How are humans that *important* when their largest colony on Terra Nova only has 4.4. million people? Why is it that you see so many humans on the Citadel? Humans only discovered the existence of an intergalactic society about 30 years ago from when the game begins.
So why is the Alliance considered a "sleeping giant", when its population is tiny? Why are they being considered for a seat on the Council?
This universe makes no sense.
>>345002990
Cus power fantasy
Because humanity.
>>345002990
We're the party race. Everybody loves us.
>>345002990
Because they fought the Turians, the most powerful military in the galaxy, to a standstill
>>345003503
>Because they fought the Turians, the most powerful military in the galaxy
That's an overstatement. They literally beat back a policing force...
Because it's a game made by humans. Of course humans are gonna get jerked off in the fantasy setting. It's not like there are any real Turians, Salarians, Asari, Krogan, Hanar, Elcor, etc to call Bioware out on it.
>>345003592
They took a planet from them.
Fact: The Council took special interest in humans right off the bat because they were able to go toe to toe with the Turians
>>345002990
let's see your shitty turian fleet be remotely as good at killing a reaper as the alliance one was
There's a large inconsistency because the Mass Effect codex - as well as the planet information one obtains from scanning - very much gives the impression that human populations outside of Earth are very small.
However, the writers of ME2 realized this was a problem if they were going to make humans more "important" and "relevant" in the story, so they changed the population of some colonies to be much higher. However, high colonial populations make no sense, since humans only begun their colonization efforts some 50 years ago, and only were integrated into the galactic community less than 35 years ago by the time of the game.
Something that also bothered me was how there can be 2 million humans living on the Citadel by the time the game begins. This sounds hard to believe.
>>345002990
Because Earth has 11.4 billion people on it.
The Asari homeworld only has 5 billion, the Turians 6 billion, the Quarians 300 thousand, the Krogan 2 billion, and even the Salarians which were the most prevalent only have 10 billion.
So right off the bat, there's more humans than any other species. More than a couple of them combined, even.
Further, humanity progresses way faster than every other race. What most of the other Citadel races took centuries or millennia to accomplish took Humanity decades.
Three thousand years before the start of the game, the Asari were at where they are now technologically. We went from wielding iron swords to commanding the strongest galactic military since the Protheans in that time.
>>345002990
Humans are the youngest space faring race and have advanced quickest in technology, biotics and numbers.
They're not the strongest, but the citadel recognizes the potential for the future of humanity.
>>345002990
Buttmad turian detected.
Go eat some cholocate, faggot. Oh wait. You can't.
Consider that Illium - an asari colony that is not officially even a part of asari space - has a population of 89 million.
Now remember that canonically, Terra Nova is the largest colony of the Human Alliance. It only has a population of 4 million, and this after extensive Alliance-funded colonization and incentives. Fair to say that humans are vastly outnumbered by every other species.
>>345004248
>>345004425
Seems like the other races should be treating humans as they treated Krogans then rather than sucking humanity's dick.
>>345002990
Because Bioware
ITT: People just realizing that Bioware sucks at writing
>>345004248
Which is bullshit because average of 2 billion spread out over 50 worlds is still 100billion people
Humanity have a single overpopulated homeworld and some sparsely populated colonies while other species have time to colonize and dig in resulting in an overall larger population.
We're literal space poo in loo from the point of view of other Citadel species. Complete with Humanity will be developed species in 30 years
>>345002990
Normies can't relate to an alien race.
>>345004646
Except the humans aren't a race of near-mindless warriors like the Krogan. Human scientists are better than even Salarian ones.
So I'm sure the last thing the Council wanted to do is challenge human scientists to see who could engineer a genetic plague to wipe out who first.
>>345004248
That's just the homeworlds, though. We don't know the exact number of colonies each species has, or the number of people on those colonies.
Considering the time between the asari discovering spaceflight and the date the games take place in, they could have hundreds of worlds, each with hundres of millions of inhabitants. The turians, too.
The turians even had an interstellar civil war.
>>345002990
Because Bioware was too stupid to pull off Babylon 5's barely relevant humans.
>>345004827
What non-Homeworld planets do you think have billions in population?
>>345002990
Because in-universe Humans are unnaturally good at fucking everything to the point where it literally frightens the other races.
Turians had ME tech for ages before the war between Turians and Humans began and Humans fucking won. As you say Humans only really discovered Galactic society about 30 years ago but we're already at the forefront of civilian and military technology, biotic research and advancement, galactic diplomacy, trade, etc.
Humans also have a reputation for pragmatism;
"When you want a problem shot call a Turian. When you want a problem talked at call an Asari. When you want a new problem call a Salarian. When you want a problem fixed call a Human."
>>345004248
The trading post backwater of Illium has 84 million people on it. Estimating the older races based just on their capital world pops is stupid.
>>345005124
>humans invented both space carriers and medi-gel
Bioware, pls stop.
I always hated it when people shit talk humanity. We're the best goddamn animals to come off this mud ball.
We also have insane stamina and endurance. We're soft but we last a long time. We're the long distance runners of the animal kingdom after all.
Party race.
>>345002990
The game is made for a human audience, and we like to be flattered.
irl, the geth would dominate everything except for the reapers. There's no beating machines except with more advanced machines. Biologicals are inherently inferior and out of the running immediately the moment intelligent machines are created.
Humans need food. They need air and water. They need to spend nearly half their time unconscious. They need to shit, they can die from a modest fall if they land wrong, and if you kill one it takes ~18 years to replace it. Millions of robots can be manufactured in that amount of time.
It's not even close to balance. It's baby vs. rhino. Puppy versus steamroller. Like if there were to be a war between humanity and frogs or something.
>>345002990
Because Bioware was too fucking lazy to create alien models. Also humans have to be "special snow flakes" to keep all the normies happy.
>>345005432
The only real advantage of a machine race is that they have 100% knowledge of how to edit themselves and can evolve at a break neck race. If a biological society reached the same knowledge of themselves it would be the same with self evolution
>>345005257
>backwater
Yeah, try again. Illium is the major trade planet between the Asari Republic and the Terminus Systems. It's the Constantinople of the Asaris. I don't actually remember a larger non-Homeworld planet for them.
>>345005432
>Humans need food. They need air and water. They need to spend nearly half their time unconscious. They need to shit, they can die from a modest fall if they land wrong, and if you kill one it takes ~18 years to replace it.
All things we can overcome with science.
We didn't evolve claws and teeth to fight with. We evolved intelligent brains. We're the problem solvers, the tool users, the innovators.
>>345002990
Because it's a game made by Bioware, and it's rige with inconstancies. wtf do you think?
>>345002990
Because fuck you, thats why.
Its science fiction. Shit doesnt have to make sense.
>>345005672
>blah blah blah we're so great because X Y Z
Result: Killed by machine
>>345005635
Illium isn't even in asari space. It's not even an official asari planet. And yet it has a population of 89 million.
Compare to humanity's largest colonies on Elysium or Terra Nova or Eden Prime - these only have a population of 4 million. Most human colonies you encounter have populations in the thousands.
Pretty sure humanity is outnumbered.
>>345005432
>implying
You assume that you can program limitless creativity and ingenuity. That every facet of intelligence is directly understandable and processable. And with that presumption you assume that they have limitless resources to endlessly self-replicate and upgrade.
The Geth don't exist inside a vacuum. For a bunch of slave robots for how far they've managed to stretch that AI is pretty fucking impressive at all.
>>345002990
cause we are technologically advanced considering we just discovered 'the mass effect'
and personally I think the asari wanted our dna, if you take my meaning.
>>345005432
The most sophisticated machine would be a biological organism.
>>345005432
While all of this is embarrassingly true, no sci-fi ever does a good enough job depicting what human advancement would look like even 100 years into the future.
We're on the verge of producing honest to god genetically modified super soldiers, being able to regenerate limbs, organs, CNS tissue, fusing with mechanical and electrical augments that enhance vision, immune function, have exoskeletal systems that further enhance speed, strength, reaction times. Every single human being could be a Master Chief with telekinesis.
40K's Spess Mehreens aren't too far removed from a possible reality. If we tailored a developing embryo with the geneseed instead of doing it to an adult we'd be able to make it happen.
>>345005880
Why? Because on the largest Asari planet we're aware of, they have less than 100 million people? Combined with their homeworld, that still puts them at less than half what humanity has on its homeworld alone.
>>345005963
>You assume that you can program limitless creativity and ingenuity.
No I don't.
>That every facet of intelligence is directly understandable and processable.
No I don't.
>And with that presumption you assume that they have limitless resources to endlessly self-replicate and upgrade.
No, just faster than we can kill 'em.
Machines don't need to be conscious or even particularly "smart" to win. They just need to be able to self-replicate and identify/kill human targets.
>>345006172
>No, just faster than we can kill 'em.
Why would you assume that?
>>345006020
Hey that's a reall good point, I bet it will save you from-
>Result: killed by machine
dangit
>>345003592
If you read the codex you'd know that the turians thought it was our entire fleet fighting them, but they were BTFO after the actual main fleet came to wreck their shit.
I'd say the only reason the council took interest so much is because if they didn't give us a special snowflake pass into the alliance, we'd have destroyed a very good portion of the turian fleet.
>>345002990
Humans are an effective tool for the Citadel because they're rapidly colonizing every planet on the Citadel borders, expanding its control. Every one mentioned in the game seems to go to shit, but that doesn't really matter to the Citadel because they get to keep the expanded territory while humanity's the one shoveling colonists into the furnace.
>>345006298
Why do you think it takes 18 years to make one robot?
>>345005124
>>345005379
This is what I hate the most about Mass Effect's brand of humanity fuck yeah.
Look at Halo lore before 343. We got our shit kicked out of us. Hundreds of world burned to ashes, yet we still spit in the eye of the covenant and fought tooth and nail until the Elites began to respect our tenacity. They admire us for our courage and cunning in battle.
That's humanity fuck yeah done right. We earned it through blood, tears and sacrifice.
Then came Mass Effect's humanity. Compare to most species, the council practically bend their asses over and handed us everything it took most species centuries to earn within a decade on a silver platter, yet we complain it's not made out of gold. It's like a whiny kid who's speshual just because.
>>345006428
Why do you think it takes 18 years to kill a robot?
>>345006510
Humans and robots can both be killed quickly but they cannot be *replaced* at the same rate.
>>345006479
>self-hating faggot
Is this the science fiction equivalent of white guilt?
>>345006094
All humanity has IS the homeworld.
Its colonial and extra-solar population is irrelevant. There are 12 billion humans living on Earth at the beginning of ME. Factor in all the colonials (people not living on Earth or on Sol), you - at most - have a population of 13 billion.
>>345006382
It's a patrol fleet. Casualty on both sides are around 600 with slightly higher on the turian's side since they're caught with their pants down. That's like a fraction of a fraction of both side's military.
![1f8[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/mVh4RXd.jpg "1f8[1].jpg")
>>345005432
>implying frogs wouldnt beat the shit out of humanity easily
Fucking REEEEEEEEEEEEE
>>345005432
4.3 humans are born every second
That's 135 604 800 per year.
>>345006618
It's not self-hate. It's the fact that it breaks the immersion by being so ridiculous.
>>345006479
Humans are apex predators, and no matter how far we advance we'll always have our cave man instincts for killing, and cumming in everything that our cocks fit in. We're the very best that mother nature could spit out, and we've been fucking shit up since day 1. Literally 100,000+ year pedigree of being motherfuckers.
We split the atom, turned war into the most profitable industry on our planet, and every single day think up new tools to kill one another. We are ruthlessness incarnate.
>>345006604
Right, but humans produce biologically. Robots are constructed and require materials. Since the Geth aren't allowed in Council space and no one is trading with them, their capacity to reproduce is shunted. And for as many Geth as there are, they'd still have to kill hundreds to one to break even against the Council.
And that's just assuming that Geth are equal. Complete lack of access to Biotics and biological engineering is costly too. A Vorcha blows off a Geth's flashlight head and the Geth dies. The Geth blows off the Vorcha's head, and a new one sprouts.
>>345006618
>implying being space wellfare niggers is HFY
>>345006901
Think about how much faster the number of machines could grow over that same period when it takes at most a few hours to build one.
I wonder if Christcucks in 2180 are opposed to interspecies relations.
>>345006920
So they fuck off into deep space and mine astroids for metal. Raw metals + sunlight = more geth.
Sure, biological life has magic super powers in the Mass Effect universe. They have to in order to compete with machines. In real life, magical super powers don't exist, but robotics does.
>>345006906
Why? So many races are the best at different thing, why does humanity excelling in some areas bother you?
Does it trigger you that Krogan live centuries and Asari live millennia? How about the Rachni's ability to exist in the vacuum of space and travel at FTL organically? The fact that the Vorcha have situational evolution?
No. Just humans.
>>345005672
>We didn't evolve claws and teeth to fight with. We evolved intelligent brains.
Actually, that's wrong. Higher thinking and tool use certainly contributed to our success at hunting and absolutely was essential to the creation of farming and industry (which is why we are the dominant species), but in terms of hunting and beating other animals our brains aren't our weapon.
As another anon said, we have unnatural endurance and stamina. While most animals relied on speed and savagery to hunt their prey we simply followed them and waited, knowing that we would be still be awake and ready to capitalize on weakness long after the animal became exhausted, tired, dehydrated, and starved.
>>345007273
Assuming that the costs of FTL travel, planet surveying and mining all manage to break even AND produce a profit when they're pushed out of all the rich core worlds. It's like trying to get rich dumpster diving.
>>345007358
That's really weird too considering our brains are such calorie hogs.
>>345007129
>when it takes at most a few hours to build one
Ok, let's take comparatively simple machine.
91.5 million motor vehicles were produced globally in 2015.
This is with an entire world wide industry.
>>345006667
That's still more than either Asari or Turians, not to mention that technically if humans wanted, they could multiply their productive population by two every 25 years or so.
Seriously why not outlaw pregnancy prevention on colonies.
Be completely honest with me, /v/:Would you bf a turian?
>>345006479
Did you even play either of those games?
In Mass Effect, humans were hated everywhere. We managed to beat the shit out of the Turians despite a massive technological difference, in a war that wasn't our fault. The Council had to DIE, and humanity had to force a human member on to the new Council, which still tried to fuck with humanity and not listen. Through hard work, sacrifice, compromise and guts, humanity managed to save the entire universe, even those that tried to kill us.
Halo was about how humanity made a god-damned super soldier, before we even had alien technology, that single-handedly won a war and beat not just one alien race, but an alliance of them. Humans in the Halo universe were just gifted for no reason. If they hadn't been retarded, they wouldn't have lost most of their colonies either. They didn't earn shit from "blood, tears and sacrifice". They huddled together in a corner of Earth going "Please save us from the aliens, Master Chief!".
>>345007452
What profits do you mean? What economy do the geth have? They are machines.
They do not need "core worlds". They do not need planets to live on, period. They are as at home in space as fish are in water. Space is a machine's ideal habitat.
Try to imagine something like Skynet escaping into space instead of staying on Earth to fight humanity.
Once it makes it to the asteroid belt it has essentially unlimited metals to replicate with. When it comes back in maybe a century or so it would be unfathomably advanced, powerful and numerous.
>>345007310
It's not the fact that we excel in some areas, it's the fact that we suddenly became giants overnight even if everyone else have hundreds of years of head start in terms of economy and population alone. I mean, if it takes place like hundreds of years after first contact it's believable the kind of influence humanity have on the galaxy but 30 years of constant is just too little.
>>345005635
Illium is a backwater that's tolerated because of it's small nature. No frontier outpost small enough for plausible deniability (that's not an Asari planet wink wink) will ever be the equivalent of Constantinople
>>345007248
ashley whats-her-face is a christcuck and she dislikes aliens
>>345007473
That's not constrained by technology but by economics. That many were produced because that's what they projected they would be able to sell.
You are very dumb. This is another reason machines would easily kill you.
>>345007709
By profit I didn't mean literal currency. I mean that exploring the vastness of space itself requires fuel and resources. Surveying planets requires resources. Mining requires resources. You might not find enough usable resources in an excursion to make back what was used in the attempt, let alone take back an excess to go creating more Geth with.
That's the problem with the whole AI theory. They don't exist in a vacuum with infinite resources where they endlessly self-duplicate. The Geth have to come from somewhere and they're not allowed anywhere. The Quarian describe a similar situation with themselves, constantly trying to just break even on their flotilla, and even they have the benefit of being able to trade with the Council races.
>>345004168
>be humans on citadel
>need to rapidly expand population
>have shitload of advanced technology
>grow humans in artificial wombs as well as offer incentives for women to bear children
It works
>>345007730
Just like the Krogan did. And the Rachni. And the Turian. Every other century in the Milky Way galaxy there's another race uncovered that becomes the next giant that gives the Council pause. You're only bitching about humanity though.
>>345007829
>You are very dumb. This is another reason machines would easily kill you.
Are you 12 or something?
I provided you with actual realistic numbers, you merely repeated yourself about how your magical robots will be superior to everything ever. It's like talking to an embodiment of anime storytelling.
>>345008140
Stop arguing with the self hating Bernie supporter. You'll never get through to him.
>>345008140
The Krogan and Turians had to distinguish themselves by fighting long wars that devastated their colonies and inner worlds.
Humans didn't do anything besides beat back a patrol and call it "victory".
>>345007739
>small nature
>backwater
Where do you guys keep getting this?
I might be mistaken and if I am, correct me, but is there a single larger Asari planet outside their Homeworld in the entire series? I don't remember one larger. And every description I remember reading of Illium has it painted as a major trade hub, hell, THE major trade hub with the Terminus Systems.
So... is there a bigger Asari planet? If so, which? Is there a larger trade planet? If so, who?
Because the writing shits the bed 5 hours into the first game but people insist that it's a masterpiece because they don't know how to find plotholes so big they can fit their head through them.
>Shepard is a reaper which means he doesn't answer to anyone except the council
>Except when it becomes convenient to create drama and create a shitton of filler to pad out game time, at which point Shepard now answers to everyone except the council
>>345007129
>machines are hard-capped by how much metal they can get
>biological life is hard-capped by how much fucking energy of virtually any type they can inject into the food chain
wew lad
>>345007358
And we knew that because of our brains. You cannot find a reputable scientist anywhere that would say anything over than "Humanity's best weapon has always been it's brain."
Humans have never won anything in a physical contest with animals. Our endurance means nothing, because everything else is either 3-5 times faster, or strong enough to kill us in one swipe. We don;t have the hearing, sight or sense of smell to follow or stalk them. That leaves us with tracking footprints, traps, and tools, all of which require basic thinking abilities to use. If humans didn't have these things, hunting would have been impossible for them. From the smallest rabbit to the largest elephant, there would be no way to kill an animal just by running after it with whatever you had at hand. A human would never capture any animal like that.
>>345007456
Our brains evolved after we were already apex predators. Remember, modern humans are just the only surviving members of an entire genus of primates that hunted via exhausting their prey.
>>345008003
>I mean that exploring the vastness of space itself requires fuel and resources.
That is a much bigger problem for biological life than machines. If you are a machine you can just turn off while coasting on momentum. A thousand years is nothing.
Or you can adjust your processing speed to change your perception of how time passes. 500 years could be a few days to you.
>Surveying planets requires resources. Mining requires resources. You might not find enough usable resources in an excursion to make back what was used in the attempt, let alone take back an excess to go creating more Geth with.
You seem to be imagining sending spaceships and equipment like humans would. Machines do not need to do that. They only need to send a seed: A single self-replicating machine, sometimes called a von neumann universal constructor.
It can make loads of these and send them out in every direction like spores. Very small waste for the ones that never find anything of value but it isn't as if asteroids are rare.
Again this is also a problem for biologicals but much moreso.
>That's the problem with the whole AI theory. They don't exist in a vacuum with infinite resources where they endlessly self-duplicate.
Neither do biologicals. If anything it's a worse problem for biologicals because of how much more difficult it is to make food than it is to find metals.
You don't need to agree with me. Machines would still win. You could even keep disputing it as it is happening but it would still happen nevertheless.
>>345008442
>Humans have never won anything in a physical contest with animals.
I measure dicks with my cat all the time.
Little faggot always loses.
>>345008140
Turians have been in space for centuries before first contact. They even have a Unification wars beforehand after the colonies start becoming self sufficient and going rogue.
Krogans breed just as fast as rabbits and are practically immortal unless killed. They can close the population gap faster humanity could.
>>345008284
>remember reading of Illium has it painted as a major trade hub, hell, THE major trade hub with the Terminus Systems.
That's not much considering the Terminus Systems are the frontier i.e. uncivilized space
>>345007709
>Space is a machine's ideal habitat.
That is absolutely false. A lack of gravity makes maintaining machinery a fucking nightmare, the tiniest amounts of conductive particles can float right onto the circuits of delicate equipment and fry everything.
>>345008161
>I provided you with actual realistic numbers, you merely repeated yourself about how your magical robots will be superior to everything ever.
No I didn't. I pointed out that the numbers you supplied are constrained by economics, i.e. worldwide demand for automobiles, not by technological limitations to the rate of production.
You have ignored this point because it destroys your whole argument. Probably you will ignore it again.
>>345002990
The harbinger has your answers
>“Quarian; considered due to cybernetic augmentation, weakened immune system too debilitating.”
>“Drell; useless, insufficient numbers.”
>“Asari; reliance upon alien species for reproduction shows genetic weakness.”
>“Salarian; insufficient lifespan, fragile genetic structure.”
>“Human; viable possibility, impressive genetic malleability.”
>“Geth; an annoyance, limited utility.”
>“Krogan; sterilised race, potential wasted.”
>“Turian; you are considered...too primitive.
>“Human; viable possibility, aggression factor useful if controlled.”
>“Human; viable possibility, impressive technical potential.”
>“Human; viable possibility, if emotional drives are subjugated.”
>“Human; viable possibility, great biotic potential.”
>>345008409
>>biological life is hard-capped by ability to produce food, which is a much more logistically complex process than mining
ftfy
>>345007496
>That's still more than either Asari or Turians
We know the Turians have been in space since at least 700 AD and have multiple colonies (unification war). There's no fucking way that Turian population growth is so low that even with a 1480 year headstart on us they have less population than humans.
>>345008442
>Humans have never won anything in a physical contest with animals.
Can someone explain to me where people like this poster are being educated?
>>345008442
>Our endurance means nothing, because everything else is either 3-5 times faster
Stopped reading here. You literally are responding to a post telling you why that's wrong.
You're retarded.
![r90glhq[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/K6Bkiu0.png "r90glhq[1].png")
>>345007584
>gifted for no reason
Now if we ignore Master Sue, technology in Halo isn't that farfetched. We are already pretty far into genetic research, even if it's just trial and error at this point, the only thing stopping us is immorality of pursuing genetical research in a practical way. We have railguns, we have mobile nuclear power sources, we have aircraft capable of low orbit flight, we have cybernetic prosthetics, and we already have simulated neural networks, I wouldn't be surprised if Google didn't come up with somethings in the next 10-20 years being the Ivy league tryhard faggots that they are. Really the only thing that I don't see happening until 2500 is FTL.
>>345008637
Then why have we sent many times more machines into space than humans? For funsies? Or because it is vastly more expensive, difficult and complex to support biological life in space than machines?
>>345008735
>which is an infinitely more extensible process than mining
ftfy
>>345008853
Because no one gives a fuck if a machine dies for science. They're worthless.
>>345005432
This is why the krogan were considered so dangerous. They reproduce like rabbits. Also I take it they hit adulthood fairly quickly.
>>345006815
>have inferior technology
>despite this, casualties on both sides are about even
That's why they got the special snowflake treatment
>>345008886
??? No it isn't. You can only farm edible crops under very specific, difficult to create conditions. Metals can be found in any asteroid or planetoid.
>>345008853
Finding suicidal mentally stable people is hard.
>>345008536
>That is a much bigger problem for biological life than machines. If you are a machine you can just turn off while coasting on momentum. A thousand years is nothing.
But for biological lifeforms, we have the entire resource-rich galaxy. We're not shunted off into the nothingness of dead space, preying on the odd asteroid that happens by.
Further, you're not going to shut yourself off while you're still actively in a war with the Creators. When any Council race that spots you is liable to open fire at first sight.
>You seem to be imagining sending spaceships and equipment like humans would. Machines do not need to do that. They only need to send a seed: A single self-replicating machine, sometimes called a von neumann universal constructor.
Nothing in the Geth technological lore suggests that this is the case. In fact, their technology seems to suggest that they have to send individual Geth to accomplish tasks that a human would be able to. It wasn't remotely controlled automated robots sticking people up on Reaper poles in that first mission, it was individual Geth.
>Neither do biologicals. If anything it's a worse problem for biologicals because of how much more difficult it is to make food than it is to find metals.
Except again, biologicals have all the resources. The machines have virtually none. You keep talking about them finding asteroid belts as though every hunk of rock in space is filled to the brim with Element Zero, Palladium, Iridium, etc. And it's just not the case.
>You don't need to agree with me. Machines would still win. You could even keep disputing it as it is happening but it would still happen nevertheless.
Well, yeah. You've given them technology they don't possess and handwaved every technical limitation they're facing to make your argument work.
I want to fuck an Asari.
>>345008536
>If you are a machine you can just turn off while coasting on momentum. A thousand years is nothing.
Rust. Collisions. Degradation. The effects of unshielded stellar radiation. There are plenty of things that require maintenance (and therefore power and therefore resources) on such a voyage.
>machines only need to send a self-replicating machine!
You are really stuck on the self-replicating thing, huh? Just because resources exist doesn't mean they are available, or that they are usable in their current state. I'm sorry but this isn't a cartoon, Justice League's Dark Star isn't a real thing.
>>345008069
>offer incentives for women to bear children
what kind of incentives
IIRC because no other race advanced their technology so fast in so little time. Took a couple of centuries for what the other race took thousands of years
>>345008620
Don't see anything refuting me though.
>>345008536
Literally one acronym, robo-cuck.
EMP.
>>345008853
>Then why have we sent many times more machines into space than humans?
Because machines don't have human lives that could be lost due to a single miscalculation, you massive twat.
Further you are arguing that space is the "IDEAL" environment for robotics, not if it's better for robots than humans. Space isn't the ideal environment for most anything.
>>345002990
Because humans are good for cheap labor, we are the Mexicans of Mass Effect
>>345009029
>you can only farm edible crop under very specific, difficult to create conditions
Crops that your spoiled ass considers edible are a small fraction of what is actually edible. Man's infinite army will live on vast stocks of algea.
>>345009297
>electromagnetic meme pulse
>>345008161
I'm going to agree with him.
You are very dumb. Why? Because you compared the global output of one type of machine in 2015, with the theoretical maximum output of a future robotic civilization attempting to mass replicate.
>>345009151
Money of course, legalizing prostitution and offering to buy out any spawn would do it.
>>345008706
What about those things on Omega, the Vorcha or whatever? They're like smaller Krogan.
>>345005432
OP, watch it from the Alien PoV
>>345002990
Short answer, because humans are fucking beast in the mass effect universe. They can specialize in a wide variety of abilities and combat techniques mimicing a lot of what makes the other races "special".
Don't like it? Oh well.
>>345009448
>>345008650
You can agree with yourself all you want, it's all just magical fairy tales you're talking about.
>>345009398
>If I call it a meme he'll forget about the fact that any nuke can and will fry every electrical device in its radius
Idiot.
>>345009115
>But for biological lifeforms, we have the entire resource-rich galaxy.
No you don't. Machines can spread out and colonize all that much faster because they reproduce faster and don't have as demanding logistical needs.
>We're not shunted off into the nothingness of dead space, preying on the odd asteroid that happens by.
Find a star system with asteroids, begin consuming asteroids, rinse repat until numbers are sufficient to exterminate opposition
>It wasn't remotely controlled automated robots sticking people up on Reaper poles in that first mission, it was individual Geth.
Realistically machines would not operate that way.
>Except again, biologicals have all the resources.
Until they are killed by machines. Then the machines have those resources.
>You keep talking about them finding asteroid belts as though every hunk of rock in space is filled to the brim with Element Zero, Palladium, Iridium, etc. And it's just not the case.
Then they design variants which don't need those metals.
>Well, yeah. You've given them technology they don't possess and handwaved every technical limitation they're facing to make your argument work.
I'm talking about a realistic scenario where intelligent self-replicating, self-improving machines have escaped into space.
The ME universe puts them at an unrealistic disadvantage precisely because otherwise it would be impossible for biologicals to compete.
It won't turn out that way irl. If we lose containment of machine intelligence and it escapes into space, whether we live or die will be its decision to make some time down the road.
This is not even touching the fact that machines do not have to remain human sized. They have total control over their form factor and could simply become to us as you are to an amoeba.
>>345009485
Harbinger only talks about Shepard's crew.
>>345008290
>shephard is a reaper
kek
Are humans the best biotics, canonically?
You read about everyone else, they seem to be extremely rare.
No wonder humanity kicks ass, if it commands a large force of people who can fuck shit up with their minds.
>>345009297
If my satellite phone can be hardened against an EMP, then I'm sure a killer robot can be, also.
>>345009671
>memes
>>345007580
You already know the answer anon
>>345008290
>Shepard is a reaper
![3qVecUd[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/KlkgdcV.png "3qVecUd[1].png")
>>345009669
>If I get the last word, it means I win the internet argument.
>>345009749
Every single Asari has biotics.
>>345009669
>>345008650
Look, the concept of a nanoscopic molecular constructor is firmly in the realm of science fantasy, not science fiction. There's no reason to believe such a thing would be possible, especially with the kind of intelligence you are asserting.
>>345009141
>Rust.
Not a problem in space
>Collisions.
A bigger problem for biologicals in fragile pressurized vessels
>Degradation.
See above
>The effects of unshielded stellar radiation.
So include shielding. Still a bigger problem for biologicals.
>There are plenty of things that require maintenance (and therefore power and therefore resources) on such a voyage.
If you can self-replicate this stops being a problem. The replica is brand new, the original wears out and "dies".
>You are really stuck on the self-replicating thing, huh? Just because resources exist doesn't mean they are available, or that they are usable in their current state.
They don't have to be. Metals are more available than food. It is easier to mine in space than to raise crops.
>I'm sorry but this isn't a cartoon, Justice League's Dark Star isn't a real thing.
Real life isn't a videogame like Mass Effect either. Biologicals don't have magical super powers. But robotics does exist.
>>345009735
>>345009846
Spectre. You know what I meant.
>>345009749
Nigga you play the game?
Every Asari is born a biotic. Turian biotic goes to their FOXHOUND equivalent. Krogans become battlemasters.
>>345009671
You can create shielding against EMP but okay son, keep meme'ing.
I every one of you fuckers that keeps spewing non sense about self replicating fantasy robots needs to work at a manufacturing plant for a while.
>>345005432
Machines cannot into original thought.
>>345009485
Aren't they like slightly more intelligent monkeys? Krogans were genuinely advanced before they nuked themselves back into bronze age.
>>345009485
Not really. The Krogan start at pretty close to genetically perfect. Their humps are like camels, storing water and nutrients so they can survive extended periods without resources; redundant major organs as "backups" two hearts, four lungs, and four testicles; highly resistant to environmental hazards, including toxins, radiation, and extreme heat and cold; a secondary nervous system using a neuroconductive fluid, meaning they are almost impossible to paralyze and their Krogan adrenal glands allowing them to fight impervious to damage until literal death.
Plus, they're all like eight feet tall balls of concentrated muscle and power that live for centuries and prior to the genophage bred out a thousand kids each per year.
Vorcha have none of that. Their big power is that they can temporarily develop the equivalent of one of those traits one time during their life when necessary. Also? Manlets.
>>345009749
Nope. The asari are, they don't even need implants to use them and they don't waste so much energy when releasing biotic powers.
In the books they insist on biotic humans having to eat energy bars everytime they can.
>>345009297
Bioweapons.
>>345002990
Because they have the greatest potential. They get shit done, they do it fast, and in those 30 years they've achieved more than any other race did in the same timeframe.
Of course this is done to make the player feel cool, but it's a reasonable explanation.
>>345009669
>it's all just magical fairy tales you're talking about.
You're thinking of biotics.
>>345010145
Beat me to it fuck.
>>345010095
>And even knowing this some idiots chose Miranda over Samara as "Biotic expert" during the Suicide mission.
>>345008706
Would Krogan be better if they didn't get cockblocked?
>>345009939
It doesn't have to be nanoscale.
>>345010095
Yes they do.
In ME1, you can purchase biotic amplifiers, and the info on them states that the best biotic amps and implants come from the Asari Republics.
>>345010282
I'm 100% sure. They almost conquered the whole galaxy after defeating the Rachni (the 1st Reaper attack of our cycle) by themselves.
>Nobody uses their biotics to excite their body's own electrical potential to super-heat the air and create plasma
>They just throw people sometimes
Wasted potential tbqh, imagine a biotics-only class that, instead of using any guns, threw PLASMA at shit
>>345010016
>Technology does not improve over time
>>345010053
You are a machine, just a biochemical one. There is nothing magical about brains that cannot be replicated using different elements.
Anyway machines would not need to be intelligent to win, just able to self replicate from asteroid ore.
>>345010347
They use implants to power up their powers but they can use biotics withouth them.
>>345010282
>potential wasted
well yeah, if my better you mean more viable
>>345010145
>being this butthurt because somebody thinks you are dumb on the internet
what happens when you realize that people think you are dumb irl, too?
>>345010456
>you are a machine
Nope, I have a soul.
>>345009695
>No you don't. Machines can spread out and colonize all that much faster because they reproduce faster and don't have as demanding logistical needs.
But they can't. Because we already have the galaxy and they're trapped on the outskirts. It's a catch 22 for the Geth. They need the Council space removed of people to get the resources they need to remove the Council people.
>Find a star system with asteroids, begin consuming asteroids, rinse repat until numbers are sufficient to exterminate opposition
I guess that would be easy if they could enter Council space with all those rich worlds and belts. Too bad they can't.
>Realistically machines would not operate that way.
According to your head-canon? I guess not. According to the lore of the game we're discussing? Hell, according to the lore of virtually any game with AI? Sorry.
>Until they are killed by machines. Then the machines have those resources.
Again, catch 22. The machines need the resources to kill them.
>Then they design variants which don't need those metals.
I guess now we're just getting into magic. "We need Element Zero!" "Turn rocks into Element Zero."
>I'm talking about a realistic scenario where intelligent self-replicating, self-improving machines have escaped into space.
Why? We're talking about Mass Effect.
>The ME universe puts them at an unrealistic disadvantage precisely because otherwise it would be impossible for biologicals to compete.
What about it strikes you as unrealistic? That there was already a society in place before the machines rose up? How would the machines exist without people to have created them? Frankly, the unrealistic part is that the machines managed to win the war with the Quarians at all.
They're not programmed to learn exponentially, they're not programmed to know how to kill or how to protect themselves. The idea that a barely sentient toaster who's entirely world revolves around making toast leads a military campaign is dumb as fuck
>>345010428
Why create plasma when you can simply crush/throw your enemies?
Much more direct and simple.
>>345009963
We clearly stopped talking about ME a while back so fuck you for even trying that.
>collisions are a bigger problem..
fucking irrelevant to the topic at hand
>durr there's no degradation in space
Micrometeorite pitting. Crystallographic defects caused by exposure to cosmic rays and by the building positive charge caused by photoelectronic emission. You don't have the slightest fucking clue what you're on about.
>If you can self-replicate then needing power and resources stops being a problem
Self-replication doesn't break entropy you massive tool
>Metals are more available than food
Irrelevant first because we're arguing if space is the ideal environment for machinery (it isn't) and second because those metals must be refined to be useful.
You are absolutely 100% wrong.
>>345010607
Why can't it be detected by scientists?
>They are using material instruments, the soul is immaterial
Then how does the immaterial soul interact with the material brain/body in such a way as to control it?
>Uhh
>>345010550
i meme on them
>>345004646
I thought they did, which is why the Turians and the Humans fought.
Seriously I don't remember the fluff for that game at all, I was never too interested in it.
>>345010347
They don't *need* them. They still use them to get the most out of their powers.
>>345010334
>It doesn't have to be nanoscale
If it's not nanoscale then it has the same limitations on access to refined materials that we do you goddamned retard
>>345010746
>Not knowing that line is from the game
How Autistic are you?
>>345007584
>Humans were hated everywhere
Hardly. They were just treated like kids who wanted to join the government, and then forced themselves into said government when they punched out a giant squid ship.
>>345009749
The implication seems to be that humans would eventually be the best biotics. The massive jumps humanity has gone through in the past couple of decades since even discovering biotics has put them just under the Asari in power. And the Asari have been using Biotics for tens of thousands of years.
One of those scrapped Mass Effect endings had to do with humanity and the biotics, if I recall correctly.
>>345010676
>I guess now we're just getting into magic.
No, you're thinking of biotics.
I concede in the ME universe machines are at a huge disadvantage. But it's designed that way because otherwise machines would easily win.
Realistically if there are spacefaring machines, we are like microorganisms to them. The notion of war against them is preposterous.
>What about it strikes you as unrealistic? That there was already a society in place before the machines rose up?
That biologicals colonized space faster than machines.
>They're not programmed to learn exponentially, they're not programmed to know how to kill or how to protect themselves. The idea that a barely sentient toaster who's entirely world revolves around making toast leads a military campaign is dumb as fuck
Simply replicating faster than we can and surviving natively in space guarantees that realistically machines would greatly outnumber biologicals.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/robots/a13310/robot-universe-dominant-lifeform-17549081/
>>345010746
>believing only in things that are empirically provable
>>345010684
Because throwing someone into a wall is significantly less cool and lethal than burning them alive with a stream of pure, white-hot pseudo-gaseous power.
>>345010456
if self replicating machines were possible, the universe would have already been overrun by somebody else pulling that shit a few billion years ago
the other possibility is that it is still in the very starting phase of being overrun, and we just don't know it yet
:)
>>345010607
If a machine were programmed to believe it has a soul, how would you convince it that it does not?
>>345010990
>quoting a line that turned the Legion into a Pinocchio wanna be
Mark Walters pls leave.
>>345010849
>If it's not nanoscale then it has the same limitations on access to refined materials that we do you goddamned retard
Refining metals is still easier to do in space than growing crops.
>>345011075
>surviving natively in space
What is this meme and where did it come from?
Are you dumb shits actually taking scifi stories as facts?
>>345011090
stop posting pictures of me
>>345008442
Mate, the only land animals stronger than us are other apex predators and other great apes. We're stronger than 99% of the other species and faster than a good chunk of them. The reason we win out, is because while we're average compared to apex predators, we still have more endurance and are smarter than them.
>>345011156
>if self replicating machines were possible, the universe would have already been overrun by somebody else pulling that shit a few billion years ago
Unless there is something "after" machinery. Biology -> machinery -> ???
There could be some form of life/intelligence we wouldn't even recognize as technological, or be capable of percieving if it is extradimensional or some shit
>the other possibility is that it is still in the very starting phase of being overrun, and we just don't know it yet
That's also possible.
>>345011186
And your assertion was still "Space is the ideal environment for robots" and not "Robots are more suited to space than Humans."
The former is what you said, and is fucking retarded. The latter is not what you said, and is obvious.
>>345003858
You never know man.
>>345011186
>Refining metals is still easier to do in space than growing crops.
You fucking what mate, it's really fucking hard. In fact it's several times harder to pull off in space due to the lack of gravity.
>>345011141
Considering the force with which enemies get slammed into walls in the games, I am pretty sure getting hit by a biotic's abilities IS lethal.
>>345002990
Humans found the largest cache of Prothean tech aside from the secret Asari one. You'd now that if you bothered paying attention.
Then because the humans put up such a fight against the Turrians and the citadel fleet was fucked by Sovereign, humans stepped up as a large part of the Council military.
>>345011229
Space probes are a real thing. We send machines into space much more than humans because machines can endure those conditions much more easily as they do not need air, water, food or a pressurized habitat.
>>345011384
>>345011156
Self-replicating machines are obviously possible.
Nanoscopic universal constructors a la Justice League are not.
Why is /v/ so dumb?
>>345011401
Ok, I concede. I used sloppy wording. Now I am saying instead that machines are better suited to space than humans. Ok?
>>345011448
I didn't say it's easy, I said it's easIER than raising crops.
>>345011075
>No, you're thinking of biotics.
Eh, I don't think psychokinesis is anymore out there than AI.
>Realistically if there are spacefaring machines, we are like microorganisms to them. The notion of war against them is preposterous.
Again, by your own headcanon. Who's to say that "realistically" AI wouldn't follow the Geth's outline? Some science fiction writer or another came along and decided that if AI was achieved it would begin self-upgrading and learning at some astronomical rate and leave humanity immediately behind. The how or why of that is generally never explained beyond "because that's scarier."
>That biologicals colonized space faster than machines.
The Geth weren't even created until two thousand years after the Council races were populating the galaxy. It's not a question of who colonizes faster, it's a question of they were too late to the party.
>Simply replicating faster than we can and surviving natively in space guarantees that realistically machines would greatly outnumber biologicals.
Again, faster than we can is predicated on a vacuum. Unlimited necessary resources.
>>345011156
>if self replicating machines were possible, the universe would have already been overrun by somebody else pulling that shit a few billion years ago
They are possible. It doesn't stop the fact that it could very well have not happened yet. Or happened in another galaxy. The "whole universe would be overrun" thing doesn't make any sense. Because it's *literally* impossible to travel between galaxies without some sort of FTL shenanigan that ignores space expansion.
>>345002990
It's so they could shoehorn in muh racism moments ofc
>>345011527
>Self-replicating machines are obviously possible.
You are made out of them, though. We call them cells. Just as birds proved heavier than air flight was possible, cells prove that self replicating machines are possible.
>>345005432
Someone here has been indoctrinated....
>>345003883
>council uses krogan agaist rachni
>council uses turians against krogan
>council was going to use humans to keep turians in line
No wonder the Volus or Elcor can't get a seat.
>>345011473
>machines don't require specific atmospheric pressures to function
What do you think holds a machine together? Magic?
>>345011156
It wouldn't matter that I couldn't convince it otherwise, it wouldn't be true. Artificial life is only a simulation. Nothing built by us in a lab or factory will ever truly live.
>>345011449
Are you saying that, in a very enclosed area with very little room to build momentum, the slam would still be lethal?
Because I have to admit, a biotic one-inch punch is pretty sick dawg.
>>345011473
It's like a never ending stream of retardation.
Space probes are specifically designed to be as faultproof and simple as possible. The more complex machiner you send into space the more it will get fucked by the environment it's in to the point where sending a self replication capable robot would be equivalent to sending an animal into space.
>>345011696
>self-replicating machines are obviously possible
>it's not impossible, you're made of them!
Reading comprehension: work on it.
>>345011813
It's magic I ain't gotta 'splain shit
>>345011621
>Eh, I don't think psychokinesis is anymore out there than AI.
Then you're dumb.
>Who's to say that "realistically" AI wouldn't follow the Geth's outline?
Someone with a better understanding than you of why machines would not aribtrarily operate within the same constraints as humans when they have the ability to operate outside of them.
>Some science fiction writer or another came along and decided that if AI was achieved it would begin self-upgrading and learning at some astronomical rate and leave humanity immediately behind. The how or why of that is generally never explained beyond "because that's scarier."
You can open up your PC right now and install a faster processor. You cannot do that with your brain.
>The Geth weren't even created until two thousand years after the Council races were populating the galaxy. It's not a question of who colonizes faster, it's a question of they were too late to the party.
Like I said, contrived circumstances which benefit biologicals
>Again, faster than we can is predicated on a vacuum. Unlimited necessary resources.
And biologicals reproduce for free? No they don't. They require even more in the way of resource processing and logistics. It is by far a more difficult, resource intensive and fragile process to raise crops in space than it is to mine metals.
>>345008442
You can actually exhaust furry animals running behind them for a sufficiently long time.
Not you anon, you're fat.
Step one: Build an alternate machine fleet, identical to the enemy's.
Step two: use them as kamikazes while the machines stall in space. The machines, of course, will try to steal them to essentially double their number. That's the way a robot thinks, after all.
Step three: the robots all cold-weld into one another and are effectively fucking useless trapped inside their metal prisons
GG robo babbies
>>345011874
My bad, arguing with like 10 people at once now.
Anyway even macro scale replicators would be OP. Once there's enough of them, if we didn't stop it in time they would simply replenish their numbers faster than we could destroy them.
>>345011587
>I said it's easIER than raising crops.
No it's not you dense motherfucker.
>>345011762
>council was going to use humans to keep turians in line
Then humans found the citadel the Krogan were a menace no more. The only reason why the council respects the human is because it's better to have humans as allies than as enemies.
>>345010730
>you massive tool
as a matter of fact, he probably is
>>345011384
>There could be some form of life/intelligence we wouldn't even recognize as technological, or be capable of percieving if it is extradimensional or some shit
Maybe so. Could be that this organic/machine intelligence phase is, in the long run, a very very temporary state of being.
>>345011858
>Today's technology is as good as it will ever get
>>345011587
>I said it's easIER than raising crops.
lmao nobleman detected
swerve, nobleman
'Cause most games like and including ME are "Humanity fuck yeah!" power fantasies.
Not that it's a massive issue or anything but it does reek of arrogance and self-satisfaction.
>>345012146
>My bad, arguing with like 10 people at once now.
>it's just one retard that keeps talking the same shit over and over
wew this place never changes
>>345012165
Feel free to continue arguing this as machines kill you but it won't prevent it from occurring. Your inability to understand why something is happening doesn't somehow warp reality.
>Friends nag me to play this shit for years
>finally sit down and do it
>Character named "Nihlus" is introduced 15 minutes into the game
OH GEE I WONDER WHO THE BAD GUY'S GONNA BE
>>345011156
>if self replicating machines were possible, the universe would have already been overrun by somebody else pulling that shit a few billion years ago
Somehow you managed to be dumber than the idiot who thinks space is the best environment for robots.
Self-replicating machines already exist both biologically and mechanically. Making something self-replicating is fucking simple. Self-replicating machine != intelligent universal constructor. They are two completely different things. See>>345011527
>>345011587
> Now I am saying instead that machines are better suited to space than humans. Ok?
Yes, that is correct, though I don't know why you feel the need to assert it. It's completely obvious.
Now to get back to the question of why spacefaring self-replicating robots wouldn't take over anything and everything and turn all matter into other robots, they are just as limited by resources as humans. The resources they require are different, but that is irrelevant. Entropy still applies and their expansion is limited by resource management, refinement capacity, supply routes, and the expansion of space itself.
Further, as degradation of metals DOES occur in space (see >>345010730) they are also forced to use some of their resources on vehicle and personal maintenance. And no, creating a new copy is not going to be less resource-intensive than repairing the old one.
>>345012423
>Literally stole the name of Obsidian's character from the sequel to their game, in their rip-off of that franchise, complete with giving Nihlus an identical set-up to Nihilus
>>345012146
>Once there's enough of them, if we didn't stop it in time they would simply replenish their numbers faster than we could destroy them.
Except entropy and conservation of matter/energy is still a thing. Infinite replication requires infinite energy.
>>345002990
Because humans are vermin that come in uninvited everywhere like cockroaches and breed like them and die off really fast and make evolved offspring that will die off slightly less fast and have next to 0 self preservation sense so we'll stuff ourselves into plasteel cans and drop from the orbit into heavily fortified positions just to blow up 1 defense and die over and over and over taking insane casualities and still being able to continue the war so long the enemy is pushed into near-extinction from skirmishes alone. We went onto a BARREN MOON in a tank FULL OF EXPLOSIVES that WE LIT AT THE OPPOSITE END just to STEAL A BUNCH OF ROCKS in a can wrapped up in a bunch of foil ready to explosively decompress at moment's notice. We almost wiped eachother out and rendered our only planet, a homeworld at that unhabitable because 2 world powers didn't like how other ran their government AND WE STILL HAVE WEAPONS THAT WE COULD USE FOR THAT, ON YOUR HOMEWORLD, WHORE.
We also had atleast 1 significant war going SOMEWHERE ever since our recorded history.
Name me 1 point in humans' existence that was documented and I will point you to a major war in that period. You want to try your luck testing our combat experience, xeno shit? We also had planes so fast that they were barely controllable AND WE PUT A HUMAN IN THEM JUST FOR A TEST DRIVE.
We also drink poison for fun, knowingly. Often while watching sport. A very popular sport involves 2 humans attempt to knock eachother out unconscious with their fists and optionally, their legs.
In other words, don't fuck with humanity unless it's consensual and for babymaking, our second favorite thing to do right after killing eachother.
>>345012423
well, you are wrong.
>>345011985
>Then you're dumb.
Sorry, robot fetishist. I didn't mean to disparage your slice of virgin fandom.
>Someone with a better understanding than you of why machines would not aribtrarily operate within the same constraints as humans when they have the ability to operate outside of them.
I guess it's true, I didn't author any Terminator x Robocop X-rated slashfiction like you did. Still, the varying levels of AI that we have created have all been retard-stupid. Yet you seem fixated on the notion that despite reality and what's already been accomplished, the next iteration of AI will SURELY become mankind's overlord with unknowable intellect. Why?
>You can open up your PC right now and install a faster processor. You cannot do that with your brain.
Sure I can. I'll go eat a can of fish, acquire some Omega3 and return to learning faster than before.
>Like I said, contrived circumstances which benefit biologicals
You mean the Council-wide ban on creating Artificial Intelligence for fear of exactly what the Geth ultimately became was a contrived circumstance for why there were no Geth previously? C'mon.
>And biologicals reproduce for free? No they don't. They require even more in the way of resource processing and logistics. It is by far a more difficult, resource intensive and fragile process to raise crops in space than it is to mine metals.
Really? You're just taking a blind assumption here. The upgrading of one AI supercomputer might require some resource of such scarcity that upgrading is literally impossible. Why in your scenario do machine seem to feed endlessly off of microscopic space smegma floating through the air in infinite quantities when industry has never worked that way, even in science fiction?
Why would a machine go around and kill organics in the first place? They don't age, they don't eat, they don't naturally overpopulate, they have no need for colonization, literally one autonomous unit as a proof of concept would be sufficient. Wouldn't mindlessly cloning yourself defeat the purpose of evolution and cause stagnation? Wouldn't a unified "optimized" operation set across the whole population cause stagnation in intelligence growth? How could a machine design machines more intelligent than it is, not in a processing speed kind of way, but in terms of creativity?
Machines are literally a stagnant meme, once you find out how to disable one, you take them out all.
>>345011802
You're in a simulation right now. You think your soul is real, and it is funny.
>>345011767
Are you being ironic?
>>345012870
>Still, the varying levels of AI that we have created
I work in "AI" and it's a misnomer. We haven't created AI in the sense you are thinking. Neural networks are not AI. Statistical chat bots are not AI. Siri, Cortana, etc. are not AI. They are simple mathematical and/or semantic systems that do not even come close to approaching the basic requirements of AI. Calling it AI is just a trick. A marketing gimmick to evoke images of the actually-intelligent Star Trek computer.
That said, a true AI would be able to build a better AI and so on; it's generally accepted that once true AI is developed it will quickly evolve into something advanced beyond mankind. That doesn't mean it's gonna kill us all or that any of his other bullshit is any less retarded.
>>345012964
#%^#DIRECTIVE 0. ELIMINATE ALL BIOLOGICAL LIFEFORM INFESTATION. CLEANSE THE BIOSPHERE; AWAIT FOR HUMANITY'S RETURN AND FURTHER DIRECTIVES.
>>345012906
>How could a machine design machines more intelligent than it is, not in a processing speed kind of way, but in terms of creativity?
I'm assuming a robot would create another robot to fulfil a function it itself cannot. Kind of why humans created robots in the first place.
>Why wouldn';t that one robot just upgrade itself to fulfil the function?
For the same reason your cordless drill isn't also a handsaw I suppose. Creating something to achieve one specific goal is efficient design.
>>345002990
Because even back when it was still good, Bioware still occasionally dropped the ball when it came to writing.
>>345012870
>I guess it's true, I didn't author any Terminator x Robocop X-rated slashfiction like you did. Still, the varying levels of AI that we have created have all been retard-stupid. Yet you seem fixated on the notion that despite reality and what's already been accomplished, the next iteration of AI will SURELY become mankind's overlord with unknowable intellect. Why?
To be fair, Pepper is a thing. A robot with emotions protected from things like sexual or emotional abuse due to its status as a feeling being.
>>345004168
If you look at modern times, western european countries like France and England now have immigrant and immigrant descended populations of millions from almost zero fifty years ago. I could imagine space colonisation would be similar. A colony of 2 million after fifty years isn't unbelievably high.
What's more unrealistic is how a lot of space pirates and criminals seem to be humans and there is even a good lot on dangerous Omega, a violent and i assume economically weak place like that would be the last place i could imagine human immigration to. People don't immigrate to Mogadishu now do they?
>>345002990
Humans in Mass Effect are intelligent space rats with guns.
>>345013221
Machines, just like literally any construct of any kind, only operate within certain parameters. They cannot magically operate at any atmospheric pressure or pressure differential. They can be crushed. They can be pulled apart. Making something that won't break apart in space is difficult and resource-intensive.
>>345009482
we know prostitution was already legal
>>345012423
Did you fucking play the first mission you utter utter retard
>>345013392
>Pepper is a thing
Pepper is not AI. Pepper is explicit programmed logic. It is a simulation of intelligence, not an emulation. There is a massive difference.
>>345010676
>They're not programmed to learn exponentially, they're not programmed to know how to kill or how to protect themselves. The idea that a barely sentient toaster who's entirely world revolves around making toast leads a military campaign is dumb as fuck
In ME, the Geth were all connected and presumably to their military bots too. The Geth is one entity made up of millions of machines. Kinda like the internet-of-things on steroids.
>>345003858
Stifled anger
You don't know that for sure, you pink faggot
>>345012870
>I'll go eat a can of fish, acquire some Omega3 and return to learning faster than before.
That's not upgrading the hardware, imbecile.
Do you even read the garbage that you type before you hit the enter key?
>>345012964
Whatever, toasterfucker
>>345013880
Oh yay, just in time for a Mass Effect thread when I just went through that fuck you of an ending Bioware gave us.
>>345013335
Yeah but how would he know how to design that machine? Again I stress out it's not about raw performance, but somethings that would be more free in it's thought processes. Humans design machines because they can't lift 10 tons or because they can't compute pi to a trillionth decimal place in nanoseconds but they understand the concept behind it. A machine couldn't build another machine that could think outside of it's own programming because it wouldn't know how. Machines don't act, they only react.
>>345014354
Do you accept that brains are 100% physical?
Do you accept that physical processes are deterministic and thus can be emulated in a computer?
If you accept the above you cannot logically assert than a computer cannot reach human intelligence or have original thoughts.
>>345014354
We have programmes that can learn and modify itself today don't we?
There's a physics based animation thing that learns how to make a character rig walk properly without falling over through trial and error.
It can't bee too long now before we can create a programme that can create answers to questions with sufficient data.
What I'm getting at is that's it not impossible for humanity to create a programme/AI/robot that can learn, gather information and create logical answers and results and apply them. It's just a matter of time.
Did the human fuck yeahs in this thread even play the third game? The turians are the only race that consistently fights the Reapers to a standstill. Their fleet actually did work before their homeworld got shitted on unlike Earth's fleet.
Humans and turians did all the leg work during the Reaper war. Shit talk the asari and the frogs all you want, but humanity and the turians are total bros. We decided the best way to have first contact was to have a wrestling match. Human-turian relations resulted in the best spaceship and the best FemShep romance option.
Krogan get an honorary mention, but if we're being honest, that's like 80% Wrex and 15% Grunt.
>>345014172
This is not bait.
I think ME3 deserved the shitstorm for the shitty and unexplained ending it had at launch. That said, I also think the Director's cut solved most of the things that people was angry at (why is now my crew dead and now alive, why Joker left Shepard, what happened with the fleet we got, etc).
Of course it's not the ending we wanted or expected but...come on, tell me one way of dealing with the fucking Reapers, machines that have been killing everything since millions of years ago, withouth a deux ex machina.
Also, a lot of people is still mad at the "we kill organics so machines don't kill organics". It's a very understandable point from the PoV of a machine. "Killing 1000 so 10 survive is better than doing nothing and 0 survive". Also reapers told us many times "it's not a thing you can understand".
Also I will always be mad because the game lacks a final boss battle (I expected TIM to be controlled by Harbinger like Saren was by Sovereign).
>>345002990
So you are just discovering how shit this franchise is? This franchise is mediocre shit friend.
>>345014871
>We have programmes that can learn and modify itself today don't we?
No, the things you're thinking of are systems that create random solutions or random incremental changes and the ones that achieve certain milestones or improve on previous metrics are used to "seed" the next generation. There is no learning as you understand it there.
As I said before, there is nothing even close to approaching the layman's conception of AI. We haven't even begun the process. We don't even fully understand all the physical processes of the brain.
However, you are still correct that (as long as determinism and mind-brain unity hold) true AI is possible and likely inevitable.
>>345014815
>Do you accept that brains are 100% physical?
But it works 100% by chemical reactions, a computer can't do that.
>>345015389
It doesn't have to. As long as those chemical reactions are deterministic (they are) they can be emulated by the machine.
Imagine a perfect emulation of a human brain. Every process, every chemical reaction, every synapse modeled and functional and acting identically to the way a real human brain does.
Why should that brain be considered different from or less capable than a "real" human brain? Simply due to the extra level of abstraction?
>>345015387
A lot can happen in a few generations. AI is on its way. To the future.
>>345015634
>A lot can happen in a few generations
True.
>AI is on its way.
False.
Even if we knew how the brain works and where to begin with emulation we're still way behind on the processing power necessary.
>>345013502
>They cannot magically operate at any atmospheric pressure or pressure differential.
Nobody said that they could, you difficult cunt.
>Making something that won't break apart in space is difficult and resource-intensive.
So what, you impossible faggot? Doesn't stop humans from doing it already, with goofy slapped together shit.
You think 'its hard tho' is a barrier to something being possible, especially for the hypothetical super advanced, self improving AI? GTFO you boring quim.
>>345015803
>You think 'its hard tho' is a barrier to something being possible
No, dipshit, I was explicitly denying the statement from >>345011473 that "machines...do not need...a pressurized habitat"
If you're the dipshit who thinks Justice League and the T-1000 are real please kill yourself
