Because they care about character and story
Also.
>>343311837
They have no creative limitations like western devs usually have due to audience and SWJ garbage. Kaz is most defiantly one of the best written,voiced, and designed characters I have seen in vidya for a while
>>343312456
NIGGER
Westerners take themselves too seriously, in general.
Japs recognize fiction as fiction and just have fun with it while giving a message at the same time.
Also Castellanos was alpha as fuck.
>>343311837
Might be true but you picked a pretty piss poor example with anything Kojima related
>>343311837
They don't go OUT OF THEIR WAY to design them as ugly as they possibly can to not trigger someone.
>>343313693
Easily Kojima's best character. Not even a competition.
>>343311837
>make a jap
>write him as a white supremacist
Pfffft hahaha are you weebs serious? For every good Japanese character there are a 1000 shitty ones that use tired clichés like shy blond girl, tsundere brown girl, stupid but brave warrior, stern and brooding leader, underdog that ends up being the best of the best and the list goes on and on.
TLDR stop deluding yourselves weebs
>>343314572
The problem is that Jap games and stories are still better on average compared to Western stuff, nobody ever said they're perfect.
>>343311837
Kojima is one of the few exceptions
Other than him japanese can't write for shit
Japanese are better at gameplay, westerners are better at story/dialogue
>>343314572
>tldr for a single line
Retarded AND projecting.
Also 1000 characters > 3 westacuck characters
>>343314858
I cant remember the last Western vidya story i was seriously impressed with, what do you recommend?
Then again I do like Bioshock
>>343314858
>westerners are better at story/dialogue
Ok, let's give them this at the very least.
>>343315086
i wouldnt.
Hell I dont think there's one Western game that hits the same notes as Drakengard or even Nier
Not true, it almost always boils down to the power of friendship or some sort of power level competition between vampire god demon kings or whatever.
>>343315254
>MGS
>Drakengard/Nier
>Ico
>Shadow of the Collosus
>Armored Core
>Souls/Bloodborne
nah
>>343315427
Anon are you aware of the output in videogames that Japan has? Those are less than the 1% of their games.
I don't have a bias but the truth is that in average western games are better than Japanese games in almost every department. On the other hand when a Japanese manages to be great it is almost always better than any western game, but these are few.
>>343315805
I'd say its exactly the opposite.
Jap has better games on average, but whenever the West decides to stop being shit for one second we get some real gems. Like Frozen Synapse.
The Western audience only plays Western games and the Western audience has extremely low standards for good writing. They think shit like Bioshock Infinite and Gone Home are masterpieces. There may be good Western writers, but few will use their skills on videogames because that's not respectable, and the writers who aren't good enough write a good movie, show or novel will write videogames, where they will be praised no matter what shit they come up with.
>>343311837
>muh revenge
wow so deep
also 99% of jap characters:
>teenager
>dead family
>has a rival
>gary stu
99% of jap stories
>something something god
>end of world
>villain goes 'muh power'
>hero goes 'muh friends' or 'muh mankind'
>>343316458
99% of western stories
>muh muhreens
>muh family
>muh zombies
>>343316443
oh please, eastern audience thinks FF has good writing, their standards are even lower
>>343316458
99% of Western characters
>standard issue white guy
>..
>..
>..
99% of Western stories
>Save America
>..
>..
>..
Thet don't.
Also, good writers don't have to settle for writing video game scripts.
>>343316935
nah there's good things to be done with the videogame medium, the interactivity allows for stories that simply wouldn't work in a book or movie
its just that the game industry, both east and west is swamped with movie and tv rejects that just write sub-par movie scripts rather than videogame scripts
>>343314572
majority of western characters use tired cliches too
>>343316781
>>standard issue white guy
you forgot his asian girlfriend too
>>343316760
Nice retort when the OP has an image of actual japanese standards for good story
>>343317132
the fact that you consider the op a standard for a good story only serves to prove the eastern standards are just as bad or even worse than the western ones
We should reach the peaceful conclusion that writing in videogames is on average pretty bad regardless of it being western or Japanese.
But then you faggots wouldn't be able to shitpost all day so this isn't going to happen.
>>343314572
The same goes for the west though, and even then when something legitamately good comes out it's rare
>>343317330
Its true, but then some guy will bring up books as if they arent equally full of shit. They've just been around longer.
>>343316781
>Save America
Are you implying that the west has anything worth saving besides America?
>>343315016
try MotB faam
>>343317439
what the fuck is wrong with her torso
>>343317439
Their civilization
>>343317439
within 15 years this country will be a joke
>>343311992
>>343312456
>>343313429
>>343313937
Retarded weebs
>>343317439
butter face
>>343311837
Kaz is the exception to the rule because im having trouble thinking of even one character that is overall as good as Kaz out of japanese games
everything else is a combination of looking like shit and being written like shit, mostly because in japan every protagonist needs to be a pretty boy with a big sword
Immeaditely thinking of the best characters in gaming I harken to max payne, isaac clarke, kreia from kotor, western games in general tend to have more varied and interesting characters outside of the le white man with beard meme because that actually is how your average white male looks
>>343317392
nah videogames, at the moment, are worse off than books because to many folks in the game industry don't write for games, they write books or movies then try to fit them into a game
once the writers fully use the uniqueness of the medium it can mature
i think japanese developers excel at many things westerners don't understand, but characterization generally isn't one of them. i mean, maybe if you're on the autism spectrum and have a poor understand of human emotion and interaction, you might prefer characters whose motives are laid out like a math equation rather than an actual realistic, emotionally complex, often contradictory character who is difficult to discern.
>>343314882
>1000 shitty characters to deal with vs only 3 shitty characters to deal with
>>343311837
>Why are the Japs so much better at creating/writing characters ?
hmmm no they got interesting concept at times but they end up making them too cheesy or melodramatic usually it always end up becoming extremely try hard edgy and pretentious
>>343311837
99% of Japanese character are cliches
>>343311837
you have got to be fucking baiting
>>343317330
Movies aren't any better. Martian was an over hyped piece of trash that pandered to China like most movies now. Super hero movies were never good
>>343317638
Max Payne is good
Issac isnt even a character until DS2
Kreia is just some old schizophrenic
>>343312456
oh yeah he shared the same VA with travis
>>343316781
>standard issue white guy
ah you are one of those people.
opinion discarded
>>343317710
and Western ones aren't?
>>343317690
WEEBS BTFO
>>343313429
>Westerners take themselves too seriously, in general.
FUCKING THIS.
>>343311837
>muh revenge
>>343317845
its just the fact of things
like Jap games are 99% highschoolers
>>343311837
They're not. In the case of Kojima, all his characters are based on amalgamations of western ones. In the case of all other devs, it's mostly the same.
>>343316781
don't forgot them hard decisions and moral grey areas MUH REALITY IS HARSH
Japan generally likes and embraces the absurd in their media.
Murrica generally prefer things they can relate to.
>>343317908
>westerners take their work too seriously
>when japs will commit sudoku when they fuck up even a little bit
Where's that picture of Japanese vs Western work ethic when you need it?
>>343317084
>both east and west is swamped with movie and tv rejects that just write sub-par movie scripts rather than videogame scripts
No,assuming we're talking about japs since most eastern games com from them, then this mentality is wrong.
Westerners are the only ones who see movies as some higher artform.
In the east their movies aren't necessarily something they see in the same light, and while you can get some masterful movies from them they don't automatically suck off the medium to high heaven like we do in the west.
I belive there there's a better chance for a story to succeed in any medium because they don't prioritize one over the other.
>>343317330
>We should reach the peaceful conclusion that writing in videogames is on average pretty bad regardless of it being western or Japanese.
smart people know this. dumb people who believe in shitpost are sad
>>343317690
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>>343317439
this is where /pol/ thread starts
>>343318123
yeh because black and white is so compelling and hard to write
>>343317690
DELETU DISS PREASE!
>>343318239
oh please MGS is pretty much the shining example of movie reject syndrome
both sides suffer from it
>>343318357
Its just that Westerners make such a big deal about "grey morality" like they just discovered fire.
>>343318357
It doesn't help that in westerngames where you're given the "grey" morality situation in a story it will always end on one and of the black/white spectrum.
So in the end all is for naught.
This is the enemy... and he's here on his knees!
>>343318531
oh the other hand the almost manic aversion to morally grey stories on the eastern side hamstrings the depth of their storytelling badly
They're good at premises, both for actual characters and stories, but the follow-through for both is generally awful. Maybe it's a cultural thing where they just have a different idea of what storytelling entails, but it is almost always unsatisfying.
>>343318615
i dunno, most Jap games i've enjoyed make plenty use of "grey morality" without jerking themselves off for it.
Games like Armored Core, Drakengard, SoTC, etc.
>>343318558
The Last Of Us's ending was the definition of grey morality
>MGS5 will never have 6 hour cutscenes
>>343318615
Star Fox Zero was horrible about this. There are a lot of eastern villains who just spout a line or two about "do you really know what justice means" without any followup and the audience seems to be expected to be impressed by that.
>>343319116
isnt Star Fox a kids game
>>343318436
>Mgs
>one series
>movie reject syndrome
Kojima simply likes movies so he incorporates them into his work. It's like any other dev throwing Easter eggs to whatever they like.
It's heavily influenced his style but it's not like he ever went into the industry.
Besides, most of his innovations are things that could only be achived through this medium,I doubt someone soley focused on recreating movies could do that.
>>343319175
so was wind waker but ganondorf in that game actually managed to be an interesting, somewhat sympathetic villain
>>343319175
Batman cartoons are also for kids, and they can scrounge up an actual moral dilemma once in a while.
>>343318598
Man, that scene pissed me off because I wanted to drown Huey, not let his sociopathic ass go free
>>343318770
Eh not really,we couldn't be sure they could've found a cute with Ellie.
It pretty much becomes
>potentially save the world
Or
>save my new daughter
Not a hard choice
>>343311837
>>343319336
you mean the series that couldn't tell a 3 word story without a 5 hour cutscene?
>>343311837
He is so undercooked in MGSV. It still hurts
>>343311837
>Why are the Japs so much better at creating/writing characters
JAJAJAAJAJAJAJAJA
>>343319726
Have you actually played an mgs game or are you just spouting memes you heard about it?
>>343319641
uncanny
>>343320212
overexaggerations seem to be the rule for this thread
but lets be honest here MGS games are NOT good at using gameplay to tell a story, nor are their stories particularly high quality to begin with
As people here have already said, Japan and the West are both pretty bad when it comes to gaming stories and characters. Just in their own ways
>>343319726
The length of cutscenes doesn't automatically mean he's a movie reject.
So what if he stretches it out a bit,shouldn't matter much when the gameplay and ideas implemented into it are still interesting and take up more time than said cutscenes.
That would be like saying Xenogears,FFX,Kingdom hearts or any other eastern game is a movie reject because of their length
>>343320360
Firstly, I didn't ask for your retarded opinion. Also 99% of games don't tell a story through gameplay alone so faulting mgs for not doing it is fucking stupid. Also none of this proves how mgs is a 'movie reject series' like you idiotically declared.
>>343320668
the length of the cutscenes isn't the only thing that matters
what also matters is just how integral the cutscenes are to the story
also games like FFX and Kingdom Hearts are in fact movie reject games
I was just thinking the opposite this morning, I was like "why are japanese so shit at story and writing?" wait...no, I didn't say that, I said "why are the japs so shit at optimization?" I was playing Senran Kagura Shinovi Versus on PC and it stutters sometimes and I hear people say their's is buttery smooth and I am just like WTF?
>>343321213
the story literally doesn't make any sense without the cutscenes and the information conveyed in the cutscenes couldn't be properly conveyed in any other way
furthermore often it feels like much of the story is on "pause" until the next cutscene
and lets not forget the story feels entirely as if it was a movie someone later added gameplay to
>>343321480
>literally
There's that word again
Yes, mgs has cutscenes if you really think a game delivering a narrative to you via cutscene means they wanted to make a movie instead you are an actual retard. Also why do you keep trying to pass off your dumbass opinions as if they are some source to back up what you're saying? Am I arguing against fucking tumblr?
>>343321294
>also games like FFX and Kingdom Hearts are in fact movie reject games
Oh,I see I took some bait then
So what you propose games without cutscenes then?
I understood why you'd think Kojima was a reject due to his use of cinematography in his works.
But KH and FF? You've gotta be kidding me. Half of FF games tell their stories through text and you can't quantify something's gameplay to cutscene ratio when some of that gameplay relies on random encounters.
Mother fucking Nagito.
>>343321480
>the story literally doesn't make any sense without the cutscenes and the information conveyed in the cutscenes couldn't be properly conveyed in any other way
First of all, all you're doing is saying the reason why cutscenes exist, it doesn't point out a problem.
But then you're saying all games are movie rejects because practically every game with a story to tell used cutscenes
>>343319479
I certainly found a cute with Ellie
>>343317690
It's like poetry
>>343322856
>left
>uncanny renders trying to be photorealistic with grey/blue/brown filters
>right
>color,imaginative design,unique otherworldly atmosphere and heart
>>343311837
Cause Sugita can voice them
>>343322856
>implying realistic means better
Go live IRL
>>343322856
>left
>shit games
