Would FF8 have been a better game were Laguna the main character?
A game about Adele instead of Ultimecia would have been more interesting at least.
FFVIII would have been better if 50% of the game focused on Laguna's story in the past and 50% of the game focused on Squall's story in the future. And choices you made in the past as Laguna influenced how Squall's story played out. This would remove the entire need for the orphanage and Witch plot. As well as Rinoa and her forced love story.
But since it was made by the Final Fantasy team, it was doomed from the start.
FFVIII would have been much better if they used Laguna like they originally intended, yes. The original idea was that Squall and Laguna would both be the main characters. There would be several more flashbacks and they'd tie into whatever Squall was doing at the time. Laguna needed more screen time because he was such a good contrast to Squall while not being a totally different person. Squall was reserved with Rinoa while Laguna was shy with Julia. They both had leadership thrust upon them out of nowhere. It's actually kind of interesting. Also,Squall is totally Laguna's son.
>>332694943
Also if the game wasn't more broken than FF2.
>>332696051
>This would remove the entire need for the orphanage and Witch plot. As well as Rinoa and her forced love story.
That sounds perfect. But like you said it's Final Fantasy, therefore any potentially good storytelling must be sacrificed for angst, melodrama and TWEESTs.
stop posting this bait. squall isnt a bad protagonist. maybe you should actually play the game instead of shilling so hard and repeating the same garbage the majority of posters on here say
>>332696784
I agree 100% with Squall not being a bad protagonist. Still wish there was more Laguna, though.
>>332696784
>squall isnt a bad protagonist.
He is the best protagonist a FF game has had. But that still doesn't mean he was in a good story.
>>332694943
absolutely, it could have been the best FF in the whole damn series for the next 20 years after its release, then we see more spin offs or side lore of it.
>>332696784
>kid's sister left him then he cries about it 24/7 for the next 10 or so years
>his sister leaving him made him unable to make new friends
Yeah nah, he's shit and so is your taste if you honestly think that's good writing..
>>332697232
Except for literally any other protagonist from literally any other JRPG ever except Lightning.
>>332697468
yeah youre right Lightning is #1
>>332697389
>missing the point this badly
step up senpai
>>332697593
>this story has good writing if you ignore all the shit parts
Doesn't work that way m8.
>>332697468
He said in other FF games. Also Squall starts off as an introspective loner just like Cecil, Terra, Cloud and many other FF protagonists. But at least he gets over it in Disk 2, pulls up his britches and fights for what he wants. Unlike someone like Terra or Cloud who are literally trying to run away from their role right up to the end of the game.
Not really, he's still a fucking retard and possibly gay with his two buttbuddies.
>"Laguna...I'm bleeding out...please help..."
>"Oh you big silly, get up we gotta go!"
>"Laguna...I'm dying..."
>"Oh that's it, I'm gonna tickle you! Koochie coo!"
>"What...the fuck is...wrong...with you?"
>>332697797
>Unlike someone like Terra or Cloud who are literally trying to run away from their role right up to the end of the game.
Never played FF6 but aside from being afraid of screwing up and giving the black materia to Sephiroth again (which I don't understand why it isn't considered a valid concern) Cloud is otherwise just as determined to kick Sephiroth's ass as everyone else is.
>>332698040
I wonder how much of that was just the shit translation.
not sure why this game is so maligned. instead of having a generic anime protagonist the entire cast actually compliments and foils eachother in a way that it allows for a more introspective and meaningful story to be told. i wish people would try to understand this game instead of arbitrarily whining about why it doesnt make sense. its not that hard to understand, and if you pay attention you can actually see exactly what the developers were trying to do story wise.
>>332698213
Probably all of it. Both because its nearly impossible to provide an English equivalent for Japanese 'Shounen' humor. But also because the translation team didn't even try.
Squall Japanese: "You are an arrogant prick."
Squall English: "Whatever..."
>>332698613
But the game DID have a generic anime cast though, what are you talking about? We have Squall, who's basically a slightly less edgy version of Sasuke, Quistis the typical onee-san, Zell the typical hyperactive comic relief sidekick, Selphie and Rinoa the typical overly-cutesy genki girls etc.
>>332699087
Squall is Shikimaru. At least in the original Japanese script. In the west he comes off as Sasuke because he says 'whatever' to everything. A good lesson in how a bad translation can completely ruin characters. And the FFVII remake with voice acting is going to be an even better lesson in this.
>>332699087
>Rinoa
I don't really like her but I'll give her that she was a bit more unique than your standard demure girl like Rosa/Lenna/Terra/Tifa/Yuna
DUDE
>>332699442
SEED
>>332699534
LMAO
>>332696520
>Squall is totally Laguna's son.
>Julia is Rinoa's mother
>Squall and Rinoa could be brother and sister if Laguna hit that before he left
>>332699250
I don't see how they could fuck up Cloud's character any more than they already did in Advent Children.
>>332699775
They fucking will, I am certain they're remaking FF7 for western audiences.
>>332699857
That would still be better than the emo DBZ wankfest that was AC. Even the "complete" edition was still rife with plot holes, loose ends and character desecration.
>>332699775
>I don't see how they could fuck up Cloud's character any more than they already did in Advent Children.
-Fans of the original game have already given him a voice in their heads. The voice we get in the game won't be anywhere close to the voice people imagined as a preteen kid. This has already been seen by the backlash over Cloud's voice in Kingdom Hearts and Advent Children.
-The translation and the entire script itself is going to be drastically changed. Once again, things like 'Let's mosey' will be completely removed and replaced. Removing more of what people liked about Cloud.
-Aeris has been canonically changed to Aeirth. And now Cloud is going to be saying 'Aeirth' out loud dozens of times. Not to mention how drawn out Aeris death scene is gonna be now. Instead of a simple dip in the pool, Cloud is probably going to have a 5 hour cry over it.
And that's just what we can predict. No telling what other crazy things Nomura is gonna do on top of this.
>>332699087
its easy to generalize them in that way but theres a little more to it than that. squall is more like somebody like jon snow. he just knows he has a duty and responsibillity to follow, but has trouble relating to others early on. as the story progresses you realize squall isnt "edgy" at all, he wants to be like everybody else but he's putting on a tough guy front. this kind of portrayal should be something alot of people on here are able to relate to. all of the characters are subtly like this, and each character has some kind of overarching theme or trait that influences squall and makes him change his views as the game goes on.
>>332700341
>-The translation and the entire script itself is going to be drastically changed. Once again, things like 'Let's mosey' will be completely removed and replaced. Removing more of what people liked about Cloud.
Shit like this has been present in Square games as far back as 1999.
>-Aeris has been canonically changed to Aeirth. And now Cloud is going to be saying 'Aeirth' out loud dozens of times. Not to mention how drawn out Aeris death scene is gonna be now. Instead of a simple dip in the pool, Cloud is probably going to have a 5 hour cry over it.
Well people loved the drawn-out death scene of Zack, right? I didn't, but I'm saying if anyone's to blame it's the underage weeaboos who thought Crisis Core was anything but complete and utter shit.
>>332700341
Yeesh, I'd think people would be happy that FF7 is getting a non-shit translation but apparently I couldn't be more wrong.
>>332700345
He was definitely an edgy prick in the English version of the game. He lashed out at characters who only wanted to be his friend or he outright ignored them for no real reason. But apparently the Japanese version has him as a much more relatable character. I've never played it nor can I read moonrunes so I wouldn't know myself.
>>332700682
>Yeesh, I'd think people would be happy that FF7 is getting a non-shit translation
Who says the new translation will be good? SquareEnix has actually gotten even worse over the last 15 years.
FFVII will be full of tons of dialects and superfluous edits.
>>332700840
Good point, but at least it'll be more consistent and actually make sense (lol Cait Sith).
It just amazes me that people are getting pissed that "let's mosey" supposedly won't be in when it wasn't even the original line in the first place. I guess it's a nostalgia thing.
>>332700840
Even their subs are awful. I can't speak a lick of Japanese but even I know what the characters were saying in Advent Children more often than not did not match up with the subtitles. A classic case of lazy ass translators who make up shit as they go along.
Just remove Rinoa and it's already a much better game.
>>332701186
>It just amazes me that people are getting pissed that "let's mosey" supposedly won't be in when it wasn't even the original line in the first place. I guess it's a nostalgia thing.
That was my point. This new FFVII Remake is trying to make money off nostlagia. But will ironically piss off the very people who want it the most. Because everything they liked about the original game will be changed.
>>332700840
100% chance the people of the slum speak like this.
>>332700341
Let's mosey is such an unremarkable line that I don't know why Cloud fans cling to it so dearly. I guess because there's nothing interesting about the "real" Cloud. I guess there was that optional dialogue with Yuffie about motion sickness.
>>332701437
I can only imagine the kind of person whose deciding factor for not getting a game is because they didn't keep the shitty original translation.
>>332701728
It's an attempt to counter people who think Cloud is "emo." Apparently that line proves otherwise. Don't ask me how.
>>332701728
It was just a funny line. Cloud himself does have a genuine comic relief side to him and it's funny to watch such a serious tryhard in all these funny and wacky scenes which he tries to shrug off nonchalantly. I'm not one of those retards who will scream bloody murder if(when) they change it, but Square can and has done worse in the past ESPECIALLY regarding Cloud's character, who they ruined by turning into a one-note mopey faggot without a shred of the comic relief he had in the game purely to pandering to the fans in all his other appearances. They outright admitted it too http://flaregamer.com/b2article.php?p=122&more=1
>>332701728
>>332702232
When most people play a game, they just go by the feeling it gives them. The original FFVII had enough silly lines that it made people 'feel' that Cloud wasn't a serious loser. But when the remake comes out and has hours and hours of fully voiced cutscenes, this illusion will be shattered. And that 'feeling' will be gone. Some people will deny it and claim Cloud is just as good (or better) than he ever was. But most people will dislike it, and not know why.
>>332702609
Well I'll be giving the remake an honest chance, but I won't be the least bit surprised if it once again panders to the Advent Children crowd.
>>332702704
Get ready for disappointment, regardless of whether it panders to them or not.
>>332702609
Because as can be seen over the past decade Square couldn't give less of a fuck about their own integrity, they just want to appeal to the lowest denominator weeaboos who will eat up anything they fart out as long as it has spiky hair and a buster sword. The fact that Advent Children was such a smash hit shows that characters being stripped of their depth and turned into one-note idiots is exactly the message Square has been receiving.
>>332703085
Why? If it's actually faithful to the original game (with an actual faithful translation that isn't utter shit too) then I have nothing to worry about.
>>332703219
>If it's actually faithful to the original game
You mean the actual original or the english original you played?
>>332703350
The actual original, in which Cloud still had a comic relief side to him that was missing in his Kingdom Hearts and Advent Children appearances.
>>332703125
And so Final Fantasy follows the Star Wars formula yet again. The circle is now complete. Final Fantasy is the Japanese Star Wars in all ways.
>>332703551
Well Final Fantasy draws a lot from Star Wars to begin with so it makes perfect sense.
Having watched AC, I fail to see what issue people take with the characterization. I mean, the movie sucked, but I didn't see this apparent butchering of character that everyone else seems to think was this huge and awful thing.
>>332703645
Yes. That was the point I was making...
>>332703817
Cloud himself was almost nothing like he was in the game. Yeah sure, in the game he got "emo" for a few moments but then he almost immediately picked himself up and focused his mind on killing Sephiroth. Not once did he ever abandon his friends for whatever reason. Also not to mention all comic relief aspects of his personality were gone in the film.
And everyone else barely made an appearance worth talking about.
>>332704523
Wasn't he dying from a disease or something?
>And everyone else barely made an appearance worth talking about.
This is why I get confused when people talk about how all the characters were butchered.
>>332700341
Of these things, Aeris' name change will bother me the most. She's fucking Aeris, not Aerith.
Laguna, albeit older, were much more goofy and an enjoyable character than Squall, his parts were all comedy gold.
>>332704694
He along with most of the population, especially the children. And what's running away going to accomplish? As shown in the game several times Cloud needs his friends for emotional support. Just abandoning them like that when he needed their help the most is stupid and annoying.
>>332704721
I never understood this debate. I mean, I prefer Aeris and refer to her as such, but if they proper translation is Aerith then that's that and I don't see the point in continuing to argue over it.
>>332705070
I thought that he just didn't want to burden them with it, but I guess interpretation is different for different people.
>>332704721
i wouldnt give a shit if it wasnt literally fucking 'Earth'. the special bitch who becomes the gaia ghost and saves the planet is named Air Earth. real fucking subtle
>>332704737
Pretty sure those flashbacks happen over a decade or something
>>332705663
Anon, this is the same game where the main character's name is CLOUD.
>>332705663
>Square
>subtlety
Pick one. Seriously, these are the same writers who thought "my fingers are tingling, my eyes are burning, my mouth is running dry" is something totally acceptable to say when mourning the loss of your loved one.
All the characters in the main party were unlikable except for Quistis who was just there. Who knows how shitty Laguna and his team would have been if they were the focus of the writing instead?
>>332706198
Characters being named after random shit isn't something new to JRPGs. See Dragon Quest, or its inspiration Dragon Ball.
>>332706421
Yeah, so bitching about Air Earth is silly.
>>332706387
Quistis was unlikable too though. The dumb bitch actually abandoned her post and risked jeopardizing her mission just to apologize to Rinoa for hurting her feelings? Give me a break.
>>332706518
I'm not that guy by the way.
>>332706528
Oh man, I forgot about that.
Christ, what a horribly written game.
>>332695962
>Adele
You meantAdel,not the singer.
>>332706632
Well then reply to him nigga, not me.
>>332706528
>Seifer wants to go to Timber
>Instead of stopping him, she just follows and helps him do it
She really was a fuckin' dummy
>>332695962
Well, the world sure had some Skyfall going on...
>>332706808
hence why she got fired from her teaching and commander post. she was incompetent. did you fags miss that?
>>332694943
Yes.
>>332694943
No, but I would fucking kill for a spinoff with Laguna and Friends.
>>332699642
>Squall is totally Laguna's son.
He must be terribly disappointed.
>>332707234
Quistis was overall less in-your-face about how shitty she was. All the really awful dialogue was saved for the others.
>>332707234
She got fired before that, when she tries to suck squall off after cerfew
>>332707685
I still don't get why Squall didn't let her suck him off then dumped her sorry ass the very next morning, like any other teenager would have done.
>grind through the game
>learn overtime enemies level up alongside you.
How hard is it to fight at a level 1 run? Surely there are ways to do a Low Level Challenge for FFVIII?
>>332707414
>Laguna leads a coup against Adel, imprisoning her because he lacks the ability to kill her
>Ultimecia possesses Rinoa and uses her to free Adel
>Adel takes Rinoa to effectively double her Sorceress powers
>Squall just fucking kills her, travels through time to kill Ultimecia, and wins a game of Triple Triad against Laguna to get his own card
I'd be proud as fuck, honestly.
>>332707685
no way. She wanted to have a good ol' dicking in all holes from the squall.
>>332707952
He has a blocked off personality because ellone left the daycare a long time ago :^)
I liked the junction system but fuck drawing magic from enemies
How would you fix it?
>>332707234
Quistis was a teacher in training. And essentially she got demoted back to being a student because Seifer went rogue and Squall needed help on a mission.
But in reality, she got demoted to giveyou another playable character. And Sakaguchi/Kitase suck at creating solid reasons for events.
>>332708109
Just have magic drop like an item would, assign the magic to a characater after the battle.
You wouldn't be able to trade magics.
Then it's just a matter of balancing the game so you don't have 100 curagas as soon as you can get Siren.
>>332708109
Card refining and draw points.
Plus, you can beat everything in the game even without max stats.
>>332708106
It's got nothing to do with personality, it's to do with the chemicals fizzing around in his skull. No 17 year old male I know of would have shied away from getting his dick wet by the hottest blonde girl at the school.
>>332707969
Low-level runs are very doable. There's an achievement on Steam for keeping Squall Level 7 (his starting level) throughout the game. Unfortunately, it involves making sure Squall is KO'd at critical times so he doesn't gain experience. But bosses don't give XP, and once you get Card, you can fight monsters to earn AP without earning XP.
It's not difficult, it just takes some forethought and careful manipulation of the game. Hence the achievement name, "Contrived Victory".
>>332708109
Same way I would fix every bad Final Fantasy system. Replace it with runes from Suikoden. Your characters gain skills based on their level. No AP/item grinding needed. And since Final Fantasy focuses so much on story, it will only help streamline the game.
>>332708251
Kinda my point, the only reason they could justify his personality was because he had something bad happen a while ago.
I hate when writers don't acknowledge a character can change as they get older.
>>332708378
That's what happens when clueless old men try to write teenage characters.
>>332708378
He has abandonment issues and a serious loner complex. He's socially and emotionally stunted. You'd have to be legitimately retarded to think that literally every teenager in the world is exactly the same, because "hormones".
>>332708706
>He has abandonment issues and a serious loner complex. He's socially and emotionally stunted.
And gets over it pretty quickly with Rinoa. I don't see what your problem is.
>>332700840
Am I the only one who likes dialects?
They add a nice flavor to the world.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0JcnyICfaL8
>>332709229
No. Apparently the localization director of SquareEnix is obsessed with them. And Richard Honeywood uses them in everything as well. So that's at least two people.
>best girl is now also voiced by best girl
>>332709569
>Shiva is voiced
>>332709569
Selphie is being voiced by Yardley Smith?
>>332699642
>Squall and Rinoa could be brother and sister if Laguna hit that before he left
Wouldn't it be weird to be boning someone who came out of the vagina of someone your dad boned but did not impregnate?
