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You are currently reading a thread in /v/ - Video Games
You are currently reading a thread in /v/ - Video Games
I'm a senior gameplay designer working on a cool title coming out in 2016. We want a fast paced combat like Bloodborne, but better.
Therefore, I need you to improve Bloodborne's combat.
That's pretty fucking stupid.
>>319684739
Launching attacks and air attacks
>>319684739
Magical girl transformations.
>>319684980
Launching attacks?
>>319684739
Use dragons dogma style combat instead.
>>319685306
You're clearly no senior gameplay designer. I bet you're working on a indie game.
Make the Old Hunter Bone disagree the default dodge.
>>319685306
Thread over, everyone go home.
>>319684980
He said "impove".
>>319684739
>fast paced combat like Bloodborne
the fuck am I reading that shit is slower than frozen shit.
Also if you want to improve that garbage, start by removing shockwave and make collision accurate to the models so you can actually sidestep shitty phoned attacks without rolling like a retard
>>319684739
Get rid of the stretchy hitboxes
>>319684739
>I need you to do my job for me
no
More Dinosaurs
>>319685215
> this, but keep the super dark tones of bloodborne
>>319685535
>>319685306
I was asking him to be more specific.
>>319685508
Our current prototype is similar to DD's combat without air attacks but we feel it still lacks depth.
>>319685535
It's not an indie game
>>319686269
Basically it still sucks dick like Witcher 3, I'm just fishing for ideas
If you were really working on a game I'd tell you to make sure you understand what makes it good rather than trying to tack on features, and I'd go on about tight, responsive controls and smart encounter and enemy design.
But since you're just a shit on the Internet - make each hit matter more by reducing enemy health pools a bit and consider bringing in a poise system like DaS has. There's not much you can do to improve it without changing what it is.
souls combat is good, everything feels pleasantly weighted, ai can use some imrovement, less scriped behavior, more human-animal like behavior, copse-doll dragging can use some improvement too
>>319686224
>magical girl transformation out of your own period blood
>blackened shadowy hands reach out to rip away your old clothes as the period blood coagulates into new garb
>>319684739
Better than bloodborne? Just copy it and port to PC.
Why base anything on souls/bb type combat? Even with BBs improvement to the battle system it's still slow and cumbersome.
Like other anons said, DD combat is what it needs to be closer to. Possibly even similar to Darksiders 2 or taking some inspiration from DMC4 Vergil
>>319686470
He's an indie dev, he doesn't have the funding to do something as deep and polished as Bloodborne, especially since he doesn't even have a year to make the game.
>>319686442
We do have a poise system in place with a pretty smart algorithm. We're just trying to be different in some ways and not copy the Souls style entirely like Nioh is doing right now
>>319686735
>BBs improvement to the battle system
jej
>>319686810
I wouldn't really say that Nioh is copying Souls, it doesn't look THAT similar. If you're as different from Souls as that is, then I think you're worried about nothing.
>>319684739
>improve Bloodborne's combat
More than 15fps during boss battles.
![56684d36d4[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/OJ5BRtw.jpg "56684d36d4[1].jpg")
>Doing some shitty designer his work
pls
>>319684739
>Therefore, I need you to improve Bloodborne's combat
Put back all the shit the devs took out or dumbed down, like the missing stats and equip slots or the hilariously forgiving stamina consumption and nigh-unpunishable R1 attacks and rolls you can spam all day.
>>319684739
Sure, how much will you pay me?
>>319684739
make pelvic thrusting the primary evasive mechanic
>>319684739
>Bloodborne
>fast paced combat
eat shit you tool
>>319688346
Autism
>>319686034
>I have not played the game: the post
>>319687140
How is that a good thing
>>319688346
It arguably is fast paced compared to the norm
>>319688937
kek
>>319686903
well on top of this basic combat system we also have abilities and classes, so that gives a bit more depth. but base combat is still the standard bait and dodge which is kind of shitty by my standards, so cooler mechanics are welcomed
>>319689426
we also have status effects, behaviors, and disables (like poise system), knockdowns, staggers, etc that kind of thing
>>319686034
There is no way you have actually played Bloodborne.
>>319684739
Associate gameplay designer here. Not senior yet, but if you asked me it would be to:
>Differentiate more between playstyles and make playstyles more balanced. Bloodtinge and skill builds feel too similar. Arcane builds are bad all around.
>In that vein I might try to incorporate movement a bit more into it. Having Skill / fast hitting builds increase speed (maybe length of dodge step or something) while Strength / slow hitting builds would increase durability.
There isn't a ton to do with it I don't think.There are balance issues (Skill gets bonus to viscerals, but is still just as good as strength for R1 spam) that could be addressed to improve it, but fundamentally it's a very good system.
I might say more improvements are possible in the enemy design than with the fundamental combat actions. Too many enemies are beaten by dashing into them. Too many punish you for dashing away. I'd try to balance that stuff more so that players have to vary their approach in a more meaningful way in more regular intervals.
>>319689858
>Arcane builds are bad all around.
lol wut? Especially with the DLC, they're the best build in the game.
>>319684739
what game is it?
>>319689975
>Being this unfamiliar with professional design.
Look at the the number of players that earn trophies on PSN. Less than half of the players that have played the game have ever made it to the end of the game.
Arcane builds -are- effective. I'm not denying that the stats are good at -supreme- end game builds. But 90% of your players are never going to see or care about that.
The point is that the majority of arcane build actions are, for the majority of the average player's time, the same as any other build. Throw a bloodgem that scales arcane into a weapon and spam R1.
When you're designing a combat system, you want each choice to be meaningful in terms of -feel-. Arcane should either rely on Hunter Tools much more for your "standard interaction with enemies", or the weapons that scale with Arcane should be available earlier in the game and should fundamentally feel different than Skill or Strength weapons. Like MLGS feels almost identical to Ludwigs. Laser beams differentiate it a bit, but the best example is the parasite. How different that is in feel from the rest of the weapons in the game should be the default. That sort of thing should be available in, say, Central Yharnam.
>>319690503
wish I could tell you, but that might reveal too much
Fuck off. Do your own work.
>>319690662
That's not a criticism of Arcane at all, that's the same criticism that everybody makes of the game that builds are streamlined and too similar. And it's clearly not what you were saying, you called Skill/Bloodtinge too similar and then just said Arcane builds were "bad".
An actual parry and a faster heal animation.
What is the project working title and how big a budget do you have
>>319690910
Arcane builds are bad from a design point of view.
Skill and blood tinge are bad because almost every BT weapon is also a skill weapon. They're fast hitting, generally low stagger weapons.
Arcane is bad because it does literally -nothing- to differentiate itself from any other build until you've gone through at least one playthrough and all the chalice dungeons and DLC.
BT and Skill are at least different from Strength by supplying weapons that are fundamentally different. There aren't any dedicated Arcane main weapons, pre-dlc, so it's just whatever weapon you chose, only with different scaling and bad spells (Until 60 or 70+ Arcane stat).
Why are you being so defensive about a flaw in the game's design?
>>319691259
I'm not being defensive, you're just articulating yourself poorly. Arcane and Bloodtinge are both like that, they're secondary stats that don't have much utility until late in the game.
>>319684739
>cool
Your game will be shit because you're a faggot.
>i'm a senior gameplay designer and i somehow have full reign of the entire gameplay from combat to weapon systems, to crafting, to exploration, to how boss fights work and everything! and all surely for a big gaming company!
Yes of course, i'm sure you as a single person somehow have full control of all of this enough to make it exactly how you want it.
Worst case scenario this is all bullshit and you're making a dumb thread, best case you're only half full of shit and you're actually making some indie game, and if that's the case you could never make a game as good as bloodborne.
>>319691217
we're a pretty big team
>>319690895
i'm obviously doing my own work, but i can appreciate that gamers have genuine feedback on stuff they like or want to see improved. it's not like im building an entire system out of forum posts.
>>319691683
you'll see for yourself, soon™
This is mostly an animation thing and personal, but you should go with dashing instead of rolling if you haven't already
its cool as fuck while also being more believable then tumbling around.
>>319691594
No.
That's wrong.
There are BT scaling weapons in the main game, non-dlc, that function in a fundamentally different and interesting way than non-BT weapons.
>Chikage drains health for higher damage
>Reiterpallasch has a gun built in, that does way more damage because of BT scaling making a ranged fighting style actually viable.
These are important distinctions that make BT different than, say, strength. The problem is that they also scale so hard with Skill. They're fast hitting, low swing arc, low stability damage weapons. They feel like Skill weapons when they R1 spam. That's a problem.
Arcane?
What are the most popular Arcane weapons pre-DLC?
Ludwigs? Saw Cleaver?
These are just Quality weapons. Literally just quality weapons with different scaling. There is -nothing- different about an Arcane build until you're 70+ in that state and Call Beyond or the like end up doing meaningful damage.
Part of the problem is that the best tools, like hunter's bone, weapon buff, and beast roar have NO scaling and can be used at 15 Arcane. Meaning that -any- build can use them because of the low cost of entry. There is nothing that makes a 50 Arcane/15 Skill/15 Strength build -feel- any different than a 15 Arcane/50 Skill/ 15 Strength build.
I'm sorry if you don't understand the design concepts employed here, but try not to be so defensive about the subject. You'll learn something if you are more open.
Principal Gameplay Designer here
ask me anything.
>>319693353
What are your opinions on Obama weaponizing Boi Pucci?
>>319693341
>Chikage drains health for higher damage
That's just that weapons gimmick, it has nothing to do with it being a BT weapon. The Tonitrus also has a unique gimmick, and that's an Arcane weapon.
>Reiterpallasch has a gun built in, that does way more damage because of BT scaling making a ranged fighting style actually viable.
Except it's still not viable at all.
And Chikage and Reiterpallasch are both late game weapons, by the way. You've already got Hunter Tools by the time you get to them. BT is hardly different than Arcane early on, and ARC only becomes MORE different than everything as as the game progresses.
>There is nothing that makes a 50 Arcane/15 Skill/15 Strength build -feel- any different than a 15 Arcane/50 Skill/ 15 Strength build.
And you could make the same criticism of BT, it only affects the numbers once you have the stats to wield what you need. I'm plenty open to learning things, but what you're saying just doesn't make any sense.
>>319694067
>baka
If you're not willing to listen to and learn from someone that does this professionally, you might as well stop responding.
>Losing health and incorporating a firearm into your primary action tool kit are fundamental changes to how players view and feel about these weapons.
Arcane tools literally serve no purpose, as I've stated, until you're at 70+ arcane, a state very few players ever reach.
These are the flaws. You're willfully ignoring them.
If you have any actual questions, I'm willing to discuss them, but if you're just going to continue to be a child about it, then I won't continue to belabor a point to someone too petulant to learn.
>>319684739
Go play Godhand.
>>319694576
I'm totally willing to learn from a professional, but he has to be any good at his job. If you're going to say that Arcane is pointless until you're above 70 Arcane, then you're literally retarded and I have nothing to learn from you.
>>319694643
>Platshit
>>319694947
Can we all agree that vagina blood magical girl transformations would be a bonus?
The longer a boss battle goes, and as the AI reads the amount of heals you currently have, the AI will use different types of attacks.
For example, after seeing that the player has one healing item left, while HP is also down to half, the AI will not use any batshit crazy attacks that are very hard to dodge and defend from.
Also, the AI should know how long a battle has been going on and adjust its behavior. Its not to let players win easily, but to at least acknowledge players' efforts in trying to win. So the only way a player would lose is due to a fault that can't be blamed on the AI or gameplay system, but only on him/her self.
>>319685215
Fuck you, anon. Shit taste.
>>319696226
>please let me cheese bosses
haha, holy fuck thats the most causal shit I have ever read.
>>319696734
Only because you haven't fought the Orphan of Kos and Laurence at NG++++ and further.
Both of them go
>SLAM SLAM SLAM JUMP WHACK WHACK WHACK SQUEEEEAL REEEEEE, AND ATTACK WITH 1KM NEEDLE ACCURACY RANGE ATTACKS.
You should try experiencing the Orphan air strikes.I beat them though.
I mean, imagine if you fought Orphan and he just kept on spamming his two hit dual wielded combo into napalm strike, over and over again. That shit is no fun because it has no openings to attack. I had to wait for him to stop sperging out just to get a hit in. Because he takes 39 vit away on a successful hit at the player.
>>319684739
A jump button and jumping attacks with air combos, think a lite version of Devil May cry
>>319697201
> I beat them though
Then they weren't too hard.
>>319697857
He asked for ways to improve it, not ruin literally everything that makes it good.
>>319693341Reiterpallasch doesn't gain very much damage out of high BLT. It actually gets most of its gun damage through tempering gems.
>>319684739
Two dodges in a row
>>319698431But those are main weapon gems that can't be put into off hand guns. That means that the whole functionality of a main hand shooting bullets IS what permits that to be applicable. It's a fundamentally different experience based on putting points in BT.
>>319684739
You would know not to ask such vague questions without giving a proper context as to what your game is like if you were actually working on one.
Within the context of Bloodborne, though, I'd make the vials take longer to use and maybe build up some frenzy-like effect so you can't use too many in a row.
Focus most on what you do in the game the most. So many designers make an art piece instead of a game. Make the core gameplay (sounds like combat is) more of a draw than comparable titles. What this boils down to is adding even a single layer of depth, such as weapon arts coming to das3. Someone mentioned launchers and juggling earlier, DMC has good active "go up" combat.
>>319684739
bigger butts!
>>319697857
we're considering air attacks but need to stay in character. maybe only add them to one class
>>319685215
How can a little girl menstruate?
