Co, I read all of Frank Miller's Daredevil this weekend.
Holy fucking shit, that was incredible. Except for The Man Without Fear Mini, this was incredible. It's been years since I read DKR but I can't imagine it being anywhere near as profound and stunning as Born Again.
Any thoughts on this run?
>>77644706
its great. best cap quote by far came out of it.
>>77644706
>Except for The Man Without Fear
That was far from the strongest part, but I still thought it was like 8/10 minimum.
>>77644706
>Any thoughts on this run?
Best "serious" cape run of all time. Born Again is the peak, but just in generally it was better than any other attempt at a serious portrayal of superheroes and probably the best thing Marvel ever published.
>>77644706
Born Again is fucking incredible and I'm glad you enjoyed it. It's just a fantastic piece of comic-bookery, well worth reading at any point.
>>77644706
Flawless. Frank Miller had the right combination of deep drama, great action, captivating art and freaking great sense of humor. This run inspired TMNT, a powerhouse of its own.
Often overlooked, my favorite part was Melvin Potter's rehabilitation. He freaking rehabilitated a villain, who has done that? Spider-man died and he still didn't rehabilitate Dock Ock.
Oh, and there's Kingpin and Bullseye gay shit who cares about.
And, echxuse me, what the fuck did you just say?
>Except for The Man Without Fear Mini, this was incredible.
I'll give you that, it's not Born Again. But that's like getting a bronze in the Olympics.
>>77646433
>He freaking rehabilitated a villain, who has done that?
*cough* Magneto *cough*
>>77646576
He's still a filthy mutie, so he's still a villain.
>>77646607
fair enough.
>>77646224
>lent it to one of my friends two years ago
>he moved away
>none of my contacts for him work anymore
>will never get my comic back
I hope he's enjoying it at least.
>>77646200
>>77646224
Born Again was the perfect story up until after his "resurrection".
Then it becomes full blown retarded by introducing shitty Vietnam metaphors, an idiot Captain America, and suddenly this edgelord villain Nuke who is completely incongruous with the storyline.
It's like at first Miller set out to tell this beautiful story dealing with conviction, faith, and renewal, but at the last minute couldn't help but write in another surface-level criticism of the government.
>>77646774
>>77646576
Wasn't Magneto still a villain when Gladiator stopped being one?
>>77646774
I don't think you understand what kind of victory Matt has achieved over Kingpin.
>>77646759
>gave a copy to my nephew
>the little shit still hasn't read it
It's amazing. and don't forget to credit Mazz too. Born Again is just as much him
>>77646774
>I am actually retarded
>>77651515
This. Miller with Mazz is so much better than Miller without. See Born Again and Year One vs The Dark Knight Strikes Back and Holy Terror..
>>77651674
>Born Again and Year One vs The Dark Knight Strikes Back and Holy Terror
That's not really fair comparison, both TDKSA and Holy Terror are post-9/11 crazy Miller. Ronin and TDKR are still great and don't have Mazz
>>77651751
From what I understand it was more his divorce that caused poor Miller to have a breakdown. His post 9/11 behaviour is a symptom of that not a cause.
>>77652217
The Lucas effect. Varley really doesn't get the props she should
>>77652217
I don't really know much about his personal life and what caused his post 9/11 behavior but whatever it was happened around that time and there's a reasonably clear distinction between work done before and after 2000.
Holy Terror was 9/11 as fuck though
Yup OP, one of the most intense, yet at the same time subtle stories ever told in comics. Miller in the 80s was amazing.
>>77653049
>Miller in the 80s
Is there a creator with a better run than that? Like probably Lee/Kirby creating the Marvel U?
>>77653088
Gaiman when writing Sandman? Robinson when doing Starman? Grant Morrison Doom Patrol? Peter Milligan Shade?
Also, I can think of a few manga creators at this level, but even then it's a narrow list.
>>77654723
Ostrander doing Spectre and Suicide Squad.
>>77646168
>That was far from the strongest part
Agreed, I'm one of the few people that like it more than Born Again
>>77654831
OP here. I think it has some lovely moments but that Miller goes back and changes too much of what was perfect. If the entire comic has been like the scene where Matt and Elektra go skiing and he flips in front of her I'd have loved it just as much.
>>77654914
I liked how he handled Matt and Elektra in MWF more than the origin in his original run
Elektra is my Daredevil OTP
>>77654723
>>77654791
Yeah but as good as those were I don't think any changed the game like DKR/Daredevil. Maybe Sandman? I mean shit even the overlooked Miller stuff is like Elektra Assassinthis is a dumb argument but it's better than just bump
has marvel reprinted the DD companion omnibus? i was so mad when the main one didn't have Born Again
>>77655002
I mean, Elektra's pretty great, but I don't see what there was to gain by having her be insane from the start.
>>77655311
I have to still read Elektra: Assassin. Is it as insane as I've heard?
I'd argue that all the runs I mentioned and the Ostrander ones are just as good, but in different ways. Born Again though...have there been any individual arcs as good as that? I've seen series as a whole as good and even single issues as good, but no six issue sequence as good as that.
I could be reading the wrong things though.
>>77655313
I read that as her being wild not insane
>>77655444
She mentions hearing voices in her head.\Since there's not a ton of mystical elements, there's kind of one conclusion. I could have misread MIller's intent with that, though.
>>77649779
I've never read his Daredevil run but google makes it look like Miller beat Claremont to the punch by about a year. Given that Claremont and Miller were collaborators on the Wolverine mini there is probably some influence.
>>77655543
I need to read that, too.
Has there ever been a crossover of Daredevil, Hawkeye and Black Bolt, titled "No Evil"?
>>77644706
>profound and stunning as Born Again.
Oh you like born again do ya?
Do you like snarky dirivitaive Law&Order SVU style imitations of it?
then read any of Bendis arcs.
All jokes aside I thought "Last rites" -the followup to the events of Born Again- was pretty good. Lee Weeks does some spectacular art on it. he does a good job of aping that Mazz style and brings a great sense of movement to the book that's all his own.
>>77660714
I actually liked End of Days a lot. How much do I deserve to be mocked for that?
>>77644706
DKR was fucking profound, so was Year one. Miller's DD run is great, start to finish. Most of Miller's art is top notch, and his writing still produces the goods after this. Sin City, Rusty, Martha Washington, Hard Boiled. Even his Spawn or All Star stuff is fun.
>>77646576
who became evil again.
