Is it a meme to overhate this game here?
I mean Its definelty not as good as the original but the consistant level design and mass of different wepaons make this a decent game at the very least, compared against the trash that usually comes out this is at least an 8/10
>>341629440
>Is it a meme to overhate this game here?
Yes. This thread will just be shitposted to death about DaS2's "problems" despite a lot of them being present in both of the other games in the series.
They'll also ignore all of the things it added and did better
Prepare for the thread to devolve into shitposting almost immediately.
Yes.
But everything is a meme here. The statement is just used to invalidate opinions that someone doesn't like.
>>341629719
True, I mean even before playing i was warned here to straight up skip it, while it does have some glaring issues after getting used to the game I had a blast. I'm now on the DLC.
Its like people dont even aknowledge the second of DaS is trash
Its way more fun to polarize
Anyway, here are some valid points
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UScsme8didI
>foaty as fuck movement
>no weight to weapons
>area transition s dont make sence
>always getting ganged by enimies instead of good sing 1 on 1 battles
>fucked hit boxes
>artifical difficulty fucking everywhere
Average at best.
>>341629440
In fairness. Do NOT listen to Soulsfags. The whole fanbase is infected with autists.
Remember this is a franchise where you are applauded for dying a surplus of 20 times. People measure their fucking dicks based on how many times they died to a boss in this series.
>>341630741
>>341630741
>mathhew mcautist
have any opinions of your own?
>>341629440
fast travel ruined the atmosphere and interconnectivity almost completely, the things that made DaS the best game in decades.
really sad...
>consistent level design
>>341629440
it somehow manages to control worse than DaS1 and has a 60fps lock for some reason
>>341631052
Name me a Das2 levels worse than Lost Izalath, Crystal Cave, and Demon ruins
>>341631023
>I hate it because its not exatcly like da furst one!!!
>>341630214
>Its like people dont even aknowledge the second of DaS is trash
People ignore massive faults in whatever version they played first.
Ironically, I played up to Londo in DaS1 first, as I was borrowing a friend's copy and he wanted it back so I couldn't finish it.
Afterwards I went out an bought DaS2 so we could play together, and we both had fun with it, but my PS3 died halfway through the Gutter after I had the other 3 lord souls.
So I spend the next week or two finishing up DaS1 at my friend's place after work, and saw that the game was clearly unfinished, and the last boss, outside of theme, was incredibly underwhelming.
Went back to DaS2 when I got by PS3 back, beat it, and had a far more consistent experience than I did with DaS1, and even though the last boss was probably even more underwhelming than Gwynn, everything else was more enjoyable.
I'll never understand why everyone wants every single boss to be a 1v1 fight. Maybe they just want a challenge without actually having to be challenged to change the way they play. A lot of DaS1's encounters were just way too simple or easily cheesed, and that's considering the fact that I felt like a lot of DaS2's bosses were easily cheesed.
I used to think so, but I don't really know now.
I went back to it after playing through dark souls 3 twice and couldn't stomach it for very long. It's so slow, floaty, and unresponsive that I quit after playing through the tutorial.
Is Dark Souls the same way?
>>341629440
Honestly I just got finished with playing DS1 and DS2 to get ready for DS3, and DS2 is hot garbage compared to DS1
The level designs are so monotonous and artificially difficult with tedious bullshit, and then the bosses are a fucking joke
Shit game, was glad to be done with it
>making rolling tied to a stat
>>341630996
Still, he has valid points. I never mentioned my own opinion, neither that this is mine.
>>341631294
Iron Keep, Earthen Tower
>>341631023
fast travel was in dark souls 1 you retard
>100+hours on dark souls 1
>download dark souls 2
>shitty cutscene
>adaptabiliwhat
>4 ring slots
>fast travel since the beggining
Never dropped a game so fast since I tried Path of Exile.
Dark Souls 2 isn't a bad game by any stretch of the imagination. People shit on it because it is a disappointment compared the prior souls game. It has a noticeable drop in quality in certain regards.
>>341630857
bait
>>341631294
>Demon Ruins
>Hard
>Lost Izalath
>Hard
>>341631294
Fuck Izalith and Demon ruins, but crystal cave wasn't bad at all.
Invisible bridges in an otherwise straightforward path.
Is it worth buying the PS4 version for $15?
dark souls 2 is better than 3 and that is really sad
>>341630832
There are no good 1 on 1 battles in the Souls series outside of boss fights
>>341631462
Neither of those are even close, so you either didn't play DaS1, or you didn't play DaS2.
>>341631573
No one said anything about difficulty autist.
>>341631502
autism
>>341631573
he didn't say they were hard, he said they were bad, you moron
I just got it the other day through the Steam sale, just waiting for the payment to process.
It can't be awful enough to not be worth >10 dollars, a Souls game is still a Souls game.
>>341631720
>"I don't really like this game because x, y, and z"
>"AUTIST REEE AUTISM"
>>341631342
I've played 1 and that floaty hsit isnt ethere, there also no deadzones in movement so its fluid
Weapons, sheild blocks, movement everything has weight. Its great. I,m going to buy 3 in a few weeks is it the same there? Already kinda pissed about no poise because i loved being a big ass tank with huge swords
>>341631719
>tower of poison
>not a huge pain in the dick
>lava castle with mega archers and meat shield armor knights
>not a huge pain in the dick
both those places suck ass, I literally just got done with both games
>>341629743
Shut up you cuckold
But in all seriousness, yes it's just a meme, ds 2 does numerous things better than both ds1 and ds3
>>341631462
Iron keep is solid you faggot.
>>341631639
Nah its not that bad. It's just fresher shit while DaS2 has been festering for so long its grown hard and no longer smells as bad.
>>341631491
Not until Anor Londo.
>>341632127
this tbqh
Every time I see someone use the word meme, my spine locks up and I feel slightly disgusted
I think there's a word for it...For real though stop saying "meme" you underage tumors. Also OP is a faggot
>>341632026
How is the windmill a pain? Even if you want to collect every item in there the poison is never a major issue, but if you don't you never have to deal with the poison at all. Sounds like the mere existence of poison triggers you
>>341631908
the fact that you dropped it immediately is autism. I dislike the game for the exact same reasons as you. Still worth playing through unless you're autistic.
>>341632168
it was still in the game regardless
>>341632026
>tower of poison
>not a huge pain in the dick
How the hell do you find Earthen Peak difficult at all? It takes all of fifteen minutes to get through, and you could probably count the number of enemies you fight on your fingers.
>lava castle with mega archers and meat shield armor knights
>not a huge pain in the dick
Did you fall off the platforms or something?
I can't fathom how you had so trouble with either area that you'd compare them in quality to blatantly unfinished level design.
>>341632127
It's far worse because it has way more potential to be good than Dark Souls 2, and has the occasional moment where it's almost great, but then fucks it all up with awful design decisions
the worst meme this aspies repeat is
>muh not connected level design
wtf are you game fans or architecture fans?
>>341629440
For me its
DeS 8/10
DaS 8.5/10
DaS2 6/10
BB 9/10
DaS3 7.5/10
>>341631502
>>341631502
>>4 ring slots
>>fast travel since the beggining
How are these bad?
>>341632026
>>tower of poison
>>not a huge pain in the dick
Literally just run through the poision
>lava castle with mega archers and meat shield armor knights
>not a huge pain in the dick
How fucking bad are you? why dont you complain about the Arno londo archers?
I will give yu that Shirne of Armana was a load of shit.
>>341631925
yeah it's there.
Das3 is on the bloodborne engine, so it's much faster and more responsive than 2
that alone makes it a better game imo
>>341631502
>adaptabiliwhat
I initally hated this but all you need is like 15 and you're set. hell not even that
>4 ring slots
makes sense for the games, Espically because of ring of binding. How the fuck is this bad?
>fast travel since the beggining
Fair enough
>>341632310
>"you are autistic for dropping something you don't like, not like me who despite not liking it in the least I kept playing till the end."
Ah, neo/v/ summarized in one sentence.
>>341632437
how are any of the DS1 levels you listed "unfinished", or whatever metric you're using
>Demon Ruins
>Pull one big demon at a time and kill them easily because they are slow and stupid
>fire breathing gargoyles that move 2 MPH
>literally just run past the aggressive egg holders
>one-off wall burrowers
>bonfire like 100 yards from the beginning
>Lost Izalith
>run by the headless stone demon
>armor breaking demons die in like 2 hits and are mega slow
I fail to see anything about either of those places that are shit
>>341631491
I think the difference is having fast travel right off the bat. In DS1 you unlock it in Anor Londo, after you've already explored all the game and the only areas left are the archives and then 3 levels totally unrelated to the rest of the game anyway.
DS2 having fast travel right from the start means that the geography doesn't really matter. You always go straight forward and never ever back. If you go through the game without it (for the secret ring) it's way more interesting and high stakes.
Just an aside but DS2 has the best NG+ of any souls game by a country mile. All sorts of brand new enemies, new encounters, spiced up boss fights and brand new equipment. Even cool PvP benefits like grabbing players into your NG+7 rat rape lairs and getting summoned by the Mirror Knight boss.
DS3 was either super rushed or had no love put into it, because it's literally the same exact game but every enemy is a crazy health sponge.
>>341631294
prepatch shrine of amana you nigger
>>341631491
>>341631491
>>341631491
the feeling i would get when travelling the world and visiting firelink shrine was gone in DaS2
>>341631294
i cant even remember most places in DaS2 because the atmosphere was so bad. still a great game but i have no desire to replay it, while i replay DaS frequently and i do like every level there, even those you mentioned
>>341629440
What I personally hate about this game is that it feels like everything was done on purpose, from how slow and clunky it was to the difficulty. The devs took the meme of Dark Souls being hard to new levels and just littered it with artificial difficulty that really doesn't feel challenging or rewarding, it just feels tedious and drawn out.
>>341633065
>I fail
Obviously, because you have some blatant fucking bias.
DeS, DaS and BB are really good games with one of the best and most inmersive gameplay out there.
2 and 3 are just cashgrabs.
>>341633356
>opinion based thread
>YOU'RE JUST BIAS!
Fucking idiot I tell you, what is the point of giving an opinion if it isn't your opinion
Tell me why Demon Ruins and Lost Izalith suck then
>>341633065
Not a single thing you listed makes for engaging or interesting encounters and if you are ignoring enemies because they are neither useful nor fun to kill then you've got a problem. That's not even getting into how bland the architecture is, how barren the area is, how ugly it looks and that awful fucking lava damage sound
>>341633171
>It used to be bad years ago!
Comparable to:
>It will always be bad, and is still shit to this day.
Nah.
Hivemind mentality does exist with some games on /v/. This being the biggest example.
The thing about /v/ is most people come here to fulfill some sort of social interaction because they are typical antisocial or awkward in real life. Anons like to come here and see others they can relate to while seeking approval from them. When games start to get shit on here it catalyst itself because anons start to parrot things they heard about a certain vidya in order to fit in. People are afraid to say anything about games like ff13 other than hallway simulator because they will be ostracized by others trying to prentously seek approval from other anons.
>>341633171
>prepatch
Does this count? They patched the dragon butts in Izalith which was a massive improvement. Both areas still suck, though.
>>341633535
If you can't see that those two areas are some of the worst in the entire fucking series, there's no point in trying to carry a conversation about level design with you at all.
>>341633601
its still a shitty area because you still wade through the water at tectonic plate movement tier speed while sorcerers shoot their MAGIC MISSILEs at you
just that this time you are less likely to get absolutely fucked by them
>>341633686
Pretty much this, and the souls saga is a magnet for this kind of people.
>>341633171
I thought prepatch SoA was fine. It's a nice looking area and I like the singing demon. Only thing that frustrated me was the witches after the bonfire cave that shoot at you from miles away. And the NPC invader didn't help things either.
The level design sucks overall.
The mechanics are way worse, everything is floaty and slow.
There are way too many bosses that are just big guys with swords and they all fight the same way and it gets really annoying and tedious. Also people say Bed of Chaos is the worst boss in the series but I think that dubious honor definitely belongs to the Ancient Dragon.
There's way too many groups of enemies, which is especially bad in DS2 compared to the others because of how slow and clunky combat is. And just like the bosses, most enemies are just humanoids with weapons without any interesting things to set them apart.
Fuck adaptability.
DS2 feels like a fangame, I don't even consider it part of the main series. That said it's still a decent game.
>>341631294
If we are including DLC, frigid outskirts is by far the worst location in the series. Probably worse than anyone could ever attempt to surpass even if they tried
>>341633913
The group fights in DS2 are a whole lot better than the group fights in 3. The mocement is sluggish but that applies to both you and the enemies in 2, while 3 is filled with really fast enemies with long combos, dodges and gap closers which makes the player character feel slow as shit
>>341633065
the worst offender areas in lost izalith and demon's ruins are the two spots with a bunch of copy pasted enemies, namely the taurus demons that are just hanging out and dragon butt alley
these two things stick out so sorely that many over-react and call the entire half of the game past anor londo shit, when its really not
similarly das2's level design gets blasted for a few areas being super boring and overall making less sense the more you look at it, but it's, for the most part, decent
Honestly one of the worst games I've ever played.
>>341629440
Playing through DaS2 in coop with a friend was the best DaS experience I've had.
It was nice being able to summon on some bosses without them becoming a complete fucking joke.
>>341634240
Jesus christ, aren't you at least a little bit ashamed to admit your lack of experience with video games?
>>341633751
>if you don't agree with me than it isn't worth it
kill yourself immediately
I just got done replaying this recently, my first time playing all the SoTFS content. Overall I'd say that it's definitely my least favorite of the Souls games, but it's still a decent game in its own right. I enjoyed the levels and the story, but almost all the changes to the game mechanics were terrible, terrible ideas.
>>341634197
I completely disagree, nothing is worse than group fights in 2. The lack of an actual quick roll, the lack of cooldown cancelling, and how slow you heal all make group fights these incredibly tedious experiences where you basically just turtle until every single enemy has attacked at once or one attacked and is far away enough from the others that you can get a hit or two in. It's tedious, it's sluggish, and it's really annoying, but any other option is just too risky because if you try to be offensive at all you'll probably get punished for it, whereas in other games you can get quick hits and pokes in even while surrounded.
Not to mention parring is steaming hot garbage and backstabs take forever and you aren't even invincible during them so they took away even more options for fighting groups. God just talking about DS2's combat mechanics make me mad, they ruined so much shit for no reason. Thank god they went back to the old systems in DS3
>>341634234
the Iron keep is literally like 3 enemy types, saying that Demon Ruins is worse is laughable
>>341634190
Frigid Outskirts is great. Memory of the Old Iron King and Iron Passage are the worst.
>>341634884
Frigid Outskirts would be a cool area but the fucking horses completely ruin the area and make it this horribly aggravating experience. I think it's by far the worst of the stupid terrible co-op areas just because it's so long and the horses are so annoying
>>341632984
if I didn't like it in the least I wouldn't have kept playing it. You have the attention span of a 3 year old if you drop it instantly without giving it a chance
>>341634708
The combat is only like that when you're inexperienced with the game or running a low adp build, otherwise all the enemies are so slow that you can safely bait out attacks, dodge them and counter. DS3 crowd combat is a clusterfuck if you choose to do anything but stunlocking everything once it gets in range because nothing feels balanced around your character's speed. Any kind of methodical play goes out the window. DS2 also has a far, far better balance of enemy types where you're fighting low poise, medium poise and infinite poise enemies which gives the combat variety instead of it just being shitty R1 spam because no one can handle getting poked with toothpicks.
>>341635230
Fact of the mater is fighting multiple big enimies is tedious and not fun.
>>341629440
yes. literally trolling
>>341635336
It can be unfun and sometimes is in DS2, but it's still a whole lot more engaging than killing trash mob after trash mob in the exact same way without even seeing their attacks
>>341634781
The level design is solid though. Which is the original point
>>341629440My tier list is BB>DSII>DeS>DS>DSIII
>>341635230
>otherwise all the enemies are so slow that you can safely bait out attacks, dodge them and counter
Not in groups, because while you're baiting one enemy/attacking one enemy the other 4 are on your ass too, so you have to bait every enemy at once or have one be far enough away from everyone else. This is because every attack has like 3+ seconds of uncancellable cooldown and it makes everything slow and clunky as fuck and it's just not a fun experience. I mean hey, if you love turtle fests so be it, but I think most people vastly prefer the faster paced combat in the other games because it's actually enjoyable.
DS2 doesn't even do slow clunky combat well anyway since you end up fighting basically every single enemy/boss encounter the same way.
>>341632437
I love DaS2, but fuck you. Earthen tower is the biggest piece of shit level in the whole fucking series.
It's a solid game but it can't hold up to the series standard. Doesn't make it awful, but it sets off the soulsfag autism.
>>341633535
>fight a boring boss to turn off the lava
>fight your way through 6 of the exact same enemy in an area that amounts to nothing but a glorified hall way
>those enemies are a recycled early game boss
>fight another recycled early game boss
>fight a shitty centipede nigger ie fight the camera to the tune of some more recycled boss music
That's demon ruins. and if you walk around to explore there is nothing but a completely flat plane with, surprise surprise, some more early game bosses lazily sprinkled around the landscape.
Now Izalith,
>walk around another isotropic plane fighting dragon asses until you stumble across where you are supposed to go
>fight a gimmick boss
That's really all it amounts to. If you think those levels were worth a shit and not lazy/unfinished, your opinion is not worth a shit.
>>341635587
Then The entire Aldia's Keep-Dragon Aerie-Dragon Shrine series is the worst in the entire series
>>341634708
>parring is steaming hot garbage
Use a small shield and git gud, I can realiably parry most enemies and I haven't even played it as much compared to the other Souls games. It's infinitely better than DaS1's laughably forgiving parries.
>backstabs take forever and you aren't even invincible during them
Literally the best decision they've made when it comes to combat, too bad DaS3 goes back to letting you trivialize humanoid enemies with circlestrafing backstabs.
Thr truth of the matter is no one cares about opinions especially when it comes to the souls series. You have people who started with kings field, des, das, and even 2/BB/3. Everyone likes different things and there will never be a concensus, exactly how it works with every other game where no matter how bad it is some people love it. ALL of the games are imperfect, all take something good away or add something horrible, all have HORRIFIC netplay, something is always OP as fuck, covenants have never been implemented as intended. Just look at the posts, this one included, people just drop their opinion and there is no discussion. Realize you like what you like, and to call any one game the worst in the series just doesn't work because they all bring something to the table. 2 brought on the best small upgrades like estus on ladders, powerstancing, actual dual wielding, great build diversity (after patches). But it added things people hate like soul memory, bad atmosphere, level design is "convoluted by time", and adaptability. It doesn't "feel" like a souls game but to some it's wonderful and has some of the most fun gameplay in souls available.
>>341635914
>talking about DS1 recycling bosses when they literally recycle like 4
Pursuer, Flexile Sentry, Dragon Rider, Last Giant, suck my ass
>>341633365
the only sensible post in this thread, congratulations anon
It was better than 3
I have a honest question /v/. How would you make a Souls game better than DaS1?
>>341636220
that's not dark souls 1 m8. Dark souls 2 is a different game. I'm only addressing why lost izalith and demon ruins are bad. you asked me why to tell you why they were bad and i told you
>>341634708
> parring is steaming hot garbage and backstabs take forever and you aren't even invincible during them
Parrying actually requires timing in DaS2, and Backstab does have i-frames, it just doesn't last the entire animation. You can't just fish for ripostes and backstabs all game and have success like in DaS1.
>>341635758
I don't think you ever fight more than three enemies at once in DaS2, save for the Gargoyle fight. If you've pulled so many enemies that 4+ are within swinging range of you, you fucked up.
>This is because every attack has like 3+ seconds of uncancellable cooldown
No it doesn't. Even the slowest weapons in the game barely last half of that.
You actually sound like you're just terrible at the game and you think it's the game's fault.
>>341635758
Enemies have combos you can bait out, and they are easy to spread out ysing the environment. I hate using shields and found DS2 to be a far more aggressive game when compared to 3. When you are fighting truly huge groups the game also goes the DS3 route and makes them easy to stagger. You only really fight 2 or 3 tanky enemies at once most of the time. Tanky enemies with slow, predictable combos. Compared to 3's clusterfuck movesets, this actually rewards aggressive playstyles and enemy knowledge instead of rewarding those who don't even get to see enemy attacks before they kill them. It's also far less samey than DS3 was because of the previously mentioned poise balance.
>>341635092
>try something
>don't like it
>quit it
wow it's like I fucking behave like any human being
DS2 vanilla is better than DS3.
The DLCs better be The Old Hunters tier for me to go back to DS3.
>>341636492
>says DS1 level designs are bad because recycled bosses
>DS2 does the exact same thing
>Hey man, we're talking about DS1 here
No, we are talking about DS1 vs DS2, now either come up with a valid argument or shut the fuck up
>>341636125
>>341636590
No, parrying is steaming hot garbage because:
A) The timing is retarded and unintuitive. Every single video game ever has had parries work the same way: you press the button right as the attack is about to hit you. But not in DS2, where you have to press it quite a few seconds BEFORE an attack hits you so the enemy attack magically bounces off your face.
B) Executing the riposte is also horrible. You have to fucking wait for the enemy to SLOWLY fall down and then you get to stab them. Not only is it extremely unsatisfying, it's also not even worth it; you'd have gotten more damage overall just by dodging the attack and wailing on them.
They completely ruined parries, which are always a fun mechanic. If they wanted to "fix" them all they had to do was make the parry window smaller, not arbitrarily move it to the middle/end of the parry animation rather than the start and completely butcher ripostes. Oh, and they had parries actually work intelligently with curved swords but then patched it out so now they're garbage too. Wonderful!
>>341636248
anon please you're making me blush
>>341631669
You can still slowly walk upon an enemy and only trigger them rather than the whole group and deal with them individually.
Why do people feel the need to protect something as a videogame with all their might?
Dude, some people like it, some people don't.
90% of the bosses were rehashes/literal copypastas.
Game difficulty came entirely from more enemies vs. interesting encounters.
Punishing the players for dying in a souls game is just ridiculous. Dying and having to retrieve your souls is already plenty of punishment.
Just overall doesn't have any memorable moments other than "Hey you remember Dark Souls? Here's a throwback that'll make you want to play that instead."
2/10 see my after class tier game, blame it on From's B-team or Miyazaki's abortion clinic for this game.
I really like the little Pirate Cove, played the game with low gamma. It was pretty cool, wish they had worked the whole torch light/dark thing in a bit more.
>>341636726
Parrying was a shit mechanic in PvE. The timing was trivial and it made enemies which could otherwise pose some threat into jokes. It removes almost all skill from the combat beyond getting some simple timing down. The less viable it is, the better
>>341636681
I'm not that first guy, you fucking idiot. you realize we are on anonymous image board where anybody can reply to anybody? you asked why demon ruins and izalith are shit and i told you and you have yet to give any counterargument as to why you think they are not shit.
M O R O N
>>341629440
>be an incomplete piece of turd
>get called the best in the series by neckbeards and fats, constantly
>because LE EBIN EDGEWALKER LORE HAHA xD
>and DUDE 2 BOSSES AT ONCE LMAO
>mfw i have no face to mfw with
>but all i can really say is...GOT EEEEEEEMtbqh fampai xD
>>341637106
yeah but god damn does it feel gooooood
>>341637132
I am obviously not talking to you you idiot
Dark Souls 2 is better than Dark 1, but not as good as Demon's, Dark 3, or Bloodborne.
I think people are in love with the idea of Dark Souls 1 more than the game itself. The entire second half of that game is just...boring, bland, forgettable. Dark 2 never reaches the same highs as its immediate predecessor, though it is more consistently good.
>>341629440
Well I just hate it because my character takes damage from attacks that make no contact. It did a lot of good things too, I miss powerstances, and some of the armors were really nice, but none of its strengths make up for the shitboxes imo.
>>341637260
>get proven wrong
>I WASNT EVEN TALKING TO YOU BRO
>>341636726
>The timing is retarded and unintuitive. Every single video game ever has had parries work the same way: you press the button right as the attack is about to hit you. But not in DS2, where you have to press it quite a few seconds BEFORE an attack hits you so the enemy attack magically bounces off your face.
I get it, you suck at timing your parry, in which case you could just get a Scimitar and not have that problem, but you choose to bitch instead because you're bad.
>you'd have gotten more damage overall just by dodging the attack and wailing on them.
There's so much wrong here, it's like you fucked up your parry window a bunch of times before getting it once, and then you were like "WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW HE'S STILL ALIVE FUCK"
>Oh, and they had parries actually work intelligently with curved swords but then patched it out so now they're garbage too. Wonderful!
So the game just needs to be idiot-proof for you to like it I guess.
I've never seen someone bitch so hard that they suck at something, and then try to pass it off as a fault of the game.
>>341637106
So all they had to do was make the timing tighter. That's it. But the B team completely butchered it for no reason because they don't actually know how to fix things, as shown from other "fixes" like adaptability, completely butchering the perfect estus system in the original, letting you get hit during critical animations, etc.
>>341637359
No, because the entirety of DS2 is a low with some rises into decent compared to the rest of the series. It's not even consistently good, some areas are terrible like brightstone, the black gulch, the dragon shrine, earthen peek, and all the co-op dlc areas.
>>341637132
Demon Ruins is gorgeous and I don't see how it is any worse than other areas, Lost Izalith has that great poison pit area with the Catarina guy, unique level design, unique enemies, Soltaire fight
>>341637582
that was someone trying to stir up more trouble
>I'm not that first guy, you fucking idiot. you realize we are on anonymous image board where anybody can reply to anybody?
Ironic
>>341631294
Literally nothing wrong with Crystal Caves.
>>341637158
What?
>>341636726
>But not in DS2, where you have to press it quite a few seconds BEFORE an attack hits you
There's nothing wrong with this. Parrying was extremely broken in DS1 and gave too much reward for not enough risk. DS2 parrying requires timing and prediction.
>so the enemy attack magically bounces off your face.
Parrying isn't anything more than a simplified abstraction in these games.
>>341636220
>>341636681
The Difference being that DaS1 had about 24 bosses and DaS2 has about 40.
>>341637967
who?
>>341629440
Agreed. And the DLC's are 9.5/10.
>>341631294
>crystal caves
shit taste, get that opinion discarded
>>341638057
>game with 1 DLC vs one with 3 DLCs
>quantity over quality
DS2 bosses are a JOKE compared to DS1
>>341637930
>nothing wrong
>literally one pathway with some invisible path gimic
>good
>>341637626
>>341637978
There is something wrong with it: That's not how video game parries work. It's really stupid and unintuitive. All they had to do was tighten the timing. But they made parries a useless waste of time instead. And for the record, I can parry in DS2. I just never do because it's never worth it. Also I like how you can't criticize anything in any Souls game without someone saying you just suck.
>>341638197
why
>>341637774
>So all they had to do was make the timing tighter
Hard to make it much more difficult because parrying isn't really about reaction times. Adding the delay is a good way to make it more tricky.
>>341638337
see>>341638343
It looked nice but it was literally a 5 mins lineir walk with some monsters just before the boss. Boring.
>>341636220
>Pursuer, Flexile Sentry
There's a difference between a boss appearing again as a miniboss a couple of times and the common enemies for a level being nothing but previous bosses and also having the same enemy as a boss 3 times
>Dragon Rider
Only comes back once and fights differently because of the one shooting arrows
>Last Giant
That never appears again
Even if you consider either of those rehashing it's nothing compared to the levels of recycling in DaS1
>>341638473
that is one of the most generic statements ive ever heard. it can be said about nearly every area in the series
It is better than DaS2 but worse than Bloodborne
>>341638343
It's just an extension of dukes archives which is one of the most comprehensive maps in the game.
>>341638662
Only if you go out of your way to ignore all content. In crystal caves there is no content to ignore
>>341638662
Other areas have branching paths and more content. crystal caves is literally
>walk for a while, fight crystal golem
>turn and walk for a 10 secs
>turn and walk again
>kill crabs
Then the boss.
>>341638528
>You have to kill 5 more Taurus Demons with lower HP
>Pursuer appears in 6 places with the same HP as he originally had in the boss fight
>Flexile sentry appears 3 times
>Last Giant
>not appearing again
>what is the Giant Lord with the exact same size and moveset
Holy shit did you even play these games you fucking moron?
>
Dragon Rider comes back multiple times
>>341638387
>That's not how video game parries work.
You haven't played very many video games.
>But they made parries a useless waste of time instead.
For the third time, just because you suck massive cock, doesn't mean the parry is any of the following; Bad, Tedious, Unintuitive, Useless, or a "Waste of Time".
>I can parry in DS2.
Obviously not consistently.
>Also I like how you can't criticize anything in any Souls game without someone saying you just suck.
But in this instance, that's literally what you're bitching about. You suck at a facet of the game that hundreds of thousands, possibly even more, players can use well, and you're acting like it's somehow the game's fault because they didn't dumb it down for you and leave it as an easy-mode "no-risk, all reward" mechanic from the first game.
>>341638387
>That's not how video game parries work.
That's not how parries work in real life. Like I said, it's an abstraction. The core principle is still the same, there's just less lenience.
>It's really stupid and unintuitive. All they had to do was tighten the timing. But they made parries a useless waste of time instead.
Parries are actually quite useful in certain situations since you're given ample time to heal up before the riposte. Other than that, parries have almost always existed for style points since you're almost never in a situation where you'll need to parry to survive.
>And for the record, I can parry in DS2. I just never do because it's never worth it. Also I like how you can't criticize anything in any Souls game without someone saying you just suck.
I never said anything of the sort, but nice try.
>>341638438
>Because parrying isn't really about reaction times
No shit, it's about learning enemy timing. Adding a delay is an awful way to make it tricky because it makes the mechanic unintuitive, ESPECIALLY since it doesn't match up with the actual parry animation at all.
I mean if we really want to get into it, here's the problem: when the parry is at the start of the animation, there's no guesswork involved with the input itself, because it activates immediately. That means it is solely testing your timing of the enemy: if you miss the parry, you just haven't learned the enemy timing, plain and simple. But when there's a delay in the parry itself, suddenly it adds another variable into the mix, and you have to time two things at once. It doesn't help DS2 has shitty mechanics on top of it like buffering and delay, which further complicates things way more than it needs to. Now of course you can still work with all this and learn to parry, but at the end of the day it just means parrying is less precise overalljust like fucking everything in the god awful combat of DS2If parries are too easy, then all you have to do is shorten the active frames/increase the overall cooldown: if a parry is at like 2-3 frames then you really need to know a move's timing or you will get destroyed for it.
>>341638907
blue slab
>>341639190
>Pursuer appears in 6 places with the same HP as he originally had in the boss fight
All the clones besides the one that drops the ring+1 have half HP.
>>341637106
Is it really a shit mechanic in pve? It is already easier to roll through an attack and backstab, poise break-lock, or just hold up a decent shield and stun enemies by deflecting them. If anything, parrying doesn't belong in pvp (or being parried by pve enemies barring situations where it is telegraphed like with Balders) since it takes control away from the opposing player.
>>341638341
Are we really going to start this meme? Think about all the shit bosses in Dark Souls 1 - Pinwheel, Taurus, Asylum 3x, Moonlight, Capra. Seath is a lagfest and you can't see what he is doing when you are stabbing his lightning-vagina but it doesn't fucking matter because he is so damn easy. Sanctuary Guardian will die in 5 hits by the time you get around to the DLC. Centipede is another lagfest but is also too easy for it to matter. Queelag has no threatening attacks except the aoe scream. Gaping dragon just sits there and lets you hit it for 10 seconds at a time after charging or slamming. Let's not forget the worst boss Bed of Chaos which is just a trigger fight. What about discharge, who most people just cheese and otherwise all that matters is being able to survive a hit from him since he takes so long between attacks. Golem, that gets stunlocked instantly or just falls off. And finally Priscilla, who dies in 4 hits as well. Oh, who are considered the best bosses in Dark Souls? Manus, Artorias, Sif, Gargoyles, Gwyn, O&S, Sif? All "knight guys" that people love to complain about when talking about Dark Souls 2.
>>341639256
I just think it's a terrible implementation of the mechanic. How does that mean I suck at it? I know DS2 defenders don't really have any arguments but it really is funny that they all boil down to insults.
ALso, just for the record: what other games have big delays in parries form when you press the button and when the active frames begin? I can't think of any games that really use parrying that work like that
>>341636726
>The timing is retarded and unintuitive
No it isn't, as I said use a leather shield and get good, I can reliably parry most enemies on reaction even when I'm rusty and haven't played in a while
>You have to fucking wait for the enemy to SLOWLY fall down and then you get to stab them
If you're fast enough you can do it early, it rewards quick reactions as opposed to DaS1 where you instantly go into the invincible riposte state, no timing needed whatsoever
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-X8aBIZJw98
>Oh, and they had parries actually work intelligently with curved swords
God no, it was broken as shit
Your post makes me think that you only tried parrying a couple of times and gave up because it wasn't easy mode like in DaS1
I actually like it more than Bloodborne. This is with Sotfs of course. The character creation isn't that bad as people make it.
How well did I meme guise?
>>341639190
The second drgaon riders fight is diferent enough to be its own boss fight. The bow dragon rider has different moveselt and hp
>>341639531
Nope, the clones are full HP AND are all already in dark magic power-up mode
>>341629440
Dark Souls II's gameplay was better than I in every single way. It's just casual shitters on /v/ cried "hurr ADP" and gave up.
>Smoother controls
>Tighter hitboxes
>Far more build variety
>Backstepping being viable and rewarding
>Parrying isn't braindead easy and instantly active on 1st frame
>Overall mechanically better designed bosses
>Attacks that lower your hitbox allow you to counter attack while simultaneously dodging horizontal strikes
>You can avoid several boss attacks by spacing instead of rolling every single attack therefore being more stamina efficient
>Weapon types actually make a huge difference
That isn't to say this game is without flaw, but some of /v/'s complaints are very superficial.
We agree that soul memory and ADP was garbage, but the disjointed world is a weak argument. Graphically it was clearly butchered from the demo, mostly because console peasants toasters wouldn't be able to run it at demo quality. Also I don't see how mobbing enemies is a bad thing. Pretty much every 1v1 encounter in Souls games comes down to dodge+attack or running r1 stun into r1. Mobbing adds a layer of challenge if you know how your spacing and use the environment to your advantage.
>>341639895
Hiede's Tower, then "omg it's only half recycling" in Drangleic, one outside the Royal Aegis fight, and one in Shrine of Amana guarding Vendrick's Soul
4 is a lot different than zero
>>341639190
>>Pursuer appears in 6 places with the same HP as he originally had in the boss fight
Wrong.
The Pursuer that reappears doesn't even have the same A.I. as the one you originally fight and starts off enraged. He has much lower health and generally uses mid and long range attacks whenever he has the chance, whereas the first Pursuer will almost always attempt to charge at you.
>Flexile sentry appears 3 times
Yes.
>what is the Giant Lord with the exact same size and moveset
Similar but not exactly the same like the shit in DaS1. He has a different model, attacks faster, and he uses his sword to lunge, stab, and cleave at longer range, making roll timings much more difficult and putting casters at a bigger disadvantage.
His stomp attacks are the only attacks he shares with The Last Giant.
>Dragon Rider comes back multiple times
Yes, but the second dragon rider boss fight has a different dynamic than the first due to there being one with a bow.
I don't mind the complains but i wish people would stop acting like its the worst thing ever - Especially considering how bad the first game is after you get the Lordvessel.
Even the most boring bosses and the most annoying areas of DS2 never get Moonlight Butterfly, Lost Izalith or Ceaseless Discharge tier bad.
>ADP was garbage
RES was garbage
>Soul Memory
Decent idea - Horrible execution
The worst thing about the entire debate is that DS3 went back to the mistakes of DS1 that DS2 fixed.
It's a flawed game for sure, but not absolute trash. It had a lot of potential but untimely fell short in a lot of places. I played it a Ton whereas in DS3 it felt petty damn short and I have no urge to replay it. Also, they dropped the ball with multiplayer in DS3. It's just garbage; there's no option to invade sinners. I've been waiting for 15 minutes already to be autosummoned as a blue sentinel.
Bloodborne DLC is a better game overall than DS3. I hope DLC gives DS3 longevity and introduces an invasion item for Blue Sentinels/Darkmoon blades
>>341639924
I don't know, it takes very little time to get enough ADP for a reasonable amount of i-frames. You should have enough points to wield a decent weapon and have 92 or 96 agi by the time you exit the 2nd area or so. But still, I don't agree with the game forcing you to build into good rolls, especially since it is already very easy to hide behind a shield for most of the game.
>>341640321
see>>341640227
So how is the Taurus Demon recycling worse than the Pursuer then? The argument is completely invalid as the Taurus Demons have less HP and are smaller with less reach
>>341639632
I agree The whole "Das2 has too many dudes in armour "is utter bullshit Theres only a slightly number of them in 2. and even then most were enjoyabe abpat from the ganksquad.
>>341632717
Fast travel from the beginning is bad since it means the devs can separate areas with bonfires instead of physically connecting them to each other.
>complaining about fast travel
Then don't fucking use it you jackasses
>>341639343
The games are specifically designed to be slow and methodical. Defensive maneuvers like rolling and shielding are instant but attacks have intentional wind ups to make you consider the appropriate timing. DS1 style parries are broken because they work instantly like shielding and rolling but give you an easy opportunity for huge damage. Delayed parries are a much better option because they work like weapons and force you to learn your enemy and your own tools to use properly.
>>341640771
>So how is the Taurus Demon recycling worse than the Pursuer then?
I didn't say anything was better or worse, merely stated facts.
>>341640771
You have to remember that the Pursuer refight isn't easy to come across. It is only in SotFS that you fight him multiple times. Also, the taurus demon is just a very unexciting fight. Theres no reason for there to be like 10 of them in the demon ruins. Also, isn't the argument that Dark Souls 2 bosses suck? It seems like this is a defense claiming dark souls isn't worse against a defense claiming that dark souls 2 isn't worse, so the defense is just giving up ground.
>>341629440
>Is it a meme to overhate this game here?
logical fallacy
because souls have always been a forced meme
the giantbossight gimmick got stale after 2004
it doesn't impress anyone who isn't riding the gravy meme train from neogaf or reddit
rest of gameplay is mediocre
totally a forced meme
>>341641329
What? No, the original argument was that DS1 had worse level design
>>341641542
>Dark Souls was too hard for him
IT'S JUST A MEME GUYS
>>341641542
I agree.
Literally millhouse.
>>341629440
DS2 has the best hub world theme for any Dark Souls ever. Chillest shit, man.
Despite the levels not hooking up together geographically, they were very diverse and memorable as well as you had at least 3 different areas you could go to just from the start of the game.
Also, Champion's Covenant for people looking for a challenge.
>>341641565
Maybe in this topic, but the argument in general has always been that Dark Souls 2 has worse bosses, worse hitboxes/tracking, and worse level design.
>>341632043
So many things that you couldn't even name one, amirite? Dark Souls 2 is the worst in the series.
>>341642062
too many to list
>>341629440
game is dank af
haterz gone hate
>>341641931
Very much yes to hitbox, Pursuer impaled me on his sword when I was standing next to him and it glitched me backwards
Bosses in general were a fucking JOKE. The only difficulty I had was Smelter Demon and Scorpioness and I still killed Scorpioness in my first try
>>341629440
>Mass of different weapons
half of the swords had the same moveset. Alot of the weapons were just clones with different stat numbers.
The losing health mechanic works against the player for no reason when the point of the game is to use
trial and error and experiment with different stuff. Atleast ds3 handled it a little better. I got through the entire game with 2 weapons anyway because the game is easy.
>The stats
I had no clue that you had to invest in the defense stat to get "Agility" which improves dodge frames.
I didnt really put any into it because I wanted a kit where it was based on my ability to dodge stuff so I could go for strenght and hp alot more,
But alot of enemies that swing weapons vertically have bs hitboxes and you will get hit even if it misses your model entirely because you didnt know to get the defense stat.
Agility implies moving faster, or recovering faster, not a hidden dodge stat.
>Consistent level design
meh. When you look in the distance and see other areas, things dont make sense. The world isnt cohesive at all. You climb up the stupid poison tower to find out there lava out of nowhere even if you
look from the bottom of the tower and see no sign of a volcano or anything. Pillar of flame doesnt look at all how it does from majula. So many pathways just lead to shitty loot that you dont really need.
For my personal take on the game, it takes too long and it drags, but thats just me. I would give this game 5/10 (dont think about it like an IGN score you fucks) because
I thought it was midely enjoyable in small bits, but very mediocre and repetative. Its just such a drag to play compared to ds1. I didnt even play ds3 because I was so turned off at this point.
>>341642358
Both games have their share of shitty hitboxes and tracking. We can cherry pick all day but I don't know if anyone has bothered quantifying it. I have a much easier time with DaS bosses than DaS2 bosses as well. Probably players weren't as used to the series when they played DaS so they felt like it was harder when it actually wasn't.
