SO, I think we can all agree patreon is bullshit, at least when it comes to artists that put their art behind walls for nonpaying viewers to see. For many who would WANT to support, but can't, this is complete bullshit.
Is there a way we could get some "undercover: system going here? like, someone who can drop a penny or so on a patreon page download the images that are locked behind patron walls, and put them on here, and maybe even a private imgur folder. a "Patreon Penetrator", if you will?
Who's in?
>>423844
I really WANT to buy a car, but can't. Will someone buy one for me? It's bullshit that manufacturers expect me to pay money.
>>423844
Entitled much? Artists can do whatever they want with their art, you have no inherent right to it.
>>423844
You're aren't entitled to their work.
They spend many hours to complete their work. Many artists are even able to devote more time to their work instead of a job because of patreon.
It sucks that you can't see the content, but the pay wall helps assure the artist can pay their bills.
Stop being an entitled little shit
>>423844
This isn't the film industry. The dollar you pay doesn't go towards a bunch of shareholders. While Patreon does get a cut, most of the money goes towards paying for the artist's living. Without that money the artist would have to work doing something else and you wouldn't get to yank it to a steady stream of furry shark vore. Once you let everyone bypass the paywall, the artist's monetary support will shrink and they will have to go back to spending more time working in another job. Imagine if you find a Netflix account on google that everyone could use at once and they couldn't stop it. Netflix would shut down.
>posting fur shit
Anyway most threads already have people who leak relevant artist's stuff anyway.
>>423844
Artists buy food and pay for rent with the paywall you ass hat. Patreon takes a small cut for providing the platform, most artists on there literally need the money to live.
TL:DR = You are an ass hat.
>>423919
What's the problem with Patreon specifically?
>>423922
>>423912
you all act like their aren't artists doing just fine without patreon, which there are plenty of. they get jobs, and still put heart into their work.
Patreon is for people too lazy to contribute to society. they want to make money on their hobby? just do personal or public commissions like everyone else. wanna make an industry on your art? make it your career and go to art school like every normal artist, and will continue to do.
>>423937
>Don't do what you want to do, do what I want you to do. If I don't think it's a career/job, it's not, you fucking freeloader. Gimme my Lolo robot futa right now.
>>423937
You're a troll, right? This is a troll thread, right?
If not, get over yourself, OP. It's not the artist's fault you're too cheap to pay for your porn.
>>423937
Either troll or jelly.
>>423844
The Artists are making a product you want, you pay them for that product, you get porn, they get food, everyone's happy...this isn't that complex.
What artist are you specifically after? Tell us whose art you desperately want to see, but can't scrounge up $5 to see so we can laugh at you.
>>423844
In my experience, most artists don't lock art behind Patreon forever anyway. If they have art that is Patreon Exclusive, they set a period of time for which it is so, and then start posting it to their website/artsite account/ect.
Actually, if anything, what most graphic artists do with a Patreon userbase is use them to poll for content, and raffle off free commissions.
So, being an entitled shit really gets you little if anything no matter what.
>>423844
>ITT: An entitled shit gets shut down by rational people.
>>423844
>I want things I can't pay for and they refuse to give it to me! WAAAAAHHHHHH NOT FAIR
what are you, 6? If you can't afford something you want it's called Too Fucking Bad. Get a better job or save up money.
>>423924
People using it as a paywall
>>424094
More like "OP is sighing in disappointment at people on /d/ not wanting MORE free porn..."
Since when did 4chan become a site full of goodie-two-shoes? Do you fags pay for movies and music as well?
>>423844
my frustration with paetron is how it affected the commission market. Like, I don't want to view your stream and pretend to be your friend for a couple months for a chance at art. I'd rather just pay full price upfront and be done with it.
>itt people that i guarantee you have torrented or are torrenting tons of music/movies/games jerk off people that draw dicks on the internet, or are them/wanna be them themselves.
as if /aco/ wasn't enough of a circlejerk.
i WOULD download a car. fuck all of you
>>424128
>>424142
The problem here isn't that OP wants free shit it's that he's being an extra sack of shit about it.
I pirate shit all the time, but I don't act like people are bullshit for wanting to make money. If I had the chance to quit my bullshit job and spend all my time writing or drawing smut I'd do it in a second.
I wonder if all these faggots against this idea use any porn sites like pornhub, xhampster, redtube, etc. Because it's the exact same concept. Videos get leaked from sites and reposted onto the above for people to view freely.
If you're against the above idea, yet you still use free porn sites, get the fuck over yourself you pretentious fuck.
Also, I donate to several patreons, so I'm not a free loading cunt, but at least I'm not a fucking hypocrite.
>>423844
Man. Artists put in hard work; and you just want that content for free? They are doing this as a job, putting HOURS into each picture, and you are one of the scummy online fuckers who expects free content for your personal pleasure, because you think you're fucking entitled to it.
The replies in this thread make me so happy. I love you guys.
>I think we can all agree
>nobody agrees
This made me laugh harder than it should have.
>SO, I think we can all agree patreon is bullshit
Yeah gosh how DARE people ask for money for their time, skill and effort.
my only issue with patreon is when its used to fuck over people.
I've seen artists that keep making free stuff for their fans, and give variations or WIP versions to patrons, and thats cool. but then theres the ones that stick the middle finger up to whatever fanbase that they had before patreon and put all content behind a paywall and spam heavily censored or cropped work on their blogs. I mean how annoyed would you be to find out the pic that made you become a patron of a porn artist was a SFW piece with a misleading teaser.
But the worst I've seen is a guy that's like pay me $10 a month to get my comic, then he updates maybe once a month, and delays the patreon work to make multiple other comics to sell outside of patreon, all the while spending about 3 month with only text updates saying stuff like "i'm working on it guys, real life is real busy"
its guy like those that give it a really negative image
I don't know why you guys are acting like /aco/ is some bastion of intellectual property.
Patreon stuff gets leaked all the time usually to much applause.
>>424246
It's the entitlement this colossal faggot is coming off with.
I don't pay artists, but I don't complain that I don't get to see what I don't see worth paying for, and I don't beg someone else to pay for me.
If you want it 'for free' go be a hacker or some shit and break past the paywall or scam some other gullible 14 year old shitstirrers over on /b/ to pay it for you. Put some effort into your fucking thievery.
>>424450
>beg someone else to pay for me
You don't have to do this.
Patreon is shit so all you have to do is pledge and you get all their previous stuff and then withdraw your pledge before payment time comes up.
>>423844
furry isn't allowed here
Greedy artists who expect you to pay for porn shitscribbles are scum.
>>424148
>My porn doodle is the same as a high quality car!
>>424450
>entitlement
Now you just sound like the artist's defensive little whore.
ITT: Entitled artists who think they have to be paid for their hobby
>>423844
>>423937
Holy fuck OP sure does feel entitled to every-fucking-thing doesn't he?
What the hell is the problem of having people that are willing to pay toward a patron of an artist to help support them and their work? The guy doesn't even fucking give a good argument why it's shit, this is nothing more than a childish rant that OP can't get something he wants for free. How pathetic.
>>424220
I can agree on that. I've seen that a few times before as well, stopped watching certain people because they slogged down on their actual work over other shit. Though in fairness, some patreons just don't get enough cash to help support the artists so they're forced into needing to do such things. It's just one of those things that need a judgement call on if they're being asshats or if they're doing it to help with getting by.
>>424246
And that's true. Quite often patreon work is leaked to places, or we get the artists having their work timed to where they'll put it out eventually and have patrons being the first to get access to the work. Most of the time, it's not IF you get the work, just WHEN.
>>424617
>we get the artists having their work timed to where they'll put it out eventually and have patrons being the first to get access to the work
The only acceptable way to use patreon.
>>424627
I can agree with that, to a certain degree. Things like sketches for certain works or maybe things like roughs on a comic page so the patreons are the first to see that kind of stuff, I could see that being just exclusive. But their really big stuff, I'd prefer if it was a timed exclusive before eventually moving onto allowing everyone to see the work.
I want you all to know that OP made my cancer reach stage 4, please kill me.
>>424668
We'd be better off without suckups like you anyway.
>>424670
Oh god you've done it, you've unlocked a new cancer, it's evolved into something even I couldnt imagine, stage 5.
>>424670
All those flavors and you chose salty.
>>424685
Enjoy your death then.
>>423844
I won't buy you patreon, but I would buy you a dildo so you can go fuck yourself
>>424714
I hate you for being a furfag but I otherwise agree with you on everything.
>>424719
Well, "technically", the artist says it's a dragon, but yeah. Pretty faggoty here. GF is too, so we'll probably burn together.
>>424721
That shitposter is still alive? How unfortunate.
>>424722
I know, right? Kinda wish I killed myself weeks ago, too!
Why hasn't this shit thread been deleted yet?
>>424740
Stop bumping this shit thread retard you're as bad as him.
>>424740
There, that make you feel better? There's still some warm milk on the counter...
Can a mod just delete this thread already?
>>423844
I CAN'T FAP TO THIS THREAD
>>423847
called a loan senpai
>>424755
Fucking this
>>423844
Just admit you don't want to pay for it. Have some pride.
>>424220
The beautiful thing about this system is, that you can just stop giving the guy money if you aren't satisfied with his work.
>>425011
That rarely ever seems to happen though.
>>423844
Alternative idea! You spend years of your life learning to make high quality art, then make tons of it and give it to us for free? Fair?
>>425039
>High quality
The lady thinks too highly of herself.
>>424755
OP got fucked super hard, that's pretty hot.
>>424702
Oh god its unbelievable I'm the equivalent of cesspool with out the healing factor.
>>426202
Found shadman.
>>426335
Are you fucking retarded? He has is own FREE website. The only thing behind is patreon is a WIP gallery. Stop baiting you stupid fuck.
If you want free shit you gotta work for it
That is why if i ever set up a patreon it would just be per completed work and a finished one, not a rushed thing.
>>423844
greedy shits like OP is why artists have such a hard time making a living
if you're not giving them money they don't owe you shit
you want free art, give 'em free food and shelter
>>423912
It's EXACTLY the same as the film or music industries: creative people getting ripped off because lazy slugs don't want to spend money on their wares
I'd feel sorry for artists if they weren't major torrenters of shit themselves. until they clean up their act, MR GORBACHEV TEAR DOWN THIS PAYWALL!
>>424151
you pirate shit all the time but you have a problem with someone asking for assistance in pirating some shit.
>>muh artist friends need the money
>>muh kkkorporations are too big to hurt
the best part is that when people start Patreon rips, just like with JigglyGirls and Hizzacked, these small fry artists won't be able to do shit about it, just put on some pirated sad music and cry.
>>423844
>73 replies
>0 images
I'll be damned if i'm not going to try and fap to this
>For many who would WANT to support, but can't
First off, you're a cunt, because there's no way you intended it this way, but there are circumstances where, despite you want to give money to Patreon, and you have money to give to Patreon, you can't. Whether your payment service is declined, or because of the country you live in. It can actually be a big bummer if you wanna support someone, but can't, and you're stuck being unable to see art you'd otherwise be able to see. Patreon is pretty fickle about what payment types are allowed afterall. Most artists, however, are aware of this. I've sent a tracfone card ID number to an artist as payment for a commission since I couldn't otherwise send them money. You can usually work it out with an artist.
If you just wanna pirate, don't be fucking meek about it. You don't need to rationalize it. You can say "Well, I don't have a Nielsen Box, so it's not that bad" as much as you want, but it doesn't change the fact that you're stealing. Don't act like you're on some just cause. Just fucking say, "I want something for nothing." 20% of this board is already Patreon exclusive shit. We are stealing. You are asking to steal. Fucking own up to the fact that you're the most pathetic form of a thief that currently exists. We all are. And we're gonna say fag and nigger a lot like we're in some Tarantino film and act all tough. But we're petty thieves who rely on other people to do the heavy lifting. The sooner everyone fucking admits that to themselves, the less of this shit.
Image irrelevant because fucking christ, someone should have posted porn to begin with.
>>427229
>Copying content is the same as theft, which removes the original content from the owner.
Wrong.
>>424142
>i WOULD download a car. fuck all of you
Well sure, who the fuck wouldn't? But do we see you making threads on /o/ about how unfair it is that companies won't give you free cars? I highly doubt it.
>>427229
it's not as simple as "you're just thieves, accept it" and it's not as simple as "I'm doing this because fuck the establishment". It's a variety of reasons which influences people differently on a case-by-case basis.
If it was just "I want this for free", then we wouldn't be seeing so many pirates converted by services that are about as or even more convenient to use than the piracy options.
>>427232
You maintain the illusion that your poorly drawn porn has value like a car does.
The only problem I really have is artists are still keeping things hidden from us even if they have a pateron set up.
DAMMIT I WANNA SEE WHAT WHAT LEWDS YOU'RE DRAWING! HOW MUCH DO I HAVE TO THROW AT YOU TO SEE THE STICK PEOPLE YOU DOODLE!
FUCK
>>423844
Are you so poor OP that you can't even spare $5-$10 for the month? Seriously, don't buy a case of soda for the week and you get lewds to wank to senpai.
>>427231
>copying leaves the original, therefore you're not a thief
Nice logic, friend!
>>427239
Yep, that's sound logic. You forgot to construct a strawman, pose a disagreement, or otherwise make any kind of differing argument to what I said.
>>427235
Easy there with those assumptions broke nigga, any art that I've ever made is freely available dA since I'm a Level 1 scrub. And obviously art doesn't have the same value, or else they'd be charging thousands upon thousands of dollars you daft fucking cunt.
>>427237
They don't deserve the money, is the crux of the issue.
>>427245
Porn scribbles have no value.
>>427247
Then why do you even want them? Clearly they do have value or this thread would not exist.
>>427248
>You
I didn't make the thread.
>>427251
Ok? That doesn't change my point.
>>427259
Opposing the idea of paywalls doesn't necessarily mean I desire the content behind them.
>>427242
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_fallacy
Now go back to primary school
>>427267
If you'll read your own link, you'll realize that you are using the fallacy fallacy, the use of an accusation of fallacy to attempt to discredit an argument and/or the illusion that an argument is made invalid by containing a fallacy. You even failed to explain what fallacy you believe was used.
>>427247
But they do, that's why patreon artists are getting paid to do them.
>>427340
People in Haiti pay money for pretty colored dirt to make into dirt cookies. It doesn't mean the dirt has actual value, only that morons think it does.
>>427352
So basically the people defending patreon have no proper sense of value?
tbqh senpai the auction shit is actually annoying shit trend when people realize they could milk money shit out of furfags who actually buy into it
>>427352
Value is subjective moron...
>>427358
Indeed. They don't know the TRUE value of things, that has nothing to do with their actual market value. Only I know how much things are really worth and I get really upset when they don't actually cost that.
>>427369
They spend it on dirt because they can't afford real food, idiot.
>>427374
They spend it on dirt because they value the dirt over food, my dear beloved anon.
>>423844
Paywalling is not nice. Which is why I post my art free, while patrons get EXTRA stuff. win-win
So, anyone wanna actually do this, now? Like, Somebody list an artist, what do ou want? Sure someone will work on it if SOMEONE gets the ball moving...
>>423844
patreon is for faggots, i'm not spending a dime on these idiot for them to draw fucked up shit for me when there's so much stuff for free anyway. it's like paying for air. people who spend money on this are sheep being fleeced
>>428156
All the ones I know about already get regularly leaked anyways.
>>423924
overcharging and under-delivering.
When some up-and-comming artists wants 20- bucks a month and puts out one or two images in that time. For me personally any artist who wants website money has to match what I got from the dimitry's network.
There is also the annoyance of supporting a bunch of artists separately, again when I can pay one fee for 5 or so sites worth of established content
>>428620
its disgusting
i mean, if i were to do patreon shit, i'd do it within the bounds of my ability, i ain't charging no 20 bucks for shit art, kinda doubt i could even charge 5 bucks for it, but still.
You know, I support both sides of the argument.
Artists need money to draw for you, and the pay distribution is not sustainable by most individuals.
However, don't be an entitled faggot. You should never expect someone to do something for you just because you insist it should be done.
You have to give a little to get a little.
On the plus side, the Patreon system is better than the Japanese model, you work to death for a single CG set and kill yourself doing it.
So, while everyone else complains; do we have anything that's actually constructive floating around here?
>>428831
>Gated shit content that doesn't end up in galleries is better than being able to get stuff easily dumped and uploaded anywhere.
No.
>>428840
I think the thrust of that guy's argument is "artist gets paid and is able to produce more art." You do realize that these are human beings with bills to pay and groceries to buy, right? These guys and girls are trying to keep the lights on, and you want to bitch about how it makes stealing from them slightly more inconvenient
>>428851
They shouldn't be trying to live on porn doodles and putting their porn doodles behind a paywall. You're a pathetic suckup.
>>428156
No ones going to do it because the whole premise of this thread is basically, "I'm too lazy/cheap to pay for the thing that I want so someone else get it for me."
Anyone else sympathetic to that plight would most likely be in the same situation and basically incapable of doing shit.
>>428857
Which comes back to the argument of "Well if what they're doing isn't worth it why do you want it so bad?" To which there is no legitimate response for. Either you admit that art has worth, which to any person born in a capitalist society means it's something an artist is allowed to charge for, or if it's so easy/worthless you either nut up and draw your own fap fodder or learn to live without this worthless thing.
>>428896
It's still a question that needs answering even if you're just here for the sake of the argument.
Either you admit that art has worth, which to any person born in a capitalist society means it's something an artist is allowed to charge for, or if it's so easy/worthless you either nut up and draw your own fap fodder or learn to live without this worthless thing.
Sub out all uses of 'you' with 'the person who wants the art' and it's still the same argument.
Why do you think people being able to charge money for things they make is bad, my filthy commie friend?
>>428906
Charging for low quality shit makes you greedy scum. Greed is not something to exalt, no matter what you were taught by your own warped society.
>>426335
found the retard
>>428909
> low quality
So basically a subjective measurement of the worth of the product. See "if it's so easy/worthless you either nut up and draw your own fap fodder or learn to live without this worthless thing."
> Greed is not something to exalt,
Yet here you are defending OP's shit which is literally spawned from greed. OP gets to whine about his inability to use his imagination for faps, but someone who spends a few hours actually making something, they're the bad guy?
>>428923
>subjective
>My deviantart doodles of furry dicks have value guys!
>OP
Low quality trash being free is not greed because it should've been free in the first place.
>>424158
Jesus Christ you're a fucking moron. Do you even know what a patron is? Patreon isn't amazon. You don't go there to buy a product. You go there to become a patron of an artist you enjoy. You don't want to be a patron that's cool fuck off, but don't expect that artist that you don't support are suppose to give you anything.
>>424220
Than drop those artists. That shit is simple.
>>428926
You're not Michelangelo and your work doesn't deserve patrons.
>>428925
> My deviantart doodles of furry dicks have value guys!
Apparently, because this thread exist. Desire determines worth.
"if it's so easy/worthless you either nut up and draw your own fap fodder or learn to live without this worthless thing."
>>425017
what do you mean? You personally can't stop giving money to an artist that doesn't deliver? Why the fuck not?
>>428932
Railing against paywalls does not mean you desire what's behind them.
>>428934
I mean artist's who do shitty things or never deliver never actually seem to lose patreon support.
Idiot you really couldn't gleam that?
>>428937
> Sub out all uses of 'you' with 'the person who wants the art' and it's still the same argument.
> Why do you think people being able to charge money for things they make is bad, my filthy commie friend?
>>428930
I'm not an artist retard, but I regularly give money to artists I do enjoy. Because I want them to keep drawing and also because I'm not fucking poor.
Patreon was supposed to be a tipjar.
People would willingly give artists money and would receive earily drafts/wips in return, in some cases they'd even get the finished product a couple of months before non-supporters.
This was a good system, allowing people to support their favorite artists and get art before the general public, while not punishing those that were unable to pay.
Turning it into a paywall was a dick move.
But OP is still a faggot.
>>428940
Who the fuck cares if it's not your money?
Instead of getting jealous why don't you simply not give a fuck?? Holy shit, do you think the artist is cyberbullying by getting other people's money?? Maybe those people think it's worth it.
haha how does this even affect you? Besides igniting your sense of entitlement and your obvious autism.
>>428948
Then what is you measure of value? If we desire something do we not give that thing value? Or are you going to argue that nothing that is essential for survival has merit?
Can we just bring back Patreon dump threads?
>>428948
supporting the greedy? I'm not supporting you, so I guess I'm doing something right.
I'm the moron for having disposable income??
You have contributed nothing to anyone in any sense. Why the fuck would I care what you have to say? I actually fucking laughed out loud that you would think so highly of yourself.
>>428981
I got exactly what I wanted from spending that money. Making sure an artist and an art community is thriving.
You tell me what you would've spent that money on, be specific too.
>>428949
>Who the fuck cares if it's not your money?
I don't.
I just telling you how things are.
As for the rest of your post.
Don't assume your talking to the person you think you are on an anonymous image fucktard.
>>428989
And so did the Haitans who bought dirt.
>>428811
that's the crux of my issue with this. I don't mind paying for porn. I'd just rather get as much as possible for my dollar, so supporting tiered pay scheme artists on a by-person basis is more trouble then stealing or going without,
It helps that now many artists do the heavy lesbian anal focus I enjoy. Ass worship, rimming and ovi tend to be furfag fetishes
>>429029
Believe whatever you want
>>428944
So much this. Patreon should be a step between blind donations and commission work, a way to give back in some small, low-effort way to the people who'll give you a little every month. No pressure, no conditions.
But some artists decided to take it a step further. Either because it's less effort and less damaging to their reputation then making a full paysite or because they legitimately want to take their porn further and offload the cost onto people willing to finance it
Is this thread just two twats saying "their art sucks so I should get it for free" like their opinion is some de facto objective statement?
fuck off
So I can assume that everyone here is paying Z0ne for their work and didn't just take the newest pics from that other thread, or are y'all just hypocrites?
http://www.deviantart.com/art/Drusilla-595544222
Read the description.
The guy who made OP's image knows.
>>429518
This just proves he's fucking ignorant. He knows it bothers people, and does it anyways because "LOZ I CANZ XDXD!"
These are the kind of people that piss me off, becuause unlike a movie or videogame, you can totally ignore the creators and enjoy the product, but you are CONSTANTLY shoved into the face of an artist's personality whether you like it or not. It's absolutely disgusting. I don'f know this guy, butOP was right. I'm gonna leak all his shit later on today, just to mock him
>>429533
>>He knows it bothers people
It bothers a really small number of entitled, ignorant wankers
>>423844
My Partner is an artist and has just started on Patreon. Go fuck your self.
I'm gonna start a Patreon and put all my art behind a paywall so I don't have to deal with twats like the OP finding my work and hassling me for free titties.
>>429535
>>429535
Well, now that I've actually seen his attitude, it bothers me now. As much as OP was an asshole about how he worded his opinion, I see where he's been coming from. Now I have proof to this Blaz dude's flaming faggotry.
Though it's an extreme parallel, it's like the french before the revolution. The pilgrims (non-paying fans) get the scraps, while the nobles and clergy (patrons) get to stay on top, with the monarchy (the artist) gets to stay on top and be jolly and none the wiser, kind of like Marie Antoinette.
And we know what happened to her in due time...
>>423844
I hate people like OP. Why don't you just draw/create the shit you want to see, cut out the middle man, asshole?
>>429551
That was the stupidest comparison ever. Implying the "pilgrims" dont have the same chances as the "nobles" to get stuff. They are simply unwilling
>>429647
You act like everyone has a dollar to spare...
>>423844
I don't get your post.
So you want to support them yet you don't, but you want the benefits of supporting them without doing so?
Are you twelve years old? This is a serious question.
>>429647
Actually, at the time when pilgrims/nobles were a thing nobles did in fact have more rights to ownership than the peasants. Not in America ofc, but then America didn't have "nobles".
>>430110
They also assume that people asking are not supporting anyone at all. They can say "Its only $5 a month, you cheapskate" but multiply that by all the artists you like, all the ones that "deserve" it, and you could end up paying more for porn per month than monthly car repayments.
>>430110
Odds are if you have the free time, Internet access, and a device that allows you, to go browsing for cartoon porn odds are you have some kind of entertainment budget. Which might not be unlimited like >>430450 said but that's when you as an adult make decisions about what you're willing to pay for
.You can't have everything so find out what stuff you like that you're willing to pay for. There are still plenty of people out their who draw and write plenty of free porn you can get instead.
>>430515
>but that's when you as an adult make decisions that let you get it for free.
>>430522
As long as you're not entitled bitch about it sure. If you admit that you just want the thing then fine. But when you act like you're ENTITLED to other people's work and you shit on them for charging for it that's where the debate starts.
>>430526
Whining about 'entitlement' makes you look like a suckup. People that make paywalls are greedy fucks. Entitlement does not enter into the equation.
>>430532
And calling people a suckup because they're not entitled makes you look like a bitch. Everyone on 4chan is some type of asshole. As long as you don't try to justify what type of asshole you are it's fine. If you want to get free shit it's cool, but calling people greedy and whining about paywalls makes you entitled. You feel that this person should give you their work for free, regardless of the quality, that's entitlement. Entitlement does enter the equation, it's literally the first factor.
>>430539
I'm calling you a suckup because you're slurping on artist dick.
>>430544
I'm not slurping artist dick, I'm slurping free market dick. I'll ride that dick all day. It's better than your bullshit where stuff can only be made for free or it doesn't get made at all.
Is there a website that indexes NSFW Patreon artists according to related tags or something, since Patreon won't do that to maintain relationship with puritanical PayPal?
That seems logical to get their pages more exposure and actually allow potential artists to be found. But I've never heard of such a thing.
>>430554
But you are, you're supporting every measure of greed from everyone, doing nothing but sucking up to them.
>>430532
How are people who make paywalls so they can profit from their labor "greedy fucks"?
>>430564
Except I'm not because when an artist is charging too much for work I don't want I just don't support them. That's an option Haitian dirt man. You have the option to not buy something and walk away,
>>430564
How is saying someone should be paid for work they have done "sucking up"?
>>430578
Then why do people like the OP want it if it has no value?
>>430581
Shit taste? You see the image he used, clearly OP is not a sensible person.
>>430578
Come on dickcheese, how does porn both have no value and should be given away for free because people want it?
You sound like those manbaby MRA types that scream about pornstars being worthless whores while they jack their 3cm dicks raw.
>>430587
How do your personal tastes change the value of something that other people like?
>>430597
This is purely your opinion as to the value of something that numerous other people want. Why do you actually think this is a valid argument?
>>430600
>It's purely your opinion that buying dirt instead of good is a bad idea.
>>423847
>>423853
>>423855
>>423912
wow look at this same fag
>>430606
In other words, all you have is at this point is >no u
So to recap the thread:
>people who want to be paid for their work are fags
>people who think they should be paid for their work are shills
>cool dudes with cool tastes like good stuff but shouldn't have to pay for it because art should be free
>>430615
No, in other words, absolute subjectivity is a child's view that facilitates never having to be wrong, or call others wrong and hurt their feelings.
>>430610
lol u a bitchmade loser who's upset he can't jerk it to cartoon titties
>>427245
triggered
riggered
iggered
ggered
gered
ered
red
ed
d(ude why you so mad tho)
>>430621
Many other people wanting what you don't want, and you not wanting something doesn't actually change it's value.
We already covered this, read a couple little golden books, learn a little more reading comprehension, baby steps.
>>430636
Many other people will buy dirt while they starve. Those people are morons and wrong.
>>430638
You're circling again. You claiming something is dirt doesn't actually make that true.
Oh, right, sorry.
Some people like thing. If you not like thing, that not change other people like thing.
Let me know if I need to use smaller words.
>>430648
>You claiming something is dirt
Nobody is making a claim. It's called a comparison.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3337cj4sJQ
>>430653
Ah, now it's a comparison!
Except, yet again, it will still be subjective, and therefor irrelevantly based on your opinion.
>>423844
fuck off socialist scum
>>430653
So either there are porn artists who do deserve money, which means your decision to support them is purely based on your subjective opinion versus artists you don't like, and your argument is trash.
or
Porn artists don't deserve money because they draw porn which is a view based entirely on your opinion of the value of porn, period, one which many people don't share. Also since you're on 4cahn lol if you don't jerk it to porn, so in essence you actually *are* one of the manbabies who cry about pornstars being worthless whores while furiously masturbating to all their movies.
>>430632
Because invalid arguments irritate me.
You really believe content creators shouldn't get paid for their content?
I've gone so far as to disable adblock on artists sites that I like and other websites I support.
These are people's jobs.
>>430759
They shouldn't be.
>>430684
He has spoken! Its over now guys, don't taunt him further! He might say the sky is green and IT WILL BE TRUE
>>430759
top kek, forcing yourself to sift through a bunch of ads because some idiot who thinks they're an ARTEEEEST has to rent out adspace to make buxx.
So, people who produce art and display it for free with no expectation or even ability to accept payment... are they scabs?
I mean, they are stealing traffic from other artists who need to make money.
You know what, fuck this retarded thread and OP.
I feel dumber for having engaged in an argument with an idiot
At what point will 4chan realize the best way to deal with an idiot is to let the stupid die an inglorious unreplied death an sink off the bottom
>>431192
I know right, if only people were smart enough just to ignore the artist dicksuckers, this would have been over days ago.
>>423919
then go look at their content instead. The only reason to post about this is if you want to see their art. That is why they have success because people want to see their stuff. A lot of artists are rich enough to not charge but most aren't. If there's an audience and they need the money to support their art then they should charge for it. There is enough free content out there that you don't have to pay but then you can't really complain. Or learn to make art yourself and be the guy who gives it away for free.
>>423937
lol. Yet there are many who use it and succeed with it so you are clearly just wrong and a cheapskate. If you thought they weren't good enough to charge then this would be a non-issue and no one would complain about shitty artists with a paywall. Clearly they are good enough that you hate the paywall which means you want their art. Complaining just proves how useful patreon really is for these people
Recently subbed to manicpaint's patreon, don't know if I'm gonna keep going next month if it costs me a buttload like I think it might(20dollar tier, but it's for every photoset/sketch thing).
I wish more artists did it by month and had a "commission" tier, where you plop down like 60(or whatever they want to price it really. But most people aren't made of money for something like 100 a month) a month and get a comm+the previous rewards.
>>430610
God I hate poorfags, and I am one.
Get a fucking job and contribute to society.
>>432556
Manicpaint is one of the greediest jackasses on the site. Permanently locking all nude pics behind a paywall, no timed releases or anything like that, just plain censoring everything for everyone who doesn't waste ass tons of money.
>>432926
It's prolly why he doesn't have alot of patrons on his thing.
Also the ammount he wants to get a sketch from him is kind of retarded because it's the 20dollar tier. Which would be fine if it was just a 20per month thing. But it's not.
Hope the sketch is at least decent and not like the other sketches he puts out.
>>432927
I take back what I said, he's making a really good amount because of the "money every time he uploads something model"
747.86 per image Set/Sketch Request
Crazy.
>>432929
Pure greed.
>>423919
there are plenty of people who don't use cars.
>>432926
>no timed releases
Why would they implement a way for paying content to lose its value? It's like you've never tried to sell something.
>>432951
So you don't burn your fans because they can't see your fanart of characters you don't own because they have to give him an insane amount of money just to see even the HD versions of the drawings.
>>432951
Gesture of good will, public relations, and getting people interested in your content. It's highly unlikely anyone is going to pay you specifically for an old image when the goal is to essentially be like a donation and community involvement thing. It's really like you've never been involved in business yourself. Do you know what free samples are? Sales? Free trials?
>>432926
But they don't owe you anything, you're nothing to them.
>>432958
Stop worshiping him as a god.
The world is not founded on a system of obligations alone. Certain behaviors and practices are considered to defy acceptable or fair behavior, the same reason you're expected to bathe yourself before going out. You're not OBLIGATED, but it's considered indecent otherwise. And being that money grubbing and greedy defies acceptable behavior, which allows us to criticize him. He is not your untouchable god.
>>432960
>Certain behaviors and practices are considered to defy acceptable or fair behavior
like begging for free shit?
>>432963
Do you think defending him online will make you his friend or something?
Like charging ridiculous amounts of money for cartoon drawings that are otherwise locked permanently behind that paywall, alienating your own fans and damaging your public relations.
I don't get why you guys are sucking his dick so hard.
I like his art, but now I'm just being put off by how much he's charing for so little in both his comm's and his patreon.
He's charging 25 for a color'd sketch and tacks on 10 more if you want the drawing to be "lewd"
Then you can only see these comm's on his patreon and not to mention that the rewards on his patreon are kinda poop for the amount of money you're going to be spending because you get charged for every set he uploads.
>>432965
I just don't like entitled faggots who whine about thing they want not being free.
>>432970
I really don't give a shit about MP, if you think he charges too much you can just try another artist.
>>432970
Like really, if you just want him to draw you a sketch from one of his patreon rewards. That's 20bucks everytime he posts a set and he might not even color it. If he posts 2 picture sets that month, that's 20 dollars. That's more then even his regular color'd sketch comm price.
Which is crazy.
>>432979
He also uses emoticon's so god damn much, how old is this guy anyways?
I'll prolly let my 20dollar pledge ride out for the month cuz I want my poopy sketch then cancel it after that.
I don't have time to read all this but I'm assuming OP is faggot and no one is going to buy his porn for him.
>>433682
this thread convinced me to support an artist.
so now unfortunately for me there's a rope in the next room with my name on.
I am weak.
>>428944
This is why people who still do timed release instead of just fucking paywalling it up deserve mad props.
Because they're using the site the way it's supposed to be instead of twisting it into another goddamn paywall.
>>423937
The real question is, does putting stuff behind a paywall get more Patreon bucks, or would the wider exposure of not using a paywall do a better job of bringing in donations?
Best system is probably letting the Patreon folks see it first. Have like, a 1 month delay before your shit goes public. That way thirsty patricians get their prime content boner waxed, and everyone else gets to see your hot shit. But, that's just a gut feeling. This shit needs numbers.
OP, patreon has a truckload of issues that make it the worst possible platform for supporting a flexible creator
if an artist wants to be an artist and only an artist, they should join a syndicate that publishes their brand of art
those sites either have a paywall with SHITTONS of content and sidebar ads or popups or redirects, and make millions of dollars doing so
I'm not gonna contribute 10 bucks a month for someone that puts out a picture or two a week "if they can", where that same ten bucks can go towards something like hentaikey or zonearchives, who have schedules and know when content will start and stop and will put out 3x the content
patreon is just a shitty paywall because once the money goes out, the account holder isn't necessarily motivated to do anything.
If Shitman can put out a picture a day max and live on that, then any artist with commissions and a remote semblance of skill should be fine. Patreon just pretends it's the best.
I've only ever contributed to one patreon, and it was so heavily demanded that after 3 months he/she'd hit her 5th or 6th milestone and couldn't possibly put out any more content, so I pulled it when the number were fairly steady.
iirc that patreon is still at like 12 grand a month, so I don't regret it.
>>434462
Mind telling on who the paywaller is so we can call him a fag?
>>434496
No, I like his/her webcomic
>>434541
I found the fag
>>434545
>implying I make 144k a year
>that I'm an artist
>that I'm not a dockworker with an eye for good stories and a solid fantasy webcomic
>>434541
I want to know so I can be disappointed in them.
>>423844
>can't chuck $1-5/mo at your favorite porn artist
Mum won't let you use her credit card?
>>435567
Some people don't want to support the greedy regardless of how much money they have. Else, they have enough sense not to waste cash.
>>435589
Oh totally.
Artists that don't just do it for side cash/fun that make the proceeds part of their living though, I can chuck cash at them.
What happened to good artists forming teams and splitting profits in an effort to create more/better content faster?
>>435614
Like hentaikey and such? Again, it's probably just laziness or greed. It's easier to set up a program where you get as much money as possible for minimum work, and having a collective site or circle requires responsibility and effort.
>>424148
If I could download myself a Lexus, I would.
>>435589
>implying artists are greedy for wanting to get paid for their profession
so I take it you run the cash register at wal-mart for free, eh?
>>436133
Artists are greedy for putting porn behind massive paywalls, yes.
You know what this means, right.
We have to BOYCOTT PATREON.
>>436143
I don't understand how it being a paywall makes it any different. That's just how they get paid for their work, man.
>>436158
You're demanding to get paid too much for too little. Greed.
>>436162
If you think it's too little, just stop paying. No one's forcing you to do it.
>>436164
Me not paying you doesn't stop you from being greedy for charging it.
>>436165
Okay, why shouldn't they charge for it? Why should they give up their work for free?
>>436170
Because they're being greedy assholes and people will perceive them as such.
You really are a trash person if you have no morals at all and just seek to maximize profit.
>Muh super hard work drawing one porn sketch every three weeks guys!
>>432512
>A lot of artists are rich enough to not charge but most aren't
Putting your art behind a paywall is actually probably the worst way to make money.
Essentially turning away free advertising.
On the the contrary only the most cemented and successful artist's can afford to put up a paywall.
If only you knew how many people use patreon for free victim money. And they get away with that shit without producing anything each month..... Seriously. How the fuck can you earn 3k usd for producing NOTHING:
>>436172
And what do they get if they lower their prices? Your approval? Then I've got bad news for you, since that isn't worth anything.
>>436183
Better exposure and good will to create a loyal fanbase that will ultimately lead to a larger and more consistent payout over time.
Wow it's like you never even studied business, for all your talk of muh product and muh profit.
>>436185
>exposure
Oh, I'm laughing. Artists sure love them exposure bucks!
>>436195
Oh sure anon, you can totally get a following without putting any work out there or making any kind of name. Definitely.
Ever heard the expression "Spend money to make money"? In this situation, that applies to putting out tons of free art to build a name for yourself. You're not going to get anybody donating to you if nobody knows who you are.
>>436198
Most people who have been called 'greedy' in this thread are plenty popular, though. They really don't need additional exposure.
>>436203
Those people are being called greedy for charging too much for too little, as has been pointed out to you. Same way you'd shit on McDonalds for charging $10 for a cheeseburger.
Unless you're against any kind of criticism, in which case you're shit at business still.
>>436207
A price of something is just a consequence of the market forces. I just don't think your advice is very sound business-wise.
