Is Baldur's Gate the best western RPG?
>>319782443
BG2 is one of the best
>>319782443
Nah.
It's okay, but not even close to the best.
>>319783525
where's pillars of eternity?
World of Warcraft is the best western RPG
you know why
>rtwp
>good
>>319783685
let me guess you consider garbage like planescape to be best
> what is dragon age inquisition
Fucking hipsters
>>319783525
Just wonder, why do so many people consider M&M6>M&M8?
>>319782443
well tell me a name of another game that perfectly balances good combat with rich, interactive world, deep roleplaying system and decent story together as bg2
protip:you cant
Baldur's Gate is just D&D for people with no friends desu
Diablo 2 and many others are far better
GO FOR THE EYES BOO, GO FOR THE EYES
>>319784652
because you were still in school when it game out?
>>319783525
First Witcher is a better RPG than second
People need to play the fucking co-op. The Durlag's Tower, it's something. I did it with my little brother, he almost got crazy.
>>319783525
Yes, BG2 is the best wRPG, from an overall perspective.
>>319785119
didn't MM8 have broken as shit dragon hirelings?
>>319782443
Fallout: New Vegas is
>>319785146
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8lLruVR2zQ
>>319785389
retard
>>319783525
how the fuck is diablo 1 in mid, have you not played it
>>319785092
It's a turd. Next question.
>>319783525
>all that old shit no one will ever play
I get why they're on there but literally who cares
>>319785552
brb need to spam leftclick in this little corridor
>>319785379
Sure, it also allowed one extra slot for party to make up lack of NPCs following. You start with only one character and recruit shitloads of adventurers as you play, leveling them up however you like. I like the ability to freely modify my party in the way 8 does it.
>>319785389
Agreed.
Will we ever go back to the Realms in a GOOD game?
How'd they make such a garbage setting seem so amazing?
Walk among them, these beasts that are less than you are. See their strength, see how easily you fall to their muscle and skill.
>>319785817
The setting itself is bland, generic garbage.
>>319785875
Did you even read what he said
>>319785552
I always felt I was one of the only people who preferred it and it's multi to the second game. With Dark Souls popularity though I'm not sure why it is when, so much of that game is more updated version of that. In terms of it's multiplayer.
>>319785615
whatever newfaglet
>>319785615
Its sad that I reflexively thought the guy was baiting based on the positioning of some of the games. But holy shit, for real, who actually played ALL of those games to compile such a chart? Esp since alot are probably just worse versions of one another.
>>319785654
>implying game play is different in two
>implying that's why diablo made the list at all
you are the type of gamer diablo 3 was made for
>>319783525
>tfw Nox will never have a sequel
>>319783525
>NWN
>low-tier
fucking triggered
otherwise, a pretty decent chart
>>319783525
>Storm of Zehir in low tier
It's LITERALLY on par with MotB but for entirely different reasons.
It's probably the best actual roleplaying you'll have out of all the NWN2 package.
>>319783525
Eye of the Beholder 2 should be moved up a tier
>>319786212
Everyone claims that both NWN games are mediocre campaign-wise. Honestly, I played through the first half of the OG campaign and it's fun but can be dull. NWN2 is a bit better, but the atmosphere isn't as good IMO.
Can someone clue me in on why Jade Empire is held in such low regard here?
Also does the Gog version of Darklands work well? I have wanted to play it for a while since J. Sawyer said it was his favorite game of all time.
>>319783525
Most of those are mediocre dungeon crawlers, not roleplaying games. Someone must have mixed up dungeons and dragons combat for actual roleplaying.
>>319786519
>NWN
>goat
Jesus christ nigga that original campaign was utter shit. First official module too. Hordes of Underdark and fan modules was only redeeming factors of this clustefuck.
>>319786519
>Call od Duty has more endings than most of the modern RPGs
What a time to be alive
>>319786519
jack off to your visual novels while I play Wizardry
>>319785126
Gothic 2 is definitely on par.
Although i must agree that BG2 is much more replayable with it's fuckhuge amount of classes and party variations
>>319786519
This to be honest family
>>319786519
>roleplaying experience
>Planescape -> At least you tried tier
This is so retarded it hurts anyone with a working brain.
New Vegas and Bloodlines are great games, but roleplaying-wise nowhere close to Torment or Arcanum
>>319785389
2glitchy4me
>>319786978
Funny thing is, while I consider BG2 a better game overall, bigger in scope and with grater replayability, I find the plot of the first BG way better (a devilish plot to turn nations one against another, the original idea of bhaalspawns, doppelganger infiltration of your home, etc.).
BG2's is like: dammit, got captured. Gotta chase big bad. Dammit, got captured again in the silliest way possible. Gotta chase big bad again...
What are someaccessibleWRPGs on PC? I've tried some of the older shit like Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale but I couldn't get into them.
>>319788196
I'm sorry I hurt your feelings, but giving the player 10 dialogue choices that only change a few lines of responding dialogue isn't good roleplaying material. In fact, any game that only affects the plot through dialogue choices is effectively a ham-stringed roleplaying game.
>>319788848
Skyrim
>>319788848
You could try Pillars. Not as good as oldschool, but decent enough I guess. Other than that there are like 3 nice shadowruns out there.
>>319783525
Holy Shit Wizardry VIII God Tier. And I thought I was the only one that liked this game!
>>319788848
>I couldn't get into them
git gud
>tfw no 4th edition Eberron video game
Why must god be so cruel to us all
>>319788753
I can see your point, although i enjoyed stories in both games. What BG2 really missed were the wilderness areas to fuck around. It felt great hiking around and discovering shit in BG1.
You realize your tier god games don't offer even that? To do a quest or not to do. Oh, and a solid 5% of said quests have, like, 2 different endigs, yo!!!11!!
But surely you already knew that. Either you are a troll or too retarded to listen to reason, so whatever
>>319788954
Damn nigga, I haven't seen this bait in ages. You take a vacation or something?
>>319788848
Pillars is decent, but it has flaws in its story and the gameplay is either love it or hate it.
>>319789346
Crap, this is for >>319788954
Is boo really a miniature giant space hamster?
>>319788753
>>319789270
I agree with both of these statements. I did like the backstory of Irenicus though, and how that led to the plot, as direct as it is once it starts.
I can see why the devs hands were tied for free-roaming in BG2, though of course I dislike it as well. It just wouldn't make sense for all these towns to exist, given the competency of the town guards, with monsters all over the place that are worthwhile foes to level 15ish parties.
You must gather your party before venturing forth
You must gather your party before venturing forth
You must gather your party before venturing forth
You must gather your party bef
You have been waylaid by enemies and must defend yourself
>>319789027
the best turn based blob combat ever
>>319789838
Well, although I kinda ridiculed a bit BG2 plot, it's really not bad. It's just that the MC assumes a more reactive role, opposed to BG1 where you unveil stuff and act on it.
On the other hand, BG2 does a lot of thing better. Like more depth to char interaction (know the backstory of those who you travel with, which is more that you get in BG1), or class-specific quests.
Tfw so old my school used to have role-playing story/adventure books that you read and rolled dice to choose which paragraph/outcome came next.
pic related, feels old man.
>>319789263
3.5 eberron was better, you shitheads let warforged have dragonsigns.
>>319790516
*marks
>>319786519
Hello RPGWatch.
5:0
>>319790516
My groups never really used dragonmarks, so I never noticed.
>>319782443
I think BG2 improved a lot on some aspects. But I actually didn't like ToB because except for continuation of romances (and they weren't too long), it didn't have any story to it or interesting non-fight related stuff. It was just like boss fights expansion pack.
Is there some fantasy-themed rpg similar to what fallout 1 and 2 was?
With more emphasis on survival, managing resources and the like?
I've had some goat experience back in the day on NWN roleplay servers with mods, but that does not exist now.
>>319791575
Arcanum and Age of Decadence comes to mind.
>>319789697
Yes
>>319791796
Thanks, played Arcanum, but it kinda only looks that way at first and you grow out of it (in game) too fast. Haven't tried AoD though, will be my next stop.
>>319792640
AoD is my personal GOTY, i think every fan of original Fallouts is gonna enjoy that.
There is also Lionheart, which even uses Fallout's SPECIAL system and is worth playing for the great city of Barcelona. Game turn into shit after that tho.
>>319783525
>Fallout 1 and 2
>God tier
>>319794243
fuck off underage
>>319786404
NWN has ton of fan made content. It's stupid to place a good game in low tier because of just main campaign.
>>319794337
Fuck off back to reddit. They like hipsters over there.
>>319794437
So does Skyrim, that doesn't mean it deserves higher spot.
>>319794521
>liking two of the most popular games of all time
>hipster
What?
>>319794521
meme harder please :^)
>>319794243
Fallout 4 is waaaay better.
Am I rite, gamerudes or am I rite?
>>319783525
Love Baldurs Gate 2, definitely better than the first one, even if the first one had more freedom. The second one had more fleshed out characters, story and game mechanics though.
And the final boss (In Shadows of amn) is a ton more charismatic and likeable than Sarevok
>>319785119
I think the most common argument is the story? Not sure.
What do you guys think of M&M X? I don't see it on the WRPG tier list but I recall most people like it. I do think it's a pretty good game.
Something I'd love to see in future M&M games would be more interaction with Hirelings. I felt like there was some potentially fun personalities in some of the hirelings in M&M X and I feel it's a shame you don't get to know them better.Also, what WRPGs lets you have monster companions?
>>319794585
It's not the same. You can build completely new game using game mechanics of basic nwn.
Skyrim mods are only about content quantity.
>>319785041
Planescape was by far the superior game.
>>319796214
You could do the same with Skyrim, nobody would do it only because it would take a shitton of time to make it look good, unlike NWN where nobody gives a fuck about graphics. NWN OC is atrocious and definitely worst work Bioware ever done. If you slapped only Hordes of the Underdark on that list, everything would be a-ok.
>>319785126
>good combat
>deep roleplaying system
Wait you're talking about baldur's gate?
>>319783525
The only ones I haven't played from God Tier are the Ultima games. Did they age well enough or are they not worth playing anymore?
Also kek @ Diablo II being god tier while Diablo 3's shit tier. From a sheer gameplay perspective Diablo 3's the best while from an atmosphere and story perspective Diablo 1 is the best.
>>319796431
I wouldn't say it's garbage, but it's definitely overrated.
>>319797334
Everytime it's mentioned, half of people in the thread shits relentlessly on it. I wouldn't say it's overrated.
>>319783525
>Fallout 1 & 2
>Top tier
In the trash it goes.
>>319794337
Your favorite games are shit SHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIT!!!
>>319796431
the only thing that planscape trash does better is story and dialogue minigame and that story is not even that good, everything else is better in bg2
oh well its probably better game for shit eaters like you
>>319799969
BG is literally walking from trash mob to trash mob until you reach the end boss. The combat isn't nearly as good as people like to claim, yet that's 95% of the game.
>>319786519
Where's Shadow the Hedgehog
In related news The Age of Decadence is winning the RPG popularity contest against meme game Undertale in general; that in the humble opinion of this reporter is well deserved. We can only hope that it will be victorous in the end.
>>319783525
>Jagged Alliance 2
Probably the best round-based shooter to be ever made. Well at least with 1.13.
>>319783525
>Diablo II
>RPG
>Diablo II
>good
>>319803486
>GGG marketers are waking up
>>319803664
I don't know what GGG is, but I've always hated Diablo II and clones of Diablo.
They're a fucking garbage genre that consists of endless clicking to grind for loot that lets you endlessly click to grind for better loot faster.
>>319782443
I consider the Baldur's Gate series one of the best RPGs simply because it's so well-rounded.
It involves decision making and role playing, exploration, excellent combat encounters which are in many regards still unsurpassed up to this day.
Also, it has a huge and literally epic scale. Many RPGs have the player start out as a demi-god and have him become a slightly more powerful demi-god at the end of the game where instead of one meteor he now summons four. In Baldur's Gate you start as a nobody and you end up as a god. There is a real sense of progression and they managed to have an epic level campaign that doesn't get boring and doesn't feel like a drag. Many games simply lack the scale, they're too short and too focussed to describe a comparable journey.
>>319788954
In general, I would agree with your sentiment but it take more than an adaptive plot to be an RPG.
The essence of RPGs is interactive storytelling but not just any kind of interactive storytelling. It is interactive storytelling where the player assumes the role of a character within the plot and is given the opportunity to interpret that role on his own.
Choices and an interactive plot alone don't make a game an RPG.
It takes choices that the player makes through the character he plays and choices that reflect upon that character so that the player can define said character's personality.
In that regard, Torment does a great job while Deus Ex is rather weak.
What Deus Ex did remarkably well was reactivity. New Vegas did so too. But in terms of role playing choices Deus Ex doesn't really give the player that much opportunity since too many decisions are forced upon him (e.g. joining Paul, leaving UNATCO, etc. - which originally was planned to be up to the player if I remember correctly but not realised out of time constraints).
>>319785146
Minsc annoyed the shit out of me. I really don't see why he's so popular.
>>319805651
Boo's influence.
>>319802448
>Look it up on GOG
>Low fantasy
>Low magic
>Post-apocalyptic
>"If you want to be a hero, this isn't the game for you."
I think I'll pass.
>>319783525
Honest question, why is Morrowind regarded by many as the best TES? Isn't it just an older Oblivion?
>>319785552
you cant run in that one...
I liked Icewind Dale more for it's sheer RPness and party building. Though i get why Baldur's Gate is more talked about since it had a stronger story
>>319782443
It might be good, but I never got very far in it because I just couldn't get over the Vancian magic system. I like playing casters, but I *hate* D&D wizards. NWN was only good for me because I could play a sorcerer.
>>319784301
In the trash.
>>319806342
You also had to click for every single attack instead of just holding the button down.
>>319796579
D3 is a fucking disgrace and D1 is hardly playable anymore even with great plot and atmosphere
>>319803773
>consists of endless clicking to that lets you endlessly click
so like every game ever?
>>319783525
I'd bump up one tier DA2 and Oblivion.
And bump down fucking Conquistador to Mid. Seriously fucking HOW is it High
>>319795416
Sorry for late reply, but I dunno. I think it's interesting and I might've enjoyed alot if I played it 10 years ago... but with the product we got now... I think it's ok. I'd rather they remake 4-8 with engine similar to X or something. Do have to give props for how the game handled exploration though.
>>319783525
>Might & Magic 6 not God Tier
opinion discarded
>>319806239
Oblivion was a dumbed down game set in a more generic world and plagued with game design fuck ups like retarded level scaling of loot and monsters
>>319782443
Contenders
Fallout 1 & 2
BG Series
Torment
Arcanum
Star Control 2
Morrowind
Personal choice would be Arcanum
>>319782443
I never understood the popularity of this retarded bald cunt.
Literally the most annoying character in gaming, on par with the Adoring Fan from Oblivion
>>319800649
How is Avernum series anyway?
where my nature of a man niggas at
>>319807164
take that back you edgy cunt
>>319807081
Guess it's time for me to try it. Anything I should know / do before so? Any mods or stuff of the sort?
>>319807081
>Skyrim
>No birthsigns
Technically it had them, they were just dumbed down and easily switchable.
>>319786514
i liked it, but it seemed simplified from their previous games. and the characters were a little bit weaker
>>319786519
Where would something like Mujura's Mask fit in here?
>>319807371
just patches and graphical enchantments
I don't know if this is still up to date but:
http://www.ornitocopter.net/morrowind-overhaul/
>>319807431
those shitty buff shrines?
>>319783525
>Low budget, flawed Gothic games any better than DA:O
KInda sad you gotta pretend to be a hipster oldfag so baddly, DA should be higher than a lot of games there for the combat alone, not even mentioning top production values and god tier music.
>>319807784
underage
>>319806181
Found the faggot
>but muy hero shit
Moral please fuck off.
>>319807784
DAO is mediocre to the bone
>>319782443
No.
>>319807990
nah bruv its pretty gud, 7/10 fo sho
>>319807990
it's redeeming quality is being a crpg
>>319807784
>DA:O
>good combat
what did he mean by this?
>>319782443
I have been looking for a fun WRPG or cRPG to play, but honestly I can't get into any. I tend to be really picky. In the past I have mostly liked action games like Nox, Diablo, Divinity, and Sacred but I am open to turn-based. I played through Fallout 1 and 2 and they are okay but not that amazing.
I really tend to be put off by party-based games. In Arcanum if you look any information up it is like "Oh, don't do this or this or this because you get this guy at some point and he has these skills." I looked into Ultima 6 and I got the same shit it felt like. Even in Fallout and games like Dungeon Siege or Original Sin I don't play with companions (summons and pets are usually as far as I bother). I also don't want to put 200 hours into a game unless it is amazing. So, what do I do?
>>319807953
>defending, hey /v/ do i fit in yet? Flawed shit tier taste.
That list is utter garbage and a waste of time, some of the "top" games are unplayable by today standards and likely to turn away from even wanting to try getting into the genre, "great" tier is also filled with mediocre and games that barely count as "rpg" like the witcher 2, that list is nothing but "look how unpopular my opinion is" and should never leave this containment board if you don't expect to be laughed at.
>>319808413
you have shit taste, live with it while i enjoy muh games
>>319808413
not at all unplayable, just different from what many younger people are used to today
like old movies and old books, they're just as enjoyable but you have to get into the right mode for it. if you watch a movie from the 50s and except Avengers or whatever, you're going to be disappointed. same with these games really
>>319807990
How?
>Decent story with interesting characters
>Good combat
>great visuals and music
Porbably you are one of those "Bioware are SJW" faggotlords as well.
>>319808340
Play Arcanum blind, you're missing out
>>319808413
chill out Gaider, at least you made Ascension
>>319782443
It's the best game ever made.
>>319807081
Reminder that Morrowind is shit too, the entire Elder Scrolls series is mediocre or even downright garbage.
>>319805651
Because he has a fucking space hamster.
>>319808742
>Decent story with interesting characters
>Good combat
>great visuals and music
>DA:O
>>319808712
True classics don't age baddly.
>>319806873
That'd be nice but I'm not sure if they can capture the charm of those games again. It'd mean getting 3d enemies and I feel like it'd feel a lot less charming due to our nostalgia for the old games.
That reminds me that I still need to actually bea M&M VII, but I feel a bit bad about cheesing it in the start when I made a new game recently by abusing a glitch with load and save after killing the dragon on the starter island.
I fell into the temptation of getting tons of artifacts, which I shouldn't have, so I probably will start over and do it without cheating.
Although I will still cheese the fuck out of the dragon to kill him by strafing around and spamming arrows and magic.
>>319808742
>how is it mediocre?
>Decent story
>Good combat
you answered it yourself but: it's mediocre because BG2 is ten times better in nearly every regard and came out ten years earlier
>>319809037
wrong and wrong
>>319808887
You N'Wah!
>>319809005
>I didn't play the game because /v/ told me not to!
Worse kind of retard. Circlejerk more.
>>319809037
they absolutely do if you expect something by modern standards
you could argue that shakespeare is "literally unreadable garbage" because it doesn't read like modern prose. but if you read it with different eyes, it's breddy good
edgy newfaget underage is strong in here
>>319809320
the combat in DA:O is trash though. Literally just a clunkier version of WoW's with pausing
>>319809320
>>319809320
I'm not even trolling I honestly think banning people like you on sight just for having tremendous shit taste and spreading blatant misinformation would make the board a way better place.
>>319809516
Fuck DA:I though.
>>319808340
For an action RPG, try Torchlight if you haven't already.
For something more complex, you might like Neverwinter Nights. It's not as party-based as Baldur's Gate. You can have companions, but they're mostly AI-controlled and you don't have to micromanage them. There are also a ton of fan-made modules available.
>>319782443
>Vampire the Masquerade
>God tier
In what universe?
>>319809320
>story is literally an ancient evil awakens, fight those faceless enemies until you win
>combat is 4-5 skills, even KotOR has more options
>looked dated the same day it released
>can't remember a single piece of music
>>319809763
are you done?
>>319783525
>Dark Sun
I really wish those games didn't come out during that awkward transitional period between SSI and IE generation of games. Both are absolutely great, but sadly hampered by technology of the time despite having great ambition.
>>319809489
>trying out DA:O
>enjoying it well enough
>Gf walks in
>"Oh em gheee it's like an offline Wow"
>Dropped it a week later maybe 30% through
eh
>>319809489
Because action "rpg" button mashing and spam quen combat from the witcher 2 is so much better.
That list is inconsistent. its not good taste, its hipster tier, non mainstream circlejerk.
>>319802448
>In related news The Age of Decadence is winning the RPG popularity contest against meme game Undertale in general
Not really. If anything Age of Decadence will got head-to-head against Underrail and we win no matter who comes out on top because they're both great games.
>>319810269
>Because action "rpg" button mashing and spam quen combat from the witcher 2 is so much better.
Why yes, yes it is.
>>319783525
I could take issue with a lot of things in this list, but at least you got BAK and U7 in god tier.
Shakespeare doesn't even read like "old prose".
>>319810410
No its not. Its clearly because this nostalgia shitters are so biased to Bioware, they willing to eat shit as long is not related to anything highly popular.
>>319810487
book technology didn't change last time I heard
>>319810695
>Witcher 2 is highly popular
>Dragon Age isn't
Oh yeah sure, whatever you say man.
>>319783525
ITT: nostalgia googles.
>>319800573
I was loving Betrayal at Krondor until I was stupid enough to check out the book series it was based on and it just killed the whole thing for me.
>>319810410
>>319810695
clunky hotbar cooldown fests are bad and boring
button mashing is bad but at least almost fun
>>319810435
let me guess
>hurrr D2 RPG at all
>Buggerfall was better
>BG2 casual fest
>>319810367
I'm talking about the indieDB contest, Underrail is not there.I agree we all win
>>319810269
DA:O's tactical combat is nothing to write home about, and the game itself is pretty marginal. It's okay. Easily the best in a bad series.
That list is OK. Just criticizing the top tier, there are a few games that clearly don't belong. Wizardry 8 is not a good game, for instance, and and Shattered Lands is cool but really doesn't belong in god tier.
But on the flip side, seeing legitimate top shelf classic RPGs like Krondor, U7 and World of Xeen being appreciated by younger people is pretty chill.
Also, probably showing my age here, but where the fuck is Starflight on this list?
>>319782443
I prefer champions of norrath
hands down the best thing to ever have the everquest name attached to it
>>319811413
>Wizardry 8 is not a good game
>>319807663
Cool. Will try. Wonder if I can pull of my usual Breton Conjurer
Anyone have that image about "character progression games" vs true RPGs?
>>319811657
sure you can
you start up as a prison ship hobo though
>>319811747
no but here
