Let's say im a socially inept shut-in but willing to do something about it so hold your horses.
Let's say I'm trying to figure out the rules of the "game".
From what I understand - the reason we bother at all is we all have an inherent, inbuilt NEED for companionship - much like hunger. When it's not satisfied nasty things happen. Another reason is that it's simply easier to manage things in life when you don't do everything on your own. We also do it because we like it (when it's no longer a need, when not needy). Some of us socialize because we feel like losers if we don't - but I don't think this reason ALONE (opinion of others, self-esteem) is good enough to fuel and justify all this effort, hence I mention the previous.
What I'd like to get clear on is the specifics. How many human connections is healthy? How many friends and how many acquaintances? Does it even matter? Why? Does gender make much difference? I see people sticking to their own gender more often than not. Would your partner not get jealous if it was otherwise? I don't make any distinction for "family", you don't always know or are on good terms with each and every member so they count to me as friends/acquaintances in your "starter pack" you get when you're born. How much time do you dispense to each chosen contact and why that amount? How often do you contact/spend time with them and why? What decides it's time to drop them completely?
I think probably as with everything eventually you get a "hang of it" and manage these things intuitively. But people like me who been out of the loop for too long I think need this extra bit of introduction. If you're "in the loop" you may see this as pointless/annoying/pedantic/stupid. Feel free to link me to resources if you don't feel like writing lengthy answers - as long as they're on topic.
If you respond with insults or criticism which is not constructive - expect the same in return. The last bit sounded a bit gay but had to say it, faggot.
>>17226412
>Let's say I'm trying to figure out the rules of the "game".
>the "game"
>"game"
I realized everything after this would be whiny bullshit and I quit reading.
>>17226425
Thanks for that answer, truly insightful.
Why don't you suck a fuck and kill yourself?
>>17226465
This is like the core issue of almost the half the threads here. Nobody here has anything close to advice. It becomes so much harder as you get older.
The secret is the rules of the game change depending on who you're playing with.
You can make any rules you want for your relationships, but a good relationship involves sharing and agreeing on some rules.
People sometimes hide their rules though, or expect everyone to know them. Because some people think humans are hivemind and all share the same rules.
There is not a set number of human connections you need. Some people are introverted, some are extroverted. Gender can make a difference. Partners can get jealous. But it's not some 100% rule where you're not allowed friends of the opposite gender. If someone is trying to prevent you from making friends with the opposite gender, that person is seen as controlling and is likely bad news.
There isn't a set amount of time I spend with people. I'm more introverted, I don't have enough people I'm close with that I need to juggle them. I haven't decided to drop people completely, it seems like something that just happens overtime (like with highschool friends). Even then, I talk to them maybe a couple times a year. It's just more reminiscing than talking about current things. We don't see each other and don't have day-to-day things to talk about or share a friend circle anymore. Personally I'd drop someone if they were a bad friend/bad person to be around.
>People sometimes hide their rules though, or expect everyone to know them.
That's very true and it's a mistake I unfortunately made many times myself
>There is not a set number of human connections you need.
Perhaps whatever works / is needed. When you feel there is a need for more (yeah I know, not very precise) - you get more, and vice versa.
>Partners can get jealous.
>If someone is trying to prevent you from making friends with the opposite gender, that person is seen as controlling and is likely bad news.
Maybe it's about their ability to not interfere DESPITE feeling jealous - if no rules were broken. A kind of immaturity.
>I don't have enough people I'm close with that I need to juggle them.
If there is at least 2 of them you may start ignoring one for the sake of the other and that can lead to endless shit.
>I haven't decided to drop people completely
Seriously? None of your "pals" ever screwed you over? Never had your "friends" let you down when you needed their help most?
>Personally I'd drop someone if they were a bad friend/bad person to be around.
Perhaps it's when they fuck up ur trust beyond "fixing" (and not even trying) that it's time to toss them out of your life/contact list.
>>17227118
responds to
>>17226535
OP here, perhaps it's not about "specifics" so much as confidence because I seem to know the answers when I really want to.
By confidence I mean the feeling that ur not full of shit or somehow "inherently incapable" (insecurity) of doing anything well socially - an "argument" scum can (ab)use once they realize you're "weird" to convince you you somehow fucked up even if you didn't do shit. At the same time remembering that like everyone you also make mistakes.
Perhaps that's what it's REALLY about.
This sounds silly but if you want to understand the ideal social life you'll watch King of the Hill.
Hank has three friends, a few acquaintances, some family. He works, does chores at home, and makes time for pleasurable activity. He isn't in his wife's ass but he does spend regular time with her. He has dinner with the extended family every so often and on holidays.
Really, KOTH is a fantastic guide to being a normal adult.
Maslow's hierarchy of needs, yes we need/want to be with someone.
I don't think it's that complicated.
>>17227286
Yes. YES
>>17227389
When you've never connected with anbody since the age of 5, it seems hella complicated.
I sit adjacent to my work colleuges, just to hear what they talk about but it still sounds like another language.
>>17227780
I understand idividual word and phrases but it still sounds foreign to me.
Here's the issue with people like you: you come on here and write a short story full of silly "problems" that you expect some sage to provide the answers to. You selfishly believe that life is a game that you can prevail over others in if you just find out the right things to do and say in life. But there are none. You wouldn't think for a second to go outside and ask someone how they are doing today, or get them to talk about themselves. To find others interesting. When James Joyce said "I never met a boring person," he meant that if you observe anyone long enough, you will find that they are a labyrinth of behaviors and thoughts and fears and emotions and aspirations and all that other stuff. Just like you. Once you realize that you're just like everyone else, then you can find what you're looking for.
>>17226412
>What I'd like to get clear on is the specifics.
Too bad, they're not clear. People are not easy or simple.
All your quantitative questions are pointless and have no answer.
Gender makes a difference in that women are statistically more extroverted: the difference is obvious at the low end of the scale (high introverts) with psychiatric disorders like autism, schizoid, etc being heavily male.
>Would your partner not get jealous if it was otherwise?
Some do.
>How much time do you dispense to each chosen contact and why that amount?
However much you want. I have 1 "chosen contact" and so all of my socialization is directed towards her.
>How often do you contact/spend time with them and why?
Random intervals. Whenever i have something to say or want to ask about how they've been doing.
We exchange some texts every few days or so.
>What decides it's time to drop them completely?
When the friendship is obviously dead, ie when they no longer respond normally to messages (eg they take a week to give a one-word reply).
>>17226412
>eventually you get a "hang of it" and manage these things intuitively.
Some don't, such as autists, schizoids, sociopaths, etc, who must rely heavily on their conscious mind to handle normally unconscious social processing and behavior.
>>17227894
People like OP (socially isolated) don't necessarily think that way. Autists usually don't, for example.
Have some faith.
>>17228124
I think that, barring actual autism, you can learn to socialize and meet human needs under normal circumstances
I think the number of relations depends on each person. I have three main people I'm close to, but others probably need more. But I'm also a kind of solitary person and I like keeping my personal information private. I think this is something each person needs to decide on their own. Different people have different needs simply put.
t. semi reformed shutin
>>17227894
>You selfishly believe that life is a game that you can prevail over others in
I disagree with this very much so. The issue is typically figuring out how to participate in the game to begin with, rather than dominating it. There are some that are Elliot Rodgers tier, but I believe those are a distinct minority as far as shut ins go.
>>17227286
Thanks, seems like an actually good point of reference. Actually mean it.
>>17227389
Was kinda my point in >>17227194
that when ur insecure despite knowing ur shit you don't act like it.
>>17227894
>you expect some sage to provide the answers to
Advice is fine. Thought I'm on the advice board m8. What's your problem?
>You selfishly believe that life is a game that you can prevail over others in if you just find out the right things to do and say in life
I think it's more about filling maslow's pyramid as >>17227292
pointed out. "Prevailing over others" imo only matters if you already believe you're somehow 'inferior' to others and feel you've something to prove to your peers. That's teenager/manchild tier motivation, no offense
>You wouldn't think for a second to go outside and ask someone how they are doing today, or get them to talk about themselves
If it helps you good. You do things your way, I do things my way.
Someone sounds butthurt. Not my fault you feel inferior to me, didn't do shit. CUNT
This is exactly the kind of shit I was talking about in >>17227194
when I'm confident I don't let people tell me I fucked up if I there's no legit basis for it.
>>17228124
>All your quantitative questions are pointless and have no answer.
Starting to recognize it too.
>However much you want. I have 1 "chosen contact" and so all of my socialization is directed towards her.
That's like binging on one type of food.
>Some don't, such as autists, schizoids, sociopaths, etc, who must rely heavily on their conscious mind to handle normally unconscious social processing and behavior.
And your point is? Being a "monkey see monkey do" on autopilot is somehow better? How exactly? What are the "types" you listed supposed to do instead? Let me guess - "kill themselves". You're a genius.
I don't know which "type" I fall into, neither care enough to check "to get proper help" which consists of pretty much being even more socially marginalized while everyone yourself included pretending it's "for your own good". My ass. I'm not playing the "pick a disease/anomaly to justify being weird" game. It can help but up to a point. Shrinks can't help you unless you help yourself anyway, isn't that like their motto or something.
>>17228146
Not like there's much alternative.
>>17228169
>I have three main people I'm close to
Do they feel jealous of each other? Happens to me all the time and it's a pain in the ass.
>I disagree with this very much so. The issue is typically figuring out how to participate in the game to begin with, rather than dominating it.
Spot on
>>17226412
OP you are fucked. A lot of us are in the same boat. We're nasically the runts of the litter who should have been mercifully killed at birth.
>>17228430
>hurr I gave up, give up too so I don't feel like an ass
And do what? Keep whining on /r9k/ about how lonely I am? For how long?
Why EXACTLY should I accept the thought of being "litter"? How does it help me? (besides no longer feeling the pressure to actually DO something about my problems)
It's one thing to have a difficult time, another to be a fucking loser. You give shutins a bad name m8.
>>17228412
>That's like binging on one type of food.
Nobody else around here that I want to talk to.
And a strained 10-minute conversation every few days isn't exactly binging.
I'm not a social guy (schizoid) so i'm not a typical specimen, exactly.
>Being a "monkey see monkey do" on autopilot is somehow better?
Yes, because it doesn't require conscious processing power. Like having a GPU takes the graphics processing load off of the CPU.
>What are the "types" you listed supposed to do instead? Let me guess - "kill themselves".
No, they cope by handling it all with the conscious parts of the brain.
And don't worry, nobody expects you to seek help, people like you are notorious for avoiding it.
You're not gonna get diagnosed with anything fixable anyway.
>>17228430
No. You're probably seeing too much of yourself in OP.
>>17228462
>You give shutins a bad name m8.
Shut-ins give shut-ins a bad name. M8.
I'm just saying there's no real useful advice here you could't get from a fortune cookie. Your thread is one of many that have the same core issue of socializing. But /adv/ has no advice to give for it which is why the same thread repeats itself.
On the bright side if you're one of those underage b& morons who keep posting on this site, you still have many years to straighten your life out.
The cutoff point is around 25.
You just need to get off the internet dude. This place has poisoned your fucking mind in where everything's a debate and your honor is at stake. I've seen it so many times. I was that guy myself at one point. Go out in the world and be agreeable for like a week and I promise you something will click.
>>17228497
>Nobody else around here that I want to talk to.
Fair enough. You'll get tired of it after a year ...or two of ...living with her though. 100% guarantee it.
>all of my socialization is directed towards her.
>And a strained 10-minute conversation every few days isn't exactly binging.
We (as humans) need more than that. Apologies, thought you see her often.
>Yes, because it doesn't require conscious processing power. Like having a GPU takes the graphics processing load off of the CPU.
The Unreal (first one) devs pulled off a pretty good job with their software renderer. You optimize the code regularly and it runs quicker. You are right thought. It's a TON of work, burdens your mental space incredibly. What's your alternative? Change the "GPU" just like that? Accept isolation? You're making effort despite being schizoid, why shouldn't I? unironically gg with ur gf if not being a fucking dick/liar about it
>And don't worry, nobody expects you to seek help, people like you are notorious for avoiding it.
help > "help"
>You're not gonna get diagnosed with anything fixable anyway.
Hurr getting ready to whine, feel bad about myself and being a bitter cynical fuck like you. What's your problem? You need ur asshole fisted? Think I have/had it any easier?
>>17228501
>Shut-ins give shut-ins a bad name. M8.
No, just the whiny fat loser shits like you.
>I'm just saying there's no real useful advice here you could't get from a fortune cookie.
Thanks for the warning. How about I let my own mental faculties judge what's "useful" for me though? Something apparently you never ever do.
>/adv/ has no advice to give for it which is why the same thread repeats itself
You haven't passed the "cognitive distortions" tier yet, not sure I wanna talk to you unitil you do, let me guess - "what's the point"
>The cutoff point is around 25.
Get fucked and blow it out your ass. Not feeling sorry for dogshit like you. Crawl back to /r9k/ where your place is.
>>17228526
Something will click alright if anyone tries to get me to "go out" by using force/intimidation not legit intel.
Been there, done that.
I've done the "let the GPU do the magic, trust it" too many times to fall for this shit again. If you don't get the "GPU" analogy I don't really wanna talk to you. Nothing personal, just not wasting time on bullshit. If you're not making effort why the fuck should I. Done doing all the fucking effort for fucking morons.
Shouldn't even respond to cunts like >>17228501
I'm the one getting advice here, all he's giving me is pure horse shit
>>17228618
>You'll get tired of it after a year ...or two of ...living with her though. 100% guarantee it.
I'm tired after a week of texting her. This is actually far more than i normally socialize, i'm really trying here.
The unfortunate part about schizoid is that i don't need casual social contact and it just irritates me, but i do want and need deep connections with people. The problem is that deep connections only come after extensive casual bullshit for most people: i hate small talk and such with a passion and hate having to do so much of it before we can skip to the baring-our-souls part.
That's actually why i'm talking to this girl and not everyone else: she's perfectly happy with that.
And thankfully she has a bf. I'm very far from ready to be anyone's boyfriend (at least any normal girl's).
That's kind of the trick to socializing: find the right people and it becomes much easier to tolerate and even enjoy.
As a kid i was friends with all the freaks, weirdos, rejects, autists, etc i could find, since i could just sit down next to them and start talking about whatever strange shit or weird-ass hobbies and they would to. We'd be instant best friends, it was awesome.
The problem is that they all decided to go into engineering and computer science, and I chose medicine.
That's another important thing: environment plays a big role in how easy and enjoyable it is to socialize with like-minded people (or even find them in the first place).
And relax, man. I mean there's not much of a point in going since you don't sound crazy, as in it doesn't sound like there's anything deeply wrong with you that a psychiatrist can help with. I'd just say "minor cluster-B traits" at most.
>>17228779
>but i do want and need deep connections with people
the good/bad news is it's prolly gonna be with tards like me in similar/same shit because others wouldn't be assed/patient/empathetic enough to put up with .........software rendering, unless were already doing it themselves 24/7
>i hate small talk and such with a passion
I consider ITT a form of small talk, casuals talk about the weather, itc we talk pseudo-intellectual "deep" meme-flavoured horse dung, same difference
Oh wait, you don't do the meme part. It serves as "comic relief" for the audience.
>hate having to do so much of it before we can skip to the baring-our-souls part
Because you don't realize the dangers of getting too "close" to WRONG people. The mask is used for a reason, it's to not expose your true feelings/thoughts to people who turn out to be assholes. Everyone uses masks, very few know they're using them, even fewer use them right (I'm not).
>That's kind of the trick to socializing: find the right people and it becomes much easier to tolerate and even enjoy.
Agreed.
>The problem is that they all decided to go into engineering and computer science, and I chose medicine.
You sure fucked up. IT/Coding is the only area (that I know of) where... "this" is tolerated and even valued.
>it doesn't sound like there's anything deeply wrong with you that a psychiatrist can help with
I'll take that as a compliment
"insults" are part of the ritual, you were cranky yourself. niggers do this too for what it's worth
>>17228941
>You sure fucked up.
So where does OP look now?
OP again.
What if I simply need to associate with my "own kind", and it's just that simple. It's not like anything "new" or revolutionary either. There's even a saying for it - "birds of a feather fag together". How about doing THIS instead of trying hard to be the common denominator joe sixpack. I don't mean this in any derogatory way/sense/whatever, there's a lot to learn from joe/hank, but probably vice versa. In b4 insults and more whiners.
>>17229723
...and it CAN be/is hard because "my own kind" tends to hide in caves just like myself (metaphorically speaking). The interbutt is a great tool though for luring scum out.
100 years ago shut-ins would have to accept "being fucked", occasionally giving so called "just talking to people" a try or being taken out by force, failing miserably, becoming more firm in their belief that "it's not for them". Thanks to advances in civilization it no longer has to be the case.
What some of you dimwits don't realize is what YOU think is keeping us from going outside (internet) is actually the main source of both online and irl contact and if we "cut it off" it makes things WORSE, not "better" in that respect. Not everyone is a lazy shit that just needs that "extra push", I know it's mind-blowing but some people have genuine problems.
It seems to me that most "naysayers" are in the exact same shit. They just don't want to face up to the fact that there could POSSIBLY be something they could do about things because it opens up a can of SHIT they already made peace with not opening ever again. If you REALLY cared about your comfort you'd take care of the long term comfort as well. This need is not going anywhere and good luck dealing with it when ur 70. Whiny turds.
>>17229703
Not sure what you're asking.
>>17227894
>Once you realize that you're just like everyone else, then you can find what you're looking for.
I used to think if it is humanly possible, I could do it as well, but reality shown me otherwise. I am also socially awkward.
The last time I had friends was in grade school, not really friends but they hung around me because I had a lot of shit(cash/games/bikes ect).
Nowadays people just come off as assholes and it built a bitterness inside me. I really want to believe that I am like everyone else, but since I don't follow social stigmas(which I think most are fucking stupid) they definitely treat me like an outcast.
>>17229865
What sort of other autists did you have in mind? The only ones that come to mind are geeks but that attracts regular cool people now.
>>17229977
Maybe "in a way" everyone is the same and yet "in a way" different. Kind of like procedurally generated enemies/characters that share same stats but are tweaked differently. Does it really matter? Point is to get needs fulfilled. Is it not?
Outcasts will treat you as one of their own. I don't treat you like an outcast do I.
>>17230050
Whatever you'd describe urself to be like (or wanna be like, not coming from outside pressure) without whining imo
>>17227286
Wow, thats actually very true.
Life is all about balance really.
This may be make-believe on my part and I have no proof for this... but what if simulating what it's like to be "social" by trying to figure out the mechanics of it and participating in THIS fashion that we're more comfortable with serves as a sort of a "crutch" or an "enhancement" (hurr) or "conduit", rather than a "replacement" for the DEFAULT mechanism everyone seems to rely on?
What if it's off because it wasn't used much, and it wasn't used much because it was off?
I like the anal-logy/idea of the "Social Enhancer" from Deus Ex: Human Revolution
All I'm saying that perhaps there's more than one way to skin a cat. Or maybe not - fuck it then, I'll just do something else.
