![PRMeh[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/dca3v9F.jpg "PRMeh[1].jpg")
When did multiplayer games go from "you can make friends in this game" to "you can play this game with your already existing friends", /v/? Was it when the normalfags invaded the internet? What games were the first examples of this?
I didn't really play multiplayer games past the first/second generation of MMOs which were extremely conductive to making in-game friends and taking those relationships outside of the game, so I completely missed this shift, and now it seems that every game is either a "get teamed up with randoms" or "play with your existing friends" type of game.
Time passes, majority of people who played MMO's are now busy with their job/kids/whatever to the point that they simply don't have the option to invest so much time into a game.
easy-to-pick-up-and-play-but-somewhat-competitive-team-game is good solution to this. You have some player interaction with teammates and enemies, you have some fun, type "gg" and get back to whatever you have to do IRL.
Also it's addictive as fuck.
>"you can play this game with your already existing friends"
what if I don't have friends at all?
People realized there are only assholes in the internet so why bother trying to make contact?
>>339343478
Problem is casuals man.
If we want people to make friends then they need to encounter difficulty and persevere through said difficulty because of the specific qualities of someone else. Those qualities might become useful later, mutually, and so friends happen.
But if casuals arrive at a game primarily due to hype. Blow out all metrics of "which group of users produces the most revenue"...
And then promptly leave the game for the 'next big thing'.
Then we get a whole generation of games catering to that type of behaviour.
Casual behaviour. You want to sit at the computer, and see lights flash for maybe 20minutes to 2 hours, and then you want to get up, put your kids to bed, fuck your wife and go to work the next day. You don't have time to build relationships with people online through perseverance of a difficulty over time.
That's why Anon.
Because of casuals are the most profitable.
really it'a noose for the neck of the industry. Previously they were able to make a title with development time, and it would support itself for years with minimal patching. It would produce merchandise, tournament revenue, and even maybe DLC/expansions...
Now because they're going for the casuals.. They make a game CATERING specifically to casuals. The casuals arrive, and as casuals do play the game for a week or two, and move on to the next thing. That leaves the developer again making the next casual bait to lure them again.
THis is WoW's model now, this is overwatch's model, this is Call of Duty's model, this is Battlefield/front's model.
Repeatedly pumping out casual shit so as to hook the casual player base for a few weeks worth, and then dumping it and moving onto the next casual bait.
>>339343878
>>easy-to-pick-up-and-play-but-somewhat-competitive-team-game is good solution to this.
But it's just like watching a sitcom with a laugh track, that laughs for you so you don't have to. It's not even the Big Mac of socialization, it has even less substance.
>>339343478
Because the novelty of meeting people through the internet has faded away. Like >>339344004
said, most online experiences will be pretty bottom of the barrel, so it's not really worth wasting your time with.
I've had a ps4 since day one. Still not a single friend request and loads of hate mail in my messages. Fuck this I'm going back to pc
>>339344161
If not even meeting and cooperating and socializing with someone who's on the diametrically opposite side of the world is "novel" anymore, what's the point of life and why continue living?
>>339343478
I've thought about this a decent amount
in regards to mmos, people went from having fun progressing to needing to progress as quickly as possible to endgame. gearing up became a necessary process rather than the point of playing end game content. guild progression became a chore until you get better gear again instead of the point of the game.
modern players don't understand the point of mmos through not appreciating what an mmo provides. an mmo provides a roleplaying game where your actions impact the actions of other players and visa versa.
the reason to play should be the journey, and definitely not the end game. end game is content meant to provide an experience after the journey is pretty much complete.
>>339344004
Only because developers don't bother trying to encourage good behaviour on the internet. Instead they make the online games and allow private servers led by "warlords" who want to stretch out their micropenises by exercising their power over people. This creates a culture of trolls, bigotry and homosexuality in which everyone competes to see who is the biggest asshole of the server.
>>339344557
The MMOs we have nowadays aren't true MMOs. They are just glorified single player games with mute people running on the background while you do crawl through your automated progress line and occasionally team up with literal whos in instanced sessions, never to see them again. It's a genre that has genuinely regressed mechanically because as it stands now it's more like a prototype of what it used to be, a proof of concept at the very best.
>>339343478
I ask myself that many times. You cant make friends online anymore. No one interacts, and people are full of vitriol.And it really sucks cause a big part of on-line gaming is the magic of meeting people.
>>339344895
I remember when LfG was introduced and suddenly all the instances turned from fun quests with some homies into a fucking mobgrind races. You actually had some time to talk to people and do some duels near the summoning stone.
I used to have a lot friends online but today it seems it's a different story, you can only play with IRL friends you have.
>>339344295
Anon :(
I find it incredibly easy to make friends in online games. How could you possibly have trouble with it?
What do you even mean by friends? I mean it's trivial to be nice to someone and have that kindness returned, just keep up friendly dialogue between you and that person.
Are you just whining that nobody will do content with you or are you annoying and unlikable?
>number of friends I used to have on steam in 2007
168
>now
19 and I hardly talk to anyone
>>339345674
Got soft banned from souls 3 by getting black crystalled too many times as a sunbro refusing to join a gank. Yeah I'm done
>>339345790
I remember adding almost every player I came across that I thought was cool, then time went on and I got bitter, now my friends list is back at 0 because I can't be bothered to have people play with me nor keep in touch
>and I'm ok with that
>>339343478
Nothing changed. Most games have a matchmaking system. Try talking to someone you had fun playing with in matchmaking.
>>339345850
I never played any of the sequels, but it was fun playing the first dark souls and helping someone kill a boss instead of pvp, always felt like pve made better bonds
I've gotten friend requests multiple times playing Overwatch, declined all of them.
I mostly only play with 5 friends though.
>>339346192
Try souls 2/3, and the blue sentinel covenant
>that feel when you help a way of blue bro, fighitning against an invader.
>>339345967
>this feel
Used to bother me a lot, now I can't really see it any other way.
>>339346347
>Put on ring
>Wait
>and wait
>and wait
>>339346347
I mean don't get me wrong I like the souls franchise, but I'm too much of a casual, prefer playing regular rpgs where I just slap on armor m and walk through an army and have loot explosions
>>339346192
>>339346347
>this honestly
I'd love to be a blue and help people...but they are a myth in 3 and I've never been summoned. I'd also love to help people pve but every time I get summoned it's anon you and these 3 other guys deal with the invasion for me while I hide. Maybe it'll get better when the casuals stop
>>339346570
Before I felt obligated to log on all the time otherwise I'd lose a person online, now I just play on my own and man going at my own pace feels nice
>was a fool to think online friends > my own enjoyment
>>339343478
Wow Gang! Looks like we have a mystery on our hands! We must look for clues and try and find out what the Metzen Monster is up to!
>>339346812
That's kinda why I didn't wanna bother with the souls games too, Pvp is fun and all but my favorite feeling was working with someone to get past that difficult part or helping them get that thing they wanted
>>339344161
This isn't true, the way most people meet their partners is through the internet nowadays.
I do make friends in games though
They're not real, but I make them and they're my friends
>2016
>2016
>having friends
>>339344119
>casuals
They a problem for single player and most multiplayer games. For mmo, the problem are the hardcore players. They are the ones who bring the silly elitism that ruins comunities because other people copy them, they are the ones that destroy the sense of exploration and learning because you have to know everything as soon as it's out, they are the ones who exploit anything they can and then they complain it's easy, and they are the ones who play 10 hours each day and complain they have nothing to do.
If WoW and other mmos had only casual players, they would be much better.
>>339348291
>casual mmo player thinking people who actually care about the game are wrong
It's the casuals who kill exploration, progression, and challenging content. Not the hardcore people who only felt 'elite' in the first place because they did all of the things plebs couldn't or didn't have time to do.
No elitist ever said to Blizzard that they should remove challenge and exploration.
>>339348021
>Asian girl doing karate moves, mexican couple are a whore and her pimp
Ha ha
>>339343878
I get sick of this "the players grew up" fallacy. Many of us were grown ups then, in fact, I'd venture that games like EQ and vanilla WoW had older players than any mmo has today.
>>339344119 has it right. They stopped designing the games to foster relationships by taking away the necessity of having a team.
Now it's seen as bad design if you ever have to wait before you can do something, so all the design is focused on speeding up the gameplay loop.
>>339348418
what are you trying to tell me
>>339348670
yeah I was the only kid I knew playing vanilla wow and most people my age now(mid 20s) never played earlier mmos I'm sure.
it was different with other games but mmos back then had subscriptions and kids don't have jobs.
>>339348291
>>339348414
This.
Elite players made the game what it was.
It was the elite plyers that gave the game it's reputation that DREW in the casuals that then proceeded to make blizzard change the game or else theyl'l leave.
What blizzard didn't realise is that casuals will leave to the next flavour of the month regardless if they change it or not.
But because they DID change it not only did the casuals leave, but the hardcore player base left as well leaving them with 8 million lost subs that they have to justify to their shareholders as "The market is changing", "Players just don't like MMO's anymore"... "There's lots of competition now".
It's none of that. it's that they dun fucked up.
>>339348884
Essentially they had a faithful decent girlfriend that was a 8/10, that they cheated on to get with some dumb hooker 8/10 slut (The casual market).. that left them as soon as they catered to it.
Then they came back hoping to get back with the good faithful girl, but she moved on now as well and they're left with nothing.
So now blizzard has gone to try to catch HIV by screwing other casual hookers with their newest venture "Overwatch". They've basically given up on decent women.
I don't play online with others, I just don't like it for some reason.
>>339343478
Is this picture implying that you are raiding alone?
>>339349071
perfect analogy
>>339344837
>Only because developers don't bother trying to encourage good behaviour on the internet.
When they do, like Riot seems to want to do, it backfires immensely and just leads to more bullshit.
>>339350323
What happened? I'm not familiar with this.
>>339350843
>Riot creates a game where teamwork is important and the average match is over a half-hour, but there's no voice chat or anything
>naturally this leads to angry people talking mad shit through text chat
>Riot sees angry people as a threat to their community, so they start banning based on "bad-behavior" and invented buzzwords like "toxic" to curb this "issue"
>even petty remarks like "gg ez" could get you flagged down if it triggered someone, creating a subculture around reporting people for dumb shit, wasting everyone's time
>this just makes people scared of talking shit and angry people angrier
>nobody wins
>>339351485
>start banning based on "bad-behavior" and invented buzzwords like "toxic"
Did they also have a tranny community manager like Trino?
http://www.reddit.com/r/archeage/comments/4k4ae3/huge_changes_to_chat_policy_announced/
This sounds like exactly the same thing that SJWs pull pretty much everywhere where they take power as mods etc. - just bullshit rules that make it so that you can report anyone for anything, but of course only the people who are not on the "right side of history" get banned.
Thank god I don't actually have an office job or something like that where I'd have to suffer through that IRL.
>>339348418
>mexican couple are a whore and her pimp
I can understand the chink one, but this one doesn't make sense.
One of the main problems is that MMOs moved from group games to singleplayer games where you only have to team up for raids.
Pair that up with automatic raid finders and no build in voice chat and people barely have any contact at all
>>339352672
Voice chat is another thing that killed socializing.
>>339352672
>and no build in voice chat
This is a good thing you retard.
>>339352746
why?
>play vidya for years
>played wow since I didn't have many friends in school , vanilla days
>started making friends in school
>started playing more normie games with them
>cod, halo, Cata wow, league, now overwatch
>I moved away from my home country
>still Skype and play vidya with these same friends 8 years later
>10 years strong now
Wouldn't have it any other way
mmos are shit
>>339343478
In recent time, nobody seems interested in adding/talking with you outside the game session
And now I have nobody to play doom with
>>339352927
You probably bug them
![09c[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/fvRHwAJ.jpg "09c[1].jpg")
Me and my friends returned to WoW for some nostalgia and preordered the Legion after watching the film.
>>339352768
role playing
>>339353013
yes no one talks in role playing
>>339352967
Haha, maybe
But usually I just say like hello guys, and wait for a response
>>339343478
because the generation of socially inept gamers has mostly died off. it was the first generation of serious gamers, the ones who grew up with games like ocarina of time, age of empires etc. (and maybe a little before that), the first generation of gamers that was actually really big in terms of numbers but still bullied in school because games weren't cool yet.
Nowadays everyone plays games (except for many women because they're retards), like everyone watches TV, reads books or listens to music, so there's no audience for autists anymore who need a game to make friends. To most people, having to make friends with randoms online is an annoyance, not something to be enjoyed. Playing with your already existing friends is much more fun.
If you're one of those nolife autists with no friends, will sorry friendo you're gonna have to grow up.
>>339343478
Blame teamspeak, ventrillo, mumble, party chat, etc. When you are BY DEFAULT excluded from public chat then PC gaming suddenly becomes very reclusive. It use to be about the community but now it is about small cliques. You can blame Xbox LIVE and their horrid Party Chat feature for invading the theme of gaming across all platforms.
Even in Ogrewatch it forces everyone into GROUP chat first, before team chat. Despite the fact that it makes more sense from a DESIGN perspective to force everyone into team chat.
>>339354034
>>because the generation of socially inept gamers has mostly died off.
I'm not even 40 yet, come on.
Remember when everyone used to talk about some MMOs being like theme parks? Now the entire multiplayer gaming experience is designed like that.
>queue up to go on the ride
>have fun with a bunch of random strangers
>leave and never think of the people you shared that experience with again
>join another queue
How do we make MMOs great again?
>>339355593
Just mash UO/SWG+JTL/EVE/Archeage/Rift's dimensions together, remove ALL P2W BULLSHIT, remove ALL SJW BULLSHIT, and don't be a greedy fuck.
>>339355770
That doesn't seem so hard.
>>339355306
Because it sadly worked. WoTLK was the peak time for WoW, though arguably Cata brought in the most first-time players, both of which were peak themepark shit time.
Long after it's release other games that promoted similar shitty social queuing were MOBAs (which also killed the RTS genre straight out, thanks) most console shooters (more and more like glorified computers are consoles, but still queue systems and non-dedicated servers abound) and Steam/Skype in general keeping people locked into individual social cesspools (please listen to Kojima next time, he warned you)
I can remember when I was worried about friends list caps in some MMOs (not on Steam, that was always fucking huge) and these days I keep in contact with less than 15 people. I'm sure they still play games but they're undoubtedly in this same shitty cycle again, because somehow production costs rose to the point where every game is scientifically engineered to make you want more without providing tactile fun aside from feigned progression and loot bait.
>>339357410
Can you help me assemble a list of genres and what they devolved into? For example:
RTS->MOBA
Point&click adventures->hidden object games
It can be subgenres represented by different games too, for example Deus Ex/System Shock->Bioshock/DX:HR
>>339357410
>(please listen to Kojima next time, he warned you)
That's from McLuhan and other sociologists and philosophers from the first half and the middle of the 20th century, it's all been written about in great detail.
![Image-02-Brightwood-Grove[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/wkrR1H5.jpg "Image-02-Brightwood-Grove[1].png")
>>339343478
well it became shit because of shitload of meaningless content that you have to know about game to play it. Best times in wow were 2005-2008 when fanbase was new to the world and they enjoyed exploring elwynn forest and duskwood ... those were times.
>>339344837
>Only because developers don't bother trying to encourage good behaviour on the internet.
Because if you do you the faggots will catch on and make the experience even worse. If you try to hard you get called out for censorship. People are retarded online nowadays.
>>339345275
>all the instances turned from fun quests with some homies into a fucking mobgrind races
Hmm not really
if you played long enough all dungeons started to feel the same anyway.
The start of Cata was the only fun dungeon experience I had. Apart from TBC of course.
>>339350323
Riot is more like a thought police at this point.
>>339357623
I'd be pretty saddened to help, but here's what i've noticed just recently;
roguelikes => indie pixel art likelike monstrosities
car simulations => photo mode simulations with broken physics and half the content into DLC
WRPGs => shooters with swords
JRPGs => gameplay with softcore porn => softcore porn with gameplay
I'd simplify the car thing down to Gran Turismo lite, but even GT has better physics than even most PC car sims these days. LFS, a simulator from 2004 (crashing wackiness aside) STILL more accurately models grip, suspension, etc.
>>339357698
Didn't know this honestly, thanks for the information.
Wrong place for this but how is Tera? A friend keeps trying to drag me into it but i'm already invested in DDON
>>339360015
>Didn't know this honestly, thanks for the information.
Read McLuhan, Neil Postman, Jacques Elul and similar, it's all there.
>>339345706
where did you get that monitor?
I didn't even know mitsubishi made monitors until i saw your pic.
>>339360015
Oh yeah, fucking "roguelites", forgot about that shit even existing.
