Are we in agreement this is one of the best and most compelling works of art of the 21st century?
Nah, I think you mean this
why is every thread bate today
>>61467373
im new to /mu/ this isnt supposed to be bate
>>61467314
No. It sacrifices musicianship for a political and cultural message, and not a particularly wise one either.
>as blacks, we need to learn to love ourselves
cool
>fuck the police
well... okay
>muh trayvon n michael brown
bu-but if you look at the forensic evidence
>white people are evil, fuck you white people, this is all your fault
lmao
He's just another nigger desu. Blacks will never emerge from their shit state of being with these kind of messages
Is it just me or kendrick can't sing? It's ok but the he just can't sign and the social message is just similar to that of every other rapper out there. RTG have done it better. I would say it's a 5/10
>>61467314
7/10 possibly 8 at most
>>61467575
>white people are evil, fuck you white people, this is all your fault
Whom are you quoting?
>>61467314SB2H?
>>61467575
>>61467578
Oh i see, /mu/ is full of edgy faggots
>>61467575
>sacrifices musicianship
I was going to rip apart this post but I won't bother since you didn't listen to the album
>>61467606
My hair is nappy, my dick is big, my nose is round and wide
You hate me don't you?
You hate my people, your plan is to terminate my culture
You're fuckin' evil I want you to recognize that I'm a proud monkey
You vandalize my perception but can't take style from me
And this is more than confession
I mean I might press the button just so you know my discretion
I'm guardin' my feelings, I know that you feel it
You sabotage my community, makin' a killin'
You made me a killer, emancipation of a real nigga
>>61467615
>>61467627
literally nothing I said is edgy
>>61467635
It's not enjoyable to listen to and there are overtly weak songs. It sacrifices enjoyability for more "blackness"
>>61467675
Where does it say white people exactly?
>uses racial slurs
>not edgy
Really now?
>>61467675
someone really didn't get that song.
>>61467675
>The Blacker the Berry lyrics
Why do you think he's talking about white people in general?
>Literally nothing I said is edgy
What about "he's just another nigger desu"?
>>61467675
>I'm the biggest hypocrite of 2015
Obviously you didn't get the song
>>61467675
I like the amount of /pol/ autism in this post.
>>61467800
Why don't you explain it then, if you're so smart?
Oh wow. How does Kendrick go over your head? Dumber than a nig, lmao
>>61467675
funny thing is, if the shoe fits so well he is talking about you. Also, you mention trayvon martin, did you hear the counterpoint he made in the same song?
>>61467575
Pretty much.
>>61467314
Honestly the musicianship wasn't that great, the only reason people praise this thing is because of the lyrical content. And it's not even really because of that, because KRS, Tribe, Mos Def, etc. have all been saying similar shit for years now but never hit it as big as Kendrick did with TPAB.
This album is critically acclaimed because it's Kendrick, and that's it.
>>61467815
not /pol/ necessarily at all
I was more than nervous about the direction Kendrick Lamar was heading after hearing “i,” the first single from To Pimp A Butterfly. It was praised for its uplifting nature in a genre that’s flooded with negativity; and while I’m in full support of the track’s message, the execution was flat-out corny. Thankfully, my fears were alleviated some months later with the surprise release of the full product. It’s dark, impactful and unbelievably confessional. I was moved enough to shelve the album for many months after my initial listen – I just wasn’t sure if I could bear the emotional weight TPAB pours out more than once in a short span. It may not be my favorite album of the year, or my favorite rap album of the year for that matter, but it is without a doubt the most important album of the year and worthy of the cultural position it has amassed in such short time
>>61467795
>>61467796
>>61467800
Him acknowledging it's hypocritical doesn't mean he is disregarding his points on muh appropriation etc
>>61467776
>back2reddit
>>61467815
>expresses non-leftist view
>lmao when did /pol/ git here xxD
>>61468208
>Him acknowledging it's hypocritical doesn't mean he is disregarding his points on muh appropriation etc
Again, why do you think he's talking about white people in that verse?
And what does cultural appropriation have to do with this? Are all reactionaries this retarded?
>>back2reddit
Nice argument.
>>61468202
>I just wasn’t sure if I could bear the emotional weight TPAB pours out more than once in a short span.
>>61468250
the entire song is about blacks complaining about how white people hate them (and are evil), despite the fact that even blacks hate themselves it's pretty straightforward
>complains about the use of nigger
>on 4chan
like i said, back to reddit
>>61468239
You got me!!!! D A M
>>61468202
it is very heavy and an album you have to listen to more than twice
>>61468312
>the entire song is about blacks complaining about how white people hate them (and are evil),
[citation needed]
>>complains about the use of nigger
>>on 4chan
>Global Rule #3: You will not post any of the following outside of /b/: Trolls, flames, racism, off-topic replies, uncalled for catchphrases, macro image replies, indecipherable text (example: "lol u tk him 2da bar|?"), anthropomorphic ("furry") or grotesque ("guro") images, post number GETs ("dubs"), or loli/shota pornography.
>>61468312
I didn't complain about you using that word though, I just called you edgy. Which you are.
>>61468353
>citation needed
are you dumb
>cites 4chan rules
BACK
A
C
K
TO
O
E
D
D
I
T
fucking lmao dude
How the fuck do people actually think this album is anti-white?
Kendrick went out of his way to make this the most white-friendly hip hop album ever in all ways other than sound
>>61468239
>Expresses mature, reasonable opinion
>"Go back to Reddit/Tumblr"
>>61468312
>>61468353
This isn't 2008. Any racism will result in a B8 so please don't trigger anybody.
>>61468396
So are yo gonna provide that citation? Or are you gonna keep memeing?
>>61468410
"Hey guys maybe we shouldn't burn black people"
"BAK 2 TUMBLR FAG"
>>61468396
>Are you dumb
Ad hominem, nice 10-year old argumentative skills assclown.
>Back to reddit
Nice argument.
>>61468410
>mature, reasonable opinion
>I like the amount of /pol/ autism in this post.
>>61468434
>>61468444
read the lyrics you dense fucks. If that's not what it's talking about, what is it?
You people have to be fucking with me
>>61468440
When was the last time anybody burned a black person here again?
>>61468250
i'm actually with the other people, the lyrics seem to have a tone to them that are angry at white people.
But i could easily be wrong, I don't listen to a lot of hip-hop, and the lyrics could have gone over my head. What was he talking about if he wasnt expressing anger at the white community?
>>61468148
Underrated post
>>61468466
>Read the lyrics you dense fucks. If that's not what it's talking about, what is it?
40 minutes later and you haven't explained why you think it's talking about white people. Anecdotes won't work here, dude.
WE
EAT
POO
I opened the thread cus I was expecting a lot of butthurt and you guys didnt disappoint
>>61468493
>I don't understand hyperbole
>>61468466
He's talking about racists, not "white people" you dumb fuck.
>>61468590
Well anon probably is a racist so....
He kind of showed himself too easily.
>>61468519
WUZ
>>61468590
but only whites can be racist senpai
>>61468553
By using hyperbole your point is lost.
You're literally just shitposting.
>>61468628
Combo breaker. Take your shitty memes to /pol/, retard.
>>61468636
In America yes. Learn the difference between racism and prejudice
>>61467575
>hasn't even heard album
>gives opinion on said album
>>61468590
Is he also talking about casual racists?
I'm a casual racist and just want to know if he's talking about me.
>>61468657
Are you real
>>61468628
KANGS
>>61468639
That's not how conversations work if you have basic comprehension skills
Plus this site frequently defends shit like that anyway
>>61468680
>Is he also talking about casual racists?
He's talk about racists in general.
>>61468657
You're going to get jumped on by everyone else, but you're right
>>61468717
Are you white and talking about racism?
That's racist.
>>61467575
>Hasn't even heard album
>Decides to review said album anyway
>>61468680
>Is he also talking about casual racists?
Yes?
>>61468208
This guy probably came from reddit btw
>>61468717
Which also applies to him.
I'm praying for him.
>>61468742
No it's not.
>>61468742
No.
>>61468771
Fuck off, racist.
>>61468787
What point are you trying to make?
>>61468709
>>61468680
>>61468742
>>61468752
black people can definitely be prejudice, but its not the same as racism. hurting white peoples feelings isnt racism.
>>61468800
He's being a memeing faggot.
Ignore him.
>>61468800
I'm making the point that all whites are racist, and even the act of them talking about racism is racist.
>>61468822
Keep backpedaling, racist.
>>61468838
This is bait btw
>>61468811
Racism is prejudice based on race, nothing more. Institutionalized racism though is a specific type of racism. the "racism is prejudice plus power" thing is a made up sjw faggot thing
>>61468863
You know nothing about racism, honky.
>>61468863
Racism consists of ideologies and practices that seek to justify, or cause, the unequal distribution of privileges or rights among groups that are conceptualized as racially or ethnically different.
>>61468863
lol youre actually wrong tho
>>61467575
You literally have no idea what you're talking about
Reminder that until you've actually EXPERIENCED racism, you can't HOPE to understand it. (Whites can't experience discrimination.) So, if you're trying to even TALK about it, STOP.
>>61469047
Well, you're entitled to your opinions, but I personally think it's idiotic to think that the act of talking about racism itself is racist. Also, I'm not even white.
>>61469047
>Whites can't experience discrimination
Nice bait
>>61467575
Did you listen to it or just read a bunch or 4chan cuck posts and think you knew the album?
>>61468995
Not really
>>61469204
He's falseflagging senpai, I don't think any sane person really believes in that
>>61469204
You're fine. It's these whites who think they aren't being racist even when they are that get on my nerves.
>>61469424
Well, don't think white people talking about racism is inherently racist, either. That goes completely against what figures such as MLK preached. But again, you're entitled to your opinions, if you're not just a falseflagging troll.
>>61468995
>>61468925
>>61468924
I'm not even white but the notion that you can't be racist to white people is utterly retarded.
All racism is strictly based on race, regardless of which one.
>mfw basement dwellers try to talk about critical theory
>>61469047
>Whites can't experience discrimination.
Are you actually retarded?
>>61467314
>baiting so bad
>>61469572
Not true. Whites hold the power structure. If you hold the power structure then you can't be discriminated against.
>>61469572
you can be prejudiced and discriminate against white people but actual systematic racism never manifests itself against white people because white people literally run the world and power structures
>but muh white people are poor too
economic oppression, while linked to racism in many ways, is not explicitly racist and is rather one of a multitude of factors that determines an individuals social standing.
like ugh y'all are killing me
>>61469572
In my opinion, it's not really that you can't be racist to white people, but that racism against white people is pretty much irrelevant. Some black dude calling you a cracker or honky in high school is very different from facing decades of institutionalized discrimination, regardless of what the reactionary media may tells you.
>>61469572
Racism is based on superiority complex, prejudice against whites is based on an inferiority complex
>>61469581
>basement dwellers
sure man, if it helps you feel better about your shitty flawed ideology
>>61469635
>Me Calling a white guy a honky is not racist because there are white people in power.
That's literally what you're telling me. Get rid of that SJW Jargon and strip it down to its skeleton, it's a load of bullshit.
Imho, m.A.A.d. city is better
>>61469674
Wrong. It's because the white RACE holds power.
>>61469640
>Some black dude calling you a cracker or honky in high school is very different from facing decades of institutionalized discrimination, regardless of what the reactionary media may tells you.
BUT THIS. LITERALLY. DOESN'T. MATTER.
YES BLACKS HAVE BEEN THROUGH MORE.
YES ASIANS HAVE BEEN THROUGH MORE.
THE CORE DEFINITION OF RACISM IGNORES HISTORY. IT'S JUST A FUCKING TERM TO DESCRIBE ACTIONS/NOTIONS DISCRIMINATING AGAINST A PARTICULAR RACE. THAT'S IT.
literally beneficiaries of apartheid painting themselves as victims
>>61469674
its prejudiced and discriminatory but not an aspect of institutional racism
can you read
Because the whites are held to a higher standard due to being in power and having easy discrimination-free lives, blacks suffer. TPAB is testament to this.
Whites can't understand what it's like because they hold the power structures.
>>61469674
If you tried to understand the worldview of so-called "SJWs" in places such as /r/ShitRedditSays instead of just following the reactionary #Gamergate bandwagon, you'd see that there's nothing wrong with them. Except for some more extreme cases.
>>61469625
Did we change the meaning of "discrimination" too? White's can definitely be discriminated against, I think you're trying to say they can't be discriminated against FOR being white, but a white individual can face lots of discrimination and persecution for a million other things.
>>61469715
It's not about groups or races, it's about individuals. An individual harassing another individual who did nothing too him is wrong
>>61469807
Discrimination was meant as a synonym for racism, in that post.
>>61469752
>institutional racism
No one gives a fuck about this and no one will mention this in real life. We're talking about core racism, which everyone is a part of
>b-b-but systematic oppression that whites planned
Ok yes that's a thing. Has nothing to do with the definition of racism.
>b-b-but whites are in power
Ok cool. Means nothing about the definition of racism.
As said here >>61469741 it ignores history.
and I'm talking about just the core definition, not your retarded ass institutional racism that no one needs to bring up when referring to racism against whites because it's literally irrelevant.
>>61469807
I feel like it is supposed to be understood that they are talking about racial discrimination
>>61467575
>>61467575
>No. It sacrifices musicianship for a political and cultural message
Yah
>He's just another nigger desu. Blacks will never emerge from their shit state of being with these kind of messages
Nah
>>61469741
Again, I'm not saying that you can't be racist to white people, but that racism against white people is irrelevant.
>>61469807
what, like not being able to play in "the wiz" or not getting a spot in college with a below average SAT lol
>>61469828
>it's about individuals
The individuals are affected always by the groups. And the larger the majority, the more the minority is oppressed.
>>61467675
>Follows a song in which is says 'complexion - it don't mean a thing
>Biggest hypocrite of 2015
>>61469807
>I think you're trying to say they can't be discriminated against FOR being white,
But even this, even this isn't true.
Racism affects everyone but SJWs and some of you literal degenerates are trying to shift the weight.
>>61469860
How does the album sacrifice musicianship? Did you listen to it? Hes 100% being himself, he doesnt apologize for or sacrifice anything.
>>61469878
>Racism affects everyone
Only minorities who don't hold power structures can experience racism.
Once black men hold power structures is once racism for black people ends.
>>61467314
NOTM did it first and admittedly better
>ride has never said nigga or nigger once in his music, making the title purposefully ironic.
>"my terracotta army disarms me, disowns me" addresses the inferiority complex a lot of african americans have, letting made up bullshit become their biggest problem. this complex does not allow their kind to progress, which ties into the titular joke. there will never be a "nigga" on the moon.
>"you do what my people would grunt" is about how whites actually take the initiative to do things while blacks just get mad at them for doing said things.
>"support gravity, my people would" is about how blacks spend every waking moment of their lives bitching about how whitey keeps them down while still living on welfare.
pretty redpilled guy t︂b︂︂h
>>61468148
Youre assuming things that aren't true.
The actual sound of the album is the richest, most complex sonic arrangement on a hip hop record of the 2010s outside of the experimental hip hop genre. The flows are amazing, the live instruments, the sampling, the attitude, the lyrics, EVERYTHING is amazing.
>>61469877
He calls himself a hypocrite, hes fighting with himself, he was talking about how he had to get accustomed to going from being in an all black high school to having white people connect with his message and what he learned
>>61469940
>having white people connect with his message
Except they'll never understand his message. They can only pretend. That's the point of the album.
>>61469926
Is this serious?
>>61469878
You're right, deep down we're dealing with people who are looking for an outlet for justified self righteous hatred.
>>61469988
Never mind it's just shit tier bait.
>>61469844
>tfw no gf
>>61469972
Thats not true. His message isnt always strictly black. Sure "Alright" is but "For sale?" a lot of people would be able to relate with, its very sweet temptation personified even if you arent religious..but hell, even "Alright" can be interpreted in a way you want to enjoy it..Whites may not experience instritutionalized racism but damn sure experience all the hardships blacks do we're all people with the same flaws
>>61469875
Yes but basing all morality and justice around groups instead of actual individual humans is stupid and dehumanizing, and blinds you from the actual situation. A white person killing a black person is wrong, a black person killing a white person is wrong.
>>61470110
whoever said it wasnt like that lol. kendrick gets on black people killing black people more than anyone in the album
>>61467373
Who the fuck are you? /mu/ doesn't need more trips you faggot loser
>>61470062
My point is that whites can never and will never fully understand TPAB, so it's pointless for them to listen to it and pretend like they're cultured by parading it around.
http://strawpoll.me/6443989
curiousr
>>61470216
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTmHuavOXNg this guy is kind of a faggot but he gets it imo for the most part
>>61469926
Black people were enslaved during centuries, then shoved into crammed urban areas and forced to attend underfunded schools with poorly trained teachers, have little to no opportunity to advance, are over-policed and are disproportionately the most likely demographic to be arrested, convicted, sentenced to prison and even killed for committing the same crimes.
But it's totally themselves who are holding their race back.
>/pol/ tries to talk about something
Why do you fuckers think you are some kind of super intelligent group shedding light on things people don't understand? Literally worse than /r9k/
>>61467314
http://strawpoll.me/6443989
>>61470349
Exactly. Whites don't experience these same things blacks experience. Especially not the Irish or the Italians who worked in hazardous factories and got caught in buildings and burnt alive on many occasions.
>>61470382
Nice argumentation.
>>61470439
Do you honestly expect anything better when you're arguing with edgy teenagers that most likely are just imitating their parents beliefs, albeit more extreme.
>>61470542
And what makes you think you have such original and independent viewpoints?
>>61470349
I agree with this. Killer Mike made a statement that Blacks are only 50 years into freedom which is relatively accurate.
>>61470422
Did I ever say that white people never had any difficulties? It's not like Irish and Italians were even considered white back then, by the way. And even then, it doesn't really compare to what black people faced and still have to face.
>>61470351
>>61470349
>>61470216
>>61469988
>>61470012
>>61470439
>>61470542
all of these posts are by me
>>61470604
Nothing, but active racism has significantly faded over the years, those that still are racist try to enforce it on their children. Or they all have normal parents and want to 'act different' by coming on here night after night shit posting ideas they'll eventually grow out of.
>>61470673
Uh huh
>>61470666
You're right. I'm sorry for being racist. Black people just by merit of their blackness have it bad.
>>61470761
>Black people just by merit of their blackness have it bad.
You mean by merit of their history and environment.
>>61470717
If racism is fading then what purpose did Lamar have of releasing this album, and why do you support it so much?
>>61470802
No, I don't.
>>61470761
ill stop pulling the race card when i get my 40 acres and a mule. The US just gave millions to holocaust survivors. I want real estate
>>61470821
>No, I don't.
It's not like you can blame the problem on their skin color itself instead of the stigmatization of that skin colour through history.
>>61470821
>If racism is fading then what purpose did Lamar have of releasing this album, and why do you support it so much?
Are...there's no way you're serious. How could anyone be this retarded.
This is a meme right.
>>61470885
You can't? Then how did I just do exactly that?
>>61470915
(because youre a fucking idiot)
>>61470914
>>61470939
>can't argue point
>results to ad hominem
>>61470915
if you think the issue is because im black give me a million dollars and ill go back to africa, americans are obsessed with giving jews money like the rest of the world. we got jim crow after slavery
>>61470915
Pedantism at its finest. You know exactly what I meant, twat.
>>61471005
>give me a million dollars and ill go back to africa
You wouldn't honestly go back to Africa, even for two million.
>>61470972
>entire thread has been arguing the point
>uh nuh uh im totally right!!!
>thinks theres been no actual discourse
read a book or something
>>61470972
you are a worthless dork
>>61471064
There hasn't been discourse. This has been me making points and then teenagers rebutting it with "Ur stupid" like >>61471097
>>61469926
>There will never be a "nigga" on the moon
...
>>61471097
>dork
>>61467314
I couldn't get into it at all, the lyrics just put me off.
>>61471146
you watch filthy frank dont you
>>61471270
what
>>61471055
Yes I would. I would go straight to Nigeria
>>61467406
the most bait
>>61468925
>Mom I used polysyllabic words again! It must make my argument correct!
Racism has nothing to do with power you fuckhead. It has everything to do with race. By insinuating that power determines race, you're creating a hierarchy which supports those in power.
You're part of the problem.
>>61471410
How about a one-way plane ticket? Would that work? A million is a pretty big asking price.
If you don't want to live in the US, then leave. You have the freedom.
mediocre jazz album, mediocre hip-hop album
>>61471524
I love my country, im saying to people who hate black people so much if you want me to leave, give me mines first
>>61471524
>ignorant sheltered middle class white boy doesn't realise moving country requires a certain financial status
>>61471055
>>61471005
Hell, I'm white and I'll take 1 or 2 million to go to Africa. Sounds great.
>>61471677
Well you aren't stigmatized by society any more. Enjoy affirmative action and the anti-white sentiment that has completely overtaken the entire world thanks to American foreign policy.
>>61471706
>middle class
>implying
>>61471730
i dont want affirmative action and white guilt lol. i want those fucking 40 acres
>>61471769
so does everyone
>>61471726
We would happily welcome non racist whites in afrimerica. people like that still believe africa is all in huts
>>61471520
>>>/pol/
>>61467314
If you're be honest, this album is fucking basic. Fucking basic. In every aspect, of everything. Basic, basic.
The whole album is based on this Tupac poem about black people condiction and racism which is a immutable constant in social interactions.
I mean this album was designeted to being a critical bait following the emmergency opportuniscally of the recently racial tension of the "police brutality" against blacks thugs...Claimming a state of being a "black messianism", but... without any focus or density, so its feels like an random pseudo-activism, what this "Alright" song who was sang by the "black lives matter" activist is pretty cringe...
And.. all the beat bited this bait, and ignored the music itself....... which on this is basic. At least is not moring than a solid 7/10 to a light 8/10.
>>61471810
I reverse searched it and found nothing.
Critic baiting...
So "Pimp A Butterfly" was smart campaign, a marketing trumph, because everybody now that media, most composed by whites, ABSOLUTE LOVES that subject, race intensions, the pros and cons, so if you're focusing hard on it... you're running the run to get this Grammy, this Oscar, this whole shit... you now...
Beasts of the Nation...
12 Year A Slave...
Selma...
Invictus...
>>61467314
>Hip Hop
>Art
Even video games are more art than hip hop
>>61471730
Pro-non-white doesn't mean anti-white.
>>61472003
What in the fuck are you talking about
>>61472033
See:
>>61471730
>Enjoy [...] the anti-white sentiment that has completely overtaken the entire world thanks to American foreign policy.
>>61467575
Hi /pol/. Go fuck yourself
>>61467314
That's not Good Kid m.a.a.d city
>>61472115
He has a point, the slurs notwithstanding.
>>61472134
What fucking point? Dude probably never heard the album and is pulling all his points from shitty /pol/ bait threads on here.
>>61471991
go away
>>61471966
This is entirely true, and the racist anon who said that he sacrifices musicianship for the message is also correct.
The best hip hop is visceral, purposeful and immediately engaging. If I wanted to read racially charged poetry, I would read racially charged poetry and it would be far more complex and interesting than The Blacker The Berry. The album contributes nothing new to the conversation of hip-hop. It is my hope, and if I am being honest, my expectation, that this album will be forgotten.
>>61472192
This is not an argument, this is you refusing to consider opinions that differ from yours. What is it about the album that makes you defend it so blindly?
>>61471463
fuck well said dude. That's the best anti-power plus prejudice argument I have ever heard. Most people standing up to the Sjw's just spew ignorant shit.
>>61472319
Not that guy but blindly misinformed opinions are garbage tier. His ignorant opinions are pretty amusing though.
>>61469047
This is funny because literally no one is arguing white's can't experience discrimination, not even the most sjw people of all argue that. You're just a fucking idiot.
>>61471463
>By insinuating that power determines race, you're creating a hierarchy which supports those in power.
this has absolutely no meaning. who insinuates power determines race? what does that even mean?
>>61469625
>mfw sjw's try to understand sociology but they just cement eurocentric worldviews
>>61472406
How about you answer then. What is it about the album that makes you defend it so blindly?
>>61472555
>Implying I'm defending the album
>>61471730
Dude you gotta get off the internet and go outside some time everyone in real life loves white people, especially white Americans.
>>61467314
>try to have a discussion
>/pol/ ruins the thread
every single time, I can't escape these whiny faggots.
anyway GK/MC is better
>>61472583
>"No. It sacrifices musicianship for a political and cultural message, and not a particularly wise one either."
>WHAT A GARBAGE UNINFORMED OPPINUNS
>NO IM NOT DEFENING ALBUM WHAT U TALKING ABOTU
I'll assume most of the people here rarely, if ever, accept any piece of art as great or 'compelling'. Just because you can pull out a few quotes from the hundreds of lyrics of the album that you disagree on doesn't mean you should deny its overall excellence, who the fuck likes every single detail of great works of the past anyway. If the artist wants to offer such a huge mass of thoughts and feelings in the way that this album did then you can't expect to agree with every bit of it. Not many people have offered arguments to why tpab isn't musically great either, because that's apparently less relevant than debating the definitions of racism
>>61471991
(you)
>>61472650
Why can't musicians make political and/or cultural messages?
Why stop them at all?
Why isn't it wise?
Lamar can do as he pleases.
>>61472319
Tell me where in the album Kendrick says or even implies something akin to "white people are evil, fuck you white people, this is all your fault"?
You can't criticize an album if you haven't even heard it.
>>61472628
>Anyone who has non leftist opinions is /pol/
keep telling yourself that
>>61472755
if you say nigger and refuse to acknowledge the history of discrimination against blacks you are /pol/
how come this gets to be the black saviour album but Black Messiah doesn't get shit when it's a better album?
>>61472777
I never said nigger, also yes what happened to black in history has been bad, but lots of things that went down in history were terrible and not all caused by the evil white man. White's aren't the only people to enslave others or to be racist
TPAB is fucking shit. There's much better funky political hip hop albums out there, OP
>>61472806
because normies can't get into soul
>>61472708
That wasn't my post, so I will not defend it verbatim. I think it was an OK album with very little innovation, which is one of the things I enjoy most about hip-hop. I'm just fascinated by yall who defend it so rabidly. What is it that makes it so untouchable to you?
This guy: >>61472699 for example assumes that if you don't like TPAB you must just not like music. Look at all the posts in this thread refusing to have a conversation about this album. It's fucking fascinating imo, and I just want to know what makes it such a sacred cow.
>>61472878
poor D'Angelo, as if shit hasn't been hard enough.
>>61467675
>My hair is nappy, my dick is big, my nose is round and wide
>You hate me don't you?
>You hate my people, your plan is to terminate my culture
>You're fuckin' evil I want you to recognize that I'm a proud monkey
>You vandalize my perception but can't take style from me
>And this is more than confession
>I mean I might press the button just so you know my discretion
>I'm guardin' my feelings, I know that you feel it
>You sabotage my community, makin' a killin'
>You made me a killer, emancipation of a real nigga
fucking shit
are those the lyrics from the album FOR REAL
i'm glad i'm never listening to that shit
>>61472806
Because Black Messiah pushed too many boundaries. TPAB was nice and safe while still pretending to be doing something weird, kinda like a hip hop indierock band.
>>61472987
>kinda like a hip hop indierock band.
kek that's pretty apt. oh well maybe in a few years it'll click.
>>61469893
Kendrick had a really good story telling ability that he kinda dropped in tpab, not to mention most of the instrumentals were shit. I agree with his message though I don't like how he got a about making it
>>61472883
Not quite sure I understand your response, but no, I'm assuming that if you dislike tpab as much as many in this thread seem to, it's got to be for more reasons than disagreeing with a few controversial lyrics. And even if you can justify disliking the album for its message, surely you can accept that there will surely be loads of people who will love the message.
>>61473132
Loads of people love the message of Mein Kampf. What's your point
>>61472987
It's kinda funny because TPAB feels like a much whiter album than BM.
>>61473278
>>61473278
anti-intellectualism is the cancer bringing the west to its knees
>>61473301
wut
>>61473301
Not the deffinition guy but please do not pretend that either side is innocent of anti-intellectualism.
>>61473322
a 40 word dictionary entry can't provide a nuanced or insightful understanding of a complex social phenomenon
>>61473278
Am I the only one who feels like the definition of racism changes every few years
>>61473381
>the literal meaning of words are too simple to service my world view
>>61473381
the definition of racism and discrimination are pretty simple actually. Institutionalized Racism is the phrase you're referring too.
>>61473174
mein kampf has more than a few controversial lines and is a load of poorly written unfounded shit. It's claims are literally wrong. Either way if enough people loved it at the time in Germany based on its message then there were also clearly problems with the mindset of the German people. If dislike tpab's message and want to argue that lots of people loving it therefore reflects poorly on our society then go ahead.
In tpab not much of the message is new, it's mostly already accepted and apart from a few points there's not much in the lyrics worth debating, did people actually listen to the album and judge whether they liked the music or hear the blacker the berry lyrics once and make assumptions
>>61473470
my point was that argumentum ad populum is not a valid argument
not that Mein Kampf is comparable to TPAB
kek
>>61468680
When you grow up hopefully you'll figure out that "casual" racism is just straight up regular racism.
>>61473443
a sign of a critical and mature mind is trying to understand people's position/ trying to understand where they're coming from not just dismissing opinions and viewpoints because of internet memes
>>61473446
wrong
>>61470349
holy fuck quit complaining and just do something about it. People like you give blacks a bad name
>>61473541
settle down bill cosby.
>>61473541
>do something about it
What? Like single-handedly bring millions of people out of poverty?
Do you realise how fucking stupid you sound?
People like you give whites a bad name
>>61467675
bruh, this is directed at capitalists n shit and oppressors, not all white people.
>>61473602
>at capitalists
You do realize Marxism has failed everywhere right? Even Marx himself admitted his ideas were bad
Kendrick is just smart enough to convince normal people he has something to say, and just dumb enough that he doesn't actually have anything to say.
>>61469635
This is actually a pretty solid post, I don't know why other SJWs don't break it down like this more often.
>>61473646
do you realise the lengths the american government has gone to to sabotage the realisation of socialism in central american, south american and european countries?
>>61473529
How so? You can't just change the definition of a word to fit your political narrative. Racism is discrimination based on race, it has nothing to do with general social imbalances. A black person could still have prejudices towards a white person or any other non black race based on racial differences, at the heart of it all racism is racism. Now if you want to talk about social power imbalances, we're talking about "institutionalized racism"
>>61473513
I agree. But that means you should try to understand why people on /pol/ feel the way they do as well.
>>61473671
they do all the time. that's a pretty common breakdown you can see anywhere of what systematic racism is.
>>61473693
because they aren't rational, they are depressed juveniles desperate for some kind of identity
>>61473776
>a sign of a critical and mature mind is trying to understand people's position/ trying to understand where they're coming from not just dismissing opinions and viewpoints because of internet memes
>>61473809
what's your point? that literally describes the majority of them
>>61473776
That's just your bias talking. If it were a black youth who wanted to rob and kill it would be different.
Holy fuck i cannot get rid of this image, pic unrelated.
>>61473690
Yes, and it's entirely justified if you read Das Kapital or Manifesto, it falls apart on its own if you look at the consequences logically. Marxism is collectivist, collectivist ideology falls apart because its mission can never actually be accomplished, there will always an "out" group and an "in" group and those definitions will continue to change based on circumstances so the collectivist ideology can survive.
>>61473870
>entirely justified
yeah, you lost all credibility there
>>61473903
You didn't even bother looking at my reasons, Marxism is just bad theory, Frederich's take on it was even worse
>>61473870
actually you lost all credibility when you asserted marxism as the only alternative to (a specific form of) capitalism
>>61473834
>If it were a black youth who wanted to rob and kill it would be different.
It would tho? Why wouldn't it be different? What a retarded non-sequitur.
>>61473943
I read your post, but I'm not convinced by your asseration
>collectivist ideology falls apart because its mission can never actually be accomplished, there will always an "out" group and an "in" group
>>61473870
>Marxism is collectivis
>I'm using words I don't understand to describe positions that are out of my grasp!
Ok bud.
>>61467314
>listening to hip hop
>>61473944
>(a specific form of) capitalism
Read >>61473602
I don't recognize any indication that he was referring to any specific form or type of capitalism, if you do please point it out to me
>>61473903
Well, he's not wrong; Marx did write about how the capitalist would follow the Hegelian march of history and defend capitalism...
>>61470270
Fuck me was am I doing here
What do other people in their late 20s do on the internet? I never figured out how to leave here like the other oldfags did.
>>61473962
What I mean is you don't want to understand /pol/ because you disagree with their views/think they're spooky.
>>61473944
Are... are you insinuating Kendrick is a afro-Kropotkinist, because that's fucking rich
>>61474026
>What I mean is you don't want to understand /pol/
You're saying this as if there was anything of merit to /pol/'s ideology. Protip: there isn't.
>>61473993
Marxism is collectivism though, it asserts that all of history is the history of the innocent proletariat being exploited maliciously by the bourgeois, it necessarily demands that all poor people are being oppressed by all rich people in some way or another
>>61474020
>late 20s
>on mu
>>61474005
That bears no relation to my post whatsoever, why are you all so bad at arguing?
>>61474002
>I don't recognize any indication that he was referring to any specific form or type of capitalism
well the lyrics being angry about capitalists/oppressors implies we're talking about an unfair capitalist society, and immoral capitalist individuals etc.. that's all i meant by a specific form
>>61474035
no, also you aren't "witty'
>>61471524
I need a million dollars first.
>>61473975
Mmmm not him, but the real issue with collectivist ideologies is the ambiguous line between collective as an abstraction and collective as an entity, whereas individualism makes the line very clear, all collectives are abstractions. Collectivism is the philosophical equivalent of drawing a picture of someone and then asking the picture if it likes it instead of the person.
>>61469741
YOUR. PERIODS. ARE. FUCKING. RETARDED.
You're a fucking idiot to assume blacks have been through more. You're a fucking idiot to assume asians have been through more. You didn't even mention hispanics, are you racist? What's your deal racist?
There are white people born into pure shit that have dealt with pure shit since the antebellum period, but you baiting faggots seem to ignore that because it doesn't fit your, "blacks are the only ones with shitty lives!!!!!11!!1!" rhetoric. It's disgusting and perpetuating racism and the esteem differences between races. Maybe you should wipe off your cat-eyed frames and take a look at the world and see that everyone has to deal with insane amounts of weight and stress, and that's what makes us people, and that's what fuels art and expression. Instead, muh racism ughhh white people only blacks can experience racism!!! Quit the special snowflakery and try to make the world better for everyone, not just one race, you chode.
>>61474002
Well, we could start by mentioning the types of capitalism that are not described, I'll start: welfare capitalism.
>>61474081
Just wait 12 years and you'll be in the same position, friendo.
>>61474159
I ain't giving you shit. Quit being needy.
>>61474161
not even remotely convincing or meaningful
no lmao
>>61474089
Your not going to respond to this because you are completely wrong and have no reason to acknowledge it, but he said that Marx called the capitalists defense of capitalism justified, and then you said he lost all of his credibility, and then I clarified that Marx really did say that. That is completely related to your post you fucking idiot.
>>61474209
Why does that analogy fail?
>>61474209
care to respond then? Or just keep pedaling leftist ignorance. What ideology do you subscribe to anyways, surely you arent actually a marxist lenninist...
>>61474071
>Marxism is collectivism though
The problem is that it's a complete non-descript term you're using to disqualify marxism. Capitalism is also subjected to collectivism. It's an empty objection which only libertarians argue against because they don't know how shit works in real life.
>>61469877
Complexion is about hate between light skinned blacks and dark skinned blacks.
>>61474173
You legit think whites experience racism on the same level as other races? Even if you're in a predominately black school that isn't true, you still don't get followed in stores, discriminated against in public arenas EVERY day.
If you think he was talking about 'experiencing more struggles in general', he's still generally right, but I think he just was talking about racism/discrimination.
>>61469741
but also to you, he was obviously using the 'prejudice with power' definition. is this a new definition? relatively, but it's such a normalized/popular thing even in academic discussion now to use that definition of racism, you can't ignore the fact that that's what that word means to some people, even if i agree with you that it's obviously not the long-standing definition of racism
>>61474247
>hurr durr collectivism is constucts
yeah show me any society in the history of everything ever that does not use or rely on constructs, fuqin dumpass lmao
>>61474361
Constructs need to be based on tangible and real things, not on subjective things like who belongs to what ideology or who the cool kids are
>>61474347
>Even if you're in a predominately black school that isn't true, you still don't get followed in stores, discriminated against in public arenas EVERY day.
This is no longer the case.
>>61474403
Where's your evidence to back that claim?
>>61474392
>Constructs need to be based on tangible and real things
Millions of years on evolution so that you can conclude that abstract thinking is actually wrong. Why don't you just drop your computer, remove all your clothing and live like a monkey unable to count to two. At least you'd stop with your literally non-sensical thinking.
>>61474403
what country do you live in? because i live in midwest US, spend a lot of time out in public with black friends, and you're definitely wrong.
>>61474369
You haven't read the worst of the thread, bro. Nothing but nonstop white guilt, degeneracy, twisting meaning of words. Typical leftie jew shit.
>>61474322
Actually Capitalism is neither collectivist or individualist, it's a system. Philosophy and analysis about the system can take either path analytically, but the system is just a system. Marxism, on the other hand, is a strictly collectivist system of analysis.
>>61474414
>shifting the burden of proof this hard
>>61474424
Midwest also, and you're definitely wrong
>>61474420
>He doesn't understand nominalism
teehee
>>61474238
late to respond because i wasnt watching this thread
regardless of whether marx predicted the capitalist defence of capitalism that doesn't justify it, especially when we're talking about aggressive foreign policy regimes
you seem really far up your own ass, this is a historical/political discussion not a philosophical one
also if you insist on calling people fucking idiots you should probably try and get simple things like your/you're right
>>61474460
lol okay. next time my black friends get followed around walmart for no reason aside from their race, or their girlfriend's families disown their daugher for dating a black man, or someone calls them 'nigger' on campus, i'll make sure to tell them that racism doesn't exist anymore
you're a fucking dumbass
>>61474434
guilt is felt as in individual emotion, being aware of the misdoings of your own race doesn't translate to guilt that is felt on an individual level. emotions are felt on an individual level, why don't /pol/ autists understand that?
>>61474361
Not saying it's a useless abstraction, that'd be fucking stupid. Stop assuming everyone you disagree with is fucking stupid. All I am asserting is that collectivism as an ideology treats an abstraction not only like it's a real thing, but better and more privileged than real things. Individualists argue thats fucked up.
>>61474511
Look, you like to project your evil thoughts onto other whites, defend dindus, that's your deal. Just don't poison the well with your backwards thinking and self-hating poison.
>>61474434
these kind of tired ad hominems is why no one takes you seriously
why do some americans have try to turn anyone who opposes them into a caricature?
its called nuance u fucking caveman
>>61474546
hahahaha wow, sometimes i can't tell if you guys are serious or not
>>61474546
youre a fucking moron who will never achieve anything or have any impact on anything, that's your deal
again self-hatred is an individual thing, is not related to awareness of the misdoings of ones race
>>61474562
>hurr your dumb
Keep trying jew.
>>61474473
It's justified because it follows the march of history. If you are talking about justification it's a philosophical discussion whether you like it or not.
Also: I'm on 4chan, I'm not going to proofread my posts. I also do not think you are a fucking idiot, that's just the diction we all use here you know that :).
wish we could block r/hiphopheads users cant you guys stay on your shit meme rap site
>>61474520
>All I am asserting is that collectivism as an ideology treats an abstraction not only like it's a real thing, but better and more privileged than real things. Individualists argue thats fucked up.
I don't know if it's an oversimplification or what, but you seem to be arguing that individualism and collectivism are polar opposites always all the time, which is untrue.
Thus you're using this false dichotomy to conclude that, because marxism has no regard for the individual, marxism is wrong.
>>61474593
>justified because it follows the march of history
That doesn't redeem/justify immoral actions committed by individuals
>>61474584
Again with those twisting of those definitions. You really need to change up your tactics. It's getting pathetic.
>youre a fucking moron who will never achieve anything or have any impact on anything, that's your deal
Lol don't blow a gasket, leftie.
>>61474506
i could waste my time making up stories to argue the opposite side too, but i frankly can't be moved to give a damn
>>61467314
How do I get into pic related
>>61474669
>>61474687
I swear this is bait.
>>61474369
Cry more.
>>61474751
>>61474728
i swear this is bait.
>>61474728
>bait meme
You are really really tiring. No wonder you have to latch on to blacks to seem interesting.
>>61474687
so you could post stories of instances where a black person wasn't subject to racism, to prove that racism is no longer a problem?
you're really something
>>61474724
Listen to Every Nigger is a Star, Parliament, Funkadelic, a lot of jazz, 2pac and Public Enemy
Whatever order you think would make sense
>>61474546
>defend dindus
Oh I see I'm really "understanding" /pol/ now. They should totes hire you as a peace ambassador for furthering such "understanding" between parties, goddamn.
>>61474728
well duh
>>61474765
hahahahaha
>>61474687
>shifting the burden of proof this hard
>>61474724
- Watch cuckolding pornography
- Order a K.dot shrine to worship
- Look in the mirror and scream at your whiteness every morning
- etc.
Im just glad than not all of 4 chan is infected by poltards and they can still get BTFO on other boards(and on their own board) on a daily basis when they spew their shit.
>>61474810
what motivates you to get out of bed in the morning?
jw
>>61474562
i understand that your viewpoint comes from the evidence you see in the street of your town/on the tv and perhaps personal experience that you have had
but i think you should be aware of the attention/interpretation bias that comes from a viewpoint that expresses very strong opinions about most members of a very large group; the world is complex enough that sweeping generalisations dont really cut it if you want to live life intelligently
blond haired blue eyed white western male actually
not that it matters
>inb4 'cuck'
this word makes your sexual insecurities very obvious
>>61474810
>Watch cuckolding pornography
Not good enough, he needs to actually marry a white girl and have 10 black pornstars cream in her pussy
>>61474810
nice b8 m80
>>61474826
Why no direct response to anyone you fucking pussy
>>61474780
you can feel the bitterness in this post, foreal
>>61474856
do you think this is a funny post? honestly reads like something a 14 year old would write
>>61474864
>>61474837
le epic bait meme
Now for something completely related to the thread
Why does p4k called the last Young Fathers' record trite while at the same time unashamedly praising Kendrick for the exact same thematic?
I'm still butthurt about that.
remember when "don't feed the trolls" was essentially a mantra for this website
lol
>>61474865
filtered don't even reply to me you fucking mental midget
>>61474856
>>61474810
I'm not even being ironic here, I legitametly believe some of these people have a racial cuckhold fetish based on some weird guilt complex
>>61474883
Dude c'mon it's just a joke, don't take it personally, oh wait you take your wife's plastic dick personally up your ass every day LMAO
>>61474934
no really youre supposed to be at least 18 to post here please go elsewhere
>>61474924
This is what SJWs and Tumblrinas resort to I hope you know.
>>61474933
I wouldn't doubt it.
the extremely blurry line between 'anti-PC' and 'complete lack of empathy' in modern day net culture is so perfectly exemplified in this thread
>>61474892
congrats on taking the bait
>>61474933
>legitametly
jesus christ..... >>>/youtube/
>>61474978
>This is what SJWs and Tumblrinas resort to I hope you know.
It seems you get real butthurt when people who represent an intellectual authority over you decide ignore you. Does your mom and dad also constantly ignore you and thus you have a complex for feeling left out? ;_;
>>61474980
You sound like a cuck
>>61475026
I'm not even the tripfag. Just stating facts.
>>61474865
I didnt direct my response to anyone because i just arrived to the thread, saw poltards getting rekt left and right and commented on it. You guys get mad too easily, i frequent pol because im extremely curious about your kind, as it turns out most poltards are just poor bitter and unhappy losers (i know this from personality threads, jobs and career threads, etc.) whose only achievement in life is being born white, so they cling onto that all the while they blame all their problems onto others namely minorities, the goverment, the jews, etc. Its very funny to watch.
>>61475032
nah p sure that's you
>>61474980
Political Correctness is pretentious fake empathy though
>>61475122
I wouldn't refute that it can be, but you're ignoring my point
>>61475143
I don't agree with your point, Who are you to say that your average non pc 4channer doesn't feel empathy towards the real people in their day to day lives, most people however don't actually get strong feelings from abstractions and concepts of people.
>>61475122
>pretentious fake
nice meaningless adjectives bro
>>61475370
yeah nobody feels any regard for human lives external to them, that's why i kill 10 nairobian children every day, i don't meet them ever, so i feel that this is correct.
>>61475633
If you told me that 10 nairobian children died, I'm not going to cry or feel much because that's so far from being relateable to my life. Sure you can pretend to be outraged, I'm sure we can both agree that it's not a good thing, but nobody is going to be legitimately moved to tears from it, unless they were directly involved with those children
>>61475840
and thus killing nairobian children is a-ok. as long as you don't meet them. because really, nobody around me is going to feel bad for them, so it's fine.
>>61475893
you imbecile misconstruing things and pretending to be morally outraged, you're fucking insufferable good thing this thread is dead
>>61475916
i accept your admission of defeat.
>>61475926
Sure thing man
>>61475916
i just hope you understand how irrational and egoist is to take part in what's percieved as wrongdoing by another crowd by mere virtue of you not being personally emotionally affected, as menial as that wrongdoing might be (and being menial also begs the question, if it's so minimal, a mild inconvenience, why does thou protest so much?)
for a crowd that protests so much that feeeeelings shouldn't be above people's rights, you sure talk too much about your own feelings.
