I remember a while back this happening. Anybody have the image or a video source on this? I really need it.
>>345484741
>thinking VC games being emulated is Nintendo being "caught"
Are you fucking retarded?
>>345484741
>I really need it
No you don't. Why would you?
You may want it. But what circumstances could really leave you "really needing" it?
>thinking 'ports' arn't a rom running in a virtual machine 99% of the time
iShiggy.
>>345484741
This doesn't even make sense, an emulator is literally a virtual console, hence the name, of course it's an emulator that uses roms you weenie.
>>345484741
what's up with the frog
>>345485117
He wants to EXPOSE Nintendo obviously.
are you retarded op? they own the rights to the game they can do whatever they want with them; of course it's going to be emulated roms how else are they going to sell old games?
>>345485237
>I don't know what I'm talking about: the post
>>345484741
What? How the fuck do you think Virtual Consoles would work otherwise?
What OP means is that Nintendo got caught selling a headered ROM that was ripped with piracy software, which means they literally just download ROMs off the internet then sell them to you.
>>345485117
Cuz he wants to win an important internet argument with his "source"
So then, Nintendo actually benefited from using piracy? Well, it's not like they can make much money from a hardcore niche market, even if every hardcore videogamer that plays classics supported the industry and didn't pirate, they probably couldn't give Nintendo more than 1% of the money they could be receiving from casuals.
So in the end, I guess we actually contributed something by pirating.
>>345485332
He's talking about Nintendo using iNES ROMs downloaded from the internet for the Wii virtual console.
>>345486291
What he means is that they got caught using actual scene rips, which they publicly condemn as piracy and theft.
>>345484741
The controversy wasn't that they were "using roms" but that the roms had data signatures on them that showed they were downloaded off the Internet from illegal rom hosting sites. I think it was from coolrom.com or something. Which is funny because since then Nintendo has cracked down on rom sites.
So basically it wasn't just Nintendo using their own roms, it was Nintendo downloading the roms from illegal sources on the Internet, after condemning those sources, then SELLING those roms with the rom site's signature still on them.
>>345486590
Wouldn't that count as copyright infringement in a way?
>>345486462
What the fuck is a scene rip?
What's wrong with them distributing video games they have licences for?
>>345486350
Why does this even matter when it would make absolutely zero difference if they ripped the roms themselves. Besides, it's their property, so they can take credit for the rips if they damn please. (Do people really go autistic apeshit over credit for a rip?)
>>345486692
No, because Nintendo holds the copyright. They have the right to sell it. However it's still pretty unethical because it's clear that Nintendo relied on an outside site's archiving work for older games without crediting them, and went as far as to DMCA them for hosting the ROMs in the first place.
It's still their game, they have all the right in the world to make use of someone illegally uploading their games to the internet
>>345486462
Please fucking leave this website. Jesus Christ.
>>345486692
Don't think so. They own the games those ROMs were ripped from in the first place, so if the rippers were to complain Nintendo could just sue them for distributing those games illegally.
>>345486949
How hard would it have been to manually rip the roms themselves? Two wrongs don't make a right.
>>345487023
Kill yourself reddit
>>345486692
lmao no
>>345487163
more difficult than hitting up coolrom
>>345486462
>>345486881
>""""Scene"""" faggots steal Iwata 2.0's dog
>Iwata 2.0 angry as fuck about his dog being stolen, sues """"Scene"""" faggots for being dog thieves.
>Iwata 2.0 gets his dog back, can play with him again an be happy.
>""""Scene"""" faggots: b-but I fed your dog all this time, you owe m-me.
WWWOOOOOWWWW
>>345486706
A "scene rip" is an amateur rip of game data, unsanctioned by the copyright holder/publisher, and usually uploaded by a group on the Internet for others to download - to pirate, basically.
Theres nothing wrong with Nintendo using these from a legal standpoint, but it's 1. A display of incompetence that Nintendo couldn't be bothered to archive their own games and had to rely on amateur pirates who they themselves condemned and 2. Pretty unethical for them to take advantage of the archiving work of people they condemned, without crediting them, and even launched litigation against them with DMCA takedowns.
>>345487292
>this whole stupid post
At least it wasn't a food analogy, I guess.
>>345484741
no, because /v/ is the home of the Nintendo Defense Force.
if VC uses scene rips then you are paying for a pirate copy if you buy VC. i don;t know if you remember those warnings from DVDs but piracy literally funds terrorism.
>>345487292
More like
>iwata has his dog's DNA stored in his basement
>burglars break in and copy the information so they can get his dog's DNA too
>a few years later iwata wants to clone his dog using the DNA
>could just go find his copy of the dna in his basement
>instead he goes and gets a copy from the burglars for some reason
Of course, there's nothing actually wrong with nintendo doing it like this, it just seems weird
>>345487163
>Two wrongs don't make a right.
But how is it wrong for the actual licence holder to use illegally ripped roms?
Illegally ripped or not, they do have the licence. The one who ripped the roms illegally never had any ownership of them.
>>345486462
Scene rips are 1:1 to the actual cartridge
>>345487763
The point is that Nintendo condemned the illegally ripped ROMs, but then they sold the very ROMs they condemned, without crediting the people who bothered archiving the ROMs. It's two-faced and unethical, and make Nintendo look really incompetent. But it's not illegal or anything like that, Nintendo's still the copyright holder.
>>345487848
No they aren't.
Learn what an iNES header is.
>>345486070
>doesn't know the Circle Game
I'm glad I own an Acekard and don't give game companies money. Fuck AVGN, AlphaOmegaSin, MetalJesusRocks, Pat and the others who wast money.
Oh and Nintend's NES Classics on GBA were also just ROM files running on a freeware NES emulator they grabbed online, and didn't even credit the source.
>>345487283
>>345487023
He's right though. Try posting content in your posts instead of empty insults and image macros. If you're gonna be a faggot at least explain why you're gonna be a faggot.
I don't think this ever happened. If it did, you'd probably be able to find evidence of it through google.
The only similar situation I remember happening was with Ubisoft, when they used a crack as an update to fix their stupidity.
>>345486462
Are you American by any chance?
>>345484741
Shit's as bad as GOG selling cracked copies of old games they downloaded off the internet.
>>345488029
>>345484741
>see these pics
>automatically brace myself
>>345488029
The question is, punches or push ups?
>>345488029
it looks like one of those terrible casual games. GTFO cancer
>>345486462
why the fuck would they even consider using ripped roms when they have the fucking original? they have all the software to run their games because they are the ones that made it in the first place.
>>345484741
i know what you're talking about OP, but i can't find the image. sorry you're being barraged by newfags
>>345487987
>The point is that Nintendo condemned the illegally ripped ROMs
It is illegal. So there is nothing odd about this at all. Even if you are pro-piracy you should recognize this.
>without crediting the people who bothered archiving the ROMs.
They've got no reason to credit them. Technically speaking they are criminals. They could credit them, but it's neither expected nor necessary. And complementing the work of an act that's against company policy would be contradictory in itself, so naturally the illegal work wasn't credited.
>It's two-faced and unethical
How? The rippers never had the right rip the roms. And yet Nintendo does have the rights to them no matter who ripped them. Nothing is stopping them from using them.
>>345488201
This did happen, it's actually fairly common in the industry. Google "Nintendo virtual console ines headers" for a taste.
>>345487848
They aren't. NES cartridges frequently had extra chips on them besides the ROM which are used to either expand the amount of ROM that can be used, or to expand the capabilities of the NES. Emulators need to know which games use which chips so they can function correctly, so a file format called iNES was created by people in the scene which stores this information in a header followed by the game data itself, all in one file. When Nintendo launched the Wii virtual console, people were quick to notice Nintendo was also using this file format (complete with the iNES) signature, which suggests they downloaded the ROMs from the internet rather than ripping the games themselves.
>>345484741
I know what you're talking about but can't find any information on it. Was it 3 years ago or more?
>>345487992
They use a similar sized header but it's not necessarily iNES header.
It doesn't matter anyway. I'm sure their emulators are mostly code taken from open source MIT licensed emulators
>>345488658
>>It's two-faced and unethical
>How?
Because as >>345488692 said, these roms aren't just ripped, they're also altered by hardworking people for free so that they can be more easily enjoyed. Nintendo took advantage of that work and sold it, while at the same time condemning the work that was being done and litigating the people responsible. That's dishonest and unethical, if you can't see why then you need more life experience I guess.
And no, "well it's legal they have the right!" is not an argument here, I acknowledge it's totally legal, it's just a shitty and unprofessional thing to do. Nintendo should have been able to create their own format to work with NES game data instead of copying the work of unpaid amateurs, but either they were too incompetent, or they didn't want to bother. That makes Nintendo look bad either way.
>>345488318
Punches.
>>345488412
They probably don't have the originals, most video game companies at the time didn't bother to archive their games. Sega no longer has the code for the original Sonic, and Konami list the code for the first Silent Hill (which is partly why the HD port was so broken, they had to reverse engineer the game from a PS1 rip). And even if Nintendo still had the code to their own games, third parties that are also on VC might not.
>>345487848
Not always.
There's a rip of Golden Sun floating out there with a unobtrusive intro, that only appears if you hold L+R whilst you load the rom.
>>345489362
whoever had the idea of putting cracktros in GBA games should be hung upside down and beaten with a baseball bat
especially if they're unskippable, who the fuck thought this was a good idea? it's not like they actually cracked the game unlike the C64/amiga days
>>345488760
No, it's literally the same header. Look it up. Here's a comparison between a SMB rom and the Virtual console version. The same.
>>345488292
>>345488318
>>345488371
There is no preparing.
>>345489674
I never know what I'm looking at when I look at hex values of a file.
How do they know the first two rows are the header? Why are the values different at the bottom?
>>345489674
For that matter why are they different sizes? Why is the one on the right a .app file? Why doesn't the one on the right start with 0? Why are the sizes different?? How does anyone read this shit?
>>345490005
>How do they know the first two rows are the header
because they're at the top?
do you have a hunchback?
>>345490212
Why not just the first row? Why not the first 10 rows??
>>345490131
just a guess, but the .app file is most likely extracted from whatever VC game it was
it's just a renamed .nes file
>>345490267
a header can be as long as you want it to be
in this case the iNES standard is about 15 bytes
>>345490005
The values are the same at the bottom, the one on the right is just cut off.
>>345490005
>>345490131
It's a hexadecimal representation of the actual data contained in the file. Open a hex editor and look at any file, it'll look something like that. The reason they're different file types is because one is a rom meant for an emulator and the other is a virtual console app - but they both have the same data despite having different extensions.
Headers always come at the beginning of a file. Hence the highlighted lines which are the same.
By the way, the whole rest of the file is the same too. Look at it line by line, the data is identical.
>>345490273
oh wait im wrong, looks like the .app file might be the actual VC emulator with the rom embedded into it
>>345484741
Virtual Console is an emulator what else would they use?
>>345486456
>>345486462
>>345486590
Wait, this doesn't even make sense.
Nintendo downloaded their own games from the internet? Why didn't they have access to their own data? This is ridiculous. It's like the official DVD release of a movie being cell phone video recorded in a theater.
You guys might see this as an ethical issue or something, but I'm just wondering how they could be so retarded.
>>345490782
Yeah, that's the point. Even if you don't think it's unethical, it still makes them look like idiots.
>pirates steal nintendos games
>nintendo returns what was stolen from them
>/v/ spergs out
I know everyone on this subreddit is big into self-depricating humor, but you're not really that retarded are you
>>345490506
That explains a lot, thank you anon
>>345490782
>Why didn't they have access to their own data?
Do you think Nintendo just has digital versions of NES games lying around on hard drives somewhere?
If it aint for sale anymore, they don't have it anymore.
>>345491241
>Do you think Nintendo just has digital versions of NES games lying around on hard drives somewhere?
Even if they don't see the value in having digital copies (despite the fact that the entire NES game library could fit on a USB stick), they should at least be able to get a hold of one of the cartridges they made, or something.
Sometimes books go out of print, and then get another print run later. But when that happens, you don't see the publisher going to Barnes & Noble to buy an old copy and then photocopying it at Staples to create the new edition. That's basically what Nintendo is doing.
>If it aint for sale anymore, they don't have it anymore.
That's the thing. It is for sale.
>>345491846
the difference is Barnes & Noble is a responsible company run by smart people
>pirates getting mad when their own work gets pirated
lol
>>345491846
You do know that for thousands of years the only way to keep books in tact was to make copies.
And then those copies were copied.
People today don't credit the monks for doing that shit. In fact they actively deny it ever happened.
>>345492235
it's not even that
it's just that they're trying so hard to shut them down then they do this, where the fuck are they gonna get the pirated games then?
>>345484741
I don't get the problem, Nintendo own's the property they are selling. Roms for archival purposes are not illegal, not in the United States anyway.
>>345484741
I remember seeing a single picture claiming it, and no proof
>>345492360
>In fact they actively deny it ever happened.
Not really.
>>345492360
>TFW you hire 70 monks to make translations of your bible and they all come back with the exact same translation
>>345488570
I like this image, but at the same time I really hope it isn't implying that 4chan doesn't function in exactly the same way for exactly the same reasons.
>>345493736
4chan is actually worse because the anonymity makes it much easier to drown out dissenters by making it seem like the popular opinion is larger.
And if somehow anyone notices the problem and manages to organize well-enough against it, mods just step in and start banning people under umbrella terms like "shitposting" "offtopic" "quality of posts" etc and nobody knows otherwise because bans don't need to be public.
So, hold on. Someone extracted the ROM of a virtual console file, and it looks like the header of an iNES file, which apparently is a file type for NES roms.
How exactly does a NES rom look different from an iNES rom in the first place?
>>345494452
most NES ROMs actually contain two ROMs, one for the graphics and one for the actual progarm
when people rip them, they usually combine them and throw a header on top so the emulator knows what type of cartridge to emulate
>>345488692
>>345494731
>>345494803
Okay, that's a good suggestion, but is it impossible that Nintendo got copies of their own carts, then ripped them and put them into the iNES format themselves?
>>345484741
Besides /v/ just trying hard to make a historic screencap, I know what you're talking about.
There's that photo where it showed Nintendo using something for emulators that was created by someone else. Something like that.
Don't have it though but I know what you're talking about.
>>345484741
Nintendo has evry right to use rooms for its own games.
And ti was not roms but using Zsnes or something for its snes emulator.
>>345495075
nintendo is way too lazy to do that
but it's their shit though and it's nintendo. don't they just get away with it just like that?
>>345484741
Of course VC is roms, what else would they be?
>>345489539
Thank god for no-intro.org and their intro removal tools.
What the fuck would they do even if Nintendo was?
"You're using our ripped roms of your console's games".
>>345496464
nothing, it's just that nintendo are complete assholes about it
>>345495075
It's not impossible but 1) why would spend the effort 2) why would they use a format created by pirates if they were going to do the manual work themselves anyway
>taking back your games from pirates
disgraceful!!
>>345496701
1. To be able to cleanly adapt a rom that they know is good coming from a cartridge
2. Maybe the iNES format just happens to be the best format for making ROM interact with virtual machines? Especially since I've read that NES carts have to direct the system to any peripheral chips that they might use.
>>345486070
>>345492667
kek'd
>>345492667
this entire thread is shitflinging with literally no sources
PS: THEY GOT THE ROM FROM INTERNET
>>345484741
>Nintendo caught using roms for Virtual Console
Uuuuuh, isn't that what they've always been doing? I didn't expect anything different from it being a VIRTUAL console. Is this like some Clickhole or Onion article or some shit?
>>345484741the game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLWY7fCXUwE
Didn't Capcom do the same shit with the recent Megaman Classic collection?
>>345490685
>Virtual Console is an emulator what else would they use?
They could code the game again from scratch
>>345496865
Do you have the source on this? I remember it I just can't remember the name.
>>345489216
>Because as >>345488692 said, these roms aren't just ripped, they're also altered by hardworking people for free so that they can be more easily enjoyed.
I am aware.
>Nintendo took advantage of that work and sold it
And what's the issue here exactly? If the work was already done for them, why not make use of it? Why work on it from scratch when that's no longer needed?
>while at the same time condemning the work that was being done and litigating the people responsible.
And what's strange about that? They did Nintendo's work for them, without the licence to do said work. If they had been under Nintendo's employ before doing the work then all would have been fine and dandy, but they weren't. So their work was illegal. But still useful since properly done.
>That's dishonest and unethical, if you can't see why then you need more life experience I guess.
No seriously. They were working outside of the law. Yes I do admire the work they've done and the work that's still being done today on this subject. I value it a lot and consider it quite extraordinary and incredible. And if it weren't for it, the amount of valuable data that we would have likely had lost through the ages is just a depressing thought.
However, they have been working outside of the law. Everyone have known that. They knew that. That was always as plain as day. And if anything, it makes their work even more admirable albeit still illegal.
>>345489216
>>345500876
>And no, "well it's legal they have the right!" is not an argument here, I acknowledge it's totally legal, it's just a shitty and unprofessional thing to do.
No seriously. How is it not an argument? What's unprofessional about it? Do you honestly consider the professional and legit thing to do have an actual official credits list sponsored by Nintendo reading the following "Brought to you, these criminals - "?
There is absolutely no reason to and it wouldn't make sense to do so on so many levels. In spite of how admirable the work is or not. It's still not labelled correctly, it has not been legit work. It has been black work done without a licence or Nintendo's approval.
>Nintendo should have been able to create their own format to work with NES game data instead of copying the work of unpaid amateurs, but either they were too incompetent, or they didn't want to bother.
No they could have most certainly have done it. But why bother? Why bother when the work has already been done for them? If anything that would have made them look incompetent.
>That makes Nintendo look bad either way.
For using fine work presented to them (and the rest of the entire world) on a silver platter. Work that they by all rights own even though they did not issue it? That makes them look bad?
>Are Game Copying Devices Illegal?
>Yes. Game copiers enable users to illegally copy video game software onto floppy disks, writeable compact disks or the hard drive of a personal computer. They enable the user to make, play and distribute illegal copies of video game software which violates Nintendo's copyrights and trademarks. These devices also allow for the uploading and downloading of ROMs to and from the Internet. Based upon the functions of these devices, they are illegal.
when will nintendo go to jail for their crimes???
>>345499920
Interesting watch.
Hopefully more games get the Mega Man treatment and released on other platforms.
Why is this even a problem? They own the IP to the game anyway. If I was an underpaid developer tasked to make Virtual Console, I'd download a torrent of ROMs and slack off for the rest of the month. Fuck that shit.
nintendo distributing rips that people unaffiliated with nintendo made is pretty retarded.
could you imagine if microsoft made you download windows 10 from other users instead of their own servers, and someone had figured a way to inject those files with altered code?
>>345502862
That's actually a feature of Windows 10 though.
By default, Win 10 machines will discover other Win 10 machines on the same network and deliver updates to them
>>345486350
>they just download their own software and sell it to you
How
>>345486692
doesnt matter, it's ok when nintendo does it
>>345484741
I don't think you quite understand what a ROM is, retard. How the fuck else are they supposed to dump the information from the game into a file?
>>345504770
just like a virus
>>345484741
are you fucking stupid
>>345489216
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLWY7fCXUwE&t=40m15s
>>345500975
It is perfectly legal to do many many illegal things as long as it is deemed legal in some form, fashion, or in some loophole.
Look at how any government works.
If the legality of an thing isn't in question (it isn't) but people are still more concerned with the morality inferred, maybe the legality should be in question.
>>345485332
lmfao what show is this from?
>>345495904
WADS
>>345507246
This is possibly the most retarded post i've ever seen, virtual console games are distributed in WADS that contain an emulator and rom
>>345488412
Ubisoft pirated the soundtrack for Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood collector's or whatever edition.
>>345502858
That's probably exactly what happened. Nintendo tells some code monkey to go put games on their virtual console. Code monkey does what all code monkeys do and google virtual console and found that everything has been done. Code monkey copies and paste and finish everything in one day and slack off for the rest of the month.
Technically nobody can sue Nintendo since its their games to begin with.
>>345484741
legit question,
What would they use if not using ROMs?
This is the most retarded thread I've seen in a long while.
>>345509842
It's not that they're using ROMs, it's that they obtained the ROMs by downloading them from piracy sites they've tried to shut down in the past.
>>345510226
literally no content to your post, why respond?
I think what OP is trying to get at is that they're cutting corners. They could dump the roms from cartridges themselves, since they definitely have the means to do so. Or maybe the data is backed up on something else deep in their archives, whatever.
This definitely isn't even the first instance of official emulation doing this, though. I was having a long talk with a professor of mine that worked on one of those arcade game compilations for the PS2, and he said that the team just downloaded all the roms from the internet, since the publisher wasn't getting back to them with the data as quickly as they would have liked.
Whenever devs do this stuff, they usually take a look at the files and make sure there's no traces of who dumped it. Nintendo just slipped up here.
>>345486195
>>345485332
>>345484916
literally
>DELETE THIS REEE
>>345510438
ah, got it
>>345510703
Ease off the butthurt
>>345486350
I read that the headers are such a small amount of coding that it can only be done one way, meaning even if Nintendo did their own code, it would be the same as the ines headers.
>>345491241
Are you high?
>>345484741
>Nintendo owns these properties
You fucking retard. They can do whatever they want.
>STILL literally no proof of these claims
top quality thread m8s
>>345508272
You sound 12.
>>345512318
>expecting sauce on a shitflinging nintendo hate thread
ok
Anyone has that image that says is okay when Nintendo does it?
>>345512947
keep sucking that dick
>>345512947
I expected some semblance of proof, considering people are arguing this shit like it's real
whats up with all the shills and cucksuckers on /v/ lately?
Threads full of people defending shit companies do,yesterday there was a thread with lots of people defending poor translations
>>345515979
yeah i don't understand it either
it's a pretty recent phenomenon
>>345515979
>what's with all the people defending companies against my claims that have zero evidence? Why don't people just accept the bullshit I'm making up? When did facts become more important than my feelings?
