Did you play Peace Walker before MGSV? If you haven't, you are in no position to complain how large of a departure MGSV is from the rest of the series. It's probably the most important game in the series for understanding everything in MGSV. You fuckers probably don't know you can take Paz to the beach and do lewd things to her in the love box.
>>343122604
I did. Peace Walker was shit, too
PW worked because of the platform and how areas were structured. The same system in PW will not work on platforms that are far more capable than the PSP. Open world is a meme
>>343122604
don't care, v and pw are both the cancer of the series
PW was way better than MGSV
>co-op
>actual boss fights
>no helicopter rides
>main ops with an actual structured story
>much, much more variety in the side ops
>better story
>tapes only used to add more info and not explain crucial story parts (aside from the final secret one)
>way better characters (anyone on MSF >>> everyone on DD)
>much better level design not plagued by open world shit
How they dropped the ball so hard coming from a PSP game of all things I'll never understand
Peace Walker worked well because:
>Monster Hunter-esque level design worked well due to it being a portable game
>Grind isn't as bad as MGSV
>Bossfights were exactly like Monster Hunter fights
>Fulton didn't alarm guards as long as you put them to sleep, you could fulton fucking everything in sight better than MGSV
>Co-op
>real-life weapons instead of fictional weapons like MGSV
It was a fun portable title.
MGSV sucks
I used to love PW but recently came back to it and couldn't play it. V completely blows it out of the water. The shit like "more mission variety" or whatever is irrelevant. V is 100x more fun
To anyone who hates MGSV: Did you enjoy MGS 4? Do you think it's a great game? You do?I thought you would, your opinion is now discarded, you /tv/faggot
>>343123036
>it's a /v/ goes full retard in the sake of being contrarian episode
You'd have to be high to think PW has better level design than V. I swear y'all shitpost about the dumbest things
>>343122604
I did, it was bad too. Now what?
>>343122604
I played Peace Walker before and was also disappointed by it.
>>343123636
I've never played 4. It's still not on PC
>MGS V managed to be worse than a hand-held title with grinding, mediocre boss fights, shitty controls and an okay story
The pain won't ever go away
>>343122893
This. I used to love the idea of playing an open world game where I have control but then I steadily grew to despise it (mostly due to Ubisoft games) and now every time I hear about a game being open world I get a little sick. The MGS series is far more interesting as a linear game.
I can already tell Death Stranding will be open world. Let's hope it isn't shit.
>>343123962
Umm yes it is?
Ever heard of YouTube?
>>343124184
>I can already tell Death Stranding will be open world. Let's hope it isn't shit.Please no.
From a purely gameplay point of view, MGSV feels and plays better than PW, but PW is a better designed game and was more enjoyable to play.
>>343123036
>>343123491
to add on to these, I'll use an analogy
PW is like a top tier college athlete while MGSV is like a mediocre professional athlete. Sure, the professional athlete would rek the college athlete one on one, but against other pros, the pro athlete sucks, while against other college athletes, the college athlete holds their own better than most.
>>343125505
what an awful analogy. MGSV is a great game and much better than PW
>>343125505
That's a pretty good analogy.
>>343125505
'Tis an awesome analogy!
>>343123790
You know he's right, why deny it?
>>343125656
familia, I liked and enjoyed MGSV for what it was, but pound for pound, it's probably the worst Metal Gear game in the series.
like said here
>>343124674
Phantom Pain is a better game in that the controls are more polished and it feels and plays better than Peace Walker, but it falls short in pretty much everything else.
Peace Walker was a portable game designed for a shitty PSP and excels in what it set out to do.
Phantom Pain was an unfinished AAA next-gen game that fell victim to the open world meme and somehow had a worse story, less variety, and lacked all of the charm of what makes a MGS game a MGS game in comparison.
Peace Walker was still bad
>>343123962
I envy you
Peace Walker was clearly designed as a handheld game, with gameplay design adjusted to suit. Instead of a large cohesive area to explore and gain access to, as was the norm for MGS, it had short, mainly linear levels and a home base. The gameplay was more segmented, which works better for pick-up-and-play situations. Borrowing from the success of Monster Hunter, it was also based around 4 player multiplayer, with very MH-inspired bosses. There was a big focus on collecting resources, which you could allocate back at the base in a somewhat addicting progression minigame. It worked out fairly well, they were able to bring MGS to a handheld in a way that worked.
It was a big mistake to base MGSV on all that, though. Awful idea. By building on the changes they made in peace walker, V lost almost all resemblance to MGS1-4. That includes most of the things I loved about the older MGS games.
Peace Walker is rubbish. It's pretty much a joke trying to go back to that game after V. And what's worse there are people who honestly think Peace Walker is better? what a laugh.
>>343124132
>shitty controls
What
>>343124184
Ubishit ruined open world games for everyone.
>>343125505
Actually surprised by your analogy, bretty gud, and it's not even about fuckingfood.
>>343122686
fpbp
>>343122604
I went out of my way to never play a single MGS game in my life, but i'm still going to complain. Come at me, nigger.
>>343129158
nah, you can do open world without falling for the same mistakes Ubi did. V is evidence of that
>/v/ has this sever of a mob mentality
Sickening.
>>343132310
>defending a game objectively inferior to previous ones in the series
coming from a guy whose first metal gear was V i can definitely say 2 and 3 blow it out of the water
>>343133013
>objectively
That's not what that means newfag.
>>343133272
okay, let me reword it for you since it's got your panties all up in a bunch
v sucked and 2 and 3 were better, in my humble opinion
I dont see the point of bitching about TPP so much when MGS2 was the best the series ever got
I was enjoying the fuck out of MGSV for the first half of it, maybe first two thirds even, but after Skullface died and the repeat mission filler started and it became clear that I had entered the unfinished part of the game, I quickly lost enthusiasm and now I'm struggling to even bother to complete it. The annoying "people online can rob your resources and staff while you sleep" mechanic that they jokingly call multiplayer certainly doesn't help.
So yeah, could have been great, crippled at the finishing line by lack of at least six more months of polish and some really bad individual ideas.
>>343123036
>>343123491
No seriously, how does a dev make such a 180º turn and ends up with something better on a handheld while the big console one gets completely fucked? The onyl good thing to come out of TPP was the engine and that will never be used for anything but soccer games and pachinko.
I honestly don't know why the fuck people are hyped about Kojima new game, it even has the first warnings going up with him only showing a goddamn teaser from his game, a fucking teaser that made zero fucking sense in every single way, I seriously thought I was watching a french art house project
>>343131584
>V is evidence of that
Fucking how? Going from base to base with literally nothing in between, because the animals outside of a few jackass and mules are all going to be caught using that shitty trap box, how is that good? Even the bases are fucking useless since they are manned by the same 6-8 guys with the only difference being if they have or not some extra armor, no tanks, apcs or anything if you attack, at most you will get a helicopter very late in the game.
Ubi with their craptacular games at the very least has the decency of putting actual things to do around in the world when you're not going for the next mission, MGSV has no such thing, you will only ever have something worthwile to do on the bases or in the area right outside the fucking base
>>343136085
Because V controls like a good game. UBI games are shitty outside of a million carrots dangling around that you do the same thing over and over to get. V actually gives you options and is constantly evaluating you on how you perform, wrapped in one of the most complete shooting experiences released in a long while
>>343136085
I have a hard time even calling MGSV an open world game precisely because there is so little to do that calling it a world is a stretch. It's... more like a mission-based game where all the mission maps are connected to one larger map for some reason.
>>343136323
Nigger, are we talking about controls or the fucking open world aspect? Because that is what I was talking about, MGSV somehow fails even harder than fucking Ubisoft in that department, I don't give a flying fuck if the game controls fine, that is to be fucking expected from the previous games also
>pped in one of the most complete shooting experiences released in a long while
The fuck does this even mean? Can you even speak in anything not drone-speak? It was a goddamn TPS and the shooting mechanics were the exact same as all others or do you consider changing the camera side a ground breaking technology?
>is constantly evaluating you on how you perform
Oh yeah the game that evaluated how you played by how fucking fast you could complete a mission, that was only patched so that being stealthy AFTER Kojima left, so being fast and only fast, being stealthy in a stealthy game be damned, was how Lord Kojima originally intended
>games are shitty outside of a million carrots dangling around that you do the same thing over and over to get
ANd that is still far better than having literally nothing to do outside of a mission, there is zero incentive to do anything outside missions IN A FUCKING OPEN WORLD GAME
>>343137035
Except all of the other MGS games have had middling controls at best. The open world works because it's a great showcase for how the game plays. And the gameplay is great because of how freeform it is
>there is zero incentive to do anything outside missions
False. The reason the game works so well is exactly because of how every action you do is accounted for in some way
>>343137620
Amazing, you literally cannot write as anything but a drone, you forge tthat previous games had pressure sensitive mechanics to do a bunch of interesting shit, to interrogate someone you couldn't push to hard the buttom or you killed them, same for haging or ledges, but those are middling controls at best right? Those are all superfulous things, its far better to just press a buttom for the awesome thing to happen right?
>The open world works because it's a great showcase for how the game plays
Well I guess the game is a horse racing game since what is showcased is you mounting your horse and running from location to location to start the next mission, do you know what else showcases the way a game plays? A mission if you're so fucking retarded that you cannot understand how a game plays by the first goddamn mission you have some pretty serious problems
>False. The reason the game works so well is exactly because of how every action you do is accounted for in some way
Right, because after esactly 5 attacks anywhere using the exact same tactic and the game making a token attempt by giving your braindead enemies armor or goggles is a ground breaking new technology
Here let me show you a new ground breaking technology never seen before, don't tell anyone I showed you this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMYso30L9zI
>>343137620
>False
It's true actually.
If you disagree, feel free to list the useful things you can do outside missions. Fuck, I'll even help you out by posting what I've got:
- Collecting plants (quickly becomes meaningless because you get such pitiful amounts of them by picking them up manually)
- Finding wild animals for you to tranq and fulton (only matters while you're working towards the "collect all animals" trophy, the rewards are pitiful)
- Finding random good soldiers to tranq and fulton (pointless because you'll have much better opportunities to do the same thing during missions)
- Finding cassette tapes, posters or delivery vouchers (pointless after you quickly find them all, also the rewards aren't even good)
>>343138418
>you forge tthat previous games had pressure sensitive mechanics to do a bunch of interesting shit
Pressure sensitive inputs are the worst fucking thing in the world, don't even attempt to pretend like they're a good thing.
>>343137620
Can you answer either
>>343138418
>>343138497
of those without spouting those platitutes that dance around the questions?
>>343122604
Peace Walker was easily my least favorite up to the point, and finding out that MGSV was Peace Walker.05 made if even worse. Peace Walker is laughably bad. It's not even a stealth game.
>>343139012
Hey what can I say, I hate Far Cry because everything feels so disconnected, whereas in V everything is connected and centered around polished shooting mechanics
>>343138497
Everything feeds into your FOB inventory which is used to help attack and defend other players, which ties into one of the central plot points of the story.
>>343139096
How is it not a stealth game?
>>343139340
>Everything feeds into your FOB inventory which is used to help attack and defend other players, which ties into one of the central plot points of the story.
Holy shit man, does Kojima pay you to defend this peace of shit?
>>343139340
>How is it not a stealth game?
PW/TPP are just action games with Stealth features
GZ is the only one where Stealth is actively encouraged and supported by the game design itself.
/v/ hates so many games that at this point it doesn't even matter what you play.
At least /mu/ has a coherent idea of what good vs bad music is; /v/ is just a mess of edgy teenagers hating on anything popular and/or they don't own and/or can't play.
>>343139501
what, not enough cutscenes for you?
>>343139340
M8 this isn't healthy what the fuck
>>343139612
There have been a billion valid examinations on why MGSV is a bad game.
Almost none on why its not.
The thing is you can still like a game even if its bad, so I dont get why people want to defend MGSV so much. I say this as a Drakengard fan.
>>343139340
>Everything feeds into your FOB inventory which is used to help attack and defend other players, which ties into one of the central plot points of the story.
Except if you try to grind using the base game you're fucked since you will never get a decent amount using what you gather manually, you need the MP component and only the MP component and that is completely disconnected with the story
>>343139578
I almost cried when I realized that Ground Zeroes was a better MGS game than Phantom Pain.
>>343139975
>Almost none on why its not.
>>343139987
How is the MP not connected to the story, where you play a cross between Big Boss and a clone of Big Boss in a world where a collective of PFs have risen after the events of GZ?
I've played all MG games except for portable ops and the original MG1 and MG2 and I got to say, MGSV is, after all, my favorite game in the series
at first I liked MGS3 better, but now, after 100+ hours in it I love almost everything about this game
>>343139975
>>343140150
>Almost none on why its not.
>>343140150
>>343140245
lol are you serious
>>343139975
>>343140150
>>343140245
>Almost none on why its not.
>>343139975
are you a literal retard? you better be
>muh favorite youtuber don't like it ;_;
>>343139975
The only reason that it's a bad game is because it didn't live up to the ridiculous hype that fanboys built up around it. When just judging it as another game it's great
>>343122604
I have played Peace Walker, it fucking sucks.
1>V>=3>power gap>2>4>power gap>Peace Walker
Reminder that MGSVfags are on the same level as RE6fags in terms of sheer delusion.
>>343140516
kill yourself
>>343139612
>At least /mu/ has a coherent idea of what good vs bad music is
no, they don't, they worship Grimes, Kanye, Death Grips, AnCo, etc. While they have some cool songs they aren't next holy grail of music
The same goes for /lit/, if you love literature stay out of that place, the same applies to almost every interest you may have, but yeah, /v/ is the worst of all those boards
>>343140532
I bet 4 was your favorite lol
Every fucking thread has the same
>muh perfect gameplay
And the gameplay is a copy of SC Blacklist but worse in some ways. TPP has one of the worst cover mechanics for example.
It also doesn't matter if the game controls well when there's no level design to speak of.
>>343140394
this, mgsv is fucking amazing
>>343140637
>no, they don't, they worship Grimes, Kanye, Death Grips, AnCo, etc.
If you're going to argue any of those are Bad then you're clearly an idiot.
![18j3z5wzvmtwwjpg[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/XPIcD6o.jpg "18j3z5wzvmtwwjpg[1].jpg")
I´ve played Peace walker a lot , in fact burned 300 hours into that game. thanks to the mon hun syndrome i had back when i got my PSP.
This didn´t make TPP any better. every character got killed offscreen. Story was the biggest let down of my life.
Game was fine in terms of gameplay and controls. but the empty world and after realizing the story is such a shitshow, it just ruined the whole game for me.
also Quiet being the most useless irrelevant character in MEtal gear History.
At least Cecile was pure waifu material.
People praising MGSV are nothing but casuals that started the series with this game without knowing all of the stuff that the game shat on.
Ocelot doesnt even use revolver for god´s sake.
>>343140757
>then you're clearly an idiot.
don't be mad faggy, come back when you acquire some taste
>>343139340
>Everything feeds into your FOB inventory
And none of it matters worth shit. The best way to get resources for FOBs is to run FOB missions and ignore the "main game".
Also there is no story content anywhere in FOBs so people who care about the story have no reason to even touch that side of the game.
There is just so goddamn little to do in MGSV's world, so little life in it, that they could have easily removed the whole "open world" aspect and just had you pick from a list of missions. Which most people actually do, they deploy from the helicopter and return to the helicopter and don't freeroam. Why would they? There's nothing for you to find so there's no point in exploring.
>>343140394
Judging it from a purely mechanical standpoint, MGSV is really just barely above average.
I think people only hype it up because Kojima stamped his name all over it. MGSV isnt doing anything Ubisoft hasnt been doing in the past 10 years. If you actually play games this is painfully obvious.
And I think the MGSV's story is actually pretty decent, for Kojima anyways.
3 > 1 >= 2 > 4 > PW > V
>>343140892
Check my RYM kid, I have better taste than you: https://rateyourmusic.com/~boldfaure
>>343140904
Main game missions are good way to get soldiers and materials without fucking up your FOB record, not to mention doing missions for the scores and to level up your soldiers.
The open world may not be littered with a bunch of cutscenes and scripted events, but that doesn't mean there's nothing to do. The game is substantial where it counts, in the core gameplay mechanics
>>343140768
>also Quiet being the most useless irrelevant character in MEtal gear History.
Quiet is super useful, mechanically speaking.
>>343140910
Please. V shits all over anything Ubisoft has done in the last 10 years
>>343141231
a DLC tier game like FarCry Blood Dragon handled open world better than MGSV, dont even start that shit about games you havent played.
>>343141098
>https://rateyourmusic.com/~boldfaure
>5* beatles and beach boys
this is an 18+ board kid, leave now
also
>RYM
lol
>>343141349
Blood Dragon was also 8 hours long. FarCry has always been shit with sluggish controls and poorly implemented mechanics with sluggish controls. And the shooting is garbage
>>343141231
Why did Kojima copy Blacklist so much then?
>>343141206
she exists to make the game easy, like almost every one of MGSVs "features"
>>343140910
>MGSV isnt doing anything Ubisoft hasnt been doing in the past 10 years.
this is /v/ for you, people don't even try anymore, just shitpost all day
>>343141131
>The open world may not be littered with a bunch of cutscenes and scripted events, but that doesn't mean there's nothing to do
But there is nothing to do.
Only thing that resembles exploration with a good payoff in MGSV's open world mode is finding Tsuchinokos or some other super-rare animal. And finding those employs the worst mechanic possible: setting up a ton of traps in some extremely specific spot and hoping you randomly catch it instead of eight useless gerbils. You can't even properly hunt for them because the rarest animals are invisible and can only be hunted with traps; you just spam traps and hope for the best.
Presumably side ops were intended to be the "life" of the open world, yet who the fuck wanders around the map, hoping to run into a side op, when it makes much more sense to just deploy to the correct location from the helicopter?
>>343141485
It has more freedom and better sound design than Blacklist
>>343141659
I guess I should be fair.
Ubisoft never based an entire game around slapping balloons on everything.
>>343141637
To be fair, that's true of almost every MGS game.
>2016
>not frying motherfuckers with the power of thunder
you guys just don't know how to have fun
>>343141727
>But there is nothing to do.
Infiltrate and capture resources, get into firefights and do missions for performance scores with different loadouts. Then there's base management and FOB grinding. Face it, if you think there's nothing to do you just have bad imagination.
And why would you only do one side op per deployment??? that's just dumb
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhlG_lDdbe4
>1:40 to show all weapons and equipments in the game
>don't even cover buddies
>don't even cover weapon customization
/v/ is just full of shit, like aways
God I fucking hate all of you. I remember when I used to get excited for MGS threads and now it's all MUH DISSAPPOINTMENT MUH PUSSY HURTS MUH TRAILERS memeing now.
>>343141472
>ignored all my other choices
This is an 18+ website kid.
>>343141950
>And why would you only do one side op per deployment??? that's just dumb
Why would I do more than one? The chopper doesn't cost that much to call, and I'd rather not have to sprint ten minutes through empty wasteland with nothing in it.
>>343142285
There's a horse and cars. Not to fucking mention you can just go to the menu and teleport to the heli after it autosaves (it does after every mission of any kind). I find it funny how /v/ strokes their dick over RDR but with MGSV it's empty and you have to sprint everywhere.
>>343142285
>If there isn't something awesome happening all the time then it's shit. Why should I have to plan in order to optimize my experience?
There's Vehicles, D-Horse, and even fast travel you know
Peace walker was fun and had the metal gear feel. Mgs5 had a bad story and felt generic and very unmgs like
>>343142117
Quality over quantity.
There could be twice as many guns and it wouldn't mean anything if you don't want to use them or if they're generally the same.
>>343142586
They aren't all generally the same though
>>343140245
>>343140353
do you seriously base your opinions on reviewers?
>>343142662
An assault rifle is an assault rifle.
And at the end of the day, I just use the Tranq pistol.
>>343141745
Blacklist has more verticality to it's levels and levels that are actually designed to be completed in various ways.
>>343142783
so you're shit at the game then ok
>>343142827
>im shit at the game for not bothering with meme weapons and being efficient
>these are the people who try to tell you about """good games""""
>>343142817
and yet it's still more restrictive with its linearity and much smaller toolset. Not to mention lack of base building metagame
>>343141950
>Infiltrate and capture resources,
You can do this during missions just fine. Admittedly, there were times during the early game where I would storm the relay station just to fulton the 7500 fuel, gut after you unlock FOBs the best way to get resources becomes doing whatever is the current FOB event.
>get into firefights and do missions for performance scores with different loadouts.
Pointless. Also, missions are not a part of the open world.
>Then there's base management and FOB grinding.
We're discussing the open world here. Those are not a part of it.
Let me clarify so that it's perfectly clear what we're talking about: the empty area between mission locations. The vast nothingness between the various bases where the actual game happens. That's what we're discussing here. And that is full of no content and not fun and probably should have been cut entirely.
>>343142149
Yeah, we should all just delude ourselves into thinking the game is flawless.
>>343142936
>Not to mention lack of base building metagame
As if that wasnt the most useless part of MGSV
>>343142932
except there are more efficient choices than the tranq pistol in different situations
>>343142719
>I'll base my opinion on people that agree with me and shout down people who don't
>HOW DARE YOU DO THE SAME THING
WEW
>>343122604
I thought Peace Walker was shit but MGSV is fun. Though I only really hated Peace Walker for looking and playing shittier than MGS3 and the bosses being bullet sponges. I didn't mind the motherbase management or side-op mission aspect of it.
>>343143042
Yea, like staying out of sight.
This is supposed a stealth game you know. Or did I miss something?
>>343143015
well then it's dumb to complain that the open world doesn't carry the game while also acknowledging that there's more to the game outside of it. It's just a different way to dick around and do something quicker than a full fledged mission
>>343143043
you're the same kind of people who shitpost exclusives with metacritic ratings
>>343140245
Time gave MGSV a 100?
Welp, pack it in folks, none of you amateur reviewers mean dick.
>>343143015
>Yeah, we should all just delude ourselves into thinking the game is flawless.
You are a fucking bitch. When did I say that? How did I imply that at all? I just want to talk about the games instead of see the same bitching every day. Kill yourself, I could not care less if you liked MGSV or not.
>>343143042
Like the tranq sniper or stun rifle? Stealth non lethal is always the most efficient.
>>343143016
It's sort of the thing that ties the game together, actually
>>343143148
You can stay out of sight while blasting motherfuckers left and right you know. Just go for nonlethal shots.
It's faster than crawling around and lining up your shots. And if you want a challenge infiltrate a FOB
>>343143257
>I could not care less if you liked MGSV or not.
you're doing a pretty bad job of it my dude
>>343143209
>I'm going to accuse you of something I think you do after I get BTFO.
Okay friend, just remember that jaded faggots on /v/ and Reddit agreeing with you means jack shit.
The fact that I can go on various other forums and screencap people agreeing with me means all you're doing is putting yourself in an echo chamber, much like how you just tried to shout me down by accusing me of something that isn't even on topic.
>>343142434
>>343142435
Only reason to use any of those is if during a mission you have to move a long distance. There is no reason whatsoever to travel BETWEEN mission using them, when chopper will just effectively teleport you where you need to go (you have to watch the boring chopper ride animation, but it's still faster and less effort than fucking horseback).
More to the point: I don't want to travel through MGSV's shitty ass boring world. That's kind of the problem we're discussing here. Its world outside mission areas is shitty and boring and has nothing cool in it that would make it worthwhile to manually traverse. The game itself seems to agree, given how easy it makes to just skip all that with the heli.
>>343143370
>It's sort of the thing that ties the game together, actually
Not really, it got in the way of what actually mattered which is the stealth.
I would rather have VR missions than whatever the fuck he was trying to do with Mother Base.
>>343143339
>Stealth non lethal is always the most efficient.
It's slow and no penetration.
Just go with a silenced macht and body shot/wormhole anyone who gets in your way boom. Or use the lightning arm, or knock people out with decoys I don't know. But the idea that there's a specific optimal way to play the game 100% of the time is just false
>the shooting is the same as all others in the series
actually my friend, they added bullet drop since ground zeros, if you knew metal gear at all you'd have noticed because you can't scope them with the binoculars, switch and headshot with tranq anymore.
as for thread topic the only thing I didn't like about PW was the 'hold prone to remain prone' bollocks, the game itself is fine, and I still don't get why people don't like V either.
or why most seam to think 2 was the best when you clearly can't eat snakes and pull bullets out of leech holes and quaterize the wound with a cigar, instead you get to freeze c4's with not-snake. at least you get the codec call about memes and scissors :^)
>>343142936
Linear=bad. Nice mindset. Open world in MGS did nothing positive to it.
Most of TPP gadgets are useless or lolsorandomhahaha! Also downgrade to previous entries in several ways. I can capture snakes but not use them like in 3. Why even put a animal collection in the game? I'll answer that, it's there so retarded people can get a useless trophy for themselves.
>>343143583
>It's slow and no penetration.
Learn how to aim and go for the head/legs, bam
>>343143502
>it's still faster and less effort than fucking horseback
not really. It's much more expensive too.
It's like people who complain about the game only experienced 10% of it and just said "yep, I'm done, this is all there is"
Peace Walker?
Does ANYONE but the 5 people who played it care about it?
Doesn't even tie into the story, really.
>>343143664
I didn't say it was bad, but it certainly sets itself apart from Blacklist in that respect.
>>343143695
It's still slower than going semi-lethal, and so not the optimal way to go through the game (there is none). Also good luck going through armored guards
>>343143649
>or why most seam to think 2 was the best
Contrarians.
Come into a series, see most people agree MGS3 is the best, so they flock to the lesser popular title and pretend it's better.
No, a 30 minute youtube video about meta narrative doesn't retroactively make a game good.
>>343143847
>Also good luck going through armored guards
Its called going around them
>>343143782
PW had a great story, and it was set apart from the main line from the start with the Operations moniker in the title
>>343143901
Or I could just head shot them with a revolver from the shadows
>>343143890
I can break down in exquisite detail why MGS3 has a weaker story than 2, but I like some parts of it so I wont pretend its a bad game.
2 is just clearly the better choice so far as having something interesting about itself. MGS3 was entertaining at times but you hardly walked away with something to think about.
The Fury is also the best Cobra
>>343143847
>and so not the optimal way to go through the game (there is none
It clearly is due to Heroism and the ranking system dictating that stealth non lethal is the mandatory way to achieve high rank in both
>>343142117
The game has like two hundred guns in it, but the differences between most of them are just minor deviations in damage and accuracy number, and for the majority of the game you'll be using the same setup for every mission, only major deviation being whether or not you need to take a rocket launcher with you or not.
Granted, some of the gear is inventive, but since using anything costs money and you never know exactly what you'll be facing in a new mission, you're kind of pushed towards going for safe bets only. And that means the starting rifle, the starting tranq gun, your favorite sniper, and little else.
>>343123036
>actual boss fights
Yeah I sure loved HP sponge tanks and helicopters!
>>343122604
Peace walker didn't give you chores to do while waiting for the story to progress. It paced it much better and moved the side missions to an optional area where they belong. Also it had actual boss battles.
>Snake, we need you to bomb this caravan for the fifth time BUT THIS TIME ITS A SPECIAL STORY CARAVAN EAT SHIT
MGSV was a great game and even with all the trailers I never thought it would truly trump 2 or 3. People acting like it's the worst thing ever are retarded or had way to high of expectations. The game had great gameplay and controls which allowed for a lot of different scenarios and ways to make your own fun. Like every installment before it, you would have as much fun with it as you made.
Sneaking around at night and fucking around with outposts and guards was as fun as any other entry. Fighting the skulls in complete action with perfect synch to the final countdown at the mission in Africa was one of the most fun I've ever had with the series. The gameplay was so good I didn't even care much for the next cutscene although I still liked them. Skullface was a good villain and seeing liquid as a kid was cool as fuck too. Also getting all that dialogue from Cipher Zero, Skull Face, and everyone else over the tapes was great. I didn't care much for the wolbachia science but it was cool and definitely fit Metal Gear shit for all purposes.
Each cutscene with skull face was just as ridiculous, funny, and over the top as seeing ocelot rant in a previous game or get hyped over GW. It was great. The missions were fun as fuck to, especially the one where you're riding around destroying Russian tanks and choppers and meanwhile you can hunt down special OP launchers on cargo. Or the creepy hospital one with all the dead dudes where you fight man on fire, or infiltrating the mansion in the woods, or the quarantine mission, or rescuing huey, Huey's whole character is interesting, the triangle of boss, skull face, and zero, and their ideas of the boss was eye opening and well told.
Game gets way more flak here than it deserves.
>>343142117
Also weapon customization is 98% cosmetic. Its main mechanical use in single player is slapping silencers on all your guns before you have researched "officially" silenced versions of them. In FOBs an additional use is slapping sleep gas grenade launchers on everything because noobtubes are always fun.
>>343144196
It gets all the flak it deserves like MGS4
Both are objectively bad games, but its alright. We love them anyway.
>>343135783
>No seriously, how does a dev make such a 180º turn and ends up with something better on a handheld while the big console one gets completely fucked?
Because MGSV was a poorly handled mish-mash of all the things Kojima wanted to do at the time, none of which involved Metal Gear. Konami had no creative direction for him and was just waiting for him to lay another golden egg like they'd come to expect. He was creatively burnt out and wanted to do anything other than Metal Gear.
MGSV is just a bad, disjointed mashing of interesting ideas that don't flow well together. The hospital scene at the beginning is fun but there's nothing else like it in the entire game and it's horribly out of place. It's a pretty fun ride, but it's definitively a "ride", a cinematic on-rails sequence that is incredibly out of place with every other part of the game. GZ versus TPP is another example. Kojima talked up big shit about how controversial MGSV was going to be, and GZ delivered (even if it pushed the lines of taste) whereas TPP fell flat on it's face in that regard. The most controversial thing in the game you can do is kill Quiet,which is actually a good idea since Miller is 100% correct about the threat she poses and who's pulling her strings.Or take Ocelot. He's basically not even Ocelot at all. It's like Kojima had another character he wanted to write but wasn't at liberty to so he just slapped Ocelot's skin on him and called it "Metal Gear."
Peace Walker, for all its faults, was a definitive project with a single cohesive vision from beginning to end.
tl;dr MGSV is just a bad mix of a bunch of ideas Kojima was playing with at the time.
Hell, maybe he was just sucking Konami for all they were worth so he could have resources to play around AND get fired so he could actually walk away from Metal Gear since he first said he would 14 years prior.
>>343144083
again, that's why you go semi-lethal. Once your rank is high enough or you've upgraded the arm, you get a 100% recovery rate from critically wounded soldiers
>>343143502
>pause game
>return to help
>automatically in main hub
>go to next mission
WOW SO HARD. The world isn't there so you can find quest givers and shit like an RPG. The open world makes it so you can enter how you want, execute how you want, and exit how you want. It gives the player full control over the mission. There is no need to travel everywhere by horse or car unless you need to. And the world isn't there for the reason you have in your head.
>>343122686
It has it's issues like a very barren open world and poor level design in general but I still had a ton of fun with it.
>>343144360
>tl;dr MGSV is just a bad mix of a bunch of ideas Kojima was playing with at the time.
This. You're right about the opening too. It literally belongs to a different game.
>>343143397
How dense are you? I want discussion besides you retards crying about the game.
>>343144172
>Snake, we need you to destroy this tank for the 39328585th time BUT THIS TIME ITS A SPECIAL STORY TANK EAT SHIT
There I just described your average Peace Walker """"""""""""""""""boss""""""""""""""""""
>>343143203
>well then it's dumb to complain that the open world doesn't carry the game while also acknowledging that there's more to the game outside of it
The whole game is outside it. There is practically no game content in the open world. So why is it even in the game? Either make it good and dynamic with tons of shit happening, or cut it out entirely.
>>343144660
to be fair, PWs AI bosses would have been really fun to fight in the Fox Engine
>>343144401
We are talking about the 'optimal' way to play. Not things you can do if -blank-
I'm sure someone said this already, but the reason Peace Walker worked, and was acceptable is because it was a PSP spinoff game, it was canon, but it wasn't marketed as a mainline numbered title. The reason people were disappointed with MGS5 being like it, is because it was a mainline title, people expected it to be story based, and play more like 4 or 3 over peace walker, which, again is pretty much a spin off.
>>343144360
You're wrong. Kojima wanted to perfect the formula of combining non-linear infiltration with adventure and storytelling. And he did, MGSV achieves all of that.
PW is tedious as fuck, I'll probably never play it again.
>>343144881
V had story. People are mad because it didn't fit their autistic visions of what they wanted it to be.
>>343144064
>2 is a better game than 3 because the story made you think more
>>343143702
>not really.
Yes really. The helicopter teleports you where you need to be. Why would I ever not use it? There is no sane reason to move in any other way unless you have to. It's not like I'm going to miss out on some exciting rock texture or a goat.
>It's much more expensive too.
I'm fine with paying a couple imaginary game coins to save minutes of my own precious life that I only have so much of and which I'll never get back.
>It's like people who complain about the game only experienced 10% of it
You're literally talking about empty map with nothing in it. You'll excuse me, but I'm fine skipping that 90%. It's a waste of my time.
>>343145021
If a story doesn't make you think then it isn't a very good one. 2 and 3 both make you think though.
>>343144995
Fucking this. I'll never understand how anyone actually enjoyed Peace Walker. The whole game felt like such a chore and the fact you actually had to grind for shit and even an ending was fucking sad.
>>343123036
Boss fights in V were are 3rd best in the series behind 1 and 3.
>muh whirlybird rides D:
Most autistic complaint ever.
>He didn't listen to the tapes in Peacewalker
There is plenty of story critical information in Peacewalkers cassettes.
Level design in PW was shit, level design in MGSV is only behind 2 and 3.
>>343143847
>Also good luck going through armored guards
Eh, just spam that deployment task that prevents enemies from using riot suits.
>>343145021
Oh, as a game?
2 had better core stealth. 3 had better bosses.
3 was filled with too much experimental bullshit that honestly got in the way rather than adding to the game (survival, camo, etc) while 2 was a natural evolution of what the series had already been. 3 also started the trend of adding too many useless weapons instead of the core few.
Another thing it did do right was adding a limit to the tranquilizer. That was one feature MGS2 sorely needed.
But from a pure mechanics and content standpoint, 2 > 3.
>>343145216
4 had better boss fights than V
>>343124184
Kojima has said that Death Stranding will be a smaller game as it's the studios first project.
Where the fuck did you hear that it's open world?
If you didn't play every story mission and listen to all the tapes you aren't a real fan of the series and your opinion means nothing to me.
>>343125505
>sport analogies
>>343144875
Right. The semi-lethal way can be faster if done right. Tranqs work well, but they have their drawbacks too
>>343145251
But that also comes at the cost of using a deployment for a more lucrative online op
>>343145216
v's bossfights were pretty lacking
>dropping supply boxes on quiet
>use quiet w/ brennan on skulls for easy kills
>sahelanthropus is a bullet sponge a la pw
>>343140768
>Story was the biggest let down of my life.
>Game was fine in terms of gameplay and controls. but the empty world and after realizing the story is such a shitshow, it just ruined the whole game for me.
>also Quiet being the most useless irrelevant character in MEtal gear History.
>At least Cecile was pure waifu material.
>People praising MGSV are nothing but casuals that started the series with this game without knowing all of the stuff that the game shat on.
>Ocelot doesnt even use revolver for god´s sake.
All of these points are 100% valid if you replace Cecile with Kaz.
>>343144440
>WOW SO HARD.
???
Would it have been that difficult to read to the end of my post? Because I just said that the game makes skipping all travel easy. I literally fucking said it's not hard.
My point is that the fact that I WANT to skip all travel indicates by itself that the game's open world is not worth shit.
>The world isn't there so you can find quest givers and shit like an RPG.
It should be. That's exactly the sort of shit it should be. Because that's the kind of world that's worth exploring, or existing. Having NPCs in the world give you special ops would be better than almost anything in MGSV.
>>343146320
>It should be. That's exactly the sort of shit it should be. Because that's the kind of world that's worth exploring, or existing. Having NPCs in the world give you special ops would be better than almost anything in MGSV.
Nah. TPP's iDroid system is pretty goat. Having NPCs in the world giving you side ops would just be like any other shitty UBI open world where you see the same long cutscene to kick off another copy paste counter crawl. Sure, that's what side ops are in TPP too, but the method of commencement by walking into a particular area feels more polished
>>343146320
>It should be. That's exactly the sort of shit it should be
Casual baby detected. Go play something else then. The open world simply serves as a map for everything and a means to completely control the mission. To enter, infiltrate, and exit however you want. It gives more wiggle room and opens up possibilities, that's why it is there. Quest giving would be stupid here and wouldn't make sense.
>>343146002
You're quickly going to have more deployment slots than you have good ops for.
>>343143782
Honestly, at the end of PW Big Boss is still a quirky, autistic soldier-savant and it still did more to show his transformation to a warlord then MGSV did.
>Recruiting and USING child soldiers
>Fighting against the US
>Rejecting the nation-state system and trying to build a country by soldiers, for soldiers
>Acquiring nukes to protect his utopia
Meanwhile TPP is a game about a guy who isn't Big Boss who doesn't get revenge on a guy who isn't actually Cipher. MM stays silent most of them time and when he doesn't it's to talk about how he's going to save those poor child soldiers and keep them off the battlefield, and how it's not their place to judge the guy who brought down Motherbase.
>>343146837
That's a shit reason to waste a game with open world.
Large area that is DESIGNED to be infiltrated from various points like in GZ and Blacklist would have been so much better. TPP is basically a sandbox that has some copy pasted buildings slapped to it.
>>343146837
>Quest giving would be stupid here and wouldn't make sense.
It makes perfect sense. You're literally a mercenary. A gun for hire.
>>343122604
I played MG 1 & 2, MGS 1-4 and PW before MGSV came out and I did that all in 2013. Didn't even have a PS1 back in 1998 so there is no nostalgia for MGS with me.
Still fucking hated MGSV.
>>343147357
GZ was DESIGNED to be a prologue and blacklist was linear.
>>343141034
2 >= 3 > 1 > 4 >= V > PW
>>343147768
Alright man, get hyped for ubisofts wildlands then.
>>343147954
>all dem memeboyz in friends
>>343147954
I like this list.
>>343125505
i'd say PW is like a delicious off-menu subway sandwich while MGSV is a sandwich that a chef spent so long working on and we don't have to be chefs to tell whether its good or not
WHO IS DOING THIS?
SUCH A LUST FOR REVENGE
WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
>>343122604
mgsv is hated for being an incomplete game. peace walker has nothing to do with it being hated because everyone knew going in it was going to have pw style base building, the difference is mgsv was advertised as having a motherbase that was actually alive and populated in trailers and instead we get platforms with nothing going on unless you accidentally trigger a cutscene like the birthday party or the low morale one.
PW and MGSV are their own thing. If you like them, cool.
MGS1,2,3 are their own thing. If you like them, cool.
As long as we can agree MGS4 is shit, lets all go grab a beer.
>>343148492
>mgsv was advertised as having a motherbase that was actually alive and populated in trailers and instead we get platforms with nothing going on unless you accidentally trigger a cutscene like the birthday party or the low morale one.
Man, it's been 9 months and it's still hard to believe how much bullshit there is in MGSV. When people watch trailers they think they're getting a taste of what's to come. Instead we didn't even get what was in the trailers.
>>343140768
>ocelot doesn't even use revolver
?
>>343147338
Chico doesn't count. Snake was just being a super dad :3
There should have been more areas in TPP, but they should have been around the size of Camp Omega, maybe a bit smaller or larger. Instead of having a big open world with nearly nothing in it, you would have a few good bases to run around. Adding some actually good interior levels would have been good, too.
The number of story missions should have been greatly reduced. The story is padded to hell and back in TPP, and the tiny amount of information you get at the end of each mission might as well not matter at all.
Also anything interesting they could have done with Venom not being the actual Big Boss didn't happen. The only character that has any development at all is Kaz, I guess, even then he's just kind of angry throughout the game. Ocelot is a boring infodump instead of the fun Ocelot from the rest of the series. Venom is just a silent protagonist. Actually, Huey is probably the most interesting character in the game now that I think about it.
Side Ops should have been more like GZ's and Peace Walker's, which still had goofy sutff like the Monster Hunter missions, the phototaking missions, the ghost missions, Deja Vu, Jamias Vu, etc., of 5+ different flavors of 10 different uninteresting mission objectives. The closest TPP comes to having fun with the side ops is the Rescue Kojima mission, which is just a repeat of something from GZ.
Collecting animals should have been like Snake Eater. Remove the RNG traps entirely.
There should have been way more interactions on Mother Base other than the Vagina Bomb Ghost. Maybe check up on Kaz or Ocelot once in a while. The whole base as it is right now is just another empty, lifeless area, much like Afghanistan and African, with some soldiers you can beat up, and some pointless target practice missions to do.
Cassette Tapes are an alright replacement for Codec Calls, but a terrible replacement for actual cutscenes, which there are very very few of in this game and I miss them.
I could probably go on
>>343143015
>Fun need a purpose
You only need a reason to experiment with the games toolset because you're a retard.
GZ is better than TPP
>>343123036
it pains me a little but I actually agree with this. I enjoyed PW HD on PS3 much more than I did V. probably largely for the reasons listed here >>343122893
>>343123636
>muh cutscenes
Act 1 was superb
Act 2 was great
Act 3 was shit
Act 4 was meh
Act 5 was good
The boss battles, especially the first and last, were cinematic and rewarding for the most part.
many of the cutscenes could've been cut or abridged, but they don't ruin the entire game, especially if you've played the others and you know what's happening. The game's got a solid 10 hours of gameplay, which is fairly standard for that type of game.
>>343146146
3's boss fights were pretty terrible
>spam cqc on the Boss
>use thermals on the end
>use shotgun on the pain
>use stun grenade + ak on the fury
>use mushrooms and mask on Volgin
What I'm getting at is that a Boss is not bad because there is an easy way to beat them.
MGSV's bossfights were legitimately well designed, all except for Eli but then Eli is a fucking great boss because of how much like The End you can totally circumvent him with a sniper rifle.
In fact most of the Boss fights can be totally avoided through stealth with the exception of Volgin, the armoured skulls in Metallic Archaea, Quiet and Sahelanthropus (and the latter 2 can be played like a stealth fight anyway not unlike the fight with Raven in MGS 1) which is fucking fantastic.
![tumblr_nt6qpfKRWv1sljzwqo1_1280[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/xtoyBKq.jpg "tumblr_nt6qpfKRWv1sljzwqo1_1280[1].jpg")
>>343150256
>Metallic Archaea [Extreme]
DUDE
>>343147338
>He didn't get what the twist at the end of V meant.
The twist at the end of V was indisputable proof of Big Boss' fall to villainy, it's an fucking fantastic way to showcase his hypocrisy that was touched upon briefly in 4, it also serves to underline who he is as a person rather than how he sees himself, in PW you're given a bunch of justifications behind his actions because that's mostly Big Boss and MSF convincing themselves that they're right.
But then Venom comes along and says "I'm already a demon" which Big Boss would never say and Venom would have no reason to believe he himself was "already a demon", the demon line is actually there because Venom was implanted with Big Bosses memories and without the context behind Big Bosses actions Venom believes that he is a villain.
It does SENSE better than 4 ever did.
>>343150387
I will grant you that was fucking terrible and there was literally no way to beat it without making Quiet do all the work or using the parasite suit.
>MGS V was a bad game
Only thing bad about it was the cut content. We can thank Konami for that.
The missions are highly replayable due to the gameplay being rock solid. It's not my favourite MGS game but then again, it's the one I probably pumped the most hours into.
I just started a new save with infinite heaven which really brings needed flavour to the open world.
>>343150941
Absolute bullshit. All the villains and threats you fight are legitimate world ending threats. Boss does nothing close to deserving an evil label. Him or Venom
>>343147954
>4 above anything
Nah
>>343150101
>The game's got a solid 10 hours of gameplay,
Pfhahahahahahahahahaha
>>343150941
>But then Venom comes along and says "I'm already a demon" which Big Boss would never say and Venom would have no reason to believe he himself was "already a demon", the demon line is actually there because Venom was implanted with Big Bosses memories and without the context behind Big Bosses actions Venom believes that he is a villain.
That makes virtually no sense. Why would Venom interpret himself differently then Big Boss would when the whole point of Venom's existence is that he's a perfect mental and physical copy of Big Boss? Nobody in the game treats him as anything other than that. Even at the end Big Boss treats him as an extension of himself. He has all his memories and all his patterns of thinking.
>The twist at the end of V was indisputable proof of Big Boss' fall to villainy
How so? All it does is absolve Kojima of any responsibility to depict Big Boss's fall himself. It's not actually anything wrong, and there's certainly no lack on in-game justification as to why it was necessary like there was for things in PW. At worst you could call it cowardice, but cowardice does not properly justify how BB was a villain who needed to be put down and SS was in the right for taking down the focal point of resistance to the Patriots. The Patriots show up in 2 and apparently are really evil and call the shots, and BB shows up in 3 and is a fun and heroic good guy, and then in 4 we find out he was at war with the Patriots the whole time. Somewhere along the line players realize that there's this disconnect between these in-game descriptions of Big Boss as a villain and a tyrant and his described role as rebel against the not-Illuminati. MGSV does nothing to bridge that gap, and honestly there's not that many strong arguments against those who say "SS was the villain and BB did nothing wrong" except for some lines from 16-bit games that came out 30 years ago and were retconned to hell and back years before V.
>>343122604
But peacewalker was the worst canon game in the full series, V was second worst. Take your casual taste and get fucked
>>343151372
I didn't say it was terrible. I find the Chaingun on D-Walker pretty useful too, and flair grenades are a godsend
>>343151718
>Only thing bad about it was the cut content. We can thank Konami for that.
I'm not on the "let's lynch Kojima train" and I'm sure Konami is in no small way at fault for what we got, but there are bad artistic decisions that are unarguably based in Kojima's vision for the project. Having Venom be a braindead mute so he can "identify with the players"? Who the hell thought that was a good idea? Even I could tell you that wouldn't fly, and I've never made a videogame in my entire life.
>>343122604
I did, PW was solid.
MGSV still has a shit story though.
>>343151372
Is this some kind of meme?
>Bring CGM
>Sprint to rooftop
>Spam CGM
>Win battle in under 2 minutes
>>343150101
>The game's got a solid 10 hours of gameplay
You can't be serious
>>343152628
But he's not braindead nor a mute.
>>343151846
Big Boss armed a mercenary group with a nuclear weapon and the means to use it.
He recruited and used child soldiers.
He made a habit of kidnapping and brainwashing enemy soldiers into fighting for him, releasing them to the mercy of the comrades they betrayed when he ran out of use for them.
He proved his hypocrisy by doing to Venom what Zero did to him and what America did to the Boss (And what Zero/FOX did to Skull Face) taking it to another level by stealing his name and face.
Big Boss looks like a good guy in PW because you are playing as him, Venom says it all when he says "I'm already a demon", he isn't referring to himself, he's referring to Big Boss because that's who he thinks he is.
The game even takes it a step further with its morality system, at the start of the game Venom has demon points, the least you will probably ever have but throughout the game as you assume the role of Big Boss your demon points will grow which is something explicitly shown at the end of the game where in the flash forward Venom is shown as a full demon because at that point he literally is Big Boss.
>>343122604
I think PW was complete shit and V was good. Fight me, niggers.
>>343123491
>>Grind isn't as bad as MGSV
BULLLLLLSHIIIIIIIIIIIIT
PW had you upgrading up guns by using them on EACH level.
It is literally grinding within grinding.
>>343152272
Because Venom isn't Big Boss, he hasn't lived as Big Boss he just has Big Boss' memory, his MEME.
He didn't experience the same SCENE and he does not share the same SENSE.
Venom's relationship with Big Boss and his coming to terms with his new identity is an amalgamation of the major themes of every game in the series, even PEACE the theme of Peacewalker.
The one theme that cannot be linked to Venom is REVENGE, he does not seek revenge against Huey and he is unable to take revenge against Skull Face because he instead takes revenge for Kaz, he spends the entire game on a quest for Revenge that isn't his, it's Big Boss' and Kaz.
It's a showcase of his hypocrisy, he left the Patriots because he disagreed with Zeroes methods but his theft of Venom's identity and his willingness to force his own identity upon Venom shows that he doesn't actually have any qualms with those methods.
My personal interpretation is that the real reason for his self imposed exile from the patriots actually had a lot more to do with his lust for power, something which he couldn't satiate when he was working alongside Zero.
The Patriots aren't evil, The Patriots are an idea.
>>343152993
It's a hyperbole, but the man barely even talks. Even in tense, high-stakes situations he acts like he's not even present. It's just Miller and Ocelot bickering back and forth, it's easy to forget he's there at all.
It's ironic that there's this whole Ahab/Ishmael thing hinted at, where Ahab is the protagonist of the story and Ishmael chronicles his quest for revenge, but even though he only appears in a 5 minute cutscene "Ishmael" still has more definitive character than "Ahab." The "Ahab" of the story is not the protagonist and not even really a proper character in the story. He's an impassioned observer, one who watches but does not interfere. He's much more of a backseat narrator then "Ahab" should be. Hell, even the real Ishmael controls the context through which we see the world by narrating the events directly to us. He's important because it's ultimately through his window we see the world, the struggle between man and beast. If Venom has opinions or a particular take on the events that unfold he keeps them to himself, and since we cannot hunt him down and ask him about them after hours they may as well not exist. The fact that he smirks when BB mentions that they are both Big Boss is a little glimpse of personality that occurs at a few other moments as well, but it doesn't make up for the fact that for most of the game he is an anti-character, a lack of character. He is a nobody with no opinions and no voice or ability to affect the events around him, referenced only is passing by others. Why Kojima thought this approach would help people project themselves onto him baffles me. When you watch a porno the more generic the guy is the better, and the less details he has the easier it is to put yourself in his shoes. But that's because you want to see the action and are actively trying to think about anything that isn't sexy. Why he thought this approach would work in a setting that is driven by actual story and not eroticism is beyond me.
>>343154170
>He didn't experience the same SCENE
Yes he did. He has all the same memories. You spouting the themes of each game as though they mean something in this context changes nothing about the actual game itself.
>his coming to terms with his new identity
What "new identity"? He sees himself as BB for the entire game except for the end, where he goes "lol that's cool too I guess" and just rolls with it.
>>343154836
No, has his MEME, he has the raw information, he did not have the SCENE to contextualize the MEME nor the SENSE to interpret it in the same way as Big Boss.
He lived several years before his identity was taken away, his memory was not wiped he was just hypnotized to have preference for the memories of Big Boss that he was implanted with.
That bit of the ending where he punches the mirror says that he was a little less than happy about the way things turned out, his immediate response was "lol k" but in those 20 n years his opinion obviously changed.
It doesn't make MGSV any better.
>>343155453
>No, has his MEME, he has the raw information, he did not have the SCENE to contextualize the MEME nor the SENSE to interpret it in the same way as Big Boss.
What the hell is that even supposed to mean?
>his memory was not wiped he was just hypnotized to have preference for the memories of Big Boss that he was implanted with
There is virtually nothing in the game that supports this and many statements that directly contradict it
>That bit of the ending where he punches the mirror says that he was a little less than happy about the way things turned out, his immediate response was "lol k" but in those 20 n years his opinion obviously changed.
Oh sorry, I didn't know I was arguing with someone who was high as a kite. Go hang with your friends or something while you're on stuff, don't post on IBs, that's depressing as hell.
>>343155709
That's because V is already perfect
>>343154456
I honestly don't think it's that bad. Sure, he's more silent than previous Snake's but he's not devoid of character. He speaks up when he has too and Kiefer did a good job voicing him tbqh.
Take the cutscene after the "where do the bees sleep" mission for example. Kaz is doing most of the talking and he replies with short, to the point answers. It shows Venom is smart and determinate at that point, even though he says very little.
He's just a man of few words, the emotions he's experiencing can be seen in his facial expressions, which is what Kojima was aiming for. Just look at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qUei1fwIUA , the first few minutes.
>I wanted Snake to have a more subdued performance, expressed through subtle facial movements and tone of voice, rather than words.
I think he succeeded for the most part. Granted there are several big moments that went belly up (the infamous jeep ride for example) but I like Venom's character overall. The tapes are also great and show a lot of character.
And about self inserting, I think that only plays a very small part in how Venom is behaving. The whole "you are Big Boss too, dear player and fan" was more of a show of appreciation towards the fans than anything else.
>>343122686
First Post Best Post.
>you're just mad it's a departure
3 was a massive departure from 1/2 on almost every level except for controls. It's still a good game. PW/V are just bad. They completely abandon what Kojima's actually good at to present you with a list of easy errands to run, over and over as you grind to you S rank japs love so much.
Complete shit, the both of them.
>>343122604
I did and Peace Walker was better than MGSV despite the gimped controls
MGSV is better than both 4 and PW.
You were a fool if you thought MGSV was going to live up to the original trilogy. MGSV was flawed but atleast there was fun gameplay to make up for it.
>>343155897
Venom has Big Bosses MEME, that is the raw information of his memories and experiences.
Venom did not experience his SCENE, the environment which contextualized his MEME.
Venom did notn share his SENSE, the blend of GENE, MEME andm SCENE which shaped Big Boss into the man he was.
What do you mean there is nothing in the game that supports it?
A tape explicitly says that Venom had Big Boss' memories implanted into him and that he was hypnotized to believe they were his, there is no mention of his memory ever having been wiped and the Paz cutscenes are significant evidence to the contrary, not to mention the fact that Venom remembers the helicopter crash and the events preceding it in the ending cutscene.
>Oh sorry, I didn't know I was arguing with someone who was high as a kite.
The part where he punches the mirror takes place 20 years from where the cutscene starts, look at the reflection of the door at 5:19.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xN0VAsJElX4
>>343156221
Honestly, I don't think we disagree about what's there. I think Kief did a damn good job of voicing/mocapping Snake, and scenes like the end of Shining Lights have him as a strong contender for the best portrayal of Snake so far. When he appears in the tapes he's great too, the one where he talks about genetics with Huey is really fun to listen to. There's no denying that what's there is good, all we disagree on is whether or not what's there is enough.
Snake doesn't appear in the vast majority of TPP cassette tapes. This is in direct contrast to PW and even GZ, where he was a leading character in almost any tape he could be expected to be present at. In PW tapes, the tapes are about various characters talking WITH Snake, having dialogue back and forth. Snake also exerts a lot more influence on the world around him in previous titles. To use PW (the game that is most structurally similarly to TPP) it's Snake who initially shuts down Zadornov's proposal and it's only with his go-ahead that they go through with it. He's the one who decides he's going to bring Cecile back to base or tells Miller that Amanda can leave sickbay if she wants to. Compare that to Venom in TPP, who only ever shows initiative in bringing Sally back to MB. It's Ishmael who tells him what to do to escape the hospital, it's Ocelot who tells him to rescue Miller and then then Miller who points Snake in the right direction for the rest of the game. We never hear Snake talk about how worried he is about Miller or how much he hopes he makes it in time. Ocelot points him in the right direction and he starts walking. He never talks about how he personally feels about Skullface or what happened to Motherbase. He goes on missions as Kaz tells him to, all the way up to going after Skullface. There's never any sense of initiative or personal compulsion in any of Snake's actions. He might growl at Huey but he never actively voices opinions or exerts influence on the events around him.
>>343145021
2 controls a hell of a lot better than 3, where the shift to the new style of camera obviously was hard for them to understand
>>343157463
I think that may actually be intentional, Venom was just a soldier that followed Big Boss' and Miller's orders before suddenly becoming Big Boss, the game shows that he has some of Big Boss' memories and in combat he's as good as Big Boss but the only time he really shows any leadership ability is in the low morale cutscene but even there it's more like he views them as equals rather than subordinates.
I put over 200 hours into PW and unlocked everything. This was with the claw controls. I really liked PW, I loved the comfy feeling of it. All I wanted was to be able to actually visit that comfy Mother Base. When MGSV announced Mother Base, I was so excited. They took that and stomped on it and gave me a dead husk and took away the family bond. I am still mad.
>>343122604
I played it and liked PW. I liked how well it was made for the short plays while on bus or waiting somewhere.
And spliting game for missions wasn't bad idea for mgs v.
What I hate about mgs v is fact that it conclude great series with UNFINISHED game that just really stops in middle of it. I always liked cutscenes in mgs, so you have another guess why I hated it.
>>343158526
That's on Konami though, not Kojima or the MGS team
they cut him off early, not his fault
