What the hell just happened I wanna go back to my town
town's fucked, everyone's dead, being a squid is way cooler fampai
"We Want the Splatoon Audience"
>>320282881
You became a god.
Enjoy it.
>>320282881
Then you shoulda let Gehrmann kill ya
You would have woken up back at Yahrnam and went about your merry way
You get to grow and fly through fucking dimensions and shit.
You might even end up a pretty sea based old one.
>>320282881
>not wanting to be a tentacle monster and fucking your doll mom
/waifu
>>320282881
Let Gehrmann kill you in the dream and you're released from the hunter's contract
Kill Gehrman without the cords and you take his place
Kill the Moon Presence and you become an infant god.
>>320283617
This. Becoming a god means only existing in the Dream World. Thats how the Old Ones transcended.
>>320282881
The doll even gives you pets.
Oh Good hunter. pet pet pet
>>320283674
Daily reminder that the Doll is Oedon and that you're it's new baby boy.
I dont understand anything about the game.
So there is a real Yharnam out there with actual beasts and all the fucked up shit happening in the dream?
Or is the dream just a codeword for alternate universe.
Does the dream even matter? How are multiple people in the dream?
>>320283719
There are so many Great One forms to choose from. Why did we have to choose the tentacle?
>>320283617
>go about your merry way
>with the horrific memories of your journey, and all that there delicious Insight
>"merry way"
>implying that you'd live a normal life
I don't think so, Tim
>>320283874
Go back to Reddit
>>320283884
you're a baby. who knows what you'll look like when you grow up?
>>320283884
I assume it's just the infant form, and you'd eventually transform into something cooler
>>320283940
You dont remember anything when you wake up. Gherman literally says that to you and Micolash screams it when you kill him
>>320284037
Go back to Yharnam.
>>320283874
>Formless Odeon
>Formless
>>320283878
Yharnam + beasts == reality
the Nightmare and the Hunter's Dream are two different alternate planes of existence.
You can die in reality, but so long as your mind is trapped in the Dream, you live on in the Nightmare
>>320283878
The dreams are realms created inside the minds of the old ones
The Mensis cult used the Brain of Mensis to create the Nightmare of Mensis to try and revive Margo, an infant old one that died
Rom was acting as a barrier to prevent the dreams from mixing with the real world
>>320284123
HE POSSESSED THE DOLL YOU FUCKING DUNGO
Doll is a great one, you're her surrogate child. Have fun.
>>320284103
and yet Eileen and Djura are ex-dreamers who remember everything, and still maintain their supernatural hunter strength/dexterity/speed
>>320283878
Dream is a codeword for a magial realm, basically. Real Yharnam exists and it really is experiencing all the beast plague shit. Nighmare/dream realms are parallel realities, and can be created by rituals and shit. You can die in the real world and still survive in the dream, which is what happened to the Choir. The crazier shit going on in Yharnam is because the dreamworld and real world are overlapping. Killing the old one in the nightmare at the end of the game ends the conjunction of both realms and returns the world to relative normalcy.
>>320284103
That's cuz Micolash is dead in the real world.
>>320284301
There's no indication that they remember everything, just they're aware of the dream and might have vague memories of it.
>>320283719
Is accepting death one of those non-standard game over things or is it a viable option with an actual ending? And what if you choose to fight but die anyway?
>>320284252
no problems , i'm fine with incest
>>320284116
A W A Y
W
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>>320284519
It's an actual ending with a cutscene and you're booted into NG+. If you fight but die then you just try again.
>>320284479
but they still remember the Hunt and whatever motivations they had before getting kicked out. All that shit you did in the non-Hunter's Dream? All that horrific ptsd-inducing, frenzy-inducing bullshit that you saw? You're gonna carry that weight, even if you "forget the dream." good luck living a normal life with all that shit in your head.
>>320284519
It's an ending with a unique trophy and everything but you miss out on 1/2 fights and don't get the burial blade or Gherman's set.
>>320282881
>What the hell just happened I wanna go back to my town
Then you should've submitted your life, jackass
>>320284182
Wait what
>>320284194
So the dream is just a dream of the old ones?
>>320284405
If the nightmare world and regular world are both experiencing the beast plague then whats the differnce
>>320283874
The hunter's dream is a construct of MP.
>>320284519
It is a viable option with an actual ending. It severs you from the Hunter's Dream, and you reawaken in the material world.
If you choose to fight but die you get to fight Gehrmann again until you win, probably mostly for playability reasons.
>>320284519
If you accept death you just don't fight Ghermann or the Moon Presence and the game ends with you waking up in Yahrnam in the morning
Fighting and dying does nothing special, you just keep coming back until you win
>>320284709
>and don't get the burial blade or Gherman's set.
Was this patched or something? I swear I got the badge after accepting death on my first playthrough.
You're a squid now.
Its a pop up text option as well as what the other anons have said.
You basically get to choose that or the second ending, going in with prior knowledge or just blind luck gets you the third one.
>>320282881
I hate it when a game's ending is actually a way more interesting concept than what we got.
>>320284740
The nightmare world is actually only a relatively small number of locations in the game, including the DLC and the Nightmare Frontier. You are in the real world most of the time. The real world is being invaded by nightmarish shit. The nightmares and the Old Ones are the source of all the eldritch horror and the plague of beasts. Cutting Yharnam off from the nightmares saves it.
>>320284740
The Nightmare is an alternate plain of existence. It is created by a Great One. You enter the Nightmare like falling asleep, hence the name "Nightmare." Like a Dream, you can be sitting inert, sleeping, in reality, but doing stuff in the Dream -- your mind and body are decoupled, and your mind (your perception of the world) is what determines your state of existence, not some weak sack of flesh, bone, and water. So long as you're alive in the Nightmare, literally anything can happen to the body you left behind, and you still carry on just fine (although this might lead to problems in the event that you wake up).
>>320284740
No only the regular world has the beast plague
All the really crazy shit like the brain trusts, those big amalgamations of corpses, the respawning dudes in Yahargul, and the One Reborn are a result of the nightmare leaking into the real world
>>320285018
Isn't the beast plague a result of people injecting Old God blood into their dicks?
>>320285082
>respawning dudes in Yahargul
>One Reborn
that's the product of whatever evil magic summoning bullshit that the rouge Pthumerian ladies that the Mensis have working for them, can do. I don't think it's as simple as the Nightmare leaking into reality
>>320284978
Where the hell could it possibly go from there from a gameplay standpoint? You're a helpless infant.
>>320283617
But then you don't get to fight him.
>>320282881
You're a squid now.
>>320285220
Plague of Beasts is a curse.
When you piss of a Great One, it curses your civilization in revenge. A popular curse for Blood-using civilizations is to infect their Old Blood with Vermin, which cause them to degenerate into Beasts. This already happened once in the Pthumerian civilization of Loran, and it's happening again in Yharnam, because Mankind never learns from their mistakes, and the Yharnamite researchers pissed off a Great One against all rational sense.
Yharnam is Kadath
Bloodborne in general becomes a hell of alot easier to understand once you've read some of the Dream cycle of Lovecraft.
>>320285220
Yeah, but it gets more complicated than that.
Originally the blood was pure. We learned in the DLC that the blood was specifically cursed by the Old Ones residing in the hunters' nightmare as a result of the sins of Byrgenwerth.
>>320285286
Not really the "infant" part, but a RPG game where you are a newly formed Lovecraftian God ready to butcher your eldricht kin is appealing to me.
>>320285360
>b-but muh platinum
>tfw want to read the dream cycle but hate how people wrote in the early 1900's
>>320285527
Yup, it's very Lovecraftian.
Shit, you basically have Innsmouth in the DLC.
>>320285360
>>320285924
then back up your save
>>320282881
Will this lead to tentacle rape?
>>320285924
He's a good boss with nice music.
>>320286157
great ones are not for sexual
didn't we have this thread yesterday?
>>320286414
But the Doll is a Great One
WEREWOVLES OF LONDON
AAOOOOOOOOOOOO
So, lemme hash out a basic timeline and see if my ideas are correct.
First, the Pthumerians make contact with the Old Ones, culminating in their creation of Ebrietas. Much later, Byrgenwerth scholars discover Ebrietas in the ancient labyrinth. Seeking to learn more from the Old Ones, they terrorize the fishing hamlet that was recently visited by Kos. As punishment for the experiments conducted upon the people of the hamlet, Kos releases Vermin into the blood used for various ministrations, causing the plague of beasts. The Church emerges as a result, with the Hunters being their martial arm. The Moon Presence, having lost its own child, makes a surrogate of Gehrman, who fashions the dream of MP into the Hunter's Dream - which enables his pupils to return from death in the real world.
>>320286157
Consentacles
>>320282881
Yharnam Sunrise is a better ending than being a squid, plus you dont have to kill based Gehrman for it
>>320286553
lore threads are comfy, shut up
>>320286590
vaati pls go
the doll is merely the MPs avatar in the Dream, it uses it to present a form more pleasing to you as it takes your delicious blood echoes. nothing more
>>320286612
ebrietas was found after the church formed, discovering her is what kickstarted the formation of the choir
there's very strong evidence to suggest that the Hunters were around during the time of Byrgenwerth -- Gehrman knew Master Willem personally, he calls to him in the Dream in his sleep, and Simon mentioned that the Hunters sinned in Byrgenwerth.
Everything else seems OK tho
>>320286706
>Murder the fuck out of the Moon Presence
>Doll still acts independently
>>320286701
Gehrman wants to be killed, you're doing him a favor
>>320286612
>>320286872
What is the ideological and methodological differences between the Choir and School of Mensis?
>>320286701
But doesn't killing Gehrman finally free him from his imprisonment?
>>320286987
School of Mensis seems to be more concerned with Insight than Blood Ministration, much like Willem.
>>320286876
because you immediately take over the Hunter's Dream once it dies, and you keep it around
>>320286987
choir was using blood experimentation to produce a Great One (the Celestial Emmisary), and the Mensis were trying to ascend by being granted eyes ala Byrgenwerth (going back to their roots, as it were)
>>320284604
Mean neger
>>320287251
>>320284604
/a/ pls go
>>320287124
>because you immediately take over the Hunter's Dream once it dies, and you keep it around
If the Doll is the Moon Presence then you'd have no way to "keep it around" immediately after killing the Moon Presence. Why would the MP even be subservient to you if it's a true Great One anyway?
Should I have killed the Witch of Hemwick before Amelia? Does it matter?
Also Arianna is safe as long as I don't take her blood three times, right? I didn't send the cannibal to the chapel either.
>>320287124
did Master Willem have a hand in the Mensis' coup against the church?
There are some hints of civil war between two factions in the game
Maybe we'll be the boss in Bloodborne 2!
>>320287406
Sorry, I misworded my argument. It's not literally the MP, it's a construct that the MP created as a Blood-echo siphoning system. Hunters get cute maido doll that they sacrifice their BE to, and the MP gets its BE, and the Hunters aren't freaked out by talking to a giant skeleton monster -- half of them would probably try and kill it on sight.
You keep the construct around once you take charge of the Dream because you like it.
>>320284252
>>320287668
Quit using a guide, you dork.
>>320287668
Everything becomes more expensive after Amelia
>>320287668
witches don't matter
no one is safe, keep that in mind
>>320285491
How did they piss off the Great One? The Pthumerians and the humans, I mean.
>>320286414
>not for sexual
>oedon impregnating bitches left and right
>great ones are unique, so unique they need to breed with other species
>SOMEONE, a man brave beyond measure looked at Kos sunbathing on the shore one day and said "I'M GOING TO FUCK THAT"
>>320287669
Willem and Byrgenwerth was long past it's prime, and irrelevant, by the time the Mensis and the Choir split. And there's not much to suggest a civil war, the guy with the Upper Cathedral Ward Key in the cage has a door that isn't locked on the inside, it's locked from outside. The guy can leave when he wants, the cell is meant to keep him safe, not to imprison him.
>>320287709
The theory fits, but considering the clear motherly roll the Doll takes on throughout the game and especially during the final cutscene I have to say I think it's more likely that she's a Great One herself.
>>320288021
well a construct with such abilities would be 3/4 of a great one anyway, so there's really not much to separate the two ideas.
It's a doll in the first place because Gehrman, being the pact-maker, got to pick the form of the Dream's waifu
>>320287383
It's the purest love anon, don't you love your family?
>>320282881
You're a squid now. You're a kid now. You're essentially a god now.
>>320287406
It's magic.
Not going to explain shit
>>320287940
First off, the Pthumerians are technically human.
The people of Loran pissed off a great one by fucking around with non-Great One approved births, which the Great Ones apparently regulated very heavily.
Yharnam incited the wrath of the Orphan of Kos by brutalizing the Fishing Village, which was under it's patronage.
>>320286157
>rape
The doll been craving your holy blade since you had only 1 insight
>>320288402
So are the Great Ones supposed to be dicks? Cause they seem pretty chill to me.
>>320288614
They are often sympathetic in spirit.
>>320288614
the Great Ones aren't a team. They all have their own agendas and "personalities." some are dicks, some are helpful
>>320288614
Some of em are pretty alright, and are mostly preoccupied with keeping the dick old ones in check
>>320288675
Yeah but their version of sympathy gets you trapped in a dream forever or gets you turned into a lil squid babby.
>>320288860
it just says that they're sympathetic, it doesn't say that they're actually good at helping you out when they try
>I'M HELPING!!! -- your average Great One as it accidentally ruins someone's life
So how many Great Ones are actually in the game. Are Rom and the Wet Nurse great ones?
>>320289197
check your trophies
>>320283641
Im still weirded out that Kos has a woman's face
>>320289292
Can't really tell if that's a feminine or masculine face.
>>320283874
>boy
But I played as a qt girl hunter
>>320290047
Good job anon.
>>320289546
>Orphan of Kos
>As in Kos birthed him
>can't tell if dude or girl
>>320292821
ARE YOU IMPLYING THAT ONLY GREAT ONES THAT USE FEMALE PRONOUNS CAN HAVE KIDS BECAUSE THEN YOU'D BE WRONG YOU FUCKING IDIOT
>>320286414
>>320286590
GREAT ONES GONE SEXUALLLLLLLLLLLL
>>320293160
A W A Y
W
A
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>>320293137
>le ironing le epic may may
>do I fit in yet g-guys
>>320293712
Shitposting won't make you right, anon.
>>320288021
If anything she's your wet nurse faggot she isn't a great one
>>320284037
kys
>>320282881
>>320283874
That makes sense actually. Blood echoes are invisible but are the essences of life that you take from your enemies. It accumulates into you.
The only being to acknowledge its existence and is able to turn that essence into power that makes you stronger is the Doll.
Also, the game states that all great ones desire children, but lose their children as they are born, and thus desire surrogates. Moon presence took Gherman, Kos took the orphan, whoever that once was, Ebrietas wept for Rom, Mergo's wet nurse stole Queen Yharnam's baby, the Celestial Emissary hangs out with humans that have been forcefully turned to aliens.
And when they were all dead and you ate the three umbilical cords, the doll takes you in. Wow. I understand bloodborne now.
Only the Brain of Mensis didn't desire to steal kids. But if you perform the Make Contact gesture, it gives you a rune. So inherently its not a bad Eldritch monster, just that it kills everything it casts its gaze at.
If the Doll is Oedon, it also explains why Arianna and Iosefka were punished to birth horrors. She didn't want you lusting over them. Also, the nun Adella was the only female you encountered that was spared because she couldn't have a baby if she wanted.
>>320294202
But anon, if you do the third and secret ending, there is no reason for the Doll to be alive and to be taking care of you.
Redgrave must have a ton of insight for noticing the details, assuming he's the one who found the theory.
>>320286706
The Doll is literally just a stand-in for Gehrman's dead waifu.
>>320295971
yes, that is why it looks and sounds like Maria, specifically, as opposed to some random hot chick
>>320295971
I want to have consensual sexual relations with maria, if you know what I mean
>>320297658
I spent 45 minutes trying to get myself visceral'd for that peck on the cheek.
>>320295971
THAT OEDON POSSESSED
>>320298085
>letting maria cheat on her husbando gehrman.
>>320299270
>not destroying maria solely for the purpose of further legitimizing the doll's existence
I want to snuggle with her as we drift to sleep in the dream.
>>320299270
>>letting maria cheat on her husbando gehrman.
no, Maria doesn't have a husbando. Maria is Gehrman's waifu. He even made a life sized dakimakura of her.
>>320299270
Maria doesn't have a husbando, she is /u/
>>320300675
Yurishitters go home.
>>320301456
>not liking /u/
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