So what was it with FF villains during the SNES?
>literally Vader
>a tree
>literally Joker
what is up with any FF villain really?
Who /Brave New World/ here?
>>342659430
I think it's sad that the tree was the most enjoyable concept out of all of them
>>342659430
>Golbez
That's not fucking Zemus/Zeromus.
Why did the developers of FF6 make Kefka so frail?
>>342659759
>game makes you think he's going to be le evil pope man
>rules over a nation that has been under siege by dragons for 1000 years
>knows the truth, but knows he can't tell the people or else the destabilized country will fall
>has to find a way to end the war and save his people
>first thing he tells you when you walk into his room is that ascians have been talking him and taught him to summon primals
>he assures you he's not dumb enough to do what they want and wants to work with you to fuck them up
>ends up summoning knights of the round into himself
>kills ascians just like he said
>you only end up fighting him because summoning things eats the lifestream
>literally did nothing wrong, was a humble man who believed he had to sacrifice his own humanity to save his people
Some of them can be pretty great.
>>342660383
literally who
>FF1: Guy that got some demon power from time loop shenanigans.
>FF2: Guy that died and then kicked Satan's ass, becoming the new lord of Hell.
>FF3: Physical anthropomorphization of the void.
>FF4: Physical anthropomorphization of a butthurt moonman's hatred.
>FF5: Tree wizard that can't deal with his shiny new void powers and becomes another void anthropomorphization.
>FF6: The Joker leeching off some statues.
>FF7: Some fag with a mommy complex slurping up the planet's lifeforce
>etc
When did the "The final boss is God" meme start?
>>342660383
Yeah, but he should have left the ascian slaying to me. We could have figured out a way to deal with those evil fuckers.
>>342660383
Why does FFXIV models look so plastic and cheap?
>>342660120
Zemus get mentioned right before the penultimate Dungeon and isn't known as the enemy until the final dungeon. Golbez is the villain of the game even if he isn't the Big Bad.
>>342659990
I mean Kefka at first seems like a lame wanna be arc villain who's going to get thrown in the trash. The supposed big bad is well established from the get go, unlike Zemus. And then he kills all the summons and wreck his boss and is a fucking God now. I liked him.
>>342659990
Bullshit. Kefka was far and away the best villain the series ever had.
One of the best villains in the history of video games, period.
>>342660749
Main reason why I can't get into FFXIV.
>>342660716
Well Kefka's clearly a god by that point. Likely from because the Warring Triad are supposed to be goddesses.
>>342660716
I don't know, I can't think of that many JRPGs where you actually fight God. Off the top of my head I've only got certain SMT games and Xenoblade.
>>342660716
Kefka became the god of magic after he absorbed the Triad's power. That's why magic vanishes again after you kill him.
>>342660749
console limitations
>that fucking retarded plan Garland had
You fucking idiot, no you are not immortal just because the heroes are going to kill you nearly a 1000 years before you are born due to you traveling back in time. You fucking lost, your soul isn't going to funnel into your baby self.
>>342660716
Its a power trip. Whats better than starting at lv1 and ending as a godslayer.
>>342660880
A generic ''crazy jester'' is the best villain FF has to offer?
Kuja is still the best villain in the series and he had legit reasons to become a villain besides ''muh power'' or shit like that.
Great character.
>>342661335Magic vanishes because you kill the Warring Triad.
>>342660880
He's basically just the Joker with super powers.
And that's badass.
>>342662073
>"If I'm going to die eventually, then everyone else should, too."
He's a little bitch.
>>342662073
he was a villain for "muh power" until the last disc. Where he was a villain pretty much out of jealousy that the world would exist after him.
>>342662205
nope, you kill them before Kefka and Magic and the tower, and the Esper corpses are still good. Kefka stole that factor from them.
>>342662073
>find out you're going to die someday
>WELL I'LL JUST BLOW UP THE MOTHERCRYSTAL THEN FUCK EVERYONE
I wouldn't really call that a legit reason.
>>342662306
He did regret that shit in the end but, his life was fucking horrible and he had no developed emotions so I dont blame him for acting like he did (even though it was stupid).
>>342662352
>"muh power"
more like
>FUCK YOU GARLAND YOU'RE NOT MY REAL DAD I'LL SHOW YOU
>>342662073
too bad he's not the last boss and the last boss is a total asspull
>>342662352
But he was forced to do what he did by Garland since the beginning, what happened to him could had happened to Zidane and he was pissed about it, he thought there was no purpose to his life so he went full narcisistic and tried to have Gaia for himself to feel better with himself, of course when he found out he was flawed he throwed a tantrum and went full absolute madman mode.
Having no emotions and being a war machine since you were conceived is bound to fuck people up.
But you're right with the ''muh power'' in a way, but atleast he wasnt shallow.
>>342663090
>But he was forced to do what he did by Garland since the beginning
seems he actually cut ties with Garland well before the game. Garland goes out of his way to foil him getting Alexander.
>>342663507
I'm talking about before the events of the game, I should had been more specific, he was already fucked in the head before the events of the game, he had no emotions, no way to judge right from wrong, all he had known since he was brought to the world was killing and he only knew how to scheme evil shit, kill, betray and basicly be an asshole.
His evil villain attitude comes into play when the events of the game unfold but they were caused by his cruel past.
>>342660383
>literally did nothing wrong
The man perpetuated a lie that lasted over thousands of years and demanded devout prayer so his own power could be increased to a tier above Light and Dark. Dude was definitely doing wrong.
Many people died. Our biggest fan being one of them.
>>342663090
Wasnt he mad because Zidane was supposed to an upgraded version of him
>>342663865
>The man perpetuated a lie that lasted over thousands of years
Yeah, because fucking the country from the inside with a civil war was an awful fucking idea when dragons are laying siege to you and you can't even grow food anymore because your country has been thrown into an eternal winter. He knew that, and said it straight out to Aymeric. Thordan had to sustain the lie until he could end the war or else more people would just die.
>>342663787
I don't remember, why does Zidane have emotions again? Being raised on Earth?
>"Kefka is so cool and unique, the fact he won really adds to him"
>all he does is move some statues
>once he gains power he does jack shit and just becomes a "muh power" villian
Kefka is overrated as fuck, up to the flying continent he was pretty enjoyable.
Who is the best?
>FF : Conquered and ruled the world for an undefined number of time loops
>FFII : Conquered and ruled the world for some time before dying, then split his soul in two killed God and Satan and returned to earth
>FFIII : Force of the nature able to erase and re-start the world, failed to do it.
>FFIV : Failed to conquer the world, got imprisoned in the moon, failed to destroy the world
>FFV : Magic tree who got sentient after being the prison of too many powerful evil spirits, destroyed one world, destroyed parts of another, failed to fully control the void and erase the multi-verse.
>FFVI : Conquered and ruled the world for almost a year, killed most of the world population and permanently changed the geography of the world. Whe he died all the magic disapeared from the world.
>FFVII : Summoned a meteor that dealt big damage to earth, but failed to absorb earths life energy
>FFVIII: Compresed time in one single moment, failed to keep it compresed
>FFIX : Destroyed one planet, failed to destroy earth
>FFX : Conquered and ruled the world for 1000 years
>FFXII : Failed to conquer the world
>>342664304
Venat was the best. He successfully fucked the Occuria's rule and went down fighting with his friend because he knew the world was already free.
>>342664136
Probably got bonked on the head as a babby like Goku.
>>342664304
I love Exdeath just because of how perfectly generic Saturday morning cartoon evil he is.
>>342664018
Yes, thats why he dropped him in Gaia, he wanted Zidane to grow up and see the world he grew up in gone to shit.
He also wanted to prove to himself that he was better than Zidane could ever be so he didnt kill Zidane because, he thought that killing Zidane would mean that Zidane was a threat to him and killing him when he is most invulnerable would only further prove this, and that would hurt his ego.
>>342664304
>>FFXII : Failed to conquer the world
Successfully fucked over the Occuria and restored the reins of history back into the hands of men.*
FTFY
>>342664304
ultimecia is more ironic than that
>attempted to kompress time to a single moment to stop the legendary seed from killing her, in the process she created the legendary seed by fucking around giving him a reason to kill her
>>342664245
Are you just going to forget him taking it upon himself to level grind and then kill all of the summons by himself?
It also nice that he gets stronger every time you meet him and shuts down Mr "this is obviously the big bad".
>>342664456
>Probably got bonked on the head as a babby like Goku.
okay but the other Not-saiyans just quietly lives. Does the game say Garland specifically made Kuja an attack drone?
>>342664673
zidane and kuja were specifically made as angels of death to reap the souls of gaia
All the other genomes were effectively suits that the terrans were going to possess after the assimilation of gaias souls
>>342664673
He calls both Kuja and Zidane 'angels of death'. The reason Zidane is different, has emotions, and is all around better, is because Garland installed a soul into Zidane to allow him to use Trance. Zidane was supposed to replace Kuja who was the test model.
Kuja was only able to Trance after he absorbed Brahne's soul, and then freaked out.
>>342664673
>>342664136
He had emotions because Zidane was created as a child and lived a life on Gaia, meeting people and allowing his soul to develop and develop emotions.
Kuja was created as an adult, had known only war and hatred and didnt connect to people, he was flawed because he could not develop emotions and couldnt enter Trance, thats why Zidane is superior, Zidane can channel his emotions to enter trance gaining incredible power while Kuja had to harvest thousands of souls to be able to Trance (and be powerful as fuck because he had countless souls and emotions in him amplifying his powers).
>>342664304
>Conquered and ruled the world for an undefined number of time loops
Timeloop thing Garland blabbers about is stupid. He thinks its a loop just because he went back in time to die.
>>342660716
Well you have to keep in mind that these games are created by the Japanese and their concept of God/Gods is different than the what people from the west think of when they hear the world God.
Gods have died and been killed by non-Gods in Japanese myths, legends, religions, etc. They can be powerful for sure but it's actually not a requirement for something to be considered a God. They elevated a stray cat that just hung around a train station a lot to the status of "God of that specific trains station" when it died.
While here in the west thanks to Judaism, Christianity, etc when most people hear the word God they think of this all powerful being that created everything, knows everything, cannot be beat, cannot be questioned, etc.
So when a Japanese game has a character become a God it can cause non-Japanese players to get the wrong idea or even get confused.
>>342662073
He's a manchild in a thong that couldn't accept that everything, including himself, must die at some point.
>>342664816
>>342664903
>>342664958
okay, I understand. Kuja is indeed more justified, Garland fucked up.
>>342665372
Indeed, but the thing that I really like about this game's story is how everyone got fucked over, Garland was also this superhuman created to supervision the crystal's assimilation process and to watch over the Terrans souls and make sure the process would be done correctly.
He is nothing but a pawn devoid of free will made by the far more technological advanced Terrans.
Kefka managing to succeed his goal and causing long lasting effects (even after he dies, the world he pretty much destroyed ends up deformed) makes him my personal favourite villain, and also because of how his motive is as simple as "Because, why not".
If there's one aspect I'm not a big fan of, it has to do with how he's interpreted more as a "Clown" rather than a Psychopath nowadays, as seen in modern representations of his character (Dissidia, for example).
>>342664673
>Are you just going to forget him taking it upon himself to level grind and then kill all of the summons by himself?
I still don't know what the hell the explanation for this is.
When the Sealed Gate got opened the first time, he was literally helpless to do anything about the espers that rushed out.
They immediately trashed the magitek facility that could possibly account for any powerups.
Almost all their magicite was stolen prior to that.
While they still had MagiTek armor, that was only good for flattening some filthy returners after they tracked down the espers for them.
How the fuck is he suddenly capable of one-shotting an entire race that literal gods used as chess pieces during their little war a few centuries ago?
I get that the villain has to get the magical world dominating/destroying mcguffins for the sake of suspense, but the writing just handed omnipotence to him on a silver platter.Seriously. Measuring a villain by success is stupid. That guy in Dragon Quest VII is probably the most successful villain ever, and he was shit. SHIIIIIIIIIIT.
>>342665906
All he did was push some statues, wow I'm impressed.
I remember reading somewhere, can't remember where though, that the original Japanese implied at points that both Zidane (Well with Zidane it's more obvious since he's part of a theater troupe) and Kuja had read a fuck load out of all the classic stories, their universe's version of Shakespeare and other shit like that.
So while the game is going on they both realize the parts they would have played if their adventures were a story like that and try to subvert, I don't wanna use this word but I can't think of anything else that'll fit, tropes to avoid shit like getting killed and out play one another due to "He knows that I know that he knows" mentality.
And that the English translation completely ruined this. This is more than likely just some "THAT KID" kind of bullshit. But it's interesting to think about I guess. I probably could have explained this shit better too but I'm about to head to bed.
>>342665906
>everyone thinks Kefka is a clown
>he can use female-only items in Dissidia
>he's actually just a drag queen
Nobody ever notices.
>>342666126
Source?!
That sounds brilliant and would make the addition of the theater and all the theatrical references much better.
>>342662073
That's not how you spell Caius.
>>342665917
I figure Gestahl just correctly planned where to save more Magecite and was able to pull that shit out the same way he fooled the Returners into thinking he had surrendered then attacked. His attempted spells on Kefka suggests he was just as powered up. If Celes and Leo were on board they likely would've gotten the same treatment.
>>342664304
The loop in FF is that the LIGHT WARRIORS are prophesized to save the world because they went back in time to do it.
So the world already knew they'd succeed.
>>342659759
what's with any villain really?
why are they trying to destroy the world? um hello? you live here too, stupid.
>>342666759
>His attempted spells on Kefka suggests he was just as powered up.
He literally helped himself to statue-power and bragged about how awesome it was right in front of you before that stuff happened.
best FF villain ever here
>>342667179
You don't even get your own battle theme, loser.
>>342666418
Not that guy, but It's alluded to but not fully realized in the English version. Kuja still makes several references to "I want to be your canary" as well as several other theatrical references, although any references Zidane would've made seem to be completely gone except the one at the very end, which, you know, is the most obvious one.
At least, as far as I can remember. I went back and replayed it twice in the last month, so it's still pretty fresh.
>>342667030
oh right. I guess you might have a point then.
Kefka seems to power up a few times since he straight up runs from you in the first encounter then is a boss later, but I guess you're right about that Esper wiping power up being particularly ridiculous.
Gestahl did somehow manage to turn the tables way too easily and then give Kefka stronger troops though, I guess its a villain plot armor moment.
>>342664663
It goes further than that.
>Ultimecia has massive sorceress powers passed on to her and needs to be killed
>Legendary SeeD kills her
>Aforementioned SeeD keeps the company of a Sorceress from his own time, who can take Ultimecia's powers when she dies
>Sorceress from the past returns to her own time with ultimate power, and must be put to death
>Powers pass from host to host until, in the distant future, they again reach the girl who becomes Ultimecia
>>342666830
But when they beat Garland the time loop was destroyed and the timeline completely changed. It's implied that Chaos killed the light warriors numerous times perpetuating the loop and creating the prophecy. So it's the opposite, the world believed they'd succeed because they had already lost.
>>342664304
The Emperor is pretty badass. Conquers and enslaves half the world, nukes the other half, conquers hell, conquers heaven, gets killed but lives on anyway by enslaving a summon spirit. How does this guy keep losing to random dudes?
>>342666708
>Muh lolis
