>"SFV is a masterfully crafted game. I sincerely enjoy it." - Daigo "The Beast" Umehara
What did he mean by this?
>>344713285
Daigo's a sellout
>>344713285
Though I like the game, the guy hasnt been relevant in years. He's like Pelé talking about soccer nowadays.
>I like SF5 because Ryu is top tier and capcom dumped a bunch of money into tournaments
>>344713285
>500000 bison bucks have been transfered to your account
>>344714652
was imagining him chugging a Pitch Black after that quote.
People need to get over his SF3 parries.
Guy is a has been.
>>344713285
With SF5 the genre gets drawn back into abyss it was in pre 09.
SF4 despite its flaws was actually a very good game.
SF5 absolutely isnt.
All you doubters will repent when Lord Daigo wins EVO on Sunday.
>>344714901
Daigo is still Daigo. Every athletes has their peak moment. No one can remain the king for so long.
He still has a fuckton of experience in this domain, even if he's not the champ anymore.
>>344715218
Top 8?
Very likely
Winning it all?
Nope
>>344715340
Wanted to quote >>344715220
he is saying such things to sell his book
>>344713285
source on that quote?Also check my 9
>>344714901
>>344715113
>Guy is a has been.
-anonymous never-beens on a chinese cartoon image board
>>344715218
The whole series is garbage. Every other fighter is better.
>>344714901
>the guy hasnt been relevant in years
Nigga, he was in the grand finals of Capcom Cup 2015.
Daigo is cute!!
>>344715082
>it's like real money!
>It just works!
>>344718956
This. He was also what, top 5 at CEO?
I like how just because he hasn't been getting in first recently people automatically call him a has-been. He's still one of the best players in the world.
>>344713285
The base game is actually one of the best Street Fighter games ever made. However, the way it was handled was so out of the galaxy stupid that it has marred an otherwise great game.
>>344715218
SF5 is worse than 4 but 4 was not good either
FADC and focus alone ruin it, risk/reward and footsies are absolutely fucked as a result of both
>/v/ cherry picks words from interviews from first impressions of SFV
>DUDE THEY HATE THE GAME LMAO DEAD GAME DEAD GAME LMAO
>more interviews now and the pros say they like it, nothing to cherry pick from
>pssh, they're washed up, who cares what they have to say?
>>344713285
Isn't he like, not that relevant anymore?
Anyway SFV is fine. The outrage over a lack of story mode in a fighting game is fucking idiotic.
>>344713285
>"Im getting paid off by capcom/sony"
glad to be of help anon
>>344718074
Preface of one of his books
>>344720183
No it isn't, the base game is the worst part.
Most people can get over stupid shit like no story mode. People can't get over the fact that the game is so watered down and simplified and designed with shitters in mind to the point that only a single playstyle is viable and every character plays the same or is garbage.
It set out to be a simple old style fundamental game, something it deserves credit for. However, it is just designed badly.They were so scared of making the game too complex that they made a game with no complexity at all.
I mean fuck, you can't even play a real shoto game without some faggot instantly shitting on you for daring to actually try to attempt a zoning/anti air game with his dedicated anti-fireball/teleports behind you move that literally 90% of the cast has.
It's just so poor. Without a major rework of how the game is fundamentally designed it is just never going to improve either, there's just not enough there to work with. I think the new characters show that very well.
>>344713285
>privately bitches about how slow iv is for years
>v is even slower, and tweaks the game even further away from the quickly reseting rock/paper/scissors daigo likes
>suddenly claims to love it
Checks in the mail Daigo.
Except in this case it's long cashed, the book came out in nipponland 5 years ago.
>>344713285
"Thanks for the money, Capcom."
>>344720652
t.bronze
>>344720652
not to mention the input lag makes it harder to anti air, period. The only difficulty the game presents is artificial difficulty.
They aimed to make the game less about vortexing, so instead they gave 80% of the cast a bunch of bullshit mixups that are 50/50s or even worse, 66/33s
>>344713285
This little chinese boy isn't going to win anything anymore
His days are long gone
>>344715218
>SF4 despite its flaws was actually a very good game.
>SF5 absolutely isnt.
Surprisingly true. The bullshit that was 4 (rewarding you for taking a beating, FADC get out of jail free, ettc) was somehow better than a FG distilled to its basic elements without the gimmicks.
Daigo on V's bullshit blockstun
>As a result, a game is less fun if it promotes defensive play style–because they are given less time to push buttons.
>He suggested that a fighting game should promote play-making, for example, by limiting how many times you can block (10 times) or escape a throw (5 times) and reducing timer from 99 seconds to 40-50 seconds per round.
>>344720827
Great post, thanks for your contribution.
I am interested to hear more though. What was incorrect about the post? Are you denying that the entire metagame revolves around simple frametraps and throws? Are you denying that every single viable character plays in that style and excels at it? Are you denying that zoning and defensive play is completely and utterly nonfunctional and deliberately so? Are you denying that okizeme is almost entirely absent outside of meaty setups and maybe some cross unders if you're lucky?
>>344713285
Daigo honestly isn't even the best when it comes to the pro player scene. Gets his ass kicked all the time, I'd go as far as to say Tokido and Alex Valle have surpassed him.
One meme moment at EVO over a decade ago and people still think he's the entire face of competitive SF. Still like SFV tho.
>>344721145
lol you're so passive agressive the reddit is leaking out of you.
>>344713285
What a fucking sellout, either that or he's just blowing smoke up everybody's ass. This game is legitimately the worst SF game ever made. If you disagree you're either a shill or a scrub, plain and simple
>>344721254
A pretty sad attempt to salvage your stupidity, don't waste your time replying again, because you won't get another from me.
>>344721282
t. bronze
>>344721282
CFN?
@344721381
>>>/reddit/
>>344721030
SFV isn't a fighting game distilled to its basic elements. There are many genuinely good games that do that. SFV is just bad. That's all there is to it. If anything its problem is that it leaves out so many basic elements entirely and is just an incomplete experience.
>>344721540
How would you fix it, anon-san?
>>344720652
You have no clue of what you're talking about
Fireballs are still strong in this game because they're still free space control, you have to adjust the range you throw them, but i don't know why I'm wasting my time talking about a fighting game on /v/ it's just s bunch of armchair theorists talking nonsense
HEY GUYS LET'S MAKE A GAME MECHANIC THAT COMBINES SF3 PARRYING AND SOUL CALIBUR'S UNBLOCKABLE ATTACKS
WHO'S ON BOARD?
>>344721392
>person criticizes a game they think is not fun and a downgrade from the gam ebefore
>HAHA I BET YOU DON'T HAVE A HIGH RANK IN THIS GAME YOU SAY YOU DON'T LIKE
sf5 shills are truly the most cancerous
>>344720652
>muh zoning
get pooped on beeflord
>>344721540
What elements are missing? Whiff punishing is weaker due to input lag but once that gets fixed it's a lot easier to deal with
It's always funny watching SF4 dick riders to try and explain why SFV is bad because most of the time they have nothing besides muh focus attack
SF5 is too casual to take seriously. Removing the 1 frame links was the worst thing to happen to street fighter.
>>344721641
>Fireballs are still strong in this game because they're still free space control
No they are not, not at all. They are objectively slower with much more recovery than usual, and almost every character has a move SPECIFICALLY made to render them ineffective. Some characters like Nash have multiple, who also ironically is probably the only character who CAN actually throw a fireball without taking his life in his hands every time he does.
Fireballs are nerfed to hell in 5. I dread to think what Sagat will be like when he's released. Not even Guile could bring genuine zoning into SF5.
>>344721667
CHOOO CHOOO
>>344721723
Lol this. I refunded this shit anyway after experiencing this godawful unfinished product for an hour
>>344721723
If you arent proficient at the game, you don't have anything useful to say. Mjaority of /v/ sucks at fighters, let alone more casual toned down ones just for them like SFV, but they would never admit they can't climb out of bronze in SFV because it would hurt their pride, so they just namedrop SF3 or maybe GG like its some get out of jail card.
The most hilarious thing is everyone now saying SF4 was so good when it obviously fucking wasnt. As barebones as it is, SFV is much better than SF4.
>>344721605
Just make a fucking fighting game without clearly being petrified of it being 'inaccessible' and deliberately neutering the fuck out of everything as a result.
Look at shit like Akatsuki Blitzcampf, doesn't get much more basic than that. And yet, it is better than SF5 is pretty much every way from a gameplay perspective AND managed to be more accessible at the same time, despite having a similar design philosophy.
There was nothing wrong with SFV's core concept. The problem was simply that the designers didn't make a very good game.
However, because it's Street Fighter, people literally cannot accept this, because as we all know Capcom has never made a bad Street Fighter game. Nope. Not at all.
>>344721805
or >>344721856 this lmao
>>344721942
I got to rank 107 by the end of the Beta. I played it 8 hours a day every day in the final beta or whatever.
I thought to myself "maybe it'll be better when the game releases"
I played it for 80 hours before making a decision, and decided it fucking sucked.
But shitters on /v/ like >>344722038
who've probably never even played against pros in tournaments will talk shit saying "HURR BET UR BRONZE XD LINK CFN "
I understand that 99% of /v/ can't even do balrogs BNB in 4 but that doesn't mean ranking should be the argument.
>>344721605
>tighten up input buffer
>further lower the amount of option selects
>run game at 1.5x speed
>dramatically lower the silly hit/blockstun
>put i-frames back in the reversals they were stripped out of
>remove comeback meter, make v-ism work closer to the alpha games
>guard crush mechanic
>2 frame throws, but bigger tech window can stay
>put chip ko's back in, quickstand and no long lasting ex moves fixes this problem
There are a few things about V I like:
>no more get out of jail free fadc, read or die
>v trigger is less terrible than ultras, causes much less ST style 'he has meter, have to respect it and change my entire play'
>less 50/50 setups (always an overblown problem)
>>344721861
So why are fireballs still thrown in top level matches constantly? Why is it absolutely necessary to have a horizontal fireball in V to be good if fireballs are ass and v skills make them useless? Oh right, they're not weak and still provide space control for free.
Fireballs are weak if you're just trying to play super turbo and keep them out, but if you use them as intended( to lock people down) they're still good
But I don't expect much from a "muh zoning" shitter
>>344722120
Combo execution is a meme, nice try though
>>344722038
guilty gear is a more technically accomplished fighter though, this is a fact
>>344720036
Hes been gettin top 8 at almost every major he has went this year, hes easily between the best 10 players in the world now
>>344721540
No, it's pretty distilled. There are few gimmicks aside from V triggers/skills. A special bar is pretty standard and has been for quite some time. The game is actually fighting one another, not seeing who can mash a light attack into an ultra or who can play the most defensive with parries like previous entries. It simply isn't done properly and its uninteresting.
will I get banned for doing this shit
https://youtu.be/zCapO9MWEos
>>344720269
Theres absolutely nothing about fa that ruin footsies, as the game ended up being one of the most footsie heavy games ever, even more than ST
>>344722297
I'm sorry we must be watching very different high level matches.
Can you link me a single match in any tournament at all in which a player successfully walls off a player with fireballs and wins the round doing so, in a similar way to what you would see a Sagat or Guile player do in another Street Fighter game? I genuinely don't think you can because it simply doesn't work.
I think I understand what you might mean, Nash players using fireballs to deny space to cover their dash in or bait very bad players into jumping at them. I guess that is a use for fireballs, but Nash is kind of a special case there. Ryu and Ken for example cannot really afford to do so at all. They gain virtually nothing from the fireball due to the huge recovery and many characters can punish them for doing so, even fullscreen.
Nonetheless, I do accept what you're talking about is a kind of zoning, but it doesn't change the fact that zoning as a playstyle has been literally removed from SFV, reduced to a situational tool to work your way in to play the same game as every other character for a minority of characters in the roster.
UMEHARA GA
>>344721061
He said the same about sf4, specifically that he wanted guard breaks. Its interesting that such a lame player wants these changes
>>344722756
Jiyuna's translated tips from Daigo about Karin v Ryu even said that you have to throw fireballs to get her to stop filling space with buttons that Ryu doesn't have the means to contest with so you can dash/jump in. Which is what Phenom correctly said V is about. Less footsies/zoning more getting in and pressuring.
>>344722639
Doubt it. Capcom is pretty incompetent when it comes to things like these. I mean it took them 3-4 months to ban those ragequitters in the top of the leaderboard, and they still haven't fixed the real issue with ragequitting.
Also about 5% of PC users have the one million FM achievement. I can bet my left nut that none of them achieved that without mods/trainers. And now that the PS4 way is out there too, I'm sure shitloads of people will do it too. Capcom's not gonna ban all these people playing their game. Maybe they will try to find a way to rollback that FM but then again it's capcom. They're incompetent.
>>344722756
You've practically sold me on this game, but Ill wait until after evo to decide, I lack the free time to dedicate at the moment
>>344713285
Paid.
Will Redbull make me handsome like it did for Bonchan?
>Bob Sapp still hasn't gone full Highlander on Umehara
>>344722894
This doesn't really contradict what I said at all, if anything it confirms it.
There is no thinking in SFV, there is no multiple playstyles or making your character your own. You get in, you frametrap, you throw, or you bait a throw tech. Then you do your meaty setup/safejump if you're lucky and do it again. That's the whole game. Doesn't matter who you're playing. That's why it's bad. Utterly brainless.
>>344722962
You think I'm gonna play 2000+ matches against that AI for some colors? Fuck that.
if SFV was so casual, why are all the 09ers getting exposed left and right while the vets are still making top placings?
>there are people here who can't enjoy multiple fighting games series
>>344723328
>6 years isn't enough to be respectable
Not everyone started at the Golfland arcade anon
>>344723328
Because SF4 was an ultra fraudulent game depending on who you played and allowed people who couldn't actually play fighting games to win if they played retarded characters like Fuerte or Viper. Fundamentals always stay with you, it's no surprise that the players who could actually play fighting games rather than rinse stupid shit in SF4 continued to do well.
>>344723328
Infil is an 09er and he's the best in the fucking world. He himself said the game lacked depth and was boring as all shit. sfv shills getting desperate
>>344723328
the players winning now are the same players who were winning at 4, outside of Americans. On top of that, all the American OGs got bodied and now are the subject of jokes (I.E. Graham Wolfe, Art)
>>344723328
But Infiltration is an 09er and literally plays nothing but training mode and netplay.
>>344723471
So you need solid fighting game fundamentals without gimmicks to be good at SFV?
>>344723471
>mfw Keoma and 801 Strider are irrelevant now that they don't have Abel step kick faggotry
>>344723486
>>344723541
WASHED UP
>>344723589
Yes I think that's mostly fair to say, it is a fundamental game, just a very bad one with no real depth to it. The only common mixup in the game is a basic throw mixup and frametraps, which are about as fundamental as it gets. Again, the problem is that it oversimplified it and neutered many of the interesting elements of fundamentals outside of that.
only problem is that wakeup should be an instant roll without a 50/50 mixup every time
also delete karin and replace with a good rekka character
and I'd like some more pokes for le footsies
>people actually want 1f links
LOL fucking faggot nerds
>>344723649
poor tokido has been cucked by infil 10x previous to this, it was a pity win kek
>>344722639
Probably not but if you do the trick to make all the DLC costumes free I bet your ass gets banned.
>>344723715
>those parries
>pity win
>>344723715
I like that Tokido finally broke the chain, it was an exciting moment. So many people counted him out when they saw it was another Infil vs Tokido GF
>>344723846
Exactly retard, infil was playing him soft and knew he was being set into those parry traps and that's why he let him win. funny how you think 1 win = exposed, i expect tokido to get raped by infil at evo
>>344723715
>SF game comes out
>WAAAH ITS NOT LIKE THE LAST ONE
>gets updated
>YOOOOO THIS SHIT IS SO TIGHT NIGGA FINALLY A GOOD SF GAME
Every time. You niggers will be singing praises after capcom cup once the balance update happens.
Is SFV good for newcomers? I only played SF2, not experienced at fightans.
I was so excited to get in on the ground floor of this game. FADC, Ultra, and all that other bullshit game. Just a pure fighting game.
Then wham. It's dull and boring.
So fucking mad, I thought I'd found the game I was going to be playing for years to come.
How likely is a fighting game sale during EVO days?
>>344723979
>infiltration was pretending to be retarded!
I'm pretty sure they were both playing their best and Tokido won a good match.
>>344724226
Yes.
Best girl for beginners comes out next month as well.
>>344724387
Are you implying Juri is good for beginners?
>>344724483
SFVI when?
>>344724137
This
People forget the fucking nightmare that was SF4 vanilla
>>344724483
http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2016/mar/07/combofiend-says-newcomers-should-start-cammy-or-birdie-street-fighter-5-no-plans-expand-local-mulitplayer/
SF4 vanila was garbo, it got a little better but still wasn't fantastic. SF5 is pretty fun and has the potential to be godlike.
>>344724241
>FADC, Ultra
are you saying you like these?
>>344724672
Fuck Combofiend.
I'm hoping Du takes evo, he needs his competitive spirit back
>>344724663
or how New Generation and 2nd Impact pretty much killed SF to the point that 3S couldnt save the series. Even 3S had its issues
>>344724805
No, I was calling them bullshit. Meant to write "gone" not "game."
>>344724849
>american player
>winning EVO
so why do people hate sfv?
>>344725178
>Implying Justin doesn't have a shot
>>344725276
Because it's the newest iteration of a fighting game and casuals don't know the rule, "the first year is always bad," because the first year is usually tucked away in arcades.
>>344722694
Focus Attack hurts footsies a bit, but alongside invinsible backdashing and getting Ultra Combos every round, it creates an atmosphere where Balrog is considered a defensive character because playing footsies on offense is too dangerous.
>>344722756
Most people who think zoning doesn't exist in SFV don't understand what zoning is. First of all, you don't need fireballs to zone. Arbiter in Killer Instinct zones mostly with his big ass normals. Second, zoning only works if the opponent is afraid to use the moves that get around your zone. Guile can literally zone the entire cast because there is no move that can deal with the two hit Sonic Boom without putting you at risk if the opponent reads you. Dhalsim's zoning game is still strong. FANG has an incredibly powerful mid range zoning game.
>>344725276
Rushdown focused and the game they will be playing for the next 6 or so years. Updatres should fix it, as they always do with SF. Also its popular, and was rushed.
There are reasons to dislike it, but you know how /v/ is.
>>344725276
It's just what people do when a new SF comes out. After a couple updates it will be hailed as a masterpiece just like every other one.
>>344725276
contrarian /v/irgins who always say the last game was better
like how they started the 09er meme and called it babyfighter etc. etc.
>>344725536
On release SF4 was called turtle fighter 4. So they hate defensive games and they hate offensive games?
>>344721208
>Alex Valle surpassed Daigo
You want to know how I know you are full of shit? Tokido, you could make an argument for, but Alex Valle?
>>344725276
Painfully simple mechanics when coming off of Ultra Street Fighter IV, some V skills and Triggers just seem haste-fully thrown together.
8 Frame Delay
Probably the worst launch in fighting game history
Not everyone likes the roster or returning characters
Entire game is down when servers go up for maintenance
Horrid online
Probably some more reasons, but launch SFV was a fucking disaster and I don't know how anyone in their right minds justified paying full price for it.
>>344724820
he's right tho
>>344725653
Well in both cases, only one style of play is optimal, when it should be a wide variety, othjerwise it gets dull. The fact that Dhalsim shines by being agressive in SFV is a bit worrisome. CEO this year proved that SFV can be entertaining to watch at least.
>>344725805
To me a fighting game is local VS online VS and training mode. Everything else might as well not exist. So launch was fine for me other than network problems, but I honestly can't remember the last game that launched without network problems.
>>344714901
>stream monster: the post
>>344725971
Overwatch launched without problems.
post Juri
>>344726064
Didn't buy it because I disliked the beta. Good for Blizz though after the fucking D3 launch. That was horrid.
>>344726205
Go to a booru you lazy cunt. Or /e/ or /h/.
>>344726205
She's so beautiful. I wish she was my mom.
>>344721208
>Alex Valle
Hahahaha
>>344721856
>this post is real
LO FUCKING L
>>344725279
he doesnt
>>344726484
>Doubting the cali power
>>344721208
Alex Valle hasn't been relevant to the tournament scene as an actual player in fucking years. Daigo still constantly makes Top 8s.
>>344721030
But most FADC'd able reversals were unsafe in Ultra. Most cost 3/4s of your meter to make safe.
SFV has gimmicks too man, don't fucking deny it.
>>344713285
He means he's gone delusional \ due to playing fighting games competitively for over a decade, and smelling hospital chemicals for 40+ hours a week for about 5 years now
>>344726810
It does but not nearly as many as 4.
>>344726581
Some new std name?
>>344726812
>hospital chemicals
Please tell me he's a male nurse.
>>344713285
Link me the source where he says "masterfully crafted". Hes said hes enjoyed it but someone like Daigo can't seriously think this is a top of the line fighter in its current state. SFV is just like every first version SF before it. Lacks polish and its going to get it and become a solid game.
>>344727072
Dmmb 09er poster, that was Valle's name back in the day.
>>344727130
Yep. If he was a Doctor/Surgen, I doubt he'd be able to find the time to go to as many tournaments he does within a year.
>>344727320
>>344727320
Oh for Christ's sake. He had to take the gayest job one can have in a hospital?
Looks like Filipino Champ has some competition.
>>344727301
How is that an 09er thing, his name was CaliPower all through SF4, too.
>>344714901
>Still places top 8 at tournaments regularly, even winning some in Japan
>HURR HES WASHED UP AND IRRELEVANT DURR
Fuck off.
>>344723124
Actually it was Daigo who go Bonchan to lose weight and improve his physical health. Bonchan was trained by Daigo and Daigo basically told him if you have a healthier body you'll have a healthier mind and that in turn will help you win. It obviously worked as Bonchan was easily the #1 Sagat player in SFIV, and really, Sagat being so mid tier was the thing that held Bonchan back the most yet he still did amazing with him.
>>344721208
>Alex Valle have surpassed him.
lmao
SFV dickrides are scaring me. You people need to stop being blind and see the games faults
8f delay makes yellow bar SF4 tactics work in competitive play in a game where AAs are already weak
The games core gameplay is
>Playing neutral for 5 seconds which usually ends in one side dashing forward randomly because LOL 11 FRAME DASHES XD into momentum into strike throw jump shimmy guessing and then usually stun or maybe just maybe a guess and the other player brings things back to neutral.
The game needs 1 or 2 more defensive mechanics. V-reversals are far too slow and people can just throw through them well using mediums in blockstrings that are already plus as fuck so they're a non issue.
SF4 was setplay heavy but had a way better neutral game as SFV stands SFV is guess heavy which in a way is worse. In SF4 you guess which setup based on the spacing your opponent is going to use most characters that wasn't even hard to deduce. In SFV you guess between a 3-4 way option that is massively out of your favor and the most you have is "opponent bias" which means nothing because higher level players will outright pick a option out of a hat or read your defensive habits. And in SFV because of the lack of defensive options they just have to guess if you're going to tech or jump unless you're one of the few with a dp they might have to guess on.
Its not interesting to watch at this point because the core game is almost always the same because of the lack of defensive tools. I really hope the end year updating isn't shat on being dickriders think this flawed okay game that has so many opening to polish itself is "perfect" the way it is.
For god sakes Capcom is claiming online data is proof of a games balance.
>>344723523
What happened to Arturo, last I remember he was one of the best Dhalsims in V
>>344727983
he got his shit slapped by the chinks after talking shit and now is the laughing stock of the fgc
>>344720376
Here's a current opinion
>I think the majority of SFV players aren't playing for the game itself. They are playing for the money. I don't want to see what would happen if the cpt was pulled.
>>344727983
>>344728190
His style of Dhalsim is pretty weak in SFV. The reason Champ is so much more successful is Champ players in a versatile way which really isn't the point its the fact Champ can play rushdown Dhalsim and SFV is 99% about momentum RPS fishing.
Arturo might be better come updating and 8f being fixed down to 4-5f like SF4. These are excuses but its a fact players who were successful and were specifically defensive are suffering in SFV. SFV is a objectively terrible fighter in terms of catering to many different play styles. You have to base your play style around the one single way its designed.
Not to say you can't be a lame aggressive player who is less flashy and more baiting. But you can't be outright defensive with a majority of the cast as the game is.
/v/ niggers like to parrot some dumb shit about GG being setplay but there is a character for every style and every character can be played almost every single way besides outright keepaway. SFV is just designed around winning neutral with something random and then being better at RPS with medium level execution.
>>344725276
Really simple. Also it's rushdown as fuck, like most fighting games these days. But not nearly at good as them.
SFIV's greatest selling point was that every style worked.
>>344726672
valle is better at sf5 than he was at sf4, hes not a pushover
>>344728190
>We can't share our tech with the japs
>The japs knew most of his tech and the other parts they didn't care about
>went 0-5 and 1-5
>looks like he shops at sears
Can you get more exposed than that?
>>344728480
I honestly think it's because fighting games in general are attracting numbers and the interests of Esports. Super defensive playstyles aren't "hype" to watch, they aren't exciting and won't bring the numbers.
This is why Sanford and Dieminion were my two absolutely favorite sets to watch when NBLC was on, Sagat vs Guile is literally 100% footsies and spacing knowledge with fireballs yet 99% of Twitch idiots will just cry fireball spam.
>>344720376
>More interviews now and pros say they like it
You're delusional if you think plenty of pros aren't still voicing their opinions negatively.
Phenom just won Dreamhack beating Daigo and said the one thing he dislikes is how neutral in SFV is RPS and 8f delay/lack of hurtboxes on medium normals allow this to do on atm. Saying Bison is outright a weak character because jump ins are too strong and the game lacks defensive mechanics beyond the weak ass bursts 15-20f v-reversals are.
>>344713285
>「クソゲーでした。」
>>344728568
That's entirely different from saying he's "surpassed" Daigo though.
>>344728691
I hate people who can't get hype for defensive play.
>Dude jumps in once and it lands
>Wins by guessing right a few times
>LOL XD COMEBACK HYPE!
>Dude AAs perfectly spaces fireballs that don't do stun and do like 80 dmg each perfect and wins with little to no guessing maybe minus when he takes the momentum from his opponents slip up
>LOL SO LAME SPAMMING
But then these same people can't get hype for Guilty Gear because they hate games they don't understand.
Justin Wong well playing Potemkin on a stream said the words.
"GG isn't as popular as SF because its a game you have to understand to watch" Its sad that a large percentage of the SFV community can't even do their dial a combos.
>>344728867
That's why infiltration vs gamerbee was so great. Even the plebs enjoyed defensive play.
>>344713285
I got to ultra gold with fang in the first 2 months of release and then dropped it because I didn't enjoy the character variety. Ultimately it's an amazing game though, for people who are still playing are the new characters viable enough to get back in it? I am thinking about maining ibuki, but really want to wait till urien get's in. What do you guys think?
>>344725521
Focus attack is a new option for footsies. Can you not FADC? Literally gave it more depth, and if you are one of those "more types of moves is not depth" people I'm going to have an aneurysm.
>>344728934
I really hope SFV when updated will become a more defensive game to a degree. Not more so then offensive but a balance of both. I know the 8f being reduced to SF4 levels will help that as PC players like Floe/Chris G preach about what you can do on PC alot nowadays. But alittle more like 1 or maybe even 2 core mechanics.
I almost feel like invincible backdashes should return. Not SF4 level but more like GG/KOF level ones not the first frames but a few after. I don't understand why SFV forward dashes can be allowed to remain at unreactable windows outside of Bison/Alex/Zangief ones. Most like Ryu Chun Li Nash and Ken are 11-14f which is fucking nuts for a game like this where momentum wins games in moments.
>>344728764
its also entirely different from saying hes not relevant
Why do people still worship their Daigod? It's pathetic.
Your prayers won't bring back his skill. Just accept that he is done.
>>344728934
Are you talking about the match at Kumite?
>>344728934
> infil v gamerbee
> plebs enjoyed it
Considering how much lamerbee got spammed during, after, and to this day?
>>344715218
u r not good as daigo ur opinion is shit white bitch
>>344729321
t.K-brad
>>344729172
I don't get why casuals thought FADC was bad. It was just how some characters had too much meter build. Someone earning meter and using it to their advantage if both baitable and rewarding in a good way.
Dumb casuals who though SF4 was bad for that factor alone need to stay away from games like GG. Hell alot of games have a cancel mechanic. Its a good way to allow for rewarding comebacks without something like xfactor/rage/ultras.
>>344729229
As much as I'm really not liking the game I don't doubt it will become more balanced in style as time goes on. It feels like the release of the game was designed to grab as many of those proto-serious players as possible.
>I almost feel like invincible backdashes should return.
Exactly what I mean. "no invincible back dashes" "no hard knockdown" "no free reversal". They applied those ideas as easily as they good and the result was a game that actually favored the attacker on wakeup even more than IV. Even though that was supposed to be what they avoided.
>>344729321
t. Bandwagoner
>>344729573
GG's cancel system makes sense. FADC doesn't.
>>344729401
EVO
I'm a mk baby , never got into SF. Only played it casually. is SFV worth it?
The balanced styles and the way different characters were practically playing different games was what gave IV it's appeal to me. Since V doesn't have that I'm better off finding a better game.
>>344729732
Yes.
>>344729732
Maybe
>>344729732
Maybe
>>344729680
FADCs made more sense in USF4. Capcom did a bad job balancing what was safe and what wasn't with them. Some characters had insane meter build which led to matchup issues. Some like grapplers specifically had almost no uses for FA/FADC outside of red focus combos.
FADC was not a bad cancel system it was just poorly implemented with the casts balance towards it.
SFV/SF4 share a common problem
V-reversal
V-trigger
V-skill
FADC
What do all these mechanics have in common? Each game has core mechanics that are not equal across the cast. In SFV the only defensive mechanic is 20f startup with some and then 10f with some like Chun Li with little to no evidence to say why it should be that way.
The reason GG allows for so much character loyalty compared to SF games in the long run is every mechanic
IB
Blitz
YRC/RC/PRC
All these mechanics function the same way across the cast. No different hitboxes/hurtboxes besides blitzs and frame data is about the same on all blitzs and IBing is always the same.
SF mechanics are designed to be mastered to easily in SFV and have little depth to explore. FADC was a weak mechanic because of balance implementing
>>344729732
I don't know
>>344729840
SFV just feels like Capcom said "hey guys what if the entire cast played like Cody from SFIV?"
>>344729732
Can you repeat the question?
>>344713285
He's getting payed by playing the game and is a jap. Of course he would say anything to please his sponsors.
Or he could be just so retarded he can't notice
>8f of input lag
>almost identically played characters
>so offence oriented that mindlessly jumping in or dashing in is legit strong
This slanted eyed gook and his dick riders are the cancer killing the FGC.
>>344729732
YOU'RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME NOW
>>344730049
Focus Attacks in general were an odd issue because of how differently everyone's FAs were. Fei Long's and Evil Ryu's were leagues above everyone else. This was really inflated by the addition of RFCs, in which some characters like Sagat got literally nothing from it while characters like Yun got the entire world from it.
>>344729732
Depends. Are you a rushdown specific player? If not probably not. SFV as it is caters to one play style. I can only play it in short bursts because of it. I get it SFV Ryu is great hes top 3 but i played a defensive Ryu in other games which is harder to make work in SFV. I could play aggressively if i wanted to but why bother? Ill just wait until they polish the frame delay to allow for better defensive play and flush out the game like they did SF4.
Although i do enjoy Bison alot i feel like hes the only character that matches my style and luckily was my main in SF4 and at his core is still really similar but with a different moveset overall function wise.
SFV shits on reactionary/defensive play unless you pick someone like Karin/Chun Li with the normals to fling out all day.
>sf5 is crap
>"no fuckyoureddit"
summer
i hate 5 solely for the atrocious models
>>344715280
>athlete
>video game athlete
>>344730120
Cody could be played defensively though anon. He had pretty solid AAs and his rock is probably a better zoning tool then anything in SFV.
>>344730291
Yeah, though I sometimes miss SFIV Bison's RH. Shit was cash. I would sometimes use it in V forgetting that he has that gimp ass knee normal now.
>>344730049
Different guy
I liked that a lot of those mechanics operated differently between characters. Made the characters themselves feel really unique. Even if it wasn't the best for balance. GG's cool and all but it's strange knowing that I have generally the same escape options whether I'm playing Pot or Sol.
>>344730290
To be fair guys like yun didn't get as much out of RFC as guys like zangief or vega did. All it did for yun was let him do slightly more damage when he was already going to do damage.
>>344730291
Aren't most fighting games rushdown anyway?
>>344730456
I really wish cr hp had faster startup or a bigger hitbox on the top. That and he has no 3f normal to contest alot of shit. Id love his st lk or cr jab as a 3f normal.
It sucks that Bison loses to half the cast by .5 on Phenoms list because df HP sucks ass for momentum if someone has a 3f normal that has even alittle reach. After they block it all Bison can do is a 4f normal and its +1 so Bison will trade and lose momentum and shit returns to a neutral state usually at a spacing they can jump at him with.
>>344730598
Only certain ones. The thing is that it's important for fighting games to offer a variety of play styles that are still viable. This isn't the case with SFV.
>>344730598
Most fighting games are optimally rushdown. But SFV specifically favors rushdown above all else and everything else is really sloppy. Although that is probably specifically because of the high 8f delay and without that it would be alittle less lop sided.
>>344730519
Too be fair that isn't true. IBing is equal but Pot/Sol don't have the same framedata or hitboxes so a punish Pot could get off IBing something specifically is something Sol might not be able to get. Also Sol has a dp well Pot has no real reversal.
Luckily GG characters have far bigger movesets so they have a shit ton of unique feelings to them more so then SF ones well having balanced core mechanics.
> people still don't understand what year one for a fighter means
Fucking 09ers and 16ers
>>344730892
Except year one keeps getting reset with each character release. The game isn't even fully roster'd right now.
>>344726205
>>344730940
Pipe down you fucking casual. SF4's year one only had 16 characters until they unlocked Seth, Akuma, and Gouken. We didn't get over 20 characters until year 2.
>>344730892
This but this is what scares me. Alot of the FGC even some lesser pros think this version of SFV is "fine" and people should just "adapt". No i'll adapt until the game is polished sure but this isn't final version material. Even without the 8f delay issue this feels like the SF4 vanilla of SFVs life.
Too many people are willing to settle for this for some weird hardcore brownie points. They act like there isn't a shit ton of room for improvement. I just want a better game and i'm afraid people willing to eat up a 6/10 fighter will prevent that.
Of course SF is my secondary series to GG but id like to enjoy both. If i knew SFV would remain the way it is id drop it right now.
>>344726205
juri
>>344731082
Except SF4 didn't have a month character release schedule. And with the characters being something you have to be buy, it locks the game behind both a paywall and gives no one any time to learn the game at its current state. In SF 4, you either had Super or you didn't. V is all about do you have so and so character unlocked or whether they have been released long enough to learn the matchup and the characters themselves.
>>344726205
more juri
>>344726205
>>344718074
>Also check my 9
Nice try, but how about you check this 5
Can someone tell me why in SF V, there's a large occurrence of people crouching and looking at one another more than in any street fighter ever?
My biggest non functionality issue with SFV is the colors unlock system. It basically forces you to waste time grinding out survival with each character you use and them in their alts again.
No FM option to buy them no real money option too. And the level based one for 3 colors that aren't any better then the others. It sucks watching tournaments of SFV compared to SF4 ones in this aspect. Pro players who used to have their own color/alt reduced to the bare 2 colors because of this.
A bad unlock system in general for cosmetics. Capcom could sell people colors and make money. Also premium costumes costing 4$ each AAHAHAHHA last gen it was 4 bucks for a 5-6 pack. Now its for one. So lets look at this
>First version of a sloppy unpolished decent game
>Shit unlock system
>Basically everything is alright functionality wise besides training mode which is good.
Its a shame this game lacks polish even for a first version all because Capcom had to push it out the door super fast over MUH PRO TOUR!
>>344731686
The pro tour is an entire marketing gimmick due to the game being rushed. This is just for them to try to make a big deal about it despite the game hardly being done
>>344731195
A lot of the FGC has experience with fighting games and knows SFV didn't have a one year arcade beta run.
ASWs insistence on sticking with the arcade model is also why we're still in the stone age buying full priced revisions separated by physical product for servers instead of having it patched in.
We're literally in a state where casuals don't even understand how good they have it with the new system and because they didn't listen to Capcom all throughout 2015 they got burned even with the transparency of the game being updated throughout the year and being released as a service platform.
Which means SF6, if there is one, will go back to the old system of having it locked to Japan for years and revisions released as full priced products.
>>344731775
> a tour set up in 2013 for SF4 is a marketing gimmick for SFV
>>344731915
The old system had cheaper characters and costumes.
>>344731481
because throwing fireballs is no longer a viable option most of the time so the best option is to do nothing if you aren't in range to apply constant pressure
>>344722962
Wait what is this ps4 exploit for fight money? I haven't heard anything
>>344732018
If you bought costume packs on sale later and had SSF4 on PC yeah.
>>344732067
What about the instance where people are literally a sweep away and crouch watching one another.
>>344731481
>press button
>get hit by random crush counter canceled into V-trigger for a 600 damage combo
Or in the case of characters like nash, just them dashing when you're doing nothing is scary.
>>344731915
>How good they have it with the new system
>Skinner box level fighting game with 30 dollar half game price season pace for less then half the games worth
>Low quality in almost every area.
I dislike the buy a new copy alternative but if this is the "new system" ill take the fact i have to shill out for a quality product over this slop.
SFV isn't going to be a good game for awhile and needs patching now on a core game/8f delay/functionality level right now and isn't getting those until the years end and we don't even know how much effort Capcom will place in them.
Meanwhile Revelator is all around good game and you had to buy it new. The tie breaker here is Revelator is a good game and is worth my time. SFV is a decent game and won't be good until it gets polished so i'm wasting my time.
I can always make more money and blow some of it on a game i can play now and enjoy verses slop i can't enjoy as much.
>>344732234
Costumes did not cost 4 dollars individually on any platform in IV.
>>344732308
> quality products
Spoken like someone that didn't play SF4 vanilla and don't know how badly Super was needed because vanilla from start to finish was a fucking mess.
And Revelator is not worth $60 in any world. It's a $15 expansion that they're jewing me for that'll be dead in two months.
>>344732274
I dont know whose idea was it to give heavies in this game a 7f start up time.
>>344732432
the costumes are worth more money because they are higher quality
>>344732461
How so? I played vanilla i'm glad they took some time to make SSF4 it was better for it. If they tried to stream that content in slowly it probably would've been less polished because they'd have less time to focus test/arcade test everything.
>15 dollar expansion
>new stages
>4 new characters
>New mechanics
>Some balancing
>Some new modes
>New story for fags into that.
60 dollars nah but 15 is too low. Also Revelator is still a quality product. It took Sign a alright good game and improved upon it and made it great and only really added to it.
Even if you hate the price you can't argue that Revelator isn't great.
>>344732308
Why do people expect sf to be good in couple of years? Not hating just wondering. Was sf4 also like this? Im actually interested in buying the game
>>344732838
if you make enough lefts you eventually have to make a right
>>344732838
I loved SSF4 i felt like it was the perfect offensive defensive version. Then until USF4 i didn't care and felt like that was a lesser SSF4 in most ways.
SF usually just turns out that way. SF2 turned into ST which is great and SF3 had 3s. Each SF game eventually gets polished and reaches its peak. So people expected SFV to do the same. Although this time Capcom keeps releasing articles like everything besides the 8f delay is fine despite pros who are even winning like Phenom saying it needs work.
Capcom is trying to be as lazy as they can be with SFV not even letting people buy colors and overpricing costumes.
>>344732491
I'm glad Capcom hates Ken.
I liked the story mode
>>344733028
>Each SF game eventually gets polished and reaches its peak.
and sometimes they polish it and then turn it into a pile of burning garbage like Super to AE.
>>344722194
All that talk and no proff......
I never thought I knew cancer until AE Yun.
snake eyez needs to stop this ryu SHIT.
his ryu aint special enough to go anywhere, he still has the same holes in his gameplay. dude needs to embrace that hes the GIEF GUY and just play mika already. i think hed do great with her
>>344733126
This is the problem with things now. Unlike GG which keeps getting better and better Capcom reaches and peak where they aren't good enough to improve but instead of letting things go and letting people have fun they fuck with it more.
Probably a greed thing too. They see no spike in purchase so they feel they have to make a new update/version good or bad. The issue with this is they control the competitive setting for their game pretty much. So people can't choose to play the best version its just the latest version.
>tfw Daigo will never play Huitzil again
>>344713285
It means sf5 has ryu parries and he loves it.
>>344733028
Yeah but everyone seems to say that its dumbed down so nerfs or patches wont really do anything. Do they add new mechanics?
>>344733230
>>344733126
>The home version of Super SFIV was made with extremely good balance, explained Ono. The balance was done in such a way that there's no one overly powerful character.
>Arcade Edition, on the other hand, has some characters who were purposely made strong. The reason this was done is because Ono feels that having such a character helps to build community and competitive spirit.
>characters who were purposely made strong.http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2011/feb/24/ono-claims-ssf4-arcade-edition-unbalanced-dlc-news/
>>344733508
I remember reading that. Fuck Ono
>>344733357
Add a few more defensive mechanics so the game returns to neutral more.
Buff a few normals for each character besides maybe Karin/Chun Li and maybe specials as well
Fix the 8f delay
These changes alone would make the game better. The problem is the neutral leaves once one RPS guess usually from a unreactable dash into shimmy/throw occurs.
Crush Counters well nice to watch are not such a good mechanic especially since a majority of them are safe and those that aren't can be spaced to be safe.
But just design the game so there are more possible ways to return to the neutral. Momentum is far to easy to build once you mount the opponent once.
>>344733602
>Add a few more defensive mechanics
Or just make fireballs not suck
>>344733631
That'll lead to the shoto problem where if you dont have a projectile, you're shit out of luck in advancing on someone with one
>>344733602
Crush counters would have worked better in SFIV. Where they wouldn't have overwhelmed the other options.
>>344733674
It worked fine in 4. Just don't give them ST tier frame data.
>>344733279
He's playing Alex.
>>344733790
how do i do karins moves?
>>344733674
Just improve normals overall. SFV normals are so weirdly terrible overall they're stubby and half of them don't even reach as far as their stubby selves look like they do.
SF2 had fine normals
3s had decent normals that hit where they reached
SF4 had some insanely stupid normals and the only bad ones were bad because they were slow
SFV has both slow and bad normals overall and Karin/Chun Li are probably the only characters that feel like they have decent normals overall in the neutral.
The only good normals in SFV are point blank frame trap ones outside of those two characters.
>>344713285
He means he doesn't play Zangief.
Thanks Cockcom.
>>344734116
Dropped Alex for Ryu
>>344734190
I blame mostly widescreen television on this.
>>344722639
just did it. it works and i got the 1 million fight money achievement
>is jewish
>plays against a user called "Holocaust"
>said user plays a blonde character with blue eyes
>loses
>denies runback
Floe is now a Holocaust survivor.
>>344721061
He's a defensive player though, of course he's not going to like it.
>>344713285
He meant that the game is great and only fucking retards hate it.
#BRINGBACKTHENIPPLES though
