one wants. The movie was shit accept it.
>>84007720
is taking a really big shit that leaves you feeling physically and mentally drained better than constipation
>>84008055
>paranoia
>>84008046
He's saying BvS was a fantastic story created by Jews that everyone wishes were real. It inspires hope in everyone.
>>84008073
>Deflect and misinform
>>84007720
It's pretty bad, and this is coming from someone who liked MoS. But it has a lot of those "so bad it's good" parts like the plane scene in TDKR.
Worth a watch because everyone has such conflicting opinions on it.
>>84008055
4chans userbase isn't big enough for anyone to pay people to come post to get 15 people to buy the movie. This isn't reddit. Take off your tinfoil hat.
OP here. Why is everyone being so mean-spirited?
>>84008055
>>84008073
>Disney shilling is just a conspiracy theory
>Everyone knows only WB hires shills!
>>84008086
>That's exactly what a Shill would say. Fuck you Zach Snyder.
>>84008078
>paranoia
>>84008042
It's similar to Man of Steel
>Jonathan Kent, troubled and unsure how he should be raising this boy from another world, Clark asks if he should have let those kids die. Jonathan says yes...maybe..l dont have all the answers son, Kevin Costner acts unsure, with a heavy heart, just wants to protect his son.
>Pa Kent is a sociopath who wants Clark to let everyone die
like...it's a complete lack of being able to understand human emotion, an inability to understand how people communicate.
>>84007720
All the flaws of MOS are magnified.
>>84008128
>Repeating ones self that seems like a Shill tactic.
>>84007857
This honestly. Almost every complaint is NOT MUH.
>>84008158
Only militant AUTISTs think this movie is good. There only option is to deflect and point towards the ultimate edition as its savior but you can't make shit taste like chocolate it's just not possible.
>>84008158
The big problem is that, despite being in different circumstances, they stuck to their core beliefs and people are too blind to see that. Superman still saves people no matter what, Batman still goes after criminals to defend justice.
>>84008192
Thats the complete opposite. Only autist think its the worst thing ever. Much like yourself. It was an okay movie with some good scenes. Casuals didn't like it cause it's set up like a DC comic with lots of build up and few fights.
>>84008192
Being this contrarian
The only valid criticisms of BvS are pacing, editing, and narrative flow, all of which are fixed in the Ultimate Cut
Any other criticism is autism.
>>84008255
Agreed. The pacing and editing were off but it definitely isn't the abomination people act like it is.
The intro Batman scene was 10/10.
>>84008228
You have never read a dc comic and have no idea what you are talking about. It has nothing structurally to do with a do comic.
>>84008255
Lol you are delusional. This is what happens when shills believe there own bulshit. The exposition is nonexistent the characters are undeveloped. Doomsday is a cave troll. Lex is autistic. The dialogue is bad. The quips are bad. Do you get paid to suck Zach snyders dick this much?
>>84008333
Top kek. Do you read what you type? If only you had any idea who you were talking to.
>>84007852
BvS tells you right up front "this motherfucker isn't even the Lex you wanted" with his floppy red hair and the Jr. in his name.
Fedoracore angry-at-god atheism as motivation is just the icing on the cake.
>>84008379
>Lol
Go back. You have to go back to plebbit. It's your kids anon.
>>84008387
A faggot?
>>84008379
>doomsday is a cave troll
Except he's not. He's Zod covered in Lex's blood. That's how I know you didn't watch the movie.
>>84008396
Kek what's funny is you have no idea how casual that just made you sound
>>84008410
Nice comeback bro tell it again.
>>84008379
If you want Exposition watch a Chris Nolan joint. Your dumb ass should be able to understand those since it seems you have a problem getting Zack fucking Snyder.
Here's a tip chap, stick to the IMDB top 250, you clearly aren't cut out for the rest.
>>84008333
>sets up individual characters
>Has Batman and Supes skeptical of each other at first
>Has main villain
>Has minor villain for a team up fight
>Turns out main villain was being controlled
>Splash page teasing the next issue
>>84008426
This is the post that explains your autism. They wasted one of superman best villains and made him into a little period blood faggot. Comic book doomsday would have wiped the floor with superman,WW, and batman. Using him in a 10 minute sequence is outrageous and shows that you know nothing about comic books.
>>84008086
and yet we had a thread everyday for weeks reminding everyone that the dvd was coming out and how it's going to be great
That is shilling, whether someone is getting paid for it or it's some retarded fanboy doing it for free, there is obvious intent to promote the movie, a movie no one talks about, that died off very quickly after it came out.
Here we go again.
Some anons shilled MoS, a stinker in my opinion, for years on /co/ calling it great, despite practically no one ever agreeing with them, even the general populace didn't care for the movie, no one did.
Now the same things is happening to BvS, I can expect these same people creating threads till the next movie comes out calling it great, dismissing all criticism and pretending it didn't happen once they start the next thread.
I hope you are getting paid for this shit anon or anons.
People didn't care nor do they still care for the movie, all it had was hype then after the first week it quickly tanked in viewership because no one was lauding it.
See you tomorrow where you do all this again.
>>84008479
So you are admitting that Zach Snyder is a shit story teller?
>>84008158
>Snyderfags genuinely believe everyone hates this movie cause they're hardcore comic book nerds
>they'll probably call you a donnerfag if you point out how shitty the characters were portrayed in general
>the absolute backpedaling WB is doing right now including yesterdays p-please watch Justice League press tour
No, anon.
>>84008426
>>84008495
You're retarded. It took countless deaths and battles for Doomsday to get to that point. He was a combination of the "baby" version of Doomsday and the full grown version; a sort of in between style. He gained more power because of the nuke.
I've never heard a defense of the movie that didn't sound like sour grapes or have another defense contradict it three minutes later.
>>84008430
I know all the fuck about both the Alex Jr. that was Lex's brain in a clone body pretending to be an Aussie neckbeard and the Alex Jr. from Earth-3 who becomes the villain of Infinite Crisis, son.
NEITHER character is the Lex you introduce for the first fucking time in your newly created Superman universe if you have half a brain.
And neither character is an acceptable substitute for the real Lex, whose motivation of "I'm really jealous that Superman stole all the spotlight from me and I can never measure up to someone with powers like that, but in public I'm going to tell everyone the reason I hate him is because having an alien do everything for us will make us soft" is infinitely superior than ANYTHING else you could ever possibly come up with.
>>84008512
Firstly how autistic are you to type all that and secondly how much of a faggot are you to get triggered that some people like the movie?
>>84008536
Not in the original DOS. He wipes the floor with all the other Heros and only supes is left.
>>84008549
>NOT MUH NOT MUH NOT MUH USE THE ONE I WANTED
>>84008560
Not him, but why then are other anons who did like the movie triggered when others don't?
>>84008560
>Deflect and shill
>>84008582
No matter how hard you make fun of it, "not muh" will never stop being a valid response to an ADAPTATION OF SOMETHING THAT ALREADY EXISTS.
>>84008549
>NEITHER character is the Lex you introduce for the first fucking time in your newly created Superman universe if you have half a brain.
This is really an underlying issue across the board. WB is so eager to get a successful franchise they're trying to skip to the middle rather than let things build properly. So now we're killing Superman in the second movie.
And for all the talk of how Snyder's movies have these epic stakes, what does this mean for the future? What's Steppenwolf gonna do? Kill Superman AGAIN? Kill someone weaker and thus less of a feat? Kill a bunch of background prop NPCs?
>>84008479
Are you actually suggesting that BvS is a better movie than Shawshank Redemption, Godfather, 12 Angry Men, M, Se7en, Alien, a number of Hitchcock, Kubrick and Scorcese movies?
How do you expect anyone to take you seriously? Have a screencap.
>>84008608
>I'm not familiar with Elseworlds
It wasn't an adaptation of anything you stupid shit.
>>84008578
>n-n-not muh
Autism.
>>84008086
You're a retard
It has been confirmed SO many times paid shills DO shill on 4chins
It takes a handful of minutes to reach potentially millions of people
>>84008625
Yea I agree with you anon. They should have built up the death of superman. Now they have nothing. People are just going to expect supes to come back from the dead every time.
>>84008653
Confirmed where? My sides are entering the orbit if you are referring to people saying they are shills that are trolling you.
>>84008634
Autist detected.
>>84008636
I don't think you're familiar with Elseworlds.
The entire point of Elseworld is to deviate from the baseline. They're not meant to be definitive in the way film adaptations are. Elseworlds don't work without the context that the baseline, the "main universe" provides.
Not to mention that it's kinda fucked up that BvS shares the most story points with an Elseworlds where Superman doesn't even exist.
>>84008639
>Deflect and shill
>>84008653
>he thinks any board on 4chan has millions of people
My god. The delusion.
>>84008678
Not him, but how is that autism?
>>84008678
>Deflect and shill using the word autist
>>84008684
Yes they do. You being autistic and thinking that film versions should be "the definitive version" is your own problem.
>>84007720
Theres many valid and alot more non valid problems with the movie i think its like a 7/10 on average so people who say its shit are obviosly exagerating if you are a not muh kinda person gou might not like it its totally followable tho but motivations arent always clear and pacing is wierd the bvs fight was really cool so were most batman action scenes final fight was a little too flashy its a good contrast to marvel and nolan films tho if ur bored with um and is worth watching
I found it to be on par with civil war which i think was one of the weaker marvel movies ifyou sat thru civil war you can sit thru bvs
>>84008692
Because it's speaking against Zack Snyder.
There are literally no way to defend Snyder's movies than
1. Denial of reality
2. Accuse the critics of bias
3. Accuse the critics of stupidity/autism.
The guy and his films are a /tv/ meme and they're gonna run that mother into the ground.
>>84008678
Here's your (you)
I watched BVS two times just to make sure it was shit. Any scene not with batman in it is like a chore to watch. The ending was terrible and doomsday was Terrible. 6/10 at best.
>>84008560
If all your responses are going to be about autism, fuck off to another board, you're obviously not a regular on /co/, the average /co/ anon does not dismiss or respond with that level of shitposting, so I would appreciate if you would stop being an obnoxious bitch.
I have no issue with someone liking the movie, but you apparently have an issue with people disliking it.
My issue is how often these thread appear, definitely more than the popularity and interest seem to indicate they should and overall low quality of the discussion of these threads, you for example, your posts are absolute shit, the quality of the board would increase if you stopped posting.
>>84007720
>people ITT actually acting like this movie is so bad you shouldnt watch it
Wew lad that is some hardcore contrarianism. .
>>84008819
Most posts have been defending the movie though.
>>84008801
Kek no the quality of this board would be a lot better if autistic people like you didn't post paragraphs in threads about how no one could possibly like something. You need to take a long hard look at your life.
>>84008819
If anything it's argument ad populum.
Protip: Whichever side Armond White is on is the contrarian one, and he's pro BvS
>>84008788
6/10 and shit dude i understand why people dont like it its not for everyone no movie is but why exagerate its totally a 6/10 maybe 6.5 but i never understood why people say its shit its not
>>84008849
You have said nothing but autism in every post. When someone takes the time to destroy you in a long paragraph. You should accept your fate.
>>84008854
I havent seen a single person in this whole thread give a valid reason for why they think the movie is "shit" outside of NOT MUH, NOT WAT I WANTED or NO ONE LIKES THIS MOVIE STOP PRETENDING TOO CRITICS HATE IT SO YOU SHOULD.
>>84008861
Yea but it could have been so much better that is why people are so upset. 60% is a barely passing grade.
>>84008889
>autism
>>84007827
>X-men Wolverine Origins bad.
BULL FUCKING SHIT Its flawed as fuck but they are light years apart.
Their a NO aspect of Origins that is not incompetent.
Very little besides the editing of BVS is incompetent.
>>84008902
>Only I get to determine what reasons for liking or disliking something are valid.
And I haven't seen a single reason to like this movie other than "you're too dumb to understand it" or "you're autistic it's awesome" or "based snyder jesus" so I guess we're even?
>>84008945
don't forget pacing.
>>84008512
>despite practically no one ever agreeing with them, even the general populace didn't care for the movie, no one did.
Lie harder faggot!
>>84008953
Costumes, cinematography, fights, Batman. Batman. Batman. Set pieces. Wonder Woman.
WB has pigeon holed themselves by using a non cannon else-world adaption and the only way to go from here is down.
>>84008984
subjective, meaingless meme, fucking nothing, muh muh muh, meh, muh.
>>84007792
The first reply is a shillpost. I'm not a shill, I'm a filmlover and I can tell you that you have to be a braindead moron to expect quality from a Hack Snyder film. I've actually enjoyed one and a quarter of his works (DotD remake which is most likely due to James Gunn's script and whom I've been a fan of since fucking Tromeo & Juliet and my cut of 300 where I fast forward through the bullshit) and even then they weren't so great.
>>84008983
A 60% out of 100 doesn't get you into Harvard. It gets you into Devry University.
>>84008922
I definately agree with you but its like people just dont want anyone to like it
I dont think rt scores are fixed but the fact that tmnt out of the shadows, xmen apocalypse and bvs got such low percents while civil war and junglebook etc. Did well makes me question the quality of rt reviewers
>>84009005
>ask for valid reasons
>someone gives them
>he just spouts 4chan speak
Wew lad you are handicapped
>>84009013
The % is irrelevant, it being split down the middle shows that it has a audience and the other has biases against it not all to do with quality.
It not pandering to every no taste having fuck doesn't make it bad.
>>84008953
>And I haven't seen a single reason to like this movie
Everything listed in the good & great section.
>>84009054
That retard is gonna immediately say hes the worst Batman cause he blew up cars. There is no arguing with the mentally challenged.
>>84009036
No, I'm you.
>>84009047
Why is it that we should assume a bias against it regardless of quality but not a bias for it, even in denial of the fact that it was getting 10/10 audience reviews before it could possibly have been seen?
This is the kind of bullshit that torpedoes any of your credibility. Haters HAVE to exist but hardcore fans that will like it on principle can't possibly?
>>84009077
Batman was the only good part of the movie. They should have just made a batman movie and never let the abortion of BVS exist.
>>84008983
What part did I lie about, I never said anything about the movie being hated, although the critics did, but that people don't care about it, am I wrong?
No one talked about the movie favorably after it came out, no one recommend it after watching it.
When I asked people what they thought about it, it was usually an eh, no one is hyped for the next one.
That user review is slightly above average, ho hum, do you honestly think people care about such a movie?
>>84009077
Actually I'm gonna say he's the worst Batman because he acts like an idiot for the entire movie, because were he firing on all cylinders there'd be no conflict. Affleck isn't the best Bruce/Batman until we see him in his capacity as a brilliant detective.
He punches good sure but there's more to Batman than punching good. Just like there's more to Superman than the cape and rescues. Oh but wait that's a MUH argument, I forgot.
>>84009036
Not him but fights and batman were the only thing keeping the movie above shit levels
Wonderwoman and the costumes were shit tho
>>84009113
Yea I can agree with that. He killed a bunch of people and was a shitty detective but He was prolly the best batman yet in size and look.
>>84009113
>the casual speaks
Batman has NEVER trusted Superman despite them being friends and is ALWAYS leery at first. Do you even Tower of Babel? Batmans extreme paranoia is a defining trait.
>>84009125
>shitty costumes
This is how I know you are a troll.
>>84007720
Honestly, BvS wasn't the best movie out there, but it certainly isn't the perfect film that contrarians on /co/ seem to enforce. The first hour was boring, it almost made me fall asleep, no film has ever done that before, also, I didn't like the lack of Superman and what we saw of him, he's dour, depressing and kind of an idiot. Batman was great though, Affleck was a good choice and I'm excited about his future appearances. I didn't like Luthor, I found him annoying. I also didn't like the scenes which are meant to anticipate Justice League, they came across as kind of forced to me and didn't really add to the plot much. I didn't like Doomsday's design, he looked more like the cave troll from LotR instead of the actual Doomsday we're used to, he didn't look very threatening. But I liked the soundtrack and the warehouse action sequence was very well done.
6/10 - Not the best film I've seen this year but definitely not the worst. I think it could've been better but I'm not bothered with what we got.
>>84009151
Tower of Babel is non canon you shill just like BVS
>>84009179
Who the fuck cares if its canon or not. Jesus you are so fucking stupid. Did you even finish school?
>>84009137
>but He was prolly the best batman yet in size and look.
He's a good look for that particular Frank Miller Batman, but there's many different iterations of the character aesthetically. A sleeker more stealthy looking Batman might've worked equally well.
And that's kind if. Snyder's got some decent aesthetics but that seems to be all that's worthwhile. Good costumes alone does not make for an entertaining movie. If that were the case, just hire cosplayers because they do it even better.
>>84009189
You clearly don't read comics. I have a Ph.D. Faggot.
>>84009167
No one who is serious is saying its fucking perfect.
Mos is my 2nd favorite movie and even I know it has flaws.
>and kind of an idiot
No not really.
>>84009165
Well bats and kgbeast were shitty wonderwoman and supes were decent and i actually liked the movie but im not gonna pretend its great it was pretty good tho
>>84009206
I'm so glad I don't have to worry about someone as dumb as you ever breeding
>>84009151
Yeah no.
Tower of Babel Batman doesn't fully trust Superman, so he researches and stockpiles weapons against him.
BvS Batman never fully trusts Superman, so he gets all his information handed to him second hand and never tries researching the man himself. He can't, because if he does he finds out about Martha immediately and movie's over.
>But he was blinded by rage!
Yeah. He was so mad that he turned into an idiot. Doesn't change the fact that he was an idiot.
>>84009226
Well, that's your opinion, man. I respect that. I'll keep to my own.
>>84009235
If you don't have to worry then why are you replying?
>>84009047
A split down the middle on a system that comes down to yes or no of course it's going to have one or the other, that's how that system works.
There is no way to discern whether or not people thought it was great or good or okay vs bad or terrible. You're reading too much out of it.
Why do you assume that biases only work against the movie that that's the reason people are not liking it, once again you assume that because a lot of people didn't like it was only because it didn't pander to everyone?
It is clear you are the biased one, you assume that an aggregate right down the middle putting it just barely above average is proof of bias against the movie, people judging it poorly because of bias, proof it didn't pander which is why it's divisive, instead of the most reasonable interpretation that it's just an okay movie, as reflected by the numbers.
>>84009236
Kek. How did you not pick up on Desaad fucking with their heads.
>>84009235
>Shill shill shill shill shill shill Shill shill shill shill shill shill Shill shill shill shill shill shillShill shill shill shill shill shill Shill shill shill shill shill shill
I got 2 kids faggot how about you?
Itt view the Autist in its natural breeding ground
Notice how not a single person was able to paint a picture of actual critical flaws of BvS
Meanwhile the level headed ones who praise he film give reasons and even admit what the film's critical flaws are
Protip, NOT MUH is not a valid criticism.
>>84009271
Great. So he was a BRAINWASHED idiot.
You can explain it however you want, it doesn't change the fact that as it stands Batman is a worse detective than Lois and Lex, and we have not seen otherwise of Affleck's Batman yet. Until we do, I reserve the right to say he's the GOAT Batman of all time.
Because him being a detective is a huge fucking part of his character.
>>84009271
>Desaad
Desaad? Ha. More like "Desaad get off my fucking chair". As Darkseid would say.
>>84009242
Nothing he did lacked intelligence.
He didn't communicate with the public as to not get dragged down into the politics and arguments of what he should and should not be allowed to do.
I agree he should have tried reasoning with Bruce more especially after the first dose of Kryptonite wore off.
>>84009279
>Itt view the Autist in its natural breeding ground
But I can't see him.
>>84009306
Still, that's your opinion, man. I still respect that. I just don't agree with you. Can we still get along?
>>84009306
>He didn't communicate with the public as to not get dragged down into the politics and arguments of what he should and should not be allowed to do.
Using your tears and semen to glue the story together is just sad.
>>84009279
https://jonnegroni.com/2016/03/29/65-things-that-are-just-plain-wrong-in-batman-v-superman/
>>84009306
>He didn't communicate with the public as to not get dragged down into the politics and arguments of what he should and should not be allowed to do.
But that happened anyway.
>>84009269
Because the universal complaints...
>Dark tone
>Destruction
>Killing Zod
>No trunks
>Brooding
>Religious Symbolism
>Military usage
Are NOT technical flaws, they have no barring on its quality or lack thereof.
They are biases of people that came in wanting bright happy silly Superman and didn't get it.
>>84009369
But mos/bvs Clark didn't want to be worshiped ether.
Hence him smiling when he rescued the girl from the fire and then became uneasy as the people of the taco went all "must touch the god"
>>84009390
It'd be nice if you could at least attempt to disguise the fact that you're really just jerking off over the tone.
>>84009428
Proactive resistance defines. As does active resistance.
Let's do a hypothetical. R&B Singer R Kelly has two underage girls in his hotel room. He pulls down his pants and starts urinating on them. One girl moves out of the way and says "Don't piss on me". The other girl frowns at the stream of urine splashing against her face.
Which girl didn't want to be urinated on more?
>>84009440
Snyder blatantly copied Nolan because he thought it would make him a good director via osmosis.
I found it to be a 7 AT BEST. There are parts to like/that work, but it's kind of bogged down by too much that doesn't. It's not the worst comic film by any means but if you grade it higher you're fucking delusional
>>84009480
Didn't you get the memo? Nolan isn't dark anymore. Nobody liked it either. It doesn't count because you're autistic.
>>84009390
Those are the personal opinions of some anons on /co/, Rotten Tomatoes and the average moviegoer have nothing to do with any of that, you are conflating some people on /co/ with all movie goers.
Second, why are you restraining complaints about the movies down to only technical flaws? Does writing, consistency, motivation, character building and all the other parts of good writing to be dismissed?
Because by those metrics any big budget movie does superbly.
>>84009523
>It doesn't count because you're autistic.
Not him, but how is that autism?
>>84009533
>Does writing, consistency, motivation, character building and all the other parts of good writing to be dismissed?
I consider those to be technical flaws/film making flaws.
Let me restate...
Nothing I listed above are film making flaws.
None of the reviews I have read for mos complained about the writing other then some dialogue. Motivation is fine, Character building for the primary cast is fine.
>>84009440
>It'd be nice if you could at least attempt to disguise the fact that you're really just jerking off over the tone.
Absolutely.
That has no barring on my argument.
It being dark DOES NOT make it a bad film, it makes it a a film made only for the people that want or can tolerate such a tone.
The only complaint I hear from normies is they wanted more fights but DC has always been more about the character growth and story and less about the fights.
>>84009540
Zach Snyder is in every BVS post on /co/ and he hates criticisms.
>>84009664
Then why didn't we get any character growth in BVS?
>>84009629
It doesn't make it a good film either though.
It's a risky prospect because when you do a movie like Snyder's doing it, there's a chance the audience isn't going to find anyone to root for at all. Things like the death of a character don't have impact if they're not going to be missed, and that's the case with his Superman for many, many people.
A darker tone could work, even for the majority, but not in the way he's gone about it.
And let me be blunt. I know you're that "everyone just wants a silly campy superman that never struggles or fails" guy and that kind of assumption is so disingenuous it makes any attempts you make at being fair reek of bullshit.
>>84009540
I'm saying those are the arguments put forth.
>>84009600
And it's obviously impossible that anyone could find significant reason to disagree with your critique of "fine", .
>>84009698
>Batman starts out violent and angry
>Ends hopeful and ready to protect the Earth
>WW starts out wanting nothing to do with man
>Ends willing to help and protect them
>Supes starts out conflicted over if he should help these people that hate and fear him
>Died to protect them
You didn't see the movie huh?
>>84007720
The movie is far from perfect, but still deeply enjoyable.
It has several glaring flaws but also several moments that really shine.
If you didn't care for "Man of Steel" I'd just say don't bother with this, you probably won't like it.
And that's okay.
Was anyone else kinda gladsuperman died?I thought it was the best point of the film, aside fromBatman beating him.There's enough superman films out there already, and I'm glad we're going to get more focus on the Batman, who's not only more likable, but more morally correct and awesome too.
>>84009707
>It's a risky prospect because when you do a movie like Snyder's doing it, there's a chance the audience isn't going to find anyone to root for at all
Once again that merely makes it for a target audience not the entire audience.
Art films has tiny audiences and have zero mass appeal, that does not make them flawed for being such.
>>84009375
>argues critics of this film aren't autists
>posts link to a literally autism filled juvenile diatribe against the film
Holy shit. You can't this stuff up.
>>84009766
How did they achieve all this character growth without dialogue? That's right they didn't. They beat you over the head with it until there was nothing watchable left.
>>84009754
None of the reviews complained about motivation or character development.
>>84009814
But why can't you refute anything from the article is it because you can't?
>>84007720
I enjoyed it a lot, possibly one of my favourites. Check it out. Even if the movie was utter shit (which isn't) it's Batman and Superman, the most iconic american superheros.
>>84009819
>where was the character growth
>list it all out
>NUH UH I WAS TOLD THERE IS NO DIALOGUE
Go watch the movie man. It's clear you haven't seen it.
>>84009799
Esotericism is not inherently intellectual or possessing of depth.
And it's silly to expect that out of a major tentpole superhero franchise. I you think that everyone involved was going for a niche audience with these movies, that's a level of denial that make it impossible to even have this discussion.
Because this isn't even a matter of "this was a movie for fans" as you people going "NOT MUH" all thread have been eager to elucidate.
>>84009863
>>84009858
>Shill shill shill shill
>I've seen the movie three times.
>>84009822
I'm curious why you'd make a broad sweeping claim like that when you know you can be proven wrong so easily.
>>84009867
The people saying NOT MUH are most likely not fans. As another anon pointed out this is an elseworld. The people saying NOT MUH have only seen the animated series and movies and think that makes them experts on how these characters should be. Christ one of them didn't even know Batman suffers from irrational paranoia.
>>84008902
The pacing is screwed up and the forced inclusion of world building for other movies is out of place. Really the best movie to compare BvS with is Iron Man 2 as they share the same flaws in filmmaking. Civil War has a bit of the same problem with the Spider-Man stuff, but the Russos smoothed it out by placing it in the lull between dramatic beats.
>>84009916
>As another anon pointed out this is an elseworld.
You mean yourself?
>>84009916
>Only a real fan would like this movie
>No true scotsman would dislike it.
Just stop man. Just stop.
Besides you already moved the goalposts to Batman being brainwashed by Desaad rather than just irrationally stupid..
>>84009901
Because I read a fuck ton of the reviews and never encountered any.
>>84009916
In Tower of Babel the non canon works? Batman is one of the most level headed of all the super Heros in DC.
>>84009891
Just expressing my opinion bruh, didn't even tell you how many times I watched it.
But now fuck you, stay mad.
>>84009867
No not a niche audience, just not the audience that only wants safe happy movies.
>>84009983
Did you read them or did you skim them for a word like "fun" and then write them off entirely?
>>84009916
But thats the point, it is a esleworld and the people "not muh"ing about getting a dark brooding Superman STILL won't tolerate it even tho they got 5 films with what they wanted.
>>84009994
>Batman is level headed
Tell that to his contingency plans to take down every member of the league.
>>84010019
>Throw Batman in it
>A risk
Keep digging your hole, man.
History's already proven you're in the minority given how WB is trying to damage control with Justice League.
Its too little too late obviously but still.
>>84010051
The problem isn't that it's an elseworlds. The problem is that it's trying to have it both ways.
>>84009798
Man, it is vaguely concerning that someone might actually HAVE this opinion.
>>84010082
You mean the contingency plans he made himself based on his own independent intel instead of just asking Lex "what do next?"
>>84007720
Yes and no. It fixed some problems that MoS had (man of murder, shitty filter) and Superman was slightly better in characterization. but it's pacing is awful in comparison. Not to mention Zacks retarded reason to make batman kill because Zack wanted him to be more edgy. Lex was a shit villain.
>>84009798
I'm not glad but I don't particularity care. This universe is based on The Nail anyway so Superman isn't a necessity.
>>84010084
But thats the point, dark Superman was for the dark Superman fans and Batman was added in for normies.
>>84010117
What do you mean?
I find the elseworld the most bullshit hand wave excuse that's abused
Watch batman clobber Superman with a toilet seat.
The only worthy scene
>>84010234
But its not bullshit.
A alternate universe is suppose to do alternative fucking things.
The mos trailers were a bit more hopeful then the final film but NOTHING in them suggested it would still be a bright happy camp fest.
>>84008713
You do realize that your argument is the same thing as saying "Dennis Hopper Super Mario Bros. and Milla Jovovich Resident Evil did nothing wrong"?
>>84010051
>even tho they got 5 films with what they wanted
I don't recall ever getting a SINGLE film where Lex was both bald for the entire movie and ran Lexcorp and had the motive of "all my hard work becoming the most important guy in Metropolis was blown out of the water because this fucking alien can fly?"
>>84010278
No because those are genuinely technically flawed in plenty of other respects besides faithfulness.
>>84010333
Tone wise I mean.
>>84010227
Snyder's DC movies thusfar try to deconstruct genre conventions but also rely heavily on them in order to have a coherent narrative. They demand to be judged on their own merits, in a bubble, isolated from other works, but a ridiculously large amount of the meaning and symbolism is metatextual and requires knowledge of those things it references.
So for example, An alien living among humans would invite government intervention and monitoring, if not full on capture and vivisection, so Clark needs to hide (deconstruction) BUT that same government for some reason couldn't detect his ship landing, and never bothered tracking him down during his childhood (reliance on convention). Superman's whole secret identity doesn't really work in a 21st century post social media/selfie landscape where everyone has cameras and GPS and tracking and all that, so Lois is able to track him down. (deconstruction). But then we time skip to the end with him wearing the Clark Kent glasses and seemingly having a secret identity anyway and a guy like Batman who we know has satellites in his arsenal can't be bothered to find out who Superman is (reliance on convention). Even though a guy with comparable resources ALSO found out (deconstruction again!)
You see this in its fandom too, which is the most interesting part. They laud the movies for bucking trends and defying the genre, but then look to other movies in the genre and scream about how they can "get away" with being genre movies. They praise Snyder for being thought provoking, but then if the thoughts that are provoked lead to a negative review, suddenly it's just a movie and everyone is autistic and nitpicking and thinking about it too hard.
Will they fix Diana Prince's acting in the ultimate edition, she's worse than early Chris Lambert which i thought it wasn't possible.
>>84010276
A bright happy camp fest like what? Like All-Star? The story where Superman is DYING?
You seem pretty sure of what haters want but fuck if I've ever seen you actually explain what this campy superman that's so terrible is.
I'm increasingly sure you just played Injustice and think you're an expert.
>>84010402
Snyder's fate is now making different flavors of Watchmen then.
>>84010402
>so Clark needs to hide (deconstruction)
That isn't really a deconstruction.
He has always hid in the comics hence the secret identity.
They just took it further by having a Pa Kent that is worldy & rational enough to not try and sell Clark a fantasy land hopeful bullshit version of the world.
>>84010402
It's easier to say that they just don't measure up to other films in the genre, so fanboys try to create some entirely new metric for them.f
Which is stupid, because it's all the same superhero stuff.
Change the question. Is it worth watching just to see Batman and Superman beat the shit out of each other?
>>84010480
Watchmen was ultimately the worst thing to happen to comics because its copycats and descendants don't seem to grasp what made it a worthwhile venture in the first place. They just go "Look we have rapists and murderers and it's serious too!" and call it a day.
>>84010434
Never read All Star.
Never played Injustice.
A camp fest like the Reeves movies.
I never said Campy Superman is terrible.
I'm merely saying him not being campy is not a flaw ether.
If Batman can have Adam West vs Killing Joke differences in tone so can Superman.
>>84010525
>Pa Kent that is worldy & rational enough to not try and sell Clark a fantasy land hopeful bullshit version of the world.
He literally has a hopeful monologue about Clark being humanity's answer and shit.
"I know you did. I mean, part of me even wanted you to, but then what? Make you feel any better? You just have to decide what kind of a man you want to grow up to be, Clark; because whoever that man is, good character or bad, he's... He's gonna change the world."
And so on.
>>84010365
See, tone isn't the actual problem though. Characterization is.
You could make a Superman movie that's "dark" but still has Superman smile sometimes because that's what Superman's personality is supposed to be.
Like, imagine a live action version of Superman vs. The Elite. That would be fine.
>>84010525
If you read comics you might know that there have been versions of Jonathan that do that in ways that aren't quite so ass backwards or nonsensical.
But since you bring it up, let me ask you this. Why was Clark on that bus in the first place? Why wasn't be being home schooled? Because we know that he's already had one episode of superpowers BEFORE that scene, in the middle of a crowded class. If Jonathan were so wordly and rational, why did he not pull Clark out of school when that happened? Hell, even without that episode he'd have cause to just because of how Clark is bullied. If he's so scared people will follow the trail to his alien son, why's he taking alien artifacts to get tested by scientists?
Snyder's movies try to be deconstructions and go "logically in the real world this is what would happen" and then thirty seconds later go "Don't think about it! It's just a movie! Turn your brain off and go with it!"
It's schizophrenic at best.
Coming of the Supermen movie when?
>>84010408
If you're talking shit about Highlander 1, I swear on me mum I'll cut you mate.
"This was in the chamber with you. We took it to a metallurgist at Kansas State. He said whatever it was made from didn't even... didn't even exist on the periodic table. It's another way of saying that it's not from this world, Clark... and neither are you. You're the answer, son. You're the answer to, "are we alone in the universe?"
Muh carefully guarded secret identity!
>>84010596
He gave him a speech about personal choice.
That is not the same thing as you should go out and expect to be loved and praised by everyone.
>>84010577
I dunno man. Superman's equivilent to The Killing Joke is probably What's So Funny About Truth, Justice, and the American way, and that wouldn't work in this universe.
Superman's Elseworld's and one shots and the like aren't the same as Batman. This might stun you to know, but Superman and Batman? Not the same character. The same techniques can't be applied to them uniformly.
>>84010608
He smiled in both films.
I agree he needed more happy scenes in BVS.
But his personality is not required to be non broody.
Hence Kingdom Come, Hence Earth One, Hence For Tomorrow, Hence parts of the new 52, Hence parts of TAS.
>>84010345
but their lack of faithfulness was totes okay?
>>84010577
>If Batman can have Adam West vs Killing Joke differences in tone so can Superman.
Did Superman ever really have that kind of tonal shift though?
>>84010638
Because he wanted to give him a normal childhood.
Just keep the abnormal aspects of him a secret.
He tested the metal to make sure it wasn't some scam or earth made ship who has human parents waiting for him.
>>84010696
I'm talking tone, not similar stories types.
>>84010745
Some was some was not.
Key thing is they were the first adaptions made. So they needed to establish what the source material was.
Superman has already had 5 movies and a long tv show and several animated adaptions it can afford to do new and unique things.
>>84010717
So hence the story where the point was that Superman couldn't be who he was in the changing climate so he leaves, hence the story where Superman is Peter Parker and doesn't want to help people. he just wants to be rich and famous, hence an admittedly good story that nonetheless begins in medias res and requies the preexisting "campy silly" version you so hate to work at all, hence parts of the Superman that DC has already retconned out of existence, and hence selective cherry picked parts of an acclaimed series irrespective of their context or continuity?
>>84010717
Honestly, I read a few issues of For Tomorrow as it was coming out because I was hyped to see a Supes story with the same flavor as Hush...and it wasn't that and I hated it. Never tried it again, maybe it's good and I'm being closed minded, I dunno.
What I DO know is that the Volume 1 of Earth-1 is probably the single worst telling of Superman's origin EVER committed to paper. It honestly made me even angrier than Snyder's take does.
And Kingdom Come only works as a story specifically because of its context as "Superman USED to be the way you know him, but this is a dark future where shit went bad and he lost faith and retired"
>>84010748
Earth One, For Tomorrow, Kingdom Come, Injustice, Red Son, New 52, portions of the 90s, arc were Zod and company killed a entire planet and then Clark executed them.
>>84010717
Superman's mythos at it's core is the tale of an incredibly powerful superhuman guided by a solid ethical core instilled by his warm and loving adoptive parents.
Stuff like Kingdom Come is about that ethical character LOSING that core and struggling to regain it in a confusing world of grey.
Snyder robs the character of his most essential trait right out of the gate, turning him into a bewildered, forlorn and angst-ridden man wandering aimlessly well into his 30's.
By the time he encounters Lois Lane, he's still ambiguous about helping out humanity and has to be prodded into it by her and his father's ghost.
This is an OC that has nothing whatsoever to do with Superman as anyone has broadly understood him for the last 60 years or so.
>>84010829
>hence the story where Superman is Peter Parker and doesn't want to help people. he just wants to be rich and famous
That is American Alien not EO.
>>84010789
And? You can go Darker with Batman because the core of the character is inherently dark. THe thing you seem to be ignoring is that Adam West was the abberation, not the standard. His moniker is literally "the dark knight". Superman has never been that guy. He's the comparative white knight.
He *can* work as a byronic hero, but only after being given a baseline context. Snyder skipped over that part.
>>84010857
>Honestly, I read a few issues of For Tomorrow as it was coming out because I was hyped to see a Supes story with the same flavor as Hush...and it wasn't that and I hated it. Never tried it again, maybe it's good and I'm being closed minded, I dunno.
It was good to a extent but convoluted for sure.
I am merely referring to his characterization and tone in it.
>>84010857
>What I DO know is that the Volume 1 of Earth-1 is probably the single worst telling of Superman's origin EVER committed to paper. It honestly made me even angrier than Snyder's take does.
Characterization wise I am prone to actually agree with you in that they did make him to emo.
But the tone and world building was spot on.
>>84010888
Don't pretend like you read American Alien. You just saw the name "Max Landis" involved and got mad at a couple out-of-context screencaps on the internet.
AA in its entirety is actually the best story of Clark's teen-to-debut years since Birthright.
>>84010859
I already addressed most of the things you cited but I do find it odd you saw fit to include two literally evil dictator Superman elseworlds in there in order to make your case seem a little fuller.
Also you're off by a decade; Byrnes was in the 80s. And again, you're trying to pick specific scenes and stories out of a greater context of their runs and series which, at best, is disingenuous to your point.
>>84010888
American Alien would actually be an improvement over what we've gotten on screen. At least where Lex is concerned.
>>84010880
Bullshit, that is the POINT to give us a Superman that has a rational, realistic and non mary sue idealistic view of the world.
Him being perfect and doing everything perfectly IS NOT A ESSENTIAL FUCKING TRAIT!
>>84010958
>But the tone and world building was spot on.
You seem to think characters are separate from world building and tone rather than a product of them, which makes it strange that you keep trying to cite Elseworlds as a defense given that their entire concept is "Let's see how this change in venue has reshaped the characters".
>>84010960
I didn't get mad, I have no problem with alternative unique takes on the character.
I'm just factually saying, Earth One did not give a shit about being rich or famous.
>>84010958
>But the tone and world building was spot on.
Are you fucking with me?
The Tim Burton movie villain from the planet next to Krypton is good worldbuilding?
Clark going around Metropolis, with no disguise yet, blatantly using his powers to try out for the high profile jobs like the NFL the same week he debuts as Superman, and nobody notices, is good worldbuilding?
What the fuck is wrong with you?
>>84010994
>Him being perfect and doing everything perfectly IS NOT A ESSENTIAL FUCKING TRAIT!
Nobody is saying it is except you. You can't even manage your own words. Stop trying to put new ones in our mouths.
>>84011034
>Earth One did not give a shit about being rich or famous
Yeah, that's why the entire story until the badguy shows up is just him auditioning for the best paying jobs in the city.
When the fuck in AA does Clark even once mention money? At first he wants to stay in Smallville and become a farm animal doctor for fuck's sake.
>>84010988
I included them because they are still Superman. Regardless if they evolved differently.
>>84011034
It opens with him going to places like Star Labs for a job and trying out for a pro football team. How is that different from Peter Parker wanting to be in show business or a wrestler?
Hell, dead Jonathan even does the whole "with great power" thing.
>>84010994
>has a rational, realistic and non mary sue idealistic view of the world.
Wandering the backwoods, sullenly doing shit jobs and being unable to deal with social conflict without lashing out violently?
I get that you relate to all that, but Clark is supposed to be from a stable Midwestern family with good American and Christian values, not Le Wandering Autist.
No one said anything about "him being perfect and doing everything perfectly." Being overly idealistic is in itself a flaw that can lead a character into all sorts of conflict and bad situations, see Rodgers, Steve.
When you make Superman a cunt you've basically made a new character and painted an S on him.
>>84011025
False, they could give us a broody serious Clark that evolved out of such a world without making him emo or uncaring of others, Mos is proof of that.
>>84011080
That's only true if you consider the only things to matter about the character his aesthetics and power set. To even begin to claim that Red Son Superman is the same character as any of the others you listed is intellectually dishonest to the point that you shouldn't even be trying to have this conversation anymore.
>>84011035
>The Tim Burton movie villain from the planet next to Krypton is good worldbuilding?
Conceptually yes, his facial appearance was the only problem.
>>84011130
>without making him emo
But they did.
>>84011118
Apparently the character can be anything and so long as the S is painted on him it counts as Superman.
>>84011118
>but Clark is supposed to be from a stable Midwestern family with good American and Christian values
Yes and that was the POINT they changed that to give us realistic folk instead and showed how he evolved into a similar but less perfect person as a result.
>>84011142
>That's only true if you consider the only things to matter about the character his aesthetics and power set.
And basic origin & mythology.
His personality matters but it not required to be identical for alternate realities/adaptions.
>>84011164
>Conceptually yes
You actually like the idea that Krypton's destruction was caused by a war with an outside race, as opposed to them bringing it on themselves and having the classic scene of Jor-El trying to tell the council and them not listening.
Every other dead planet in the fucking history of fiction was blown up by space war, Krypton is like the only one with something unique going on.
>>84011229
Realism isn't cynicism no matter how much you repeat to us that it is.
>>84010827
It's the first major cinema JL so JL should be done right to the source material and JL being done right requires superman to be done right.
>>84011170
>>84011170
Hence my problem with EO that MOS rectified.
>>84011266
>And basic origin & mythology.
Yeah so have you actually read Red Son?
Because Krypton doesn't exist in the Red Son continuity. Superman is from future Earth, and obviously landed elsewhere, so what exactly is the same about his basic origin and mythology there?
>>84011299
Your grasp on english is apparently terrible so I'm going to spell it out for you.
Man of Steel Clark is an Emo Kid too. That bullet was not dodged.
