How the fuck was Witcher 3 able to make a large open world with cities than actually felt like cities, with numerous towns and expansive forests/grassfields etc., while Skyrim failed to do so?
All at a lower budget and smaller team? I'm genuinely curious.
>>341973693
Because Skyrim was made with 256mb ram limitations in mind and has 100 times more background scripts running at every moment. And the fact you can interact with every Skyrim NPC, kill them, steal them, follow their schedule while W3 NPC are just there.
It's not hard.
>>341973880
>It's not hard.
>>341973880
I'm sick of your lies Todd.
>>341973693
bethesda is overrated
>>341974110
>>341974110
What lies?
You could climb the mountain
Skyrim had infinite quests
Fallout 3 had over 300 endings
>>341973693
Because Bethesda builds their worlds like themeparks while Witcher 3 in particular used its world as backdrop for stories it wanted to tell. Although it does help Novigrad is probably the best city in any RPG ever made, though.
how to do i make two graphic mods work together when they are only conflicting partly (i think)?
>>341974409
You can't, whichever you install second will overwrite the overlapping parts of the first.
>>341973693
It takes a team effort to make something like this.
But Skyrim was made by Bethesda, so there is your answer.
>>341974356
>Because Bethesda builds their worlds like themeparks while Witcher 3 in particular used its world as backdrop for stories it wanted to tell.
this. which is why constant comparisons are ridiculous and people have no idea what they're talking about. games have different focuses even if they appear to be very similar at first.
>>341974356
>Novigrad is probably the best city in any RPG ever made, though.
Nope, that would be Toussaint, it's even better
>>341974448
well that's disappointing, graphic mods should have been better implanted.
>>341974338
>Fallout 3 had over 300 endings
it did?
>>341974686
*implemented
I for one absolutely LOVED Skyrim™. It has a MUCH better world than stupid old Witcher 3. You can even climb the mountains! By the way guys have you preordered Skyrim™: Remastered? It looks so rad, dude!
>>341973693
Better question is really what DOES Bethesda spend their development time on? I mean, look at what CDPR produced for Witcher 3 compared to 2 and that's with engine upgrades included in development cycle.
Every character in Skyrim is a named character with their own dialogue options, schedule and belongings, etc and you can enter every building, which is not the case in Witcher 3.
If Skyrim had one or two named NPCs with dialogue per town and a bunch of no-name NPCs that just wondered around, and you only had access to a few of the buildings then they'd probably have more "immersive" cities, towns etc
That being said... Fallout 4. Maybe they've just run out of ideas.
>>341974503
I wouldn't call it a focus, it's the way both companies chose to make their games but both games have the same goal in mind at the most general level
it's like hand-made vs mashine-made craft
>>341973880
>mfw es6 will have a meaty 5gb vram on consoles to make a sexy big sandbox map
I won't lie, I get hard over massive mythological world's like that. If eso wasn't so shit and expensive I'd be playing that right now.
Here's a question though:
How will the new es6 work when eso exists? As in, they'll have to follow the exact same storyline as eso which will probably kill the gane because you can just read the lore in eso to find out what happens in es6. Also if anyone is dead or gets killed in eso they won't be in es6. What makes it worse is that they can't even split up the two games in terms of lore because they know lorefags will go crazy at them.
>>341974801
Maybe if you take each subplot's ending, then you may get a combinatorial explosion, but in any case it's essentially "two endings for this questline" times "two endings for this questline" etc., rather than the "my story can end in 300 unique ways" thing that people expect.
>>341973693
>mfw Witcher 3's cutscenes and "lifelike NPC interactions" everyone praised were generated through computer algorithm and then touched up by hand
You know what the sad part is? Inquisition's hand-crafted cutscenes come off as more robotic through sheer incompetence on Bioware's behalf. How does that even happen?
>>341975112
Game*
>>341975112
What? ESO is a prequel.
>>341975112
Have you played TESO? It's set in 2E so no overlap whatsoever.
>>341975112
>mfw es6 will have a meaty 5gb vram on consoles to make a sexy big sandbox map
Then why was Fallout 4 shit?
Wrong. 200 people were involved in w3 development as opposed to skyrim 100, also it had similar budget of 80 mil dollars(excluding marketing).
>>341975175
Like you said, incompetence. I also have a feeling that no one really truly cares about it, and it has that EA soulless feel to it. TW3 is not perfect, but it's clear that a lot of passion went into it.
>>341975215
>>341975242
You think they'll add books and hints to es6 in eso?
Also why do I get this feeling that they'll try to market eso to everyone playing es6 as in they create a sick side storyline but they create a shit half ending to it and then be like "finish the story in ESO!"
>>341975162
>but in any case it's essentially "two endings for this questline" times "two endings for this questline" etc., rather than the "my story can end in 300 unique ways" thing that people expect.
exactly
>>341974960
Skyrim has 1087 voiced characters, Wicher 3 has 407.
Skyrim has almost 3 times the amount of people to talk to.
>>341973693
A combination of caring about what you make and slavic technosorcery.
>>341973693
Effort.
Something Todd Howard is afraid of.
>>341975559
Yeah and about 300 of them all took an arrow to the knee. Nice one Todd.
>>341975549
ESO is Zenimax, ES mainline titles are Bethesda. The only relation they have is being set in the same universe. ESO will never be referenced or alluded to in any of the main games.
>>341974531
Haven't played it yet so I can't comment, but that's even better if true.
>>341973693
Their dev team's made up of competent menand women
>>341973693
One of the main reasons is the inside of the buildings. One of the reasons I didn't like skyrim is that if I entered a house I felt like I didn't leave the outside map at all. The ambiance felft the same. That was not the case in The Witcher.
>TES
>Bethesda
Anyone with a brain already stopped caring about Todd after playing things like Gothic.
>>341975296
The world was pretty big it's just the graphics were meh. Fallout 4 was in development before the consoles came out and they probably thought they'll have more horsepower to work with. We saw the same with assassins creed unity when they made a very beautiful game but they had go downgrade it as fuck to work on consoles, like it was running at sub 1080p. The fallout devs were probably targeting 1080p from the off and had to downgrade it to match their target. Don't forget that most multiplats are built with the consoles in mind. The 360 and ps3 had some of the best hardware at the time when they released which allowed them to age well compared to the ps4 and xbox one which had outdated hardware at release. An example of this would be oblivion on the 360. It was the best version of oblivion on release and not even the best gpu at the time could match it.
>>341975691
Me in the middle.
That's my gf standing next to me.
>>341975175
Imagine if someday voicework can also be computer generated at a high quality level, so that we can go back to expansive dialogues, if the writer is so inclined.
On another note, I always wondered whether a semi-open world rpg could work with a large city or castle complex as its setting. A closed space, but meticulously crafted. A city built upon older ruins and different districts, varying from decadent splendor to beggar-filled shady back alleys, from modern architecture to ancient designs in the lower levels.
>>341973693
I would say:
1. CDPR has better management
2. CDPR has a more competent development team
3. CDPR were not constrained by any console limitations
Good management, fewer constraints, and a competent team is what made Witcher 3.
Bethesda/Bioware will never be able to compete; in the former case everyone is lowest bidder type with little experience or lazy as fuck. In the latter case it's filled with incompetent women and SJW cliques who also have little experience and, while they may not be lazy as fuck, waste enormous amounts of time on simple tasks because women being women.
Talent
>>341976084
>3. CDPR were not constrained by any console limitations
Witcher 3 is on consoles though.
Whitcher3 cities are about as realistic and lively as pokemon's. You are just a braindead shit eating neogamer that spend his "game time" looking at trailers and let's players.
>>341976159
Oh, well I guess they were constrained by console limitations.
Guess it's just a case of other development teams being incompetent fuckwits then.
CDPR did it by cutting out all the gameplay and combat from the game.
>>341976275
kek, cause that's the main attraction of elder scrolls amirite
>>341975175
Bioware's inability to make good character animations has always been an issue
Putting aside the eternal X series Vs Y series discussion and the obvious baits for a moment, I have a question about the Ladies of the Wood / Whispering Hillock quest. It's just a question, please, no spoilers.
So, I'm in front the succulent plant which claims to be simply a victim of the Ladies, and I'm not sure if I should free it or kill it like the ladies want.
To sum it up the information I have gathered so far:
>Pro ladies
-The villager says that the Ladies help the village, and that they are the only reason why the village isn't as poor as the other nearby villages.
-the monster kid basically said that they are vindictive bitches but that they are also mostly competent at keeping the whole area in order, and the monster kid seems the only trustworthy person of the whole area.
-their medium is taking care of the kids. As crazy as she's, she clearly love the kids.
Basically, if I help the plant and fight the ladies, there could be heavy bad consequences for the village, the orphanage and the whole area.
>cons ladies
-the succulent plant said that the kids are hostages of the ladies, and it's probably right, an orphanage in the middle of a swamp managed by the ladies' medium is fucking strange
-someone stole the voice of the monster kid, and I still don't know the reason. Also, the crazy medium tried to make the orphans ignore the monster kid with the whole "he's made up, he doesn't exist" shit.
Basically, letting the Ladies do whatever they want doesn't seem a good idea.
The question is: am I missing / forgetting some pieces of information that can help me decide what must be done?
Please, no spoiler or confirmation/denial or dumb joke that are basically spoilers, I just want to think about all the information the game give the player before deciding.
>>341976749
>hurr do I free an ancient horrible fucking demon that's said to be even worse than the crones
think about this using some common sense
>>341976749
dude people are just going to spoil it for you and tell you what you should pick,
Both decisions are pretty much equally bad/good so work it out yourself and pick from there.
>>341976080
>On another note, I always wondered whether a semi-open world rpg could work with a large city or castle complex as its setting. A closed space, but meticulously crafted. A city built upon older ruins and different districts, varying from decadent splendor to beggar-filled shady back alleys, from modern architecture to ancient designs in the lower levels.
I guess we'll find out soon enough.
>>341976749
Gonna try not to spoil anything for ya but there is also a bunch you can find somewhere (I really can't remember where) that isn't a quest book but talks about the 3 ladies and who/what the tree is/was. It might influence you decision on which route to take for the quest.
>>341976749
This is the kind of quest where you must choose between two evils, no good guys here.
>>341976250
>>341976250
>>341976250
This. The game felt like fucking GTA chore simulator. Nivograd is the greatest generic piece of shit ever. If you newfag scrublets want a good example of open world which actually does feel lively with non-generic content, Gothic 3 is the way to go.
>>341976080
>I always wondered whether a semi-open world rpg could work with a large city or castle complex as its setting
Closest we have now is Hub based shit like Deus Ex, and even then theres like 2-3 out of 100 buildings per hub as explorable.
>>341976942
>>341976749
meant to say book not bunch. Anyway the link to the book is here if you can't find it in game. http://witcher.wikia.com/wiki/She_Who_Knows
>>341976749
do you feel nice and comfy in the tree's presence?
>>341977037
>Gothic 3
get the fuck outta here
>>341976749
Being nailed to a living tree.. that is the super natural equivalent of a super-max prison, mate
things nailed to tree's are BAD
also.. the kids are fucked no matter what
there are no happy endings in the Witcher
>>341973693
I seriously cannot grasp why Bethesda is so succesful. Their games look like shit and are bugged as hell on release. Their gameplay mechanics are clunky and basic. Their stories and characters are bland.
Literally everything about their games feels cheap and rushed. They fail at technology, they fail at gameplay, they fail at story. Yet everyone gobbles their shit up like there's no tomorrow. And no, mods are not even an argument because their shit sells on consoles like hot cakes as well.
>>341976749
There's a book in the game that should tip the scales to the crones' advantage
The tree is basically an ancient vengeful arch-evil, crones are light-weight compared to it
>>341973693
TW3 was made on an old toaster by a handful of Slavs in between squatting sessions.
Skyrim was made by Americans.
Because those Poles wanted to make a good game, while Bethesda just wanted your money.
>>341977190
>I seriously cannot grasp why Bethesda is so succesful.
Because they're literally the only ones doing their shtick. Yeah, there are open world games, but most of them aren't RPGs and few that are don't fit Bethesda's mold.
>>341977131
Just fucking kill yourself dumb frogposter
>>341973693
Because this.
After Two Worlds 2.... people stopped making rpgs
oh god that game..
>>341977190
literally one reason
>easy modding
>>341977391
>calls me dumb
>claims that Gothic 3 is an example of a good-looking and working world
It's shit precisely because they tried to be too much like TES. Play Gothic 1 or 2, shitstain man.
>>341977472
g2 notr.. excellent
Daily reminder that if you're not playing gwent you're not playing the real game.
>>341977425
Then why does their crap sell on consoles so well?
>>341977037
>good example of open world
>lively with non-generic content
>Gothic 3
>>341977472
G3 was shit because it was unfinished. What content is in the game is good, but a good chunk simply isn't because it's just there.
>>341977636
console bros will praise any AAA shit they get
>>341977658
>>341977472
>>341977037
No, really, go play Gothic 2 with expansion and then you'll know what a good RPG with open world is.
>>341977636
dude-bro crowd
So my coworker goes on and on how he loves Elder Scrolls but he's never played Daggerfall
he's also a big Dragon Age fan
I just shook my head and walked away
>>341975559
None of them interesting, none of whom feel like actual people.
>>341976856
>that's said to be even worse than the crones
Been a while since I played but where does it say this?
>>341977739
It's fundamentally flawed and designed in a crappy way. The combat sucks. The world is less interesting and themed. You talk to the fucking gods personally, and the plot is a mess. Characters look like something that makes fucking Klayman appear human. On top of it all, everything is stretched and some things make no sense if you've played the previous games.
Fuck Gothic 3 and fuck its apologists. Gothic ended on NotR.
>>341977991
A book that was already mentioned here.
>>341973693
Most likely because of more capable personnel and ones who are actually interested in making games rather than riding on the IP name and churning out half-baked products and hoping the modding community fixes them.
Proper allocation of shekels counts too. There are some out there who would just throw too much money on PR/viral and hoping the bad reviews/impressions go away.
I'm just glad they ended it on a rather high note and know when to stop. Others would probably be tempted to continue and milk out a series until it becomes another brain-dead cash cow.
Because CDPR care about their games and fans
The reason why Bethesda keep making shit games is because they know people will buy them no matter what and will praise them so why bother with a good game when you can make a mediocre game and hype it up?
People who don't play video games have no experience with older games so games like Skyrim set the standard and they think that it's the best thing ever
It's like taking a person who hasn't watched a movie in ages and show him Iron Man 3
You think he gives a shit about story or characters or anything like that?
All he sees is mindless entertainment so he loves it
what's limiting rpg's nowadays..
Writing/worldbuilding
which the Witcher succeeds in easily, due to the plethora of material already crafted
>>341973693
Witcher 3 is made in Poland where the living costs are a lot smaller and workers don't have as many rights.
>>341978226
There's a ton of foreigners working for CDPR now.
>>341973693
because you can only go inside 4 buildings
Daggerfall was utter fucking garbage, and shows how Bethesda have been lazy fucks since the start
>making an interesting sand box is too hard
>lets create a few seeds and let the computer RNG randomize them together into a big pile of shit
>Daggerfall is so big it would take 10,000 years to explore it all!
and the main quest line was like only 5 steps long and dumb as fuck. you were an Imperial prisoner who got shipwrecked or something (god forbid you ever NOT be an imperial prisoner in a TES game) and then you got a MacGuffin and had a choice between 3 or 4 to give it to to turn then into LITERALLY GOD. Give it to the Lich King just so he efficiently genocides the entirety of Daggerfall and turn them into forsaken for the lulz.
BETHESDA IS FUCKING LAZY
>>341977337
And honestly look what happens when other devs try to be Bethesda. You get absolute shit tier stuff like Gothic 3 and Two Worlds.
>>341974012
>>341974110
Everything he said was true, but keep forcing your memes.
Seriously though, every NPC in Skyrim has their own inventory, stats, schedules, names, etc, and nearly every room of every building can be entered. The Witcher 3 goes the Assassin's Creed route which allows for much larger, but less detailed cities.
>>341978141
plenty of book series out there that could be turned into an rpg
but everyone's too cheap to pay for licensing or something,
I won't mention WoT as that was already turned into a game.. and it was a shooter lol
>>341978392
Because everyone's big on their own property so they don't have to pay royalties, licensing fees or whatever. If you can make a good game, make a good game. From what I understand Obsidian was working on a Wheel of Time game but it got cancelled.
>>341978226
This has nothing to do with why Bethesda is so lazy.
They are the only company that's too lazy to build their own fucking engine despite being a financial giant.
>>341978593
What do you mean, anon? Creation Engine was a brand new engine.
>>341974531
Except Toussaint is not a city. You are thinking about Beauclair.
>>341973693
Skyrim cities are like 6 houses.
>>341973693
>>341978531
Imagine a game with a world as broad as WoT,
with hundreds of class/builds
and a random fucking character start lol
that's the kind of game I want
>>341975898
The graphics weren't why it was shit m8
>>341978887
start as a peasant, start as a bandit, start as a prince. grow,learn,succeed DON'T DIE!
>>341978593
>>341978675
Saying Bethesda hasn't built their own engine is like saying Valve hans't built their own engine because Source is based on Goldsource and Goldsource is based on Quake. Very few developers start their engine from total scratch.
>>341979134
Uh, bud. Half Life 2 is still a bigger graphical and technological leap from Half Life 1 than Fallout 4 is to Morrowind.
>>341978887
>with hundreds of class/builds
Would have played a wool-headed hair braid tugger.
>>341978593
What's wrong with the engine?
Another thread praising Witcher by bitching about other games, every time. Why can't you just enjoy your game for what it is without being jealous that other games enjoy their own successes?
>>341979426
Get outta here, Todd.
>>341975112
ESO is literally in the second era and is another dragon break or whatever. It happened, but it didn't happen.
>>341979426
Maybe because by setting a standard other devs who are far more financially capable should try living up to it and surpassing it than just rehashing the same shitty looking game 50 times like Bethesda does.
The Witcher has larger towns but nothing is as detailed or unique as in Skyrim.
>>341979285
You start as some goddamn weird ass native on an island thousands of miles from the actual game quests,
There are no ships to sail you there, World gets saved anyway without your help after 1000 hours of playtime
>>341979278
This isn't true at all, especially if you go by the original released of HL2.
>>341975681
what the hell is this, is this supposed to be /v/?
>>341979550
So you think Skyrim should be living up to Witcher 3's example? You got a time machine, genius?
>>341975691
The woman is just here to brew the coffee.
>>341979728
Coffee is the lifeblood of game development
>>341979647
You know Fallout 4 came out not too long ago and it looks just as bad as Skyrim right?
>>341975112
Is eso good in any regard? Genuine question. Like is the story good? Or the gameplay? I almost bought it when I saw the dark brotherhood xpac or whatever that is, but I figured it was probably a bad idea.
>>341979783
You know OP made specific mention of Skyrim, right? Damn, I should be getting paid to teach this board how to read.
>>341973693
I jut hope it leads to Bethesda upping their game from now on, because holy shit people turned on Fallout 4 FAST compared to the honeymoon Skyrim got.
>>341979046
I think if the graphics were more polished and have the game a bit more atmosphere then the game won't be as bad as it's viewed now.
>>341979939
Gave*
>>341979889
it's just people getting less and less patient with games, especially when it's already familiar formula with the depth of a puddle.
>>341979550
>caring this much about grapahics
The real things Bethesda need to work on are combat and role-playing, but unfortunately there's nothing to learn from The Witcher 3 in those regards.
>>341979783
I think Fallout 4 looks really nice though? Maybe add some high-res texture mod and it looks actually modern.
>>341980060
>caring this much about grapahics
But don't you know how important it is to count every blade of grass?
>>341980060
Nice b8
>>341980062
Yeah all of Bethesdas games can look great if you rebuild the entire fucking thing from scratch with a team of monkeys that don't work at Bethesda.
>>341980291
>Nice b8
Nobody's baiting, but I accept that you don't have anything to say in response.
>>341980291
>Yeah all of Bethesdas games can look great if you rebuild the entire fucking thing from scratch with a team of monkeys that don't work at Bethesda.
Who cares as long as it pleases your eye?§
>>341973693
Paying Polish to make Witcher is probably even cheaper than paying Murican to make 3 Skyrim.
Open world is about the AMOUNT of content, so the human cost is REALLY a big, big issue with open-world games. Poland still got a relatively cheap but skilled digital labor so it's perfect. (finding the same coder in Murica might cost 4-5 times and I'm being generous)
If you have a billion dollar and want to make a game studio, might as well go there.
well this thread is getting boring.. goodnight gamers
I was about to restart that quest where Triss gets tortured, then I realized she was faking the pain.
>>341980385
>Who cares if Bethesda puts any effort in their game at all as long as they have dumbass monkeys to buy it and texture everything for them
Hmmm.
>>341980352
>Nobodies baiting
Oh so you aren't pretending to be retarded then? You just actually are a drooling retard? Glad we could clear that up.
>>341978069
A book that the crones could have very well penned themselves.The only logical choice is to kill them all
>>341980425
so you're telling me foreigners cdpr hired settled to work for a pittance? or that native workers are ok with said foreigners getting special treatment if they sign for higher salaries? nigga, please.
>>341980519
>You just actually are a drooling retard?
No, I'm not defending Witcher 3's combat. You doing ok? You need to take a break?
>>341980425
I think most other AAA companies get by alright building their own engines, making graphically appealing games, and actually filling them out with layers of life without going to Poland.
Bethesda is the only one who makes games as bad as they do.
I mean I hate Ubisoft games but even post-downgrade they are still pretty graphically nice.
Bethesda shit takes me back to Oblivion each time I boot it up, because Todd Howard knows he'll never have to try since the people who buy his games are as retarded as a block of wood and have no standards or self respect.
>>341980519
As long as we have those 'monkeys' you should be happy with the game right?
>>341980598
You're not a drooling retard but you actually think Bethesda makes better combat than CDPR?
>yfw a budget of potatoes built a game better than anything Bethesda has ever developed with its own custom engine and 10x better graphics and retards defend Bethesda for it
lol
>>341980751
No because a game is judged by what its developers create, not the fans.
I don't think Rockstar makes the best multiplayer in the world because SA MP was one of the greatest online mods ever. GTAO is dogshit and Rockstar has bad business practices surrounding it.
>>341980857
>you actually think Bethesda makes better combat than CDPR?
You definitely need a break, they're on the same level. You're apparently reading words nobody's saying, I think this discussion is breaking you if you're hallucinating.
>>341980948
Yeah and you shouldn't care about some metacritic score as long as you like it.
>>341980967
>literally has to lie to himself to defend Bethesda's shitty gameplay
Lol what a drooling retard.
>>341981062
You're all over the place, seriously don't hurt yourself.
>>341980967
m7, not one of bethesda's games is even close to witcher 3's combat mechanics
witcher 3's combat may not be anything particularly special, but they still blow bethesda's work out of the fucking water
You've been drinking your own witcher 3 shitposting koolaid for too long
>>341981034
Well there's nothing to like, the games are trash and they look like shit.
From graphics to gameplay to writing there's not one redeemable feature to Bethesda games and its complicated further by the lack of respect Bethesda has for its shit eating fans to provide them better technology in the form of their licensed Gamebryo engine.
>>341974356
Is there a map like this for Velen? I'm missing 2 cards from there and they're driving me nuts.
>>341980857
>>341980967
>>341981062
I think The Witcher has somewhat better combat, but it also has much less variety. TES has to juggle a lot more fighting styles which I think is better for an RPG even if the combat is less polished.
They both have pretty terrible combat though.
>>341981259
you did the tournament I'm sure, and the masquerade party
probably a merchant
>>341981184
When's this coming out anyway? Are they still asking for pre-release funding or have they a date ready?
>>341979889
I just wish there was another competitor in the first person RPG scene. How the FUCK is Bethesda still the only developer of them given the immense popularity of Skyrim/Fallout.
>>341980553
>so you're telling me foreigners cdpr hired settled to work for a pittance?
not him, but that is exactly the eastern european model of game development, its an extremely effective way of making high quality games on a low budget:
>hire talented interns without much industry experience on a contract
>when they get good enough to warrant a higher wage, don't renew the contract and replace them with more young talent
>maintain a very small team of professionals to direct the young workers and touch up in places where quality falls flat
this is how every game in eastern europe is made, a notable example is the STALKER series; almost nobody who worked on lost alpha (not the mod) worked on shadow of chernobyl, almost the entire dev team of clear sky was made up of SoC modders who were prominently fired for that disaster and almost nobody who worked on the original SoC team worked on call of pripyat
it's not exactly a friendly way to do business, but it's just how things are over there
t. managed a tiny ukranian dev studio making profitable shovelware for a few years
>Felt like cities
>A PAUPER WITH A LIBRARY?!?
>IS THIS FISH FRESH?
>OOF
>>341978325
>The Witcher 3 goes the Assassin's Creed route which allows for much larger, but less detailed cities
Nigga, have you even played Witcher 3?
Also
>every NPC in Skyrim has their own inventory, stats, schedules, names
That's literally nothing in processing power used. Morrowind did that shit, minus the schedules, which are in Witcher 3 too.
It's a shame I have been spoiled by a generation of games allowing me to customize my character, I miss out on great games like TW3 because I literally can't be bothered to give a shit about Geralt and his personal woes, ties or storyline even if the game provides minimum choices to characterize him.
If only they made a section of TW3 where you could make your own backgroundless avatar to explode and play like a proper RPG I'd be so happy. But I understand the amount of effort put in it is simply because the developers are very passionate about the character and the storyline in particular, sadly.
>>341981406
so what is this, it's like someone made a story driven Mountain Blade
>>341973693
People who made TW3 are good at programming, Skyrim hired 600 shitters with garbage coding skills to work together to make a mess of a game.
>>341981374
2017 unfortunately, was delayed. I pee ordered though and day swordplay is as close as you can get to the real thing in video games. Pretty good. Only mechanic it needs is a kick to throw your opponent off balance since that's super common.
>>341981532
>backgroundless avatar to explode and play like a proper RPG
It's not a requirement for being an RPG
>>341981696
Yet still appreciated when it is.
>>341981663
Ow. Anyway, nice to heart that the combat is good
>>341981663
Bannerlord will be out before then,
I hope I will be able to beat that game without ever fighting a battle personally
I want an entire caravan trading company with dozens of active convoys, and a private army of mercenaries
Merchant Prince for the Win!
>>341981554
but the price was high...
>>341981763
Well, personally I don't care much either way. Whatever fits.
>>341981532
I think I would rather have a static character that the world reacts to appropriately and knows like Witcher 3 than to have to literally make things up in my head to tell myself the game is something it isn't.
I wouldn't say you're spoiled, you just like playing dress up.
>>341981817
Cause being able to play and win a game, completely different from the way 95% of the players will
Is a good thing
>>341977410
My feels.
>>341973880
Unless you count an npc spouting the same line of dialogue for the hundredth time as interaction then yes you can interact with every npc and you definitely can't kill every npc, there's probably more named invincible npc's than not.
>>341981974
I'm glad I bought the game twice
lets hope Cyberpunk is great too
>>341981893
>you just like playing dress up
That'd be roughly it. I enjoy designing my character and its reactions - and no, not the "kill for the lols" average Bethesda reactions. I like to make my own set of choices, argument them and create a fitting personality to it of my own liking, which also adds majorly to replay value, where a couple of choices, a different outfit, a change of build and a new weapon can very well turn the game into a completely different thing for me. Which can't be done with a static character, basically.
>>341982061
I'm a pessimist at heart but I'm not worried one bit for Cyberpunk at the moment. CDPR has never let me down yet, and I've been following them since Witcher 1 EE
>>341981817
Banterlord has so many of the things I want too like formations and siege equipment. The trailers showing that stuff off have me excited.
>>341981974
At least releaserealmodding kit before you kill Geralt, you goddamn poles!
>>341981554
morrowind, not skyrim, and the original devs werent exactly bad (they where also not great), and they didnt bother to update the game since them
>>341982061
>lets hope Cyberpunk is great too
It's gonna be hella good. Is it 2017 or 2018 btw?
>>341982148
Bannerlords showed exactly those two things I wanted to be added to warband.
>>341982164
I want a Witcher game.. main character is DANDELION
he has no combat skills, nor magic
Just him trying to sleep with as many women as possible. and failing
>>341976084
>3. CDPR were not constrained by any console limitations
Only for the first game, and that's why we get shit like 3D medallion, eat/drink animations all missing from the other games.
The third game was downgraded and CDPR admitted that it was due to consoles literally unable to play it.
>>341982164
They won't because people did jack shit for Witcher 2 with REDkit. It's simply not worth it, apparently.
>>341982191
This reminds me, at the core of Skyrim and Fallout 4 there's still fucking Gamebryo, right? Like, they literally have a modified version of an engine from 2002 running their newest games and people still wonder why they run like shit?
>>341982146
>vaporware
>>341982328
gambling, drinking, and lute playing simulator
Can you get him out of debt before they break his fingers?
>>341973693
CD Projekt Red actually gives a fuck about their work.
>>341973693
dem fucking slav magic
>>341982551
they save money by not buying office chairs
>>341974960
There are only like 3 lines of text per NPC in Skyrim, are you smoking crack?
>>341982372
That is the point.
Are people that starved for RPG experiences that don't suck that they're actually willing to praise Witcher 3?
A game in which you make maybe 3 choices during the whole story?
Where you have basically no agency in the world at all?
You guys really ought to play a classic RPG, from before they all sucked, so you can see how it should be done. But you won't, because it won't have the ubisoft open world and graphics you're clearly so interested in.
>>341982818
>everybody is so stupid
>everybody but me xd fase
>>341982818
Not all RPGs need choices to be good.
>>341982860
Well you sure proved me wrong with that well thought out reply.
>>341973693
>All at a lower budget and smaller team? I'm genuinely curious.
Both False, TW3 and Skyrim had the same budget for both marketing and development combined but Skyrim was developed by a team of 90 developers where as TW3 had 260 people working on it.
>>341981840
Hello death
>>341974531
I agree. The cities in the expansion make me want to move to France and start a vineyard
>>341982818
It's an RPG in that the Role you play is Geralt
you can only make choices he would make.
that's the limitation of staying true to the source material
>>341982818
The only RPGs that have meaningful choices are the Black Isle games. Everything since then has been railroaded shit, not that a story matters at all. I literally only care about the Witcher because of the visual design.
>>341983208
Zerrikanian's have invaded that land
As someone who loved The Witcher 1 and 2 and hasn't enjoyed a single Elder Scrolls game (no, not even Morrowind), I can tell you that The Witcher 3 might not be as empty as Bethesda's games, but it's bland and empty enough that it was still way too empty and a worse game than the other two because it fell for the open world meme fags. "MUH IMMERSION", "MUH REALISM"
I finished The Witcher 1, I finished The Witcher 2 three times. I wasn't even able to finish The Witcher 3 one time, let alone the DLC's. The series was ruined for me because they sacrificed depth for the sake of being Bethesda 2.0
I hope to god they don't go Open World with Cyberpunk 2077
>>341983210
Yes I agree, and in Fallout 4 you play the role of the Lone Wanderer who lost his or her son and you can only make choices they would make...Hang on a second that's exactly what makes it a shit movie game and not a worthwhile RPG.
>>341983483
Witcher 2 is the worst of the three.
>>341975112
The fact that they're on new consoles now is very enticing, but that won't mean shit if they continue to use the shitty engine they have for the last god-knows-how-long.
If they actually develop their own engine for use with the new and more powerful consoles and PCs, then you can start getting excited.
>>341983614
Actually, it goes 2 > 1 >>> 3
2 is a classic and I went to replay it when I got bored of 3's bullshit. Oh look, another bandit camp with maybe one unique scroll in it.
Open World games are the fucking worst.
>>341981184
so will deliverance truly deliver?
>>341983792
you know you could completly ignore the bandit camps and focus on the superb side/main quests?
3 is the absolute pinnacle of CDPR`s work
The red baron quest alone shits over 1&2 and pretty much the most of the other RPG`s quests.
>>341983352
>>341983792
3>1>>>2
Worst story, worst interface and worst gameplay (ESPECIALLY alchemy. Alchemy in 2 was atrocious).
>>341983792
3 > 1 >> 2 imo.
I don't even remember 2 that much tbqh.
>>341984152
>you know you could completly ignore the bandit camps
Yes, I could ignore the bandit camps and the notice boards and the repetitive monster hunting battles and the generic villagers all saying the same shit and the millions of fetch quests, but it doesn't change the fact they are there to badly fill out an empty open world that is big for no good reason other than it being more realistic.
The entire game's design takes a backseat to the open world meme, not as much effort goes into the shit that matters. Oh, are there a few good sidequests that were actually properly designed and well thought out and fun? Good luck finding them without wasting 10 hours wading through generic shit.
Again, Cyberpunk 2077 better be semi-Open World like The Witcher 2 and not go full The Witcher 3. There's no benefit to it whatsoever. It's a waste of the developer's and the player's time.
>>341984623
That's your opinion and you are a minority, sorry friend.
>>341984817
Hopefully everyone will get sick of the Open World Meme someday and I'll become the majority. I can only hope. It's ruining series I love.
>>341984362
1 definitely has the worst story.
>>341982334
For the second game too : It was a PC build first, then they made another build for the x360.
For TW3 they downgraded their game in 2014/2015 for a console build.
>>341985079
TW3 open world is exceptional. It was actually fun to just explore. It also didn't take much away, I mean how was it really harmful to the game?
>>341974356
Sometime i think the world map is a little misleading in its size,i remember running on foot from oxenfurt to crow's perch and it took a little over one min to do it.
I'm not complaining though.
>>341985465
I've already explained how it was detrimental to the game. Follow the reply chain.
>>341985587
The only point I see you making is that it makes finding "good" content harder. But how? All the quests marked as side quests are awesome and unique (meaning they don't follow, say, the treasure hunt scheme), and those are marked in your journal or an internet guide. In addition to that, you have the cool world to stroll around in between those quests.
>>341975559
>Skyrim has almost 3 times the amount of people to talk to.
HAVE YOU HEARD OF THE HIGH ELVES?
>>341985860
>>341985587
That's not to say I wouldn't have been happy with TW2 style hubs, but TW3 worked so well that at this point I'm not sure it would even have been better.
>>341982268
2077
Because CDPR aren't completely incompetent
>>341980967
>they're on the same level
TES combat is litteraly right click spam, it's widely accepted as being the weakest point of the franchise, you're not fooling anyone
>>341986245
Witcher 3 's combat is even worse.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kkFqn1TMeH4
>>341985079
Sonycucks want every game to be like uncharted where you just press forward to walk and watch a movie with some shooting in between. Can't you realize that open world is the best setting for a big massive medieval RPG?
People fail to understand that Bethesda compromise a lot for the sake of the old school RPG traditions
They have to work on a game where you could be using magic, bows, weapons, invocations, compagnons and mods who can affect every single aspect of their game, while CDPR focus on an established character and storyline
Overall Bethesda try to keep your options open, while CDPR try to tell a good story
>>341985860
>the quests marked as side quests are awesome and unique (meaning they don't follow, say, the treasure hunt scheme)
No, they aren't. Even after you take out the bad Contracts of the equation and the Treasure Hunt bullshit, quite a few of them amount to talking to a dude, fast travelling to the location closest to where he wants you to go, going around using witcher sense, killing a bunch of monsters and then coming back to the quest giver. It's MMO tier shit. How the fuck will you know which quest will actually be remotely interesting and result in something fun? You don't. Or you use internet guides, which is the weakest fucking excuse for open world garbage I have ever heard.
>SPOIL YOURSELF ON THE GAME SO YOU KNOW WHAT YOU SHOULD BE WASTING TIME ON.
>>341978675
>Creation Engine was a brand new engine.
Sure explains why there's code from Morrowind still stuck in Fallout 4.
>>341986603
t.
>>341986732
I'm not seeing it as being overly generous to Bethesda
Actually, I liked W3 more
>>341986723
>quite a few of them amount to talking to a dude, fast travelling to the location closest to where he wants you to go
Literally what RPG doesn't follow this? And why is it a problem when the writing and story telling is good?
>>341986464
Actually, I don't want a purely linear walking simulator and I don't want an empty map Bethesda simulator either. They're both extremes that suck.
The happy middle is in a semi-open World like Witcher 2, S.T.A.L.K.E.R., Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines, etc.
Basically, maps that are big but still handcrafted instead of just gigantic big empty bullshit that is all copy-pasted. Maps that are big enough to look huge but not too big that the majority of the time you're just walking in between objectives.
>>341986723
All of the side quests have some kind of backstory or extra weight to them to separate them from standard go-there-kill-that quests. Could you please point me to the RPGs that have zero quests like that? I genuinely wanna play them.
>>341986887
It's not as big a problem when the quests are all close together and there aren't a million of them to fill out the huge empty open world. Again, it's a simulation of wading through generic shit to try to find the 10% of the game that is actually worth a shit.
>>341981445
Serious difference between Ukraine and Poland.
>>341986963
I agree, it still doesn't excuse them and doesn't change the fact they become much more annoying when it takes half an hour to complete each of them, not counting the time you spend travelling around looking for them, again, in the hopes of finding the actual fun quests.
>>341983352
Underrated
>>341986893
>Basically, maps that are big but still handcrafted instead of just gigantic big empty bullshit that is all copy-pasted.
TW3 map is definitely hand-crafted, that's the best thing about it. Just by looking inside simple peasant huts you can see that the interiors are individually designed and all different, they make sense and look like people live there. Same goes for the nature, the rivers, rocks, swamps, roads all look dynamic and carefully placed.
>>341986603
They don't add any of those things to any of their games though. They pretty much copy paste it from the last time and spend about 10 minutes throwing together a generic world to waste your time in then call it a day.
Especially the mods bit, part of the biggest reason why they never upgrade their engine is because a) it would mean they would have to for the first time in their companies life make their own game engine and b) they would have have to integrate meaningful mod support which clearly they don't know how to do since they have relied on Gamebryo forever for this.
>>341986723
You are a retard.
>>341986603
>compromise a lot for the sake of the old school RPG traditions
Such as gradually removing all RPG mechanics?
Bethesda sure are in the forefront when it comes to that.
>lower budget
80 million dollar budget is low? Comparing a current gen only game to Skyrim?
The fuck is this noise?
>>341987084
Well, guess we have different tastes because this time around the open world shit actually felt good and purposeful to me, not just tacked on.
>>341983004
There's something to be said for developers who are more tied to a culture and are less removed from hardship and suffering.
>>341973693
witcher 3 felt like a bunch of space filled with nothing except a lot of copy and pasted content. And the gameplay was atrocious.
stop making multiple of these fucking threads daily.
>>341987398
>copy and pasted content
Stop spewing that retarded bullshit, W3 shined with the absence of lazy copy-pasting.
Also the 'gameplay = combat, combat = bad' meme is disproportionately retarded.
>>341987189
Nah, mate. And even if you were right, it doesn't change the fact that they are empty or full of stupid shit like bandit camps and hunting missions. Complete waste of effort.
>>341987303
There was nothing purposeful and note-worth about the hundreds of bandit camps and the million fetch quests. If The Witcher 3 had the map be like 30% the size it was and took out all the useless padding bullshit, the game would be a million times better. What disadvantage would this offer?
>>341987084
>complaining about more optional content
What the fuck
>>341987651
The total amount of meaningful content (that is, excluding the fillers like camps) is pretty big, I don't mind it being spread out a bit, that makes it feel less cramped.
>>341987760
>What disadvantage would this offer?
Less immersion, that would turn it into a theme park. Theme parks aren't bad, but this works for TW3.
>>341973693
>smaller team
This is actually wrong, believe it or not. Bethesda actually is quite a small team, which makes no fucking sense since they try to make games with such a large scale. I guess that explains why their games have become so lacklustre of late.
>>341987834
No, I'm complaining about bad and useless optional content, and I'm complaining further because this optional content is hiding the actual content worth a shit
>>341987842
I mind it being spread out, and see no disadvantage to it not being spread out and being more concentrated, The Witcher 1 and 2 were like that and it worked well in their favor
>>341987937
Losing on some immersion is worth it for the sake of not wasting my time. Games don't need to be 100% realistic.
>>341987937
Theme park world design comes from scale issues, when develoeprs try to cram a large area into a small area, like modern Bethesda. Getting rid of the padding doesn't do that.
>>341988228
>I mind it being spread out, and see no disadvantage to it not being spread out and being more concentrated, The Witcher 1 and 2 were like that and it worked well in their favor
Funny that you should mention TW1 while bashing 3, I remember the areas being quite large and open in 1, and I definitely spent way bigger portion of my playtime running around bored in TW1.
>Losing on some immersion is worth it for the sake of not wasting my time. Games don't need to be 100% realistic.
Point taken, but we'll have to settle with differing opinions
>>341988228
>bad and useless optional content
Why is it bad or useless?
>hiding the actual content worth a shit
That doesn't make any sense
>Losing on some immersion is worth it for the sake of not wasting my time
Then don't waste your time on it? It's optional
