What the fuck happened to all the turn based jrpgs? Everythings a dungeon crawler or arpg or some moving around shit like neptunia.
Are there any recent jrpgs that have been turned based besides the bravely games and DQ?
Neptunia is turn-based
Atelier has always and more than likely will always be turn based
whats your favourite turn based jrpg /v/
>>334677520
Is ATB allowed?
Dungeon Travelers, SMT games, someone already mentioned Atelier, Etrian Odyssey, Moero Chronicles, off the top of my head.
>>334677112
Play some of the Dragon Quest games. DQ7 and DQ8 are coming to 3DS at some point, and DQ11 is coming out as well. Although no clue on what DQ11 will be like.
There were a lot of Pokemon clones lately which were turn-based. Digimon and Moco Moco Friends, to be specific.
>>334677520
Grandia if that counts. Tactics Ogre if that counts. If not, then I'm not really sure.
>>334678927
literally all of those are dungeon crawlers. Not what the OP was asking for. Traditional turn based JRPGs with random encounters and a multi-area story progression.
as for OP, nope, not really. Most "recently" I can think of lost odyssey and the last remnant.
>>334679253
>literally all of those are dungeon crawlers. Not what the OP was asking for. Traditional turn based JRPGs with random encounters and a multi-area story progression.
They're literally the same shit with a different camera angle.
>>334677112
The more money you are putting into something, the more scared publishers get and the more they want to go broad. In order to go broad, publishers want to court people that don't like JRPGs.
That's why JRPGs started to thrive on handhelds and console JRPGs went bad.
>>334677435
It has a battle arena where you can move around, but it's pretty much underdeveloped and there isn't more strategy than "put Blanc in the boss face"! or " begin the battle far from the boss so you get a turn to safely boost your shit"
>>334679318
nah they're really different. You're trying to say FFVI and etrian odyssey "are the same shit with a different camera angle".
>>334679746
Of course you cherry pick the one that's an actual dungeon crawler. Dungeon Travelers 2 (despite the name), SMT, and Atelier are not dungeon crawlers.
>>334677112
There was a budget jrpg released on the e-shop lately, which is so by the book 90s jrpg it's almost refreshing.
The overworld looks like shit but the battle sprites are pretty neat, music is ok.
So far I like it.
>>334679951
Atelier has you wandering around a small, enclosed area which you visit from a menu. It pretty much is a dungeon crawler in everything but the first-person camera, and is certainly not the "wander all over the world wherever you want" style that most Final Fantasy games do. I enjoy the heck out of Atelier, but I recognize it is different.
>>334677112
What's the appeal of turn based jrpgs?
>>334679670
Yeah, but I'm saying it is still turn-based.
>>334680209
You can get immersed in a story without having to worry about getting too involved in game mechanics.
Persona and Bravely Default are modern turn-based RPGs. They both fine-tuned the turn-based system in their own way. Neither feels clunky, dated or slow.
Persona 5 will be almost definitely be turn-based as well.
>>334680342
But OP complained about it for that reason
>>334680456
How do they fine tune their tbs?
>>334677112
dungeon crawlers are the only turn based japanese role playing games worth playing
turn based only works if there's some sort of strategy/resource saving element, which you get in dungeon crawlers and not at all in babby games like ff6 where you spam potions/cure spells after every single fight
>>334679253
u wot m8
DT, SMT, EO, all have
>traditional turn based combat (obviously with their own spins on them)
>random encounters
>a multi-area story progression
how are they not what OP is asking for?
>>334680684
Explain how there's strategy in a dungeon crawler
>>334680734
OP wants a world map, which ironically DT, SMT, and EOIV all have.
Are there any turn-based jrpg's without the "j" in jrpg's?
>>334680834
un_____le
fill in the blanks
>>334680834
Turned based rpgs are totally a thing, senpai.
>>334680434
Sounds like a shit reason.
>>334679619
If action gameplay worked to sell jrpgs, then the tales series wouldn't be a failing laughing stock.
It's a trend in the industry that is pushed by suits who honestly don't know anything about their own goddamned industry.
Bravely Default you cuck
>>334680794
ohhh man..... theres more strategy in eo4 than most final fantasies, secret of mana games.
you must build your teams to have synergy and there are many different builds you can create, depending on your playstyle
>>334680794
There's no strategy in the battles themselves. Turn based mechanics are too simple to facilitate anything that requires any thought. But when you have limited space for items, spells cost more than a mere 1 or 2% of your MP, and enemies can easily remove more than half a character's health in a single turn, you have to start managing your resources, which means deciding whether or not to return to town or risk trekking further to find more loot to make the trip more worth it. Of course there isn't any risk in DT2 since you can save anywhere and get healed automatically for free when you leave a dungeon, but in EO you have to pay for your inn stays, and the cost scales with your level.
>>334680434
Why not just watch an anime then?
>>334677112
Rance series is turnbased.
>>334681013
Someone will fall for it
>>334681020
>watching anime
>200X
>>334680959
Wait, action game play doesn't sell? What sells then?
>>334680834
Fallout 1/2
Any old D&D game (Baldur's Gate, Icewind Dale, Planescape: Torment, etc)
Ultima series (at least the DOS ones, I haven't touched the recent ones)
Wizardry series
>>334681013
Why does cost scale with level anyways? How does this make any sense realisticly? Fuckers just want to charge you more because you're stronger?
>>334677520
I like the 7th dragon series.
pretty hype for the one actually in english
>>334681020
Because you can't take things at your own pace in an anime. You can't explore little nooks and crannies of the setting to get to know it better. You can't make choices here and there that make the adventure feel a little more personal. You can't mash buttons to let out your anger against a villain you hate. It all works to help you get more immersed than simply watching something play out statically.
>>334681130
All I'm saying is that if you just want a poorly-written gook story about high schoolers who are also German military wizards you could spare yourself the trouble of pressing the same 4-button combo for 60 hours
>>334681218
If the cost stayed constant, you could just wipe out some low level enemies on the first floor of the dungeon to cover the inn stays, and it would be trivial after you gain a few levels.
>>334680209
Nostalgia. It's trash.
>>334681218
To reduce money inflation? It's kinda pretty fucking obvious?
>>334681328
it does become trivial once you have advanced enough in the game though.
but at the beginning having the cost increase with each level can fuck you up.
>>334681142
Turn based RPGS do not become more marketable because you added badly done action to them.
As a matter of fact, redoing any series that became popular for a certain kind of gameplay with an entirely new type of gameplay is a recipe for disaster. Would be like making cod into an rts.
Hell, can you name the top 3 action rpgs and the top 3 turn based rpgs released in the last 5 years and compare their sales.
You'll be surprised.
ITT: Chess would've been a real time action game if they had the technology back when they invented Chess. This is why no one takes dumb button mashers seriously.
>>334680794
most of these games have completely or heavily customiziable characters, so you have to make a build that doesn't suck and make the game impossible without crazy grinding
you have to manage limited spell/item resources so you actually make decent progress between areas without spreading yourself too thin and getting ganked
you have to learn enemy weaknesses and what sort of stuff they can do to you, then work around these things
they tend to have actual level design instead of just a series of hallways broken up by box pushing/put the key in the keyhole puzzles
in general it's a form of educated gambling where you gamble your time, you do risky things to progress without running back to town every five seconds but risk dying and losing lots of progress
what the fuck is going on in regular jrpgs? you use your strongest move over and over, then you heal if your hp gets low then you do it again, for fuck sake half of the modern ones fully heal you after every fight
in dungeon crawlers constant enemy groups wear you down and are still threatening because you have to decide if you'd rather take more HP damage/use up healing to slowly wear them down, or use the big guns and waste that resource instead
in most jrpgs once you beat an enemy group for the first time it might as well be deleted from the game because you'll never lose to it
>>334681437
Chess would have been an RTS if they had the technology when it was made.
>>334681259
So you would be satisfied if a story could provide all of that?
>>334681591
No? I'm just giving examples of things JRPGs can provide that anime can't.
>>334681441
ahh those days of EO...
should I use my fire links agaisnt this small mob of enemies or just do regular attacks and recevie a small amount of damage... better save up the MP in case a strong enemy appears.
>>334680803
>OP wants a world map.
Get your reading comprehension check out. How does it feel to be literal this abysmally wrong? Holy Shit!
>>334681548
most RTS games are just Action games desu. There's no Strategy involved if the most important victory defining aspect of the gameplay is how many clicks you can do within a minute. It's just frentic button mashing at that point.
>>334677520
FFX has the best turn-based sytem for a JRPG.
But my favorite would probably be Brave Story
>>334681142
Not him, but the highest selling JRPG series are DQ and Pokemon if I remember. Both turn-based series.
A series like Tales puts up awful numbers in comparison.
And FFs popularity peak was probably at 10, which was their last turn based game.
>>334681690
English isn't your first language, is it?
>>334681723
And that's how I know you just suck at RTS. Macro is even more important than micro. Ask literally any SC2 pro and they'll say the same thing. You can have just average APM but still move up any RTS ladder if you have good macro and on-the-fly strategic planning.
I believe they've all moved on to the 3DS.
Consoles are more towards satisfying the current teenage market.
>>334677112
People realized turn based was trash
>>334681892
Fewer and fewer teenagers are playing the current consoles. It's almost entirely adults now.
>>334682072
How are theu trash?
>>334681889
>Ask literally any SC2 pro
And that's the point when your whole opinion became garbage. SC2 is literally the most action-y non-RTS out there.
>>334682081
Mobiles are sadly the future of gaming.
>>334682118
You just pick your strongest attacks/spells every turn over and over. At least in SRPGs you have to focus on positioning and in ARPGs you have to watch the enemy's movements and discern when to block or dodge.
>>334682072
It isn't inherently trash. They struggle if they can't find a good balance between being easy enough to not force an arbitrary grind, and being hard enough to warrant using mechanics in the game outside of mashing the main attack button until you're done.
>>334682151
A decent number of adolescents play on PC as well, but usually just for things like Minecraft and League of Legends. But yeah consoles are almost entirely adults now. I noticed when I was playing Advanced Warfare on Xbone that virtually every other player was acting like an old fart. These guys would have been absolutely annihilated if they tried playing CoD4 back in its heyday against the unstoppable teenage cyborgs that seemed to fill every game.
>>334677520
Mana Khemia: Alchemists of Al-Revis. I feel like there's only a handful that's played that game around here. I really liked how you can switch party members in and out of combat, and those reserve members recover MP every turn. So you could actually get away with spamming your best attacks, then switching them out.
>>334682219
>At least in SRPGs you have to focus on positioning
In which ones? The only ones I played where this mattered at all was X-COM and Jagged Alliance. Weeb tactical RPGs that I played are literally jRPGs with moving around on the field maps without adding a reason to do so.
>and in ARPGs you have to watch the enemy's movements and discern when to block or dodge.
Which RPGs? In Gothic you can easily lose if you don't watch yourself. Grinding for levels will make old encounters easier, but it won't guarantee victory if you don't pay attention to the enemy's attack patterns. But in weeb action RPGs like Nights of Azure (to use a most recent example) or any Tales of game you can just button mash your way to victory. And if you cant then you can grind a few levels to do so.
All weeb RPG games are shit.
>>334677520
SMT IV, really hyped for Apocalypse
>>334682292
How do you make them better though?
>>334682482
You make them like Etrian Odyssey or Wizardry where the main strategic layer is the party building.
>>334682440
Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance and Radiant Dawn will murder you if you just place your characters wherever you want willy-nilly. And you definitely cannot mash your way through most Tales games on hard difficulty.
>>334682638
Then how do you make party building interesting?
>>334682219
>You just pick your strongest attacks/spells every turn over and over
I'm pretty sure that describes pretty much any other game, RPG or not.
Besides, there are plenty of turn based RPGs that are balanced, limit your abilities in various situations, and present numerous challenges.
>>334677520
Final Fantasy V though it's time-based. If you want straight-up turns I'd say Bravely Default. I'm kind of a turn-based jrpg casual but it's a very specific genre.
>>334682638
Or you make them like Seisou no Amazones where you're forced to chain skills to do decent damage, characters have cooldown meters that affect ALL of their skills so you can't spam the same chains over and over, and you can only attack with three characters per round, or you could attack with fewer and save the turns for later rounds and potentially build ultra-long chains.
>>334682715
you could just make your 5 characters and have them have specific roles like, warrior, mage, healer etc. like in most rpgs
OR
you can make your 5 characters have abilities that combine with other characters abilities and exploit your skill combos and do crazy shit
It's not enough that they killed the genre off and moved every game series that was turn based into mash x to win, now they're "remaking" the old games into mash x to win so you can't even have that anymore. It started with Lufia and now it's at Final Fantasy.
I hate this generation. Everything about it from the top down sucks. Everyone from this generation has shit taste and because they're the market, everything has turned shitty. Fucking EVERYTHING. Tv shows, music, movies, video games, reality in general.
>>334680020
Name?
>>334682715
There are several ways to do it, but my favorite is Etrian Odyssey's take on party building which is about making a party that will always lack one important strategic element because of the 5 character parties. In D&D and its derivatives you are usually able to (and have to) make well rounded parties that cover each party role, not so in Etrian Odyssey.
>>334677112
Just replay Golden Suns for GBA, that'll do for your TBS JRPG hunger.
Turn based RPGs are like an old pastime, it's hard for the younger players to understand their appeal. World has gotten a lot faster paced too, from communications to transport, and RPGs take patience.
Guys in my generation (myself included) tend to really like the 3DS because of the persistence of JRPGs on that system. I really appreciate the continued passion of these developers.
>>334682482
First, balancing. You shouldn't be forced to grind to beat a boss unless you are severely underleveled or ignoring mechanics for some reason. Likewise, the normal encounters should not be so easy you can just spam the same couple of moves to quickly win almost any encounter, again barring being severely overleveled.
Second, your party should be customizable, whether through their gear, abilities, or swapping out characters entirely. Their power should be the result of you making specific decisions on what you want your team to be capable of. The difficulty here is that you need to make everything viable/unviable in its own way, otherwise all of this customization goes out the window when you run 3 dark mages casting Doomblast again and again or something with 90% of their stats in Int and 10% into Speed.
You also need a good system in the first place, which is where you make your core features and see what works. Maybe you have cooldowns so you can't spam the same abilities. Maybe you have a tile system where party members/enemies can position themselves to enhance/detract from the effectiveness of certain moves. Maybe you can't enter a fight with all of your abilities, so you need to customize your party for what you think/know is coming, or even what you don't know. Perhaps the first time you enter a dungeon your party is well-rounded, then you make changes to min-max for what you find there and know what works well.
A good world is also extremely important for the sake of building the game, but the environment could also impact mechanics in the fights and adds a lot as long as it isn't blatantly obvious like the characters having a long handholding talk about how they should flood a fire cavern to make firefiends weaker.
There is a lot of potential for these games, it just takes good design.
anyone here looking forward to Cosmic Star Heroine?
Action RPGs are too fast paced for my enjoyment, I can beat them but it's just not as fun as a slower turn based.
Other than wizardry and the EO series what are some games with great party customization?
>>334677520
FFV.
Nocturne and DDS1 are both very close to being it instead but they have some extremely unfun dungeons.
There have definitely been a lot of dungeon crawlers recently. They just seem like low-budget games that are shoveled out to make a quick buck. The recent more polished EO games have been good though.
Action RPGs are and always will be attempts to cater to people who otherwise wouldn't play JRPGs. Forget the people who want to sit back and relax with a simple, slow-paced game -- change the gameplay so little kids with ADHD can have fun too.
>>334685271
Oh look it's the ADHD meme again
>>334677112
is dat sum celes
>>334681437
Are you trying to say single player turn-based JRPGs have the depth and complexity of chess? Are you a retard? I could understand if we were discussing multiplayer turn-based strategy games
>>334679253
>LIterally all of those are dungeon crawlers
They all have traditional JRPG gameplay. In fact it's a lot better than most JRPGs.
DRPG > JRPG
But whatever, SMT games are structured like JRPGs if you want to sit there and watch a crappy anime instead of playing a game.
>>334682151
A lot of genres are flat out impossible on mobile die to abysmally shitty touch controls
Consoles/handhelds are just either gonna become a lot more niche or try to pander even harder to casuals. Probably a bit of both.
>>334682662
Problem with Fire Emblem is it's got a backwards difficulty curve, in most games the first 10-15 missions are the hardest but it becomes a cakewalk once you get your team sorted out.
>>334681892
funnily enough all the kiddies play mobileshit and all the low IQ JRPGs have been moving over there.
>>334677520
Shin Megami Tensei: Strange Journey or Nocturne
>>334680534
The brave/default system breathed some life into what otherwise has become a fairly stale battle system, I thought. And then I'm a sucker for customizing party members' classes, so I might be a bit biased. I'm not sure how Persona fine-tuned the battle system, when it is just watered-down press turn from mainline SMT.
>>334680209
Focusing on picking the right skill and turn order over speed. Same appeal of tactics games over RTS games.
what's the appeal of ARPGs?
>>334677112
Haven't you heard? Turn-based is archaic now. It's literally not allowed.Bravely series and Etrian Oddyssey are the last bastion.
>>334685271
>Forget the people who want to sit back and relax with a simple, slow-paced game -- change the gameplay so little kids with ADHD can have fun too.
JRPGs and Japanese strategy games have the huge problem of repeating ridiculously long animations over and over to look flashy and extend playtime. If more turn-based games were quick like classic Wizardry then I bet a lot more people would play more turn-based RPGs.
You don't need ridiculously long animations for a simple attack.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p82ZY3wubL4
>>334686671
Not that guy, but plenty of Tactical games actually have more going on than chess. And they are turn based as well.
Its up to you however if you think 'more options' is 'depth and complexity'. But I'd wager to say that chess isn't as deep and you think it is.
Tactical games have their own problems of course. With so many places to position troops, you can mess up a lot easier than in chess. And some games like Fire Emblem have shit mechanics where random enemy reinforcements appear. It would be like playing chess and on turn 15, your opponent magically places down four queens for free. But some games that do this are so easy, it doesn't matter (Valkyria Chronicles). Still a shit mechanic that needs to be done away with and makes the game seem weak.
>>334687205
You're totally, 100% right.
It's cool to see an animation play out once or twice when you get a new skill, or maybe it's satisfying when you're dealing a decisive blow to a boss.
But when you have to watch the same animation every single time you use an ability you could use a hundred times, it gets amazingly tedious.
>>334687205
Dragon Quest actually used a first person view taken from Wizardry for the exact reason of making battles faster. In some DQ games, you could start a battle, choose your attacks and finish the battle in under 5 seconds.
But every game since Dragon Quest VIII has had a third person perspective with visible animations. And while they're not FFIX level slow, they do make battles slower than the earlier DQ games.
>>334677112
>>334687205
Something I really liked about BD was that you could just fast-forward through all the animations.
>>334687074
It's an action game that comes with a treadmill. Perfect for the ignorant consumers of today that think things like turnbased combat and actual challenge are outdated because some game reviewer told them so, and that really just use games as a timesink, valuing things like achievements, game length, and completionism over challenge, pleasant atmosphere, story, or anything that would actually make a game interesting and fun to play, action or not.
![1028261[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/T9cUEfI.jpg "1028261[1].jpg")
Trails of Cold Steel. Cold Steel 2 is coming out as well, plus Trails in the Sky the 3rd is coming out to, so you can play through the TitS games (even though they aren't really recent)
Play on Nightmare for Cold Steel. Hard for TitS
>>334687074
You use your twitch reflexes on top of gear management and strategy. You can feel the difference in gear and abilities beyond just seeing different numbers and status effects (most popular turn-based JRPGs don't even have many viable status effects).
>>334687461
>actual challenge
I remember popular turn-based JRPGs being easy as shit. Games like Chrono Trigger, any Final Fantasy, Earthbound, Super Mario RPG, Xenogears, etc. are braindead as fuck. Popular JRPGs to this day like Persona 4 are still following the no challenge trend.
>pleasant atmosphere, story, or anything that would actually make a game interesting and fun to play
How about gameplay? Like control of your character, indepth level design, a complete moveset for both you and your enemies?
>>334686671
>thinks chess is the deepest game ever
>calls someone else a retard
Are you?
Persona 5 and DQXI, the last bastion of jrpgs
>>334687378
Ohh god this game is awful. Each trivial encounter takes so fucking long and the monster density in all the areas leading up to the climax of the first half and every other area during the 2nd half was just too much for me to handle.
>>334687919
>i remember popular
I remember it too. I was talking about action games when I was talking about challenge. Console action games are a joke and basically always have been, and they've gotten easier and easier because people have been somehow convinced that they should almost never actually die in a game. Arcade action games get so hard that they could seriously take a year or multiple years to beat if you aren't already at a really high skill level. A game like that absolutely would not sell well in the console market. An example of some other things the "gamers" of today think are outdated would be 2D and low poly graphics. As far as challenge goes ARPGs at least have Monster Hunter to brag about, but Monster Hunter is a complete joke before G-Rank.
Games in the ARPG genre are often custom made to excuse poor design and a lack of challenge. See the problem with pretty much every bethesda game from oblivion and onwards. Every complaint of it being a shitty action game can be countered with "that's because it's an RPG" and every complaint of it being a shitty RPG can be countered with "that's because it's an action game".
>how about gameplay
Yes, notice I said "or anything". I wasn't trying to make a complete list of things that would make a game interesting. Also there isn't a single ARPG with indepth level design. Designing good levels would take time, which means they would end up with quality rather than quantity, and quantity is what sells.
>>334677112
>or some moving around shit
See now this is why we can't have nice things. You don't like dungeon crawlers? Fine, me neither but I don't make a fuss about it. No argps either? Damn, you're a picky lil fag aren't ya? Whatever, your loss.
But dissing on the sub-genre you supposedly like because characters just move around? How do you manage to function day after day with such autism? Its literally just the characters moving about and adds another layer of strategy. What the hell's wrong with it? Do you hate Grandia,TiTs and Skies of Arcadia?
>>334688382
>thinks chess is the deepest game ever
Where did I say that?
> I was talking about action games when I was talking about challenge. Console action games are a joke and basically always have been
God Hand, Devil May Cry, Ninja Gaiden?
>Also there isn't a single ARPG with indepth level design
Souls
>>334689595
Not him, but the movement in TiTs really does bother me. It doesn't seem to add much if anything to the game.
>>334689994
second half was meant to reply to
>>334688820
>>334690030
>If you don't have enough mov to move around you can't get close enough to hit enemies or move far enough from an AOE of certain bosses.
There's your addition. If you can't handle even that there's always easy difficulty.
>>334689994
God Hand is a braindead game unless you self-impose limitations that make the game tedious rather than just boring because playing the game correctly means trivializing every encounter except for the last fight with the three stooges and the last fight with Devil Hand. Devil May Cry is admittedly a decent challenge on DMD, Ninja Gaiden isn't bad either, but neither of them are even half as challenging in comparison to other games as people think they are.
>souls
Alright, you got me there. DeS had good level design. Haven't played more than a few minutes of the later games because I'm not fond of the combat.
>>334677520
Pokemon. Come at me, faggots
>>334690454
>neither of them are even half as challenging in comparison to other games
Like? You're not going to tell me some bullshit like Chrono Trigger is challenging.
>>334690584
Every arcade beat em up worth naming from the 90's more or less.
>>334690685
Most of those are simply spacing and extremely easy once you learn spawns. You have probably not even played any beat em up from the 90's enough to understand how they work beyond "it's hard". There isn't any need for timing, pattern recognition, or moveset utility on the same level of the best 3D beat em ups.
Don't tell me Final Fight or Golden Axe are more challenging than God Hand, even if we go for no death runs.
>>334691023
I'm talking about games like Alien vs Predator, Armored Warriors, and Battle Circuit. In the first place I only mentioned beat em ups because of similar mechanics. If you want a really hard game play pretty much any arcade shmup worth naming. Even the most well known, almost every single one that Cave made, are far harder than any game developed with consoles in mind. Also I'm willing to argue that Final Fight is harder or at least on the same level as God Hand, since I can beat God Hand on KMS Hard with the side kick that you start with, the basic punch combo that you start with, and the forward and backwards dodges, and it's so effortless that it's hard to even pay attention. In fact on a good day I would almost never even need the backwards dodges.
>>334688646
not a problem for me since I like the battle system
>>334691794
The system itself is OK, it's just everything else around it that sucks. From the spell / skill balance to the enemies, it's just a massive trainwreck. You spend so much time setting up contracts only to have them snatched away since enemies can take contracts and cast spells on the same turn. And every difficult encounter just boils down to using Water Shield. Without it you get rekt, with it you trivialize everything.
>>334691567
>and it's so effortless that it's hard to even pay attention
And yet you can play turn-based JRPGs? Most that only require the attack button for a good chunk of their random encounter battles? I'd love see you effortlessly beat God Hand. I find it hard to imagine someone who effortlessly beats games would want to downgrade to JRPGs and would rather graduate to something like fighting games.
