Why the fuck are 2.5D games even allowed? There are so fucking ugly. every single one looks like garbage and always has. I thought we got over the "2D games look bad" meme in the early 2000s. holy shit.
>>342022402
Shadow Comples looked pretty good.
>>342022402
so much this
game like ori and ghost song just proving it
I love 2d games so much
let's post some godlike 2d games
>>342022402
guilty gear xrd looks pretty good m8
so does bloodstained tbqh, but it's at least a year out
Where the fuck is my demo, Iga? You said we'd get the demo!
>>342022402
Bloodstained is 2.5D because they said they couldn't afford good spritework budget, which is believeable since good sprites cost a fuckton and the only reason the GBA and DS games were even being made with their meager budget is because they kept recycling whatever they could from the previous games, mostly Rondo and SotN.
Just look at another fully made from the ground up (visually) Castlevania made under Konami, namely Dracula X Chronicles (the PSP remake of Rondo). It was 2.5D because they couldn't afford proper 2D remake with their non-existant budget.
>>342022770
>>342022965
Ori had Microsoft budget, Rayman had Ubisoft. Bloodstained has nothing.
>inb4 muh Vanillaware
I too love cardboard cutout paperdoll animations and virtually 0 enemy and boss variety.
Vanillaware art is amazing but they clearly can't afford to make a game as big as Castlevania in their art style.
With that said and done however, Vanillaware shit does look great, at least when it isn't moving.
>>342023253
>Ori had Microsoft budget
ok so how about ghost song?
$54000, made by one guy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eujm3ZQWjdk
>>342023919
It's not even out and the sprites look pretty bad, especially the animations.
You clearly never played Castlevania since Castlevania sprites are SMOOTH as fuck. Tons of animation frames.
>>342024047
still looks better than bloodstained
>you clearly never played Castlevania
bitch i've played sotn more than i can remember
>>342023919
>Metroid clone
Metroid clones can get away with tremendous amounts of palette swaps, minimum-detail enemy design and fairly basic environments. SotN had something like 50 unique enemy designs or more and pretty varied enrivonments, and Bloodstained has to top that.
I doubt Ghost Song will be within spitting distance of Super Metroid in terms of size or complexity, but I'll be impressed if it is.
>>342023919
game is a blatent super metroid rip off.
>>342024394
like a said, one fucking guy vs 3m igavania
>>342024489
should nintendo sue?
>>342022965
Ori is very pretty but that's really all it has. The platforming wasn't anything special and the combat is largely mediocre, poor even.
>>342022402
Because making actual 2D games takes effort and talent.
>>342023919
>$54000, made by one guy
You understand how development work right? He doesn't have employees to pay. That's why he can do this. He probably lives with someone or has another job to sustain himself and the money from the kickstarter is just a bonus. It's why the game isn't released after two years.
>>342024684
for you
>>342024257
>still looks better than bloodstained
The environments sure, the character and enemy sprites look worse than Bloodstained by far and their animations are terrible.
>>342024684
The platforming is basic but the controls are so tight I still found it really enjoyable. The level design was largely pretty interesting too
>>342024846
so that's why this 3 million project looks like shit? gotcha
>>342023253
Vanillaware's artwork is some of the ugliest shit I have ever seen, about on par with their animations
>>342024562
And how big is it actually going to be? Like I said, Bloodstained has to top SotN in every capacity.
Every shot in that video looked almost identical bar some palette-swapping. No shit that can be done by one guy given enough time.
>>342025162
No that's because you're looking at an alpha screenshot with no shading you fucking moron
>>342025162
No, it looks like shit because it's not fucking done, you mongoloid.
>>342025162
>implying 3 million is a lot of money
Grow up. I spend more than that every month just on living expenses.
>>342023253
>couldn't afford sprites
yeah goddamn those millionaire sprite artists who refuse to work for anything less than high art.
2.5D was a CHOICE not a settlement. Now Mighty Number 9 on the other hand...
>>342025201
shoo shoo kotaku shoo shoo
don't you have to pay Hogan and suck IGN's cock?
>>342025375
>>342025343
>>342025394
>t. Blunderstained backers
>>342025394
>sprite artists
Name 10
IGA is focusing on the gameplay and that's all that matters. You can keep your artsy games to yourself.
>>342025343
>>342025375
>>342025376
it's the japs hacks apologists episode
>>342025162
>show a legitimately pre-alpha screenshot several weeks after development began
>CAN YOU BELIEVE HOW SHIT THIS FINAL PRODUCT LOOKS?
this has to be bait, no one can be this stupid
>>342022402
What about fighting games like Super Smash Bros?
I think 2.5D is fine. Games like Valkyrie Profile 2 and Trine look great. The demo footage from Bloodstained looks good too. I really don't understand what all the bitching is for.
>>342025683
>>342025375
>>342025343
>>342025376
ok guys, one of the latest screenshots
got anything to say?
>>342022402
I just want a 2D metroid for the NX. Is that too much to ask Nintenjews?
;_;
>>342025629
the burden is on you fampai. i said there weren't good sprite artists that would work for cheap sarcastically, you came at me with name them?
>>342025507
idk what kotaku said about vanillaware (though it was probably something about feminism) but I've hated it since odinsphere
>>342025983
Axiom Verge just went multiplat.
>>342025983
Has there been a single 2D game on a nintendo console since the N64?
Why does every fucker in /v/ wants to see games fail? Did TORtanic left that much of a shockwave?
>>342026095
>idk what kotaku said about vanillaware
said the titty queen Sorceress was a loli and railed against the artist Kamitani
>but I've hated it since odin sphere
shit taste
>>342023113
guilty gear xrd is 3D presented in a 2D way
>>342025920
looks great
>>342026212
Four Swords Adventures?
>>342026308
>shit taste
that's like, your opinion, man
>>342026238
It left a hole that /v/ has been desperately trying to fill.
>>342026360
Bloodstained is the same
>>342026238
TORtanic put /v/ on the map in the way that the fappening put /b/ on the map, so of course new people who stumble into this place try to replicate all their epic maymay screencaps whenever they post
>>342026238
tortanic needs to be filtered
you dipshits come and shit in threads so you can meme
just leave the board
>>342026437
shitstained is not even close the xrd cel shading
>Wario Land Shake It
>beautiful looking game
>every single frame of Wario's animations were painstakingly hand drawn
>sold like shit
It just isn't worth it anymore, OP. 3D modeling is easier and it's what most game developers know now.
>>342022402
Guilty Gear exists, so your opinion is irrelevant.
>>342023252
>Conned by the con man
Bloodstained looks more like castlevania than any of the other 3D ones anyway so what is the issue? I was never wowed by the sprite backgrounds in a single castlevania. It was never a series i played for the visuals.
>>342026662
this was not a very good game, also
>wii selling anything but mario and wii sport
>>342026360
yeah m8 that's what people complaining about 2.5d games are talking about
3d games that have a fixed plane so the game is 2d
they're upset that the game uses models instead of sprites
then they jerkoff over vanillaware, whose games only look good in screenshots
>>342022402
Bloodstained looks fine, as do several other 2.5D games. You're letting your nostalgia for 2D spritework color your opinion. There are plenty of bad looking 2D games to go along with the good ones, and plenty of good looking 2.5D games to go along with the bad ones.
bad rats is 2.5D and it's also a great game
>>342022402
2D isn't the same as it used to be. 2D now is largely tweening and warping, which to me, looks like total ass. Looks like paper cut-outs sliding across the screen.
>>342026958
your post is why Operation Rainfall happened.
Iwata abandoned the hardcore fans for the grandmas.
>>342024394
>SotN had something like 50 unique enemy designs
Damn really? Such a great game. Shame I never bought it back then.
>>342027195
I did not bought the wii
So are shitposters trying a different aproach to their bait threads?
>>342022965
Ori looked great but was otherwise mediocre. I was so disappointed once I finally played it.
>>342027164
>OW THE EDGE Incredible Machine ripoff
>greatI know you are being sarcastic I just wanted to giving you a (you) for mentioning some obscure game
fully agree. Sadly spritework is expensive.
If im going to have 2.5d I prefer the characters to be the 2d and the backgrounds 3d. They can at least do that
PSP was the kind of garbage 2.5d "remakes" that looked worse than the original.
>>342027106
>and plenty of good looking 2.5D
post them
>>342025920
that doesn't look too bad except for the cannons
Crystal Shards and Klonoa 2 were alright, so was Viewtiful Joe.
>>342024394
SotN also stole sprites from previous games. And I don't think it was near 50 enemies.
>>342027402
Dracula Chronicles X comes to mind.
JUST MUDDY N' BROWN MY SHIT UP
>>342022402
I'm not crazy about 2.5 but I'm sure this will turn out fine. I don't think anyone other than Vanillaware really makes 2d these days anyway.
>>342027402
though as an aside I thought that that mickey and the Castle of Illusions remake looked pretty good.
I think 2.5d is at its strongest when the camera actually moves like a 3d game (pandaemonium on the ps1 as an example) while the gameplay remains 2d.
![GuiltyGear-7[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/h7EQIox.jpg "GuiltyGear-7[1].jpg")
pales in comparison to the original sprites but still looks alright
it's cheaper to make passable looking 3D graphics to put into 2D gameplay than making passable 2D graphics, which typically require custom drawn animations for each action in the game.
>>342027683
forgot my image
2.5D can look good if the devs do it right or actually make an environment take advantage of the 3D for great backgrounds or unique setups. But often it's done poorly, as if the devs wanted to cut their costs more easily for a 2D-style game yet didn't want to make a full 3D one.
If you tell me Einhander is a shit 2.5D game, you can go kill yourself.
>>342022402
where is the fucking demo?
>>342027898
I loved Einhander and R-Type Delta in the PS1. Soldner X games also look good.
>>342027402
Painted backgrounds are the better strategy if you want scenes to look good. They don't have to move (although you can have animated layers). Look at Ori, which people are jerking off.
Ori's sprites on the other hand were made using 3d models, which is where reducing labor costs for animation are a benefit.
>>342026858
Cyclists should be purged. It should be illegal to ride a bike during rush hour.
>>342026651
Xrd was in development for quite some time before they showed it off. It took them a long time to get the look right. Bloodstained has only been in development for a year. Xrd also a much smaller scale game with no more than two characters on screen at once and single screen backgrounds. Bloodstained is far more complicated and would be a nightmare to tweak everything to look like Xrd. Comparing the two is retarded because the games and the amount of effort required to get that look in them are vastly different.
>>342027714
Doesn't pale at all. Although the models have some imperfections, I have a hard time looking at XX sprites now from how good Xrd looks. This coming from someone who spent hundreds of hours playing #Reload and AC+.
Modern sonic games look pretty good when it switches to 2D. Although that's probably the engine and backgrounds being so good that it doesn't matter if it's still 3D graphics
>>342028162
I mostly walk or take public transport. Most drivers are cool, cyclists are annoying because they acts like pedestrians when it's convenient and cars when that's convenient. Fucking wafflers.
>>342026125
No I want a 2D AAA Metroid game on consoles. I'll except handheld as long as it's also 2D but I definitely prefer console. The potential would be insane but sadly Nintendo doesn't care about Metroid.
>>342026212
Sure there has. Vuetiful Joe comes to mind.
>>342022402
>game looks worse than some indie game made in some dude's basement
>>342028084
id call Ori full 2d and not 2.5d personally. I think Rayman Origins was made similarly.
It's hard to find good pictures, but this game looked much better than MN9 imo.
>>342027530
>SotN also stole sprites from previous games.
It had way more unique variations than any previous game, including Rondo, like something close to double. Previous threads mentioned a total of 150-something odd different enemies. Obviously some of those will be palette-swaps, but it's still a fucking ton, each with unique animations. That's not something that's easy to replicate from the ground up.
>>342026403
>>342028364
I didn't think of either of these nor the paper mario games at first, but there still aren't very many
>>342022402
Eh melee doesn't look bad, especially considering how old it is.
>>342028516
That was a game where the backgrounds were more of a focus than the character models. Especially since actual cutscenes were usually either CGI or paused gameplay with text dialogue overtop. You occasionally got close-ups on the character models and they were pretty simple, nothing to write home about.
But then that game also used the cel shading properly compared to MN9's weird pseudo-cel UE3 shading.
>>342028516
just post megaman x8
>>342027416
Off the top of my head: Trine 2, Klonoa, Klonoa 2, Klonoa Wii, Xrd, Lost in Shadow, NSMBU, Nights, Shadow Complex, Outland.
>>342027530
>SotN also stole sprites from previous games
>mfw castlevania games were still using that SNES skeleton sprite well over 20 years later
could konami not have found a budget for some of that shit?
>>342028613
given how it's cheaper to make games today than then I highly doubt it. I all comes down to them being lazy since it's clearly show it can be done
>>342028797
I really FUCKING love this game, fuck nostagiafags.
>>342028797
>emulated
But the game is on PC too.
>>342028837
ori is still better
>>342028951
That's kind of why I liked Aria of Sorrow and Circle of the Moon and Harmony of Dissonance to some extend, most of the assets in those games are original because of the artstyles.
>>342028991
PC version of the game only allows you to play at the maximum of 720.(Onimusha 3 also has this issue) Unless there is some fanpatch that makes it go past 720 then emulated is better
>>342028989
Good game easily in my top five X titles
>>342027530
>stole
That's not what that word means you little shit
As long as they manually animate all animations in Bloodstained instead of relying on animation blending I think it will be fine.
Just like I SotN like actually having proper transition animations and what not.
Thats why Ori's animations look so good as well.
The developer had a talk about techniques he used and basically he had a script that told him where transition animations were missing and hed create those.
>>342028162
They have as much right to use a road as anyone else.
>>342026662
It also wasn't as good as any WL before it.
>>342027714
I find myself forgetting that this game is 2.5D and then every now and then i notice it during supers/KO freezes and just kinda go "wow"
>>342028162
>tfw live in a city where most people travel by bike
>bikes are treated like vehicles and nobody minds
It's great really
>>342029213
Ah, so that's why you were playing it emulated. I myself don't mind the low resolution, but I can see why it'd bother people.
And I'll agree with you and the other guy that X8 is one of the best X games.
>>342027714
But Arcsys sprites and animations are really bad...
Post yfw you didn't back this shit
>>342029349
its fucking obnoxious when you are caught behind one on a small road. Or even worse, behind one behind a truck.
You get a pas if you're doing it for transport, but if its for exercise there is no excuse.
>>342029585
Oh yeah?!
>>342029349
Not when there are sidewalks that are legal to ride on
>>342028968
>given how it's cheaper to make games today than then I highly doubt it.
You say this based on what, exactly?
>I all comes down to them being lazy since it's clearly show it can be done
Show me an example of a modern 2D game with SotN levels of complexity and detail that wasn't funded by a major publisher. Go on.
>>342029612
forgot pic
This game wasnt beautiful or graphically impressive, but i still think it's one of the better looking 2.5d games due to how it's been stylized.
>>342022402
At least post a reasonable size of the image. I can't wait until this "2.5D" games look like shit, meme ends.
>>342029349
No they should be on the fucking sidewalk so they don't slow the flow of traffic and pedestrians on foot are far fewer than those in vehicles. Not to mention those cyclist tend to ignore the rules of the road and get themselves hit all the time slowing traffic even more. Fuck cyclist
>>342022402
>2D games look ugly meme
nobody thinks that, dude, sprites are just really hard to make.
>>342027402
>Sadly spritework is expensive.
Why?
>>342029759
That one furfag game
>>342029349
>Too fucking slow and small to use the road properly
>Too 'fast and hazardous to pedestrians' to use pavements
I hate that it's illegal to cycle on pavements in this country.
I've nothing against cycling in general, but almost every major traffic problem in my area during rush hour is due to cyclists. Cyclists fuck everyone's day over.
>>342029817
This game is surprisingly fun.
only problem I saw with the bloodstained footage was that both damage dealt and taken share the same font color and skill acquisition/level up animations take too long
>>342029894
nigga please
>>342030229
I love it, only bad part is it's a bit easy and some bosses are pretty lame
>>342030071
Freedom Planet? That didn't have anywhere near SotN level enemy variety. It did have pretty busy level design, I'll give you that.
>>342029962
Why do cyclists never pay attention to right of way?
They pull out in front of me all the time.
>>342030173
It's legal in Florida and as far as I'm concerned if they're riding on a normal speed road with a parallel sidewalk then any accident is their fault
>>342030328
The other fur fag game one
>2016
>living in a city
>>342030328
I think he's talking about Elysian Tail or something like that.
>>342028797
X8 looks like shit.
>>342026238
>>342026413
>>342026492
>WAAAAAAH! I BACKED A COLLOSSAL SHIT AND AM GETTING SCAMMED AGAIN SO I AM JUST GOING TO DAMAGE CONTROL! WAAAAAAAH!!!
Fuck off and let the adults discuss Conman Iga and his Blunderstained scam
>>342030449
I'm sure that the judge at your trial will be sympathetic to your position.
>>342030495
>8453
>living
>>342029894
>>342030280
Honstly, the only thing specifically bad in comparison to the concept art is the colour scheme.
>>342030628
>GETTING SCAMMED AGAIN
nice projecting, anon.
don't forget to take your meds.
>>342030649
I'm not saying I'd hit him...
>>342025162
I still like that room. It has a really comfy vibe like Juste's place in HoD.
>>342025771
ugly games that look like shit?
Street fighter 4 is the worst offender.
>>342030961
Christ, I forgot how painfull garish HoD looked.
I still like it more than PoR though.
>>342022402
Mortal kombat reboot looked good.
>>342029098
Looking? Definitely. It's gorgeous. It's just not a very good game. It's one of the few games I actually bought for my Xbone (which was a terrible purchase btw) and while the game wasn't bad it wasn't good either. It's the definition of mediocre.
>>342024684
>>342027374
NO YOU FUCKING NORMIES!! IF A GAME DOESN'T LOOK GOOD IN A SCREEN SHOT I CAN UPLOAD TO /v/ THEN IT IS SHIT!! IT IS FUCKING SHIT!!!!!!!!
>>342030586
It's 12 years old and still looks better than mem number 9
>>342023253
Huh, did not think of budget constraints being the factor behind so much sprite recycling, seeing the same enemies over and over in the span of 5-7 games gave Morrigan sprite a run for its money
>>342030070
It isn't expensive, it's just bad 3D is cheap as fuck. There is no excuse.
>>342030280
This looks uglier
>>342029254
You know what I meant.
>>342030328
Freedom Planet levels had tons of copy-pasted portions to make the levels bigger.
Today I will remind them.
IS THE DEMO OUT?!! PLEASE RESPOND
>>342031302
better to look good than simply look different. I have no problem with recycling sprites.
>>342031626
>>342031732
Oh me either, the sprites are some of the best in the era, maybe of all time.
>>342031634
No, we fell for it
>>342030070
Tons of work and hours for what 3D can replicate and unlike sprites, said 3D models can be reused for other things.
>>342031920
Sprites were often a return on the investment, it's how so many fighting games could get released, especially VS games with lots of characters.
>>342031432
>>342030070
>>342029817
too bad it was boring
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzAGkLOJ-No
SOON.
>>342030070
"spritework is expensive" is a popular meme, and while there's a misunderstanding at its root, it's true in some ways:
-It's expensive in terms of texture memory. Memory usage grows quadratically with resolution and GPU texture compression techniques, which have to allow random access, are lossy and suck for pixel art. That being said if you throw a good programmer at the problem, it's solvable. That's the case with lab zero's engine, which stores the sprites in conventional memory with very efficient non-random access compression and uncompresses and movies them to the GPU on-demand. They're the only company that adressed that problem, for some reason others still use uncompressed sprites like idiots, or skeletal animation styles like Ubi.
-The workload of pixel art scales up poorly. Makes sense when pixel count grows quadratically. Pixel art is a tool to convey detail at low resolution and so it's an error to use it for hi res stuff. Use non-pixel styles instead.
-Retakes are expensive in traditional animation. Want to change a character's design? Gotta change all frames. Wanna change a move? Gotta draw new frames for the new anim. That one's the cincher, because most game producers are used to the 3D way, where the initial model and rig are expensive to make but anims can easily be added and the model can be changed while keeping the anims. That means with 3d you can create your assets early and change them late, while with sprites you're better off working with very rough drawings until you're sure you've got the gameplay down, then clean them up and add details. and frames, moving the art phase after the design phase. Most game producers simply don't know that. You've gotta be familiar with 2d production to handle that and since 2d games are rare nowadays, the knowledge is being lost.
>>342026698
>play on emulator
>bind waggle to a button
>is slightly more tolerable
PC wins again :'^)
>>342025394
You do know that Japan doesn't work like your minimalist indie devs, right?
>>342032391
Looks neat but why is it in 4:3?
>>342032391
I kinda get the criticism for Bloodstained now in terms of the need for it. Like for people who haven't played SoTN and they see Bloodstained, why not just play SoTN and those games? Bloodstained doesn't look like it's doing much different than CV so far.
But this... this looks 1:1 with Metal Slug, like were these guys even trying to do anything different at all? I personally have no problem with that but I can see how people would, there's like 10 Metal Slug games already after all.
>>342032847
it's a neo geo game
>>342033184
Oh, no wonder.
I wonder how much was Vanillaware, and Ori developers budget to make their games.
>>342032391
>Metal Slug clone
>it actually looks kinda good
MUH FUCKING DUCK
>>342033181
>there's like 10 Metal Slug games
And the majority of them suck shit.
>>342032847
Because the company develop for weird platforms like the Dreamcast, NEO GEO AES, etc to be authentic.
Take NEO XYZ, a SHUMP, they released a few years ago:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sh8atZxKzCA
>>342023253
is leifthraiser even worth checking out? never bothered with the original odin sphere, but it seems like those games that are praised solely because they look nice (which I don't even think vanillaware games look that great)
>>342033505
Plays like muramasa now so it's an improvement and has more content than the original. I say go for it
>>342033398
>Vanillaware
If you added every unique enemy design from Muramasa, Odin Sphere and DC together, you might at a push have the same variety as SotN. Maybe.
>Ori
No variety whatsoever. Multicoloured light blobs for days.
>>342033505
There is a demo available. Everything about the gameplay has been updated and made a lot more fun. Still stuck revisting the same environments a lot, but it's a lot easier to take now because the characters are more fun to play as / more different than they were before.
>>342033181
Bloodstained is already doing a few things differently. For 1, they included kicking weapons. So that's a new weapon type, perhaps more to look forward to? And they've taking advantage of the 3D space, with more background elements like pieces of the shit being broken through, and the boss alters her attack from back to side. But yes, it's most the same. However, I figure if they keep peppering in new things as development goes on, then you might have a considerably new experience.
>>342032439
>Pixel art is a tool to convey detail at low resolution and so it's an error to use it for hi res stuff. Use non-pixel styles instead.
Well this explains a lot. Modern tv's have much higher resolution.
>>342032439
>You've gotta be familiar with 2d production to handle that and since 2d games are rare nowadays, the knowledge is being lost.
This is sad to hear.
>>342026238
TORtanic was a lot of fun, but I think it has to do with the large number of contrarian autists we have.
>>342033181
But these fanbases WANT more of the same. Castlevania fans were clamoring for another Metroidvania, especially after years of nothing but Lords of Shadow. And now we only have Castlevania pachinko to look forward to. So yeah, the whole point is to continue the Castlevania style of games Iga made before. The game is mainly trying to appeal to longtime fans who already played all of the other games.
>>342028398
He's still working on the right? I haven't heard much out of him.
>>342033505
They're praised because they're good games. Try the demo and make up your own mind.And get your eyes checked.
>>342034450
>>342034806
I think the biggest thing Bloodstained is doing in terms of bringing "new" stuff to the igavania format is;
1. it's a legit HD game for real consoles
2. biggest castle since SoTN
These two things can both appeal to new fans who heard of how great SoTN was and old fans of SoTN who loved it but didn't like the hand held follow ups for whatever reasons. So this is the first time an igavania game has had a fighting chance since SoTN. I'm pretty happy about it as a backer myself.
>>342034572
>Well this explains a lot. Modern tv's have much higher resolution.
No, I'm talking about the game's internal resolution. The TV's resolution only matters as far as rescaling algorithms go, because even gorgeous art can be ruined by poor upscaling.
>>342034903
working on it still but due to the 3ds port the game is super delayed. it's presenting him with the most issue. Since he wants the whole thing to release at once we have to wait for the 3ds users as the game was suppose to come out five months ago
I know I can't exactly prove that I'm credential but basically it's like this.
The average person who plays video games doesn't buy a game based on how good the graphics are. The only time a game gets more sales based on graphics is when the graphics are advertised as "THE GREATEST BESTEST MOST HIGH END GRAPHICS IN THE WORLD" because everyone wants to experience this eye-sex for themselves.
Otherwise graphics quality isn't that big of a deal. Most people can't even tell the difference between 2 decent looking games. Style on the other hand is what plays a large part. Style is much more loud and easy to identify just by a glance. People will buy games because it has an anime style or because it has a gritty style or because it has a steampunk style, etc etc.
And so as a result, 2D sprite based games sell worse then their counterparts. Period.
2D fighting games sell worse than 3D ones
2D RPG's sell worse than 3D ones
2D sidescrollers sell worse than 3D ones
And so on.
There just seems to be an unfortunate stigma attached to 2D games. I've talked to people who thing it looks cheap or question "well why don't they just make it 3D" and so on. It's why despite all of graphics backlash that new King of Fighters game is getting, it will without a doubt sell better than XIII by virtue of being 3D alone.
>>342022402
Why the fuck are games even allowed? There are so fucking ugly. every single one looks like garbage and always has. I thought we got over the "games are bad" meme in the early 1800s. holy shit.
>>342035156
A lot of people are unwilling to admit that for all the work they put into KoFXIII's sprites, they weren't really that good.
>>342035030
Yeah I'm also a backer and pleased with it so far. There's plenty of room for improvement but they have a lot of development time left. I'm psyched about the large castle but I hope he makes it challenging. I love SotN and Iga's handheld games, but they were far too easy (even OoE). CotM is the only one I felt got difficulty right, and generic had nothing to do with it. I doubt Bloodstained will be that hard, but hopefully it won't be a cakewalk either.
>>342035582
sometimes the sprites came out well animated. other times they were so choppy it was hard to tell what was going on and all the characters look like they had their abs painted on.
>>342029740
I fucking wish
>Lawmakers are all 80 year old "get off my lawn you whipper shnapper" types
>of course they pass laws saying you can't bike on sidewalks, despite the fact that my city has 8 feet wide sidewalks
>can't skateboard/longboard on them either
>people bitch at you when you take up 1 foot of space in the shoulder of the road
There's no winning.
>>342035352
This tbqhwyf. Every game ever made is ugly to my standards and so none should ever be made cause I said so.
>>342035582
Biggest issue with the graphics in that game were the hitsparks.
They were as obnoxious as humanely possible and at times would completely obscure whatever the character is doing.
>>342035156
>people buy games based on style instead of INCREDIBLE GRAPHICS
Depends on the market segment you're talking about, but sure.
As an aside, during the 2D generation, because everything was sprites on certain platforms, style was the only thing differentiating one sprite-based game from another.
>that's why people don't buy sprite-based games anymore
No. Part of the problem is screen pixel density. Sprites that look great at their original resolution look like ass when upscaled to fill a 1080p screen. That's why the default GBA/DS/etc. emulator windows are so small, because monitor pixels are much smaller than the pixels on those devices.
Pic related. It's 480x640, and looks good at native resolution, but if you scaled it up, it'd look pretty bad. And preserving that level of detail over 1080p would be insane.
Sprite art is based off of every single pixel mattering to the overall design. That simply doesn't work on a larger display, where each pixel is incredibly tiny, so you either have to upscale everything (which looks like shit), or have much simpler sprites (like KOF did).
That's why 'pixel art' now looks cheap: it's either upscaled, and thus blocky looking, or much simpler.
Speaking of style, KOF XIII's sprite style was bad even compared to contemporary titles like Blazblue CS.
3D, however, upscales really, really well (other than textures, and it's easier to produce high-res textures than high-res sprites). It makes sense that 3D is more and more popular, since screens are getting bigger and bigger, and single pixels are getting smaller and smaller.
>>342036768
HD was a mistake
>>342034572
The best you can hope for in the future is to have actual animation companies do your spritework for you like Production I.G. helping Nintendo make Wario Land Shake It!
>Wario Land: Shake It! was developed by Japanese video game developer Good-Feel. Madoka Yamauchi was the game's director, while Takahiro Harada and Etsunobu Ebisu were the producers. Yamauchi proposed the hand-drawn art style seen in the final game, though Tsukawaki was initially opposed to the idea since future changes to a character's design meant changes to all of its individual animation frames.
>Over 2,000 frames were drawn to animate over 200 actions for Wario alone; over 6,000 frames were drawn for all enemy characters, including those that were removed from the final game. All the game's backgrounds and scenery were also hand-drawn.
>Program director Koichi Yagi stated that clever programming techniques were required to efficiently store and handle both the non-repeating backgrounds and the thousands of character frames in the Wii console RAM during gameplay.
>Japanese anime studio Production I.G assisted with character animations and both the opening and closing cutscenes, while studio Kusanagi drew the backgrounds.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wario_Land:_Shake_It!#Development
>>342037553
It was.
>>342035156
/v/irgins will argue this but it's the reality. I had a teaching job a few years back and had the chance to show some students some classic games, all the pixelated games were automatically met with negative reactions. Kids hate 2D like you probably would've hated silent black and white movies compared to modern movies as a kid despite their value being mostly subjective. This probably goes for normies too I'd imagine.
>>342038019
>pixelated
it's the upscaling. Pixel art is going to look bad on anything above its intended resolution (and some pixel art looks bad at its intended resolution).
