Historical European Martial Arts Thread
Please keep it kind and on topic. Also no SCA/Reenactment please.
Essential Information:
http://www.communitywalk.com/user/view/81443
https://www.zeemaps.com/map?group=619536
http://hemaalliance.com/?page_id=686
http://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Main_Page
http://www.hroarr.com/
http://www.middleages.hu/english/martialarts/treatise_database.php
last thread >>1054314
I want to train cutting so bad, but I got no sharps, no cutting stand and no place where I could practice.
>fuck being me
How do you store your swords? I got a couple now and they are all over the place. Are there wall mountings or something? Maybe a gun rack will do?
>>1104769
Umbrella stand
>>1104721
well, start small: building a stand isn't that hard, and going through the motions of having your blade properly alinged can be trained with basically anything that looks half way like a blade. while doing that, save up for a proper and well made sharp (seriously, don't go too ceap on this).
>>1104769
in a corner of the living room
A picture frame hook and two bowlines.
>>1104803
The missus has strong objections to that.
>>1104717
Any quick tips on getting started?
>>1104806
In a closet or build a rack then, it wouldn't be hard
>>1104809
Join a good club.Train hard and often. Buy gear when you need it and not before. Have fun.
>>1104816
I'd have agreed with this before but this year our clubs had a few rich beginners who got fully kitted up pretty much day 1 and I think it's really sped them along rightly.
Especially for gloves.
>>1104834
If your club has gloves, use them. The first thing you wanna get is your own mask, sweaty smelly clubmasks no more. If you can borrow a waster for drilling at home, do that.
You do not need hema gloves until you advance to contact drills / light sparring. And even if you are a prodigy this will take months.
Rather invest your energy in footwork and distance management, you gonna need it.
>>1104852
I'd reccomend gloves first every time. I didn't have a pair for about two years into training HEMA and only used ill fitting club ones and I've frankly never got used to doing techniques with gloves on. You'll enjoy sparring much more long term if you just get used to the kit you'll be using from Day 1. Not always ofcourse because it's worth having the chance to learn techniques with the best possible dexterity.
If you're not in a position to regret losing a few hundred on gear you'll never use if you quit then there's no downside to having your own kit other than making people jelly.
>>1104806
mine puts her swords just into the pile
>>1104927
sounds kinky
>>1104769
For the various trainers (feders, shinai, bokken, etc) I've ended up with over the years I simply bought as large, plastic flowerpot from IKEA and put in corner.
For the various sharps and antiques I got a few Japanese style stands here and there in the apartment. Not exactly ideal for non-Japanese style swords, but it works reasonably at least.
>wake up
>go into study
>my fucking andrea ferrara claymore is sticking out of my recliner
im about to get a divorce
goddammit albert
>>1104769
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dp5FP8nFOuw
Enjoy friend
>>1105035
>Matt Easton
Good post
>>1104769
knight shop sword hooks
cant believe no one said this
>>1104769
I'm not a hema guy and have no idea how I ended up in this thread, but I play the ukulele and I hang some of my instruments on a wall rack I made with a couple planks of wood and some U hooks from home depot
What are the little points on german longsword blades called?
>>1105395
The widened area down by the hilt on a feder blade is called the schilt, the points you may get when the corners of it are drawn out probably don't have any specific name.
>>1105402
Ah okay schilt. Sorry I'm clueless. I also found out that the pointy bits on a zweihander are called parrying hooks? Parierhaken? Why wouldn't things like that be on longswords?
>>1105513
Some are, look up Spanish Montante
The reason is they're not universal is because of context, and if you add something, you must take away from something else
It adds mass, weight ect and also can make a sword less convenient for daily carry
Swords are sidearms primarily, if you can't easily carry it in a socially acceptable and convenient way it kind of enters its own c
A big 6 foot Bidenhander/Zwei can be more likened to a polearm than a sword, role wise, because you can't make a big sword a sidearm
>>1105525
Great points, thanks.
Anyone have any detailed information on Kaskara?
JUST
anyone got good vids on bolognese sword and shield?
>>1105670
dunno about shield, but just search bolognese sidesword on YT
So for protective equipment I have:
mask
mask overlay with back of head protection
fencing jacket
cheap lacrosse gloves
Do I really need anything else for synthetic sparring? When I git gud enough for steel, what else will I need?
I know I should upgrade my gloves, but I'm waiting for the Koning/ProGauntlet gloves to be available. I also kind of want to get fencing pants just because I want to be fully decked out in gear.
>>1105696
youve got the right idea
personally... id like to see people fighting in riveted mail, with no belt
>>1105696
For steel, when the time comes, you're going to want a gorget, some decent gloves of your choice (of which there are several good options and more on the way like you mentioned) some knee and elbow protection, and maybe even shin guards. I personally use baseball leg guards because its knees and shins and they're not too heavy.
Other than that, you're good. I've seen some people augment their jacket for steel sparring but honestly, it doesn't seem necessary to me. Better to be nimble and focus on not getting hit than to bulk up on plate padding on top of the jacket and slow yourself down, I think.
>>1105670
Ilkka Hartikainen did some videos about forms with the sword and rotella.
If you meant bolognese sword and buckler, it should be much easier to find, as it was a primary concern of them.
Oi m8's,
The 2nd Australasian HEMA Convention is coming up in June.
Who's signing up?
It's three days of instruction and fencing with some of the sickest kunst in HEMA, including; US instructor Stephen Fick, Stephen Hand, Paul Wagner (of "HEMA Armour is Wrong" notoriety), Callum Forbes, Colin McKinstry and several others.
>http://www.stoccata.org/index.php/component/civicrm/?task=civicrm/event/info&reset=1&id=1
For those who think we're backwards, show up or shut up.
See you there.
>t. George Giller
>>1105670
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbpDoWUNsvQ
>>1105984
Question to the Australians
Yurop here, I make my own quarterstaffs, mostly from dogwood saplings.
Now I guess you guys must have some of the hardest, densest timber in the world. Did any of you made stuffs or cudgels out of some native Australian timber?
>>1104769
Under my bed
Does anyone here moderate for the HEMAA forums?
I've just been cross-training with some running and horrible-routine lifting. What do y'all do? Are you /fit/?
>>1106934
Some lifting, some running. Managed a Marathon last year (10-12 Celsius, pouring rain, and at times stiff winds, oh joy), otherwise nothing even remotely remarkable.
>>1106034
We use Tasmanian Oak a lot.
Basically most Native timbers are either too dense and heavy (Iron Bark, Gum trees), to sappy and prone to break and full of ants (Gum trees), or perfect but don't grow long and straight enough (Gum trees). Everything else is expensive.
Rattan is commonly used, as are composite staffs (i.e. Tas Oak with some sort of Pine).
>>1105984
I bet filthy yank is shitting in his pants right now
>>1105984
I'll be attending.
>>1105984
>For those who think we're backwards, show up or shut up.
We don't need to fly 20 hours across the globe to know you're backwards. The videos Wagner puts out are enough evidence. You are backwards.
So I see the majority of posters here are from US and Australia. Explains a lot.
>>1107606
>The videos Wagner puts out are enough evidence
of?
I thought this might be of interest:
http://www.metmuseum.org/art/metpublications/The_Academy_of_the_Sword_Illustrated_Fencing_Books_1500_1800?Tag=&title=&author=&pt=&tc=&dept=&fmt=
Free to download or read online.
There may be others, but it's an art museum collection, so I don't know how many other martial arts books they would have, but there's a lot of pages that I haven't gone through.
>>1107683
Evidence of Australian HEMA being backwards. They wear larp gear, fight with sticks, nylon or blunts, repeat outdated interpretation and consist of a majority of fat balding middle aged men with beer bellies.
https://youtu.be/bS-fal6f2CQ
>>1107801
>2012
You need more recent evidence if you want to prove anything.
>>1107813
OK. https://youtu.be/PA0ofDiSHaY
My bad, it's not all fat and balding men. There's some skeletal teenagers too
>>1107198
u wot m8y
>>1107880
>There's some skeletal teenagers too
>Lankets
>Even in HEMA they don't learn
>spoopy
>>1107880
In fairness it is HEMA.
All Europe has other than this is bearded ponytailed men.
I was laughing at the last event I went to when our beginners going grew beards before the event to fit in.
>>1107880
>tfw skeletal
>work out constantly
>pushups
>cardio
>lifting weights
>can't fucking bulk up to save my life
>only get faster with more energy reserves
>never any noticeably stronger
>>1108494
because you're not eating more than you workout.
>>1108494
Eat a lot of protein and use low rep (like 5 or so) exercises close to your maximum load.
>>1108494
Give up and become a trap.
>>1108494
SS + GOMAD
Are there tournaments with historical rules? Stuff like no thrusting or you score points only hitting the opponent head? Some masters developed techniques for those kind of contexts, it would be nice to spar under the same rules.
>>1108494
You need to eat historical food if you want to gain historical strength.
>>1113589
>tfw the aurochs is extinct
>>1113587
Fanco-belgian rules, thee have been a few tournaments.
>>1113618
I'd love to know more about it, can you name the tournaments so I can find more infos?
>>1113587
British "Cudgelling" or "Single stick".
>>1104721
He's doing it wrong
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efelZtMbfNk
>>1113919
You clueless aussies need to fuck off.
>>1113657
http://mindhost.tumblr.com/post/109975087767/franco-belgian-longsword-tournament-rules-short
http://www.fechtschuleamerica.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=76&Itemid=64
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8CXijKxTaM
On a scale of "shit" to "better than the Koning Glove", where will the ProGauntlet rank?
>>1115875
I'd say it's fantastic and completely beyond reality.
Where can I find an english translation of the "le jeu de la hache", possibly with an interpretaton of the techniques?
>>1116043
I really think these threads should start with a list...
http://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Le_Jeu_de_la_Hache_(MS_Fran%C3%A7ais_1996)
>>1115875
I'd rank them as a classic case of milking the hype too long and now scrambling to get it out.
Guess their "muh astronaut" "muh construction industry" "muh deus ex" didn't work out well.
Good luck boys, hope it's cheaper than the Kong or imbues it users with superpowers :^)
>>1116095
It looks cooler in my opinion. Koning literally looks like trash-tier leather gloves for digging in shit. I don't really understand why they hide protection plates under it.
>>1116094
I know it but as far as I know it isn't the best translation possible. I was wondering if there is a better one around.
>>1116101
Literally to hide them. So it can't be copied at least until they've sold the first batch.
Same reason ProGauntlet was hidden/censored in videos.
>>1116094
A pastebin would be good. Something to get people started.
>>1104717
I've a growing desire to learn about French smallsword, which sources should I look into for either classical or eccentric use of said weapon ?
I'd rather look into french sources or rather sources in french (so I guess Angelo counts), but I'm still open for anything else interesting, if there's such thing.
Progauntlet site is live.
It's fucking nothing.
>>1117159
Well the main page picture is really cool but this all reeks of lifelong students. Measuring their milestones like anyone gives a shit.
>We don’t expect to open pre-orders for the ProGauntlet Mark 1 before 2017
Great.
> What will be the retail price?
Since there’s still a lot of uncovered ground and both the design and the production method are still under development, it is too early to give a sound prediction on pricing at this point in time.
Well that pictures really cool.
Guys. I need good hema shorts. I'm starting to wear out my BDU capris and they were always a bit of an awkward fit. What do you wear for pants/shorts/capris/anythingbutkilts?
>>1116101
>Koning literally looks like trash-tier leather gloves for digging in shit
>>1117159
>>1117182
Well I for one am shocked--shocked, I tell you.
>>1117242
>Koning literally looks like trash-tier leather gloves for digging in shit
I'm not a fan of the bright brown or red colors, if there was an option for black I'd like them a lot more.
>In the meantime, we’re developing our production design and capacity in order to release the ProGauntlet Mark 1 in 2017. So, sometime next year, they will be ready for shipping.
At this moment Koning already will be all over the place and maybe even with some additional improvements after so many people tried it.
Eh, I can only hope they what are they doing.
>>1117476
>Eh, I can only hope they what are they doing.
Yeah they tried so hard, but in the end it doesn't even matter.
Great scientists, engineers and all-round cool dudes. Crap business men.
>Hurr derr out crowdfung went well, lets use that as pre-seed to get seed
>fug we don't want anyone to steal our super-secret techniques, better piss off everyone who gave us their money
>Can we have more money?
>Can we forget the primary market for this and try to enter other markets before we even have a product?
>Derp, someone released a bretty good product faster then we did and they've got HEMA-famous people spruiking it
>better release a picture
>not that we're even past alpha testing but fuck it we'll do it live
>but it's still not going to be available until another year
>pls don't forget us, gibmedat
> :^)
When it [if] comes out it had better be revolutionary and not just "better".
I've tried literally every available pair of gloves on the market at least once. And I've played enough vidya to have an understand of modelling.
I've travelled enough and handled enough original gauntlets to know the basic premise.
I've got buddies in a wide variety of industries and who enjoy all kinds of sports.
Pretty sure I could smash out a 3D printable model in a third of the time it's taken for them to even begin entering Beta testing.
Would it suck? Yep. Then I'd listen and fix it. Then you know what I'd do? I'd re-release it. Repeat ad infinitum.
The problem with academics is that they want to quantify, measure, calibrate, optimise, know every detail before they even start doing anything.
I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed that after three (soon to be four [and them most likely five]) years all they have to show is a picture.
A fucking picture that any competent digital artist could smash out in a couple of days or less.
>Boys, if you're reading this...
I love what you're doing, but I'm losing faith. I don't care about your "progress", I want to be inside it. I want it on my hand.
We're consumers. You better feed us. We're selfish, impatient. We don't care, and like it or not we owe you nothing.
You have a patent now, show us the money! Show us a video!
Fucking five seconds of fingering the guard I don't care!
Something concrete, something so that we know that you're not just a shell-company in a notorious tax-haven.
Its been so long that I have a fucking kid now!
I can't even do HEMA as much as I did over three years ago any more.
But here I am still hoping and giving your competitors money.
I pray to God that your gauntlet takes off in not just your core audience, but in motorcross, lacrosse, hockey, cricket, fucking space astronaughts. Because that's how good it's gotta be, that's how good I want it to be. That's how good I know it will be.
/rant
So that's where my money went...
>>1117182
>Measuring their milestones like anyone gives a shit.
This.
>>1117395
>I'm not a fan of the bright brown or red colors, if there was an option for black I'd like them a lot more.
Booooooring.
>>1117222
Knickers/breeches are the standard, after normal track pants. I've seen people with some that don't have the high waist and suspenders, if you don't like that style, but I don't know where they get them.
>>1117793
call me a faggot but the rest of my fencing attire is black and white, I wanna match. The colors that are out remind me of riding gloves.
Has anyone here ordered Koning gloves?
I'm worried they might not be safe enough because I don't just want them for HEMA, I was going to use them for SCA too.
I wish they'd just give some information about what they're actually made of or how the parts link together.
>>1118059
If they're safe for HEMA steel sparring, they're safe for SCA stick fighting too.
>>1118226
Nah, that's not true at all.
SCA has completely different standards and requirements.
In the SCA they hit way harder, but you can't get swords stuck between layers of metal like we can in HEMA.
Some of the best HEMA gloves are banned in the SCA.
>>1118329
Are you trying to start a "SCA vs HEMA" debate? Because it's really not welcome here.
SCA rules unarguably require them to hit harder than us, and you can't force a 1.25" piece of rattan in between two sheets of steel.
Now git.
>>1118337
But... layers of metal in HEMA?
And while they may put more strength into it (though DESU i doubt that's true if we're comparing it to the Poles), can a "short" one handed rattan stick hit harder than long two handed steel sword with a much thinner impact area.
>>1118337
>between two sheets of steel.
What steel? besides the blade there is no steel in HEMA
And yes, a 1.7kg steel feder hits a harder than a ratan stick ever will.
And no, I'm not trying to start a discussion, especially not about the SCA, but your statements are just nonsensical and need a bit of explanation.
![tumblr_inline_ne6da4irmy1rzq2ed[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/jVD9WWr.jpg "tumblr_inline_ne6da4irmy1rzq2ed[1].jpg")
>>1118357
>But... layers of metal in HEMA?
Yeah, I've never seen it personally but I've heard of people managing to get swords stuck in the gaps of gloves like pic related.
It might just be hearsay though.
>>1118363
Fuck me, this happens every time.
The SCA rules are set up so that the minimum level of force needed is enough that if you were using steel swords and wearing padded mail, you'd still be causing broken bones or blunt force trauma to organs through the mail.
That's the minimum level. It goes far higher than that, especially with polearms.
That's why even though everybody's wearing 14ga steel helmets, they're still all dented to shit.
It's literally just that. We're assumed to not be wearing any armour, while they're assumed to be wearing full chainmail armour.
Now can we please keep this as a HEMA thread? I knew it was a mistake mentioning the SCA around you autists.
>>1118373
Those are pretty uncommon here, i've seen a grand total of one pair.
Well we used gauntlets way back when we started, but they were quite inadequate. Less about blades getting stuck between the finger scales, more about the scales bending anyway and making a mess of the fingers.
>>1118381
Yeah, same here.
I'd never use them, they just don't seem safe enough in the finger area.
Hopefully the Koning/Progauntlet will be better
>>1118381
>Those are pretty uncommon here, i've seen a grand total of one pair.
Seen one pair, at an event in Poland, two years ago, the lady had a hand injury afterwards.
>>1118373
So what sort of gloves do you wear for SCA, then? I'm legitimately curious now; if it's really as harsh as you say, then you've got to have some decent kit.
>>1118484
Most common in the SCA, from what I've seen, are clamshell gauntlets or non-period basket hilts with demi-gauntlet wrist protection.
>>1117793
Yeah like, specifically where to get them is what I'm having trouble with. I've looked around everywhere in person and shorts are too short but pants won't really match club attire. And I hate suspenders.
>tfw never do sport as kid b/c bullies.
>get to 18, find HEMA, love it.
>19 diagnosed with arthritis in elbow, both knees, wrist.
>only about 15lbs overweight.
seriously considering killing myself.
>>1118907
Do it, Fatty McFatfat.
>>1118907
Order that helium mask now you beta cunt
>>1118907
Is this your sword hand elbow and wrist?
Sure what's a bit of arthritis in the scheme of things.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfM8MxVZLGo
Well, that's it. Ol' Progauntlet is fucked.
Koning is going ahead PLUS other products coming shortly.
To anyone who wants to invent something for HEMA do it soon, the market is gonna be flooded shortly.
>>1120273
God damn. Dropping a nuclear bomb of news from what appears to be a fucking restaurant. Meanwhile progauntlet boys can't even get the fucking website up and running in a reasonable time frame.
>>1120273
Why do you think this means progauntlet is fucked? This is some weird console wars mentality on this board. Progauntlet isn't trying to be the only glove on the market, they don't care about coming out first, and hema people aren't 12 year old fanboys who will 'pick a side'.
Koning glove is great but it's still very bulky, it's about the size of most clamshells but with individual fingers. It's not that innovative. Progauntlet is aiming to make a much, much slimmer and agile glove and change the game forever. It'll come out when it's good and ready and if it's as good as they think it is then they won't have a problem.
It's not a race to reach the market, it's different products. Neyman gloves are selling well despite coming years after spes heavy, sparring gloves, AF gloves, and all the other ones. I know you US and Australians get a distorted perception of what is going on in the hema world.
>>1120368
>This is some weird console wars mentality on this board.
It's less that they're looking like a runner in the console race, and more that they're starting to look like Duke Nukem Forever.
Aaaaany year now.
But sure, if they finally turn up and turn out to be bloody great? Good for us.
Did feders had a scabbard or something just as regular swords?
>>1120919
Doubtful. They were just training tools. I've never seen any evidence of them anyway. Shilts make sheathing difficult.
>>1120368
>hema people aren't 12 year old fanboys who will 'pick a side'
>Koning glove is . . . not that innovative
>Progauntlet is aiming to . . . change the game forever
Physician, heal thyself?
>Suddenly thought everyone was posting with their names since it's a relatively small global community
>Remember what day it is
Oh.
>>1121652
Oh come on, Dora; you really think people would want to out themselves as someone who posts on a Mongolian claymation board?
>>1120933
Are you that stupid?
I love Koning glove and I even preordered a pair. But they're not that innovative. They're just slightly better than anything we have right now. They're still bulky and big, and probably lose some protection compared to Spes clamshells. They're the best we have though and I can't wait for mine.
Progauntlet however is promising a perfectly protective glove that you can fight with and play the cello with. That's a fucking game changer. If they manage it, the glove problem will be solved. Even with Koning gloves, manoeuvrability and dexterity is compromised heavily compared to ordinary leather gloves.
Even Axel Petterson wants progauntlet to succeed. He's a fighter first.
>>1121928
>That's a fucking game changer. If they manage it, the glove problem will be solved...
This.
In fact, I feel back for all the other glove manufacturers. They're able to charge a premium now but when the Pro comes out, well, it ain't them who'll be fucked.
Poland bro's better get their manufacturing costs down...
>>1121928
>>1122615
>Progauntlet however is promising a perfectly protective glove that you can fight with and play the cello with
>promising
>when the Pro comes out, well, it ain't them who'll be fucked
>when
Aye, there's the rub.
Look, if they eventually release something that's even close to what they've talked about, then sure, I'll be all over it, just like everyone else. But how abouts we don't hype the shit out of it until we see something more than a handful of staged photos? Seems to me these guys need fewer people sucking their cocks right now, not more.
>>1123166
>But how abouts we don't hype the shit out of it until we see something more than a handful of staged photos? Seems to me these guys need fewer people sucking their cocks right now, not more.
What difference does it make? They're working on something cool, people are excited. So what?
>huurrr guys but all we've seen is fake photos, stop liking them they're dicks!!
Sounds like you're jealous.
I just bought a short sleeved gamberson, did I do good?
What do people usually buy for body armor protection
>>1125654
AP jackets, around here. Older guys often have gambesons from the early days, but any new acquisition is an AP jacket.
Still too expensive for poorfag me...meh.
>>1125658
I just grabbed a gambeson because it was pretty cheap, only like 60-70 dollars. Was it a bad decision?
What?
>>1125680
Men hugging on the ground isn't a sport either faggot, yet we allow it.
Fuck off.
>>1125654
No. You should have bought at least a long sleeved one.
>>1125718
I bought a long sleeved one because it's really hot where I live, and i didn't want to deal with the extra heat.
And to be honest the big puffy one's look like they almost impair your movement.
>>1125724
Short sleeved*
>>1125654
I got a short sleeved Allstar masters jacket, I like it a lot, imho it is the superior choice if you need a system that works for different weapons. It is light and the protection as well as the mobility is excellent, and you can armor up your weapon arm with additional protectors as much as you see fit. makes it a good jacket for all the lighter weapons and you can still reasonable well fight with the heavies.
Only if you do longsword as you mainstay, then the biceps area can be problematic.
>>1125724
You'll have to protect your foream anyway.
>>1125758
I own a vambrace and a half gauntlet anyway, so it's not a big deal.
>>1125660
Probably not, no. It's worse than a proper jacket, but better than nothing, and fairly alright for that price if it isn't badly-made.
>>1125564
>They're working on something cool, people are excited. So what?
The thing is, these guys don't seem to do well without some sort of time pressure. The crowdfunding was almost three years ago, but only now that the Koning is out for pre-orders are we getting more info from them - and a shitty website detailing exactly how much they haven't done yet isn't great on that front.
If there were fewer people saying "oh, take as long as you need; I'm sure it'll be absolutely perfect when it's done" then maybe they'd get their act together and actually put something out, instead of just talking about it.
>>1118527
Something like this, maybe?
http://www.amazon.com/PUMA-Mens-Training-Pant/dp/B00OBHG1Z6/
>>1126386
I was thinking something more with this look but one which would actually be...good.
http://www.amazon.com/Southpole-Jogger-Capri-Colors-Length/dp/B00TH209TE/ref=cts_ap_1_cts
I tried a pair of these off amazon and immediately returned them because the fabric was so rigid that even just taking a full normal walking stride almost ripped the inseam. Everything else was fitted normally, but fuck having to do anything physical in South Pole pants.
>>1126386
I only understand being pissed if you're a backer. Everyone else needs to shill. Do you think anyone want the gloves to come out more than they do?
Anyone have experience with Superior Fencing?
http://www.sup-fen.com/
The "being made in Pakistan" thing gives me pause, but they're listed on the official HEMA website, so they can't be that bad, right?
>>1128069
>the official HEMA website
There is no official HEMA website.
>>1128153
HEMA Alliance isn't the official website?
http://www.hemaalliance.com/
>>1128342
No. The HEMA Alliance is a congregation of a few HEMA groups in North America. They don't represent or include all HEMA groups or their goals in the US, let alone the rest of the world. HEMA has no official regulatory body, it's not a sport, or an organised martial art, it's more a concept of approach to studying and practicing historical martial arts. And so there is no official website.
Not that there's anything wrong with the HEMAA. But it doesn't speak for all of HEMA.
>>1128057
>Everyone else needs to shill
lol; I think they're doing enough of that as it is.
I'm not really pissed at anyone, but if I were, it wouldn't be those guys, it'd be the fanboys.
Personally I think HEMAA are a bunch of fags, but that's just my opinion
>>1128682
You need to explain why do you think so, otherwise I have to assume that you are the fag here.
>>1128443
>No. The HEMA Alliance is a congregation of a few HEMA groups in North America. They don't represent or include all HEMA groups or their goals in the US, let alone the rest of the world. HEMA has no official regulatory body, it's not a sport, or an organised martial art, it's more a concept of approach to studying and practicing historical martial arts. And so there is no official website.
I hope one day it gets the attention it deserves and becomes a proper sport, and you guys can can have an official website, with a cute poster boy,
>>1128905
big fat pretentious neckbeards who are shit at modern fencing so they decided to take this joke up instead.
>>1129242
Oh boy, another fencer angry that people dont like what he likes
I dont even do hema by the way, I just lurk here
>>1129242
>modern fencing
I didn't know this exists. Any good manuals?
>>1129486
>fencing
>manuals
M8 fencing is easymode. Don't poke, just flick so the tip bends and hits their wrist. You win every time.
>>1129226
>I hope one day it gets the attention it deserves and becomes a proper sport...
>becomes a proper sport...
m8 they already did that, it's called fencing...
>>1128069
I've tried contacting them three times to get a quote for their standard (AP knockoff) jacket.
Only reason being:
>1) Australian.
>2) Lighter construction than Euro models (dat heat/humidity).
>3) Cheaper (because buying kit from Europe is basically a status symbol).
>4) Seriously, AUD $300 minimum for either SPES or NEYMAN, not including postage...
>5) Like, guys, srs, if anyone has a second hand one...
Kit comparison time!
Here's my current set up:
>Mask:
http://www.medieval-fightclub.com.au/combat-sports/fencing/fencing-masks/fencing-epee-mask.html
>Neck:
http://www.medieval-fightclub.com.au/combat-sports/sports-protection/wtc-stainless-steel-and-leather-gorget-collar.html
>Gloves:
http://www.medieval-fightclub.com.au/combat-sports/sports-protection/black-padded-leather-hema-wma-gloves.html
>Chest:
http://www.medieval-fightclub.com.au/combat-sports/fencing/fencing-accessories/chest-protector-mens-fencing-wma.html
>Arms:
http://clang.adkinssoftware.com/arm%20pics/bazu%2001.html
>Jacket:
http://www.zenwarriorarmory.com/catalog.php?item=255&catid=39&ret=catalog.php%3Fcategory%3D39
>Legs:
http://www.triplette.com/catalog.php?item=262&catid=25&ret=catalog.php%3Fcategory%3D25
>Custom thigh protection from foam inserted in to said pockets.
>Standard Brine lacrosse gloves.
>Brush-Cutter protectors that I need to swap out because they don't do shit for the sides of your knee.
>Weight lifting belt for extra torso protection.
And custom weapons. Gladly post pictures and specs. if anyone is interested?
Also fellow Ausfalians and Kiwi's please sign up for this:
https://stoccata.org/index.php/component/civicrm/?task=civicrm/event/info&reset=1&id=1
And remember,
>"Don't be a sad cunt, be a sick kunst..." - Abdullah Zyzz Ibrahim
Edit: Formatting.
>>1129754
You delete that post again, and I will fuck you right up the butt
>>1129754
>Edit: Formatting.
You Aussies really are an odd bunch.
>>1104717
Just for thread bump. My MMA coach fights in the ACL or at least a really similar version of it. I'll see if I can find his videos. We've started using some practice German Waster swords at my gym and he's passing off some info to me through it. I think we'll be moving up into getting steel Wasters next and armoring up. Fun shit for sure.
>>1130232
Oh boy; I'm sure this will go well...
I'm glad you're having fun, dude. If you're interested in learning more about the historical side of things, there are a lot of good sources out there nowadays. There might even be a decent club in your area, if you really want to get into it.
>>1129226
No. That's the opposite of what the majority of HEMA wants. We don't want it to become another game loosely based on a historical martial art and only resembling it superficially, like sport fencing kendo.
>>1129754
All that kit is larp tier shit. Fucking Australians, I'd tell you to never change, but you haven't since 1990 so there's no point. Say hi to Wagner the Wanker for us.
Lol Australia. Such a meme country.
>>1130411
Growing out of an mma club is alot better a start than most Hema clubs.
>>1131254
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_ekugPKqFw
Here's my teacher Steve hand teaching me how to attack effectively.
He really is a fantastic teacher.
>>1129772
>You delete that post again, and I will fuck you right up the butt
>>1129878
>You Aussies really are an odd bunch.
>>1130520
>All that kit is larp tier shit. Fucking Australians, I'd tell you to never change, but you haven't since 1990 so there's no point. Say hi to Wagner the Wanker for us.
>>1131254
>Lol Australia. Such a meme country.
>>1131361
>Here's my teacher Steve hand teaching me how to attack effectively.
>He really is a fantastic teacher.
T-thanks ;_;
>>1130520
How is it larp tier at all you fucking drongo
>>1131411
it's a spicy /int/ tier meme m8
>>1131418
what
>>1131411
You tell me buddy.
First, I watch Matt's videos and want to do HEMA.
Second, I read this thread and "what the actual fuck?"
Third, I check the only historical fencing club in my city and don't want to do HEMA anymore. Well, guess I still can practice footwork and posing with metal rod.
>>1131465
>Second, I read this thread and "what the actual fuck?"
Welcome to 4chan?
>>1131465
I wouldn't judge a club on it's google image search.
Marketing like that is very difficult because you can't help who puts what on the internet. My club has been trying to get some stuff from the very early days removed for a while for this reason.
HEMA is full of nerds and neckbeards no doubt about that but it's a locked down martial art too.
>>1131455
Holy shit, that's fucking hilarious. I'm gonna show Paul this next week.
>>1131455
We have a guy in my club who runs a vest separate arm protectors setup.
He can go on at length about getting stabbed in the armpit.
>>1131455
someone post this on the hema international group i dare you
>>1131465
>thinking the shitposters on 4chin have any bearing on the hema community
we are the fat neckbeards in the corner everyone at the club ignores.
>>1131455
wtf is this? I don't get it.
>>1140038
Paul uploaded a video talking about particular armors, some random faggot got angry and decided to shit post about him.
I'm into HEMA and personally use a blunt longsword forged by Peter Regenyei. My girlfriend prefers foil and rapier fencing. We've fenced before, my longsword against one of her foils she bought used (I don't think they were made super well either) plenty of times and eventually my sword snapped one of hers clean in half.
Basically I'm just looking to find some good retailers that make rapiers for around $500. If necessary this can be increased but 500 is what we're aiming for. The rapier needs to be able to take a beating from the blunt longsword I'm using.
Thanks.
>>1146371
rapier and foil are very different weapons...
Has anyone had experience with Lynx protective equipment? Supposedly they're some kind of Pakistani knockoff of SPES. My girlfriend is slowly getting into the martial art and she got a relatively nice jacket of theirs from one of the meetups we went to recently. I can't find fucking ANYTHING about these people online anywhere. Does anyone know their website or how to look into their gear more? She's happy with the jacket and wants to get some more stuff on a budget.
>>1146827
Sorry if this is a stupid question but what exactly is your point? I don't think I ever said they were similar.
>>1147094
You said you broke her foil and then you need new rapier. That's confusing.
>>1146371
Darkwood, Danelli, Regenyei, Castille. Probably others that I'm not remembering just now.
>>1147246
Never saided I need a "new" rapier. We haven't owned one before. She's done foil fencing and wants a rapier now. What part of that is confusing?
>>1147397
said* weirdest typo I've ever made.
>>1147300
Thanks. Will look into those.
>>1147397
not that guy, but you said she prefers foil and rapier fencing, so we assumed - not unreasonably, I think - that she had a rapier. was she really just using a foil for that? it's certainly not similar enough to be of much use in sparring (and why were you going longsword vs rapier, anyway?)
>>1148138
She's done rapier classes before. They supplied her with a rapier.
>why were you going longsword vs rapier, anyway?
Why not? Why do longsword vs longsword? I think mixed weapon fencing is interesting in that it ends up having some cool interactions between very different weapons. Just my opinion, though. As somebody using a longsword, fencing with somebody using a totally different weapon is a cool experience. I'd recommend trying it if you haven't already.
>>1147397
Judging by the background you provided it seemed she wanted a sword to use with her foil skills, only with a sword that wouldn't break so easily. Otherwise mentioning all of that wouldn't really be relevant.
>>1148138
There's historical precedent for rapier vs longsword if you're one of those purists who only fights in the context of history. The two weapons co-existed for some time.
>>1148322
I said she prefers foil and rapier fencing. She's done both. I thought that was pretty clear. Anyway it's getting late over here. I'm out
>>1148343
I know they overlapped for a while, but is there any actual record of a fight between the two, or any reference to how to approach such a fight (from either side)? I really am asking here; I don't know, myself.
I guess what I was really getting at with that comment was that sparring is of debatable utility for beginners even when using the same weapon; it seems like doing mixed weapon stuff would just exaggerate the downsides.
>>1148707
>but is there any actual record of a fight between the two,
Yes. There was a famous match in the late 16th century between a school of rapier fighters and longsworders. The rapier won conclusively. Some see this as the principle moment where rapier became the supreme fighting sword of the early modern period.
Anyone here do League of Nations stuff or have any suggestions on how to get into it? From what I have watched it's mostly just taking hits and standing. Of course getting hit and bashed into probably makes that harder but I am a sturdy, sure footed person who can remain standing whilst my friends bash me. I figured I could at least look into it.
>>1151005
Do you mean Battle of the Nations? If so it isn't really welcome here, it's very different from HEMA
>>1151494
Yeah, that, and fair enough I suppose.
>>1149034
Source.
Is rapier about parry & riposte or binding & winding or both?
>>1147057
Anyone? Please?
>>1151731
Rapier is usually binding and attacking in the opponent's attack. It's typically presented as a one tempo weapon, be it alone or with a dagger.
Smallsword really is the two tempo attack of parry & riposte, mainly because of the weight that allows very fast consecutive actions.
>>1151884
Cool, thanks
>>1151005
Find your national team and ask there. You can also search for HMB/Heavy Medieval Battle(s) or IMCF/International Medieval Combat Federation.
>>1152086
Didn't the H stand for "historical"? "Heavy" fits better, btw
>>1152105
You're right i think. On both.
>>1151964
Nota that two tempo fencing is also done in rapier, it's discussed and all, but it's not seen as the most efficient and advantageous way of fencing.
Smallsword being so fast, you can basically do two tempo fencing in the time it takes a heavier weapon to do a single tempo attack. It's also because the emphasis is on defense during those times, so it's always about defense first, then attacking.
Even bolognese masters thought that parrying skills were more important than offensive skills, as, just like many others said, everybody can attack convincingly, but it takes true mastery to be able to ward off any attack.
>>1152111
And single tempo actions also exist in smallsword.
It's pretty much impossible to give a conclusive answer unless the question is narrowed down to a single master or treatise i'd say.
The Italians (most of them?) might've been a lot about single tempo counters but the Spanish weren't for example.
>>1152124
Overall, french smallsword is a two-tempo weapon, but it's exactly as you pointed out, it depends on the masters and I don't think that even a single masters would enforce the use of only single or double tempo.
As a general rule, rapier is single tempo and smallsword two tempo, in the applications now...
And now I realize I talk mostly (only?) of italian rapier.
>>1148707
I think Giganti wrote something on rapier vs longsword, but I might be wrong in this one
>>1152277
>I think Giganti wrote something on rapier vs longsword, but I might be wrong in this one
He wrote just about everything else.
Di Grassi wrote that it's not that hard to take a dude with a montante out, you just gotta have balls.
>>1152304
Similar opinion from Pacheco. But that's his opinion on sword against anything.
Funny thing, there's yet another video about HEMA armor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iStsSoJ9Y8I
What did they actually use in period? Fucking padding, the same thing he's been shitting on for the last two videos.
>>1152540
Why don't you actually fucking post on the youtube channel rather than fucking shit posting every god damn time he uploads a video like a little bitch.
Grow a pair.
>>1152650
I'm not the same guy who posted the rest. I just found it quite ridiculous that he spent two videos telling us to get rigid protection and now makes one talking about how they used padding back in the day.
>>1152540
Why does he have to drink all the time during his video? Why does he have to put the fucking glass just in front of the camera all the time?
>>1152887
I don't know, but it annoys me too. Like pictures of people showing their food. Yeah, you can afford to eat. Hooray.
I also think it'd look better if he didn't wear his spider pyjamas in half the videos.
>>1152915
>I also think it'd look better if he didn't wear his spider pyjamas in half the videos.
The Australian heat demands special thermal dispersion garments.
What's the best protective stuff for hema if price isn't a problem?
>>1153327
If price isn't a problem at all feel free to get a full suit of plate only made of some adequate plastic or steel mesh.
Otherwise the Spes/Histfenc gear is generally good, for gloves you can also get Sparringglove or Koning, for the mask the Leon Paul Titan HEMA mask is probably the best, or at least the most expensive.
For the legs the Red Dragon shin/knee guards are pretty good, but they're just repurposed motocross gear so you might be able to find something better. For me they lack in the staying in place department.
>>1153381
Add PBT for BOTH protector and gorget. Leon Paul has a jacket based on the SPES AP jacket. Allstar and Uhlman make some really good masks.
>>1154127
Does the PBT gorget cover the clavicles? I don't like the way it looks, but it seems utilitarian enough.
And do you pronounce it gor-jit or gor-zhay?
>>1152963
>The Australian heat demands special arachnid dispersion garments
ftfy
>>1156841
>Does the PBT gorget cover the clavicles?
Yes it does, and it does it pretty well.
Opinions on the pbt jacket?
>>1156841
>gor-zhay
Oh you anglos. But yes, that one.
>>1156841
I've always said gor-jet. Well, fuck me.
My PBT gorget's little flaps on the sides keep flipping up, and while it's not uncomfortable it does seem a bit silly and also like it would reduce effectiveness. Is this just happening because it's new, or because it's intended to be worn under a gambeson, or because I got a dud?
>>1156841
Gor-jay?
>>1165877
>because it's intended to be worn under a gambeson
this
Hey, I'm getting a practice sword from Hanwei, and I wanted to ask what's better. Scent pommel or extended pommel. What are some of the advantages and disadvantages of using an extended pommel.
>>1167784
You won't notice any difference
>>1167143
Got it. Obviously I just need to go broke and buy a gambeson immediately.
Seriously though, I bought a mask and gorget because the guild's smell like ass and make my hair stink immediately...but what should I get next? Gloves? Feder? Gambeson?
>>1168254
Hands are wuite easy to wash, so if the club gloves fits you well, keep using them. I'd say go for a gambeson or, better, a HEMA jacket.
I know having a weapon is cool, but if you can use club's ones you can wait before buying your own one.
>>1168254
A good Feder and a fitting jacket are worth a ton. But if the club equipment fits you, no hurry.
>>1168675
SPES pro or the normal gambeson? Is the extra protectionr eally necessary? Is there a loss in movement?
>>1168929
I think the AP jacket Pro is a waste of money. I'd much rather use the normal AP with the forearm protectors. The plastic plates on the Pro don't cover the whole forearm, and hits to the top aren't all that uncommon.
I'm not sure if the broken arm last Swordfish was the top or bottom bone, but i'd rather not risk it, especially not if it ends up cheaper.
Is there a reason Italian longsword is less popular in the tournament scene?
>>1169073
Perhaps that there's less sources about it? Same could be said for British longsword for example.
I think Liechtenauer & Co. happened to become more popular at first so there's a lot more competitors doing it, nothing more to it.
>>1168962
>I'd much rather use the normal AP with the forearm protectors
seconded.
>>1169073
Less sources, the Germans used the longsword much longer in their tradition. Also later German sources are very complete and at least to a certain degree also contain techniques for sportive longsword fencing.
Also, shit just works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clbiwt-AKFU&t=2m29s
What are the longswords they're using in this?
>>1168254
>... guild's...
Oh boy...
>>1169652
Um, dude. You don't visit those funny hobby clubs, do you? Because, you know, fighters guild is the only place where you can actually learn swordfighting.
>>1168277
>I'd say go for a gambeson
Don't.
>or, better, a HEMA jacket.
Do.
>>1168962
>AP jacket Pro is a waste of money. I'd much rather use the normal AP with the forearm protectors.
This. Or Neyman.
>>1169073
>Is there a reason Italian longsword is less popular in the tournament scene?
It was banned because it was 2deadly5u.
>>1169089
>Same could be said for British longsword for example.
No. Because we don't have any manuals, just cryptic poems.
>>1169231
>Less sources,
That's pants on head retarded mate.
>the Germans used the longsword much longer in their tradition.
Yeah, except...
>later German sources are very complete
They literally just copied one dude for 400 years.
>also contain techniques for sportive longsword fencing.
Mostly this.
>Also, shit just works.
As does everything else.
>>1169633
They're blunt with a rolled tip, maybe Regenyei?
>>1169659
Want to know how I know you're Australian?
>>1169675
I know you have shit-tier detector, omae.
>>1169661
>It was banned because it was 2deadly5u.
Are you joking or something? Assuming we use same blunt flexible sword, how it can become "deadly"?
>>1169671
That's what I thought too but I looked at Regenyei's longswords and they're all just blunt. No rolled tips, it seems.
>>1169714
Well he does it for one handers so i'm sure he'd do it if you ask. Viktor Berbekucz makes a two hander with a rolled tip but it doesn't look like that.
>>1169661
>They literally just copied one dude for 400 years.
You just killed any credibility you had previously ever claimed.
Anybody here do empty-hand HEMA? I want to try some of it out but I don't know much about it.
What's near me is Bolognese grappling and Early English Pugilism.
>>1170220
I've done pugilism. It's a lot of fun. Kinda brutal though. Longsword sparring for example, you can gear up and take a lot of serious hits and be okay. With pugilism, it's basically the same as boxing. You can get fucking rocked hard.
