>I guarantee you the Avengers would never have you
Sure they won't Steve, sure they won't
>>82608736
I wonder what Magneto and Wanda thought when looking back at this moment during the time they thought they were father and daughter
>>82609450
That word balloon placement makes it look like Scarlet Witch's pussy is speaking
Why do I find this to be hot?
>>82608736
>>82608736
>>82608736
>>82609985
At least post the whole thing.
>>82608736
back then, marvel writers had some integrity
>>82609975
>all of this shit ended up happening in 616
Probably the point of this image but still...
>>82608736
Bet you're regreting that now, ain't ya Jane?
>>82609954
>Comics were a mistake.
>>82610042
which cartoon was that anyway? There's been quite a lot of them
>>82610061
Sort of, they used to keep their cross over clusterfucks more contained. I miss the days when x-men were x-men and not every hero was a rotating avenger.
>>82610635
The one with A WOODEN GUN
>>82610635
Judging by how cartoon!Ben's drawn, it looks like the 90's one, where Johnny sang that stupid song.
>>82610915
no, it was this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XggH5-vLlUQ
>>82610061
>>82610801
I think that it's more that the editors were former writers who had to work their way up the chain so they knew that their job was to be an overseer to make sure the writers stayed in line, not to be a wannabe creator that orders the most forced "profitable" story like a McDonalds hamburger.
A guy like Roy Thomas or even Jim Shooter would never say, "BOYS WOLVERINE IS TESTING THROUGH THE ROOF AND THE AVENGERS ARE OUR MOST PROFITABLE TEAM SO BASIC LOGIC DICTATES IF WE ADD WOLVERINE TO THE AVENGERS OUR SALES WILL DOUBLE ACROSS THE BOARD! GREAT! GET RIGHT ON THAT! THANKS YOU'RE DOING GREAT WORK!"
>>82611020
The growth of indies also hurt since that meant editors had less power to control lazy writers/artists that didn't put work in on time or put in work that needed to be re-worked
>>82608736
Look at the name. A secret origin?
How about things that are funny because of a lack of hindsight? Like in your quest to be more diverse you turn a monkey into black girl?
>>82608736
If by funny you mean ominous than sure.
There's a lot of weird ominous foresight stuff in comics. Enough to publish an entire coffee table book
![[HMMS EXTERNALLY].gif](https://i.imgur.com/AMbDAkc.gif "[HMMS EXTERNALLY].gif")
>>82609975
Holy shit. I want a storytime of some of these just to see how accurate these are.
>>82609975
>House of Ideas
Self proclaimed nowadays
>>82617355
This.
Who has them?
>>82611010
That is such an awful opening.
>>82609450
don't tell me they've retconned THAT
>>82610977
which, it's important to point out, was a fucking goof riot in the first season, but DRASTICALLY improved for its second season. Ditto iron man
>>82619803
Got some bad news, Anon...
>>82610007
I see this posted a lot. What happened?
>>82611020
Pretty much. Back then everything had a sense of control and continuity because guys like Shooter knew how to tell a story, and knew how to keep writers from bullshitting and contaminating the product.
>>82609841
>"not an imaginary fight scene"
>"or a cop out"
kek
>>82609975
HOUSE OF IDEAS
I know that it's literally the point, but it makes me smile everytime
>>82611629
kek
>>82619803
Friendly reminder it was a retcon in the first place.
>>82620190
That label might as well have been World's Finest's official logo.
>>82620032
I think I saw, in another thread, something more recent where Superman says that he doesn't have a specific code against killing, but Batman does.
>>82617355
I read the elektra one, matt and her set off to a life in an island and he gives up being daredevil ,also frank miller did it
>>82609450
>>82619803
>>82619966
>>82620523
Okay now let me get this straight. First Magneto wasn't their dad, he was just the guy who saved them from an angry mob. Then he was their dad. Then he wasn't, Polaris was his daughter, and their real father was some interdimensional demon. And then he wasn't Polaris' father. And then he was their father, again. And then Polaris actually was his daughter.
Do I have it right?
>>82609975
>What If? Hulk Ross has the mustache
FUCK YOU LOEB
>>82608736
People sure did call each other "Mister" a lot back in the day. Or maybe that was just Claremont.
Also, was blast/ed a legitimate curse at some point or is it just an inoffensive expletive for comics in the Silver/Bronze Age?
>>82620674
Basically the Watcher shows up at Elektra's funeral just to tell Matt how happy he would have been if Elektra lived, and then he tells him that she was so evil that she would have died miserably anyway and he was destined to be forever alone. Which for a vow of non-interference is pretty dickish.
>>82610915
The wooden gun one had replaced Human Torch with Herbie the Robot because reasons.
>>82620720
Blast was a thing you'd say in front of your kids if you wanted to swear. "Damn and Blast!" was the R-rated version.
Specifically the Thor part
>>82609975
What the hell was Inferno anyways?
It popped up in a really weird issue during my Amazing Spider-Man read through.
>>82611010
oh man
>>82620878
>Super-Ego the Living Multiverse
>>82620719
Red Hulk is a great design without the stache and I highly doubt you were ever a fan of the Ross character
Ya know,
>>82609712
>lettered by Costanza
I didn't even know Costanza did work for Marvel.
>>82620878
>7,000,000 terabytes of power
Triggers me every fucking time
Ollie looks like so much more of a dick when you remember that Hal's Jewish.
>>82609841
Ssso is the joke that it was a copout after all?
>>82609954
This reminds me of the old saying "The only people in the comics who stay dead are Uncle Ben, Jason Todd and Bucky".
>>82620878
I wouldn't mind a title that has different characters casually shooting the shit. Just one book, of the Fantastic Four having a casual day, Spider-Man and Daredevil having a lunch, the Avengers Mansion living room, AIM's breakroom, etc. Just a fun little comedy book.
>>82609956
Tbh I prefer if people just do the Magic Reboot Trick. I.e - person is white. Oh no,a reboot event! Reality is slightly changed! And the person is suddenly black - in fact, in this canon this person was always black!
At least it avoids a lot of convoluted bullshit.
>>82609954
Was O'Neil responsible for the resurrection or something?
>>82610067
That's EXACTLY the point of the image. They ran out of ideas for new changes to status quo, so they reused succesful What-Ifs.
For the record, DC did that occasionally too - I mean, Damian Wayne started off in an Elseworlds, and concept of Flashpoint to some degree retreads JLA: The Nail.
>>82609956
The only thing that really gets me, even though most is bullshit, is that they are all like "Oh, you must totally be the unquestioned leader of shield. You know, Nepotism and all that bullshit"
>>82621706
That might've been intentional. At current point in time it's hard to tell difference in antisemitism between leftists and neonazis.
Neonazis oppose Israel because they're neonazis, and leftists oppose Israel because of Palestine (and for some reason in like 60% of cases don't understand that you can oppose politics of a country without breaking windows in your local synagogue)
>>82617355
I read most of them. They are nothing like in 616.
They actually make sense.
For example, in the "Spider-man clone had lived" one, they made clear that this clone only has its memory up to the point in which the Jackal took his sample to clone him, which was way earlier and made clear who was the clone.
I didn't read much of the clone saga, but I doubt that was touched on the actual 616 continuity.
Furthermore, the ending was great with both spideys teaming up to make their double life easier and defeat villains they couldn't fight alone.
Honestly a great read, really.
This is a daydream from the 80's
>>82610977
Stop hating on this fresh beat, /co/.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=38VBv0ZenZU
>>82622583
>Spider-Felicity
>>82622375
>Furthermore, the ending was great with both spideys teaming up to make their double life easier and defeat villains they couldn't fight alone
Fuck I want this for 616 peter. Have these two acting like bros, each taking different jobs to help each other financially, each of them taking time off sometimes and have the other be Spiderman. Of course it won't happen though, because throwing Parker any kind of bone would be heresy unless the bone was filled with anthrax.
>>82620890
Once upon a time the X-men were living on an island in the bermuda triangle while the mansion was being repaired after being leveled by evil giant insects from space led by a bird lady.The little sister of Colossus wandered into a Lovecraftian temple and fell into a hell-like dimension. Eventually she escaped but she became 7 years older and learned all kinds of black magic while becoming absolute ruler of the place.
Many years later, the demons under her control try to overthrow her. They do this by forcing her to give into her evil side. Simultaneously the demons convince Cyclops' estranged wife to become their leader and sacrifice baby-Cable to open a giant portal to the hell-like dimension.
It turns out that Cyclops' estranged wife is actually a clone of Jean Grey made by a guy called Mister Sinister. His original backstory was that he was a kid that lived at the same orphanage as Cyclops but it was later decided to make him a 19th century biologists given superpowers by Apocalypse.
Anyway, eventually Colossus' little sister kills herself and leaves behind an alternate universe version of herself that never went to hell. The rest of the X-men kill Cyclops' evil wife and then beat up Mister Sinister.
The mansion ends up destroyed and the X-men go back to living in Australia.
>>82620719
>Okay now let me get this straight.
Sounds about right.
...I begin to believe that all comics should have a predetermined end in mind when they're started.
>>82621838
We aren't allowed to have nice things.
>>82622256
It's mostly because Muslims don't like Jews by and large and the Modern Left adores Muslims.
>>82612018
Barney?
>>82609712
do you think it sounds muffled when she's fucking?
>>82609975
>what if spidey had never married MJ?
JUST
>>82622583
This would be much better if it was canon. if you absolutely need to have all the fucking heroes know each other and be all incestous and shit at least have it be friendly
>>82610042
POTTERY
O
T
T
E
R
Y
>>82609841
I didn't know that Snyder was a mummy with a glowing purple ball for a head.
>>82623865
you left out how one of the demons is an homage to Cerebus.
>>82620032
Jimmy and Robin are both dead in Batman vs. Superman
>>82608736
This was specifically brought up in a Deadpool issue which specifically foreshadowed Deadpool's own admission to the Avengers
>>82622256
It would help if the Anti-Defamation League didn't equate criticism of Israel with antisemitism at every fucking turn.
>>82622172
>"Oh, you must totally be the unquestioned leader of shield. You know, Nepotism and all that bullshit"
So the only thing that gets you is the one thing that never actually happened and was just made up by the person who made that macro to trigger people? Because he was never made Director of SHIELD and still to this day isn't Director of SHIELD. He's just a random SHIELD Agent.
>>82609975
This needs expanded on since it's actually kinda out-dated at this point. At the very least, it needs the "what if Jane Foster became Thor" What If.
>>82627032
Wasn't Jimmy a chick? I was hoping she'd bang Superman at some point.
>>82627240
They introduced Jenny Olsen in MoS, then introduce Jimmy Olsen as a CIA agent in BvS before killing him. You'd only know either of them was an Olsen from interviews as neither's full name is ever mentioned
>>82621838
That sounds like every Bendis book ever.
>>82611020
>Blaming the editors for that
I talked to Howard Mackie at a con a few months back and he more or less said everything went to shit once control moved from creative to sales. Pretty much every shitty decision from the late '80s through the '90s was from sales coming through and making demands from creative.
Things might have changed after he left Marvel, but from what I've heard from him and DeFalco and DeMatteis and some of the other writers of that era, it was the sales department that was making demands rather than editors trying to speculate what sold well.
>>82620878
>Marvel events
>heroes fight villains
>>82621239
>Red Hulk is a great design without the stache
>The Hulk! But a DIFFERENT COLOR FROM A STOP LIGHT!
Come on, you aren't even trying. Red Hulk only doesn't have a mustache because Loeb wanted to string people along with a dumb identity mystery for like a year.
>>82627316
>from what I've heard from him and DeFalco and DeMatteis and some of the other writers of that era, it was the sales department that was making demands rather than editors trying to speculate what sold well.
As the editor in chief through a solid chunk of that time, that state of affairs must have been really disheartening to DeFalco.
>>82621790
Well they got one right.
The saying should be "The only people who stay dead in comics are the ones who died to inspire the hero."
>>82627577
Bucky managed to stay dead for FORTY YEARS.
That's a solid go of things as worm food.
>>82620295
Tchalla face looks so funny
>>82609849
wat
>>82627661
The 'naut did 9/11 before 9/11.
I think Magneto or him then later shows up during 9/11 to mourn.
>>82609975
Isn't there also a "What if Jane Foster was Thor" one?
>>82627572
If you listen to him give interviews, he clearly doesn't really like talking about it.
>>82627820
Yes. It's actually reprinted in the second Jane Foster Thor trade.
>>82608736
Don't have a pic, but Rage getting kicked out of the Avengers for being a minor now that the Avengers have 3 teenagers on their roster.
If I were Rage, I'd be even more pissed than usual.
>>82611020
That actually sounds exactly like something Jim Shooter would say.
>>82628034
Rage deserves to get a swing at Sam for stealing his spot on the New Warriors.
>>82623249
To be honest, that's kinda what he's doing with the black guy (I forgot his name, sorry) at the moment? He stands in for him in public and they go on missions together.
>>82623865
Sweet jeez, this sounds insane.
>>82628159
Prowler? I'd argue he's one of the few redeemable parts of the book actually, he's a god-tier straight man.
>>82627577
Jason Todd confirmed uninspiring
>>82620878
>Axis
>>82610801
I read that back then if a writer wanted to have a team up or a character from another comic guest star in the comic they were writing that they had to go through hoops and get their editor, the other comic's editor and writer and the EiC on the same page and make sure when the crossover took place as to not make things confusing for the reader.
>>82608736
>Chris Evans bumps into Hugh Jackman
>I just wanted to let you know, I guarantee the Avengers would never have you
It's funny because Peter pretty much tells Norman how pure Gwen is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ko_M6E1A5SQ
>>82629384
What the fuck is Peter saying? "Go ahead and kill everyone, it'll onlny strengthen my resolve", no it won't, it'll lead to you becoming even more mo and depressed.
How is leaving Osborn alive and not in prison a punishment? This is fucking stupid, Dark Reign happened.
>>82629562
>more emo and depressed
>>82609975
So how many of those what ifs ended up happening in a cannon story
>>82627140
What issue ?
>>82611629
Did he ever get the report card back
>>82612415
Heh
>>82627184
Tis a problem yes
>>82630147
>>82611629
Like it matters. The father would merely need to call the school to find out what the grades are.
>>82627957
Glad they have some self awareness then
>>82629562
This was written from someone who saw Spider Man as an actual man, not an emotionally stunted boy like they made him with "One More Day".
>>82609829
Um... who?
Oh, wait, you mean mr."I'm bored, I guess I'll kill about ten million people"?
>>82611629
I can actually see the Joker doing this.
>>82610120
Talk about characters getting shafted. Poor Marcy.
>>82621026
They forgot that was already a thing.
>>82628034
Rage needs to team up with Zubaz just to kick the Avenger's ass.
>>82621706
>Jordan
..Sheeeit. Leepest dore.
>>82624065
Man, Alan Moore figured that shit out in the seventies.
>>82626273
>S'ym
Oh goddamn it. I lived half my life not realizing that.
>>82627612
SIXTY years, actually.
>>82628169
X-books are famous for this sort of shit. They practically defined the notion of 'comics convolution' back in the Eighties and Nineties.
And now, Marvel wants to kill them all.
>>82630100
All of them, if you are not too picky in some cases - in others, they just happened outright.
>>82630446
No. Forty. Bucky's death was written in the 60s. He survived through 40s and 50s Cap and Bucky were supposed to be original ones before retcon.
>>82630501
...Yes... but... so, we're both right.
No, you're right. He wasn't considered dead until about 1963.
In fact, when was that officially stated? Was it in 'Avengers' #5?
Jason is Robin in this panel, btw.
>>82630138
I'm pretty sure it was either in The Good, The Bad and the Ugly or, perhaps more likely, Death of Wolverine: Deadpool and Captain America
>>82630615
>Death of Wolverine: Deadpool and Captain America
Yup, that's the one
>>82610042
>>82610635
>>82610977
Its making fun of the awful first season of the 90s cartoon but season 2 actually had a budget and is really great.
>>82619915
>>82630705
I still have a certain fondness for those cartoons, goofy first seasons and all, just for introducing me to those characters.
>>82630547
>Was it in 'Avengers' #5?
Avengers v1 #5. We have to be specific, after all.
>>82630750
>>82630547
Sorry to nitpick, but it was actually issue 4
>>82631099
Fair enough. I should remember - it was one of the first Avengers stories I ever read.
>>82629384
>Gwen was 'magnetized' by Norman and had his kids
>>82627302
Yeah, except you keep him off of it.
Kevin Smith might be well suited for it though.
>>82630501
Why were the 50's comics retconned? I think I've heard something about them being racist or something, but I dunno.
Maybe it was just Jack being annoyed someone else was dictating his old character.
>>82608736
>>82631684
That's the guy who did those funny little parody comics for Marvel, right?
What was his name?
>>82608736
Wasn't Cap one of the people that vouched for him to be in the Avengers?
>>82631722
Chris Giarrusso.
>>82631736
Nope, Tony needed to convince Steve to let Wolverine join under the incredibly dubious logic that "we need a killer".
Never mind that Black Widow and other Avengers are more than willing to kill if need be and aren't as bloodthirsty and unreliable as Wolverine.
>>82609841
Was there ever "World's Finest" where Superrman and Batman aren't trying to do something horrible?
>>82620451
>eyepatch switched eyes in the last panel
>>82627316
All you need to do is just look at what happened with Spider-man during that time. The writers (I think DeFalco was a part of that) just wanted a quick and easy transition from Spidey to Scarlet Spider (whether or not that was a good idea is up to you). But sales saw how great the clone saga was going and instead of finishing it nice and easy like it should it kept going for nearly 3 years with more and more demand from sales to keep things going. The comic boom of the 80's and 90's is what killed everything because it wasn't really just keep things nice and easy and have some nice runs and some bad runs. Then until even now it's all about doing everything big and flashy hoping to draw in as many people as possible no matter how bad it might get with the world.
>>82632198
(You)
>>82620878
What's this? It's really self aware.
>>82631676
They forgot about it. Also, they were really bad. Even by 50s' standarts.
>>82632222
It was just an ad thing for Marvel to sarcastically talk about Marvel NOW. It's self-aware, but also sort of more subtle mockery on the readership since they make fun of all these sort of things and do stupider stuff boldfaced down the road.
>>82632222
Marvel tends to be pretty self-aware about this kind of stuff, but since it keeps working, they keep doing it.
>>82630592
Well to be fair wasnt he gonna kill the Joker after Jason at the UN but Superman talked him out of it?
>>82632425
He was also going to kill the Joker after he thought he had killed Tommy Elliot, only to be stopped by Gordon.
>>82631676
They weren't great stories. They tried to rebrand Cap as a Commie spy smasher and it never really took. Kirby and Simon themselves took a crack at the same concept with the Fighting American, and only a few issues in they just decided to make it a full on comedy, with bad guys like Hotsky Trotsky, Poison Ivan and Rhode Island Red. Something about the Cold War didn't make for super-villains as compelling as the Nazis.
>>82632452
>Something about the Cold War didn't make for super-villains as compelling as the Nazis.
And that is why Iron Man's rogue gallery from the Silver Age sucks. And since nobody bothered giving him good villains after that, he's stuck with one of the worst rogue galleries ever.
>>82632198
>Reflections are scary devil magic and are not to be trusted
>>82632476
>. And since nobody bothered giving him good villains after that,
Hey, they tried to replace all his "godless commie" enemies with "eviler corporate rival" enemies back in the 80s/90s/00s.
It still kinda sucked because protecting your own stuff from thieves isn't as heroic as just about any other thing a super hero could do.
>>82630316
I love stories like this. Where Peter is human. That's the entire point of his character when you think about it, especially in things like the Ultimate Universe. He is the guy with normal issues or at least used to be.
I mean one of my favorite stories is when Venom was first introduced or at least directly. Peter and MJ move into their new house and have their friends and family (Mostly MJ's) help them out. He doesn't have his Avenger or super smart totally needed buddies help him out. He has people who for the most part are normal help him.
Pete's suppose to be the everyday man we can all relate to in some level and form and the guy we hoped we'd be if we got powers. A person who did the right thing for the most part.
>>82631592
>In the end. Noman had the last laugh. And he didn't even care about that bitch. He even dropped her from a bridge, zero fucks given.
This is all because of ONE thing you did Peter. You should have listened to TOAA when you had the chance. GOD told you that things where going to get really fucking bad if you made that deal with Mephisto.
Well, it did. Your life is shit now. The devil won your soul and even your writers believe that what you did was good (just ask Joe Quesada). You blew it Peter, you are not the hero anymore just the clown and everyone is laughing.
>>82627496
Hey, remember Loose Cannon? DC's Red Hulk that turned blue, then white, the angrier he got?
>>82632801
The whole "Make Peter into a childish crybaby" only really came about around the 90's 60's-80's he was growing up. High school, college, getting married the whole shebang. It was when after the marriage and them trying to write him out but couldn't when everything went to shit. Since everyone over at Marvel hated the marriage and wanted Peter to just be a fun loving guy. The writers felt too many things where holding him down and felt by that time they couldn't break it up with MJ so they just tried to fuck with more and more of his life hoping something will happen. Which is why 90's Spidey might be one of the worse superhero era for a big name hero personally.
>>82630486
and that's not including how many things from Earth-X happened in some form or another, such as Black Bolt unleashing a terrigen cloud on the world, a red skull with mind control, Franklin Richards being able to command the power of Galactus, Uatu being replaced as The Watcher, Loki realizing Asgardians are only the way they are because of stories, and a few others
>>82631676
>>82632452
Commie Smasher Cap was eventually retconned back into continuity, albeit with the reveal that the '50s Cap and Bucky were fakes (and that '50s Cap was driven insane by the attempted recreation of the Super Soldier Serum).
>>82620719
Magneto's not their dad, high evolutionary snatched SW and Quicksilver as babbys and experimented on them, then returned them.
Scarlet Witch finds this out when she curses her family when she turns evil in AXIS, but finds out her curse only affects Quicksilver and not Magneto.
>>82632902
Eh, reading through them, the nineties were pretty awful for nearly every character. I mean, Iron Man, one of the founding Avengers and a guy who throughout most of his publication history was written as a moral, if emotionally damaged man suddenly turned out to be a traitor and was replaced by a teenage version of himself.
Christ, now that I think abut it, the nineties were probably the start of the degradation of a lot of characters in the Marvel Universe. Then again the rise of political correctness and Marvel's recent success has definitely impacted how they approach their comics now.
>>82627577
>they got one right
there's an Uncle Ben clone coming at the forefront of DEAD NO MORE
along with, apparently, like a dozen Gwen clones
>>82632198
HOW DOES I SHOT PICTURE
>>82633037
God... There is a fucking story here for the Magneto Family. But goddamn it'll just keep piling more shit on Wanda.
Seriously, who the fuck thought this was a good idea? I mean, the entire point of a lot of Quicksilver and Wanda's arcs before Bendis was that they were not their father's children. That they were good people and their genes did not dictate who they were. Suddenly retconing the relationship between the three makes all those stories so worthless and makes the Maximoffs smell of even more shit.
>>82632425
actually Superman never talked him out of it. Batman kept trying to kill Joker until the helicopter Joker was trying to get away in crashed in a river, and only gave up when even Superman couldn't find the body because he had to get back to Gotham
>>82633148
I disagree. The fact that after Bendis the whole "she's Magneto's daughter so of course she's crazy" was very famaging to her character and kept getting brought up.
Removing it is actually beneficial for Wanda's character after all the character assassination she received.
>>82632902
>and wanted Peter to just be a fun loving guy.
HEY
HEY WRITERS
YOU KNOW WHO WAS FUN?
YOU KNOW WHO 'WAS' ALL ABOUT GETTING PETER TO HAVE MORE FUN?
BLACK CAT
>>82633223
Nah, Black Cat is all about being the new Kingpin and putting bounties on the heads of teenagers just because they dress up like Spider-Man.
>>82633259
JUST
>>82633209
How does the retcon make her character assassination suffer? It makes it stronger then ever before.
Instead of the Decimation, it wasn't an angry and unstable mutant lashing out at her father and his dreams. It was a mentally unstable woman with powers just lashing out at someone who they thought was their father. The first one at the very least somewhat justifies her actions. The second reason just makes her seem like a bigger cunt then ever before and totally destroys all the stories that she had because she was a mutant.
>>82633345
I don't understand. How does someone hating someone who she THINKS is her father any different from hating someone who IS her father?
In both scenarios, her motivation is exactly identical.
>>82633345
>It was a mentally unstable woman with powers just lashing out at someone who they thought was their father
No, it wasn't a mentally unstable woman at all. It was retconed into her being posessed, which is for the best.
Her obsession with her father in House of M was insulting, since she had never given a shit about him before that.
>>82633223
Isn't this the same story that had Blackcat reveal the reason she got into the gig was that she was raped or am I thinking of something else?
>>82633072
There's a lot of reasons why everything really went to shit in the late 80's and most of the 90's. Frank Miller's Dark Knight and Watchman got Sales to figure really dark and edgy stories would sell and so they focus on that over and over again. Comic becoming a bigger known thing with the Batman movie in 89 and how both DC and Marvel both did their biggest crossover around the same time (Crisis and Secret Wars). Speculator boom with people buying issue #1 for thousands or over a million for Action Comic #1 happened so once again Sales told writers to make new #1 of existing titles which meant they had to somehow do something to reset the book in some weird way. Like with your Iron Man and with Spider-Man changing to Scarlet Spider. There is a good reason people call it the Dark Age of comics.
What is really sad is that Bronze Age was actually really fucking good. And you actually could see a nice trend of slowly being more mature and deep in just the normal writing. And Sales happened and instead of going a really nice and steady they just decided to just do what all bad ideas do and that flash and burn. Just make tons of money now and fuck the future. 90's is normally the hardest to really get back into. There's a lot of great DC stuff but fuck me Marvel just went to shit so fucking fast at that time.
>>82633472
I willfully ignore those parts but yes.
>>82609975
>Jessica Jones as SHIELD
Wew
>>82633448
Okay...
Let me get this straight. Wanda was possessed from let's say Bendis to Child's Crusade by Doom. Nearly wipes out a race, kills Avengers and so on. Now that was all part of Doom's keikaku or whatever.
So, why is she still acting like the biggest cunt and there were constant references in UA to her being mentally unstable and unfit for the team.
So is she still unstable? Is she still possessed? What the fuck is going on with Wanda now?
>>82633589
>What the fuck is going on with Wanda now?
she's mostly dealing with magic stuff. Gave Cthon the bird (but I don't think he cares now that Carnage is channeling his power), rekindled her pssuedo-maternal relationship with Wiccan, at some point in the near future she shows up at Vision's court hearing
>>82617355
I have the Jessica Jones and general Ross ones, I guess I can scan them if anyones interested - They're not terribly exciting.
>>82632992
Then Bucky grew up and became the Nomad and it was pretty cool, until brubaker killed him in the most boring story because fuck comics I guess.
>>82633727
Yo, that sounds grand. Do that. Do it.
>>82620295
Oh if only they had such integrity now.
>>82633727
Is the JJ one where she becomes the Avengers liason and is somehow the only person around to realize that something is wrong with Wanda and gets her help preventing all of Bendis' character assassination?
>>82633836
Yeah that's precisely it.
>>82631610
Kevin Smith isn't suited for anything related to a comic book.
>>82633782
O-okay, looking for the cable for my scanner now.
>>82621838
A+X has a lot of that
>>82633909
Maybe ask around first, there are probably scans floating on the net already.
>>82633072
>suddenly turned out to be a traitor
As though going full Armor Wars on Stingray wasn't traitor enough.
>>82633909
There's multiple torrents that have all of them. I've got them on my external.
>>82632902
It's weird looking back over the Spider-man comics I read just how hard they were trying to break Peter and MJ up. Remember when they killed her off only for it to have been the Chameleon who kidnapped her?
Also what's with their obsession on making Peter a "fun loving guy". He's a nice guy and all but he's no swinging bachelor. He's always been a nerdy down-to-earth sort of guy.
>>82633259
What are the writers thinking with that? What's their game plan? Why do this to Black Cat it's not like Peter is lacking in the rogues gallery department.
>>82634144
I don't even know where they got the fun loving guy either. Been actually rereading all of the Spidey comics and right now about to reach the death of Gwen and while he does hang out with friends and party at times he never really do anything big. And even with Spidey it was all about him having a hard time balancing everything around him. Peter funny enough isn't actually awkward like how everyone likes to paint him as. He's pretty open and doesn't really try to not be with people. Just Spidey gets in his way of being social and not Peter is scared of people.
It's annoying seeing what they are doing to Peter since they feel they know the character but it feels like they never read a god damn comic of him and just assume based on hearsay on the character.
Don't forget MJ was meant to have a kid (which became Spider-Girl which was awesome) but that couldn't happen either because fuck you.
>>82634144
there's conflicting rumors over if it was another aspect of Slott trying to make as many changes to the spidey status quo as possible for the sake of leaving his mark, or if it was Bendis pressuring Slott to do so for the sake of giving Miles another classic Spidey character to fight and humiliate.
I'm tempted to believe the latter, since before Superior Slott wrote Big Time and Spider-Man & Human Torch, and while he wrote her as flakier than some writers, he seemed to enjoy her
>>82634244
>Aunt May gets heart touching death issue
>is brought back 4 years later to have yet still more "is dying" plots.
>completely ditch the concept of Spectacular Spider-Dad for it
>while simultaneously killing off Ben Reilly instead of setting him up as the Amazing Single-Man for sexy bachelor adventures.
>Also, Norman Osborn is alive again, even though the best thing he ever did was die and cause a plague of substitute Goblins
Truly, the worst part of the Clone Saga was the ending.
>>82620878
>Evilengers
>This was a couple of months before AXIS and Hickman's Evilengers!
Ayy...
>>82634384
>>82609954
God, how many individual plots have been titled "A death in the Family"?
>>82634446
But was Stiltman the hero the city deserved?
When will Stiltman's Secret Defenders finally be the series it has to be?
>>82634462
0 of them that have stuck.
>>82634384
It really is amazing that out of everything bad the ending is really the worse. It was a fitting end for Norman. And while I really hate the idea of them just trying to write Spidey off to Ben I can really see it working if the writers were giving the space to do what needed to be done.
Hell what's great about Aunt May in that part was Aunt May coming clean how she knew Peter was Spidey for a long ass fucking time. And was proud of him for doing what was write. Hell I don't know which Aunt May's death was worse that or OMD where she literally told Peter she was happy to finally move on and die yet Peter was written to be childish and negate his marriage to have her alive again.
>>82634333
If Bendis is behind all this shit which lets face it, he probably is, then he really needs to leave Marvel. And it's not just about Black Cat. The simple fact is that as a writer Bendis is mediocre/average at best. Sure he has had a few peaks, but still that does not excuse him from making all this trash.
Simply put, Bendis leaving Marvel could signal the start of change in the industry. It could signal that the Big 2 are no longer accepting mediocrity and that writers either need to get better or GTFO.
And if Slott is behind all this shit, then I am going to laugh. The simple fact is that the moment he and Bendis leave, this entire monument of shit that they have constructed with the spider family will be retconned so fucking fast that you'll think that Zoom is some how involved.
>>82634462
I'm sure it doesn't come close to SINS OF THE FATHER.
>>82634570
I really hope they put Ewing on Spider-Man when they get rid of Slott. He's exactly the kind of continuity-porn addict that's perfect for finding precedence to gently retcon dumb shit while still telling a story
>>82634666
what do you think there's more of? SINS OF THE FATHER or ORIGINAL SIN?
>>82634689
>Slott
>Getting off Spider-man in this decade
You poor deluded fool! He's been on Spider-man for over 1/6 of it's entire running time.
>>82634570
>The simple fact is that as a writer Bendis is mediocre/average at best.
He is flatout shit.
His best work to the date was Ultimate Spider-man, and there is a difference between decompressing a story and having nothing happen in them, and the fucker dragged his stories to the point of retardation. Ultimate Miles closes one I don't know how long arc involving miles and hydra with a cheap venom blast match, defeating ult doom before SW. His X-men are right down cancer, nothing fucking happens in it and the dialogue is awful, forget character assassination, it was character manslaughter. His run is worse than Chuck Austin's rnu, the madman did it, he set a new low for comics.
The problem is that relationships trump talent, and there is no possible way to get rid of Bendis. I have run this scenario in my head many times, there is no possible way that Marvel will fire him, ever.
They would fire better talent first
They would pander to casuals with hero vs hero books or star wars if the sales ever drop
He is there, forever, like a cancer.
>>82634715
if he's still on it by 2018 I'm killing him myself and making it look like an accident
>>82634749
his Daredevil was better than USM
>>82634749
Who does he have such a good relationship with that he can stay on full time like this? I mean as you pointed, Bendis X-Men and arguably his Avengers were all time lows of each title and when Chuck Austen did that, he got blacklisted.
>>82609975
>>82617355
>>82617603
>>82633727
>>82633782
>>82633909
>>82633909
>>82633962
>>82634077
What If V1 (01-05).rar
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>>82634880
What If v2 001-010.rar
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>>82634570
Honestly I believe everything that happened to Spidey can just be traced to Quesada. JMS was trying to make things actually better for Spidey after about a decade of shit. But Quesada was always looming over him pushing JMS to change things to fuck over Spidey even more. Like with Sin's Past.
>>82609849
Came here to post this.
>>82610042
He's even doing the Chris Evans laugh.
>>82632222
I think it might be "What NOW".
>>82634880
>>82634893
>>82609975
So anyone gonna storytime any of these?
>>82611629
DETECTIVE JOHN BLAKE
>>82627661
You said you'd never forget!
>>82634570
>Marvel is going to drop one of the handful of writers that genuinely sell cause theres no real proof he turned a bland character with a handful of fans into a bad guy
lol
>>82633538
>Black Cat
>Sin's Past
>Trouble
>Clone Saga
If OMD didn't fuck up Spidey so much his entire life is completely different we could forget it like we did with most other really bad story lines.
Has there ever been a top character that's been fucked with as much as Spidey?
>>82636079
Iron Man has to keep getting his brain rebooted every couple of years
Carol Danvers too, plus she had the whole 'gave birth to my own inter-dimensional rapist' thing, but many would argue she doesn't count as a top character
my gut says that if you line everything up Hulk, comes out worst though
>>82610042
Good times
>>82636152
Iron Man I get that. Hank Pym is one hell of a shitty ride too.
Danvers I say had one REALLY shitty story and Claremont somehow managed to use that to actually make her a better character. But that's more because Claremont is a godly writer and actually really like Danvers.
Hulk honestly never really was A list personally. He seem to just have minor bust here and there of popularity but never managed to really get high listing.
>>82636228
was Claremont the one who had her genocide the Brood?
>>82627496
As I thought you simply don't get it.
The colors for Hulk are green skin and ragged purple pants
The colors for Rulk are red skin and normal black pants
Hulk has normal eyes and fingernails
Rulk's eyes are pure yellow and has black fingernails
Hulk has a variety of hairstyles whereas Rulk only has the one. It's a flaw of Marvel that they have the same short hair when Hulk looked much better with longer hair covering up his forehead
I know the name is Red Hulk but it is NOT just a reskin with everything being the same
>>82636152
HUlk is the worst in this regard, because even his villains get that.
Remember when Abomination loved his wife and was a good husband before accident? Oh, wait. Now Bruce Jones says that he was a piece of shit and she hated him. But wait, the entirety of Jones' run is retconned. So, fuck if I know.
Same with Rick, sometimes.
Bruce himself is also stuck in the loop. You can't really write Savage Hulk for a long time. He is a great guest star, but in ongoing? No, it doesn't work. So they keep making him smart.
>>82636253
Was that when she became Binary? Man it's been about 10 years since I've read any of Clarmont's X-Men and honestly I never really read any X-Men after him.
>>82636314
Really, there was some great X-Books after. Like Remender's X-Force.
>>82636314
>Was that when she became Binary?
and was forever cemented in Brood mythology
>>82609975
>What if the X-Men died on their first mission?
when did this happen?
>>82636374
Deadly Genesis mini. Revealed that Xavier sent another team to save O5 before finding All-New, All-Different cast. They all died. Except for Scott's other brother.
>>82609975
I still like this one.
>>82620451
>Danny Ketch
>Nice normal ordinary boy
For now maybe
>>82636299
Ah yes I do remember when Bruce Jones retconned a retcon for the sake of his story and then PAD changed it back because of his hurt feelings
Savage Hulk can support an ongoing, it's just everyone is too lazy to do it. The story goes people thought it was getting played out by the 80s, but that's when Marvel started to decline, so it's probably just everyone being lazy fuckwits back then like they are now
>>82636505
Does Original Sin technically make this canon too?
>>82634847
>Bendis' Avengers
>all time low
Don't you mean all-time high?
>>82637004
Yes, also a GotG annual made this canon too wherein Fury made LMDs of himself and the howling commandos and send them off to fight a space war in a distant galaxy.
>>82628088
Youre a fucking idiot, jim shooter was a great editor and his top priorities were putting out books on time and keeping the universe consistent, he didnt let anybody do stupid bullshit.
>>82636413
And Darwin
>>82636046
>genuinely sell cause
they only sell because they are working on High Profile characters
just look at Sloths Silver Surfer. that book is selling like absolute shit
>>82637299
Jim Shooter both wrote a lot of stupid bullshit and pushed things that he thought would bring more sales that were stupid and made no sense. Like every other EiC.You can like Thomas or Shooter or, God save your soul, Harris, but all of them would do stupid shit to push sales. Fuck, Claremont had as much power as Bendis does today. And was openly a dick about that AND pissed off many writers.
Was Shooter a great editor? Yes, sure, no question. Was he businessman and a giant asshole? Definately.
>>82611020
I mean Bendis did make Avengers an actual A list franchise by adding Wolverine and Spidey...
>>82637543
Busiek made Avengers an actual A list franchise by writing well
