>Oculus Rift has an estimated cost of $1500, 600 of which is the device itself
>Vive has similar hardware needs and costs $800 AND it requires a large empty room for full benefit
>Oculus Rift has an estimated lifespan of two years
>Vive is made by a cellphone company on tech that is likely to be made available to any hardware guys that want to get in on the scene
>The tech is brand new meaning many features that will soon be considered basic simply don't exist yet
>The current quality of basic functionality will probably be considered shit-tier after only a few iterations
>Games are mostly proof of concept or other games with VR added, such that it's primarily a display thing
How long will it be until it's worth buying in to VR?
>>329807084
2 years.
>>329807084
Why does it only have a lifespan of 2 years?
What is the point of failure?besides the user of course
>>329807084
It depends. If you're poor, wait until like 2020. Otherwise, the generation after the current one should be a good time to get started as there will already be plenty of games and the most obvious and necessary missed features will get in.
>>329807262
That's because they will have a new one out that will make it seem like trash by then, not that it will dissolve into a puddle of goo in two years.
>>329807262
Not a lifespan in the sense that it fails. In the sense that that's how long they expect it will be before the next Rift generation. It'll still work, just like your PS2 still worked when they released PS3.
>>329807084
It's just like smart phones, wait for them to go through like 2 or 3 version and work the kinks out before you pick one up.
>>329807378
too bad the latter isn't true
All VR sets out now are more of a proof of concept, it really depends on whether or not devs can find clever uses for the hardware.
Luckily there are plenty of people with more money than sense that will buy the first generation VR shit to pump money into developing games and better hardware.
If you're just interested in seeing how you like VR, a Google cardboard, a plastic Chinese knockoff, or Samsung Gear VR, it's what I did. Besides of course playing on an oculus I could borrow from a game developing friend of mine.
>>329807596
>All VR sets out now are more of a proof of concept
But then what were OR's devkits?
>>329807961
I suppose they were just to promote content creation. But many of the software created is more of a proof of concept as well, like Rollercoaster demos and shit.
>>329807084
>How long will it be until it's worth buying in to VR?
between 3 and 5 years, remember how it was around that much time between Rarz to Iphone
>>329807084
I know right, why bother getting a NES? Just wait for the Playstation
>>329807596
The proof of concept was back in 2012. They have launched multiple iterations since. The consumer rift is their fully refined fourth generation device.
>>329808310
>implying the razr wasn't an excellent piece of hardware
>implying the iPhone was or is a high-quality cost-effective use of technology
>>329807596
The DK1 and Valve's QR code room were proofs of concept.
>no games
There must be something worth playing on VR though, right?
>>329807084
you can build a capable pc for $600 and rift for $600 the cost isn't much different from console psplus sub, tv and $60 games
>>329807084
>>The tech is brand new meaning many features that will soon be considered basic simply don't exist yet
>>The current quality of basic functionality will probably be considered shit-tier after only a few iterations
I'm pretty certain that eye-tracking will be the next thing in VR. Technical improvements like automatic IPD measurement and focus-based LOD are already good reasons but the possibilities for games and applications are pretty wide.
>Games and NPCs know where you're actually looking instead of having to guess from your head direction.
>Gaze controlled UIs and aiming.
>Can branch into full face tracking for avatar expressions.
>>329807186
At the minimum.
I'll check on this in 2 years.
Or when a 4k headset is available where I can browse virtual windows in high clarity
>>329809460
Plus, good eye tracking lets you do foveated rendering.
>>329809796
That's what I meant by "focus-based LOD". Just didn't think people would know the meaning.
It would solve the problem of increased system demands as the headsets get better resolution and FOV. You'd only have to put the full rendering where the player is looking.
>>329808852
So far any game that's worth playing and has VR support is worth playing with VR, but it's not really worth making a great game yet that relies on VR to play, and there hasn't been enough time for this to happen anyway. If you want one that benefits a lot from it, I'd recommend Subnautica. There are some projects that seem like they could get there, but that's the only one I know of that's actually enjoyable in its own right. And it's one of those exploration/building games where it's more or less done after a couple days unless you have utterly extreme autism.
No Man's Sky will fit that category too if they meet their goals, which is kind of a shame because if it had an overarching story, even just a sort of okay one, adding direction to the game it would have potential to be great.
>>329809460
Wouldn't the eye-tracking hardware bump unit price up even further though?
>>329810793
You are getting jewed to shit mang
Its fucking mobile screens and a tracker.
>>329811014
Yeah, the software side of things just develop itselfs, just like the product. You just throw the screens together and a VR headset comes out properly assembled and developed by the force of magical research and development coming out of thin air.
>>329810793
Probably. The SMI addon kit for the DK2 was sound to be pretty expensive, though the Fove was more affordable. It's something that's in development, so finding the best 'bang for buck' method will take time.
>>329807084
Id predicting that within 4 years VR headsets will be as popular as tablets
>>329811347
>thin air.
There was a kickstarter and like 400k products bought and paid for anon.
Theres also this thing called investing.
But I'm sure nothing could move such an avid consumerdrone like you.
>>329811372
Didn't the SMI thing track at a really high frame rate, and that's what let them do foveated rendering in the first place?
>>329811641
>400k products bought and paid for
At a fraction of their eventual cost
>Theres also this thing called investing.
Which requires returns
>>329811763
>At a fraction of their eventual cost
Ahaha now you just make yourself look stupid.
Wait you were already doing that, you dronefuck.
>>329811641I think he was being sarcastic, Anon.
>>329811712
Yeah but Fove are doing the same with less money, it seems.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNtu5sbrzEA
>>329807262
Planned Obsolescence, look it up.
>Buying gen 1
Hell no
Not to mention the hardware requirements are a bit beefy now. In 2 years Nvidia and AMD will have new cards with the brand new chipsets they've been working on, so it's better to just wait.
>>329811641
No yeah, you're sure, that paid for everything from now on. Also all the workforce involved and research that needs to be carried to be constantly improving it, such as implementing eye tracking and foveated rendering will just mature and grow by itself like a plant attached to a tree.
Damn anon, you're so smart, why don't you tell them you've got it all covered already with your very impressive research and development techniques?
>>329812192
I'm sure you own several Apple products.
VR is going to die quickly from the lack of games.
of course its going to get a burst of games when oculus launches but its quickly going to die down.
Then everything will literally just be tech demos that will never become anything more than that.
you know deep down this is true.
Now is fine if you're not poor as fuck
Otherwise have fun waiting for years in the meat space while i help usher in the waifu era.
>>329812261
>poorfag and his sour grapes
>>329812261
why dont you just point him to the better yet cheaper alternative
something like that should exist, right
>>329812301
But Anon, I bought my Vive partly because I'm going to make games for it.
>>329812634
What do you have in mind?
>>329812863
B-17 gunner sim. Including the waistgunners for those who have room to stand.
>>329812301
>VR is going to die quickly from the lack of games.
When will this meme die?
![B-17gunner[1].jpg~original.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/PHEXmxi.jpg "B-17gunner[1].jpg~original.jpg")
>>329812923
So the idea is for the wands to turn into the, I dunno what they're called, handles on the machine gun? Aren't you afraid that could get fatiguing, holding them unsupported like that?
>>329812554
>>329812540
You fags cant honestly think those were anything but the most common applefag comebacks, jesus christ
>>329814534
sounds like you should have the perfect retort already prepared then
LOL
>>329814684
You don't merit a retort here, when someone is making a fool out of themselves you don't actually need someone to point at them and say "stupid".
>>329814791
or maybe you don't actually have one and this is you trying to save face on an anonymous image board
>>329814994
>save face on an anonymous image board
Again, does this really merit a response?
>>329815036
well apparently it does, considering that you're still typing things
sounds like trying to save face to me
>>329814787
I don't get it. Is it a masturbation joke? What's the thing with the grade about?
Does the Vive even have any porn yet?
>>329814787
How the fuck is their artwork getting WORSE
>>329814787
>>329815426
How does this unfunny crap need two people
>>329815426
It looks to me like they're trying to experiment in order to get better, but forgetting about the second part which is to get feedback.
>>329807084
Both should cost about the same with motion controllers
And both need some room to move around for first person shooting/slashing/punching games
>>329807084
Vive doesnt need a whole room to be useable.
You lose the walking around in a virtual room function but you can use a single lighthouse like a webcam to use the vive and its controllers.
what I still dont get is why Valve hasnt announced a AAA title for it yet.
Facebook buys games from all the big players for the oculus while HTC/Valve throw their vive on the market and hopes someone picks it up.
>>329815938
>You lose [features]
Yes, thus you need a room for full benefit.
>>329815938
>you can use a single lighthouse like a webcam
Does that let you turn all the way around? The Vive doesn't have sensors in the back, does it?
>>329814534
You mean just anything you said so far has been anything but the most common poorfag mental gymnastics 101? What about it?
I thought you just needed a few paces to use the room function
>>329815938
>implying valve makes anything now a days beside hats
>>329816291
Depends on the game, obviously. But most seem to be designed to be playable with limited room, yeah.
>>329809656
>accesible gpu capable of dual 4k at 60fps min
in 2020 maybe.
>>329816509
You dont need that much power just for a bunch of virtual 2d screens anon, hell we could probably do 60fps now.
>>329816756
what the fuck are you talking about
>>329815265
>>329814787
I've always thought that the holodecks in Star Trek should've had a little drain in the middle.
It would be just on the edge of shot and none of the characters would ever mention it.
>>329816818
Is it that hard to read the fucking post you replied to?
>>329816818
He's not going to be playing games, he's just going to be using windows. He's not stupid, just retarded.
>>329816965
Whats retarded about it?
VR home cinema, endlessly versatile virtual desktop all becomes a worthwhile thing to do once the resolution is high as fuck.
In fact for actual huge cinema sized screens even 4k is not cutting it.
It still would be a comfier setup than buying and setting up for a projector
>>329816436
i know that Valve got lazy as fuck and rests on their steam shekels but if they continue like this they are in for a rude awakening.
SteamOS and Steam Machines was already a turd and absolute desaster. Wouldnt suprise me if the same happens to Vive.
>>329807084
The time is now.
>>329817202
>endlessly versatile virtual desktop
Maybe it's because I don't work with computers, but what would you do with that? VR home cinema just feels like a waste. I'd rather just watch it on a monitor than strap a headset on for two hours. I normally do other things while watching, too.
>>329817437
but they make a ton of money just selling hats, taking a portion of steam sales, user created shit and dota microtransactions
>>329815938
I'm a no name developer and I'm waiting for it to become more affordable as well as for the drivers/software to become more mature
Also VR is pretty new
The games work very differently
The hardware isn't commercially available yet
Most developers didn't know it would become an actual thing until recently
Most people haven't even tried VR yet so the audience is still small
...
All things considered it will take a while before there are "AAA" games for it
>>329817535
If the headset would be comfy enough - work, most of all, I work with a lot of data and a lot of applications, right now I use virtual desktops (in the "change between virtual desktops" sense) and this would let me have everything displayed around me without having to shell out for a bunch of 4k screens and shit, and even move them around in an easyfashion.
Its one thing if you don't give a movie your full attention - clearly VR is about using your all though.
I wanna lay back on my bed and watch something that way completely out of this world, and people could do their shit/sleep next to me and it still wouldn't be noticeable to me.
>>329817202
>It still would be a comfier setup than buying and setting up for a projector
I think you have an odd estimation of the comfort that having a device strapped to your face induces.
>>329817535
This isn't what he's talking about, but something like Tabletop Simulator in VR, with some basic avatar presence (if face-watching tech could be incorporated too that would be nice but having a VR device on currently precludes that) it would be like super-skype and great for /tg/ games. Dropping $1k to be able to play Magical Burst with animated figures in 3D while we're all cute lolis would be entirely worth the money.
>>329818226
I had the DK2, I can make an estimate, and I did say it would need to be a comfier headset.
>>329818320
There is a limit to how comfy you can be with shit strapped to you.
>>329818226
>Tabletop Simulator in VR, with some basic avatar presence (if face-watching tech could be incorporated too that would be nice but having a VR device on currently precludes that) it would be like super-skype and great for /tg/ games
The Altspace people want to be that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80tYGfqlb6o
>>329817535
That's only true for typical 3D movies. Have you seen VR porn? The kind where they strap the film rig on the dude? It's amazing.
>>329818617
I know they do, but I'm holding out hope for a better more polished version of that. Maybe it'll get there though.
>>329818590
Irrelevant if you are focused on what you are doing/watching.
The DK2 is a gigantic piece of shit and I used soem huge fucking headphones with it so it felt like I had a literal helmet on myself.
if the thing can be reduced to about half its weight and a nicer strap setup for it + better padding, then its already good enough.
For games - absolutely, for a good movie also, for work - yeah, I guess it can get annoying then.
Though I could still choose some super-comfy virtual location to do my job in, imagine sitting on one of those floating islands in Nagrand while doing your boring deskjob.
>>329818590
>everyone standing around the table
>not having your character in the game and your VR avatar being the same
>>329818617
I never even done or will do tabletop stuff like that but i think thats pretty cool.
I do hope it doesn't take long until they figure out a way for expression tracking while wearing one of these shits on our head.
/v/ will change forever when I get to sit around with all these faggots in a virtual room all of us facerigged to some qt girls and probably a lot of furry animals.
>>329819105
They talk about that idea in the latest video. You obviously need a pretty expansive avatar creator to be able to do that.
>>329817787
I am aware of that but Valve developed the fucking thing.
They are a respected company with big series.
If even they just release a shitty interactive demo, the portal robot repair thingy, how do they expect for anybody else to jump on their device?
The only thing that stops people from developing for the oculus are the missing controllers which get released later this year.
Time is ticking for Valve and I didnt even mention how every single VR game released for the Vive is also compatible with the Oculus while Oculus games are not compatible with the Vive.
Valve already got the potential customers and fans but if they dont capitalize on them soon Facebook and their gigantic pool of money and marketing will swoop them away.
>>329819248
Even if you had to pick from a list it would be better than standing around the table. But for their product to be any good they're going to need an expansive avatar creator anyway.
>>329819258
I think Valve is fucking retarded if they don't push out HL3 with the Vive.
I mean honestly HL2 only got big because of its engine and physics "gimmick", theres no way they can ever deliver a sequel that isn't seen as a disappointment - unless it also uses a huge gimmick.
>>329819229
>I do hope it doesn't take long until they figure out a way for expression tracking while wearing one of these shits on our head.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgKkEnaaSDc
It definitely appears to be possible. But a camera mounted on the headset like that seems less than ideal. Better if the tracking camera also did that job.
>>329819248
So? Allow custom models and it's fine.
>>329819258
I think Valve just doesn't really care
Steam generates endless amounts of money even if SteamOS / the Steam controller / Vive all fail
>>329819523
That musclemovement thing is pretty good.
Depends how cheap a cam can be I guess, if it can be made cheap enough, literally just to record your mouth movement I think it is fine.
I hope shit like this actually gets into the future "big" VR headset models, I need some good escapism from how shitty reality is getting.
>>329819460
It looks like they're going to do that with L4D3. Honestly, the Halflife franchise is a big enough deal that it'll sell whatever they put it on, and they're more likely to time VR hardware to release with it than the other way around.
>>329819821
Now L4D3 would be a shit game to be VR only.
I also dont understand the second part of your post, are you basically just agreeing with me?
>>329819920
I dunno man, if they manage to make good movement mechanics, a multiplayer co-op shooter could be fucking great. People generally walk out of VR stuff that has them interacting with other people really impressed.
>>329819701
they should care.
cs:go and dota are still running fine but TF2 is already going down the drain and no game lasts forever.
also the others dont sleep. Microsoft plans to join the fray, EA is already out and Ubisoft forces everyone to use uplay and offers uplay keys way cheaper than steam keys. GoG also managed to get a foothold.
>>329820107
I'd personally be pretty mad - I couldn't find another guy who buys a vr headset here for another 4 years atleast, much less all my friends.
and generall L4D is actually a performance based shooter, your awareness of your surroundings in VR is harshly reduced (to how much you'd have inreality).
So the game would need to be dumbed the fuck down.
Its not that a game LIKE it couldn't be fun in VR, its just that why would they need to kill this series that is already doing very well on existing systems to do it.
>>329807596
>more money than sense
You know if you quit McDonald's and actually tried you might be able to afford a toy or two now and then
>>329819523
Rather than that big camera mount, a little camera on each of the lower corners of the headset could be integrated to the headset. That would get rid of a lot of practical problems. But the need to calibrate each time will prevent mainstream adoption. It'll also need to have quite fine sensing abilities to be aware of the minor variations in expression common to usual interaction, rather than the exaggerated forms shown in the video.
Still, it's promising technology for the future.
>>329820326
>Its not that a game LIKE it couldn't be fun in VR, its just that why would they need to kill this series that is already doing very well on existing systems to do it.
Alright, point taken.
>>329820327
He is right though, early adopters always get burned. If you actually made good money and this wasn't the first time you are buying a new tech first hand you'd know better, but I guess your first job IS paying good, right?
>>329819920
Horror games seem to work well on VR even if they're shit.
I agree with your second second sentence but was suggesting a perspective different from the one that the context of your statement would imply. I think we might see a future VR headset with new features timed to release with HL3, but I don't think HL3 will be released at the same time as the Vive, which is timed to release as a contemporary of the Rift.
>>329820327
only the most hardcore enthusiasts will buy a device without games.
>>329820463
>early adopters always get burned
Except they are not in this case
If you have an early order you can sell it for almost twice as much :^)
I kickstarted the oculus, sold it for twice what I paid, bought the dk2, sold it for twice what I paid and now I get a cv1 for free
Feels great to be an early adopter bro
>>329820652
Oh now I understand, yeah, I guess they can do that too.
I guess it remains to be seen if theres more of a benefit in having a killer title for the "trial run" headset or something for the future.
God knows Valve can afford both, so even if the Vive is 'beaten' by the rift they can do another one if they really want to.
>>329820857
>hey guys why are you so poor
>wait I have to resort to scalping kits for some pocket money I'm so smart and rich
Decide what stance to take first friend.
>>329820293
As it stands none of those will become a threat for Valve in the near future
>>329820957
Not sure what you are talking about, I'm commenting on your "early adopters always get burned" comment
>>329820957
>early adopters get fucked
>Because I was an early adopter and only because I was an early adopter I was able to get a free 600% device
hurr durr you poor
>>329819229
>I never even done or will do tabletop stuff like that but i think thats pretty cool.
You have no idea how unbelievably fun it is
Although you lose a bit of fun not having people physically there with you.
>>329821127
I never evenheard of this stuff happening around here in yurop, probably missed out but what can you do
Atleast I still get to play LANs with my friends
>>329807084
When you don't have to wear some plastic shit on your face.
>>329820882
Even if they're "beaten" they'll probably have a better financial outcome than Oculus on this project. They put in a ton of R&D but sitting around doing R&D is what Valve does all day, if they weren't making VR they'd just be making new versions of games that will be scrapped and redone from the ground up a dozen times before release, all while giving zero fucks because Steam is just that profitable. Meanwhile Facebook is desperately trying to find a steady cashstream that isn't Zynga and they dropped two billion dollars on a company which only had any money due to kickstarter.
>>329821524
Yep.
I still wish they pulled out the big guns and HL3+Vived it, I'm certain despite the high entry fee it would create a MUCH bigger momentum for VR, and looking at their VR tech demos and even just how HL2VR works - they have everything for it already.
>>329820882
I don't think they were even planning on Vive in its current form. Rumors are that HTC was experimenting with VR beforehand and approached Valve for help rather than the other way around. I have a feeling that Vive 2, if it ever occurs, will be mobile standalone headset that can be optionally tethered to a PC. Lighthouse is a tech that seems like it was built for a mobile wireless headset rather than a tethered one. HTC probably went to Valve because of the Oculus/Samsung partnership, but couldn't figure out a way to keep their mobile hardware latency down, so went PC tethered only where Valve's expertise would help most.
