>"Story in a game is like a story in a porn movie. It's expected to be there, but it's not that important."
What did he mean by this?
I think what he meant is that story in a game is like a story in a porn movie. It's expected to be there, but it's not that important.
>>344648771
What did he mean by this?
>>344648634
it means that people enjoying their 20hrs of cutscenes in games like uncharted or witcher are faggots
Always hated this cunt
>>344648862
I think what he meant is that story in a game is like a story in a porn movie. It's expected to be there, but it's not that important.
>>344649525
why
I hate HL2 for making story shit popular
who is this stupid looking maggot
>>344648634
That beating it to Peach and Co is what is really important.
>>344648634
in an interactive medium, gameplay is the narrative.
that's why western indie scene went for the feels crowd and called video games too gamey.
best example would be limbo devs who go for the 'experience' and people like frictional games who actually remove what piss poor gameplay their games have if you fail a couple of times so the 'experience' doesn't get marred.
>>344648634
That 90's were a simpler time to develop games
>>344648634
But the story makes porn hotter.
Carmack is a fucking talentless hack.
gameplay is more important
>>344649649
Are you fucking serial mate
>>344648634
This isn't a very good analogy. Porn only exists to get your rocks off, but video games have the potential to do much more than be fun, even if that's a primary goal.
>>344648634
Carmack is a tech guy, it's not his job to understand storytelling. He probably thinks only cutscenes convey story.
>>344649649
John Carmack. And he said it because he is an autistic moron.
(did he really say that..? if he did, he really is)
>>344649832
>>>/reddit/
>>344648634
>want to jack it
>find video HOT BROTHER SISTER SEX
>click play
>smash cut to an obvious pornstar taking 6 inches of dick up the ass
>2 continuous minutes of assfucking until the girl gets a facial
>video ends
>mfw John Carmack bought Pornhub
>>344649649
I think that's moot, the guy who owned 4chan before the jap dude took over
>>344649692
You forgot the chinese room
worst "game" creators there are
he said it because he was too lazy to put any cutscenes into his own shitty games
>>344649976
The guy who played the time-power guy in Heroes?
>hardcore gamurs complain that all games are being turned into emotional visual novels because they have even 1 or 2 cutscenes and they don't focus on gameplay
>hardcore gamurs complain that all games are being turned into dumb action games for "casuals" because the combat slightly is improved and you don't have story every 5 seconds
So which is it?
>>344650181
maybe, he also was lex luthor in superman versus batman
What did he mean by this?
>>344650084
Well, he probably IS autistic, and thinks only in 1's and 0's. Genius at programming, shit at literally everything else. Unable to take perspective.
>>344648634
Well-developed story and characters in porn is the best fucking thing, though. It's why stories make up like 50% of the stuff I look at nowadays.
Also his statement is retarded. A great story can carry a game through mediocre gameplay (e.g. Mass Effect or New Vegas), and if you can get good gameplay AND story you blow the competition out of the water.
>>344648634
This idiot also said Doom was 2.5D. Never take him at his word.
>tfw I play video games for the story
>tfw I don't even enjoy single player mechanical interaction
Why the fuck am I on /v/?
who cares about stories in movies, I only watch them for the action scenes
if I want stories I'd read a book
>anti-storyfag logic
>>344650510
Because you're a delicate little flower and i appreciate you.
>>344648634
It means he's a pompous faggot who thinks he speaks for the whole industry despite not being relevant for years.
>>344650557
Action scenes are part of the story, though. You'd only watch them for the credits if you don't care about story.
>>344649584
What did he mean by this?
>>344650557
Movies are there to watch, not to play you fucktard.
Video games are for playing not for watching.
only women and feminized men like story in video games
>>344648634
I so miss when porn had stories, and when he was relevant.
>>344650823
That he's a savant.
>>344648634
Video game stories suck dicks, but people still expect them
>>344650841
Then why don't you go and play video games without watching them?
>>344651008
>video games for blind people
>>344648634
He's right, focus on story has destroyed video games. 90's were prime
>>344649795
>Porn doesn't have potential to be much more
>Video games somehow magically do
Faggot
>>344650841
You can have a story without interfering with the gameplay.
Deus Ex is a good example.
>>344650969
You haven't played Planescape: Torment, have you?
>“I've said that Minecraft was my grail for VR, and this was the most important gaming application that I could be involved with."
What did he mean by this?
>implying gaming isn't the best storytelling medium in the history of humanity
>image related
>>344651080
Did you even have been alive during 90's..? Judging by your post you haven't.
>>344648634
He's autistic and thinks entirely from within his own perspective. Not shitting on his fantastic work, that's just how it is with the guy. He doesn't care about story in video games and he just naturally concludes that nobody else does either.
>>344651080
The 90's is when story-focused games started becoming the norm.
>>344648634
I humbly disagree with the notion that story doesn't matter in our movies.
>>344651317
That's the point several people have made in this thread, but its seems to fall upon deaf ears
>>344650841
Why are you playing a particular game, though? What is your motivation? How do yo decide what game to invest your time in and what affects whether you want to keep playing or not?
Your choices and perceived enjoyment in regards to video games are never based purely on mechanical design.
>>344651272
It's an amazing storytelling medium. Unfortunately, people use it wrong by trying to tell you the story they wrote instead of the one you make by playing.
>>344648634
He was dropping some truth. Apparently, this whole thread minus 1 or 2 people are faggots who like story. Metal Slug is a good example of how much story a game needs.
>>344650951
Makes you think
>>344648634
>Godlike 10/10 tier
Awesome Story + Awesome Gameplay
No examples I can think of.
>Very Good tier
Great Story + Great Gameplay
Very rare.
>Good tier:
Mediocre Story + Great Gameplay
No Gameplay (VN) + Fantastic Story
No Story + Fantastic Gameplay
Mediocre Gameplay + Great Story
This is where most highly regarded games end up.
Point is that you can compensate and still achieve a "Good Tier" game, even if one element is lacking.
> I JOINED FACEBOOK NOW FUCK U BITCHES DAT CASH MUNY DOE UUUGHNNN SUCK IT LMAO
What did he mean by this?
>people parroting some numale indie dev
>>>/reddit/
>>344650557
You are the reason action movies are shit (with few exceptions)
>mfw dark souls is more discussed and analyzed than storyfag games
>>344651545
>Why are you playing a particular game, though?
Because it has good gameplay, of course. If I would play for story, I'd also could watch a movie, which most likely will have a much superior story.
Story in video games is mostly a bad thing because it interfers with the gameplay. If you'd want to replay the game you constantly would have to listen to the same dialogues, watch the same cutscenes again and again, which just boring.
>>344651629
You can't identify story.
>>344648634
gameplay > story
Does anyone even know what fucking autism is?
>// what the fuck?
What did he mean by this?
>Full on autismos that get sincerely angry if a game has ANY story
>Casuals that can't handle the slightest challenge and just want video games to be a movie or book with added button presses.
My father once told me no matter the problem, and no matter who's arguing about it, they're both wrong and the truth is somewhere in the middle. I have yet to encounter a problem where his advice wasn't accurate.
>>344651812
Dark Souls is to gaming what Lost is to tv-shows. Just a whole bunch of meaningless pseudo-mysteries where 90% of shit has no explanation, and fans are left to fill the gaps with their head canon.
I have a suspsicion that Carmack hates black ppl...
>>344650557
Holy fuck this may be the dumbest thing I've read in a while. Pretty sure it's b8.
>>344648634
Doesnt really work because story is really important in porn
I can recall countless chinese comics I ended up fapping to that had subpar art, but the situation being described was insanely hot
>>344651317
too simple, he ain't stupid , it's not that he thinks nobody else does, he thinks nobody else should.
Namely because gameplay is supposed to be the core of a game just like sex is the core of porn. He likely would advice you to watch a movie or read a book if you want a good story.
>>344651629
What's good for Metal Slug isn't what's good for every game ever made.
Can you imagine an RPG without a story? It would be rancid shit.
I hate modern games are so story focused and full of cutscenes
>So what is your favourite game?
Ocarina of time and Final fantasy 7
>>344652051
RPGs are also rancid shit as video games. They are rancid shit for casuals who can't properly hold a controller in their hands, and merely can skip though dialogues, click "attack", and walk their character.
>implying he isn't right
>implying game narratives aren't b-movies tier bullshit
>>344652028
>gameplay is supposed to be the core of a game
But gameplay is such a broad fucking term I would still call him wrong for making that argument. What qualifies as gameplay, and what doesn't to him? Does there need to he shooting? Can puzzle adventure games like Full Throttle count, since you could just read a puzzle book?
>>344652019
Agreed. I've read erotic fiction that has given me new fetishes because the stories were so well-written.
>>344651921
the thruth is subjective :^)
>>344648634
I hate stories in porn. He's a cuck.
I'm glad he's reducing the entirety of his career to pornography.
Porn with plot > Unrelated moving pictures of coitus
>>344651848
>watch the same cutscenes again and again
You can usually skip cutscenes now.
>>344652013
There's literally nothing a movie can do better than a book when it comes to telling a story. Apart from maybe adding some cheap feels through the use of manipulative music.
>>344650245
Both, gaming communities are the ultimate cancer of the internet
>>344648634
It means that he's a hack who has never been able to write even a decent story let alone a good one.
>>344652418
>Apart from maybe adding some cheap feels through the use of manipulative music.
This reads like tremendous butthurt. Using music to direct the emotion of the audience is a legit and commendable aspect of filmmaking, even if it doesn't impact the quality of the storytelling
>>344650348
Can you point out a video game with an actually good story that was executed well
>>344651848
>Story in video games is mostly a bad thing because it interfers with the gameplay
Try replacing 'story' with 'cutscenes'.
Yes, you are the kind of idiot who thinks only cutscenes convey story. Compare to films where the audience generally is able to understand that even the outfits worn by actors were deliberately chosen and those choices were dictated by narrative purposes. Video game assets, when not randomly generated, were designed and approved. That's not part of mechanical design, it's a narrative effort. If not for it, the game would consist of untextured cubes or something.
>>344651137
planescape's story is only good by video game standards and it does a terrible job at presenting the story
>large text dumps with mediocre at best gameplay
it's one of the best examples why reading books is a better than playing games if you want story
>>344652473
>a programmer genius who set multiple graphic engine and industry standards is unable to write a story
such a hack amirite
>>344652740
This, the man's a genius. Though he's the sort of genius that when he doesn't get the appeal of something he dismisses it as "doing it wrong"
>>344652559
>any Obsidian game
>older Rockstar games
>Silent Hill 1, 2 and 3
>SOTC
>MGS2 and 3
>Mafia 1
>Deus Ex
>Thief 2
The "games have inferior stories to other mediums" meme tends to be spouted by people who don't know very much about those other mediums.
>>344652602
You story fag are really grasping on straws here. What most people understand as "story" is mostly likely dialogues or text, not what kind of color the shirt of the protag has or whatever.
Story games like Order 1866 or Uncharted are complete shit and noone needs them. Only casuals who barely even play the games they buy find them good.
>>344648634
He meant that he watches boring vanilla porn.
>>344653174
Confirmed for having never experienced a good story.
When it comes to telling a story, showing is better than telling.
>>344652614
Jesus Fucking Christ... i give up...
>>344648634
>this is the comment that made John Romero leave id.
>>344651696
>Modern cancer tier
Story is told in unskippable cutscenes or scripted events
>>344653174
>Story games
What makes something a story game, is it having a certain amount of cutscenes?
>>344653356
>When it comes to telling a story, showing is better than telling.
Even if it doesn't have any text, you still need cutscenes, or at least a lot of scripted events like in Inside or whatever. No matter what, this always interfers with the gameplay, which doesn't fit to video GAMES. Since video GAMES are about GAMEplay, not about fucking story lines.
Excellent porn stories do happen though and they make it that much better
>>344648634
You get aroused at the gameplay, not to the story of milkman visiting a hot milf.
>>344653596
Either cutscenes, or being full of dialogue text or scripted events.
>>344653361
yeah, reading books is generally much better than playing games for a story. your'e still a very silly goose.
>>344648634
http://www.lexisrex.com/English/Sentence-Study/Story%20in%20a%20game%20is%20like%20a%20story%20in%20a%20porn%20movie.
>>344653660
You can tell a story without cutscenes.
Also, text doesn't interfere with the gameplay if it's completely optional. The text that's mandatory is usually just there to provide you with some basic context so you know what you're supposed to do.
>>344653174
Trying to argue that visual storytelling is insignificant (in a medium as visual as VIDEO games) because a shirt color is a minor detail is grasping at straws.
Don't try to make it look like I'm defending specific games when I'm talking about a broader subject and haven't named any games. No one's gonna agree with you just because you invoked the casual boogeyman.
>>344648634
>broke into his school as a teenager to steal computers
What did he mean by this?
>>344653919
>You can tell a story without cutscenes.
Then the story is either almost non-existent, or the game is full of scripted events.
>text doesn't interfere with the gameplay if it's completely optional.
Of course it interfers with the gameplay if you constantly have to skip text in it. You retard most likely never even played a game in your life with really good flow. The flow and pacing of a game is very important.
>>344654252
>Then the story is either almost non-existent
You are confused.
>>344654252
By "optional text", I meant stuff like logs entries and notes scattered throughout the level. You can tell a story through them alone.
>>344654060
Then what do you retard even mean by "visual storytelling"? You sound like every game is about story, which is complete bullshit.
He comes from an old era where porn movies were still the exclusive form of video porn
Thankfully, we've progressed and also games have gotten better at stories~
Basically, he's an out of touch old fag who should stop talking, like that fat apple guy.
>>344654493
They tried that in MGSV and it was garbage, I mean it can be done but I think that stuff is better for supplemental information
>>344648634
>What did he mean by this?
What did he mean by this?
>>344654493
So you mean how games like Dark Souls do it mostly? Yes, that's also a way, but Dark Souls is also known for having extremely little story for an RPG, and could as well have no story at all.
>>344654559
>about a story
Every game (or at least anything that's more sophisticated than Pong or Tetris) has a story, but identifying it is completely optional. You're entirely free to focus on the game mechanics as they are the most prominent feature of a video game.
>>344650557
kek
also true
>>344648634
>there are people ITT who WANT their game to be bogged down with story
Why?
>>344648634
I watch plenty of hentai for the plot though
>>344654881
Hell, even Pong and Tetris have a story. It's just the story of you playing it rather than a story they made up for the game.
>>344654916
kys carmack
you haven't made anything actually worth playing in a decade now and your latest meme technologies are cancer
>>344654916
because most games are too hard for them so they play movie games and those rely on story
>>344649649
Cliffy C
>>344652202
Ocarina of Time wasn't hugely story focused though and no one loves it because of the story.
>>344655023
>I hate video games
>>344655027
>all story-focused games are movie-games
I want this meme to die.
>>344654881
>at least anything that's more sophisticated than Pong or Tetris
Just because a game doesn't have story doesn't mean it's not sophisticated. Tetris has better gameplay than 99% of these modern story "games".
And no, most games barely have any story in them. Noone plays Marios Bros for the "story" in it, even if it has one. They play it for the gameplay.
Games like this are something completely different than modern "games" like Witcher 3 or whatever who have cutscenes every 5 minutes and barely any gameplay, except for walking your character around.
>>344649649
John Romero, the guy that published the 'John Romero's going to make you his bitch' poster
>>344653174
>>344655321
>noone
Stop
>>344655186
sorry meant to quote >>344654916
>>344654916
Watching cutscenes is everything the modern gamer is capable of. A game with actual gameplay would be way too complicated for them.
>>344649967
>incest
>no creampie
why is this a thing?
>>344655515
*tips fedora*
>>344648634
>>344648634
I will not watch/read hentai unless it has an interesting plot
Investment in the characters helps me get aroused
>>344652245
>But gameplay is such a broad fucking term I would still call him wrong for making that argument. What qualifies as gameplay, and what doesn't to him? Does there need to he shooting? Can puzzle adventure games like Full Throttle count, since you could just read a puzzle book?
Anything goes, a puzzle is also gameplay, what he would find obsolete would be encasing that gameplay in story like professor layton games encase puzzles into a story.
The core concept of gameplay is interaction, how the interaction is portrayed doesn't matter to him. For example you could change metroid to a fantasy setting with magic and samus as a sorceress without changing any mechanics in the game.
>>344655321
You're conflating "some people (read: I) don't care" with "it does not matter". If that's true, would changing the setting and characters of a game have no effect on how and how much players care about it?
>>344648634
>trusting the codemonkey's opinion on game design
This is that fallacy where a guy's really good at $thing and has an opinion on $other_thing that really isn't his area of expertise, but he's so good at $thing people just take it at face value because he's a genius at $thing.
>>344656214
I'm not conflating anything, smart ass. What are you even talking about
>would changing the setting and characters of a game have no effect
Setting and characters are setting and characters, not story.
Just because you put a character in your game doesn't mean it has a story line.
>>344656825
>Setting and characters are setting and characters, not story.
What do you think a story is composed out of?
Story isn't expected in porno at all. If you get some story, great, but you're really just there to see a cute girl suck some dick.
>>344654812
It has a ton of fucking story. Dark Souls 3 is the worst in that aspect, but demons souls had a metric ton of lore, so did DaS 1
>>344656993
A story in a video game is about dialogues, text, cutscenes, scripted events, etc
using your logic every game has a story line, which is like saying every porn movie has a story line. Just because there is a lot of fucking going on doesn't mean there is a story line.
>>344648634
i disagree, i can no longer watch porno without a decent story, art direction, picture quality, good editing, etc etc.
it needs to be AAA Porn or i don't care, i am done with amateur shit, just as i am done with indie shit
>>344657116
For an RPG it has very little story.
>>344657219
Yes, it does. The terms you use don't magically mean what you want them to mean. Reading your posts, I can see you view reality very selectively.
>>344656994
>Story isn't expected in video games at all. If you get some story, great, but you're really just there to play a cute girl blowing shit up.
>>344648634
That he has bad taste in both video games and porn.
>>344657362
What a shit opinion, amateur stuff is always hotter
>>344657597
if i wanted a amateur sex experience, i would just have sex, I want professionalism in my porn.
>>344657597
>amateur stuff is always hotter
mostly because you never actually get any
>>344657493
No, it doesn't. No sane person would say Tetris has a story line, just because you properly place blocks on shapes.
You are just talking complete semantics here and grasp on straws to defend your shitty B-movie tier stories in vidya.
>>344650883
this.
Mother 3 is the only game I can think of that comes close to a story that would be received well outside of a the vidya medium.
The story of just about every other vidya is in line with a michael bay movie, including shit like the last of us.
You all have just lost perspective on how bad the stories are in vidya because the act of playing makes you more vulnerable to thinking there is more to them than there really is.
>>344657952
hi /r/eddit!
>>344652019
this
there's countless moe girls doing lewd things in hentai and more 3d porn than one can ever consume in a lifetime
in order to differentiate their porn from the competition, producers have began focusing on the story
one particular doujin that I liked even though it had relatively bad art was "World of reversed gender roles", there's so much one can do with that concept
>>344651696
Don't forget about amazing music and bad - good tier everything else (Undertale)
>>344651921
everyone's got different tastes, so different companies cater to different segments of the market to maximize revenue
yet we're still discussing something as obvious as that
>>344658069
>World of reversed gender roles
Fuck, was that the one where a normal guy wants to fuck everyone and all the girls thinks he's a total slut? What was that one called again?
>story is important
>I wouldn't watch it if it's not done by an a-list celeb though
>>344658304
yep, that one
>>344649649
Gabe Newel, owner of Ubisoft
>if you like gameplay you're a fedora lord
>if you like story you're a casual
>people still try to put a decade old quote into context today
>>344657219
>using your logic every game has a story line
I said that every game has a story. I also said that you don't have to care about stories in games if you don't have to. You see, a story is not the same thing as a plot, these are different terms with differing meanings. A plot is simply things that happen, something like "demons invade an outpost on the planet Mars and lots of people die". This can be explained in a log, said by an NPC portrayed in a cutscene or incorporated into gameplay with minimal scripting. There's lots of choices. But it's not story. Story demands interaction in the form of the audience (in this case the player) actively deriving meaning from things such as the plot.
Consider the "demons invade an outpost on the planet Mars and lots of people die" premise. How it plays out in the game obviously is more specific. What kind of demons? Where on Mars? How big is the colony? Are demons the sole cause of death? What else happens? You don't have to find any of this interesting or worth thinking about but someone had to when the game was made, and that's why interpretation is possible.
>>344648634
>The guy is Einstein of gaming industry and our time.
>Spergs on /v/ know better.
Go back play your jrpgs
>>344648634
Not if you wake up one day and porn with a good story has become the standard.
>>344648634
Gameplay is the unique and defining feature of video games as a medium, and things like Story are superfluous to that experience and should only serve to complement it.
Somewhere along the line though, people got all mixed up and started giving CINEMATIC EXPERIENCES more focus because they want their games to be more akin to Hollywood blockbusters, despite the fact that it's more often than not a detriment to the quality and innovation of the game's gameplay.
Looking at you David Cage.
>>344658817
source?
>>344648634
gameplay comes first, but context makes it (and porn) so much better.
It's why Samus is way hotter than any other generic blondeslutgood-looking woman.
>>344659539
This.
It's the same basic principal with porn. You can put your story in, but if you shove in too much all it does is bog down the production and distract/make people wait on/get less of the part they're actually there to see because of the stupid play that you felt you needed to put on in an attempt to legitimize what you're doing.
>>344648634
A game with no story vs a game with no gameplay is like a book with no pictures vs a book with no words.
>>344660694
go away quinn
It would've been easy to say back then, but with how much of a significant impact a game's story can have on people, and how hand-in-hand it goes with the medium, avoiding it is like deliberately missing a good opportunity, and it will more often than not leave a gaping hole in the overall experience.
What's important is to not leave gameplay merely as an excuse for the game's story, which is a line that's been crossed far too many times in recent years.
>>344649525
Leave.
>>344650557
If you are playing a game and realize it not succeeding at telling a story of playing, then it should probably be a book or a movie, which happens all the time.
>>344659940
It's like taking too long to tell a joke, getting to the punchline.
>>344648634
fucking nu male sjw cuck. These guys is all that is wrong with the modern gaming industrie
>>344649832
I think Romero was the one who actually said it.
>>344651272
>>344651572
How do we get more games to do this?
>>344651284
>Did you even have been alive during 90's
You will immediately cease and not continue to access the site if you are under the age of 18.
>>344650883
Is that why MGS is so popular on here?
>>344664201
Good luck expecting the devs to make the effort. Creating an environment where player actions 'generate ripples' instead of resulting in strictly localised and temporary consequences is hard work, especially if the player has a large amount of actions that can be performed.
What did they mean by this?
>>344648634
well system shock 2 is generally agreed to be a great game and i sure didnt play it for the gunplay
>>344666296
this is why I never tell anyone that I'm a "gamer"
>>344648634
>"Textures in a game are like clothing in a porn movie. It's expected to be there, but it's not that important."
>>344648634
He's right
>>344666596
>clothes
>expected to be there in a porn movieClothed sex best sex
Carmack?? Moar liek car WREK lol
Seriously though he looks like a homo and I bet he smells like one too.
>>344658304
c-could you link it to me, this concept interests me
>>344659176
You are just talking semantics. You retard know exactly what people with "story in games". When people talk about "story games" they obviously do not mean Tetris, they mean Witcher 3, Uncharted, or whatever.
>>344649649
Summer time
>>344649649
Your wife's son's father
>>344667665
You're relying on a distinction that I don't care about since storytelling and gameplay do not have to be in conflict with each other. You're trying to prove that story can only exist at the expense of gameplay by referring to plot-driven games boggled down by non-interactive segments. You're constantly mixing different things with each other arguing that they are the same thing.
People who argue that The Witcher is a story-driven game are wrong. You can reject an incorrect position instead of validating it by either agreeing or disagreeing with it.
>>344648634
stories are for books. porn and vidya have a specific purpose.
>>344652019
sauce that shit nigga
