An Objectively Correct Tier List
>>318083337
This is the averaged list Reddit made of all the pro players' tier list, right?
>Shulk not bottom 5
>Charizard in bottom 10
That's all.
>>318083708
It is, yeah.
The Mii Fighter positions are retarded because no-one plays with them or if they do they do it with dumb rules
otherwise it's obviously pretty good, but it's weird how low people put Samus even though she's been getting more results than a lot of shitters in the tier above
What makes Ryu so powerful?
>>318084068
UPTILT
INTO
DP
>>318084068
Technical inputs
>>318083337
Why the fuck is Metaknight suddenly good/decent?
>>318083337
get mad every time i see sheik at the top of the tier list
>played with my friends in smash since melee
>suddenly in sm4sh no one wants to play with items on
>suddenly everyones a tierfag
>>318084304
To be fair, the items in Sm4sh are chaotic to an absurdly unreasonable degree.
>>318084379
Then turn off the retarded ones and just keep the ones that were only in the previous games. Not hard to do.
>>318084201
Consistent buffs over multiple patches and a guy did well with him in a recent tournament.
Miis using MLG ruleset, unordered within tiers.
>>318084618
He didn't really have any big buffs over the patches, not any that I recall.
>>318084687
He got damage buffs on almost every move, his damage output was pathetic on 1.0.
>>318083949
Pretty straightforward, just use 1-1-1-1 Miis that resemble the defaults.
Just for comparison, here is a tier list with ESAM not being ignored.
>>318083337
>meta knight high up
I haven't been paying much attention to updates, did he get massive buffs or did people figure out what his deal is?
Why does every tier list put DDD low? He's at least a B-
>>318084990
What? But that's what makes them awful and unplayed in the first place
>>318085135
this isn't a FG tier list senpai
>>318085135
As a DDD main, shit framedata. Plus, everyone gets discouraged by the fact that half his specials are useless, and the other half can be used against you.
B tier is the MAX he can possibly be, but he has to be at least D.
>>318085113
>>318085113
People realized he could 0-death the entire cast off his 7f safe-on-shield dash attack.
They also realized his F-smash is absolutely busted.
He's just generally a decent, B-tier fast character who jut happens to have ToD combos off the best pieces of his kit.
>>318083337
I Will still only play Gannon.
only thing that's fun for me.
>>318083337
Young Link is not in the same tier as Link.
So tournies aren't allowing custom moves?
>>318084990
That's the problem. Brawlers up b with the billion kicks has got to be the best fucking kill move in the game.
I can't wait until they nerf the only good characters like Sheik and Pikachu and the game turns into a slow, floaty, spacey ResidentSleeper-fest.
>>318083337
>Objectively
This really needs to get added to the word filter.
Who /lowtierhero/ here?
>>318085435
How the fuck is playing a slow piece of shit that can't combo, and relies on throwing out laggy power moves to KO opponents fun?
>>318083337
Little mac is 'SSSSSS' honestly. His launch rate is fucking insane and not to mention his ko, his up tilt. 2nd fastest running speed etc. I just broke this thread.
>>318084068
His Will of Fire and Indomitable Spirit~!!!
>>318083337
>>318084650
>>318085003
>diddy that low
he's better than mario and pikachu imo
>>318086165
>Duck Hunt
>second to lowest tier
yeah, okay
this is a real mess
Is this accurate?
>>318086363
I said it's unordered within tiers, Diddy is better than Mario & maybe Pikachu too though it's arguable.
>>318086990
Demokuck confirmed.
God I fucking hate Rosalina. I don't mind fighting any character, good or bad, except for her. She just ruins any fun.
>>318083337
Absolutely retarder list
>Fox higher than Diddy
>Peach higher than Luigi
>DK higher than Bowser
>Marth higher than Shulk
It's fucking random. top kek
>>318086739
>>318086363
>Diddy better than Mario and Pikachu
maybe a year ago
>Posting irrelevant tier lists.
>>318087043
What?
>>318087142
>Wendy
>E
>>318084570
>wanting rng which takes control away from a player in a real time pvp game
this is why we can't have nice things
>>318086470
Duck hunt is borderline one dimensional. He has an option for every situation, but he is not flexible like other characters. He has gunmen for long range, disks for mid, and cans for setups. At close range, he can roll away, or try to bait and punish with a tilt or smash. His combos are short and uninteresting, and he gets little reward from it. He has no character specific tech, unless you call explosive can setups tech (which they aren't).
Duck hunt overall is a fairly bland character that cannot be given anything other than a middling rating when it comes to difficulty of optimization.
Also, he is not second to lowest. He is third.
>>318087487
I don't know, there's a fuckton to learn for Duck Hunt, in particular angles that your attack make the can go and the use of B moves in general - he's definitely not below characters like Diddy (who mainly was so overused not just because he was strong, but because he's a purely fundamentals character and had great rewards for that). And then you have characters here like Ike who get incredibly technical for actual high level play and characters like Metaknight who are actually very flowcharty (in SSB4 he's dash attack: the character) and your chart makes no sense to me at all.
>>318087821
Duck Hunt has some things, but angles is something that every character has. Angles and trajectories come into play for combo characters more than anything, and Duck Hunt is not even close to a combo character. Beyond some fancy can moves, Duck Hunt doesn't have much going for him.
Ike is not a technical character at all. He swings huge disjointed hitboxes in order to space or punish. He only has 2 part combos, outside of a footstool thing that isn't a true combo and relies on your opponent being a noob. Hoping for a hard read and spacing around with fair does not make for a technical character.
MK has a plethora of options in any given situation. His combos are mostly predetermined, unlike Sheik, but the fact that he has so many options makes him the opposite of flowchart. Also, spacing uairs to hit that up-b sweetspot while reactively adjusting for DI is not as easy as it seems.
>>318083337
>Kirby that low
Into the trash it goes. Best kirby in NY goes toe to toe with dabuz and vinnie, even beat vinnie even. Trash list.
>Its from reddit
I'm not surprised.
>>318088609
>Duck Hunt has some things, but angles is something that every character has. Angles and trajectories come into play for combo characters more than anything, and Duck Hunt is not even close to a combo character. Beyond some fancy can moves, Duck Hunt doesn't have much going for him.
What does this even mean? Your chart says "the difficulty of optimal high level play", which is pretty damn high for DHD - regardless of that he's a pretty shit character and even the high end users can't do much with him doesn't stop that.
>He is not a technical character at all. He swings huge disjointed hitboxes in order to space or punish. He only has 2 part combos, outside of a footstool thing that isn't a true combo and relies on your opponent being a noob.
I thought this thing was talking about high level play like it said, not low-tier Anther's and FG. Never mind. Seriously, do you even know what a perfect pivot is, and how much Ike has to cancel to be viable? Your Diddies and Sonics sure don't.
I just noticed Fox is all the way high up too, while the Marios are D and Luigi is E, what the hell (unless this was made before the last patch, in which case it's still weird but less so)?
>>318087380
I was never saying that you should use them in competitive play. I was just saying to turn off the completely ridiculous ones off if you're playing a casual match.
Even then, rng can be fun sometimes.
>>318085847
You'll take your final cutter and like it.
>>318088703
Kirby is garbage.
>>318090196
You're garbage. Lemme guess shiek main? Kirby can take out any of the top tiers on this list.
His only MU that is a problem is Rosalina.
Sonic and ROB are doable but expect a slow match.
Protip: Dont base characters worth in online modes scrub, kirby has the tourney numbers with RRR and Mikekirby.
>>318089559
>What does this even mean? Your chart says "the difficulty of optimal high level play", which is pretty damn high for DHD - regardless of that he's a pretty shit character and even the high end users can't do much with him doesn't stop that.
Because literally all he has that could be considered difficult in any way would be can setups, which is why he is not dead last (because, without the can, he would be). Even can setups can't compare to the more difficult characters. Yes, it's cool when you throw your opponent into a can, just like it's cool when link throws his opponent into bombs or combos off of them, but that does not make Duck Hunt some technical character. He's middle, at best.
>>318089559
>I thought this thing was talking about high level play like it said, not low-tier Anther's and FG. Never mind. Seriously, do you even know what a perfect pivot is, and how much Ike has to cancel to be viable? Your Diddies and Sonics sure don't.
Perfect Pivoting is something that every character has. Watch some of Ryo's vods. It's all about spacing with giant hitboxes and getting smash reads. Ryo doesn't have many combos or character specific tech. He only has universal tech (PP, canceling, etc). Literally every character has to PP to be optimal, even Zelda who relies heavily on PP jab, and especially Sheik who can extend all of her low% combo chains with PP ftilt / utilt.
>>318089559
>>318090504
>I just noticed Fox is all the way high up too
Fox is one of the more technical ones. The shit he can do with frame perfect PP utilt is crazy. Not to mention he's a fast zone-breaker which relies on combos and setups to score KOs. Go watch Larry Lurr, you need some of the fastest fingers in the game to play Fox at a high level. The only characters that beat him out in this department would be those like Sheik or Pikachu.
>>318090795
>you need some of the fastest fingers in the game to play Fox at a high level
mid-level melee fox play is still much more input intense than any sm4sh play
>>318091509
And Sheik in Smash 4 has longer and more diverse combos than Fox in Melee. Not to mention that it took Melee many years to develop to the point it's at now, and Smash 4 ha been out for barely 1 year. What's your point?
Also no, I'm not baiting, go check out some of the crazy shit Sheik can do now.
>>318091761
>Sheik in Smash 4 has longer and more diverse combos than Fox in Melee.
yeah fair->fair->fair->fair->fair->bouncing fish is such a technical and diverse combo.
I've seen quite a bit of sheik play, and it's still nowhere near as input-heavy, technical, and diverse as fox combos
>>318086165
>A.U.T.I.S.M
>AUTISM IS WHAT I AM
the post
>>318086165
>Sheik
>Non-linear play style
>Game understanding
Boy I almost took the bait
>>318087142
This is accurate.
Does anyone have some rare Jigglies?
>>318092979
Sheik has by far the most options at any point than any other character, the exact opposite of linear.
>>318092286
This isn't day 1 anymore. Sheik makes full use of all her moves during combos. Besides, fair strings don't even combo into BF, so your whole post is retarded.
>>318086165
>zelda
>no combos
no
>>318087142
>no zero suit samus anywhere
>>318095312
>Implying the Zero Suit is better than the Power Suit.
>>318084650
>DUCK HUNT THAT LOW
I love how everyone sleeps on his edge guards and crazy projectile game.
How the fuck do you people play this game after playing Melee?
I tried playing it today and I didn't know what the fuck I was doing. It's just completely different. I can't believe people actually believe that each smash game is the same but with more characters/stages/etc. It's completely off base.
Why doesn't Hackurai just borrow the physics from Melee? Both little kids and hardcore players enjoyed it equally. It's almost like Sakurai wants to completely detatch the game from the competitive scene on purpose, for whatever reason.
>>318095221
Very small combos, mostly only if your opponent DI's into them.
>>318095675
His edgeguards aren't bad but they're definitely not crazy.
Can is great but clay pigeon is easy as hell to react to.
He has the worst kill potential in the game & it really holds him back, he has to work so hard for a kill it's pathetic.
>>318086165
>Shulk
>Not S-tier
someone can't MALLC
>>318096316
>that AC meme again
>>318086165
>Characters I like: difficult to use, need masterful control and understanding of game mechanics to succeed
>Characters I don't like: braindead, easy characters for assholes
>>318083708
Spot the Shulk main
Fuck off faggot, shulk is mid tier
>>318097209
There is an objective reasoning for all of the character positions in that list. The people who don't agree can't come up with sound arguments, it's always random shitposting or statements with no actual point (like yours).
Feel free to debate any one of them though, anyone who does has been proven wrong so far.
