>See, the thing about video games-- and this is inherently true about every video game, just due to its nature-- is that as a result of being a video game, it's indefinable. You can't point at something and say "That's a video game" and "That's not one", you just can't. It shares that quality with art, and I think, at its core, that's really the best supporting argument that can be made for video games being art. There is no purer art form in my opinion.
Well, /v/? Was he right?
How the mighty have fallen.
Sure why not
It's such a odd question.
>Vidya can be comprised of 2d hand drawn art, 3D sculpting, landscape design, actors, and a story
>But the main concept lies in gameplay, which I'm not sure could ever be 'art'
It's...art-ish. Art-esque. Akin to art.
>>339972598
>this guy was in college for engineering
really makes you think
>You can't point at something and say "That's a video game" and "That's not one",
Yes you can.
This guy is an annoying, pretentious faggot who puts on a fake personality and fake enthusiasm to rake in the youtube shekels by appealing to ritalin-addicted children, in what I call the pewdiepie syndrome.
Also I hate his stupid fucking faggot red hair, fuck.
>>339972598
well i can define markiplier as a faggot
sage
How can you say so much but still say so little? Fucking pretentious assholes.
>>339972598
this is pretty clever, well said
>>339972598
Woah! It's red pewdiepie!
>>339972598
does he change his hair color every month?
what the fuck
Why is /v/ so triggered by the idea of videogames as art?
I feel like his answer is pretty vague however I do believe it is an all encompassing form of art. Video games can do story, visuals, sound, music, and atmosphere just as well as any other form of media and yet it encompasses them all in one personal, interactive medium.
Dude is like 40 and acts (and dyes his hair) like he's a confused 14 year old girl pretending to be a lesbian.
>>339972598
He's going to appeal less to the tween demographic as his hairline continues to recede.
>>339973269
Because it's not.
>you can't define video game
>therefore it's art
I'm an artfag but that's complete nonsense
>>339972598
>"I'm not comfortable with how youtube is changing by encouraging streamers just to get views..."
>Proceeds to highlight his hair pink and do a pepper challenge video
>It's okay guise, CHARITY!!!!!1
Is there a bigger hypo-critic sellout with a furry attention-mongering brother who taught him to do it? I think not.
>>339972598
he's fallen from great height into faggot territory, but he's right
A book is no game.
A ebook is no game.
A book.exe is a game.
>>339972897
the thing what sold me on video games as art was when I clawed my way back up from tomb of the giants through the catacombs to the exit towards the graveyard.
referring to Dark Souls 1 here.
It was a massive emotional response back then and still has a charming presence even today.
this is what art means to me in vidya.
unfortunately I didn't find a pic.
>You can't point at something and say "That's a video game" and "That's not one"
Why the fuck not?
>>339972994
>Was too retarded to get a job as an engineer
>Instead yells like a retard on the internet
Yeah, it does make you think.
>>339973417
How shitty is his furry brother?
>vidya is art meme
I fucking hate everything about e-celebs. Hope his cancer comes back and kills him.
>>339972598
>You can't point at something and say "That's a video game" and "That's not one"
Yes you can.
>>339973504
http://en.wikifur.com/wiki/Tom_Fischbach
>>339972598
gameplay
Oh great we got another Duchamp on our hands
>>339972598
Who?
>>339973269
because all the arguments made in its favor are retarded and done by people who are uneducated. Just because a marble statue is a considered art does not mean that the stone itself could be thought of as art. Just so, video games may be made up of various forms of art, but that does not mean that the end result is art or artistic.
>You can't point at something and say "That's a video game" and "That's not one"
I could point at like 50 things in my room right now that aren't videogames
this rock is a video game
my butt is a video game
>>339972598
I actually liked him when he played these horror RPGs back then.
>>339973635
You're a retard. Duchamp was mocking the idea that anything can be art and making fun of art critics.
>>339973710
But they might be.
>>339973710
I guess he meant something else
point to a game and say it ain't a game while another one is.
for example gone home is no game whereas volgarr the viking is.
>>339973912
>I WAS ONLY PRETENDING TO BE RETARDED
>>339972994
>>339973490
>has a bit where he cries and says "I could have been an engineer..."
>all his fans think it's a joke
>>339973269
When you consider videogames art, you open the floodgates to shitters who make non-games and cinematic experiences, because they got rejected from actual artforms. You also legitimize people who want to censor videogames because "it can't be considered art if it's so politically incorrect!"
Markiplier is one of the few good youtubers with 1m+ subs. He genuinely seems to enjoy playing games.
>>339973749
>my butt is a videogame
Can I play it? And by play it I meant fuck it.
>>339974081
>has a bit where he cries and says "I could have been an engineer..."
>his fans thinks it's a joke
wait what?
>>339973490
>So retarded he's now a multi-millionaire for playing video games in a dream job
Damn what a retard! haha! /sarcasm
>You can't point at something and say "That's a video game" and "That's not one", you just can't
Just gonna post another pretentious douchebag talking about this but who actually fleshes it out in detail
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgu76ql6FSo
Lampshade is not a video game.
>>339974125
>Markiplier is one of the few good youtubers
No you're not.
>>339972598
>it's indefinable
Everything is definable. If you can't define it, it means that either the concept is inherently flawed or that you are not knowledgeable enough.
>You can't point at something and say "That's a video game" and "That's not one"
Fucking retarded. I can point at his guy fucking hair and say that it undoubtedly isn't a video game.
>>339974238
Gee, surely that will last forever.
>>339974360
Oh yeah? Well name me some good YouTubers.
>>339974281
I love Lampshade.
>>339974479
Related to vidya?
None.
>>339974479
There are none.
>>339974479
here you go
>>339973647
Movies may be made up of various forms of art, but that does not mean that the end result is art or artistic.Yes it does.
There is one, and only ONE goddamn reason to classify video games as art, and that is to cover it under freedom of speech, which is a really fucking good reason. What anyone personally consider vidya to be literally doesn't fucking matter, it should have legal protection like any other media.
There is one, and ONLY ONE reason YOU don't want it to be art however, and that's because you don't want to feel associated with pretentious fake glasses wearing hipsters with rainbow colored hair in flannel shirts.
Markiplier once uploaded a video where he said "Fucking niggers in my way, I wish I could just KKK stomp on a nigger baby right now" and he took it down 2 minutes later
only 500 people saw it
it was some crazy shit
>>339972598
>if something is a video game, one can't just point at it and say "that's not a video game," because it's a video game
This is the most retarded statement that I've heard all week.
>>339972697
>mighty
>>339974625
Seems legit.
>>339974636
Care to post the last week one?
>>339974238
>Multi millionaire
Uh huh.
>>339974238
Youtube fame doesn't last forever. Remember RayWilliamJohnson? The guy who made so much money, getting millions of views per video by just talking about other videos? Where is he now? He's a fucking indie actor who stars in commercials. Living the dream, huh
>>339974636
>being this autistic
>>339974604
It doesn't if the movie isn't trying to be art. My point is that just because something has cinematography, music, costumes, acting (all forms of art) it does not mean that the end result is automatically art. It can be, but in most cases it's not.
>>339974532
>>339974539
>>339974589
You guys are no fun.
>>339974479
Northernlion
>>339973339
he dyed his hair and is keeping it that way for charity
dont get me wrong you're correct on the other parts but if dyeing my hair would get people to send money to charity, id gladly do it
>>339974238
>wealth is a direct measure of intelligence and education
>>339973339
He's 40?
I thought he was in his 20s.
>>339974750
>He's a fucking indie actor who stars in commercials
Wait, how is this bad? I mean he may not be a famous movie star, but that's not bad either. Commercials can pay top dollar. Certainly a more lucrative job than any of the menial minimum wage jobs that the majority are stuck doing.
>>339974918
only if its done through business instead of fame
>>339974873
No one ever said truth is fun.
>>339972598
Fuck no. That kind of post-modernist shit is absurd. a Video game is a Video Game, a film is a film, and a painting is a painting. There are certain qualities that define a video game. The post-modernist definition of art is fucking bullshit. Not everything is art, not all video games are art. Just like not all writing is art, and not all paintings are. Sometimes a painting is an advertisement, sometimes a book is just information, and sometimes a video game is just a puzzle to be solved.
>>339972598
>See, the thing about video games-- and this is inherently true about every video game, just due to its nature-- is that as a result of being a video game, it's indefinable. You can't point at something and say "That's a video game" and "That's not one", you just can't
why
>It shares that quality with art, and I think, at its core, that's really the best supporting argument that can be made for video games being art.
this isn't even an argument, it's just a statement. why
>There is no purer art form in my opinion.
ok. what is so pure about videogames compared to other artforms? because to me, instrumental music is the most pure artform.
>>339974948
idk, he just looks old. Even my old man looks more youthful than mark and my dad is in his 50's. Must be those degenerate azn genes kicking in.
>>339972994
Only it really doesn't.
Going to school for engineering doesn't mean shit, as does going to school for law, or nursing. Those mean nothing by themselves, without the degree.
>>339974724
>>339974787
Nice cheeky, laze retorts, idiots. Next time, don't bother responding to my post unless you've got a substantial rebuttal. I don't respond well when people waste my time.
>>339974803
thats fucking stupid. art isn't defined by quality.
>>339972598
Sure, you can get a lot of mileage when you keep deconstructing concepts and words to the point that they don't actually fucking mean anything anymore.
All that means is no matter how much you call something a video game or art, if it's core components are shoddy and made purposely ignoring fundamentals of craftsmanship built upon by decades of experience then all you really have is a shitty game and a piece of shitty art.
>>339975012
WELL I DIDN'T WANT TO BE REDPILLED
>>339974731
E-celebs at the level of Markiplier and PDP probably make more per year than most traders. They can't expect to keep that up for more than a few years, but then again neither can most traders.
Some of these guys will be able to retire if they keep this up for a few more years. Meanwhile the rest of us who stayed in school will be forever miserable/alone/unemployed. What a time to be alive!
>>339975063
Honestly there were so many different definitions of art thorugh the history that at this point it's pretty much anything that causes a strong emotional reaction.
And basically anything can depending on the person. Art is by definition subjective.
>>339975112
Actually it is, but I didn't even say or suggest that in my post. No idea which asshole you pulled that idea from but I'm guess it was your boyfriends. When we stop using quality as a mark for art we open up the gates to modern art.
>>339974803
Everything is art, or nothing is, that's the point. Art doesn't mean something is good or bad. There's good art and bad art. There's art for entertainment and there's art for art's sake. It is completely up to the viewer to decide what is art to him or her. That's why the only reasonable thing to do is to classify it all as art, to give it all the same protection.
>>339972598
So what's with the hair?
Doesn't he just make money off of other people's hard work?
Video games are compromised of art (concept art, music, modelling, architecture, acting, etc.....or at least they used to be), but they are also different. Whether something is a video game or not isn't really subjective, whether something is a good or bad video game is of course subjective.
Video games can be art, but they don't have to be, and not all are. Just because a piece of software is interactive doesn't make it a video game. You can make a piece of art software that's not a video game. Gone home is an interactive piece of art, and it's a video game in only the barest sense of the word, your goal is to find out what happened to your sister, by interacting with the enviroment, it's lazy, it's got almost no gameplay but clicking, it's story is sweet but sappy and middle school level, and there's no real twist, there's no hook, there's no conflict, nothing really happens. And it's in no way interactive. It's like Dear Ester isn't a game either. You're not involved in what happens at all.
>>339975093
Don't people of the asian persuasion look really young until a certain age and then it hits them like a dumptruck?
>>339975301
>E-celebs at the level of Markiplier and PDP probably make more per year than most traders.
I honestly doubt that. I don't doubt that they make good money, but I really doubt that it's enough to let them live a cozy life for the rest of their times. Only Pewdiepie is that rich. The rest are well off but not swimming in money like Scrooge McDuck.
>>339972897
>>339973474
The thing that makes a game a game is a success state and a failure state. The fact that so few games actually use this to invoke emotion is a shame.
Dark Souls creates a frustrating, overwhelming atmosphere with its death mechanic. It gives players the feeling of being an Undead, flinging themselves over and over at an obstacle, never truly dying. Becoming more and more impatient and irrational, until they prevail, or finally give up.
>>339974604
Precisely. Anything is considered art these days. Its disgusting. The second Videogames are considerd art, a huge influx pf 2deep4u pretentious games will inevitably flood the market.
Art has become devalued, the second vidya becomes "Art", games will be devalued as well.
I could shit in a bowl and submit it to a museum and theyd have to accept it for tje sake of pretentious middle class 19 year old faggots with pink hair thinking everything has artistic potential.
>>339975105
>Those mean nothing by themselves, without the degree
Even the degree doesn't mean all that much.
You can easily get your degree with minimal effort and forget everything you learned as soon as you get the paper.
>>339972897
I guess you could consider gameplay as the experience or showcase to the art within the game maybe, like how a museum or a gallery is to art.
>>339975554
Pic was actually an experiment or prank.
>>339975348
No, video games needs its own classification. They are a completely new thing. They don't need to be held back by the same antiquited laws that "protect" art.
>>339975320
who decides where the line is then you retarded faggot? there's good art and bad art, but it's all art.
>>339975348
Bullshit, Art has definable qualities. It has to be purposefully made to evoke feeling of some kind, a reaction. There can be good art, and there can be bad art, and good or bad is up to the viewer, yes. But a sunrise is not a work of art because no human intentionally made it. No human hand carved the snowcapped mountains or vast wood with rays of light shining through ,these things evoke feeling that art seeks to replicate, but what makes something art is the intention being there of the aritst to make something. Dropping a pair of glasses on the floor and leaving it isn't art. Which was the point of Dechamp's The Fountain. He put a fucking urinal on a literal pedestal and called it art to mock the pretentious faggots who think everything is art.
>>339975270
do you enjoy someones content then that a good youtuber its a subjective thing but in reality most them are shit - okay
>>339975301
But one of the huge draws of trade jobs is how dependable the work is.
As long as civilization exists, plumbers, welders, electricians, linemen will all be essential. Whereas these flavor of the month youtubers are all plateauing now but as they waste all their money on dumb shit and become older and less popular, they will be in very bad fucking shape.
>>339975517
Yes, it does. Balding is very common amongst asians, for example. Mark better enjoy his dyke hair while he still can because a decade later he's going to be sporting a comb-over. Their faces also begin to sag quite fast.
>>339975313
I believe there's two qualifiers for art. Something that evokes an emotional reaction of some kind, and is made intentionally for that purpose. There's no such thing as accidental art. Beauty in and of itself is not art
>>339975706
I know that. But its an example of the type of garbage being put in museums these days.
>>339975764
Usually it was left to the other masters of the craft, the other artists. Now those people don't exist which is why modern art is shit and made by talentless hacks who instead inject politics into their shallow and meaningless crap because they think it adds "depth" that plebs and philistines are able to react to.
>>339973604
How awful is twokinds?
>>339975975
>and is made intentionally for that purpose
Even ancient greeks defined art by functionality.
A well made sword or even a chair was as much of an art as sculptures or paintings.
>>339974090
>When you consider videogames art, you open the floodgates to shitters who make non-games and cinematic experiences, because they got rejected from actual artforms
Wow big deal. There will always be shitty games, so then shitty games will come in new forms. It's not like you're ever gonna play them, and it's not like you're gonna see less of the games you wanna play.
>You also legitimize people who want to censor videogames because "it can't be considered art if it's so politically incorrect!"
How the hell does it legitimize them? The people who would cry about games being "politically incorrect" would fucking cry about it no matter what, classifying it as art doesn't give them an extra leg to stand on. Art doesn't have to be politically incorrect, and if some dev is already making what some would consider a "politically incorrect" game I fucking doubt they're the kind of people to care about some ball-brained dumb shit reason like "art can't be politically incorrect". Classifying it as art gives it LEGAL protection from government censorship, that's fucking it. Not that many governments step in to censor games now, but there have been attempts.
>>339975554
I never understand why people say 'anything is considered art these days'. Not true. Any famous artist's art is considered art. Take a look at Marcel Duchamp, he got famous and he made a piece of art which was an upside down urinal. That was in 1917.
People like to look at monochrome paintings (those paintings that are just a block of colour) and say 'modern art is so bad', except that movement started in the early 1900s.
>>339976110
Yeah, it's such a tragedy man. Dumb cunts being dumb cunts trying not to be dumb cunts. The question is, why do you care so much? There's always been master artists doing masterful art, and shitty artists doing shitty art, and people who flock to all of it.
wtf
