Is graphics important to you?
>>319824517
No, but a workable interface that I don't have to fight with is.
>>319824517
only good frames per second, other than that not really
>>319824517
nope, love me some fukin dorfs
>>319824586
This, holy shit. I just wanna build a room, not type a fucking essay in a German ENIGMA machine.
I would be totally satisfied if we never advanced beyond the graphical fidelity of 6th-gen consoles, but as computers improved, all of the additional processing power was instead concentrated on physics simulations, AI & natural language processing, and so on.
6th-gen graphics aren't considered photo-realistic nowadays, but they look realistic enough that players can see a legit simulacrum of real-life, unlike going back and playing Silent Hill, Tomb Raider, or Metal Gear Solid where we have a low-poly blocky puppet show.
>>319824517
Yes. I need to know enough about what the hell I'm looking at to fill the rest in with my imagination. Or enough to pique my curiosity to want to know better, just like your beautiful pic related.
>>319824517
born before '95 = no
born AFTER '95 = yes
>>319825468
This has some merit
>>319825468
Yeah, we upgraded to the SNES because of the better sound chip, clearly.
>>319824517
>Is graphics important to you?
>>319825185
Holy mother of fucking GOD this so hard.
Imagine if we kinda got stuck with games looking like FEAR, maybe a bit better, but for the most part pretty basic textures and all that.
Now... instead of focusing on making "graphics" better, Developers focused on exactly what the anon above said.
graphics are important to me
as long as there's some effort put into it.
for example, undertale has shit graphics because no effort was put into it at all.
Art Direction, FPS, Fluid feeling menus and loading > Sunrays, ULTRA HIGH DEF motion blur ANTIALISASING 20X DOF 4K HD
>>319824517
>Is graphics important to you?
Not particularly, although they're nice. But Dorf Fortress does need a texture pack to be enjoyable.
>>319824517
Yes and no. I'm not a graphics fag, but I'm not saying everything needs to be god damn barbaric either. I love dwarf fortress. I love roguelikes. I love basic games that other people say "wow it's not 3d/detailed it must be SHIT"
I just have learned to not put a graphical aspect so heavily into the game because AAA devs will circle jerk that fact and dump their budget into graphics. Great. I love you just spent 200k of the budget on trying to get a smooth animation for a thumb bending. Oh, you gotta do it for the rest of the fingers too? Shit. Thanks for my totally realistic game. Wait, you took out the gameplay just to make it look better? No budget, what do you mean not enough money?
>>319826252
get a load of this nerd I bet he actually plays video games
the absolute madman
>>319825970
Shit, sent an empty reply accidentally.
>>319824517
Depends on a game.
To me, the atmosphere is probably the most important part of any game. If a game tries to be realistic to immerse the player, then it probably has to deliver decent graphics.
I'd say the art style is more important than the texture quality or whatever. For example, I can't play anime shit, no matter what.
>>319825185
I would honestly be fine with even less then that, say somewhere in between ps1 and ps2. Maybe we'd get some fucking hand drawn games. The fact that I can't even the handhelds are moving to 3d sucks.
>>319825468
More like born after '90
>>319824517
ASCII in DF is atrocious. It works in roguelikes where there's plenty of empty space and characters are only used to clearly define what needs to be defined on screen, which is typically comprised of a small number of things which are easy to understand at a glance. DF fills literally every visible character space on screen with some bullshit, that alone making it inherently harder to decipher, but it's made worse by there being so many things in the game that virtually the entire character set is required and specific colors are needed to further differentiate between them.
Roguelikes use ASCII because that's what was most sensible to use at the time, and they were at least partially designed around the limited character set. DF doesn't effectively use ASCII for any reason other than making it resemble a roguelike, which is no different than indie games using faux-retro pixel art which fails to resemble actual retro graphics.
>>319825158
[d] > [d] > designate the location
whew that was hard
>>319824517
Yes, at least in regards to being clear enough that I can recognize what I am looking at, something many tilesets fail at.
Some level of graphical representation beyond a single letter has the benefit of allowing a much larger range of things to be easily recognizable at a glance. What is that [G] making it's way into my fort? The color helps me identify it but there are still a range of different things it can possibly be without observing it's behavior or stopping the game to see what it is. Replacing the letters of the most common objects and creatures with something unique speeds up the process of identifying what is currently going on without closer inspection or needing to make assumptions.
At the other end of the question, graphics don't matter much at all. Unlike the ascii/graphic set difference, whether I can see myself in the reflection of a puddle doesn't make a particuarly noticeable improvement to the overall experience.
>>319826842
DF is a roguelike
>>319824517
Sometimes.
really depends on how the game is trying to be immersive.
for most game, its very important.
>>319826842
Which is why [and thankfully] are tilesets. It's not that I can't play DF in vanilla, it's just that there's a point where if I mix up what a certain color is, well. It could very well mean game over
>>319824517
Yes.
If I don't understand what I am looking at I am not interested.
>>319824517
Graphics packs and therapist are enough for me. I can manage without dfhack.
Dorf fort really is a beautiful game in its own way.
>>319824517
Graphics was a mistake
>>319824517
Depends on the games focus. If it's not a very story driven and high quality writing game, I'd expect nice graphics to compensate.
>>319825468
This makes no sense. Graphics were being improved since day one. They wouldn't have been if no one cared. aka people always fucking cared and you are a complete retard, most likely the one born after '95.
can someone recommend a good df youtube channel or something where I can see an experienced df player build a fortress without being obnoxious
>>319824517
NoBut I still use a tilesetSpacefox is best. Fight me nerds
>>319828432
Spacefox is a graphics set.
>>319828432
Spacefox is nice. I like Obsidian too.
>>319828470
It's both but I'll concede the point to you. You win this round nerds
>>319828284
http://lparchive.org/Dwarf-Fortress-Boatmurdered/
http://lparchive.org/Dwarf-Fortress-Headshoots/
http://lparchive.org/Dwarf-Fortress-Syrupleaf/
Read in order
>>319825981
shit i would be happy to see a game looking like RE2 if it meant everything else got a massive boost in quality
We're talking about VIDEO games. Of course the graphics are important. Extremely important in fact because without the graphics, there wouldn't be a game, just input/output screen printouts.
Inevitably someone is going to cry "BUT MUH GAEMPLAY" like the retarded faggot they are. Newsflash folks, graphics are ALSO GAEMPLAY. The way the environment is created, how the character models are designed, how the simulation REACTS to your inputs is the POINT of playing video games.
None of this invalidates the roguelikes genre, despite what some people incorrectly assume. The massive complexity of stuff like ADOM or Nethack makes it impractical to implement complete 3D models for every single element which is why tilesets or ASCII are the best way to play them. However, if someone COULD practically develop high quality 3D models for everything in a roguelike that complemented all of the complex mechanics, then it would be massively improved.
>>319828284
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD1A3FE72C0DCAC66
This is how I learned to play. Nice, detailed enough to get you started but not overly long, nothing spergy or autistic.
It's about design. A game can look good with very simple graphics for example Warsow being years old, running on modified quake 2 engine with low poly models yet it looks and plays great. So no, but I do want my games to look nice, have decent fps and solid, responsive controls. (That said, I love me some dorfs as well.)
>>319826995
holy shit, that is so fucking hard
nerd
>>319824517
I think dwarf fortress has better graphics than many games. It's nice to look at and effective at the same time. When people say "graphics" today they actually mean resolution or polygon count. Good graphics to me are graphics that are nice to look at and doing their job in being useful in their context - something Dwarf fortress excels at. It simultaneously gives you the opportunity to paint a detailed, colorful picture in your head from all the symbols and text, instead of getting it served on a plate that will never be able to meet the same expectations.
I like good graphics. I like it when a game does a good job of conveying variables and game states through imagery.
Now if you ask me if I like PRETTY graphics, I'll just say I don't care.
>>319824517
Test
yes. i could even handle small ugly sprites, but ascii characters? that's just taking it too far.
but i'll probably try minecraft one day. i hear there's modpacks that improve things.
>>319825468
I bet you're born in 1994 and always complain about millennials.
>>319824517
How did this made?
And why there is fog of war?
>>319824517
graphics are like tits
there are retards who judge them purely by their size
then there are people who judge them by deeper qualities, like perkiness or general appearance
dorf fort is soft tits
>>319828819
I don't think he wants to learn to play, he just wants to see someone absolutely destroy the game.
It's like when you read an AAR of a Nethack playthrough from an experienced player.
>>319824517
pleasing aesthetic > stable, high framerate (options to lower for cinematicfags) > graphics
we forgave developers in the past because technology wasn't that great. now there's very little excuse to make a good looking game with a great framerate.
>>319824586
>>319825158
It's this for me.
>>319824517
I wish I was autistic enough to be able to play dorf fort
I just end up getting bored of it too quickly for fun stuff to happen.
>>319829541
Because you're about to go to war.
>>319828338
>maybe if it was open source, someone else could fix it
>implying this isn't fucking right
>>319829940
nice meme
>>319828284
>>319829702
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=139393.0
Here is a story of a guy playing on a haunted glacier volcano and doing remarkably well
>>319828432
kek
had me chuckling pretty good actually
![NetHack_3.4.3_ASCII_capture_ecran[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/FSP6Dfv.png "NetHack_3.4.3_ASCII_capture_ecran[1].png")
>>319829068
Dwarf Fortress is not nice to look at nor is its use of ASCII contextually useful. If I looked at OP's image without knowing anything about the game, I'd think that's a big castle full of gems. Workshops are all just a mess of arbitrary symbols that are vaguely supposed to resemble furniture and tools, but they're nearly impossible to tell apart at a glance. Some rooms appear to be different colors, but there's no context for what that indicates. What do all the scattered symbols in the black background represent? Are those things I can dig up or just decoration? There are countless things that share the same character but have different colors, how am I supposed to interpret that?
Anybody can look at a screenshot of Nethack and tell what's going on. Deciphering a DF screenshot is just an exercise in eye strain for most people.
>>319829652
>then there are people who judge them by deeper qualities, like perkiness or general appearance
literally 99% of big breast lovers would prefer that they be as perky as possible you dense fuck.
>>319830023
It would definitely be a better game if fucking anyone else was making it.
>spent months on making dorfs capable of making music and poetry and shit
Screw fixing anything, I want more useless shit.
>>319830029
Should also note that the story includes a lot of gifs and visualizations
>>319824586
dwarf fortress really has the worst UI, there's no excuse for it
>mfw when the keys used to control the cursor or navigate menus change randomly on every screen
>>319830524
Toady isn't making a game. He's making a fantasy world simulator.
Music and poetry are just as useless as engravings and beards. Would you rather have taverns just full of people drinking booze and nothing else?
>>319829068
Easy there champ, I understand where you're coming from with the whole "paint your own picture" thing, but the game really is an eye sore. Especially if you have no clue what the tiles mean at all.
The last game I played that painted a good picture for me was Medieval 2, all that flavor text man, god damn. Also it's not like the game goes out of its way to show you what your generals are like, it's up to you and your brain to imagine them in their every day life.
>>319830524
Except that after every major release he spends a lot of time releasing rapid bugfixes for bugs new and old. The second patch of 42 is due tomorrow and fixes a bug that was reported 5 years ago.
Oh wait, you don't actually play DF.
>>319824517
No, it's more important that it has a consistent and well designed visual style.
The Consuming Shadow, for example, does not and it looks like crap.
>>319830524
Are you angry about sieges being bugged? They were fixed with .42.01 and now they are bigger than ever
>>319828231
They did. But theirs a key difference between then and now. Back then graphics improving wasn't at the cost of gameplay. Gameplay was going up alongside graphics.
Now it's one or the other. Because they are so complicated now you have to balance where resources are going to go... mostly because we jumped too fast. Had it been a more slow progression this might have not happened. But then it went apeshit since 6th gen and now we must sacrifice one for the other most of the time lest development cost a fortune and take forever.
This is the reason why in the 90s no one debated about gameplay or graphics because they went hand in hand with one another. Now you have too many games coming out with exceptional graphics vs abysmal gameplay. It happened very seldom before now its a fucking norm.
>>319831179
wrong there, my bad.
Why shouldn't it be?
Why the fuck does it always have to be about gameplay? Video games are a visual form of media as well.
You assholes would give any movie flack if it had SFX from the 80's in this day and age.
>>319833403
One is a visual medium, the other is an interactive medium.
