If a game is going to have multiple routes, how do you prefer they be handled?
1 isn't great
2 is my favorite
3 is dumb. Really, really dumb
I'm not even sure what 4 is supposed to be.
>>343855173
Two separate routes that merge into a single route at the end
See: Sonic Adventure 2
>>343855173
4 is two paths with the same ending, say from the perspectives of two different characters.
>>343855173
4 is having multiple storylines, and having them all converge into a single ending point.
>>343854984
I like 2 and 4 best.
>>343855173
4 has a lot of replay value
>>343854984
They gotta intertwine and circle back to each other. Otherwise you just get a linear game with small branching out paths that lead nowhere.
>>343855385
Man, they really dropped the ball with 3.
4 is my favorite, and it's best with lots of long lines.
How many branches can be made?
>>343855385
>Dark Souls
>Having truly branching routes.
Yes, you can sequence break and do things out of order, but the story itself is very linear in nature. You're getting open world mixed up with branching story.
>>343854984
1 is bad. Assuming that is single decision at the end a la ME3 or DE:HR.
2 is cool if it's something that has replay value. It's not cool if a missed flag means you need to replay 30 hours of game to get a "true" end.
3 can be cool like the Witcher 2, but more often than not it falls apart like in heavy rain.
What is example of 4? I don't think I've ever seen that.
![62976-200[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/wxucFDU.png "62976-200[1].png")
like this
>>343854984
One that ends.
Challenger approaching
>>343855631
>What is example of 4? I don't think I've ever seen that.
Sonic Adventure 2, Sonic 3 & Knuckles, Sonic Heroes, and Sonic 06
>>343855173
>2 is my favorite
Why? You like having the game end on a branch and miss 90% of the content?
>>343854984
You completely filled out your timeline, right /v/?
>>343855763
>Sonic 3 & Knuckles
Nah, that's more like 1. The main game for Sonic and Knuckles is mostly the same (with some divergences for Knuckles), but the end games are completely different.
>>343855714
Something like this is what I was going to draw but a little less interconnections towards the end to kinda commit the player to their decisions from beginning to mid.
Game needs like 50 sudden unpredictable Bad Ends even in a comfy yuri story otherwise it's for scrubs
>>343854984
1 is okay
2 is VN shit
3 is okay
4 is fucking absurdly retarded.
>>343854984
>>343855714
Which game is this
>>343856341
Maybe this one?
>>343856341
Sephirot: The Tree of Life
>>343856341
>>343856208
I prefer this route.
>>343854984
none of those are actually multiple routes
>>343856631
Why did this gamehave so many endings?
Guess the name of the game
The fuck is this?
>>343855909
>tfw having to suppress my moralfaggotry and go judge dredd route to get best party members
>>343854984
Something like this
>>343856659
It's hard to tell where this even starts or ends. I'm at a complete loss as to what this would look like.
>>343856341
tower simulator
>>343856796
mass effect?
>>343855173
3 is good when it's well made, see The Witcher 2
>>343856858
Looks like some kind of VN progression chart?
>>343856858
>>343856924
>literally just googling "vn route map"
lol fags
>>343856858
>mfw recognizing those two names
>>343855714
*i am all of me plays in the background*
>>343854984
What the hell is 2 supposed to represent? Dead Rising 2? I think they're all fine when they're well made but I really get a hard on for separate but converging or intertwining storylines
>>343856341
>>343856631
>>343856739
>ever sequence you can go through has a special name
>someone had to write +300 names for all the autistic posibilities you could gonthrough the game with
wow, why?
>>343854984
My fourth.
>>343854984
Way of the Samurai 3 had a really interesting system with the time and locations to trigger events. You could just sit down and play it for hours collecting weapons/weapon parts/ weapon upgrade parts/ healing and stat boosting items, minigames, trying to figure out different endings or unlocking a side kick, trying to unlock moves on a bunch of different weapons, instant kill vs hard difficulties changed the game play immensely. There were so many endings and different ways to do shit just slightly different it would of been impossible without a guide to do a lot of it.
In a way it was so repetitive you almost hate it but it was a really addictive game and I never seen anything with that many different endings.
>>343857116
I googled School Days flowchart you double nigger
If I wanted a real mess I'd go with YU NO
>Drawn into VN's due to open endedness, freedom of choice, and wanting to enjoy a story
>EVERY SINGLE PROTAGONIST IS DUMB AS SHIT
I absolutely hate HATE having to play as some bumbling retard. I KNOW the girl is hitting on me, I KNOW what to do in social situations to not make people think im a fucking retard.
Is there any good VNs I can play where I'm not forced to be a dumbass?
>>343857350
LITERALLY WHO GOT PAID TO DO THIS?
http://info.sonicretro.org/List_of_Shadow_the_Hedgehog_Library_sequences
>>343854984
Like this.
>>343857350
>>343857546
Wait I don't get it. What is this?
>>343854984
>1: Strange Journey
>2: 999
>3: The Witcher 2
>4: Sonic Adventure 2
Personally I like Strange Journey the most
>>343857515
Rance?
>>343857639
Every combination of how to beat Shado the Hegehog has a name. So, while there are only like 5 endings, there's name for every possible way you can get there.
>>343857639
Every possible combination of paths you can get from >>343856573 has a name
>>343857515
Look for VNs that don't have the tag "Donkan Protagonist"
Then wade through all of the untranslated nukige
>>343857515
999. Junpei is a good protag.
>>343857639
Sonic the Hedgehog
Each stage you can choose to side with 3 different people. A demon guy, Eggman, or the US Military. Depending on which of the three you side with you'll move to a different stage.
On the surface that sounds deep and complex but it's actually just shallow as fuck.
Wario Land 2 style
1. Fulfilling full routes when played normally
2. Unexpected but brief side endings when creativity is applied
3. Always allowed the ability to travel back to the branch point after an ending is achieved
4. Bonus for seeing all the endings
>>343857332
BlazBlue: Chrono Phantasma, maybe?
>>343856965
you could say its a loss
>>343857813
I've heard of this but haven't given it a shot yet. I assume the applestore ios version is fine?
>>343857807
Didn't realize this was a thing, thanks. I don't really get involved in VN communities and none of my friends are into them so it's mostly whatever I stumble across on steam and here.
>>343854984
1 is shit, 2 is alright if there is a good save system in place and there isn't the same boss fight at the end of each (looking at you, fucking chrono trigger), 3 is usually pretty alright, as long as the end isn't too long, 4 is better than 3.
Guess the Game
>>343858097
/vn/'s a real shithole like every general, but you should check out their rec chart if you're new to VNs
>>343854984
>doors 2 and 3 can't be entered without heading for a game over
>no in-game flowchart despite requiring multiple playthroughs
Everyone always talks up 999 as the best in the series, but the game has a terrible flow to it.
>>343857515
>>343858097
Saya no Uta, Higurashi, and the Zero Escape series seem like they fit your requirements. I've only played the first episode of Higurashi, though. The iOS version of 999 removes the puzzles and only adds a single bad end, so I'd say emulate it.
Is he right?
>>343855173
3 is cool in games that are meant to be replayed. Think Fire Emblem 7 or Sacred Stones.
>>343856234
Aoishiro? The flowchart menu in it was amazing and more VNs need something similar or better.
![final-timeline[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/rTKkHAs.png "final-timeline[1].png")
>timeline is a plot device
>you can jump to any past point in the timeline and the protagonist keeps his skills and memories
>>343858118
Fix'd
>>343858540
>aioshiro.jpg
Nah it's Tsukihime.
>>343854984
2 or 4.
>>343858118
>>343858623
Take my ideas and make a decent RPG for fuck´s sake.
>>343858097
If you wait, an HD remake is coming to pc eventually, it's also gonna be voice. But they didn't say anything about dates.
I'd say emulate 999. If at all possible, I'd say play it on an actual DS, but its not the end of the world if you just emulate on the pc.
>>343858097
The IOS version removes the puzzles and doesn't add much content at all, I would say emulate the DS version.
>>343857546
>Punishment in Jet Black
>>343858325
Higurashi is an interesting case because the dumber the story gets the smarter the MC appears.
Most VN's that aren't generic Highschool Harem or Nukige have an interesting protagonist, they need to or else they have no other selling point. Even Shirou for all the shit he gets isn't an idiot.
>>343859559
>Higurashi
I thought that visual novel has no choices?
those are all pathetic. I'd rather have a completely linear game than jokes of routes like that. give me a real flowchart or don't even bother.
time loop mindfuck route
someone post DD's original progression chart
>>343859813
>random warp
>>343859742
It doesn't, none of his VN's do, he even kept trying to think of terms other than Visual Novel to describe it because people assume VN's will have choices. Still worth reading, Higurashi is the stronger of the two. Umineko is more interesting on paper but comes across as a janky mess.
>>343858325
Come to think of it, why aren't the routes based on digital roots? You would think that the good endings would be the ones with a root of 9 like 5->7->6 or getting a certain number tells you more about the character with that number.
Instead the order of the doors is only relevant for the good ends while the bad ends are determined by the third door you open.
Goddamnit, Uchikoshi. You had one job.
>>343859559
The story gets dumber? That's a shame. I was liking the blend of supernatural and realism.
>tfw going through a game
>see splitting path
>don't know what way will take you to an optional area and what way takes you to the end of the level
>no way to tell without doing it
I hate this
>>343854984
I prefer games without multiple endings or possible storylines. theres no way any single narrative you experience on a single playthrough is going to be improved by the existence of alternate possible narratives, and actual choice in games is meaningless since any decent storyline will give you the illusion of your choices mattering anyway. i think this "multiple ending" bullshit is mostly just for internet spergs who insist on doing 10 playthroughs in a row so they can experience all the storylines and then discuss which was best online.
>>343854984
I would prefer to see more games like Alpha Protocol, not the core gunplay of course but the illusion of choice with small but significant changes based on decisions made and how you complete missions.
Alpha Protocol would give small nods towards the way you played the game. If you shot shit up and set off all the alarms it would effect your reputation down the line. Decisions made in conversations would often come back in game-play and future interactions. Understanding a NPC would allow you to make a informed decision on how to influence them either by goading them or trying to please them.
Alpha Protocol was a great game for the illusion of choice. You always play the same missions in each run, but you pick the order you do them in and you can change small details about them through your actions in the game. How you played the game ultimately opens up different endings, but you still do the same final missions to get there, you just sort of determine who you side with and who you fuck over. So a ending is sort of personalized even though you take mostly the same route to get there.
>>343858118
Deus Ex Human Revolution
>>343860608
it's the other way around. "illusion of choice" is cancer and only cheapens the game. real multiple routes or completely linear should be the only options.
>>343854984
I'd like a game with a story where selecting between different protagonists affects the linearity and depth of their route progression.
As in, you have that simplistic hero with a white-and-black morality view on the world so it's easy to know what choices to make. But the people who are on the receiving end of his action genuinely hate him for it, so the challenges are harder than with other protagonists' in general.
Then of the others, there's that one guy who will just plainly allow the player and the world to influence his decisions and actions, turning his supposed fate into a wild card and being capable of altering the difficulty and length of his journey.How you fare with having played as them will affect the overall party's composition once they all regroup together for the penultimate quest.
>>343860949
Illusion of choice is completely linear you mouthbreather, the difference is the writer is skilled at his trade and is tricking you into following the linear path of your own accord.
>>343858413
There's a right way to do that.
Just look at Morrowind
>With this character's death, the thread of prophecy is severed.
You can kill whoever, but you risk making the game unwinnable.
Make games this way if you don't want weird unkillable character, just have killing some characters lock you out of certain missions or routes. Killing everyone should make the game near unwinnable.
guess the game
>>343861349
And this is why is annoying and a waste of time. I don't know why people call it an illusion of choice anyway. They very game you are playing is already an illusion of everything. Be it choices, feelings, perceptions, etc. That's not illusion of choice, it's just a dumb cheap trick to justify poor writing.
>>343860252
It remains pretty bleak all the way through but the tone starts to shift, I'll explain a bit in spoilers but it's better experienced knowing as little as possible.
The story retains the serious supernatural elements but the realism drops around chapter 7 around the same time they drop horror, you get even more Phoenix Wright homages, you get lines like "His Kung Fu was like ARMOR PIERCING BULLETS", you get attempted tacticool once spec ops forces get involved, you get climactic showdowns with the villain of the arc on the roof as the sun sets with this music blaring at you
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JR0SvgLy_D8
You get the first taste of the metaverse wankery that later ruined Umineko. Overall you get a completely different experience from the ending of arc 6 onwards and it's awesome, it's the same sort of awesome that makes the ending of Umineko even the slightest bit tolerable.
>>343861932
Is there even an example for D
>>343859813
YU-NO's save/load system is probably one of the coolest I've ever seen.
>>343861913
Fallout 3?
1 is good if the split is a consequence of a sum of decisions rather than just one. 2 is ideal but not a lot of games do it.
>>343862391
no
the filename gives it away
>>343854984
4 is great and should be done more often
>>343854984
2,1 and 4 when done right.
Fuck 3
>>343855909
i would if there weren't so many filler battles. cool game hurt a lot by being a grind
>>343862795
that's all there is to do in the game anyway, fight, fight andfight it out.
They encourage a second play through and affect the outcome.
I was stunned that fucking Black OPS II did this really well and so many things in the game was affected by your choices of which there are several for most missions.
>>343862952
there's no reason for a single route to be 50 hours and for it to take 15+ hours to make a new class viable
>>343862074
If you split a game into two routes, you need twice the assets. This means you need about twice your current art budget plus more if you have voice acting, unique music, or new gameplay elements. Studies on story branching show that most people only ever play through a game once regardless of branching, meaning most players aren't even going to see all that stuff you just made.
Smart writers can branch off just enough that you see slightly different content in a completely new light, but not far enough that they start bleeding the art budget dry.
>>343862379
LSD
>>343862074
An illusion of choice is by necessity good writing, else it wouldn't be illusory.
>>343863545
Just like your post, followed with an expected reply?
>>343855714
>no one mentions fucking OutRun
>>343863545
People call it an illusion because the illusion is obvious. A well written illusion wouldn't be referred to as an illusion, since you wouldn't be able to see that it's an illusion in the first place.
>>343862551
Resident Evil 2 is a good example, since it's getting a remake.
>>343864163
You're being retarded on purpose, not being able to see the illusion is what makes it an illusion and not a façade or a fake.
>>343862379
Kara no Shoujo felt a hell of a lot like it.
>>343862379
Pretty much every roguelike.
>>343862379
Looks like a crazy version of Sonic Adventure DX.
>>343864487
You're getting mad over semantics anon, while ignoring what the terminology is meant to represent.
Who's the retard here, really?
fucking when?
>>343861349
the "trick" only works if you're actively wanting it to work on yourself. everyone else sees it as a pointless excuse just so the game can claim that it has choices.
>>343863161
60 hours of gameplay is 60 hours of gameplay whether it's one 640 hour route or 3 20 hour ones. what most games do is make about 6 hours of story and then pad it out with 54 hours of sidequests disguised as "non-linear progession." the kind of garbage where you have to collect 4 space widgets and each one is in a different town and each town is full of people waiting for you to do their chores for them.
>>343863545
games with illusion of choice have lazy shit writing. completely linear games require good writing so people don't get bored or feel like their character is acting retarded. illusion of choice games hide behind the "roleplaying" excuse to give you the most basic outline of a plot and then making the player come up with character motivation and everything else.
>>343865051
You are, as you are blatantly misinterpreting the terminology.
>>343865390
Illusion of Choice is a term meant to represent a situation in which an individual is not actually given as many options as they appear to have, as many of their options simply result in the same result. This is seen as poor design in games with branching routes, as it's just a poor way of trying to trick the player into believing that their choices mattered, and that the game has more depth than it actually has. While this facade may hold up for a single playthrough, it usually results in a game having very little replay value (see: Beyond: Two Souls)
>No developer will ever do another Raw Danger/Disaster Report 2 where you play as multiple characters where the decisions you make with one character effect how another character's story progresses
I prefer this.
>>343867976
Sorry, my screen doesn't have enough black pixels to go around and show the whole image, what is this a picture of?
Two is best, but I recognize it's really hard
As in, hard enough that probably no games can do it properly anymore, and it's something that's relegated to the realm of choose-your-own-adventure games, like the Choice Of games
>>343866521
My nigga. I played one of the Disaster Report games when I was younger, it was the one where you're trapped in a flooding underground city.
It was a really unique experience
>>343854984
Fuck three so much
4 is best case senario when there is a two sided story
2 is Kirby Superstar or Snes Mario whihc is fine by me
>>343855714
>Shadow the hedgehog
>>343868080
nigga, ur screen is racist
1 looks like the "Hunter" rune from Bloodborne and it also is the same game path of Bloodborne. Everything remains the same throughout the game until you choose one of 3 endings.
I wonder why western devs don't do this more often?
