Honest thoughts on Sonic Adventure?
>>337539284
Very underrated. So many people shit on it, but I found it to be very enjoyable. Mystic Ruins has got to be the best hub world ever.
I don't remember much of 1, but 2 is in my top 10 games of all time and I have at least a few thousand hours on it accross the gamecube, xbl and steam versions.
It's super janky, but the fact it's so much fun in spite of being janky is a testament to how good it is.
I'd like to replay both to judge them as an adult but hardly have the time as an adult.Story of my life.
It's bad.
Wait what? Did they find a way to play the beta version of the stages?
>>337540709
www.tssznews.com/2014/07/12/windy-valley-beta-restoration-for-sadx-released/
Great example of how the transition from 2D to 3D can look really smooth for the first couple of years, but then can turn to absolute shit when you don't bother to improve the formula in subsequent games.
>>337539284
Game is not nearly as unplayable as it's discussed but it's worthy of being called bordeline broken because of bad controls/vices, also the level design is amateurish and the cutscenes are about as bad as you can get with early 3D vidya.
Final boss is disappointing, should've kept Open Your Heart going/made the fight more challenging and less repetitive, thankfully something SA2 fixed.
Other than that, playing Sonic is kinda fun
>>337539284
I played it rather recently and I didn't like it.
I played it just to see what the big deal was with Big the Cat.
That game was so easy to get lost in. I didn't even bother with the chao crap in this game.
>>337539284
Kids nowadays call it shit because Arin sayed so, but it's actually the best Sonic 3D game if you ignore Big the Fisher guy
>>337541305
Who is Arin?
>>337541392
A jew
its pretty bad. sonic was just never meant to go 3d. look at the jump in mario from 2d-3d and compare it to Sonic. There's a massive gap in quality
>>337540832
Thanks anon
Wonder if they'll ever restore the dragon
Games that aged like milk, however I still love 2 unironically
>>337541392
A cuck
>>337540913
This anon gets it, 3D Sanic went to shit real fast
>>337539726
People shit on it? I remember it bring warmly received and well liked by crÃtica and fans alike
I played through it early this year for the first time in about a decade. It was bad. REALLY bad. Even the Sonic levels I remember fondly weren't very good, save for Speed Highway and Lost World. I probably won't be touching it again for another decade.
>>337539726
>the best selling dreamcast game
>gamecube port sold about a million copies
>underrated
>>337539284
I have fond memories of the original DC version, it's a good game with flaws. Modders still like to touch up on SADX to this day also so that's cool.
you can get BetterSADX here, it fixes some stuff and allows proper widescreen
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=299808681
>>337542052
Why did they remove the gamegear games from the XBLA/PSN ports of SADX, anyway?
>>337542171
have no idea
Am I the only one who enjoys all the level types in SA2?
Only rouge's are overall bad. Knuckle's are fine, tail's are fine, and eggman's are great.
Worse than 2 but still good
Sonic > tails = amy > knuckles > gamma > big
>>337542485
Everything but mech stages are good.
>played through SADX years ago
>never owned SA2 despite hearing how good it was
>bought SA2 on PSN right when it came out a few years back
>haven't played it yet because feel like I should replay SADX again first all these years later
Is the HD version on SADX worth getting, or should I just replay my GCN version? I know the HD version is at least lazily done and is only in 4:3, but maybe it looks great regardless/has other good features?
>>337539284
Overall? Mediocre.
Sent the series in the shitty direction in which it is currently traveling.
Was made with normies in mind instead of the established fanbase.
Sonic gameplay is streamlined, automated, and cinematic, resulting in a less deep game. Level design is no longer complex enough to have all playable characters tackle them in different ways.
Multiple gameplay styles resulted in less time to refine the various the gameplay styles.
So much time spent on the scripting, acting, and real world look, none of which was necessary or in any way beneficial to the game. Consequently less time to spend on the gameplay.
Music's god tier. Story itself isn't bad for a Sonic game. I love the game for what it is, but it's really just not that great overall.
Sonic 3K was a better Sonic game. Sonic Adventure 2 Battle was the best compensation for being a shitty Sonic game. Sonic Adventure is ultimately inferior as far as good and bad Sonic games go.
Someone should make an improved version.
>Have Yasuhara and Taxman replicate the level design of the classics properly in a 3D space.
>Bring back the level in OP's picture.
>Let Tails and Knuckles play in all of Sonic's levels, with the same goal as Sonic (just get to the end).
>Everyone can race and hunt for emeralds as secondary missions.
>Make Chaos Emeralds freely collectible, independant of story progress
>Make Super Sonic playable in Action Stages and Adventure Fields
>Port the Chao Garden over from SA2B.
>Tell every story the way Gamma's is told, which is just like S3K is told: minimal dialog, showing not telling, legitimate urgency, and evokes more sincere, rather than cringey, emotional feelings (just in case there was some artfag hipster still on the fence).
>>337540913
Fucking this. Rather than being a 3d sonic game it's more like a 3d 2d sonic gave if you get what I'm saying.
>>337542932
fuck I forgot
>multiplayer
>>337542729
There is really no difference. It looks cleaner than SADX on gamecube thats for sure. Plus its nice to have them both together on the same system dont you think? My xbox 360 is a Sonic machine, on it I have
>sonic 1, 2, CD, 3 and knuckles
>sonic 3D blast
>sonic adventure
>sonic adventure 2
>sonic heroes (xbox disc/emulation)
>shadow the hedgehog fuck you i liked it
>sonic 06
>sonic unleashed
>sonic generations
I pretty much got everything sonic i could ever need on my xbox and its great.
>>337539284
Sonic and Tails stages were amazing, Knuckles and E102's stages were pretty good, Amy's stages were meh.
That windy valley beta stage was fucking amazing though, don't know why they replaced it.
>>337542932
>Sonic gameplay is streamlined, automated, and cinematic, resulting in a less deep game. Level design is no longer complex enough to have all playable characters tackle them in different ways.
SA1 definitely didn't have this problem. That was more of SA2's shortcomings
Had the best music of any Sonic game.and Eggman's SA1 theme is better than E.G.G.M.A.N.
>>337539284
Loved them both as a kid, played them recently and they've aged horribly, especially 1 with all the collision problems that make you fall through the walls/floor
>>337542932
>OMG MUH CLASSICS A93TRKDJAIW COPY SONIC 3 FOR LIFE REEE
autism, go fuck yourself retard. keep replaying your shitty games till the end of time
>>337539284
Aside from the awesome soundtrack, it's the little things that made it familiarly Sonic. That really helped ease the transition from 2D to 3D.
Like the sound effects, for example, still have that cartoon feel. Sonic's jump, though not exactly the same as the 16 bit era, still felt appropriate. When Sonic Adventure 2 changed it to a series of whiffs and grunts, something magical just died.
>>337539284
Its ok.
Its not bad, its pretty unrefined though
>>337543515
I love how they used jpgs as background images from adventure 1-heroes. Gives them all an iconic look
>>337539284
Somewhat of a mess, but it had some pretty good parts. Too bad Sega's shitty management caused the games to stagnate and fester.
>>337543272
>boost pads
>scripted loops
>that fucking whale scene
>mash A to kill
>mash B to fast
SA2 did make it worse, I'll give you that
>light dash is quicker
>grinding
but it also removed
>mash B to fast
>>337543508
that's not an argument
>>337543134
>Tails stages were amazing
They were just repurposed sections of Sonic's levels with character that has an ability to skip almost all of the platforming. How did you find them "amazing"?
>>337543921
Just like the original games! Wait its bad when 3D Sonic does it!
>>337543921
>dose boost rings
What a sham
>>337542932
>Was made with normies in mind instead of the established fanbase.
Gamma's story was the only one actually worth something.Never forget. ;_;
>>337544226
All of their stories are good and fit the characters, dont be retarded. SA1 has one of the top 3 stories in sonic
>>337544015
Well, yeah, using Tails in Sonic 3 & Knuckles was genuinely kind of boring in comparison to using Sonic, especially if you used the flying ability to cheese areas you fucked up. I don't think anyone's going to disagreeing with that. I hope this isn't an attempt to subvert criticisms towards SA1
>>337544373
*away from
>>337544057
Read, nigga.
http://info.sonicretro.org/Game_Development:Sonic_Adventure#Development_Process
>Though unique goals and playstyles were thought up by the team, Iizuka felt that perhaps there should be completely separate playstyles in the game represented by new characters, to not only change the pace of the game but to also broaden the appeal, and have people who would not normally be interested in a Sonic title look into purchasing the game.
>>337539284
It's better to leave SA1 and 2 in your memories. Unless you have some 12 inch thick nostalgia glasses you will find these games have not aged well at all.... They're kinda shit.
>>337544552
pandering to normies ins't the issue here, being bad at doing so is
>>337542932
>S3&K
>Story
u wot m8?
>>337539284
Is that a retexture or something? It looks horrible on the bad models.
>>337545340
Just stop anon. You cant ever talk with S3 and knuckles kids. Theyre stuck in permanent nostalgia mode for such mediocre games. Its like the guy(s?) who are the UDF-Unleashed Defense Force
Just let them bask in their opinions, but dont even think of getting them to change their tune
>>337545440
nevermind ima stupid faggot, it clearly says beta in the screenshot.
>>337545340
>come to island
>Knuckles is a dick
>Eggman's there and he's a dick
>they keep being dicks
>Death Egg tries to launch but you fuck it up and it lands on a volcano
>sneak in on Knuckles' secret stash
>go underground to get into the volcano, Death Egg getting closer the more you progress
>finally kick Knuckles' teeth in
>watch Eggman betray his bitch ass
>watch him suck your dick
>you fuck Eggman up
>you give dickhead his emerald back, and fly off into the sunset holding the emeralds you went there with and more
moderate
it brought many good ideas to the table, but also many bad and poorly implemented ones. The game just in general feels rushed.
Had they spent a bit more time and polish on it, it would have certainly been the best 3d sonic.
but thinking about it more, a lot of the levels were really boring, generic and forgettable, pulled from a wiki
>Emerald Coast - Sonic, Big and E-102 Gamma (Tails, Knuckles, and Amy via glitch)
first level, clunky at parts but fun, good intro
Windy Valley - Sonic, Tails and E-102 Gamma
>better overall level but only memorable part is really the tornado
>Casinopolis - Sonic, Tails and Knuckles (E-102 Gamma via glitch)
good idea bad execution
>Icecap - Sonic, Tails and Big
snowboarding was fun, rest of the level is shit
>Sky Chase Act 1 - Sonic and Tails
autoscroller, alright but nothing great or very challenging at all, more like a cutscene you have to interact with to keep going
>Twinkle Park - Sonic, Amy and Big (Tails, Knuckles, and E-102 Gamma via glitch)
bumper cars were fun, rest of the level was shit, bad design
>Speed Highway - Sonic, Tails and Knuckles
good level, felt like a lot of SA2's city levels were designed off it's design concept
>Red Mountain - Sonic, Knuckles and E-102 Gamma
shit, if I recall correctly poor level design at parts led to deaths if you weren't moving just right during scripted segments of level
>Sky Chase Act 2 - Sonic and Tails
see above
>Sky Deck - Sonic, Tails and Knuckles
alright but nothing too memorable
>Lost World - Sonic and Knuckles
same as above
>Hot Shelter - Amy, Big and E-102 Gamma
same as above
>Final Egg - Sonic, Amy and E-102 Gamma
same as above
>Sand Hill - Tails (Side Mission), Sonic (optional)
shit, could have done more with it
As someone who never played it when it released and only came back to it a few years ago, it's aged like milk.
A lot of things come off as really unpolished or not very well thought out. The platforming segments are mostly sort of okay but whenever it tries to switch things up, whether it's by changing characters or some dumb stage gimmick like bumper cars or collecting rings through a tedious pinball game, it got even jankier than normal, and its normal is pretty damn janky already.
Then you've got the weird cutscenes with the jiggly faces and the buttrock, the way it tried to take the series in a more serious direction, overall it just fucked up a lot.
I think games like Colors or Generations are more in line with what I would want out of a 3D Sonic.
>>337546982
So you want 2D sonic to be 3D Sonic.
I think SA1 is the closest 3D Sonic has ever been to emulating anything that the classic Sonics had in terms of speed, exploration, and platforming, and it's a shame we really haven't had anything like it since, besides a little taste in ShTH and 06.Yes, I am shamelessly stealing the opinion from that Spitball series
Good on the Dreamcast, bad on the Gamecube and subsequent platforms.
>>337543676
Every early 3d game does that, from Sanic to Doom.
absolute shit
It's a really bad game. It gets a pass from most people because of the 3d, but goddamn is the gameplay horrible.
>>337539284
is the steam version widescreen?
It's bad, but still one of my favorite games ever if that makes any sense.
>>337539284
I enjoyed both immensely. I seriously do not understand how Sega finds themselves incapable of making a third.
And bring back the fucking Chaos already, what the fuck.
>>337542932
>>Port the Chao Garden over from SA2B.
Let me fix that for you.
>Remove Chao Garden
There we go. Big's fishing levels are more engaging.
>>337550582
You got sonic 06 for SA3. And unleashed has a lot of elements that harken back to adventure, essentially making it SA4. Fuck off with this already. There were SA sequels in all but name, and the chao garden is for fucking faggots, meaning you want a pet simulator over gameplay.
>>337542485
The whole game's a slog to be honest. Only reason to play it is because the hilariously tryhard cutscenes are really funny.
>>337539284
Despite its deep problems, it's still the best 3D Sonic game.
>>337541750
>People shit on it?
It's become a hot new meme to shit on SA1 and 2 recently because a few YouTube superstars said they were bad. A lot of it is just pure shitposting.
But really, it's always been amusing to me how people say the Adventure games are bad like it's destroying some kind of sacred cow like OoT or something. You're not saying anything new or mind blowing and you're not going to trigger Sonic fans by saying these games are bad. Let me clue you in on something: Nobody thought the Adventure games were perfect, even at the time they came out. Not even Sonic fans think they're THAT great, and openly acknowledge their flaws to this day. They may say they enjoy the games, but that doesn't mean they think they're great, or even good, mechanically speaking.
When you get down to it, as far as SA1 goes, I think it's more of a relic than anything else. It's fun to go back to for nostalgia's sake, but SA2 was overall the better game and an improvement in many ways. It was also worse in a lot of ways, but I think it holds up slightly better than SA1 does.
The Adventure games have never really struck me as bad, even looking at them objectively. They're clunky and unpolished, but bad is a bit harsh. I'd say they're really just mediocre to decent with glimmers of what made Sonic great sprinkled in here and there. But it varies wildly between characters and stages.
>>337552889
Sadly, this is true. It's the last time they tried to make Classic style physics work in 3D. Too bad they gave up during development, because that's the reason why Mario 64 still holds up even to this day. The designers knew that the way Mario handles was critical and should be the foundation upon which everything else is built. SA1 seemingly did everything backwards, and it was a weaker game for it. And so was every other game after it.
Unleashed > SA1 > SA2 > Heroes > Generations > 06 > Colors > Lost World
>>337554129
Your second reply is trash, but the first post is good. No one ever hailed the adventure games as masterpieces. They offer a variety of genres on one disc, have some fun speedy sonic levels, an interesting mini game, incredible music, and action packed stories with cheesy lines and cutscenes. They are solid 7/8/10 games depending on what annoys you.
>>337554628
>generations that low
>unleashed that high
>colors below 06
can you be any more of a contrarian faggot?
>>337556219
Not contrarian, just what i honestly had the most fun with anon
>>337556348
ok then thats finedo something about that fucked up taste though
>>337556412
Oki will disagree with you and let you enjoy what you like without calling it shit, hows that?
>>337556503
That's not solving the problem though, that's just avoiding it.
>>337556635
There is no problem to solve
>>337556683
>Stage 1:denial
>>337544992
No, they've aged fine.
The bad parts are just as bad and the good parts are just as good.
"aging bad" means the parts that were good before are no longer up to par as being good, and that's not the case with Sa2 at least.
>>337549137
What makes Sa2 worse?
>>337554129
This,
The adventure games have very obvious problems, but they are a ton of fun in spite of those problems. On any objective measurement they are 8/10 games, maybe a little more depending on how you value amount of content vs quality, but if you really like the gameplay, as I do, they can be a lot better on a subjective scale
>>337543508
>>337545474
People like you are ruining Sonic threads and making it impossible to talk about anything.Especially the good games.
I don't think it's as bad as everyone seems to think. I agree that in 3D you can't have that same kind of impression that you're just blasting through levels as Sonic since you have a third dimension to worry about, but I didn't think the controls were horribly busted. It is quite sensitive but you can get used to it.
When this came out on the Dreamcast it looked really good (facial expressions during cutscenes aside) especially the rendering distance, and the game very rarely takes a dip in FPS.
The music is excellent, this is one thing they've kept constant in the series and this is no different.
Obviously Big didn't need to exist and Amy's gameplay isn't very interesting but the rest of the characters have neat little spins on how they play the levels.
I don't care much for the story in a sonic game, and it isn't always very consistent with itself but some of the full motion video cutscenes they introduce look excellent for the time. Gamma's story in particular, while it is pretty cheesy, I think is well-driven.
It isn't a fantastic game, but it was pretty enjoyable for its time. Obviously, it has not aged well.
>>337557725
>I agree that in 3D you can't have that same kind of impression that you're just blasting through levels as Sonic since you have a third dimension to worry about,
I feel the opposite. It helps since you can actually see what's ahead of you, and it still does feel fast, at least in Sa1 and Sa2
>>337557532
Generations was dissapointing
Legit dont remember anything from colors except starlight carnival act 1 and aquarium park
Had more fun with 06s levels as a resort
The end. Get off the internet if you think everyone is out to meme you
>>337558258
>posts an opinion about a game
>someone calls out this strange shit opinion
>tries to kill the topic to avoid criticism
>admits to barely knowing the game making the opinion uninformed
All you tried to do was avoid getting criticized and admitting you didn't know what you were talking about. Fuck you mate, don't post your opinions in the first place if you can't back them up, you're retarded for doing that and then trying to squash the topic when you were called out for it. Every time someone tries to do the whole "let's just agree to disagree and not be mean to each other" song and dance, it's always because of this kind of shit. Don't be such a faggot.
>>337558665
Please tell me more about how my brain works and my experiences with the games in the list, all of which I played extensively over the years and have come to form my opinions on in categories such as fun, content, music, graphics, and stories. I could write essays on what I enjoyed and didn't enjoy from each game and how they ultimately got the ranks they got. But you'd shit all over it because Generations isn't at top and Sonic 06 isn't at the bottom.
You have a giant stick up your ass because my list isn't the same as yours. And you're fucking fuming over that. Like I said, get off the internet for a bit, go for a walk. No one should be getting this ass blasted over a rating.
>>337539284
It sucks.
Pretty amazing at the the time. I still remember my first time playing.
It's aged pretty badly though.
>>337539284
Ruined the series with its GOTTA GO FAST on-rails bullshit. Only millenial babies defend it.
>>337559401
>made sonic, originally about speed, fast for the first time
GOD DAMN THOSE FUCKERS. DAMN THEM TO HELL
>>337558930
You admitted to barely knowing Sonic Colors yet you're flaunting your opinion about it and demanding that no one criticize you for it.
Now you're going into a sperg rant because you were called out, none of what you said is relevant to the matter that was just exposed.
It's simple. Keep your opinions to yourself unless you actually know what you're talking about and can back them up. You wouldn't say one movie is better than another if you watched all of one and five minutes of another. That's a shitty opinion and one you shouldn't be sharing.
>>337559442
Found the child.
Sonic was already fast for a sidescroller. Going fast was a means of platforming and progressing through the level, not just there for its own sake. When it's so fast that it has to be on rails, then you fucked it up as a game.
>>337559401
>SA1
>on rails
>>337559536
So this is what its all about? You think I havent played the game? I played it 5 years and 7 months ago today. I barely played it after 2010 because of how pathetically easy, boring, slow, and 2D filled it was. Went right back to Unleashed, SA, and 06 after getting all the red rings. I know the game but all that stands out from it is starlight carnival act 1 and aquarium park, mainly act 1 again but Ill give this one a pass since i love the setting.
Learn to read between the lines, sperg mcgee.
>>337554628
SA2 > Generations > SA1 > Heroes > Colors > Unleashed > Lost World > 06
Would have put Unleashed above Colors if it weren't for the boring ass werehog sections.
Also 06 would have been above Lost World if I hadn't spent so much time fighting the shit controls and dying because my characters kept going through the floor or walls.
>>337559671
Yeah boy! Look at this fucking high speed action!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gefSRINaMYk
>>337560023
Most of my sonic 06 runs looked like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60XTi8KS9OU
so it was pretty much adventure 3 for me. Never really had problems with the glitches or these so called "shit controls" unless i was deliberately trying to fuck the game up. Sure they were occasional and have the largest amount of any sonic game, but its not like its actually unplayable like the meme would lead you to believe. I found the werehog more enjoyable than colors so thats why I put unleashed at the top. Colors was just so disappointing. I fell for the daytime stages only meme that they were marketing at the time
>>337560025
>posting a cherrypicked example from someone who can't even jump on a spring correctly or press down on the Dpad
Not that anon, but you actually had to be good to get speed in the classic sonic games because it relied on keeping your momentum. A good example goes for that stage that you ignorantly brought up. That part before the boss where the floor was raising was entirely possible to do without standing around on the floor with a thumb up your ass. You just had to be quick enough to go up the ramp while you still had the oppourtunity.
If you were a bumblefuck like that guy of course you wouldn't be going that fast. Even then, most of the level was still fast for a sidescroller.
>>337539284
Didn't really like it to be honest.
>>337559442
Sonic Adventure's problem is that it copies the spectacle of the old games in favor of their underlying design. The Genesis games were only about speed insofar as speed is implicitly necessary to establish and maintain momentum. The core design was predicated on putting pinball movement in the context of a platformer.
>>337560485
Nigger the second fucking zone in the fiurst game has sliding block "puzzles"
>>337542729
360/PS3 version of SADX is garbage, runs at 640x480
you should just replay on gamecube, the "HD" version is a straight downgrade
>>337549550
nope
>>337560025
Yes anon classic Sonic is slow if you play it like a total retard and slog your way through it on purpose.
It's also fast if you play it well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFAdE7trRXE
>>337539284
i love sa1 (dreamcast version), but its clear all they did was make sonic stages and the rest of the character's were an afterthought.
looking back sa2 really fixed that by making 3 types of stages. the scoring system helped add content to the stages too.
>>337560776
>speedruns are fast
Woah
>>337554628
It's posts like these that let me immediately know you never played '06.
![flyingbattery2[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/u8WoieF.png "flyingbattery2[1].png")
>>337560485
The problem is that the games actual levels arent designed around momentum like 99% of idiots say. There are elements of it sure, but there are still a lot of random full stops or spikes/enemies placed just to slow you down. Theyre not momentum based at all. Its a regular platform with a pinball physics engine (which actually makes it annoying in parts where you do need to slow down) with some slopes and hills here and there to roll around in for a few seconds before coming to a full stop.
This level would be so much better if it was just pic related. Opportunities to keep rolling without constantly getting hit every few seconds or stopped by a wall
>>337560776
>implying you or the average player can do that
Nah. Nothing against speed runs and dedication, but sonic should always have speed present. Going fast and having fun shouldnt be exclusive to 5% of the players. This is ultimately what the 3D games get right. Ill trade rolling down a hill to get speed for faster speeds and pacing
>>337539726
>Mystic Ruins has got to be the best hub world ever.
Sonic adventure is the worst example of hubworld that ever graced videogames.
>>337560913
PUT THE APPLES IN THE BASKET ANON
>whole thread
>no rouge
>>337560949
>The problem is that the games actual levels arent designed around momentum like 99% of idiots say
But they are. There are occasional blunders like Marble, but most of the levels involve it. Spikes and enemies and varying paths are in the level as variables that the player has to account for in earning momentum. Otherwise it would be pointless and dissatisfying. The fact it has pinball physics is precisely why momentum is so significant.
>>337539284
It was great, and overall more fun than SA2 (because fuck SA2's treasure hunting).
>>337561112
Let's change that
>>337561112
Stupid sexy bat. Rogue is the only character who had a good voice actor in all renditions. She sounded more young in sa2 and heroes, went up to smoker milf status in shadow/06, then the current one is like a mix between the 2, leaning towards momma status.Great character
>>337560776
Gotta go too fast
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Glfx6LBbbGY
>>337561283
>implying Eggman's voice hasn't been consistently top-tier
I don't even remember what Rouge sounds like past SA2, unfortunately, but smoker MILF status makes my boner inquisitive so I guess I'll go look that up.
>>337561207
Thats where i disagree. Id be fine if it was an obstacle course if it was linear, like say a crash game or sonic heroes. 2D sonic games are the only 2D games I ever get lost and feel claustrophobic at the same time with. Metroidvanias too but those are supposed to be sprawling and confusing. I dont think its good design for a platformer, especially one thats in 2D and supposed to move fast. More linear would be better
>>337561394
Fuck, cant believe i forgot eggman. Eggmans always been good to. Its honestly pretty jarring if youre going straight from sa2 to shadow or 06 (or sonic x used her too if you ever watched that). But its pretty sultry and seductive and i love milfs, so i love it
>>337560635
>more cherrypicking
Good thing I wasn't talking about sonic 1, the experimental first entry in the series where most fans agree that some stages are rough around the edges.
Funny you should bring up Marble garden though, because the stage before it and the stage after it were extremely momentum based so you're still a fucking retard.
>>337560949
>The problem is that the games actual levels arent designed around momentum like 99% of idiots say
They are, because momentum will usually get you to an alternate stage path that you couldn't have gotten to otherwise. A path that rewards you with items and less obtuse platforming.
>This level would be so much better if it was just a series of ramps and slopes with no pesky platforming or challenge to get in the way of you holding right
>>337561607
>the second fucking level is cherrypicking
Fuck off.
>>337561607
Not really. Just make it linear and its better. Sonic levels feel like theyre all randomly generated with some loops tossed in here and there, after that they just decide where to put obstacles and shitty enemies. A more focused linear approach with memorable events or significant landscapes/scenes to further help you memorize whats where and when to avoid it is better. Everything tends to blend together in the old games and it gets annoying. I just dont like the idea of an open world platformer
>>337561815
>2 levels in a series of games with 30 something levels is more than enough evidence
>no actual response
Don't play sonic, it only leads to autism and fits of rage
>>337561913
The sonic advance games sound like they'd be right up your alley, have you tried them?
>>337562097
I have and i enjoy them very much. Im great at advance 1 and 2. Rusty at 3 but can still have fun with it
>>337561112
Have some big fat bat tats.
>>337563956
How about big fat bat ass?
>>337539284
Aged like 40 year old milk left out in the sun.
Sonic Adventure 2 was more focused, and all around a better game.
Fuck you I liked the mech stages.
>>337542485
I do
>>337564042
look up apostle or spazkid
>>337539284
Said it once, saying it again
The 3D games are just terribly design, making you play characters that have nothing to do with Sonic's gameplay style or forcing you to beat the same game multiple times in order to reach the end
Even if they get the "Sonic" part of the game right, i can only say i enjoy what could be 30% to 40% of the game, and i just can't defend that design mentality
The only true good games in the series (Maybe Advance and Rush too i haven't played those) are the classics and Generations, other games suffer from "Let's force another gameplay style or bullshit down the player's throat, because Sonic is just not enough!"
Again, not saying that the games are not fun at all, i'm saying that they are terribly designed
>>337554129
>It's become a hot new meme to shit on SA1 and 2 recently because a few YouTube superstars said they were bad. A lot of it is just pure shitposting.
Hurts my heart to see some of this shit, honestly.
>>337564254
>Fuck you I liked the mech stages.
Who didn't?
>>337564824
I hear a lot of people saying that the mech stages were shit, even calling them worse than the treasure hunting stages.
I think they just say that because they're not in the right mindset when they play those stages.
>>337564876
The only bad stage in sa2 is mad space. the problem is the settings of the game are pretty bland. the desert levels, and everyone fucking has one, are bland as shit. wish there was more forest and city levels. the spaceship levels are kinda meh too. outerspace ones are great. Theres a few unique one offs like the ocean base, pumpkin hill, security hall, those are nice. few more of those one offs wouldve been cool.
but seriously fuck those god damn egypt levels.
>>337539284
It's a genuine piece of shit that I can't help but like because it's a product of its time and that time is nostalgic
First time I played it was 2011, it's not a childhood memory thing but it still has this really strange charm despite the gameplay being shit and heavily flawed
>>337564876
The treasure hunting, shooting, driving on the American highway, snowboarding down an avalanche, racing in twinkle circuit were great fun
If people want to look at a Sonic game that was a mess, take a look at Shadow The Hedgehog
>>337557631
>On any objective measurement they are 8/10 games
you are DELUSIONAL if you believe that Sonic adventure deserves anything higher than a mediocre 6/10. To suggest that it's better than 80% of games has got to be the dumbest thing I've ever heard
>>337563956
more
>>337565245
6/10 isnt mediocre. its above average. which is exactly what they are.
>>337564824
>>337564876
>>337565173
Because people wanted to play as Sonic
>but i had fun with other characters
Maybe you did, but the majority didn't, Knuckles was fast, why was he chasing around Master Emerald shards again, why is Tails in a mech instead of flying?
I just don't get how can people defend SA1 and 2 when they have incredibly low production values besides music and they are so badly designed
The only well designed 3D game is Generations and maybe Colors if it didn't have that 2D basic and blocky Mario platforming
>>337539726
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5VBjq0oPZM
>0:54 onward
>>337565397
Average is 7 under any objective scale. Just like real life exams, 50% is barely scraping a pass and not the "average" mark - There is a bare minimum standard of quality that's expected which accounts for the lower 5 marks. Things that most people take for granted but still cannot be ignored when evaluating a game.
To make 5 average is to heavily scale your rankings, thereby making it a subjective and invalid ranking system
>>337540913
THIS. This is exactly why I like more Adventure than boost games.
Adventure physics were perfect for 3D Sonic: a balance between platforming and speed, along with some momentum-based parts. Why did Sonic Team trash it? Because 06? Because they didn't wanted to be like Nintendo?
>>337565173
Listen anon, I love SA2 as much as anyone. But I can not in good faith call those driving levels with Tails and Rouge "good."
>>337544226
https://youtu.be/EJeMnOZYViE
>>337566010
Because Sonic fans cried that the series is ruined for not being about speed.
Which is actually ruining the series nowadays.
>>337566010
Because the controls were literal oversensitive shit to normal people who weren't autistic children that spent 3 years perfecting their strategies of putting up with the shit they were given
>>337540913
This, but i think they fucked up from the get-go
>Slow Knuckles down, make him go item hunting
>Put Big because new fishing controls SEGA made at the time
>Put Amy and Gamma wich play like a slowed down Sonic and have no plot significance
>Don't polish the game and have low development values besides music
Seriously, the voice acting, the animations and everything was just garbage, and Crash Bandicoot 2 was around at the time and they nailed those things perfectly for the time
SA2
>Slow down Tails and take away his ability to fly, the only reason why you played as him before
>Break the emerald again and gives us Knuckles #2
>Higher development values than SA1 but still low
The alternate gameplay styles killed Sonic because he stopped being the focus, also, Sonic can do mature storylines, just not dark and edgy
>you will never play a dedicated chao simulator
I miss being an autist and taking my chao with me to earn fruit n shit.
What the hell happened to Charmy's voice in Shadow
>>337566492
dont diss gamma dude, best story missions in the game
>>337565632
Not him, but just a reminder: not every place uses American's grading system.
Also, video games, or any form of entertainment doesn't have fixed grading system. Any grading system can be used, and the majority prefer 5 being average, since it's more logical.
>>337567571
Where do you live, and is it actually acceptable that the average student only gets half of a test correct?
>and the majority prefer 5 being average, since it's more logical.
This is bullshit and you know it
>>337566575
Fuck Charmy, what the fuck happened to Vector?
>>337568725
>we gotta find the computer room
Shadow the Hedgehog is an extremely meme-tastic game now that I think about it.
Why you goddamn parrots can't understand that SA1 would be awesome if Sega/ST just gave game more polishing.
Oh right, you are parrots, you just learned to shitpost about muh sonic-only and so on.
I agree, there were some awful shit like forcing Big up everyone's ass, but somehow you see it as a sign that ALL stuff except Sonic has to go.
>>337539284
Pretty fun but also kinda crappy, there is potential for a good 3d sonic, but sega doesn't seem to be capable
I can't say anything about 1 as I never played it, but for 2 I felt like I was playing it primarily for the Chao garden. If they made a decent sonic game with that as the main focus, or even just a chao raising game itself I'd be all over it. Also fuck the emerald finding missions.
>>337569075
Agreed
>Also fuck the emerald finding missions.
They were a bit annoying sometimes, but man they were worth it just for gems like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjYPOAjH9s8
The game had such a varied OST.
>>337569192
>generic black rap
>unironically includes the lyric "hope I don't die"
Everyone knows Shadow the Hedgehog has the most varied soundtrack of the dreamcast era
They are mediocre even for games out at the time.
Sonic Adventures was well received on launch because it fit the idea for what people thought a 3D Sonic game should be like. Unfortunately the physics and controls are borderline acceptable, the levels aren't entirely finished because of the lack of polish (the collision detection and clipping issues a legendarily bad), and half the game isn't fun to play.
Its aged horribly because it wasn't good in the first place. Quality standards for 3D games weren't well established in the late 90s so judging the game's mechanics was almost impossible.
>>337569246
>judging it by the lyrics and not by the prod values
>>337569381
I judged it by both
>generic black rap
encompasses more than the vocals
It's got the typical 1-2 bar endless loop that shitty rap songs use
>>337569501
>It's got the typical 1-2 bar endless loop that shitty rap songs use
I think you know very little about the genre. Not even to mention the song is far closer to garage.
>>337569637
Are you suggesting that the song doesn't just consist of a series of loops that are occasionally swapped out for a different loop?
>>337568725
He found the computer Room
>>337569749
nigger that's every video game song
>>337569749
I'm suggesting that if you think the majority of songs within that (And offshoot) genres are any different, you're mislead.
>>337569783
Except that's not true, even within sonic adventure 2
>>337569837
My point is that they're all the same, and that 'same' is of little musical credibility
>>337569246
>Hope I don't die
Lyrics:
Took a shuttle to space and left from our home
At least we're with friends and I'm not all alone
Bad thing was that the Emeralds spilled
Gotta search space, man, time to get ill
What's this? Can't fly or climb
I just could float, hope I don't die
Meteors comin' my way, weavin', gotta go straight
Ain't a criminal, crime don't pay
Seen a crazy look, Eggman's face
>What's this? Can't fly or climb
I just could float, hope I don't die
My biggest problem with it is how the cutscenes lasted longer than it took to go through the levels.
>>337569984
The bigger problem is the english port is so shitty they couldn't even sync the audio cues so that they didn't run into each other
>>337569924
But that argument discredits the majority of music, the idea of a song is that it's a piece based around certain chord progressions and sounds repeated and worked together.
>>337539284
I enjoyed it just like you did when it came out. Good game. Very pretty for its time. Remember thinking the graphics wouldn't make such a leap.
>>337570070
Repeating chord progressions and repeating 4 bar melodies are two ENTIRELY different matters
>>337570061
No that's far less of a problem.
>>337570196
But they're not, and neither one particularly takes more work, thought, or talent than the other. Repeating chord progressions are arguably more generic than a repetitive bar as they rely on a more gimmicky means of presenting structure and memorability.
>>337570331
Repetitive bars inherently include a repetitive chord progression
Repetitive chord progressions can include significantly varying melodies
I used to love 2. Like I LOVED it. Then I realized something trying to re-100% it.
The only fun levels are Sonic/Shadow levels, and not even all of those. And the ones that are at forward to win. Less than 30% of that game is actually fun to me.
>>337570463
Repetitive bars can include layering and their own progression, and due to the limiting nature of chords, there are more bar progression variations possible than chord progression variations.
>/mu/ in this thread pretending to know anything about music
Fuck off.
>>337570572
Non-repetitive bars also include layering, your argument is inherently flawed
>the limiting nature of chords
Are you fucking serious right now
>>337570702
>chords are now infinite in number guys
You haven't had a valid argument beyond subjectivity in the first place.
>DO YOU THINK YOU CAN BEAT ME?
>GET A LOAD OF THIS
>NOOOO WAY, I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS
>NOOOO IT WAS A DUD
>>337542932
>Was made with normies in mind instead of the established fanbase.
The rest of your post is strangely okay considering how stupid a complaint this is.
>>337570793
The series in which chords can be played is infinite in number, as is the series in which "notes" can be played
By using loops of melodies, you are limiting that 'infinite' to about 4 different things that each instrument can play in a given bar. Not exactly high art.
Your argument is yet to use anything that isn't a double standard, outright false or otherwise illogical
>>337561435
What? Sonic levels are super linear, it's impossible to get lost in them.
The beginning of Sonic's end
>>337541464
the WHAT
>>337572367
https://www.google.com.br/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=sonic%20adventure%20dragon
>>337572367
>>337572427
By the way it seems they already did, nice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yx-5O8pH3Jw
>>337565502
>and they are so badly designed
I don't get this meme.
The gameplay is fun and far more responsive and it and the physics has more freedom then in generations or colors. The level design is way less flat and is more suited to rewarding skilled play but making it feel fast even if you don''t know all the tricks and shortcuts.
Generations and colors also shove 2d segments down your throat, which has a fundamentally different gameplay and design philosophy
>>337570061
>implying that wasn't part of the charm
.
>>337539284
Fun game, still like it
Boost is OBJECTIVELY a better gameplay style than adventure sonic.
It doesn't fit the 'momentum based' meme (which itself has been invalid ever since the spin dash), but instead it's purely reaction based. There are also a much wider range of player abilities (run, boost, jump, homing, air dash, midair boost, ring chain, drift, grind, groundpound, side dash, etc) which, when combined, provides a deeper gameplay experience than anything in a sonic adventure (which heavily rely on manipulating broken physics in counterintuitive level designs)
>>337572219
If you weren't underage, you'd know Sonic Xtreme was the beginning of the end
>>337562049
Same with Mario.
>>337573231
>MY
>OPINIONS
>ARE
>FACT!
>OBJECTIVELY!!!
>>337573551
>responds to objective analysis with subjective shitposting
wow you sure proved me wrong
I like it enough to annually replay the Sonic part (only takes like an hour or two), but I can't really call it a good game since its generally really sloppy and poorly-conceived.
SA2 fixes a few minor things but doubles down on the garbage side gameplay and makes it so the alternate gameplay is mandatory to unlock more Sonic stages. Fuck that.
>>337573682
completely subjective
>>337573748
>here are the character abilities, there are more of them and are used in more varied situations
>levels are designed to emphasise the character abilities not in spite of them
That's objective, anon. There was no 'it feels good', just pure data
I'm more of a fan of Sonic Adventure 2
Such good game design
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hmIEAlkPTk
good things about SA1
Sonic
Tails
Knuckles
E-102
Perfect Chaos
Introduced Chao
Sonics 1st iconic 3D game
SA2
Sonic
Shadow
Eggman
Some of Knuckles/Rouge
Multiplayer
Way better chao garden
Emblems to collect (replayability?)
Better bosses
Better presentation
>>337539284
it's fucking great they should have kept large hub worlds in Sonic.
Speed Highway is a fucking great stage
>>337539284
Glitchy, but fun.
>>337573231
>which itself has been invalid ever since the spin dash
>implying the spindash brings you to top speed
>implying the spindash is fast enough to get you through anything other than a loop or a medium sized slope
>There are also a much wider range of player abilities
Boost(replaced the spindash),air boost,drift,and sidestepping. We also got gimped grinding that served no purpose unlike it did in SA2. Don't even get me started on the physics. It really didnt add much it just changed how it worked.
>all of those 5 dollar words
stop trying to act like a game critic, its embarassing
>>337573984
Be careful what you ask for.
I enjoyed it as a kid.
Replayed it recently its terrible, just hold analog stick forward with tape and the Game will play itself. Really is a kids game.
>>337574334
How the fuck did grinding serve a purpose in SA2? You couldn't even switch rails neatly, you had to fight against the physics to make sure you landed in the exact right spot
![showposter[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/ENxdUOC.png "showposter[1].png")
>We got this instead of Sonic Adventure 3
That being said, this game had decent gameplay, a few good levels, and some great music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRUdjM6-iR8
>>337574729
>this game had decent gameplay
It has the absolute worst physics second to sonic 06
Take off your fucking nostalgia goggles
>>337574442
>You couldn't even switch rails neatly, you had to fight against the physics to make sure you landed in the exact right spot
Get good.You can gain an incredible amount of speed from grinding, its faster than running at top speed. Not to mention you can launch off of them and gain huge distance if you have enough speed.
>>337574826
At least you were running through every level without stopping to hunt for treasure or pilot a mech.
>>337574826
>take off le goggles
>>337574941
>You can gain an incredible amount of speed from grinding
aka the physics were broken and you liked abusing it, then complain when they actually make a competent game
If you remember this pic you are an asshole
>>337539284
this place is just full of trolls who ride the rides of memes daily.
the game is fine. sonic, tails, knuckles gameplay is perfect. e-102 too, amy even. if the entire game was just sonic with more of his stages, it would be beautiful. i have never, ever, had a problem with this game. people who say it didn't age well are full of massive shits and just love to repeat stupid phrases that literally have no meaning. the hub world was fantastic. the chao garden was great, but 2's is better.
>>337539284
It's middling. Visuals are pretty damn okay for 1998 (DX version has higher poly counts and runs at 60 mostly, but looks worse all around). Soundtrack is fucking ace. Sonic at least controls well (maybe too well, he's a bit twitchy to manuver).
Stage design is iffy, who fucking designed Lost World or Sky Deck, anyway? Really cool stage ideas, but no fun to play at all. On the other hand, Red Mountain as Sonic is great, and Speed Highway is pretty okay. Casinopolis is terrible, but mostly because the pinball physics are completely fucked and make it the dullest experience around.
Amy's stages are boring, Big's stages are hilariously dull, Knuckles' stages are tolerable but too easy (and they fuck that up in SA2, where they're dull and the radar sucks). Gamma's stages have no right to be as clunky as they are, they should be smooth, fast shooting action, there's no fucking way Sega should have have fucked up such a Sega-like concept as a timer-based lock-on shooting game. Tails' stages are fun, but they're mostly just Sonic's with random-as-fuck object placement, dash rings and extra platforms strewn around with abandon.
Adventure fields are a neat idea, but I really don't think they added anything to the game, and might have even hurt it for some people.
Perfect Chaos isn't worth playing through shit like Amy and Big's stages for, it's not a great fight.
Actually, the bosses overall kind of suck. That's par for the course in Sonic though, but SA1's bosses are pretty damn shit.
SADX is glitchy as fuck. The original DC version is also pretty damn glitchy, but SADX is glitchy in entirely different ways.
It's a 6/10 game. It has its good bits, but there's a ton of bad on top. SA2 fixes a damn lot of problems that were wrong with SA1... and introduces a bunch of its own, but that's another post of its own.
>>337575076
>aka the physics were broken
No, you were actually supposed to go fast on rails if you could balance yourself right.
>>337574951
>At least you were running through every level without stopping to hunt for treasure
you mean besides the entire Chaotix campaign (1/4 of the game) and the fact levels were designed around enemy encounters that literally blocked your progression until you killed everything, therefore making the game combat oriented with some traversal distractions in between combat scenarios?
>>337575095
Guilty as charged.
I was really fucking young when I first saw this and I felt like a fucking monster. I vowed to never banished a Chao again afterward.
>>337573231
>Boost is OBJECTIVELY a better gameplay style than adventure sonic.
I think both are trash, however
>'momentum based' meme (which itself has been invalid ever since the spin dash)
Is just false. Sonic 2 and 3&K both heavily emphasize momentum. The spin dash was introduced for convenience; it doesn't in any way negate the design. On the contrary, the fact it was even implemented implies the opposite.
>>337575328
There is no building of momentum if you have an 'instant speed' button
>>337575595
Many things in the games are only attainable if you maintain your momentum well ahead of time. Spin dash just made it easier to hit an initial increase; it didn't do anything about maintaining it.
>>337575595
Except it's not fast enough to do anything remarkable with so you still have to build momentum. The spindash doesn't put you anywhere near the max speed cap, it was designed to get you through things like loops and slopes which held people back in sonic 1.
>>337575268
Chaotix and enemies are both legitimate complaints and I agree with you on that but the rest of the gameplay is decent. Not spectacular, not great, not even good. Decent. It was playable and could sometimes even befun.
>>337575196
sonic doesn't control "well", he controls perfectly fine, having a tough time keeping to the middle in windy hill? that's not sonic. tails is fine. knuckles could have used some tweaking because he likes to stick to the ground. amy was slow, but fine. e-102 was fine. big was fine.
i disagree on sky deck, lost world is alright but it's still fun to play. speed highway is gold. casinopolis wasn't that great for sonic, but i wouldn't call it terrible.
amy's stages were fun. big's stages are a sega fishing advertisement which i despise. knuckles stages were great. gamma's stages were great as well for the time, so they weren't clunky. everything was smooth, and his power ups made it better.
adventure fields were perfect, and of course they added something to the game. it's called the adventure fields. they gave you a sense of adventure, instead of choosing a stage to play. it had chao gardens, exploration for emblems and power ups. i loved getting lost in mystic ruins.
perfect chaos was a fun boss fight, of course it's worth a playthrough. gathering enough speed was tricky but it was a worthy final boss that generations killed.
sonic adventure 1's bosses were better than 2's by a gigantic margin. actually, these bosses were fucking great. how shit is your fucking taste?
it was not glitchy, but i know that it had to be a bullet point for you, like always.
i'd give it a 7.5/10 overall.
>>337539284
Greatly enjoyed it. Prefered the levels here more than in 2.
>>337576014
>>337575268
go fuck yourselves. i loved chaotix. who else would just turn invisible with espio and go alone?
>>337576014
Heroes is the only sonic game I've dropped because I was not having any fun (genuine, masochistic or otherwise)
And I've beaten the final bosses of Sonic 06 and Shadow the Hedgehog
Heroes is on the absolute worst part of the spectrum where it's playable enough to not be completely broken but it's not playable enough to be genuinely enjoyable
>>337576193
not that anon but
>sonic adventure 1's bosses were better than 2's by a gigantic marginohno
>it was not glitchy
The gamecube and PC versions were definitely glitchy, the DC version was more stable though.
I like SA1 but come on
>>337576695
>oh no
What? Don't come on me. The boss battles were definitely a billion times better. I don't even count the mini battles you have with knuckles and shit, but Eggman, every chaos battle, those were unique and played a lot more well than retardedly fighting battle bots by hitting their weak spot awkwardly. Even the character battles were horse fucking shit. It's like they threw all their creativity out of the window and just made it so that you can hit them anytime when they are vulnerable.
Nope, there were no glitches from what I've seen. People use that call too much, and it's not a point.
>>337576695
SA1's bosses >>>>>>>>> SA2
>>337539284
2 was better
2D ones were better
>>337576193
>it was not glitchy, but i know that it had to be a bullet point for you, like always.
SA1 is the game I've fallen directly through the ground more in than any other in my life. Not say, out-of-bounds geometry, but supposedly "solid" ground.
All of SA1's bosses are easy and barely do anything of note while making you play the waiting game (apart from the character fights like against Knuckles, where you can kill them in moments). Again, Sonic bosses in general, but they're not that great even by that metric.
also, I didn't say shit about SA2's bosses
as for adventure fields, if Sega expanded more on the whole "adventure" concept, they'd be kind of neat, that's one thing SA1 doesn't do enough (and then SA2 drops completely, other than the melodramatic as fuck story)
as it stands, they were a tiny glimpse at what could have been that just got in the way between stages
also
>for you, like always
wwwwwwwwwwwwww
>>337577442
>2 was better
lmao yeah sure thing.
Emerald hunt stages were fucking garbage, so were the Tails ones. They were much better in 1
>>337577216
>Nope, there were no glitches from what I've seen
(You)
>>337577456
fun bosses in SA1
Chaos bosses
E101
Zero
Egg Viper and Egg Walker
fun bosses in SA2
King Boom Boo
Biolizard
>>337577818
>Chaos bosses
Yeah I loved having to wait for Chaos 4 to come up from underwater while he does nothing in particular. I'm glad they made me do it three times.
>>337569192
don't let it hit you move
don't let it get you groove
>>337578202
Chaos 4 is the only tedious one
Chaos 0 2 6 and 7 are fun
Why were baby globoxes overtaken by the warp in raving rabbids ?
>>337572503
the dragon is just always behind you and nobody noticed since you can't normally move the camera
>>337578359
Chaos 0 is barely a fight.
>>337541132
This except for final boss
3d sonic in the sonic adventure style will never work thanks to how big the levels need to be.
It spawned a lot of autism. That is all.
