How intelligent are they? Do they resent and hate us? Will we ever make peace?
No. they are still pissed off about the Sea World thing.
>>2151917
Well how many sea world dolphins have been released? I'd imagine theyed only know about orcas abducted by sea world or being killed by whalers?
After all, pacific NW tribes have hunted orcas for centuries
>>2151918
Dolphins have been known to rape divers too.
>>2151912
>How intelligent are they?
Extremely, one of the most intelligent animals in the world
>Do they resent and hate us?
Only in Captivity especially seaworld.
In the wild they seem fascinated by us and go out of there way to interact with Humans, they don't attack humans either for some reason except in seaworld, no wild orca human fatalities.
>Will we ever make peace?
Humans and Orcas are one of the few wild species we are on good terms with.
They don't attack us, we don't attack them and we have the banter.
Though some shithole countries do hunt them.
>>2151912
I think the hierarchy goes like
crows
dolphins
dogs
monkeys
Not sure what else can be included with dolphins, but I guess whales might fit in there too.
>>2152075
I meant for intelligence ranking
>>2152075
>crows
Is this specific for corvids alone or do parrots / parrokeets also qualify?
>>2152075
are you excluding apes?
>>2151912
>How intelligent are they?
I think they're the smartest creatures on this planet. I base this on both personal experience and what I know about their biology and social behavior. Too be so much like us and be in no way related is shocking.
>>Do they resent and hate us?
As a whole, no. It's whales like Tilikum who lash out occasionally in captivity who seem to paint that image. They don't hate US. They hate what we DO. I think to them we are merely ignorant and don't realize just how intelligent they really are and they just put up with our shit as best as they can. They're waiting for us to wake up and realize that we're the same. We look for aliens out in space but they're right here in our fucking oceans and we could be talking to them right now if anyone really cared enough to invent the technology and manpower into decoding their language.
>Will we ever make peace?
There are signs of goodwill between cetaceans and humanity. In Brazil dolphins chase fish to eagerly awaiting fishermen with nets. A practice that's been going on for hundreds of years. The fishermen even throw back some of the fish to the dolphins as thanks for bringing in the fish. No one knows how this all started.
>>2151931
That's a myth. Sometimes they brush their penis against you but that's not rape. They're more or less messing with you for the lulz.
>>2152803
After watching Blackfish, I find astonishing how we managed to live with them for so long and understand so little about them.
The whole
>I can kill and capture the other animals, I must be the smartest.
I't sad and dumb, as you said, if marine biology had the resources of NASA, during the XX century,maybe we could be talking to whales and having a better relationship with our enviroment, but instead we wasted our money and resources, cause autists like maths and explosions.
Also fucking japs stop killing cetaceans, they come to my country to kill them, and my dumb politicians let them, it's fucked up.
>>2152828
If a smart animal brush his penis against me for fun, I'll feel raped, they have to cut that shit, is disturbing.
>>2152203
No I said monkeys
>>2152077
Lol can't wait to see how many people this triggers
>>2152075
>dogs
X O O O O
I strongly disagree
>>2151933
Don't the Japs kill them?
I've got a friend from Newfoundland who sailed in a tiny boat with a pack of them once. Said he was pretty spooked because they were bigger than the boat he was in.
>>2153194
Dogs are on such a wide scale of intelligence that you can't really clump them all together.
Would sour grapes spray wind my dog up if I put it on his collar to stop the other dog chewing it?
>>2152897
I'm just saying a dolphin isn't literally going to hold you down and penetrate you with its penis I don't know where anyone got that idea from. I think most of the time it seems like they just want you to leave the water and penis rubbing works every time.
>>2152828
What about ones that gang up on you and wrap them around your arms. Those things are like tentacles.
>>2153287
I've never heard of that happening. If you can provide me proof I'll be happy to explain it.
>>2153296
>>2153311
That's not proof.
Google the term “dolphin rape” and you'll find countless references to male dolphins raping female dolphins, males raping other males, gang rape, and even dolphins raping humans. You might even find this hoax webpage claiming that dolphins regularly kidnap swimmers and take them to a “rape cave.”Jun 17, 2013
>>2153311
http://justingregg.com/the-dolphin-rape-myth/
>>2151912
well does anyone have anything else to contribute or at least a question they'd like me to answer? After disproving that dolphin rape thing I'm down for anything.
>>2153268
>Though some shithole countries do hunt them.
You got ancient tribes who do not hunt them because they think they are baller yet the Japs do.
>Said he was pretty spooked because they were bigger than the boat he was in.
Theres one report of them maybe sinking a boat and then a bunch of reports of them using their technique to rock icebergs to knock seals off on boats but I would put it down to banter.
Closest thing to a wild fatality was some surfer claiming he got bit by one.
I don't know why Japs hunt them, they probably taste bad.
>>2154043
I can clarify this. The Japs say they hunt dolphins for pest control for eating too many fish. Basically they're blaming dolphins for their own mistake of overfishing their own seas for sushi ingredients. They see dolphins as a threat for their fish too so what do they do? Slaughter them and sell some as captives for profit.
>>2154045
it still doesn't fix the over fishing problem and just harms another species that's fucked up
>>2153280
Some people give them handies so now they expect every person to give one.
>>2154045
Japanese whaling and dolphin culls are heavily subsidized by their government. They're not at all profitable enterprises on their own because the average Japanese do not like whale or dolphin meat even despite the scarcity and high expense of other red meats in Japanese cuisine. Most dolphin and whale meat ends up in welfare food programs or as mystery meat in schools. The government also suppresses research into heavy metal toxicity in cetacean meats being fed to school children in much the same way the US government suppresses research in firearm injuries and fatalities. And yet most Japanese will vigorously defend their right to kill whales and dolphins.
I'm not sure why they do this but I like to believe it's a matter of pride and saving face for them to thumb their noses at the powers that defeated them and occupied their lands. They know we hate their dolphin and whale killing so they get to have something they can fight over with us without violating their laws or engaging in actual battle.
glad the dolphin rape meme is disproved already ITT. dolphin trainer anon here, all the stuff in here about dolphins or orcas as a species resenting/liking humans is a load of crock. it's not like all the cetaceans in the world communicate with each other, some pods are actually super isolated. each pod's previous experiences with humans will shape what they "think of us." just like with any species. we don't have some kind of spiritual connection with them; some pods are curious and others keep their distance
ask me questions if you want
>>2154367
Shut up faggot
>>2152897
The Japanese are special snowflakes, thankfully due to their backwards culture, they will eventually stop being significant.
>>2154331
Gun nuts have some arguments, but I don't understand why japs fell the need to keep doing this besides tradition.
They travel to the other side of the world to hunt whales in Antartica and nothing can stop them, I hate to be preachy but it's hard to justify hunting as a sport but as an industry it's unacceptable.
>>2154462
What's the history of whale hunting in Japan? I have no sense it was ever an industry with scale on par with the whale oil business run by Europeans.
>>2151912
They're smart enough to understand that people are neither a threat nor food. In captivity, they go crazy because so many of their instincts are fucked up (echolocation, swimming for long distances, forming social groups with their families instead of strangers, etc). I'm glad Sea World is done with whales. While it's sad we won't ever be able to see them up close in a few years, they're way too large and intelligent to be kept in captivity.
>>2154453
This.
Their unholy mixture of capitalism and reactionism is doomed to fail. I wonder which exotic country the neckbeards will idolise next.
>>2154523
It never was. From what I researched it started off as a spiritual connection because beached whales would arrive at just the right time to feed a village and keep the people from starving. They saw the whale as a gift from god and thanked it for its meat. It was only after they gained the technology to hunt them that they really went after them. such as boats and harpoons.
>>2154367
how much do you know about dolphins? for your profession you seem kind of misinformed. many species of whales communicate across the oceans therefore the world. god know what they're communicating you can't rule out that they are passing along information about us collectively. after all wild species of dolphins and whales do socialize with each other which means they must also be able to communicate look up humpback whales playing with dolphins and orcas cooperating with humpbacks. how would that be possible without communicating? there's even a pod of sperm whales that adopted a bottlenose dolphin with a spinal deformity. tell me again how it's impossible they couldn't possible be communicating with each other thoughts about us.
>>2154704
>it's not like all the cetaceans in the world communicate with each other
Is different from
>it's impossible they couldn't possible be communicating with each other thoughts about us
Humans aren't as special as you wish to believe, for most ocean animals except the very coastal or fished ones (or the one pod of dolphins in Mexico that help humans fish), I'd guess that humans are pretty low on their priorities list. If I had to guess it'd be that communication about relationships within the pod, sex, and food were 99% of their communication. Tell me you honestly believe cetaceans around the globe are spreading a collective word about "humans are our friends" or "humans are our enemies" like the OP seems to suggest. And for Dolphins and orcas in particular their pod culture and relationships are much stronger than relationships between pods, based on the amount of "culture" that is EXCLUSIVE to only one pod. Fuck some pods of orcas literally can't understand each other's communication, they're about to be broken into subspecies.
>>2154704
>>2154758
To clarify. I'm not saying it's impossible for different species of cetaceans to communicate with each other. I don't think we know enough about that to determine. I'm saying it's pretty egotistical for us as a species to assume that cetaceans around the world are spreading "resentment" or "trust" about humans
>>2154761
it's not egotistical we're a presence in their ocean now and they come in contact with us more and more. Whether it's our shipping fleets or commercial fishing or whale watching tours dolphins and whales come in contact with us and yeah I think they form their own opinions as a group and individuals depending on where they live so they would know what humans are dangerous and which places to avoid. you also have cases of dolphins who will literally put their lives on the line to save a human many times throughout history dolphins have saved humans from drowning and fought off sharks for us. why is this? it's more than just we're both mammals and we share some trait of compassion. i've literally never heard of any other wild animal that would put its life in danger for a human being it didn't know and has never even so much as fed it.
>>2154783
>you also have cases of dolphins who will literally put their lives on the line to save a human many times throughout history dolphins have saved humans from drowning and fought off sharks for us
Citation needed. Basically this is a myth, something we've romanticized but there's zero solid evidence for. See article below
http://www.slate.com/blogs/wild_things/2014/05/08/adam_walker_saved_by_dolphins_from_shark_attack_the_myth_that_dolphins_protect.html
It's not something that's impossible to ever happen, maybe it has a few times, but what 99% of these claims boil down to is "I saw a shark, then I saw Dolphins, and I wasn't bitten by the shark!!!" Which of course if you know anything about sharks is based off the misconception that they're savage maneaters and any time you see a shark you're basically dead. I dive a lot for fun and that situation literally happened to me last week: tiger shark cruised by to check us out, left, and a couple mins later a pod of dolphins go by. Dolphins and sharks are very commonly in the same place and this happens all the time.
For someone who claims to be informed about cetaceans it seems like most of your info comes from "common shit people say about dolphins" but isn't actually grounded in reality.
>>2154704
Most trainers aren't marine biologists. They're mostly /fit/persons who look good in speedo and are good at public speaking and can handle training animals. A lot of them got replaced right about the same time blowgate happened, especially older male trainers. Now it's almost an entirely female profession at the few aquariums I go to.
>>2154531
My guess is north korea to be quite honest. At some point workers will get fed up with having their surplus value extracted and their environment destroyed so leftism will be on the rise again, and the reactionaries will yet again all flock to the stalin figure exploiting the trend to implement more nationalism.
>>2151912
Whales are great. Orcas are bros, and porpoises are qt.
But dolphins? Fuck dolphins.
>Contribute nothing to seaciety
>Self-absorbed rapey assholes
>About as smart as cows
>Can't even eat them, their flesh is so full of mercury
Dolphins are jerks and I'm pretty sure that last thing is intentional. Just a final "fuck you" to decent, god-fearing animals.
I fucking love cetaceans. I'd actually be totally fine devoting my life to studying them, but job prospects for cetologists are piss poor to the point where you have to pay to be part of research trips even if you have the degree.
Anyway, I'm going to go see them up in New England in a few weeks.
>>2152075
dogs aren't really that smart, just well domesticated
>>2154923
http://www.afd.org.au/images-and-videos/extraordinary-stories/mans-real-best-friend-stories-of-dolphins-rescuing-humans
There you go. I'm starting to really doubt you're a dolphin trainer now if you are you're really poor at your job and I feel sorry for the aquarium you represent.
>>2155877
Believe or not dolphins are whales. They're toothed whales. Also I've already disproved that they've not rapists. If anything I'm sure more humans have raped them than they've ever even attempted to rape us.
Smart as cows? Cows don't use sonar so sophisticated that can be doubled as a language so where did you get that idea? Dolphins are even capable of tool use and are self aware. Are cows?
And you shouldn't eat them. It's wrong to eat the great apes for being self aware it should be for dolphins and whales too.
>>2154923
>Slate
>reliable source
I wut
>>2154700
And after WW2, it was a cheap source of meat.
Dunno why Macarthur didn't just go "fuck it, send the Japs SPAM. ALL THE SPAM" when he thought the whole whale thing up.
>>2156437
/an/ mostly believes all animals are self-aware.
not the sharpest cookies in the seat cushion.
>>2156451
but do you have proof that they are self aware? that's what I'm asking.
and all animals is kind of a blanket term are we talking about insects too?
>>2156457
no, they don't have proof.
and yes, they count insects.
>>2156460
in that case I'll just ignore them because that's bullshit.
Our species is too damned specific of what it considers "intelligence" because we romanticize having language barrier contact with a non human species. In actuality, intelligence is just another specialized trait and some animals have it more than others.
Amusing we want to search the stars for these beings when they already exist on earth, we just are unable to talk to them because of the language barrier or lack thereof.
>>2156517
>Amusing we want to search the stars
that'll pass once we realize the Drake Equation is bullshit and the only intelligent life we're ever going to meet is right here.
Aliums are the atheist's god. Just as real as the god they rejected. Someday we'll accept that we only get to deal with what's actually in front of us.
>You be good, see you tomorrow. I love you.
>>2156435
>>2156440
Oh fuck off. Your random ass website doesn't offer any citations either, only anecdotal stories.
From Dolphin Confidential by Maddalena Bearzi, an ACTUAL dolphin researcher and scientist:
>Many scientists think dolphins do not, in fact, save humans, because there is no hard scientific evidence to support these stories.
>MANY SCIENTISTS
>NO HARD SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE
Also, fuckwit, not all dolphin training is for educating the public. And even if it was you should be lucky that I'm not spreading these unscientific anecdotes to clueless people who are easily swayed by the "dolphins are our magical friends who save us because we have a special spiritual bond!" crowd. I work with, study, read about, and discuss with other marine biologists (yes, I'm a marine biologist by the way) about dolphins for a living. All of your information so far has been based off of random shit you heard from other people, dolphin memes if you will. I can almost guarantee you've never done any research, taken any classes, or read ANY scientific papers on dolphins. Fuck off with your high horse because your romanticized stories may not be true. Dolphins are part of the animal kingdom, so are we, so are ants. We don't share a magical or spiritual bond with them just because they have big brains and high social intelligence. Wild dolphins care way, way more about food, sex, and the other members of their pod than they ever will about you or any other human.
Yes, I'm mad.
>>2156594
So basically you're saying all those people who claim they've been saved by dolphins are lying? I'm sorry but I find that very hard to believe.
http://www.savethewhales.org/Dolphins_Rescuing_Humans.html
So all of these stories are just made up, huh?
So what kind of hard scientific evidence are we talking exactly?
Also stop putting words in my mouth.
And if you're not educating the public with dolphins then what are you doing with them if I may ask?
>>2156594
What about the story of Old Tom? You've probably never even heard of that orca. Go research that and tell me that isn't lies. Or is a whole town full of people lying too?
>>2156594
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2648352/Did-dolphins-save-girl-SUICIDE-Mammals-formed-ring-drowning-swimmer-guiding-boat-aid-claims-scientist.html
Here's a little something contrary to that scientist you just mentioned and this is supposed to be something she witnessed first hand, so...
>>2156594
‘That day I witnessed coastal bottlenose dolphins suddenly leave their feeding activities and head offshore. And in doing so, they led us to save a dying girl, some three miles offshore. Coincidence?’ Dr Bearzi wrote."
nvm I just realized this is the same article you read and now I'm just loling because you didn't even fucking read it.
>>2157050
this was literally right under that shit about there's no scientific evidence
still wondering what scientific evidence
do you want someone to get flipper on film saving someone from certain death to convince you that it's possible that they might care about something other than themselves?
>>2156594
Guess you're not a dolphin trainer after all. Oh well.
Anyone else work with cetaceans? I'd like to pick your brain a little about the industry.
>>2154367
It would be much apprrciated if you started your own ask me anything thread.
>>2151912
does anyone else legit think that cetaceans have some kind of sense that we aren't aware of besides echolocation? I just always get a weird vibe from them.
>>2156437
>attempted to rape us
They rape eachother, numbnuts
>Cows don't use sonar so sophisticated that can be doubled as a language
Rudimentary communication isn't necessarily an indication of high intelligence.
Cows are capable of establishing long-lasting relationships, recognizing dozens of individuals, and recognizing themselves in mirrors and we still eat them.
Dolphins are nothing special. Quit idolizing them because they're cute.
>>2160184
>recognizing themselves in mirrors
no
>>2160184
You are a retard. Go back to PETA.
>>2160184
how stupid are you? dolphins don't rape that's already been disproven in this thread
dolphins also understand concepts such as creativity and math. I don't think cows can. also fuck you.
>>2152897
>instead we wasted our money and resources, cause autists like maths and explosions.
Fine, retards like you can stay on earth and talk to dolphins forever then while the rest of us go to space
>>2154462
>I hate to be preachy but it's hard to justify hunting as a sport
It really isn't
>>2160413
Sport, no. As a hobby that gets you meat occasionally, it's ok. You could say it is some of the most ethical meat that we have (prey animal lived normal life until killed).
>>2160411
you mean the rich people. poor dumb people like you are going to be left behind to die dumbass. when this planet is no longer able to support the billions of human beings only the rich,smart and famous are going to be sent into space. not dumb fucks like you.
>>2160436
If for sport it is against a population we have eliminated the natural predators of, or it's an invasive species, not only is it ok, it should be encouraged.
(And I agree with hunting/fishing for meat too, I only eat wild game, factory farming is the worst shit, if you eat farmed meat but oppose hunting you're a fucking idiot)
