which movie was better? the winter soldier or civil war? not including the first avenger since it had a different director.
>>83972083
I loved all 3 cap movies. If I had to pick one however, I'd go with Winter Soldier just for its overall quality and its ability through storytelling to hammer home the fact that Cap is a badass. Well, that and it did leaps and bounds for his character development.
First Avenger was incredibly amazing for taking a so-so character with an ancient hokey origin story and somehow making it WORK on the big screen. The challenge of making that happen was nothing short of harsh. Civil War was fun as hell but felt more like a springboard film for the rest of the characters (because it was) rather than a film squarely centered on the title character.
I feel he should have been more brutal I wish they made him like his ultimate counter part
>>83972083
Winter Soldier > Civil War > / = The First Avenger
Caps movies were among my favorite MCU movies.
I don't want to keep beating up Man of Steel and Batman v Superman, but if you look at them and then look at the Captain America movies you're sort of in awe. Cap and Supes aren't the same character, but they occupy similar roles in their respective universes. They're the moral centers and the ideological cores. If you're not on their side in a fight, you're on the wrong side, period.
So it's amazing to me that Marvel, which on the surface is supposed to be the more cynical and commercial and marketed movie universe, manages to actually translate that aspect of Cap to the screen where DC can't with Superman. Captain America IS the moral center of the MCU. Cap's sense of right and wrong is the moral, ideological backbone of those movies. This comes out strong in Winter Soldier and really gets hammered home in Civil War. They managed to make him moral, upright, and just, and they manage to take all this and make it cool.
As a Cap fan, I really, deeply appreciate that. I love that they didn't fuck him up. It means a lot to me.
Also, to answer the OP's question, while I do deeply love Civil War, Winter Soldier wins the day. It's tense, it had me on the edge of my seat. It has Robert Redford not phoning it in. And best of all, it has Captain America giving a speech about freedom. It's the best.
>>83973968
But Cap isn't ALWAYS right, even he admits it at the end of Civil War. Tony was blindsided by a one-two punch of finding out his parents were murdered, and finding out they were murdered by the Winter Soldier at the same moment. It's possible he wouldn't have reacted as severely if he'd know they were murdered by Hydra initially. Cap admits he was wrong and selfish to not tell him sooner.
Course that kinda made me like Cap more, being able to admit he was at fault.
>>83972083
TWS was a better Cap movie, Civil War was the best Avengers movie.
Would like if they used the original plans for Cap 3 for a future Cap movie, with Evans, or Buckycap or whatever.
>>83974041
I don't meant to say he's always right in every decision he makes, but his principles are rock-solid. That's key to Cap, and they nailed it.
Civil War is the better Avengers movie (I think tied with the original)
Winter Soldier is the better Cap movie.
I loved Civil War, but I still feel like it didn't focus on Cap enough. Iron Man felt like the main character since it had him interacting with a wider variety of the cast and in different settings. Cap felt really isolated in his own movie. So I prefer Winter Soldier overall.
>>83974480
Well, they had to work on Iron Man to stop from falling into the error of comic Civil War of making him a mustache-twisting villain since he has always been a dick in all the movies.
>>83974567
Honestly I think they overcorrected. They already helped Stark out a lot by not having him clone Thor or hire villains to hunt down heroes, and the prison thing was a lot tamer and more of Ross's fault than his own. But the MIT + flashback scene, bonding with Peter, seeing his parents' death put a heavy focus on him, when most of Steve's scenes were action focused. Even in the moments that could have been used for him to emote more and show the depth of his motivations, they were cut incredibly short as noted by even Chris Evans.
>>83974041
His ideals are right, but his actions are more open to question.
> He's right that Bucky was brainwashed and should not be killed/punished for actions.
> He's right that Wanda should not be used as a scapegoat because she is an immigrant.
Cap's principled stubbornness is admirable but you can argue that Tony's pragmatism may have yielded better results.
But, either way, the Avengers were fucked, and there was nothing Steve or Tony could do to stop the team collapsing.
>>83974660
I think the scenes that Cap DID get were pretty powerful. He held his own in every single discussion with Stark about the Accords.
The trouble was that Cap had a lot of shit to do. He had to fight for the anti-reg side AND save Bucky AND make sure that Zemo didn't get control of the super soldiers (or so he thought). Cap was ultimately pulled in multiple directions, and on top of all that he was still dealing with Peggy dying. I think he comes out well, all things considered.
I honestly don't get the fuss about Winter Soldier, I really don't remember anything about it other than Bucky looking cool. Just another Marvel flick in my eyes.
Civil War was a load of fun, its themes were powerful and consistent across a wealth of characters and plotlines, and it had really engrossing atmosphere in those flashbacks which isn't something you really get in Marvel movies.
Winter Soldier > Civil War >>> First Avenger > most other movies in the MCU
IMO Winter Soldier is the best single film in the entire MCU.
Civil War is a more flawed film, but it's still way better than it has any right to be which makes it a greater accomplishment relative to The Winter Soldier.
The First Avenger started excellently but had a weak last third, making it just good as opposed to exceptional.
The real question is where will the porn parody rate when it comes out in a few days?
>>83975977
It's going to be the pornkino we deserve.
>>83976053
The Cap actor looks strangely like Ryan Reynolds.
>>83975977
Tumblr's going to be all over this.
>>83972083
Cap 2 since it felt more conclusive to me but Cap 3 was pretty swanky as well. Better than the Avengers movies.
and like others have said here the Cap films were my favorite MCU films by far.
>>83975977
Huh, didn't know they made a Cap parody too.Neat.
>>83972083
Well Winter Solider was good and Civil War was shit so....
>>83974041
He seemed completely heartbroken the second he realized Cap knew, so much that he was actually fucking twitching.
I felt horrible for Stark at that second, and I was hardcore Team Cap. I was still rooting for Steve, but in a way, I wanted Stark to get a some good hardy licks in. I kind of wanted Steve to limp away from that fight for that shit. That's not the kind of thing you hide from the guy that was essentially the Avenger's sugar daddy when S.H.I.E.L.D. collapsed.
>>83974151
Really? I felt TWS was more of a SHIELD movie with Cap on the side.
Only TFA was truly a Cap movie, even if I enjoyed the other two more.
>>83976523
>>83974041
He was wrong about not telling him but at the same time he and Tony aren't exactly buddies and he was going to open a wound on Tony without providing any proof of his claim.
Granted Tony would have believed him and investigated the whole thing right away.
But yeah he should have told him and he acknowledged that although I still don't think Steve deserves to be punished for not doing so.
>>83972083
Civil War was better.
>>83976723
>He was wrong about not telling him but at the same time he and Tony aren't exactly buddies
Aside from the times they've quarrelled onscreen, they're generally pretty amicable, and Tony was the one that provided for him and everyone else when there was no one else to turn to. They may butt heads at times, but he DOES respect Stark, and Stark, whether he admits it or not, respects that Cap is every inch the man Howard described to him, and on some level, he wants Steve's approval, because it's the closest thing to the approval he craved from his father.
Also, Stark confiding in Rogers that he doesn't want to stop being Iron Man actually made him probably the one person on the team he can relate to on a deeper level than simply war buddies; Steve doesn't want the Avengers to run out of things to fight because the fighting is the one thing that gives him a place in the world. Without it, he has no idea what he'd do. It's the "dark side" that he mentioned to Stark in Age of Ultron, one Ultron himself alluded to, and once Stark mentioned that the Ultron Program was meant to put an end to the fighting, he became visibly angry.
In Civil War, Tony tells Steve that in spite of his promise to Pepper, he never stopped donning the suit because the truth is he doesn't want to stop. Iron Man is what he is now, and he doesn't know how to turn that off. Steve knows that feeling, and it's a state of mind that neither of them are proud of. Steve's silent reaction to Tony's confession there was a nice touch. The Avengers are their family now, and neither wants that to end.
So when Stark realized that the man who his father built up to be such a paragon of virtue and courage hid the truth about him and his wife's death from him, it's understandable that he went apeshit.
>and he was going to open a wound on Tony without providing any proof of his claim.
He had the Winter Soldier's file. Presumably, it detailed the assassination of the Stark family.
>>83976301
They've made several, including an earlier gay one (pic related obviously isn't it, I think it was called something like Captain Americock).
>>83978203
It was Captain Americock: The Twink Avenger
Twinks are shit, glad men.com went for the beefy porn parody.
>>83978237
>Red Skullfuck
>>83973798
>I'd go with Winter Soldier just for its overall quality and its ability through storytelling to hammer home the fact that Cap is a badass. Well, that and it did leaps and bounds for his character development
Did we watch the same movie? The whole point was he didn't change at all. He was the same goody two-shoes throughout the entire film. None of his world notions or ideals were shaken or changed in the slightest. In fact that was actually a major fucking theme of the movie, that although the world and its ideals may change, Cap will always have strong American values of liberty and justice, etc. How did you not get this? What the actual fuck?
>>83973968
>yfw they inevitably remake Iron Giant and he says "I AM CAPTAIN AMERICA" at the end instead
>>83972083
Winter Soldier was like a simple dive. One flip, zero splash.
Civil War was one of those hard as shit dives, with twists and turns and splits. It had a bit of splash at the end, but it was more impressive.
So it's two different kinds of quality, really. Civil War may not be as tight as TWS, but it managed to pull off like 10 movie-miracles alone.
Both are better than the Avengers' cannonball, Ultron's flat-splat, and BvS's jump into the concrete.
>>83972083
I give the edge to Winter Soldier. The fact is, it was a much more tightly made plot, allowing for lots of development.
Civil War, by design, had to do a lot in only so little time. Now, that being said, I think the Russos did the best job possible. There is nothing wrong with Civil War, it just can't beat TWS at a conceptual level.
Cap 1 is also fantastic. The best of the origin movies.
Civil War because it has the best written villain in the MCU.
I mean, who wouldn't find sad all the shit that has happened toTony?
>>83976189
>>83975977
> no metal arm
> not even grey paint
axel braun is the only porno comic parody director who respects MUH SOURCE MATERIAL
I liked Civil War more, because of the non-cap cast.
Overall, I think First Avenger was the best one.
>>83978751
>no metal arm fisting
Dropped.
Honestly though, what I hate the most in these porn parodies is when they ditch the costumes in the middle of the scene.What's the fucking point then?
Winter Soldier held together better. It was tight action thriller.
Civil Wars was all over the place. It was more like Avengers 3 and I'm not a big fan of Avengers.
>>83976951
It didn't. The file.
>>83973918
>were
What changed?
>>83978875
Do you ever feel that maybe you've put way too much effort into disliking the Avengers movies?
Has it gotten you laid?
Have you gotten more friends since you've started shit-talking them?
>>83978548
I mostly agree with this.
I don't think Cap 1 is the best origin movie (I give that to Iron Man), and I'd also note that I think the Russos kind of struggle a bit with the super-powerful. For example, the airport scene. Vision is just, what, floating around like an idiot for 90% of the fight? Wanda doesn't use half of what she could do, not even to kill, just to let them all get away (and that explosion to set off the plot, why send them straight up rather than a diagonal for midair explosion?). I'm glad Thor and Hulk weren't around in-universe, I'm not sure how the fight would have done dealing with those two as well.
Compare to Winter Soldier, where most are "human" in some sense, but as a result they can get some fucking amazing scenes when it comes down to a fight.
But yeah, Winter Soldier is just more tightly plotted, better-choreographed when needed, better-scripted, and just overall better.
>>83972083
TWS is a better Cap movie. CW is a better Avengers movie.
The First Avenger would have been my dream movie if Cap actually fought Nazis and they played up the historical aspect.
>>83978926
That's just my preference, man, what the hell? I don't like a movie because I find 10 superheroes in one room to be a bit too many, so I like Winter Soldier better. Why are you so aggressive?
>>83978959
I think they replaced Vision's part in the fight with Spider-man.
Then they lucked out on having him say at the beginning that he doesn't want people afraid of him, so not actually seeing him fight works for his character. But that was lucky.
In a movie with less happening, it would be more jarring, but this way, it was just one ball on the ground, with like 20 still in the air.
>>83978926
Someone forgot his pills. Chill dude, this ain't /tv/ or /pol/.
Winter Soldier is great, but it's kinda overrated. It is not really that great when compared to the Bourne Trilogy, let alone something like Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy or Casino Royale. All of this is my opinion, of course.
>>83978994
>still in the air
Just like Vision.
>>83976301
During filming of TFA they made apparently did "porn parody" style scenes during breaks according to Cooper and Atwell.
>>83979008
Because Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy is clearly the appropriate thing to compare to the Winter Soldier. You may as well say compare Captain America to Saving Private Ryan.
The Bourne comparisons are totally fair though.
>>83976951
>Steve doesn't want the Avengers to run out of things to fight because the fighting is the one thing that gives him a place in the world. Without it, he has no idea what he'd do.
This is super false.
>>83979008
Why do people always compare TWS to movies that have nothing to do with superheroes?
"Winter Soldier is overrated, it's not as good as Citizen Kane". Yeah, no shit. It's a great superhero movie and a fine action movie, nothing more or less.
I feel that Civil War raises a question that it can't really properly answer because superheoric tropes do not really hold against examination from this angle.
Superheroes are all about doing what's right in spite of silly government and its laws and due process and other silly things evildoers take advantage of. It's a fantasy of benevolent autocracy. But it only works as long as you don't have to think about it too much.
>>83972083
only thing I didn't like about Civil War was how they burned Iron Man/Tony Stark as a character in them
I don't think we'll be seeing much of either in any upcoming MCU movie
>>83979057
>Because Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy is clearly the appropriate thing to compare to the Winter Soldier.
That's a comparison that a lot of the media was making. Of course, it's completely fucking absurd, but the angle was that Winter Soldier was somehow intelligent.
>>83979149
>how they burned Iron Man/Tony Stark as a character in them
This was probably the best Iron Man's been since his first movie. I actually gave a shit about his character this time, since in the last years he's only been the annoying quip machine.
>>83979057
I don't think comparing a spy movie to another spy movie is unfair.
>>83975530
100% agree
>>83979149
Stark can go fuck himself
>>83979184
It's not a spy movie.
It's a superhero action movie with spy/conspiracy thriller elements. Do you think Ant-Man is a heist movie? It's a superhero action comedy with heist elements.
>>83979184
The genre is absurdly broad. Goldeneye is a great film and you would gain nothing from comparing it to Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy. They have basically nothing in common.
>>83979171
>but the angle was that Winter Soldier was somehow intelligent
Does anybody ITT agree with this sentiment?
>>83979184
The Winter Soldier was an action movie that used SHIELD spy shit as a backdrop. Kind of like some of the bond movies.
>>83979204
Well, with emphasis on somewhat.
It raised a more topical question and discussed it more thorough then other capes did.
>>83979204
It was somehow intelligent for the MCU, yes. It took itself more seriously than the usual comedies they make.
It's one of those superhero movies you can recommend to someone who doesn't necessarily like superhero movies. Some of my friends don't like capeshit, but they did enjoy Nolan trilogy and TWS because they were more "grounded", in their words.
>>83979204
It's probably the best attempt at an intelligent cape movie. It didn't try very hard, but films that tried harder have failed.
>>83979181
>This was probably the best Iron Man's been since his first movie.
Oh I absolutely agree, but the way they made the entire movie end with Tony visiting the prison and him sitting alone and beaten up in the office it gave me the feeling that Marvel is done with him and his character for nowsecretly I'm hoping for a redemption movie
>>83979192
>Stark can go fuck himself
No need, he gets more pussy than you will in your entire lifetime
The first half of the First Avenger is the only cap story worth a damn so far in MCU. It had a perfect tone, it was well directed, it explored the history of the character in both a conventional and a meta way and it was really fun.
Everything after that was horribly overrated. Last half of FA was just horrible, tensionless story telling. WS was a "spy movie" for people who like how "spy movie" sounds but don't have a fucking clue what it means, and CW was just characters awkwardly setting up a fight scene which, when it finally turned up, was itself an awkward tonal shift.
>>83979335
The most important thing is that you hate what other people like, and that makes you special.
>>83979468
>The most important thing is that you hate what other people like, and that makes you special.
/co/ and /tv/ in a nutshell
>>83979468
Cape movies are fun because you get to see established characters/stories on the big screen. However, most are not good movies by movie standards and most people with triple digit IQs can figure that out.
>>83979335
This man speaks the truth, to a degree.
>>83979335
>>83979663
Oh boy I love generic war stories that disrespect soldiers who actually fucking train.
At least the second half was entertaining
>>83976951
>He had the Winter Soldier's file. Presumably, it detailed the assassination of the Stark family.
It didn't, when Tony directly asked him after they saw the video, Steve said "I knew it was Hydra but I didn't know it was him.[Bucky]
In all reality, Cap WAS protecting himself more than Tony. If he'd told Tony, then he'd have been able to work through a great deal of the anger long before he ever discovered it was The Winter Soldier that did it. He also wouldn't have had the added stress of Cap having kept secrets from him.
It's highly likely that Tony might've suspected The Winter Soldier could've had a hand in his parents murder before he ever had it confirmed by the video.
>>83982157
It's been awhile since I saw TWS, but when Zola was going on about Hydra's secret history since the end of WWII, did he actually mention it was the Winter Soldier who had killed the key targets? Because that would have been when Cap found out about Howard Stark's death, since it was one of the ones Zola mentioned, and I could have sworn Zola did mention it was Bucky who had done the killing.
>>83972083
Winter Soldier, just because the whole thing is a huge middle finger at Obama.
>>83982820
I...what!?
>>83982692
IIRC it was just "Accidents vill happen."
>>83982692
Zola does show Bucky's hits including Stark's parents
That's how we all knew months ahead of CW that moment was likely going to be IM's motivation.
At best Cap was willfully ignorant. Ignoring the truth in fear of what that would do to both the team and what it means of his friend.
>>83982692
>when Zola was going on about Hydra's secret history since the end of WWII, did he actually mention it was the Winter Soldier who had killed the key targets?
No, he just said accidents happen.
Cap couldn't have known it was Bucky. We know retrospectively that it was, but nothing in TWS said it was the Winter Soldier. Hell, it was just a single 2 second shot, it's impressive that it got as much notice as it did.
>>83983235
>Cap couldn't have known it was Bucky.
>shows Bucky assassinating a foreigner official
>shows Bucky kill a president
>shows the Newspaper about the Stark's death
like I said he was keeping willfully ignorant of the whole mess. Also the fact that Bucky was there only active and used super solider till after the Stark's were killed leaves no room for another killer to be there.
>>83972083
Winter solider >>first avenger >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> civil war
>>83978751
Maybe he has a metal cock.
>>83979204
Winter Soldier is definitely somewhat intelligent, although Hydra's plan falls apart if you think about it. They needed to make it more subtle, i.e. taking out enemies by stealth to the point where it's not even clear if they were assassinations.
>>83972083
Winter Soldier.
It was the one to really make him a badass mofo. When people around the world think of CAPTAIN AMERICA, they think MURRICA but Cap subverts all that despite being a walking propaganda flag and just flats out comes out as his own man. A good man.
The character seriously gives Stark a run for his money and that's with normies even.
>>83983854
Hydra has a lot of assassins. It could have been anyone. But Bucky was a very likely suspect, based on his history.
>>83976951
>>83982157
>He had the Winter Soldier's file. Presumably, it detailed the assassination of the Stark family.
It was the Zola acid trip he saw during TWS. I assume the files didn't have anything on that, which is presumably why the only copy and evidence was the video tape in the Siberian compound and the only other testifier, Bucky, was basically a walking assassin human database with all known black ops operations. The scarcity of the evidence was probably why Zemo had so much trouble getting information on both ends.
Also it makes sense why Steve thought he knew, the only time he saw was for a split second before Zola's bunker blew up and he was stuck under the rubble with an unconscious Widow in his arms. That's pretty fucked if you think about it retrospectively.
Widow is also equally to blame.
>>83982874
Think about how much Democrats like to vilify people who disagree with them (Obama is STILL blames things on Bush, and blamed everything else on Republicans even when Dems controlled Congress when he took office) kind of like Hydra does, then remember the whole balance between freedom and security Fury and Steve talked about (NSA monitoring, etc), then imagine those hellicarriers are those no-due-process kill drones that exist RIGHT NOW.
>>83984755
Man, you're pretty far gone.
>>83984755
Forgot this part about Democrats, but liberal voters are physically attacking conservative voters, right now. That sounds like something Hydra would endorse.
>>83984797
Hey man, you're welcome to disagree, but killing "threats" without a trial via flying drones was a thing in that movie, and it's a thing in real life.
>>83984755
>Obama is STILL blames things on Bush
Yeah, it's been over 10 years, Katrina is totally Obama's fault now.
>>83984807
Hydra and Nazi Red Skull wouldn't endorse that.Soviet Red Skull would though.
>>83984837
You're a schizophrenic.
>>83984732
>Widow is also equally to blame.
Yes and no. Widow is accustomed to keeping secrets and compartmentalizing information. You'd almost expect it from her, not from cap.
>>83979059
Cap vision via Wanda implies otherwise. The second Carter tell him he can go home, he turns around and nobody is there. Even before that, he seemed decidedly uncomfortable with the victory party.
Cap might not want to admit it, but the place he feels most at home is a battlefield, fighting alongside comrades. Had he not gone into the iceberg, he might have been able to live a peaceful life as a civilian or a high ranking official, but even then he'd probably feel out of place. Fast forward to modern times, and he has no idea what he'd do with his life without the Avengers. Any home of feeling at home he had was dashed the second he flew Red Skulls jet into the water.
I actually think that might be the reason the hammer rejected him. Thor fights to protect the weak and innocent, but in the long term, he desires peace. Cap fights to protect the innocent, but deep down, he doesn't know anything else, and the idea of peace is something that unnerves him.
Winter Soldier was actually kind of dumb.
I mean, this guy ditches his powerful new friends that he knows has to stay together because they kill aliens, rogue gods, and robots because of his stupid old friend from Brooklyn.
Even if Bucky was mind controlled, he still killed people. That means he's not safe. Ergo, he shouldn't be allowed to run around. I don't see how or why it was made to look like Cap was the good guy in this movie.
>>83985170
It is stupid when you look at it in that narrow contrast.
The truth of the matter is that Bucky is his only living connection to a past he can't have. He is completely alone in this new era and nobody knows him like Bucky does and he is his best friend in somewhat of the same predicament, fucked up and alone.
Contextually he will always fighting to keep that bit of connection to a past no one else remembers alive. You'd do the same or accept death and a hollowed existence amongst friends and loved ones who will never truly understand like Bucky does.
>>83984511
Again I can't agree with that because every slide Zola showed that one had shown Bucky killing the official short of the last one. Occam razor would be screaming in your ear at that one.
Never mind he never showed this discovery of his parents getting off to Stark. Why would he hide that? Unless he knew in the back of his mind who the killer was.
>>83985170
Cap didn't want him to rund around, though. He just wanted him alive.
>>83973798
I agree with everything you just said, holy shit. Same exact sentiments.
>>83972083
TWS, but i'll give props to the Russos for Civil War, for making a decent movie and the best team-up movie of the MCU out of such shitty source material.
>>83975977
Jesus.
Gotta say, it doesn't look cheap.
>>83976189
>>83975977
Can we make a petition to make this kino canon?
>>83979181
>This was probably the best Iron Man's been since his first movie
This, so much.
>>83984908
Are you one of those no-trial kill drones, anon?
>>83984908
kys
This is not a comic nor is it a cartoon.
>>83990657
Mods allow superhero movies.
>>83990761
Superhero movies should belong in /tv/. Just like comics based off movies is /co/.
>>83990787
Then talk to the mods.
>>83990657
Or you could stop bitching and realize your post wont change shit
>>83972083
I just don't understand why so many consider TWS a good thriller or spy thriller. After the first scene with Redford's character, I knew he was the bad guy, there's no subtlety, no cleverness. Also, having Hydra be behind it all just felt very... stupid and tacked on, even if it is a part of Cap "lore". It felt like they tried to do a Bourne film with Captain America.
I still have to say I enjoyed it though. But it's nowhere near the quality of The Dark Knight or Spider-Man 2.
Lastly, the Cap trilogy made me like Cap, a character I've never had any interest in ever.
>>83991334
I don't think i'll ever understand why people praise Spiderman 2 so much.
>>83978390
I love the dive analogy. It's weird but perfectly illustrates how I feel about these movies.
>>83992008
Oh look, 12th-hour recognition. Thanks mate.
I really hate it when retards post stupid opinions on things they have literally no idea of, and then they post it thinking somehow their opinion is important and must be heard.
So many clueless people in this thread who know nothing about film/movies.
>>83978390
I like this explanation.
>>83974422
This. Civil War was supposed to be an Avengers, not a poor excuse for a Cap movie...
>>83993082
No it wasn't, Cap 3 is the one that was supposed to be another thing.
>>83972083
CW is easily the worst of the 3. It's ungodly milktoast, and is so toothless that the villain is there for 5 minutes and his entire thing is exactly what Loki and Ultron's plans were.
>>83993284
t. Zack Snyder
>>83993284
>exactly what Loki and Ultron's plans were.
no, that would be if Zemo planned to turn Hulk against them.
>>83993284
But he succeeded where Loki and Ultron failed. And he didn't even have their screentime or their powers.
Only weak point of TWS was that it was too obvious who the main villain was.
We needed to meet a bunch of Red Herring SHIELD leaders, including many ruthless self-described realists. A few of them should have been played by actors known for their villain roles.
>>83993738
That doesn't make it less repetitive.
>>83993611
I didn't like MOS, and I didn't even go watch BVS.
>>83993698
It's the same idea of "I'll make the heroes hate eachother and fight," except in CW there's never a moment, even in the climax, where I felt tension from it.
>>83993821
No superhero movie will ever be capable of creating tension.
Bad guys lose, good guys win.
Always.
>>83993821
Didn't Loki just want to rule the world, and Ultron wanted to protect Earth by replacing the population of the planet with robots? The bad guy in GotG was all about power and domination, as well. Same with the guy in Thor 2.
Zemo specifically just wants to break the Avengers. None of that ruling the world shit or power tripping.
That's not really the same. It's one of the things I noticed with Civil War. The villain is different.
>>83993821
>It's the same idea of "I'll make the heroes hate eachother and fight
But the past villains didn't attempt this. Maybe Loki to some extent, but only so he can get on with his plan on world domination, and he failed.
The distinct thing with Zemo in CW was that he just really wants to fuck up the Avengers for revenge. That's about it.
These were 2 totally different movies which is why it makes them both really hard to compare. Despite this, I would have to choose the Winter Soldier because it was tense and it had you on the edge of your seat. Civil War felt like it was holding back a little.
Civil War would have been a better movie if:
-Explosion in Lagos would have been greater, causing more civilian casualties
-The mother of the boy who was killed in Sokovia interrupted Stark's speech via assassination attempt.
- MCU would have had the balls to kill War Machine, thus showing how the Avengers that war between heroes can result in dire consequences.
- Tony and Steve's fight could have lasted a bit longer and on a larger scale.
Thoughts?
call me crazy but the leaked script of CW was better than the actual movie.
>>83994250
>leaked script
You mean one of the 10 fanfics that popped up around here every day the two weeks before the movie was released?
>>83972083
Winter Soldier is a tighter, more grounded piece, but Civil War has the best Spider-Man ever so it's a strong contender for best MCU.
>>83972083
Don't know, but they are for sure the two best of the MCU.
THANK YOU BASED RUSSOS
Centering Captain America's character in the MCU around his relationship with Bucky and having his stories portray him at odds with the established authorities and fighting the corruption within them is what makes him work so well as a character.
Captain America in the MCU fights secret societies that have taken over America while trying to save his best friend who got used as an MK Ultra patsy
>>83993958
The villain just wanted revenge for a dead family member like Whiplash, Malekith and Ronan
>>83995743
THANK YOU BASED RUSSOS
