Did this kill the franchise?
>>329444031
That's not thief 3?
>>329444031
Franchise was dead long ago.
>>329444089
Thief 3 was decent if a big step backwards
It's more like it dug up the corpse and pissed on it for no reason.
>>329444031
a franchise is never dead as long as devs still have the capability of making a proper game, which they do, the problem is that they won't.
also the game isn't that bad once you forget where it originated from, the ambience is really good.
It lives on through Dishonored.
Thief Deadly Shadows killed it, what Thi4f did was dig up the corpse and rape it extremely hard to the point where Thief Deadly Shadows actually looks like a good Thief game in comparison.
Thi4f was actually so fucking bad it wasn't even funny, a complete mockery of the franchise. The engine they used, the constricted level design, the "we're better than Deadly Shadows, look, we have rope arrows! xD" when the rope arrows in the game are only able to be used in very few places so it makes the game more linear than Deadly Shadows with the climbing gloves. The sound design and AI are fucking atrocious in Thi4f, which are the two main areas that they should have focused heavily on in development, not remaking the universe/lore for edgy goth black eyeliner 'Garrote'. The AI somehow manages to be worse than the AI from Thief 1 and the sound is definitely less defined and less reliable to count on than ever.
>>329444031
People hate on it unnecessarily, there are much worse games. The biggest failing is the level design followed a pretty linear path, which breaks the basic premise of the games. Also load screens everywhere and garrett's characterisation was off.
>>329444162
In a sense this game is something Hollywood would do with a movie. Out of touch producer gets pitched the idea how a film about ninja bandit in pseudo England would be a neat refreshment from capeshit and they wouldn't to another Spiderman movie anyway right now and it's grim, it's dark it's mature and immersive... and then some hack gets called from the studio stable and slaps it together.
>a franchise is never dead as long as devs still have the capability of making a proper game, which they do,
which devs?
>>329444162
This. There was no real reason to make another Thief game while sanding all the corners off and making it user-friendly for today's lowest common denominator fuckwits.
What was that sound everyone associated with this game for a while because of that one shitty stream/trailer/something where he just kept making the same noise over and over?
Was it EH?
>>329444301
Level design back then was done by enthusiasts, nowadays you have people with diplomas (akin to people out of screenwriting schools) design levels by the book - just look at Dishonored. You have wide corridors, you have comfortable copypasted chandeliers, curtains and nooks no one ever looks behind, you can teleport... it's all modeled to convenience and you know fuckers jerk each other off at how well they pulled this unimaginative crap off.
CRAAAAAAAAAAAWLING IN MY SKIIIIIIIN
>>329444478
I had to stop reading that before I punched something.
>>329444420
Dishonored is still 100x better than Thi4f was even though it had its problems. Main difference is that Dishonored wasn't trying to be a Thief game, it's more of a stealthy take on Arx Fatalis mixed with Dark Messiah in a Thief-sorta world. When you play Dishonored and if you had played Arkane's previous games you can realize this and feel all of their previous work going into the game.
Plus, the teleportation stuff that everyone whines about isn't even that bad, it opens up the levels to be less linear and is effectively an ez-use version of the Rope Arrows from T1/T2 or Climbing Gloves from TDS, it's still a billion times better than the restricted "you can only shoot your rope arrows at these spots [x]" thing that Thi4f had.
>>329444661
Of dishonored 2 makes stealth interesting as Za Warudo was in the first game, I'll be damn interested.
That and if they get Stephan Russell to be Corvo's VA.
>>329444661
Dishonored somewhat works as an action game but nothing it did was very good and most of good it did didn't come from developer's planning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIT2FIq7BE0&list=UUEIxlUm43rZpA_UxGXB2PAA
>>329444420
But wasn't Dishonored done by guys from Looking Glass?
>>329444593
Getting rid of the undead (for the most part) isn't bad though. I also severely disliked magic pagan hippies. I'd kick out zombies and magick from thief too.
>>329444031
The franchise was over after the third game. They tried to start a new franchise.
>>329444837
Well, I have no idea who did what on Thief and how it translated into Dishonored but I'm pretty certain that level design wasn't done by the same people unless they suffered aneurysm. Even though Thief 3 was already a step back so...
>>329444883
Thing is, with Thief 3 they tried to go open world in a sense and it always comes on gameplay's expense, even small dilution of mission based structure of the first two games (it's as if they deemed it 'too gamey') results in a more streamlined experience, less planning and worse execution. I don't mind being teleported to a segmented chunk of video game world, I don't need resources wasted on city and its streets before the heist starts.
>>329444837
Yes Harvey Smith was the director and writer for it. i think a couple of guys from Arkane Studios came from LGS too
>>329445017
Actually what I liked about thief3 was the continuity between missions. What you had in the last mission you still had in the next, you didn't loose the gear that you still had left from the previous one. Only a single mission did this in the previous 2 games. However while the city itself might have been a cool idea on paper, it ended up being shallow and boring after the first day, since after you took everything in that region nothing else would change.
One weakness that first 2 games had compared to, say MGS in a stealth genre is that while you had plenty of different approaches to situation, there wasn't much you could do with the guards, their AI was far too simplistic and Thief 1 and 2 don't offer much opportunity to fool around with it.
Certainly part of it comes to third person perspective's superiority due to the fact that you can see your body and have better moveset stemming from it but then again Thief thrives in 1st person.
>Bethesda is bankrolling Stephen Russell while he acts in Shakespeare stage productions
>the guy they replaced him with in Thi4f doesn't even have his own Wikipedia page
>>329445540
Thief is a memory game, it doesn't need anything more than simplistic AI. Sure you can throw a couple bottles to distract them, but it will rarely ever work in your favor. You're suppose to remember the patrol patterns and avoid the AI instead of confronting them.
>>329445746
you're right about patrolling and memory but nothing wrong with unforeseen consequences.
>>329445540
>Pretending MGS is a stealth game series
I love MGS1 but do the world a favor and kill yourself senpai
>>329445712
>Only reason Stephen was not used is because they wanted the VA to be able to mocap as well
It's fucking true.
Am I the only one who thought it was decent? It was another Thief 3 if you ask me.
>>329444031
Not really. It came out nearly a decade after the previous game and was then forgotten about, so it's no more dead than it was before. But it wasn't and isn't dead, in the meantime modders have been pumping out quality missions and even entire games to make up for the lack of good official games.
>>329444420
Dishonored has fantastic levels, made by designers of some of the more memorable Thief FMs. I don't think they ever reached the heights of great Thief missions, but they also never sunk as low as the shitty ones.
>>329444762
An important part of immersive sims is that things happen without the developer's planning.
>>329444031
It was already dead, that was just the body twitching.
>>329449967
Yes, but in order to do those things in Dishonored and have fun you have to use the trainer. That's not emergent gameplay.
>>329450043
Well, I can't say I ever found that necessary. I can see it opens up some more options but the same can be said for any game.
>>329449967
>free money from heaven
>>329444478
That was made before the game release, right? A lot of that turned out not to be true.
>>329451125
It was, so people should probably stop posting it. At the time though, things the developers said made it appear as if they were true (perhaps they were at some point, considering how messy the game's development was said to have been).
>>329444593
Honestly, the custom difficulty options make reading this more tolerable.
