So, does he have an ability to generate and shoot webbing, or is it from a tool he made, and his powers are largely super strength, super agility, and super senses
>>82399151
>So, does he have an ability to generate and shoot webbing, or is it from a tool he made
yes
>>82399188
I guess it varies from writer to writer then.
how is making a fucking thread easier than googling that
>>82399228
He had organic webbing during The Other and Back in Black storylines, which were thrown to the shitter after One More Day.
It's all webshooters and shit nowadays.
>>82399228
Nope. Always webshooters, with the exceptions of like one storyline where some shit happens to him, and also the Raimi films.
>>82399228
No it doesn't, there was ONE time when he had organic webbing because of shamanic shenanigans, and the symbiote suit generates its own webbing, but aside from that he's always used web shooters.
>>82399283
and ultimate. and whenever he uses the symbiote.
so, you know. not always webshooters.
>>82399293
>>82399283
>>82399278
T.Hanks!
>>82399330
He uses web shooters in ultimate, dumbass.
I like the idea of him having organic webs but he uses the shooters to control them
>mfw web condoms
>>82399293
that ONE time was a decently long run, though. it's not like it was just 2 issues.
>>82399394
Out of 53 years, it hardly registers as more than a speedbump.
>>82399383
Huh, this could work well. What's normally attributed to Peter using a different web formula can just be him adjusting the nozzle.
Honestly, it just seems dumb for him to be bitten by a radioactive spider, for webslinging to be such an integral part to his character, and yet the webs aren't organic AT ALL.
>>82399383
This would be the perfect compromise, IMO, and probably the best way to explain it.
>>82399441
53 years of status quo, any divergence is noteworthy
>>82399383
Organic web is gross tho. First that it would make no sense at all for the web to come out of his wrists, and then, he'd be basically jizzing all over his enemies.
It's really gross. It works in the Raimi films because Sam is a weird guy and loves doing gross body horror stuff, but in a comic book angle it's just weird.
>>82399504
also the fact that if the webs are just a gadget, literally anyone could make them which is kinda silly
Are the shooters just ultracompact and use magick to hold waaay more webbing than they possibly could?
>>82399605
the webbing expands on release, like silly string
>>82399639
Just to an extreme degree, I suppose
>>82399151
It's a tool in which he made. When he got bit by the spider he also gained knowledge of how to make spider webs.
>>82399556
What status quo tho? Spider-Man is the least static A-lister.
>>82399597
>kinda silly
Right, but spinning web through your wrists is completely serious and realistic.
>>82399721
>silly
>means unrealistic
nigga please. no, it's silly because if it's just a gadget, any shmuck with access to a high school chemistry lab and a hardware store could make a knockoff webshooter, and that's silly because it makes Spidey's most iconic power nothing more than a "how to" youtube video away from being a common household item.
The same reason Wolverine's claws aren't part of his gloves; because then anyone could put on the gloves and be wolverine.
>>82399597
Not anyone, Spiderman has the specific blueprint on how to make the webbing he makes.
The web shooters add for the best plot device for spiderman. If he runs out, then he's instantly handicapped and has to rely on wit and clever thinking.
>>82399597
>Anyone can make them
>No body knows fucking how
I thought it was ridiculous when I got into comics and found out he usually doesn't naturally produce webbing.
>Gets spider powers.
>super strength, enhanced reflexes, some kind of very limited precog shit,
>doesn't make web
It's all the other powers that should be manufactured, not the webbing.
>>82399895
First of all, only Peter knows exactly how to make the web fluid, and only he has the shooters that turn fluid into web.
Secondly, if you think the web shooters and the claws are what make Spider-Man and Wolverine be who they are, not only do you have a very childish view on fictional characters, but you probably haven't read many spider-man stories.
There's a reason long time readers defend the web shooters: they make for good stories.
>>82399982
>It's all the other powers that should be manufactured, not the webbing.
Where the fuck would he store all that web in his body?
>>82399931
>>82399965
How does that black kid do it then
>>82399982
YEAH, IT'S ALL THE OTHER SHIT THAT IS LITERALLY THE REASON HE DOESN'T DIE EVERY SINGLE TIME HE GOES UP AGAINST SUPER FREAKS, NOT THE ONE THING HE COULD DO WITHOUT IN 99% OF HIS FIGHTS
>>82400078
Because he also got bitten or some shit to get Spidey's powers.
It's the spider that grants the user the ability to know how a spider's body works.
>>82400078
He uses peter's, you retard.
You guys literally have no idea what you're talking about, incredible.
>>82400193
I was asking because I literally have not read anything related to Miles
>>82399982
The radiation is what gave him powers. He only chose the spider motif because he was inspired by the spider that bit him. He made the costume and webshooters to natch his stage persona of Spider-Man.
His powers, until the JMS bullshit, had fuck-all to do with spiders.
>>82400123
Super scientist in marvel can literally build portals to other dimensions, why can't they build web shooters?
>>82400055
>First of all, only Peter knows exactly how to make the web fluid, and only he has the shooters that turn fluid into web.
okay, sure. but he invented them as a poor kid in highschool. which means that any other kid in highschool COULD, and that makes them less special and unique and raises the question why there haven't been any cheap knock-offs like Iron Man has with his suits all the time.
>Secondly, if you think the web shooters and the claws are what make Spider-Man and Wolverine be who they are, not only do you have a very childish view on fictional characters, but you probably haven't read many spider-man stories.
or maybe you should brush up on your comic history.
>It was originally intended for Wolverine's adamantium claws to be part of his gloves rather than part of his body. During his first full appearance in Incredible Hulk #181, the claws were shown as flat, straight, double-edged blades that were never extracted or retracted. This idea was changed by Chris Claremont because he felt that by not having the claws as part of his anatomy, then anyone could be Wolverine by simply putting on the gloves.
http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/James_Howlett_%28Earth-616%29
but seriously, stop getting your panties in a bunch because i'm questioning the sacred cow that is MUH WEBSHOTERS. I didn't even say I didn't like them. Because I do. I think they're great. I just also think that they're not perfect. I don't think organic webshooters are perfect, either. And that is precisely why I merely commented on >>82399383 and >>82399504 that maybe there's a middleground somewhere that achieves the best of both worlds.
but god forbid we actually discuss it.
>>82400078
they gave him the schematics and formula and even then he has an Asian with aspergers do it.
>>82399895
so? Iron man has tons of knock offs, anyone with a bow can be hawkeye. no one is going to confuse Spidey for a rip off
>>82400228
It's not that they can't....why would they need to build web shooters?
Reed Richards can stretch, he doesn't need web shooters
Iron Man has suits, he doesn't need web shooters
Beast is a mutant, he doesn't need web shooters
Black Panther has a vibranium suit, he doesn't need web shooters
WHY WOULD THEY NEED WEB SHOOTERS? They can make web shooters if they like, they just don't see the purpose.
The average joe can't make the web shooters because it is out of their logic and super scientist don't need them .
>>82400251
>which means that any other kid in highschool COULD
Yeah, any other super smart kid on Pete's level, at which point he's already a threat or ally.
I don't get your argument.
>>82399569
Shooting webs already is basically jizzing over people, and if we go by Raimi he does it from there cause that's where the spider bit him
But mixing the two could work since he's not gonna roll up his sleeves to shoot it out so having a web shooter is convenient on top of focusing how much can come out giving him more control
>>82400251
>means that any other kid in highschool COULD
Parker was a Reed Richards level genius.
>>82399672
is he really?
last few years aside,
>always down on his luck
>always tragically single
>relationships always turn bad
>the one time he had a stable thing for a length of time they literally RETCON THE UNIVERSE to undo it
>always muh secret identity
>always new york
>no lasting power upgrade/downgrade/changes
but even ignoring that, being the "least static a-lister" is like being the least smelly pile of shit. it's still just relative.
>>82400251
>okay, sure. but he invented them as a poor kid in highschool. which means that any other kid in highschool COULD
You're not reading the thread. The knowledge was acquired after the radioactive bite. He didn't invent it on his own, he acquired the formula for how spider webs work. He then came up with the idea to put spider webs in gauntlets. Since he was already smart, he easily built a contraption to harbor the formula he got after the spider bite.
>>82399151
GO READ THE FUCKING COMICS YOU DIPSHIT!!!!!!
>>82400251
We are literally discussing it.
I personally dislike the whole "special snowflake" thing you're implying with organic webshooters. I think that the fact that they were made by this super high school geek make them much cooler than simply "lel spider dna i dunno".
I mean, if we're going by that logic, anyone can be bitten by a spider, too.
If anyone else had gotten bitten, theg wouldn't become spider-man, because only Peter would know how to make the web shooters.
>>82400406
Okay, friend. Point me in the right direction! What are some of the best/most enjoyable Spider-man stories? I guess in this case start off with more origin-y stories if that's even possible. I'd google it, but I've learned that my tastes over the years is more in line with /co/ than goodcomics or comicvine or wherever
For whatever reason, I can accept that he has small pressurized canisters of super concentrated, condensed web fluid that can shoot out at crazy high speeds via mechanized device MORE than I can accept that he has that much fluid in an invisible organ able to eject fluid fast enough to reach rooftops.
Comics, I know, but it's just too much.
>>82399151
Hang on, let me google that for you
>>82400382
>The knowledge was acquired after the radioactive bite
Not according to the Lee/Ditko run. Pete was already a chemical genius who had an interest in spider webs.
>>82400425
>I personally dislike the whole "special snowflake" thing you're implying with organic webshooters.
>implying mechanical webshooters that Peter and only Peter know how to make isn't an equally special snowflake thing to do
>>82400472
All of Ultimate if you want alternate universe highschool Spidey. It's great because you can just start at #1 and go from there.
If you want mainstream continuity it's a bit more complex because it spreads out into a bunch of spin offs and side titles and shit.
But I'd say start with Brand New Day and just keep going from there.
>>82400293
>so? Iron man has tons of knock offs
that's a major theme for his character. he developed groundbreaking tech, and has to constantly battle those who would use it for the wrong reasons.
>anyone with a bow can be hawkeye.
also a major theme. he trains to be the literal best because it's the only thing that separates him from the average joe. he's said as much on-panel.
>no one is going to confuse Spidey for a rip off
that's not even the point. the question is, why don't people copy it? in EVERY OTHER ORIGIN, this is answered.
Cap: Formula was lost, people DO try to copy it and it always results in bad end
Iron Man: People copy it all the time and he has to fight them
Superman: Literally every other kryptonian is dead
Hulk: see iron man/cap, whenever his powers are copied it ends badly, and the responsibility of putting the demon back in the bottle is a major recurring theme
Spidey: uhhh.... reasons?
I'm not even attacking the concept of him being the only one to use webshooters, I'm merely questioning the justification for it. Because with how much publicity Spidey gets, JUST LIKE ALL THE OTHER HEROES, you have to imagine someone would try to copy him. And sure, we have stories of people having similar animal-gene accidents (Scorpion, Lizard, Fly etc) but no one's ever really tried to copy the webshooters... when he leaves his web all over the city for easy chemical analysis and the components of his shooters should be easily available to literally anyone (unlike cap, hulk, tony, who are dealing with military grade tech and heavily funded top-level research)
THAT'S why it's silly. and silly is okay. superheroes are inherently silly. but if you can't see WHY it's silly you're literally ignorant.
>>82400665
Is Ultimate in-line with what Peter Parker is, or is is a case of "not muh peter" to many?
>>82400740
BECAUSE
NO ONE
KNOWS
SPIDER-MAN IS SUPER FUCKING SECRET ABOUT HIS SHIT
THAT'S ALSO A MAJOR THEME OF HIS
>>82399444
>What's normally attributed to Peter using a different web formula can just be him adjusting the nozzle.
That wouldn't work with stuff like impact webbing or concrete-hard webbing.
>>82400374
>always tragically single
Except for that two or three decade that he spent fucking a supermodel.
And the Black Cat.
>>82400800
It's universaly regarded as one of the greatest Marvel comics of all time.
And yes it is a very good version of the character, my favorite even.
>>82400802
>BECAUSE NO ONE KNOWS
>THere's spider goop on the ground and on buildings and on people and on other various objects
>But nobody picks it up to analyze because reasons
>>82400740
Maybe most people don't actually know he has webshooters and assume that it's organic webbing
Because his name is spiderman and half man half animal creatures attack people constantly
I mean, Iron Man is a gigantic armor weapon so it's easy to see that it can be built
But if people don't even know if something can be built?
It just seems really stupid to assume that Parker even has webshooters, it's not common knowledge
Come to think of it, is Peter the only major cape who has superpowers AND sci-fi gadgets?
The issue with organic webbing is that you have to rationalize it with some bullshit pseudoscience on why he can produce as much web NATURALLY.
Mechanical web shooters are just straight to the point. Peter's smart as hell and can engineer the shit out of stuff. Move on.
>>82400859
>they analyze it
>"yeah its synthetic web alright"
PLACE AN ORDER ON 2000 MASS PRODUCED SPIDER-MEN
THEY'VE CRACKED IT
>>82400382
that's true, but considering >>82400519
I feel like it's a cheap cop-out trying to explain the discrepancy after the fact, and it doesn't really satisfy me. It's trying to fit too many pieces together rather than just committing to one solid reason.
He got bit and it gave him a bunch of powers... except the web power, that he had to invent himself... BUT he could only invent it because the spider bite gave him spider-blueprints, but it didn't give him webs. nope. just told him how to make them. using his super-genius skills.
come on, it's weak.
>>82400950
not even close. especially scientist heroes like Richards and Pym.
>>82400740
It's a combination of most of the bad guys not knowing Spidey has webshooters. He's been mistaken as a mutant before. Plus his origins aren't just a known thing to other people the same as Hulk or Iron Man.
No one even saw Pete get bitten. He got bitten at the science show, and slipped out. He immediately used Spider-Man as a stage persona. He didn't create the webbing as a crime fighting tool.
So then look at his villains. In original continuity most of them are only using animal themes as a motif ontop of unrelated science. Vulture isn't literally a vulture-man. Rhino doesn't have rhino DNA. Scorpion supposedly had some sort of scorpion mutation shit done to him, but even then his main thing was his cybernetic tail.
They ARE copies of Spider-Man in that regard.
>>82400859
The webbing totally dissolves after 30 min. It's nearly impossible to get a sample.
>>82400995
you realize that in today's real life, not-fictional-superscience-but-real-actual-science, we can analyze any substance and figure out its exact chemical components, right? like, we've been able to do that for a while.
then the next step is figuring out how to produce that chemical, which sure, probably not a cakewalk but certainly possible (especially considering we're talking about things that a highschooler could buy)
now add in that this is comics with bullshit superscience, and why the fuck doesn't hydra or the hand or AIM have millions of spider henchmen? why hasn't anyone even tried?
>>82401014
Gaining an innate knowledge through the spider bite is sillier than developing a crazy organ system in his wrists?
>>82401014
>BUT he could only invent it because the spider bite gave him spider-blueprints,
No? He created the formula, he studies bio engineering, it has nothing to do with the bite.
How are organic shooters any less of a cop out? It's super fucking convenient for the only physical characteristic of a spider that he'd develop are web spinner on his wrists.
>>82400836
>ignoring the two bullet points right below "tragically single"
>>82401105
The same reason Hydra doesn't have henchmen with the powersets of Hank Pym, Reed Richards, Victor Von Doom, or literally any other person who has sci-fi powers
>>82401105
Because even then...now AIM has got webbing that dissolves after 30 min. Now what?
They don't have spider sense or anything. You're awfully hung up on such a simple thing to get past for everyone else.
Where did this shit about him learning to make webbing because of the bite come from?
>>82401130
>No? He created the formula, he studies bio engineering, it has nothing to do with the bite.
>>82400382
>The knowledge was acquired after the radioactive bite.
so which is it?
>>82401192
>They don't have spider sense or anything
This is also important because Peter's Spidersense is the thing that keeps him from missing a building and just falling
>>82401105
Do you even read comics at all? They do have shit very similar to webbing, but it's jusr useless in the hands of normal grunts. Spider-man mastered the web and uses it in harmony of his super reflexes, strenght and senses.
The web doesn't make super-man good, super-man makes the web good.
It's like asking why isn't every hydra soldier using a bow since Hakweye is so good.
>>82401228
The fucking stupid 90s cartoon.
>>82400226
Don't bullshit. He had the ability to crawl on vertical surfaces, the proportional strength of a spider and Spider Sense, which is supposed to be like how when you try and swat a spider but it runs away before your hand reaches it.
>>82401254
>super-man
Fucking auto-correct
>>82401192
now they commit crimes? now they fight spider-man with a dozen spider-men? now they discredit spider-man by masquerading as him?
the silliness isn't that webshooters exist, it's that no one's even tried to copy them. sure, maybe it'd be a shitty idea and there's reasons why peter and ONLY peter can make them work well, but show that in a story. IF they're a mechanical construct, then show WHY no one else uses them. because look here, >>82401166
>The same reason Hydra doesn't have henchmen with the powersets of Hank Pym, Reed Richards, Victor Von Doom, or literally any other person who has sci-fi powers
the difference with those characters is that people have TRIED to copy them. how many people use/have used pym particles? and how many people use webshooters? and yet... which is easier to acquire?
that's what I'm hung up on. and circling back to my original comment, that's why I got intrigued by the compromise of organic spinnerets + mechanical launchers, because it addresses the issue while maintaining the theme of spidey's super inventiveness.
but again, webshooters are a sacred cow and are not to be changed.
>>82401254
>They do have shit very similar to webbing
where? give me an issue, and maybe I'll shut up about it.
maybe.
>>82401313
It's not bullshit. His ability to wall crawl has nothing to do with tiny hairs like a spider. His "spider" strength isn't due to having arthropod anatomy, and his spider-sense is the result of developing a low level mental power not because he grew eight fucking eyes.
None of his powers are actually "spider" powers. He just chose that theme because he knew the radioactive bite gave him the powers.
>>82401130
>It's super fucking convenient for the only physical characteristic of a spider that he'd develop are web spinner on his wrists.
i guess we're just ignoring the rest of his spider-powers then.
like human torch has to douse himself in gasoline every time he wants to flame on.
>>82400740
Venom is his copy. Also last I checked even trapster wasn't sure about spideys webs and he is the glue villain.
Has spider-man ever stopped a bullet with his web slingers?
>>82401379
>now they fight spider-man with a dozen spider-men?
HOW!? Just because AIM invented silly string?
The webshooters are a pointless thing to replicate and the reason why there's not been a story to illustrate that is because every other person on Earth KNOWS its retarded but you. It's a dumb thing to worry about.
Spider-Man uses a specialized tool that would be useless to anyone else. It's not a suit of armor. It's a gadget that only works as well as it does because HE'S the one to use it.
>>82401467
The rest of his powers aren't physical manifestations of arachnid anatomy m8
>>82401503
No but I know one time some strong bad guy grabbed Spider-Man by the wrists and crushed the shooters, not knowing that they were there. Spidey has to escape and not let on that he wasn't able to shoot webs.
>>82401521
>IT'S A COMIC WEBSHOOTERS DON'T HAVE TO BE REALISTIC
>NO ONE ELSE CAN USE WEBSHOOTERS, THAT WOULD BE UNREALISTIC
nigga, look at yourself.
>>82401437
They were intended to be spider-powers when he was created. That's why he's Spider-Man. The idea that they're totally unrelated to the spider itself is a retcon. Especially since when he accidentally boosted his powers he grew four more arms. Like a fucking spider.
>>82401379
Why the fuck would they do it though? It's retarded. It's like asking why isn't every bad guy in Gotham using batarangs or every Daredevil villain using a billy club.
>>82401603
To be fair you'd need to have super strength because using a web to stop someone from falling usually breaks their bones.
>>82401603
It's in-universe that Spidey's agility, balance and spider-sense all are how he's able to use the webshooters with any effectiveness. He made a thing that works with his powers.
Even if a normal guy were to replicate them., he's not strong enough to swing from them, he's not got the powers to augment the shooters' use at all. He's just got a glue gun. Big fucking deal. They've got a glue-centric villain (Trapster) and he's a goddamned joke.
>>82401603
Are you being stupid on purpouse? Are you willingly not getting his point?
He's saying it's stupid to worry about someone replicating a tool that has no use whatsover for people who don't have super reflexes, strenght and a sixth sense.
>>82401559
yeah, you're right. and if we're using that as law, I can see the rationale. I just feel like it's a pointless distinction, introduced as a retcon solely to explain the question of "why does he have some spider-powers but had to invent others"
in the spirit of his origin, it's not like he was designed to face this level of scrutiny. he got superpowers because RADIATION IS MAGIC! they gave him spider abilities because SPIDER BITE! EXCELSIOR! it's not until later, when kids started to grow up and comics became an adult hobby that we started to see this shit be questioned, and as a result get quasi-scientific explanations. like punches from the punch dimension, or tactile telekinesis, or in Spidey's case, his spider-themed abilities being just a coincidence.
I mean hell even looking at his history, how many times has he grown extra arms or mutated into a human spider? THAT shit suggests actual spider DNA mutation. this kind of shit flip-flops depending on the current writer.
>>82401605
No. In Amazing Fantasy 15 he fucking SAYS that the spider thing was just a theme to match the spider bite. That's literally the reason he invented the web shooters. "What spider would be complete without webs?"
>>82399334
>>82401865
>"What spider would be complete without webs?"
The numerous spiders that don't produce webs.
>>82401665
>>82401732
>>82401744
and this is a universe where people can get those powers. so why don't we get more knockoff spider-men? the only ones we have are actual clones, alternate universe versions, or people who use his old suit.
>>82401656
there are literally dozens of knockoff batmen. thank you for helping me.
>>82402047
because there are simpler uses of his power set and they don't care?
>>82402169
oh so like cap's shield.
except for all those other guys that use thowable shields.
>>82399241
Maybe you would've understand if you knew a thing or two
>>82399151
>>82399188
No, he never did. It was always web shooters until Raimi introduced 'organic webbing' in the first film, which caused a fucking uproar at the time.
>>82402309
and there are countless cap tier heroes/villains who don't use bouncy shields. so what's your point?
>>82403229
that there's not a single spidey villain that uses mechanical webshooters, which is silly because they should be easy for a supervillain to reproduce.
the "spidey is a special snowflake and the only one who can use them" argument doesn't hold water because we never even see anyone else TRY
if his webshooters are mechanical, they should be reproducible. if they're reproducible, someone should have reproduced them. like literally every other tech/science hero has had his/her powers or gadgets reproduced in some capacity.
unless his shooters are organic.
>>82404250
But why would they if they have more effective or easier methods for using vaguely similar powerset? It just makes no sense, Pete only uses webs because it's his gimmick which he perfected into an art. I think they even had a storyline where someone tried to sell Spidey's web tech. No one fucking cared. It makes no real sense to replicate web shooters when their use is pretty limited unless you want to put in tons of work to get to the point it's more effective than being a guy who orm squat a fucking skyscraper who tanks shit. And the villains who DO have the mind for that shit already have their own means of getting around rather than just copying Spider-man. Webshooters have no purpose unless you're just trying to copy Spider-man.
>it's become a "comic books are all around nonsense but peter parker making webshooters and his own web fluid is what kills my willing suspension of disbelief" thread
>>82400354
and doc ock isnt far behind why havent he done it or vulture
>>82405448
Done what?
>>82405121
or if your looking for something thats stronger than steel and can easily pin some one down with out occupying your limbs so you can do other stuff
Every thread, every time.
>>82405478
made a webshotter
>>82405533
why not just kill em?
Or tazer them?
Knock them out?
Use some other retardedly strong material that apparently grows on trees in Marvel?
>>82405561
why would they?
>>82399394
it was retconned almost immediatlysad because i really liked the stingers he got
>>82400740
I loved the fact that back in the day Kraven is the one who tipped Peter off that the black suit was more than just a suit because he mentioned that Spidey's webs switched from being synthetic to organic
