![Ben-Affleck-Zack-Snyder-Batman-v-Superman-set[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/HG8Fby2.jpg "Ben-Affleck-Zack-Snyder-Batman-v-Superman-set[1].jpg")
>Batman 89: Batman throws people out of buildings and burns people
>Batman Begins: Bruce blows up a temple and leaves Ra's to die in a train crash he orchestrated
>The Dark Knight: Batman pushed Harvey off a building
>Dark Knight Rises: Batman attempt to shoot at Talia's truck causing her to swerve and crash, killing her.
At this point no one cares
>BvS: Batman shoots at people from his plane and leaves KGBeast to die in an explosion he cause
Everyone goes apeshit
Why do we only punish BvS for Batman killing? Shouldn't we not care or get mad at teh other movies? Do people only shit on BvS because it's easier to do since Zack Snyder is such a shit director?
>>81519318
Because after 30 years they've had more than enough time to get it right.
Also it would have been alot more compelling for Batman to be tempted to break his no-kill code to stop Superman.
>>81519318
I think the bigger issue is why Burton/Schumacher Batman is a competent killer while BvS Batman didn't kill the Joker.
>>81519318
Because I'm pretty sure he kills more people in BvS alone than Batman 89-The Dark Knight Rises combined.
>>81519318
To be fair, in Dark Knight, Batman tried to save Harvey after making sure she wasn't going to shoot a child, sadly his grip failed and they both fell.
>>81519514
He only kills 4 in this movie.
Airplane guy, and the granade trio.
Car guys could had survived.
>>81519318
You forgot Batman Returns, where he explodes a guy with a bomb strapped to his chest.
>>81519318
>BvS: Batman shoots at people from his plane and leaves KGBeast to die in an explosion he cause
Yeah. After he set out to kill Superman with a spear in the fucking heart and automatic miniguns.
What don't you get? The main Batman motivation for half the movie is on how to kill another Hero. Superman, on top of that.
>>81519439
Are you dense? He started killing just in the last 18 months.
>>81519318
probaly the same reason they go apeshit over Superman killing Zod in Man of Steel even though Superman killed a depowered Zod in both the comics and in Superman II
>>81519514
All in a world where he's allowed Harley, Killer Croc, and the fucking JOKER to live.
He'll murder Superman for doing a bad job while still saving the world, the the dude who gleefully murdered his sidekick gets a prison sentence.
>>81519528
>To be fair, in Dark Knight, Batman tried to save Harvey
Agree. It showed a more humanized version of Batman. I get the Snyder wanted to have a more brutal and punished Batman, but the fact that the movie failed to explain why Batman changed blew up in Zack's face
>>81519318
>leaving someone to die is the same as strafing them with a jet
So why a spear and not a bunch of kryptonite bullets?
>>81519566
Holy fuck lmao.
>car guys could have survived
Get in your car, let me blow you up, and then I'll hook you onto the back of my car as I go 85mph down the road, slamming you off of every building and wall possible, then I'll unhook you in mid-air, then you can blow up again upon landing. Then you can let me know if you're alive or not.
These fucking Snyder defenders, I swear
Batman should kill
>>81519623
>All in a world where he's allowed Harley, Killer Croc, and the fucking JOKER to live.
THEIR MOTHERS WERE ALL CALLED MARTHA!
>>81519678
Pontius Pilate didn't use no guns.
![c581d2b59ce31c73f6b54e6236d56c41[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/PaYV29B.jpg "c581d2b59ce31c73f6b54e6236d56c41[1].jpg")
>>81519591
>What don't you get? The main Batman motivation for half the movie is on how to kill another Hero. Superman, on top of that.
The movie was trying to show how close Batman can be to his limit. But the execution of it was shit. Pic related did this right
>>81519566
>Car guys could had survived.
>>81519609
It blows me away that people don't get this.
"Good Men Turned Cruel" what the fuck did people think this speech at the very beginning of this movie was about? Bruce went off the deep end. It amazes me that we can accept dozens of stories of Superman snapping and icing dudes, but we can't accept this one even though it's spelled out for us.
>>81519623
>He'll murder Superman for doing a bad job while still saving the world, the the dude who gleefully murdered his sidekick gets a prison sentence.
Fuck that's a good one
>>81519609
That was said nowhere in the movie
>>81519678
Spear is reusable and personal
>>81519801
>Alfred: That's how it starts. The fever, the rage, the feeling of powerlessness that turns good men... cruel
What did he mean by this?
>>81519839
That batman is jelly he cant fly like a real bat
![GalleryComics_1920x1080_20150429_BM_Cv40_5528430f327fd5.91622361[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/J2ePTUu.jpg "GalleryComics_1920x1080_20150429_BM_Cv40_5528430f327fd5.91622361[1].jpg")
>>81519678
It's more poetic
>>81519678
Or as RLM pointed out Knucks. Which is pretty close to the Ring that Batman actually had on hand from time to time in the comics.
>>81519318
Maybe the Batman shown in BvS wasn't even Batman at all. But instead Hush being brainwashed by the real Bruce Wayne whilst Bruce is off doing other things. And Hush Batman goes off the rails and starts murdering everyone.
>Punished Batman
>>81519801
Alfred said it. He didnt use the word "kill".
>>81519733
Stop with the Jesus stuff, it wasnt the only thing references, Superman was several Sun Gods. And the Spear has more to do with
>>81519866 and Excalivur than withJesus.
Anyone have the 'Imagine being Arnold' pasta for Ben and Snyder?
>>81519968
seconed
>>81519318
In 89 Batman detonates a bomb inside a factory that kills like 50 people. I mean, they wouldnt need a base so big if there wasnt enough people.
In Forever he kills Harvey.
In TDK he kills the police officers in the car. No ifs around it. Alfred saying later "its a miracle no one died" doesnt matter a shit. Its like if he said the same after the kryptonite chase scene. There is no chance no one died.
>>81519318
>Batman 89: Batman throws people out of buildings and burns people
you realize that was done as a plot point where he kills people in that movie, and is later able to give robin the advice that killing and revenge don't take the pain away.
it was a character arc
>>81519439
Batman killed the Joker in the Burton movie
>>81519839
BvS is a messy fucking movie, but I am fully convinced that the movie's loudest detractors might actually be retarded. Imagine walking away from a movie that 100% paints Batman as a crazed villain for the entire run time and somehow thinking "I can't believe he killed people!!"
>>81520083
>There is no chance no one died.
That' not how fiction works
>>81520103
And it was one again in this movie. Batman in BvS is at his darkest because of Robin's death. He not think clearly. Supes helps him realize how far he's gone into his depression and self loathing.
>>81520201
But Batman was right. Superman is basically a bomb waiting to go off, if Lois dies then the world's fucked
>>81520172
That's why >>81519439 said he's a competent killer
Batman also branded dozens or even hundreds of pedophiles and its explicitly stated they get killed in prison.
>>81520301
Did you actually watch the movie? The person that we see get branded is later mentioned on the news as only the second Batman brand.
It gets a pass in Batman 89 because that was the first Batman movie ever and because it's never established that this Batman has any reservations about murder. In Batman Begins he makes a big deal about his aversion to killing but then in the end subverts his own principles to kill Ras so that's shit. In The Dark Knight I honestly took that as an accident where Batman tackles him and just ends up falling off unintentionally because he's desperate to save Gordon's family. I didn't watch Rises so eh, I don't know. In BvS It's never really established that batman doesn't like killing but they way he goes on about Superman being dangerous while he shoots cars with people in them until they explode and intentionally smashes vehicles into people and brands people for death in prison makes him seem like a hypocritical asshole. And KGBeast did not cause that explosion Batman shot his flame thrower causing it to explode.
>>81520201
The issue isn't that Batman kills, it's that the film never takes more than a half second to acknowledge that Batman is outright using lethal force and why.
I get it, Alfred has a line about Batman being more cruel, but doesn't that undermine Batman's dislike of Superman?
Batman therefor resents Superman for the collateral damage he causes, not the murder itself?
>People are still defending Snyder's bullshit
>b-but these movies
And for the record nobody "approves" of Batman killing in those moves. The reason it's looked at the other way is because they aren't shit
>>81520363
"now he is branding people"
.
Let the retards post m8. they just want to keep hating the movie.
>>81520432
>I get it, Alfred has a line about Batman being more cruel, but doesn't that undermine Batman's dislike of Superman?
Batman's fear of Superman is that he operates on a echelon above literally all of mankind. He can "burn the whole place down." Batman might crush a few dudes in his fancy car, but he's still a man who can be stopped.
Also, Batman is killing CRIMINALS, who he considers to be little more than weeds.
Literally all of this is corroborated my the movie.
>>81519624
Look, they're merely brain dead, who'd be crippled for life anyway even if they were to miraculously wake up thanks to spinal injuries, with 3rd degree burns on 99% of their bodies and they can only breath thanks to life support but they didn't die, alright!
>>81520223
>That' not how fiction works
It's a narrative conceit that no one shoots Batman in the face.
It's a conceit his cape doesn't get hung up on something and snap his neck.
It's a conceit he doesn't trip and break an ankle when he leaps through a window.
Batman punching people as hard as he does should leave many with permanent brain damage or death, but it's a narrative conceit that he doesn't.
Why are some acceptable but not all to you?
>>81519591
>faggs talk about muh prep time day in and day out
>batman makes a spear of destiny made from a huge crystal of planet krypton
>Hurr durr he made it to kill him
Not like he covered his bases and muh preptimed the fuck out of it.
>>81519623
He's pretty batty on this Earth, broheim.
>>81520395
He shot the tank and it exploded because he tried to burn Martha
>>81520508
Average film viewers chaffed at this.
And you can argue plebeian/patrician nonsense all day, but most people wanted a more thorough explanation, a real comment about why Batman was killing.
You can debate its artistic merits, but that's how most people feel.
>>81520548
>It's a narrative conceit that no one shoots Batman in the face.
Speaking of which, that dude who shot Batman in the back of the head who gets completely pummeled was a 10/10 moment.
>>81519318
I think it's because it's less excusable to screw that up these days. Burton wasn't really into comics, but Snyder claims he's a "comic book guy." Snyder should know better.
>>81520363
>>81520456
>"The bat brand is a death sentence in prison"
>one person who was branded is enough to give it a name for being a death sentence
>>81520508
>Batman is killing CRIMINALS, who he considers to be little more than weeds.
When the fuck was it okay to make Batman into the Punisher?
>>81519318
Every Batman movie sucks, OP
>>81519318
No one ever remembers how Bruce punched a dog off a 12 story building in the Dark Knight.
>>81520658
Because he went off the deep end and was the villain of the movie, try and keep up.
>>81520548
I'm saying all of those are acceptable.
>>81520697
>was the villain of the movie
I thought that was Luthor
>>81520689
The Adam West one doesn't.
>>81520653
Two people were branded and they both died, and probably rather quickly. Yeah I'd say that's enough to say it's a death sentence if the second guy comes in and is killed within days.
I'm not saying the movie is a great work of art but people need to stop criticizing things that are just patently wrong.
>>81520637
>Average film viewers chaffed at this.
Average film viewers don't give a shit that Batman kills dudes, don't give me that.
If you honestly needed Alfred to sit Bruce down and say "Master Wayne, I've noticed that ever since the Metropolis incident you kill people now, when before you did not. What's up?" then that's your problem.
>>81520751
A movie can have more than one villain.
>>81519956
What comics is thi... ooooh, I see what you did here.
>>81520784
>Average film viewers don't give a shit that Batman kills dudes, don't give me that.
The beloved Dark Knight trilogy was all about Batman's relationship with murder.
He lets Ras die in BB, which causes Talia to nearly destroy Gotham in Rises. He refuses to kill the Joker in TDK. His hand is forced to take Harvey's life and take blame for Harvey's murders, which Bane uses against Batman and Gordon in Rises. There were consequences, dialog happened, character growth happened.
Now if Batman in Justice League decides to play nice after Superman's death, that will be character growth. Or Snyder will double down and not give a shit.
>>81521125
>Now if Batman in Justice League decides to play nice after Superman's death,
>"I failed him in life, I will not fail him in death."
What did he mean by this?
>>81521125
>Now if Batman in Justice League decides to play nice after Superman's death, that will be character growth.
did you miss the end of the movie
>>81521250
>What did he mean by this?
"Better murder more people in the sequel so they know I mean business."
"I shall embrace Superman's lesson of killing my enemies because they're too dangerous to let live."
"Die. Die. Die for Dakrseid!"
>>81519611
In Superman II there was unused footage that shows Zod and his crew along with Lex being escorted by police. They didn't die.
>>81519566
That's a pretty optimistic assumption, which sadly not the case. With those type of wreck and explosion during car chases. The chance of those goons to survive are close to none.
Not to mention, that poor innocent refueling truck driver. Batman let innocent people die!
>>81519780
So Batman is SOOO cruel that he'll kill everyone that gets in his way, all because he has one goal: Kill Superman.
But when he finally meets Superman for their final battle he doesn't just immediately kill him? Instead he toys around with him?
>>81520827
It can also have more than one hero. Unfortunately in BvS case they forgot to even have one.
>>81521639
He wants to punish him first. For justice.
>>81521717
Then changes his mind because 'muh Martha'
Batman is broken. Thats why he is becoming more violent with criminals because he feels nothing he has done has mattered. Thats why he says stopping Superman is the only thing he does that will matter as he fears that Superman can destroy the world.
The Martha thing, while odd, makes perfect sense I feel. The Martha flashback during the scene makes him realize he has become everything he has hated. He has basically become the gunmen who killed his parents ("Don't let Martha die" - if he kills superman, Martha will die).
Thats why batman doesn't brand or kill Lex in the prison at the end. Superman basically allowed Batman to regain his trust in the world. Bruce at the beginning of the film refers to heroics/the ability to do good and overcome (represented by the bats lifting him) as "a beautiful lie". The "Men are still good" line at the end from Bruce says the opposite - that people CAN make a difference. Hence why he will assemble the league in Superman's absence.
While some may just want the characters to be their fully formed comic versions, I personally don't mind the build up. BvS is a movie where Batman becomes (or becomes again) the hero we know, where Superman finally becomes a hero in the eyes of the public not through acts of good but through sacrifice (I assume in his rebirth we will get a more "classic" heroic Superman), and WW decides not to continue to turn a blind eye and instead "rejoin" the world.
I'll these story elements also of course draw heavily from religious and Shakespearian themes.
>>81521639
>Instead he toys around with him?
Toys?
He couldnt just kill him.
A nuke didnt killed him.
He needed to make him feel secure, then take away Most of his superspeed and heat vision, then weaken him enough to actually make him vulnerable to the Kryptonite spear.
If he had tried to use the Spear at the start he could had tried to run away or take the spear and trow it one mile away. etc.
>>81521717
If he was going by a sense of justice he wouldn't have reacted the way he did.
even if he was going by his own warped sense of justice he wouldn't have hesitated to kill him the second he had the upper hand.
His not killing Superman makes that whole" if we believe there's even a one percent chance.." line pointless.
He couldn't even stand by his own convictions.
And if he was going by an actual code of justice he would at least hear Superman out before deciding upon execution
>>81521978
>and Shakespearian themes.
Yeah, hamlet.
This Movie is a Vengeance Tragedy.
>>81519566
>Car guys could had survived.
did you even watch the fucking movie?
>>81521717
But Batman believed that killing Supes might be the only thing that he does that matters.
Why give Superman a chance to turn him into mass of crumpled bones and flesh on the floor when he could have finished him at lower risk?
>>81522025
Instead of using sonic weapons or bullets he could've exposed him to a chunk of kryptonite and did the deed then and there from the start.
When Superman catches the grenade and is blasted with K dust and is on his knees coughing that was the time to do it.
Instead he kicks him around and talks all this trash about Supes not being brave.
>>81521799
I fucking hated martha in this movie
>Oh honey you don't HAVE to save people if you don't want to.
> Batman turns Alfred to an accessory of murder
>When you realize Batman and fucking Robin was the one movie that threated that one thing about batman with respect.
>>81522185
>Instead of using sonic weapons or bullets he could've exposed him to a chunk of kryptonite
And he could had tried to escape.
>>81519514
You might want to check your math, boyo.
>Batman '89
-Blows up factory full of Joker henchmen after shooting several of them with Batmobile's guns
-Throws various Joker henchmen down bell tower stairwell
-Kills Joker
That's not even including the possibility of any henchmen caught in the crossfire when he shot up the parade with the Batwing.
>Batman Returns
-Sets fire-swallower on fire with Batmobile jet
-Shoves dynamite down muscle man's pants and pushes him into a sewer where he explodes
-All those poor, innocent penguins who were just following orders
-Kills Penguin
>Batman Forever
-Tosses replica coins into the air, knowing that Two-Face will panic in trying to grab his own while perched atop a narrow beam and fall to his death
>Batman Begins
-Chooses to set fire to Ra's Al Ghul's temple and kills countless ninja assassins rather than take a single man's life
-Chooses "not to save" Ra's, leaving him to die in a train collision
>The Dark Knight
-Tackles Harvey Dent over the side of a building and kills him after communications break down
>The Dark Knight Rises
-Opens fire on the truck Talia is escaping in, killing the driver and causing the truck to run off the side of a bridge, which breaks Talia's neck and kills her
Not to mention that he more or less shrugged off Selina using the motorcycle's mounted guns to kill Bane.
>>81522314
>>Oh honey you don't HAVE to save people if you don't want to.
He doesnt. She is saying that there's nothing heroic in Obligtionn, that he can be a light to the world but only if he really wants to help. And she is right. Superman DESIRE to do the right thing is more important than anything else.
>>81522314
>Oh honey you don't HAVE to save people if you don't want to.
So you think the parent of a child should instead say that it is 100% undoubtedly his responsibility to shoulder the burdens of the world? Is that good parenting to you?
>>81522440
If Batman had just released the K dust first Superman wouldn't have been able to escape, the film shows that the dust floors him.
Remember when Jason died in the comics and Batman became much more violent and brooding, to the point that everyone became concerned over his extreme methods until Tim came along to become the new Robin and bring him back from the brink?
From what we know of this universe, Bruce has operated in Gotham for approximately 20 years and Tim never came along. That means that for YEARS after Jason's death, Bruce just got worse and worse while Alfred had to stand by and unsuccessfully try to talk sense into him. Rather than Tim, it took Superman's sacrifice to turn Bruce back to the light.
>>81519318
You know, to be fair, I've had more of a problem with Batman calling himself a criminal (and also with shit pacing, "babby's first NGE fanfic"-level symbolism crammed everywhere, nonsensical plot and the abject retardation of every single character, but I digress) than with him killing. I mean, it's the post-Jason, pre-Tim era, slippery slope Batman, or at least that's how I saw him. His moral compass lost its true north, so he becomes ore and more brutal.
>>81521663
Do people really not understand Superman's character arc in this movie?
Superman tries to do good, but everyone of his actions have unintended consequences. He is paralyzed by fear not because he does not want to do good in the world, but because he cannot anticipate what his actions mean. He martyrs himself at the end, because it's not "his world" to oversee, and because his death can be a greater force for good then his life.
Obviously he's coming back, and more than likely he's coming back as a more traditional and reassured Superman.
>>81522905
>and more than likely he's coming back as a more traditional and reassured Superman.
You mean like people thought how BvS would lead to a more traditional and reassured Superman after MoS?
>>81519318
It's more about how he went about it, I think.
Like, who's cleaning the viscera off of the Batmobile?
>>81522936
"more than likely"
They went full bore with the Jesus character arc, this is the natural conclusion to such a characterization.
>"People are always like, 'You changed Superman' If you're a comic book fan, you know that I didn't change Superman. If you know the true canon, you know that I didn't change Superman. If you're a fan of the old movies, yeah I changed him a bit. That's the difference. I'm a bit of a comic book fan and I always default to the true canon."
Zack "The Hack" Snyder
>>81522936
Do you honestly believe that they killed Superman to bring him back and have him be exactly the same?
>>81519318
Batman killing Harvey Dent is kind of the point though. Its not meant to be an every day occurance, the point is he ends up breaking his rule hes harping on about the whole movie and The Joker wins in the end.
Its not the same as Batman shooting people willy nilly.
>>81519566
>Cars guys could have survived
Is this nigga' serious or trolling? I can't wait for the R-rated version, where we get to see all the gore.
>>81520752
Touche.
>>81519609
So you're telling me he had a year and a half to directly go after his actual rogues, but didn't?
Okay.
>>81523028
I would believe that if they're keeping Snyder on board.
Why do people include the League of Shadows in kill counts? He wasn't Batman at that point and even in the comics he had plenty of kills before the rule came about. Might as well argue he broke the no guns rule too for taking one to Falcone's. It's an origin's story and he's not fully formed until midway through the movie.
As for the ending Ras died because he himself sabotaged the controls. Gordon taking down the track was a back up plan to make sure the train never reached Wayne Tower regardless of what happened on board. Ras would've lived if he took Bruce on in a fight, but instead he decided to double down on his plan and sealed his fate.
Nolan kill count stands at 3: Harvey, Talia and her driver. Considering Nolan's is supposed to be a more grounded take at Batman, I think that's as close as you can get whilst still being an effective super hero.
>>81523131
Don't know what to tell you kemosabe, Superman being unable to do good because even the kindest action has unintended consequences is a natural continuation of Man of Steel and a pretty common story trope in the comics (both Peace and Red Son hit the exact same beat) so maybe you need a more convincing counter argument here.
>>81523211
>even the kindest action has unintended consequences
That usually doesn't happen in reality, is the funny thing.
>>81523211
"Dont be kind, bad things will happen! Your actions will make things worse you might as well not bother!"
Woah...so inspiring...
Friendly reminder you are defending a guy who thought it was ''fun'' to have Jimmy Olsen shot in the head without ever meeting superman
>>81523028
>do you honestly believe Superman will be a brooding asshole in JL
Yes
>>81523344
Much as I enjoyed BvS, yeah, Snyder says some stupid shit. He said he wanted to "have some fun" killing Jimmy because there are so many characters in the universe they're building that there just wasn't room for Jimmy to exist too.
>>81519318
the thing about batman is that he wouldn't actually be effective against criminals at all
even nolan's dark knight addresses this, in part being the point of the movie
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1Oy0oK38gc
snyder picks up from this and takes it a step further, but instead of making batman's mission too involved in personal conflicts it implies something greater, "criminals are like weeds"
as far as the specifics of bvs, i don't really care for the people he hurts. at all. KGBeast sealed his own fate by pulling the trigger, batman gave him a way out. if batman indirectly kills a building surrounded and full of killers to save an innocent, i'm fine with that
Thw whole problem with this is, when Batfleck finally faces the Joker...
>Tonight, you're going to break your one ru-
>Oh, you already have?
>That's all I've got then, do take care.
>>81523716
Maybe its a sign that you need to tone back on Universe building and Cameos if you cant even introduce one of the most important supporting characters
>the movies keep getting batman wrong
>its ok if hes done wrong again
its like stockholm syndrome
>>81523025
But he is right though. MOS draws heavily from the modern era (mid 80s to present) Superman.
>>81522476
>take a single man's life
a guy who probably died anyway, again, pointing out the weirdness of people talking as they are about bvs only because they are directly and purposely confronted with the effects of batman's actions
>>81523922
It's coming to terms with insanity really.
>>81523408
>>do you honestly believe Superman will be a brooding asshole in JL
why? it's not like he was either brooding or an asshole in either movie before it
>>81523037
>A child is saved
>Joker is in Jail
>the Joker won
How fucking stupid are you.
There's more important things than the Jokers stupid opinion.
>>81524400
joker wins the psychological game's he's playing, yes. which is where batman saying "the joker cannot win" so that joker doesn't win the game for gotham's soul
2:15
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oPsvq81n2A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8y9bNKj7d8
>>81522785
>That means that for YEARS after Jason's death, Bruce just got worse and worse while Alfred had to stand by and unsuccessfully try to talk sense into him.
I didn't ask for these feels damn it.
>>81522785
And this is why this is a retarded complain. It makes sense for the character in this context and at the end of the film he regain his golden rule.
>>81523902
I mean, hell, it's not even like Jimmy takes up an inordinate amount of screen time in any other Superman movie anyway. Just have him around the Daily Planet offices or occasionally show him taking a photo.
>>81523037
Not to mention the fact he retired for eight years after that night. Partially because he murdered Harvey Dent.
>>81519678
>>81519678
it's phallic
much more satisfaction for bruce to take superman on 1v1 and stab him face to face under his heel, which again plays into how the whole movie is about power
there's sex in the movie, but i'm holding on to that since all the other shit i've posted has made things worse
>>81519318
>>Batman 89: Batman throws people out of buildings and burns people
In the first movie his progression into his insanity is clearly defined, and it's not really surprising that he kills without compunction in the second. But in that first movie, he doesn't deliberately kill, and in the two Schumacher movies from the soft reboot of that continuity, he also doesn't kill deliberately.
Everybody thought it was dumb when he killed Ra's in Begins, and it contributed to bad word of mouth and the overall low gross of that movie. Harvey was dead anyway; he had maybe hours left to live and was clearly insane. What was the alternative? Take him back to the evacuated hospital and let him die on a gurney, strapped down and sedated beyond any ability to resist? Talia's truck contained a bomb that was intended to destroy Gotham and everybody in it. He knew shooting the truck wouldn't set the bomb off prematurely but if he didn't do something it would eventually go off. How long should he have waited for a chance?
>BvS
He revels in killing with impunity. He literally maims people with impunity. You want to know what's a really good way to get out of criminal charges? You tell the judge you were physically burned by a lunatic with an obsession with you, who fabricated evidence and could clearly have afforded to do so since he drives around in a fucking tank. Even an honest judge is going to say the evidence is tainted and throw the case out.
So you have there a Batman whose sole purpose is riding around in his rich guy toys hunting and killing poor people, and you can't understand why this is bad?
>>81519609
>>81519780
The world's greatest detective goes rogue but can't find and kill a flamboyant murderous clown in over a year?
I mean jesus h fuck anon. Come on.
>>81519318
Except people HAVE given shit them shit for being trigger happy Batmans.
Burton's in particular.
But BvS Batman happens to be in a shoddily put together movie, where his main motivation in the movie is killing Superman, and goes around mowing down mooks on the side.
>>81519780
>>81519609
This is some desperate damage control.
>>81525628
The movie begins with Batman still with his no-kill rule. He was retired when the Zod invasion happened. It's only because of things were pilling up in regards to Superman that he decided to ditch his morals and come back more brutal.
>>81525886
No, the anons are pointing out things that were clearly there in the movie.
Hate the movie all you want, but nitpicking is bad.
>>81519318
If you can't see the difference between those examples and Batman fucking plowing his way through Gotham City in the Tankmobile while blowing the ever-loving shit out of everyone then you're unsalvagable.
>>81526007
The fuck, man? Keaton killed people with a grim on his face.
>>81519318
>KGBeast
sorry anon, sorry, that was not the kgbeast, same name but that dude in the movie was just some sorry minion bitch. not the Reagan Kgbeast
>>81521352
That's the ending of the movie most countries not called USA saw, desu.
>>81525924
Wait so he figures out that he shouldn't kill Superman but continues acting twice as brutal?
>>81526332
Batman in the movie decided to get back ready to drop muthafuckas dead in his pursuit to prep-time against himself against Superman, his great white while. Before that he was retired.
>>81525581
>But in that first movie, he doesn't deliberately kill
He blew up that factory while people were shooting at his Batmobile and tossed that one henchman down the cathedral. Considering Joker died from that far a drop, that henchman probably was killed too.
But yes, at least Burton's Batman was consistent.
>>81524400
The Joker 'won' in that Batman failed to save Harvey Dent. Harvey Dent, Gotham's white knight and symbol of hope, was reduced to a cruel child-murderer, and Bruce failed to save him. After that Batman took the blame for killing all of the killings related to Harvey, so that Harvey's reputation, and the symbol of what he did wouldn't be tarnished, and he could now be a martyr for the city, an even greater symbol of hope and justice, meaning that The Joker ultimately lost the battle for Gotham, but did succeed in destroying Batman from a moral standpoint.
>>81521639
>>81521717
>>81522025
It never ceases to amaze me how insane Batman fans are. Toy with him? Punish him? That was the best Batman could expect to do. He used the gas because it's harder to defend against, it's to catch him by surprise, which it did. Imagine if Superman hadn't been trying to show off at the start of the fight, and instead of catching the K-round, he DODGED it and observed what happened when it hit something else? Had he known Batman had kryptonite before he had actually been hit with it, Batman would have been fucked. Imagine he pulls out the spear when Superman can still do things like fly around out of it's range. Batman got lucky, plain and simple.
>>81523344
>>81523716
The really bad thing about that is that A LOT could've been done with undercover CIA Agent Jimmy Olsen, had Snyder not been a hack and WB desperate to get the DCCU going.
There's this whole theme of distrust about what Superman is for among people and the government, and then you have Jimmy, a CIA agent sent undercover to work at the Planet with Lois, because the government knows she has inside info on Superman.
And you don't know how the real Jimmy feels about Superman. Is he against him? Does he believe one man can change the world?
So you can form very intresting narrative, where Jimmy and Clark become friends, but Clark is Superman, and Jimmy is secretly out to expose him to the government, maybe.
But no. All that doesn't have place in a universe built around how the real world reacts to Superman and how everyone would distrust him.
Better just kill him off early in the movie. The fans will love that.
