So what exactly is wrong with Scott Snyder's Batman again?
It's kinda boring.
Joker shows up too often.
>cool villain introduction
>the get batman in a real bind or have some interesting scheme
>rushed ending where the villain's scheme gets basically undone and all the stuff prior ends up not mattering for the most part
Repeat for 50 issues or however many arcs there were
Snyder's overwritten prose passages utilizing the most obvious and cliche symbolism, he writes Bruce badly outside of Zero Year,mall of his arcs end in an astroundingly boring way, he didn't have a single original idea for this run and everything he did do was done better by Morrison, one of the worst written Jokers ever.
>>83735379
Bruce was slightly too dumb for my liking, and Snyder can't do endings at all.
>>83735548
This dialogue is so bad.
snyder cant write worth a damn
>>83735379
it doesn't showcase all the "interesting" bat-family members that the fake Batman fans on /co/ love
>>83735598
>he thinks Harper and Duke are more interesting than Dick and Damian
>>83735548
I still don't understand why Joker has a Glasgow smile in this flashback
It was popular/read by a large number of casuals. Ergo /co/ hates it with a passion.
Real talk, it had amazing art that was often not backed up by a good story. Too much joker, too many 'this is literally the end, literally!' stories in endgame, zero year, night of the owls and not too many new characters for the sake of leaving a mark (baby pennyworth, duke, harper row, etc. Though it did have some pretty good character moments plus it injected actual mystery into some batman stories which was a nice change. Plus Snyders horror roots shone through a few times which was also nice.
>>83735379
>Snyders
Nothing.
It was a fantastic run, and to be honest, the Joker was the best part of it.
>>83735797
Fuck off Scott, and try not to rip off more Morrison stories pls
>CoO ends with a ridiculous that doesn't matter in the end because "Maybe, maybe not"
>Zero Year drags on forever
>Both Joker stories are pure shit
>Ruined Freeze
>HARPER ROW
Black Mirror and BatGordon were cool, he just writes Bruce like a retard
>>83735379
He's too concerned with leaving his mark on Batman, making the next classic story, next iconic character.
>>83735548
I dropped batman after this shit. This whole sequence was retarded
itt:
people implying morrison didn't rip off decades of batman stories but when he does it it's called "homage"
low-key stanning in this thread with the morrison can do no wrong-schtick. fuck off dickriders
>>83735647
The art is that good I'll give you that
Not enough joker rape
>>83736014
>people implying morrison didn't rip off decades of batman stories but when he does it it's called "homage"
>Tying together decades worth of stories, interpretations, and characters
vs
>Doing Black Glove, but worse
>Doing NML, but worse
>>83735379
Mostly unrelated question.
I know this issue is fairly valuable, and I have a copy in very good condition. Problem is, it's some kind of variant cover and I don't know if it makes the value higher or lower.
It looks almost exactly like the one in the OP but the text in the title is blue instead of yellow. Anyone know what I've got and if that makes it any more/less valuable?
>>83735379
He isn't Grant Morrison.
That is literally the entire problem people have with Scott Snyder.
Was his run perfect? No. Was it better than things like No Mans' Land and 90s Batman? Fuck yes.
The only thing which made 90s Batman not complete garbage was the fact that Denny O'Neill was editing it.
>>83736065
nice cherrypicking my dude
i didn't even say jackshit about snyder but let me say something anyways
zero year is only similar to no man's land in terms of broad concept. and this is where people's hatred of snyder lies is they look at the overarching concept and theme of it and they think "oh its like x story" when x story was also probably influenced and copied from stories prior to it or even non-batman stories at all. no man's land in particular cribs from dystopic science fiction novels and applies it to the 'street level' world of batman.
in reality though snyder's stories on a content level are different. no man's land didn't have riddler controlling a lethal laser light show in a museum nor did it have a guy who regrows bones fight batman in a blimp. subsequently zero year didn't have gangs vying for control of the no man's land of gotham (which if you remember or reread it in the past year was a huge part of the story on a content and structural level)
they're both rather different from each other. Tbh your black glove comparison is far more apt and have way similar elements to each other
>>83736086
Comic book collectors literally hurt the industry.
Die in fifty-two fires.
>>83736184
This post is so embarrassing
>>83735379
It's not Morrison's Batman.
>>83736163
No Man's Land shits all over Snyder's Batman run. It's nothing but street levels stories and is still better than the bombastic grandiose New 52 run by a mile.
>>83736235
morrison stans can't even articulate their points so they resort to this
>>83736184
>nice cherrypicking my dude
>i didn't even say jackshit about snyder but let me say something anyways
It's a thread about Snyder's Batman you dumb mother fucker.
>>83736163
>he likes Snyder more than Milligan/Grant & Breyfogle's Batman
>>83736273
i know that dumbass but my original post was more addressing the morrison dickriding itt and that was the post that got replied to in this particular line of conversation and you seem rather upset about that
>author wars inside character wars inside company wars
See this is why I'm hesitant to connect with comic book fans in real life.
>>83736199
I'm not one of those, I just bought the comic when it came out and am now in need of some extra cash.
Not making a living off this shit
>>83736369
Author wars actually make sense though
>>83735393
>Joker shows up too often.
Twice over the course of fifty two issues is too often? I mean, you hardly can count the times when he's not actually being the Joker.
>>83736460
but why tho? a lot of these authors love each other's work and we should respect that and yr perpetuating fake bullshit for no reason
>>83736572
Uh, sure you can? He's badly written there too.
>>83736651
like sure there are some that hate each other like morrison and moore or moore and dc but that doesn't mean we can't enjoy both and recognize the output they've put out as pretty good in a medium filled with dumb shit
>>83736320
>Thread about Snyder's Batman
>See people saying he used Grant's ideas
>Make post attacking Morrison
>Get ass blasted when you get called out on it
Kill yourself
>>83736651
People argue like this in lots of media anon
Everyone has their favorite and they think he or she is the best
Most of his stories have been lesser versions of previous writers works (Grant Morrison in particular) and his take on Batman and his villians lack any interesting characteristics that make them stand out as "Scott Snyder's take on insert character name". To me it seems that Snyder gets way to much credit,
I just don't feel like it's the greatest thing ever and I'm always left scratching my head when I read/hear someone say that.my god he cannot write a compelling third act to save his life.
>>83736401
Gotta be from another print run. Put it on ebay and some idiot will buy it for at least fifty bucks.
>>83736668
>He's badly written there too.
Oh yeah, how is he written badly when he was pretending to be a staff member of Arkham? Or when he's been "cured" of being the Joker and is a normal Joe Shmoe?
>>83735379
The writing reminds me of the 90s. Constant promise of ultraviolence as the main draw, weak plot twists, unnatural dialogue with way too many exposition dumps from villains, and speaking of the villains, I've never seen a Batman writer get them so completely wrong.
I don't hate Snyder Batman. I just don't like it anywhere near as much as just about any other high profile run in recent memory.
>>83736787
There are people that enjoy his run for what it is, and then there are casuals (that have never read any other Batman comic) that think it's the greatest thing since sliced bread.
>>83735961
Why?
>>83736823
But Batman was by and large written better in the 90s than anything Snyder wrote.
>>83736572
Hogging up two of the five major arcs is a lot, considering how many villains Batman has.
Boring, over-narrated, and every issue feels the same. Can't stand his writing at all.
>>83736817
>Oh yeah, how is he written badly when he was pretending to be a staff member of Arkham?
>His speech to Bruce where he explains his name just so we all know how smart and witty Snyder was
Snyder is too into himself. He writes everything with such an overdramatic tone that it's almost comical. I dropped it during Zero Year when I realized that every storyline was a rehashing of an older storyline, but with a less competent writer at the helm this time.
>>83735379
Every story involves the fate of Gotham in an explosion riddled battle, or the Joker. Coupled with the constant prose about muh Gotham, it's Batman written for twelve year olds, so it's actually perfect for the character.
>>83736882
>Hogging up two of the five major arcs is a lot
But that's only because the two non-Joker arcs take twelve issues to tell the story.
Snyder's lucky he's got Capulo with him. It's what gets me through most of his run, really.
>>83735647
I feel like the art itself carried the story more than Snyder's own writing. It's a shame that Capullo basically wants to only work with Snyder at DC.
>>83736939
Ok but two of the five major arcs are still Joker stories
>>83735888
>Morrison rip offs previous stories
>GENIUS! I WOULD KNOW THESE ARE JUST RETELLINGS IF I ACTUALLY READ ANYTHING ABOUT BATMAN BEFORE!
>>83735911
Harper Row wasn't his fault, he wanted to use Cass but editorial said no so he used Bluebird which was created by some girl
>>83735379
He cannot write Bruce. Dickbats yes, but his Bruce is terrible.
>>83736989
His allusions to Batman's history aren't retellings though. Morrison actually found a way to weave in the wacky, niche corners of Batman's my this into a more modern narrative. Snyder didn't do that. He literally copied the basic ideas from Morrison's run and just did his own, bad spin on them.
>>83736989
>>Morrison rip offs previous stories
Explain how Morrison "ripped off" previous stories
>>83737005
He wrote him well in Zero Year, but other than that his Bruce is really fucking stupid. He's just better at writing younger, confident characters.
at least Snyder understand that Batman is about failing over and over until he succeds without giving up, it's not about being a guy that has an escape plan for everything
>Batman gets mentally attacked in Morrison's run
>lol back up personality
>Batman is mentally attacked in Snyder's run
>needs to be saved by one of his allies
Just to make an example, but obviously Snyder is too popular and his stories aren't about WINK WINK COMICS GUYS! that makes the pseudo-intellectuals here feel smarter
Scott Snyder is epitomizing the crap that has been killing the character for the last decade. Do people really think stuff like this is good writing?
Snyder ripped off the Black Glove with the owl story. Now he wants to rip off Morrison's serial killer Joker.
I'm still willing to read it if it turns out decent, but given the scans I can tell it's not the masterpiece Snyder and everyone else want it to be.
>>83736989
YEAH MAN ALL STAR SUPERMAN SUCKED TOO IT WAS JUST STORIES THEY'VE ALREADY TOLD.
>>83737077
Batman isn't really "about' anything other than the basic story of his parents being murdered and him protecting Gotham. You're just nitpicking different takes on characters without acknowledging the stories behind them.
>>83737112
. By this point Snyder has written more mediocre Batman than good.
And I've only read half of the Owl story but people weren't kidding when they called it a Black glove rip off. They might as well retcon Morrison's work out and say this is the new 52 rendition of it. How many secret crime organizations are there in Gotham that Batman doesn't know about?
>>83736163
Wait, what's wrong with No Man's Land?
>>83735379
Snyder is a terrible writer with no depth ."
>>83737144
The Black Glove wasn't inherently rooted to Gotham's history and founding the city. It was a dime a dozen secret organization that happened to operate in Gotham occasionally.
>>83737077
>at least Snyder understand that Batman is about failing over and over until he succeds without giving up,
>R.I.P. only happened because Bruce tried to get inside the mind of The Joker and failed miserably
>Bruce's failure with Batman Inc. was so bad his son died
/co/, why is Black Mirror so much better than his Batman run? The only bad things they have in common are the shitty narration boxes.
>Reminder that CoO let Zero Year happen
Scott Snyder has done 1 good Batman story. He's not even in league with Millar.
>>83737225
Because Snyder writes a good Batman, as long as Batman isn't Bruce
How many sidekicks does he have at this point? Its getting fucking ridiculous
>Dick
>Jason
>Tim Drake's shadow
>Damian
>Barbara
>Steph
>Cass
>Harper
>Black Guy
>Lucius's son
And that's not even counting his other Gotham allies. This is getting ridiculous. It needs to be narrowed down to the Robins and Barb. In fact, just kill Tim because he's practically dead already
Snyder's joker is pretty terrible
he's trying to write heath ledger joker, but it doesn't work
but what's worse is the awful medieval metaphors joker keeps expositing. No jokes, just nonsense metaphors that are the equivalent of narratively hammering a square peg into a round hole. It's stupid, it's lacking any sort of real depth, and it's tiresome.
>>83737225
For one thing he writes a better Dick.
Also Black Mirror featured new villains.
James Jr ranting for 3 pages on his motive near the end of the book could just be his character or whatever.
Owlman, Joker, everybody else doing it too, especially established villains, is just no.
Also it was smaller scale instead of Gotham blowing up and being on fire the entire time.
Joker was easily the worst thing about Blsck Mirror but he was on five pages as opposed to 10+ issues.
>>83737214
Right but Snyder doesn't only stop at the typical secret organization hunting Batman.
He also includes a member of that club who claims to be a relative of Bruce's, knows a dark secret about his parents, and is connected to Willowwood Hospital. Lincoln march is a point for point copy of Simon Hurt.
>>83735379
It's a Batman/Joker fanfiction.
>>83737261
or Gordon.
>>83737225
He got too popular too quickly.
>>83735379
I dropped the book at like the resolution of court of owls and haven't gone back.
>>83737048
if Snyder used the 3-not Bane meme or Dick as Batman you would scream ripoff (if you weren't too busy jerking off to Dickbats) but since Morrison did it it's fine
>>83737283
no, better add thousand of international Batman and a new Robin, also another Batwoman
It's not that I dislike overly violent comics (Ennis is my favourite writer), it's that DOtF's violence has been so...eh. It's just violent andooo look how dark we are and OK then we get it you're mature how about some good writing now Scotty?
>>83737351
I think a very overlooked aspect of the story is how it seems to be addressing the homosexual undertones of Batman and Joker's relationship.
>>83737225
Black Mirror had a lot of the "Snyderisms" that his Batman run had.
>story begins with father telling story to main character via narration
>Gotham gets narrated about
>lots of narration
>terrible and blatantly gay Joker
>villain rants for 5+ pages at the end of the book
>ends on a "maybe or maybe not" wet fart of an ending
But he writes a better Dick than Bruce, Joker was at the minimum, the closest thing to wide scale was James Jr poisoning the baby formula or whatever it was, and Bruce wasnt important at all.
>>83737372
...What?
>>83737415
Most people like to ignore that crap.
>>83735379
Snyder makes great starts to arcs that just fizzle out to unsatisfactory endings.
It also feels like to me, Snyder is obsessed about writing a definitive version of Batman people will want to refer back to instead of just writing good stories for himself and not thinking about the future.
>>83737372
>3-not Bane meme
What?
>Dick as Batman you would scream ripoff (if you weren't too busy jerking off to Dickbats) but since Morrison did it it's fine
Snyder wrote Dickbats in Black Mirror, most consider it his best story
>>83736849
You realize he went there and showed Joker who he was, right? Which led to Joker going into the batcave and fucking everyone's shit? Why don't you explain what about that was smart?
>>83737475
>It also feels like to me, Snyder is obsessed about writing a definitive version of Batman people will want to refer back to instead of just writing good stories for himself and not thinking about the future.
he himself said to get on dc's biggest book, the book that sells more than justice league, you have to go big or go home.
i don't buy dc's biggest seller to have safe middle of the road stories
Not only is Snyder bad at Batman, he mentored an even worse writer in Tynion.
>>83737302
I'll grant that Lincoln March's identity was a completely unnecessary extra twist.
>>83738372
Tynion at least sometimes writes good stuff. Bennet on the other hand never has produced anything beyond passable at best.
>>83735888
Maybe like, I can have a fucking opinion too, man...
>>83738343
They don't have to be safe, they should be interesting though. Like, all of these stories are trying to redefine the character and shit, but what did any of them really do for him but put him in weird situations and then resolve themselves in weirder ways?
>>83736086
Sounds like a second/third/etc. printing.
>>83735379
No idea. The run has definitely got some issues, but I don't get all the hate.
>Court/Night/City of Owls
The finale/twist was a little rushed and out of the blue, but overall, everything about the first 12 issues is amazing.
>Death of the Family
Great Joker story all-around.
>Zero Year
The first and third "acts" are pretty great. Dark City isn't bad, until you read Savage City and realize that it gets a little redundant. This is where we start to see that Snyder loves destroying the entire city and forcing Batman to find some convoluted way to fix it. To me, it works in Zero Year, but it gets old fast.
>Endgame
I was a little let down when I was reading this monthly, but I loved it on my most recent reread. Synder's Gotham-ending trope is back in full force, but the Joker/Batman confrontation and the insane Batman vs. Justice League opener makes this a pretty solid story.
>Superheavy
Jim Gordon is awesome as Batman. The problem is that this 9-issue arc is extremely rushed. I think we really only got to see one proper fight scene between Bloom and Rookie. Bloom's motivations are lazy, and this story is the worst offender of the city-ending trope that Snyder is so fond of, but honestly, at the end of the day, this is a pretty damn fun (and unique) arc.
>Everything else.
The one-shots and stuff were really hit and miss, but a few really stand out to me. Namely #44 (A Simple Case), Annual #3, 51, and 52.
>>83739510
>Death of the Family
>Great Joker story all-around.
Why did he have them there and pretend to cut their faces off and not actually do it? Huh? Huh? Huh? Why? Tell me!
>>83738372
I see Cassfags are still mad
His joker was awful, his stories went on too long, and retreads multiple ideas that Morrison already used but did them worse.
I honestly liked the progression of Superheavy until the second to last issue, it all fell apart then.
>>83739580
because it's funnier to see them worry about their faces when you know it's just a farce
>>83739580
Because he wanted to scare the shit out of Batman, and then make them kill eachother anyway.
I know it's a stretch, but it worked for me, because in a shared universe like this, you can't just kill the main characters of 5 different books.
>>83739510
>Death of the Family
>Great Joker story all-around.
Bruh...
>>83739670
Yeah, but WE all know that, so you have to raise the stakes in believable ways, interesting ways, not "Haha I mutilated them all! No I didn't, for no real reason."
Feels good knowing /co/ is full of Morrisonfags. At least we can agree on something, Morrison has the best run.
>>83739832
I think his run is hard to compare to most others. You could make arguments for stories like NML or Zero Year to be as grand and epic or Red Hood and Knightfall as personal, but Morrison's went for such a grand scale on both ends and celebrated the history in a way that may never be done again.
Honestly I think /co/ just hates Snyder because everybody got hyped over Black Mirror and then got disillusioned when everything else following it wasn't up to par. Plus /co/ also drinks the PR hype machine koolaid way too easily whenever a new Snyder book is coming out, setting themselves up for another smack in the face. Ultimately Snyder's an okay writer, with a bad tendency to write very disappointing endings, so he's kinda mediocre, who just happens to be riding the flavor of the moment wave for all its worth.
>>83739957
Don't worry with enough time people will start hating King and praise Snyder instead.
>>83739510
Bloom is like the creepiest looking character design
so props for that
Zero Year was my favorite part of his run
>>83739588
we will always be until Cass/Tim/Steph get an ongoing together
>>83740067
That's basically what's happening in Tec right now though
>>83740067
...you mean like Detective Comics right now?
>>83740090
>>83740094
Batwoman is a shit though
but I liked it a lot still
>>83740108
I hope she becomes the "asshole/all work/super serious" one of the family so we can get Bruce being mostly a nice guy back
>>83740090
>>83740094
It's a Batwoman wankfest and all three are shity retconned to hell versions of the characters written by Tynion.
>>83740134
Seriously, if it was under a good writer and without Batwoman and Clayface and instead the Riddler, or Catwoman, it'd be my favorite series ever
>>83740134
>Wankfest
All we've had is a Zero issue, at least wait until the #1
>>83735379
Id say decent ideas but just poor execution and sometimes it seems like he doesn't fully think them through.
>>83740167
If it features Batwoman training people she has no business training on the basis of having gone to a military academy, being allowed to do this despite not being in Batman's confidence about what's going on with the plot, and the timeline continuing to make no fucking sense to allow all this, then it'll be a wankfest.
>>83740254
>If it features Batwoman training people she has no business training on the basis of having gone to a military academy
If anything, her military background actually makes her ideal for training younger rookies in Gotham like a drill sergeant.
>being allowed to do this despite not being in Batman's confidence
Well clearly she's in his confidence now that he's revealed his identity to her.
People rip on Snyder's Joker, but what did Morrison's Joker ever do besides pretending to beSexton? I thought the weakest part of Morrison's entire run was his Joker.
>>83741159
>I thought the weakest part of Morrison's entire run was his Joker.
That's good. A writer should never count on the Joker too much, but using him only when it serves the narrative. Morrison's Joker laughs at Black Glove attempts to kill Batman, tries to become a hero when Bruce died and goes back to his usual self when he returns, while getting the final blow on Dr Hurt using a gag. It's not the GOAT Joker by any means, but certainly a good one. Snyder's Joker is just a gay edgelord
Superheavy actually felt like something new and it sucks that it was so rushed.
>>83735379
A bit too much of the "epic", high stakes, life-or-death shit. Not every story needs to be "BATMAN YOU CAN'T DO IT! YOU'LL DIE"
>>83741280
But that's the worst way to use the joker.
> laughing at the black glove because I'm much more extreme cuz I'm the joker.
>killing off the black glove with a gag was very anti-climatic
> pretending to be a detective because I miss Bats
>>83735548
I love this page.
>>83735548
>It was then that I knew...
This fucking dialogue
>>83736184
What the fuck did I just read?
>>83741573
You're ignoring that Joker believed that Hurt was the Devil. Joker spent the entire story telling Hurt he wasn't afraid and that he'd get the last laugh. It wasn't "so extreme lol" it was Joker beating the Devil
All setup, no payoff.
>Death of the Family
>Why is Joker having Batman revisit their old fights?
>no reason
>What secret does the Joker know about Batman?
>nothing really
>Why did the Joker kidnap Alfred?
>just because
>What's in the tray?
>nothing
>>83735539
All of this.
>>83736943
>It's what gets me through most of his run, really.
Yeah, he's probably why I liked it so much the first time around.
But when people like Rafael Albuquerque drew, I found it really dull.
>>83735379
Zero year and CoO were great
Everything else is shit
>>83735548
I love this page, I don't get the hate.
The joker isn't interested in the actor, only the character and Bruce trying to get rid of the magic by saying Santa's not real gets no reaction from a guy with smile carved on his face.
>>83741159
I think you'll find very few people who disagree with you, anon.
>>83735379
>Erased Morrison's development and made Bruce more like the broody 90s version
>Erased the importance of Damian and the Robin role that Morrison worked hard to revalidate and reestablish
>Aped Morrison's plot elements
>Terrible Joker
>Shitty OCs
>No payoffs in the stories that have massive setup, resulting in boring as fuck stories
>>83746711
>tell Joker exactly who he is
>scream at everybody else when they get mad Joker destroyed their shit and hurt them because HE DOESN'T KNOW AND EVEN IF HE DID YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND HIM AND NOBODY UNDERSTANDS OUR LOVE
>>83746711
>hurr durr the Joker knowing about our identities almost fucked the Batfam
>better tell him mine
It's retarded within his own fucking narrative, Bendis tier inconsistency
>>83747185
It's worse because he assumes that because in this idiotic test the Joker demonstrated no interest in his identity, the same would hold true for all his associates even though they were all just attacked in ways that mean the opposite.
>>83736163
>I haven't read any 90s Batman
Legends of the Dark Knight is the best title the character has ever had.
On the one hand I'm so shocked a new 52 casual would pretend to have read any 90s Batman, then go for the 90s comics suck meme, which immediately outs you has having never read 90s Batman. On the other, I am acutely aware that casual defensiveness knows no bounds.
>>83736014
>Can't even greentext
>using low-key unironically
Fuck off Snyderfag
>>83747185
Nigga, this scene takes place before the Bat Family was a thing.
No depth, intrigue, subtlety
Lesser rehash of previous stories with epic shock value
Exposition spells EVERYTHING out at all times
Batman for the Nolan generation
pales in comparison to Morrison's masterful run
>>83741159
Morrison's Joker wasn't great, but it doesn't get the same complaints because it also wasn't the cornerstone of his run. Snyder's Joker isn't great either, but he uses the Joker in some capacity in nearly half of his New 52 run. That's absurd.
>>83747185
That scene takes place right after he took Dick in, so there was no batfamily.
The actual problem with the whole thing is everybody was upset Joker apparently knows who they are, but Batman insists that if the Joker knew, it wouldn't matter. And then there's shit about "you don't know how Joker thinks!!" that's basically Snyder's Batman/Joker fanfiction.
>>83748340
Morrison's Joker was perfect. He used him, like Wolverine, sparsely and to great effect. The prose issue was excellent, Sexton stuff. Scene related.
>You sound just like him
>>83747288
I can only find the new Legends of the Dark Knight volumes in my country. Where the heck could I get the late 80's - 90's stuff?
>>83746711
The problem is that Bruce decided it was a good idea to tell Joker exactly who he is. It's one thing if Joker figures it out on his own, but Bruce telling him puts the entire family in danger. It's just bad writing.
>>83749205
There's a torrent that has all of it and I'm also pretty sure that there's DDLs in the /co/ archive
>>83741159
He was so fucking good in RIP
>Something about Sombreros
>Just inherently hilarious
>>83738324
>>83749324
The card in the first panel was found in Wayne manor. Bruce concluded that Joker already knew.
>>83749679
But it was stuck to the boat he came in on.
Will we finally love snyder when there is a new author?
Anyone know the background of why Joker decided to cut out his face?
People keep talking about the BatGod, but I find the JokerGod far, FAR more annoying.
>>83735379
A lot of it comes down to
>not Muh joker
Batman has been portrayed in many ways over the years. Something that shines through in his best depictions are his intellect, his resourcefulness, and his confidence.
Snyder's Bruce has none of those qualities.
This sequence from DotF is textbook SnyderBruce- He's angry, petulant, and stubbornly argues against the basic logic that the Senpai suggests. Like, Dick and Tim are all "Holy shit, everything that you're saying suggests that Joker somehow got in the cave" and Bruce's response is, over and over again, "No, you guys JUST DON'T GET IT."
Worse yet is when the text backs up Bruce's argument. It's insulting as a reader to be presented with a seemingly direct set of circumstances, only for the truth to be revealed as something that makes no fucking sense whatsoever.
>>83750144
No. There is nothing memorable here. Just how many times have you seen pages or panels posted of this run ? In postive light?
Now compare it to Morrison's run. Or even Batman abd Robin -- both of them.
>>83750201
Joker didn't do it, Dollmaker did.
>>83750144
Maybe if the new author wasn't King
>>83749679
>>83750095
>>83750687
>Bruce concluded that Joker already knew.
So Bruce finds a card in the cave and decides that the Joker knows who he is. Being proactive, he goes to Arkham and literally is like, "Hey, it's me, Bruce Wayne, I'm Batman."
But Joker doesn't seem to care. Batman concludes that there's then NO WAY that Joker could comprehend his true identity.
THEN, Joker attacks the Batfam, claiming that he knows their true identities.
But it's chill- Bruce knows that the Joker doesn't know. Remember the whole Arkham thing? Joker. does. not. know. the. true. identities. of. the. Batfam.
AND THEN
>Joker breaks into Wayne Manor
>Joker kidnaps and tortures Alfred
>Joker kidnaps and tortures Babs' mom
>Joker tortures Dick with references to Haly's circus
>Joker tracks down and captures the Batfam one-by-one.
Given the specificity with which Joker acted, how is Bruce's assertion that the Joker doesn't know correct?
Snyder's Batman would've been good if he went for some original ideas instead of aping Morrison. He could've written a good horror/supernatural take on Batman, but instead we got some overwritten Gotham traditions and Batman/Joker homolust. How hard was it to write a slasher Joker?
>>83735379
Worst of all, Snyder's Batman kills twice: Dr. Death and the Joker.
All the "muh no killing" and he kills twice.
