Happy Kwanzaa /co/
when do we do the feats of strength?
Reminder that Kwanzaa is a fake holiday.
>>78452977
Winter Solstice:Christmas::Christmas:Kwanzaa
>>78452977
most holidays are
really the only holiday that is real and is celebrated around the world is the new year, and that's not even completely true because there are still countries who can't decide on a date
>>78453012
>Holidays with deep roots millions of people have celebrated for centuries are the same as fabricated holidays invented forty years ago that no one celebrates
k
In all seriousness, /co/: Have you ever in your entire life met a single person who celebrated Kwanzaa?
>>78452932
Why did Kwanza become less relevant in recent years?
>>78453012
Yet Christmas is much bigger than the winter solstice, given that it is also celebrated in the South where it happens during the summer solstice.
When I was little I heard that Kwanzaa has more presents than Christmas so I asked my dad if we could celebrate Kwanzaa instead and he said "We'll see."
We were white. In Utah. We never did celebrate Kwanzaa.
>>78453092
>>78453153
I think you two are misunderstanding the analogy. Both Christmas and Kwanzaa were adaptations and codifications of pre-existing stories/values that latched onto a pre-existing holiday so as to conform to the cultural mores of the people the creators were trying to get to buy in. Christmas is only Christmas because of the Winter Solstice, the same way that Kwanzaa is only Kwanzaa because of Christmas.
>>78453234
Man, people were just lying up and down to you. We didn't get any presents because we celebrated Christmas. Kwanzaa was actually more traditional Christmas-y than Christmas, with lots of solemn candle-lighting and group reflection and family togetherness bullshit.
>>78453143
"Less relevant?" When the fuck was Kwanzaa ever relevant?
>>78453143
All fads eventually die out.
>>78452932
>>78452977
>>78453012
>>78453110
>>78453143
>>78453263
Kwanzaa is celebrated by less than half a percent of Americans.
Ebery hababawanza its the bababasame.
I always bablay da bababalin bool.
>>78453402
So it failed where Christmas succeeded. That doesn't change the soundness of the analogy. If you want to complain about Kwanzaa being over-marketed, fine (even though it really isn't). If you want to complain about it being a made up thing riding on the coattails of a more popular winter holiday, well...
this would trigger so much tumblr shitposting if it came out today
>>78453402
1.5 million is still a large number, friend
>>78453110
Being a person who celebrates Kwanzaa, yes
>>78453476
>Being a person who celebrates Kwanzaa
What is wrong with you?
>>78453450
How so?
What's Kwanzaa even about? You basically celebrate being black?
>>78453402
Well, damn. There's at least two of us in this thread. I always said /co/ was exceptional.
>>78453449
>If you want to complain about it being a made up thing riding on the coattails of a more popular winter holiday
I'm pretty sure there's a reason several holidays from various religions are all centered around winter and the end of the year
Kwanzaa most definitely is a sort of anti-commercialized black christmas, but only because this is the best time of the year to celebrate things
Look at it this way, Kwanzaa doesn't start the day after christmas, it starts the week before the new year
>>78453476
You celebrate Kwanzaa? Can I ask you a question?
Is it a tradition to kidnap some white women and then torture them with hoses, telephone cords, and household appliances in the name of Black Power and then go to prison for ten years, or was that just a one-time thing Mr. Everett did after he invented the holiday in 1966?
>>78453505
>What is wrong with you?
I have asthma and I'm overweight
Also, I'm short
I don't really see that as a problem, but other people treat taller people better
>>78453548
Yeah
The actual problem with Kwanzaa is that you can't market it towards non-black people
All the normal holiday things are there, family, togetherness, the seven principles, love and what not
But it's a black holiday and apparently nobody wants to be black
>>78453476
>1.5 million is still a large number, friend
And it's dropping every year.
>>78453554
>Look at it this way, Kwanzaa doesn't start the day after christmas, it starts the week before the new year
Except is was created specifically as an anti-white alternative to Christmas... that later sold out its own integrity in order to not alienate black Baptists.
>>78453548
You reject Christmas because it's a 'white' thing but don't actually want to give up having a winter holiday so you just replace it with an even more shallow celebration of a random clusterfuck of African cultures (most having absolutely nothing to do with black Americans).
>>78453588
>Is it a tradition
My tradition is that I go on 4chan and shitpost about hot button issues about race and make broad generalization about groups of people
I'm glad that I found another person who celebrates Kwanzaa like I dojust kidding, but Karenga did technically hold me as a baby, so maybe his hatred of whites rubbed off on me and it's just waiting to kick in
>>78453632
:(
>>78453642
Yeah, because excluding people on a holiday based around unity and togetherness was kind of retarded
>>78452932
This episode was actually a stealth pilot for a spin-off about the Carmichaels. It and The Proud Family both got rejected by Nick because they're fuckin' racists.;
>>78453548
>What's Kwanzaa even about?
Umoja (Unity): To strive for and to maintain unity in the family, community, nation, and race.
Kujichagulia (Self-Determination): To define ourselves, name ourselves, create for ourselves, and speak for ourselves.
Ujima (Collective Work and Responsibility): To build and maintain our community together and make our brothers' and sisters' problems our problems, and to solve them together.
Ujamaa (Cooperative Economics): To build and maintain our own stores, shops, and other businesses and to profit from them together.
Nia (Purpose): To make our collective vocation the building and developing of our community in order to restore our people to their traditional greatness.
Kuumba (Creativity): To do always as much as we can, in the way we can, in order to leave our community more beautiful and beneficial than we inherited it.
Imani (Faith): To believe with all our hearts in our people, our parents, our teachers, our leaders, and the righteousness and victory of our struggle.
>You basically celebrate being black?
No, more like reflection on ways to stabilize and better yourself, your family, and your community. Notice that most of those values are things that were denied during slavery/Jim Crow/whatever we're going to call what came after. So essentially it's a way to reaffirm that you don't have to be a shitty gangbanger or drugee or languish on some inner-city fast track to prison, by recognizing the power black people and families have to shape their own destinies.
Bootstraps, if you will.
Celebrating being black is reserved for homecoming and summer cookouts.
>>78453695
They knew a rugrats spinoff was going to be shit if it didn't include Angelica or Tommy
But what they didn't know was that a rugrats spinoff was going to be shit no matter what they did
>>78453524
co likes to assume any outside culture in a cartoon is tumblr pandering
>>78453777
except if it's asian, in which case the creators are weeaboos
>>78453548
Christmas: Nigger Edition
>>78453792
thats always true though
>>78453554
>I'm pretty sure there's a reason several holidays from various religions are all centered around winter and the end of the year
W I N T E R S O L S T I C E
Seriously, that's why. All this shit is based around astronomy and the holidays that dem olive-skinned Romans had to make the pasty white heathens (pagans) of Northern Europe forsake in order to convert them.
>>78453401
I been giving these out for 647 years...
>>78453665
>so maybe his hatred of whites rubbed off on me and it's just waiting to kick in
To hoh
>>78453820
>"Hey guys, I know the Saturnalia is coming up, but maybe this year we could not get completely shitfaced on wine and burn down half the town before openly fucking in giant piles on the street."
>"Fuck you, that's the best part of the year!"
>"No but, ummm... shit. If you do, it'll make Baby Jesus cry!"
>"Really? Oh. Can't have that, I guess."
True story.
>>78453889
*top
Hearing descriptions about Kwanzaa makes it sound so shitty, thank god I was born white in the US
So, Kwanzaa is a black racist festivity, which was glorified by some cartoon shows, huh?
Must have become a hit, really.
>inb4 there is no such thing as black racism
because there is.
>>78454022
>feeling the need to stick your white ass into everything even if it's a holiday you already have a much better and more-accommodated replacement for and don't actually give a shit about anyway
youre just making excuses to point out non-existent double standards
>>78454163
Black people can be racist.
>>78454191
ok??
Non-American here,
That sort of stuff makes me that America is a deeply dysfunctional soceity that suffers from severe race issues
Unlike Hanukkah and Christmas you can't just change your race and celebrate Kwanzaa I've only seen it in cartoons to be "culturally diverse"
>>78453963
Don't worry, no actual black people celebrate it anyway.
>>78453143
My question is why did it got brought up so much by 90s cartoons. Made me think it was a huge thing over in America
>>78453725
>Umoja, the name of the nigger club at my school
>unity
I always wondered what the fuck that meant.
>>78452932
Remember when that should would install Banzai Buddy all on its own?
>>78454191
I bet you've wanted to say that for a long time. Go on, anon. You can type 'nigger'. No one's watching.
>>78454206
No shit.
>>78454267
i actually agree but i feel like a lot of the time people bring it up just to try to make black issues about them
>>78454206
Don't worry. Australia, Canada, and Western Europe are next. And it already looks like it will be way worse experience. It will make the American Civil War look a Monty Python skit.
>>78454233
Because retarded white people suffering from undeserved guilt thought the best way to promote racial unity was to sing the praises of a racist black holiday that black people don't even celebrate.
>>78454351
probably because of the LA riots and all sorts of racial tension brought attention to the black communities in a negative light
So people lobbied to introduce a positive african american into media so we didn't just all blacks
and there really weren't that many Kwanzaa specials
>>78454351
i think the reason why its non-inclusive to whites is because it's based in african culture. like do you know how awkward that would be? "thanks for enslaving us guys" lmao
How the fuck has no one posted Charlie Brown Kwanzzaa yet
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CLZguLUf8A
>>78454351
Why do people always bring up 'white guilt'? I find it hard to believe it's a real thing outside a few autistic fringe groups. Most of what people call 'white guilt' just seems to be people going with the general trend of "love and tolerance" that's dominated Western society for the last few decades. I don't see what guilt has to do with any of it. Just seems like another of /pol/'s boogeymen to me.
>>78454206
>Non-American here,
Then get out of here. Being in an American discussion about race and ethnic groups is like gazing into an dark Lovecraftian abyss, it only leads to madness and despair. We're talking about a country where Muslim is a race, Hispanic is a skin color and "I drink male tears" is a feminist statement. Have mercy upon your sanity and flee.
>>78454454
It's mostly an amalgamation of random bullshit culled from other holidays and a few East African themes, while the majority of African slaves were from West Africa. So what little African culture is actually there isn't even the right African culture to be celebrating.
>>78454510
>Most of what people call 'white guilt' just seems to be people going with the general trend of "love and tolerance" that's dominated Western society for the last few decades.
>"love and tolerance"
Is that what you cucks call it?
Most Mexicans see it as you whites wanting to atone for your "sins" by implementing/approving these self destructive policies.
>>78454524
>hispanic is a skin color
...it is, anon
>>78454454
>thanks for enslaving us guys
Isn't that exactly what celebrating African culture is though? I mean, the slave trade was conducted by Africans and Europeans. Modern West Africans (or at least the dominant cultures) are the ones who sold them into slavery.
Hell, even the name Kwanzaa and all the words used in >>78453725 come from the Swahilis, a people who dominated the Indian Ocean slave trade (though neither they nor the people they enslaved have anything to do with black Americans).
>>78454454
We need to dress up Kwanzaa like people did Christmas
It's already non-religious, we just need to lose the pan-african focus
Kwanzaa food that isn't just "weird fruitcake" or "regular southern dishes"
Kwanzaa traditions that are more original than candles and harvest celebration
>>78454631
But it's not.
>>78454486
>lee motherfucking hazelwood
>>78454666
they look p brown to me
>>78454631
How?
My mother is a light skinned Mestizo, my father is a dark skin indigenous Guatemalan. I'm just a one skin tone darker from my mother. Technically by burger standards, we are all Hispanics. How the fuck is our different skin colors count as one skin color? How the fuck is my 100% non-white/black father a Hispanic?
>>78454616
>Most Mexicans see it as you whites wanting to atone for your
It's not all whites. 90% of us couldn't give any less of a shit what some random white asshole did to some random black asshole 200 fucking years ago. Sadly, that remaining 10% is incredibly loud and incredibly lacking in any form of self-awareness or common sense.
>>78454708
yeah ok, youre right
>>78454666
Even hispanics seem to think so.
I'm native american and don't know a word of spanish and they are constantly walking up to me and saying crap I don't understand.
Then they look down and up and me and give me a sour look before walking off when they realize they made a mistake.
>>78454636
yeah i mean i hate talking about skincolor culture cause its all really finnicky and kinda random
calling kwanzaa racist seems pretty over-dramatic though
>>78454612
>It's mostly an amalgamation of random bullshit culled from other holidays and a few East African themes
Or a measured observation of what the black community needed to bring out from within itself in order to be successful.
I can stand a lot of racist bullshit, but the one thing that always gets my goat is when it's implied or stated that we came to a decision without critical thought. That kind of conclusion is often itself reached without much thought, ironically.
>>78454636
>Modern West Africans (or at least the dominant cultures) are the ones who sold them into slavery.
Please stop posting this oversimplification, and/or believing it if you do so unironically.
>though neither they nor the people they enslaved have anything to do with black Americans
Reminds me of Renaissance Europe vs their classical inspiration.
>>78454616
>"love and tolerance"
I put it in quotations for a reason. And why should anyone care what Mexicans think?
I just don't get it. My country (Ireland) was fucked over for centuries by the British. We were starved, murdered, and sold into slavery, and our culture was totally destroyed. I'm encouraged on the internet to hate everything the British did to my country. But the second I criticize anything the British or similar empires did in Africa or India or the Middle East I'm accused of being a white-guilt cuck. The only people who've ever tried to make me feel guilty for being white are /pol/lacks, because being white and not hating all non-whites apparently makes me a race traitor and that's something I should feel guilty about.
>>78454809
Don't worry, anon. Just remind them that they are the descendants of the conquerors they so much hate, and tell them you still gladly welcome them as immigrants to your continent.
>>78454809
Don't get upset my fellow indigenous brethren.
They think I'm Asian but get shocked when I can speak Spanish and Quiche Mayan.
>hurrr I'm native Aztec
>start speaking basic Nahuatl, learned some from my uncle who works for the Mexican government on Indian relationships
>translate it to them in Spanish
>You are a just Chicano scum, kiss my Indian ass white boy
>>78454913
How is it an oversimplification? Black Americans mostly come from West Africa, and were sold into slavery by other West African cultures (mostly Yoruba, Igbo, Akan, and Fon but also a bunch of smaller groups). Obviously most West Africans weren't slave traders, just as most Europeans weren't, but they were still sold into slavery by those cultures so I don't see why they'd want to celebrate them any more than they'd want to celebrate the Portuguese.
It's pretty ridiculous that so many Americans of both races can't just be happy with being American and have to appeal to foreign cultures. Though I guess that's just a vocal minority really.
>>78453110
No, but I'm pretty curious about it.
I really didn't care about Kwanzaa before but seeing it triggers /pol/tards I'll do everything in my power further its cause.
>>78454932
Ehh, you're Irish though... if I know /pol/ a good fourth of them don't even consider you 'white'... just a sort of pasty proto-nigger (three guesses the ethnicity the name 'Tyrone' originated in.)
Personally I think it's a real shame, especially if the Irish as an ethnicity stopped existing as I rather like the pale skin and red hair aesthetic... but those are both recessive traits... and 'Diversity' as a cultural value only seems likely to actual reduce true population diversity in the long run.
>>78454837
>when it's implied or stated that we came to a decision without critical thought
Except there was no "we." There was Robert Everett, a member of the Black Panthers that wanted an anti-white alternative to Christmas and so invented Kwanzaa by cobbling together a bunch of random bullshit culled from other holidays. When it became apparent that nobody gave a shit, he abandoned what little integrity the holiday had in an attempt to commercialize it and make it more easily digestible to a broader audience -but even that didn't work.
.5% of America's population celebrate Kwanzaa, and that number shrinks every year. Most people don't even know what the fuck Kwanzaa is.
Nobody's going to tell you that you can't celebrate it, but nobody's obligated to give a shit, either.
>>78453110
Sure, by a kid in my 3rd or 4th grade class. We had a bunch of holiday decorations and the teacher asked if anybody celebrated Kwanzaa before setting up a kinara(?), so he raised his hand. The class didn't have any black candles, so she asked if a dark purple one was okay, and he said it was fine.
>>78455102
>Obviously most West Africans weren't slave traders
So that took you a step closer to accuracy, but you forgot about the part where the Europeans both created the market for slaves and fomented the inter-tribal rivalries and conflicts that produced the slaves that were to be traded.
>Hey, hey, you're the ones who run your diamond mines like slave camps! It doesn't have anything to do with the market we create or the wars we bankroll and supply.
>It's pretty ridiculous that so many Americans of both races can't just be happy with being American and have to appeal to foreign cultures.
Yes, well, fixing that starts with punching your cousin in the face when he insists that we should go back to Africa. Or, better yet, shouting down an anon when he oogaboogawhatevers a thread that's tangentially about black people.
>>78455102
>It's pretty ridiculous that so many Americans of both races can't just be happy with being American and have to appeal to foreign cultures.
Because purposely inventing 'culture' out of the whole cloth is seen as cheap and artificial in nature... it would be the MacDonald's of culture. Our established local customs and legends are all seen as rural, folksy and 'country' and thus fundamentally unappealing to city folk who want so appear sophisticated, and urbane.
However, thee same sophisticated and urbane people want to also feel 'cultured' so they try to reach way back into their family trees in search of meaning and identity. As america is a nation of (relatively recent) immigrants this means we can usually define a nation of origin in Europe or Asia. Africans are in an odd position because hteres very little good documentation on where each family lines comes from...
Enter Kwanza... a sort of artificial hodgepodge formulated for the 'black hipster' try try and provide them with the same thing white hipsters get from sipping french coffee and drinking wine while listening to old opera on vinyl. It's the same sort of appeal to the past, but in their case it's a connection so obviously tenuous it's actually more depressing than humorous.
>>78455261
>by cobbling together a bunch of random bullshit culled from other holidays
You're doing it again. The values and rituals weren't just thrown together; they were crafted for specific purposes - to encourage reflection on the problems that the black community explicitly and specifically dealt with, and in such a way that would inspire positive and inclusive thought and behavior. Saying that it was "cobbled together" from other holidays is like saying that cognitive behavioral therapy was cobbled together from other mental therapy protocols. No; both were constructed purposefully to address specific concerns.
Also, the "we" was used because I was referring to more than just this one incident.
>>78455335
I don't know what you're getting at. I specifically said that the slave trade was conducted by Africans and Europeans. It was created by shitty Africans, shitty Europeans, and shitty plantation owners, because the course of history is mostly directed by the shittiest people. I'm not trying to excuse anyone.
>>78455261
>but nobody's obligated to give a shit, either.
I don't see anybody here putting a gun to your head.
>>78455514
Because the responsibility balance in your statements are off. Europeans and Americans hold much greater blame for what happened because they were the source of the demand and the means of transportation, rather than just the means of capture. They also manipulated local politics in West Africa to increase the supply.
Accurate appraisal of culpability doesn't end at, "Well, shit, everyone fucked up."
>>78455335
>but you forgot about the part where the Europeans both created the market for slaves and fomented the inter-tribal rivalries and conflicts that produced the slaves that were to be traded.
Complete and total bullshit. African tribes were in the practice of enslaving and selling each other long before Europeans even existed. The Ashanti and Yoruba in particular founded the entire basis of their countries on slavery.
The Imbangala and Nyamwezi's entire cultures were centered around sending out raiding parties to smaller tribes and capturing slaves to sell to larger tribes in the west, as well as to Muslim traders.
Who /his/ here?
>>78455456
>The values and rituals weren't just thrown together; they were crafted for specific purposes
But they weren't crafted at all. Kwanzaa is LITERALLY made of borrowed traditions that were repurposed to suit Mr. Everett's needs.
>Also, the "we" was used because I was referring to more than just this one incident.
We're not talking about other incidents. We're talking about Kwanzaa.
>>78455781
But we're not talking about West Africa's relatively benign form of slavery, which operated more like a caste/European class system and that wasn't tied to family lineage or skin color. We're talking about America's, "Stack 'em in ships, break up the families at port, and, if you're unlucky enough to be sent south of the Florida Keys, work 'em until death because the replacements arrive in 3 months."
These kinds of conversations always turn on the omission of key characterizations. African vs American slavery: They. Were. Not. The. Same.
>>78455966
So I'm going to need you to point out to me where in Christmas tradition self-determination and cooperative economics are emphasized.
>We're not talking about other incidents.
I am. I thought I was pretty explicit in stating that my gripe was with the way that these things TEND to go down (tend; as in, it happens often). Habitual be, senpai.
>>78455613
That doesn't make any sense. Europeans didn't just arrive in some idyllic Africa and force them all to sell each other as slaves. They arrived at the coasts and bought slaves where they found them for sale. They kept buying slaves, so African rulers and merchants kept selling them. When they ran out of slaves to sell, they captured more. The more they sold, the richer and more powerful they got, and the more slaves they could capture. Eventually the whole West African coast became dominated by slave-raiding. Europeans didn't force them, though they did encourage it. Africans weren't just mindless drones forced to obey the laws of supply and demand. They (or at least most of their ruling classes) made conscious decisions to wage wars, capture slaves, and sell them off to Europeans. Europeans weren't diabolical geniuses manipulating Africans economies, most of them were just a bunch of uneducated assholes out to make some easy money, but they also made the conscious decisions to buy slaves in bulk, treat them like shit, and sell them to plantation owners who made the decision to work them to death like cattle. They were all shitty people doing shitty things, allowed to do what they did because of the shitty societies they lived in which were shaped largely by shitty people. The average European and the average African can't be blamed for what happened, but the shitty people in both societies can be.
If you want an "accurate appraisal of culpability", blame every person involved in the process who made the decision to be a piece of shit for their own gain, regardless of the society they came from.
>>78456078
And yet those African slavers still took the money, didn't they? Nobody's coming out of this smelling like roses, chief.
Europeans aren't at fault for slavery. Greed is.
I celebrate Festivus. It's a holiday for the rest of us.
>>78456186
>most of them were just a bunch of uneducated assholes out to make some easy money
This is the kind of line that sneaks in and attempts to erase culpability. No, actually, they knew exactly what they were doing: they sold weapons to certain sides of conflicts in order to keep them going. They sent their own raid parties out. They built up infrastructure that not only increased the throughput, but also signaled that the trade was meant to be a long-term venture. They created the environment for the slave trade as we know it to exist, and they sent every signal that they would have continued, even if the Africans had decided to stop. In fact, some would even say that they did, and called it "colonialism."
I give on caveat - one - to Europeans and Americans vis a vis the slave trade, and that is that the wealth that it brought to any one country was necessary to maintain their own security, economic and otherwise, against other European countries. But the fact remains: if they had all decided at the outset that it was inhumane to engage in the practice, then it wouldn't have happened, and the world wouldn't have been much worse off for it - maybe slower technological advancement until industrialization, but not much slower.
I don't say this to be an asshole contrarian; accepting the fact of Europe's massively overwhelming culpability in the slave trade is part and parcel of keying your mind into the idea that a problem can be global but that certain parties have more of a say - more responsibility - in how things play out.
This is important because every major US East Coast city had its warmest Christmas on record yesterday. Happy Kwanzaa, and hopefully we don't have to start celebrating the ACTUAL harvest around this time every year.
>>78456249
European greed. Very specifically, European greed.
>>78456592
Yeah yeah, whatever you say, Mr. Everett. Europeans are Satan, African slavers are beautiful perfect angels.
Say, have you already picked out the white women you're going to abduct this year? What do you plan on beating them with? Don't use the toaster again, that's old hat.
>>78452932
>People honestly think that Kwanzaa is a real holiday.
>Not just a made up BS "holiday" by a Black supremacist as a substitute for the "slave" holiday of Christmas.
Why are people this stupid?
>>78456566
What are you saying? You're just going on about how horrible European slave traders were, which is something only a retard would deny. How does that take any blame from Africans? They built entire kingdoms and empires based entirely on the production of slaves. The slaves were the victims here, not the scum who built these empires. If some Fon monarch decides to massacre a few villages and sell off the survivors in exchange for some cheap European booze, how is he not to blame for that?
The fact is, everyone involved is to blame. It doesn't matter 'who started it'. They were all shit. If African kings had decided to stop selling slaves and focus of improving their kingdoms, but Europeans forced them to keep selling to them, then yeah you could just blame Europeans. That didn't happen. Shitty Europeans collaborated with shitty Africans to do shitty things to innocent people. It was shit. That's it.
>if they had all decided at the outset that it was inhumane to engage in the practice, then it wouldn't have happened
And if Africans hadn't decided to capture and sell millions of slaves it wouldn't have happened either.
>>78456949
>It's not a real holiday, it was just made up by somebody in the past.
What makes a holiday "real"? Don't say "God told us to celebrate it" or I swear to god I'm going to buy an actual fedora to tip at you.
>>78453725
>Ujima (Collective Work and Responsibility)
There's your problem
>>78453820
Every fucking culture and religion in the history of humanity has had major festivals/celebrations centered around the winter solstice.
Because that's when people have lots of food, no work to do, it's too cold to go out and do a lot of outdoorsy stuff, and there's less sunlight than any other time of the year.
All of which combines to have people throwing parties/festivals/celebrations with friends and family more this one time in the year than any other.
Nothing too mystical about it.
>>78457188
Not being made up by a racist is a solid first step.
After that, "becoming nationally recognized and legitimate" and "being celebrated by more than .5% of the population" are both good goals to aim for.
Have you nappy headed wombats watched the Fat Albert special?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDDcmKDcX8k
>>78457188
God didn't order us to celebrate it, anon, of course not, we have free will. He simply requests us to glorify Him, so we decided to celebrate His birthday. It's still a divinely inspired holiday.
>>78457415
Which God? Apollo, Ra, Marduk, and a bunch of other divine beings were all born on December 25th.
>>78456566
That also erases the existence of several centuries of Barbary State slavery against Europeans which not only was contemporaneous with the African slave trade and massive in scale.
>>78457457
The only true God, anon, who created the heavens and the stars. Of course his Son wasn't born on the 25th, only the filthiest of Protestants believe that. It's just a nice time of the year to celebrate it. The holiday is divinely inspired, not the date.
>>78457188
>What makes a holiday "real"?
Having its own traditions that developed on their own rather than just being made up one day by some asshole. Christmas traditions go back hundreds of years, and even if Christmas has changed a lot over time, those changes (like commercialization and secularization) were part of a slow development following general changes in Western society, rather than just being decided by one guy who didn't like way way things were. Kwanzaa on the other hand was just made up one day. It didn't grow out of anything, it has no real traditions, it's not a part of any culture. It has no history and no place in society.
>>78457463
Not him, but that really has nothing to do with anything. North Africans are not West Africans.
And the scale was nothing in comparison to the Atlantic trade.
>>78457705
Kwanzaa is the Elf on a Shelf of Holidays.
There's a page of Sonichu for every occasion.
>>78457188
Not being founded by a racial supremacist, for one. For two, having long-standing cultural and/or religious reasons and an actual sense of faith attached to it. In other words: everything that Kwanzaa doesn't have.
given that the media is trying to make it a real holliday it pretty much is a real holliday
that's just how culture works these days
yuck
>>78453234
>When I was little I heard that Kwanzaa has more presents
I read that gifts that are exchanged on Kwanzaa are usually supposed to have artistic or educational value, so the notion of receiving more presents on Kwanzaa is probably less than thrilling if you're a little kid.
>>78457822
Ah, good ol' Chris...
So to add to discussion: African slave trade was mostly dominated by Arabs
>>78457457
Ra was born in July.
Fuck off, Zeitgeist is a load of bullshit.
At least you didn't claim Horus, that's admirable.
>>78452956
That's Festivus
This was a weird episode, wasn't it? I don't think Sam Jackson even sounded like himself.
>>78453110
To meet a person they have to exist first.
>>78456949
>>78457333
>>78457861
>having their own thing makes them racists!!1
stop it. you clearly dont want to celebrate it anyway
>>78459809
The founder of Kwanzaa was literally a racist.
>>78452977
Is any holiday REALLY real? Think about it.
>>78453110
Actually, my office had a Kwanzaa party last year.
Obviously, it was more Kwanzaa themed than actual Kwanzaa, and I think they only did it to change things up. But the underlying values are good enough and I think I'd enjoy doing it in real life if I had anyone to do it with.
>>78459849
I'm pretty sure putting any race above another is racist.
>>78453725
god those names seem so similar to college draft picks
>>78454267
don't tempt me
>>78460399
How Do We Know If Christmas Is Real If Santa Isn't Real?
>>78452977
Wasn't Kwanzaa the holiday invented by some nigerian ex-convict?
>>78460580
more likeuniversity applicants
>>78453075
new year aint real either
we basically just picked a date
also shouldn't it logically be at the start of spring?
captcha asked me to type out the text, which it has not done in a long time
>>78452932
And a very happy Kwanzaa to you, too!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDDcmKDcX8k
>>78453476
bullshit post pics of your chocolatey skin with the date to prove it
>>78453616
well why would white people want kwanzaa
we have christmas and no offense but christmas is fucking tite
>>78460858
"In 1971, Karenga (creator of Kwanzaa) was sentenced to one to ten years in prison on counts of felonious assault and false imprisonment. One of the victims gave testimony of how Karenga and other men tortured her and another woman. The woman described having been stripped and beaten with an electrical cord. Karenga's estranged wife, Brenda Lorraine Karenga, testified that she sat on the other woman’s stomach while another man forced water into her mouth through a hose."
A May 14, 1971, article in the Los Angeles Times described the testimony of one of the women:
"Deborah Jones, who once was given the Swahili title of an African queen, said she and Gail Davis were whipped with an electrical cord and beaten with a karate baton after being ordered to remove their clothes. She testified that a hot soldering iron was placed in Miss Davis' mouth and placed against Miss Davis' face and that one of her own big toes was tightened in a vise. Karenga, head of US, also put detergent and running hoses in their mouths, she said. They also were hit on the heads with toasters."
>>78453695
Proud Family was full of racism and statist messages. "Don't work hard Oscar, just look at the nice car the lazy groovy asshole has and he didn't work for it." Also Homless Kwanzaa mooch ghosts were a riot.
>>78461071
Gotta love that holiday spirit. Time to break out the Kwanzaa toaster.
>>78461071
Happy holidays.
>>78461071
maybe we should start celebrating kwanzaa
>>78461085
it was just a pretty shit show all aroundGood milf tho
>>78461172
>this image
yes
Yes
YES
A THOUSAND TIMES YES
>>78461071
>Karate Batons
Where did they get Tonfus?
>>78461201
Indeed both her and the Hispanic across the street,
>>78461071
>Karenga, head of US
I heard the US was shitty, but man...
Never going to america if the head of the place gets away with this sort of thing.
>>78461071
white man made them do it
good boy
dindu nuffin
courts was racist
>>78461425
Thanks Obama
>>78461071
What interesting holiday traditions
>>78460797
>Santa Isn't Real
WAT U SAY?
>>78452932
And a Tip Top Tet to you.
>>78452932
>we passively-aggressively and in the spirit of the Muslim brotherhood hate white people: the holiday.
ya'll kwanzaa mother fuckers need to take your dashiki wearing, couscous eating asses to africa and just fuck off.
>>78453725
>Notice that most of those values are things that were denied during slavery/Jim Crow/whatever we're going to call what came after.
But things like black owned businesses and community unity where at a all time high under Jim Crow because blacks couldn't use white establishments in many cases.
As soon as segregation ended all that shit went out the window because black owned businesses were not able to compete with white owned stores on a open market and communities eroded as people moved to seek better employment elsewhere, the family unit dissolved later on because other reason creating fatherless homes and misguided children leading to increase in crime and poverty.
I like the idea of a black holiday. Separate but equal.
>>78455335
>, but you forgot about the part where the Europeans both created the market for slaves
As opposed to what those people would do if there was no demand which is simply executing the ones they didn't need.
Africa still has slavery in many places.
>>78454267
Are you crying behind your reaction image?
>>78456078
>But we're not talking about West Africa's relatively benign form of slavery
>Relativley benign
Dumbass they exterminated entire groups of people off the face of the earth and only kept a few as slaves either for themselves or to sell elsewhere but the primary purpose of this practice was genocide or enemy cultures.
>>78453908
X-mas comes from the germanic/scandinavian celebration of Yule
Saturnalia took place at a different part of the year.
>>78457822
>Happy Kwanza Brother
>>78454510
When people talk about white guilt they are not talking about peace on earth and good will towards men they are talking about shit like this.
Modern people with either very little or no connection to past atrocities flagellating themselves as penance for the perceived sins of their fathers endlessly for a demographic that will continue to hate them anyway.
It's not righting wrongs it's just pathetic self hatred and does no good for anyone.
>>78453616
> apparently nobody wants to be black
More like if anyone tried, they'd be criticized for blackface.
>>78464583
Hakuna matata
>>78455187
>if I know /pol/ a good fourth of them don't even consider you 'white
/pol/ doesn't think anyone is white though
>Irish, scots and welsh aren't whites because they are celts aka euroniggers
>slavs aren't whites or even human
>all spanish and porteguese people are not white by virtue of the existence of mexico and south american colonies making them all native americans by association
>germanics aren't white because they destroyed rome
>finish aren't white because they are all of 100% mongolian ancestry
>other scandis aren't white because swedens politically correct agenda has revoked white status from all of scandinavia
>mediterraneans are all moors
>turks,armenians and such are all kebab based on location
>saxons aren't white because they worship the jew of the cross
>Americans are all mongrels
According to /pol/ nobody is white.
>>78456186
>who made the decision to work them to death like cattle.
Slaves as a rule were not "worked to death". Slaves were expensive.
You're talking about a expense that was as costly back then as a Ferrari would be today slaves were treated well but they were not put into positions that would kill them lightly either.
>>78464694
forget it anon, white guilt has entered the fray
you cannot win this one with logic and reason.
>>78452932
fuck off nigger
>>78454163
>>78454191
>>78454267
the white race is superior niggers are subhumans
>>78453110
yeah, but I didn't know he celebrated Kwanzaa until yesterday
>>78465119
You won't be so pompous when Planet of the Apes becomes a reality, you stupid cracker.
>>78453449
>If you want to complain about Kwanzaa being over-marketed, fine (even though it really isn't)
Considering I'm from South America and nobody here celebrates Kwanzaa and I still learned about it when I was a little kid through a bunch of American cartoons and TV shows I'd say it is, or at least was, over marketed.
>>78453402
All of them white and living in Vermont
>>78459809
when white people want to have their own thing they always get accused of being racist, so fuck right off
>>78464642
All the people I know who go to /pol/ are smelly south americans and one indian guy
>>78465688
you have billions of things, and then when someone tries to have a thing of their own you throw a tantrum because you weren't invited
>>78453725
You left one out:JUMANJI
>>78465664
