>Importance of a JRPG
Gameplay > Story/Characters > Atmosphere > Music > Graphics
Prove me wrong
The original FFVII was your list in reverse.
>>322428507
Are you suggesting that FF 7 had good graphics?
>>322428653
CG and prerendered backgrounds were hot shit at the time.
>>322428269
If this was true for most people, Final Fantasy IX wouldn't be nearly as popular as it is.
Setting > Gameplay
>>322428269
JRPGs hardly ever have good gameplay, or gameplay at all
Story/Characters > Music > Atmosphere > Gameplay > Graphics
![Grandia_[NTSC-U]_[Disc1of2]-2.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/751Emjc.jpg "Grandia_[NTSC-U]_[Disc1of2]-2.jpg")
>>322429364
You never played Grandia
>>322428269
>Gameplay > Story/Characters > Atmosphere > Music > Graphics
Honestly, if we're discussing anything other than turn/atb based JRPGs I agree, but gameplay is the last as far as turn and ATB based goes, it just needs to be simple, everything else carries them.
>>322429364
It's more the sum of the parts. The battles, equipment, and leveling up need to be satisfying or at least competent
Atmosphere > Music > Story/Characters Gameplay > Graphics
>>322429448
>What if ff9 was good instead of edgy grimdark shit?
Love that game.
>>322429448
Lots of people never played that you weirdo
>>322428269
Atmosphere isn't a thing by itself, it's produced by combination of visuals and music.
Also
Plot > Music > Gameplay > Graphics
>>322429389
Sadly, I agree with this. JRPG Gameplay is good and all but it's the story and characters that motivate me to play the most.
>>322428653
it's aged terribly but they were good at the time
>>322429618
this
story/characters > music > graphics > gameplay > atmosphere.
an example of this is Nier.
Another example of an exellent game that follows the above pattern is Danganronpa (and yes i know it's not an RPG, but still)
>all these people saying story > gameplay
Why even play a video game? Just watch anime.
>>322430123
Is there an anime with the atmosphere of a great JRPG?
Nightmare mode: Not one of those MMO anime like Sword Art Online
Dante Must Die: Not made by Ghibli
Waifus > all other stuff
>>322430123
THIS so fucking this
You're playing a video GAME as in GAMEPLAY. If you want the story over gameplay then just watch a fucking tv show
>>322429967
Hey, danganronpa gameplay wasn't that bad (i mean it fails miserably as murder mystery, but concept of gameplay is pretty solid). And it was very, very climatic game - like, atmosphere was super important there.
>>322430709
I don't know. I don't watch that much anime. That being said, atmosphere is all fine and good. But if it's just window dressing for a boring combat system, the charm fades fast, A good jrpg needs to excel at both.
>>322430774
This guy gets it.
>>322430840
hurr durr i don't understand different potential of different mediums as well
>all these people watching movies for story instead of special effects
THIS so fucking this
You're playing a movie as in MOTION IMAGE. If you want the story over motion images then just read a book
>>322431316
10/10
>>322431316
How was gone home, anon? did it move you?
>>322428653
FFVII is a bizarre case. At the time they were absolutely incredible. Yet with our modern perspective the game looks worse than the SNES games.
>>322430840
Wouldn't that make MGSV the bestest game ever? That game has depth but all it ever did was make me want to punch a wall and scream into a pillow.
>>322431752
MGSV gameplay is bogged down by waiting for the helicopter to land and take off constantly though.
>>322431036
I understand your point about the atmosphere and story.. they were both really great. But the gameplay wasnt that impressive, just the trials with the bullet sections and all, and the explorations. It's not the strength of Danganronpa games.
besides i dont even count OP's stupid "atmosphere" into the mix. so that's why I put it last, even when it can be anywhere.
hell atmoshere s a COMBINATION of story/character/music/setting anyway.
It's a JRPG anon, there's never been a good JRPG thats carried by just its gameplay. JRPG gameplay is weak without the flavor of the other aspects.
Story/Characters > Music > Gameplay > Atmosphere > Graphics
Are there any JRPGs besides Parasite Eve and some of the SaGa games that actually have good gameplay?
>>322428269
>Gameplay
>Priority in a JRPG
What JRPGs have YOU been playing?
>>322428269
Graphics might not be important, but you would expect them getting better over time.
>>322432668
Final Fantasy series
Kingdom Hearts series
Chrono Trigger
Grandia
The World Ends With You
All are Gameplay > Story
>>322428269
>gameplay is the most important aspect of a jrpg
Jrpgs have gameplay? This is news to me
>>322432408
>music that high
My fucking nigga, the music's always the ketchup and mustard of JRPGs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU4qT3yEPhc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Umfc69VlAF4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWvVcF07DGA
>>322432579
There is, but people hate on it because it has Lightning in it.
You could make an argument for Kingdom Hearts. In general the KH games are too easy at default difficulty, and feel kind of cheap at higher difficulties, but the core gameplay is pretty fun, even if it sometimes devolves into mashing X for general mooks, and abusing a couple of specific abilities for bosses.
>>322433006
>food analogies
>>322428269
>importance of a JRPG
Dragon Quest VIII > not Dragon Quest VIII
>>322433051
I played both KHs and thought they were shit. Also, is that Lightning Returns?
>>322433154
>implying it isn't true
Music is to JRPGs as pepperoni is to pizza. You really can't have a good JRPG without good music or a good pizza without pepperoni.
>>322429364
Excuse me good sir
>>322433239
Yes it is. It makes me wonder why every game doesn't have the option of giving the characters glasses.
>>322432942
>Final Fantasy
>Chrono Trigger
>Good gameplay
Turn-based and ATB has a hard time being anything more than mediocre.
>>322433843
>Chrono Trigger
>Bad Gameplay
Okay I admit you fucking got me.
>>322433843
>turn-based=mediocre
spotted the ADHD-riddled newfag
go to bed
>>322434012
Why? I completely agree with him. It's not too crazy of an opinion
>>322434012
I like Chrono Trigger too, but it's not as if you need a lot of skill or intelligence to beat it. You can beat everything the game has to offer simply by spamming the strongest skills available to you at the time. There is no challenge to it whatsoever.
>>322429620
>ff9
>edgy grimdark shit
wut
It tackles some of the more darker aspects of life near the end but for the most part it is a very lighthearted enjoyable game
stop talking shit about something youve never played anon its not healthy
>>322434012
You can't deny that gameplay is the weakest part of most JRPGs, though, even if the gameplay itself is fun. Chrono Trigger is my favorite game of all time not because of the gameplay but because of the music and story. The gameplay was nothing to obsess over or write home about.
>JRPG
characters/story > music > atmosphere > gameplay > graphics
Gameplay is by far the most important
A good story is something that sets the stage for the gameplay. Basically it just needs to make the battles and exploration parts make sense in context and to give some reason for the plot to advance so you go to the next battle. An actual well written, thought provoking storyline is a nice bonus but ultimately not very important.
Characters don't really matter aside from being distinct and their gameplay attributes matching the character.
Music is part of atmosphere. it can add significantly to the game if suitable
Graphics matter up to the point where information can be clearly conveyed. PS4-quality graphics don't really offer anything better than PS2, and PS2-quality graphics are often not even needed.
>gameplay only means combat
bunch of fucking retards
The problem with most turn-based or ATB JRPGs is that numbers are everything. The key to beating any JRPG lies pretty much solely in whether your numbers are higher than the enemy's. In cases where there's some degree of customization involved, it's simply a matter of what covers your ass most effectively, minimizing weaknesses and maximizing strengths. Since stats and attributes are plainly written down for you on the status screen, it's just an issue of accumulating as much numbers as possible.
There's rarely any real technique or skill involved. Final Fantasy and Chrono Trigger are no exception to this. You don't really need to try particularly hard to beat Lavos.
I enjoy traditional jrpg combat and at the very least it usually requires my attention since grinding is for faggotsAlso got a hardon for managing MP/HP and personally never use items once healing magic becomes available because it makes dungeons actually feel like those random encounters matter because If you waste mp on overkilling them then youre gonna be shit out of luck when the boss comes around, makes these games much more enjoyable and theres never been a point where I didnt do this even when I was like 7 playing pokemon redgoddamn item hoarding is so good why do you have an itemlimit LoD
Atmosphere > Gameplay = Music > Characters > Story > Graphics
Totori is the comfiest adventure I've ever had.
Also love EO and DQ, fuck you storyfags.
>>322434610
>gameplay only means combat
You can tell how retarded someone is and that they unironically think this by seeing them say turnbased is bad.
>>322434590
>Graphics matter up to the point where information can be clearly conveyed. PS4-quality graphics don't really offer anything better than PS2, and PS2-quality graphics are often not even needed.
This
I have tried conveying this to so many people and they tell me I'm retarded. Aslong as what you are looking at is conveyed properly there is no issue. Everything from the snes up has been able to do it perfectly and I think it was perfected with the ps2. Now all this polish on graphics only makes game files larger and the games themselves smaller
>>322434805
Good JRPGs are challenging and require a full grasp of game mechanics when played without levelling from non-story-related battles. You need a different setup and strategy for each battle.
You can trivialize that with grinding just like you can trivialize most games by selecting "easy mode" at the start, but that makes you faggot.
Good characters are a must considering all JRPGs revolve around its characters and developing them.
The writing/story has to be good considering JRPGs are traditionally heavily story based.
The presentation of a JRPG is extremely important. This impacts the atmosphere in plenty of ways.
A fantastic soundtrack is a must, I can't think of a top-tier JRPG without a fantastic soundtrack.
Graphics are not important since animu doesn't translate well with HD or realism. Aesthetic and artwork is extremely important.
The state of JRPG combat itself leaves much to be desired in most games, especially turnbased ones. Unless JRPG combat is reinvented, a good combat system is not as important.
A good overworld/setting/towns/dungeons to explore is a must. Chests hidden around corridors, and large bustling towns and castles with secrets. Areas with significance and NPCs with interesting things to say. Most people forget that exploration/traversing the world and areas is a crucial part of JRPG gameplay.
>>322434910
That only takes you so far. Take Shin Megami Tensei for instance. Ignoring shit like SMTIV and the Persona series, it's considered to be among the more difficult turn-based JRPGs.
But that's really only at first, when you don't really know what you're doing. Once you've figured it out, really the trick is to save before the boss, see what it can do, presumably get killed, reload your save and counter the boss's attack patterns. Nocturne was considered hard, but seriously, most of it just boils down to repetition. There's also the luck factor involved in case the boss uses an insta-kill, but even that can easily be prepared for. Once you know a boss's pattern, winning is easy.
Repeat ad infinitum. Oh, sure, there are some "really difficult" bosses like Demifiend in DDS and Elizabeth in P3, but even they have specific patterns. Beating them is less a matter of skill and more a matter of writing everything they do down and having a specific order or doing things. It's like save-scumming, only requiring way more patience.
>>322428269
Story over all else
Prove me wrong, people have been buying jrogs with shitty derivitive game play since the 80's
>>322435397
Sure, if "memorizing patterns" is challenging. I'll bet you thought Demifiend was a hard boss. The only thing he challenges is your patience.
>>322435580
What video games have good gameplay?
>>322428269
Story/Characters > Music > Gameplay > Atmosphere > Graphics
I'm perfectly OK with the latter three being only serviceable if the first two are great.
Unless it's a VN, gameplay will always be the most important aspect of any game.
>>322435450
This anon fucking gets it.
>>322435450
I replay Grandia 1&2 once every so often because they have the best JRPG combat system.
Get the fuck out with your terrible opinion.
>>322436194
Grandia 1 and 2 don't represent the entire JRPG genre. JRPGs have almost always had very weak battle systems, or at least nothing special. JRPG gameplay excels at exploring its setting.
Story/Characters>Atmosphere>Gameplay>Graphics>Music
All top tier JRPGs follow this pattern. Also "atmosphere" is a bit stupid since it's a byproduct of graphics, sound and gameplay but whatever.
If you're looking for a game where gameplay is the most attractive feature, you're looking in the wrong genre.
>>322435606
I didn't even bother fighting him
>>322428269
I hate how the influx of "cinematic" games made people afraid to admit that they play any game for the story. The characters and story have always been the biggest motivation for me and most people I know to complete JRPGs
>>322436382
>All top tier JRPGs follow this pattern
But most top tier JRPGs have really good OSTs. Since the composition of the music is usually separate from the game development, seeing as how most music composers aren't actually game devs (excluding exceptions like Meguro and Ishiwatari), the music is really never really a factor. It's just a matter of hiring a really good composer.
>>322435606
>The only thing he challenges is your patience.
99% of video games, even action games, and ESPECIALLY RPGs, are literally just this. Your understanding and manipulation of the mechanics therein to defeat an AI target by using its weak points against it. I don't care how epic you think your ARPG is, you still only beat bosses in a number of ways:
>Trigger some out-of-combat event where the boss is defeated without engaging in combat
>Trigger some out-of-combat event where the boss is severely weakened outside of combat to be more vulnerable in the fight
>Fight him head-on and play the exact same numbers game you'd be playing in a JRPG, but in real time
>Abuse their shitty ability to track your character and dodge the exact same attacks a few times while still playing a numbers game, only with periodic dodging playing a role in things
A game like Tales of Graces F has an intensely solid combat system (even though most else is either meh or weak), and it tests your understanding of spacing, dodge ability, the CC system to rack up attacks, and hitting target weakpoints at the right moments to kill them as quickly and efficiently as possible. And yet it still winds up being a numbers game that tests your patience at the end of the day.
>>322432942
>Final Fantasy series
After IX the series prioritized story over gameplay.
>>322434012
CT has the same brainless combat as any Final Fantasy post III sans X.
>>322434590
The music is by far the most important aspect, not for making an objectively good game, but for the game to be remembered as one.
Every other component of a videogame has the concept of aging attached to it. Even if a developer utilizes the most advanced graphics available, 20 years down the road people feel the need to defend their favorite game by saying "well it was good for its time". However, people don't think that way when it comes to music. They will unashamedly claim some SNES chiptune is the best piece of music they've ever heard. Unlike gameplay or stories or graphics which can lose value over time, none of the effort spent on making memorable music goes to waste. Therefore, in order to make a game that is remembered fondly, a developer's first priority should be the soundtrack.
>>322436824
And that's why competitive games are the only games where gameplay really matters. Because no matter how refined your single-player game is, the A.I. will never be able to match the abilities of a human being.
Unless it's, like. Chess.
>>322429729
Atmosphere, or mood, is created by things like setting, tone, and themes. While in movies visuals, sound, and writing (dialog, character actions, etc) are often used to establish mood, only in video games can it also be established by a fourth element: the controls and the mechanics surrounding them (gameplay). To help visualize this, try imagining SH or Ico without their control schemes and interactions with the game's environment.
>>322438014
Atmosphere sounds like it's judged similar to a game's artstyle. It's not about what's being presented; it's about presenting it consistently throughout. No clashing art styles, no clashing atmospheres.
>>322428269
Gameplay is usually the last thing I'm looking for in a JRPG. All the JRPGs I have fond memories of had gameplay ranging from offensively bad to unremarkable, but the story was strong, the characters (at least some) likeable, and the world was a exciting place to spend time in.
>>322438616
All types of media are capable of having a consistent mood, varying moods, or in rarer cases, an overarching mood with underlying moods. A lot of games tend to stick to the simplicity of one type of atmosphere, while some go for a variety. Few try for the layered approach and fewer still successfully pull it off.
>>322428269
Story and gameplay are equivalent, but I agree with this list
>>322428653
It was amazing for it's time so everyone had to try it. That's when I realized JRPGs are casual trash for shitters with no reflexes or strategic ability.
>>322432408
>there's never been a good JRPG thats carried by just its gameplay
Grandia 3
Dragon's Dogma
FFX
Ys series
Kingdom Hearts series
Paper Mario
The gameplay is the best part of these games. Everything else about them is just okay at best. The music is good at least.
>>322441937
> FFX
> Paper Mario
> good gameplay
>>322442287
You can't deny FFX but I can see why you don't think Paper Mario is good. It's just fun.
>>322442462
> You can't deny FFX
Do you not remember playing it? It was the same shit as every other JRPG
unless you wrote that backwards, in which case glorified QTEs aren't my idea of fun
>>322428269
Okay, let's remove gameplay, story, characters, music and graphics. What is the atmosphere?
>>322429389
This, anyone who plays JRPG's for gameplay is doing it wrong. Even the best still have mediocre gameplay.
>>322441937
>Dragon's Dogma
>Kingdom Hearts series
>Ys series
>JRPGs
Those are action RPG's you tit.
>>322448135
They are still Japanese RPGs. If you want to be pedantic, they would be considered JARPGs.
>>322428269
music should be higher up, look what uematsu leaving final fantasy did to their OSTs
>>322448756
Really sad to see that FF14 has a better soundtrack than any of the FF13 trilogy
Sounds about right every jrpg that gets praise always seems to have great music, gameplay, story, characters and even art style but it might be lacking in the graphics department you can see proof of this with FFVII and Xenoblade chronicles both games shine greatly in everything but graphics
>>322449662
FFVII was revolutionary for it's time. It looks like absolute shit now, but when I first saw it I couldn't believe my eyes. After seeing it again 2-3 years later I thought it looked like garbage in comparisson to FF8 and 9, or really anything else on the system.
>>322429364
Stop playing weebshit.
>>322428269
>Gameplay > Story/Characters > Atmosphere > Music > Graphics
This seems applicable to more genres than just jrpgs.
waifus>lore>set pieces>cutscene direction and coreography especially the CG FMVs>ost>villain speeches>gameplay>graphics and art style>atmosphere>story
>>322428269
Story/Characters > Atmosphere > Gameplay > Music > Graphics
