What does /v/ think about pixel art?
depends entirely on how it's done. saying that you hate pixel art is like saying that you hate guitars in music.
its cool but 3d can be good too if its styled right
3d is cheaper so i dont mind if games use it, if it means they will produce more content
>>285989694
essentially this
>>285989570
Doesn't capture the magic of past generations.
>>285989694
That isn't comparable at all. Its mote like saying you hate chiptune music.
>>285990035
No, chiptune is a genre.
Pixel art is just an art style.
Just like guitars are just an instrument.
>>285990190
>Pixel art is just an art style
And your point is? Most games only have one art style, just as most music only has one genre.
>>285990035
>Doesn't capture the magic of past generations.
What does that even mean? Can you elaborate a little more on that? I feel like you may be over generalizing things a bit.
I like it.
I wish modern studios with a sizable budget would make 1080p+ pixel art games. Sadly it's just not economically viable compared to 3D models.
>>285990190
No it's not??
Pixel art is, like, limitation. And you have to make your artstyle within that limitation.
Fantastic if it's done well. See: Shantae and the Pirate's Curse, Shovel Knight, Owlboy, anything by Konjak
>>285990561
>pixel art
>a limitation
>>285990561
It's only a limitation within console specs.
>>285989570
Absolutely no reason for it to exist anymore. All it is anymore is an excuse to put less effort into your art.
>>285990190
Pixel is a medium, not an artsyle
>>285990369
I don't think you fully appreciate the level of work that would go into something like that.
Just to show my point. The metal slug series is generally agreed to have some of the best pixel work in gaming. Here it is in it's native resolution.
>>285990708
>>285990841
Yeah, nice.
Now imagine it if it weren't pixelated.
>>285990906
Stuff like >>285990708
>less effort
Shut up.
>>285990923
I know, that's why I said it's not viable. It's not like making sprites got much easier in the last 20 years, and the required amount of effort is proportional to resolution.
>>285991028
Or if it had more frames, more colours, etc
But honestly, it may be limited, but the right artist can make it look very good. Making music with only a set of drums is more limited than by using a whole orchestra, but it can still sound good
>>285991084
Compared to an actual animation of similar quality? It is.
>>285991286
but it could be BETTER. That's the point. Yeah, it looks amazing already but just think about how better it could be.
I'm a huge fan of hand drawn game art that looks like a lot of love has gone into it. Dosn't have to be pixel, but a lot of time it is. Bravely Default had some really nice hand drawn art that I appreciated a lot.
You can tell when somebody used it because they love it as opposed to somebody just cashing in on the "retro" craze.
Likewise I am really hoping for a boom in low-poly high texture games. Something really appealing about it's simplicity and limitations to me.
>>285990906
What you posted: game that looks like a painting.
Pixel art: game that looks like a damn game.
>>285991472
I see your point, but art is not like engineering. You can use not-top-of-the-line means and get good results, where as in engineering you NEED the most reliable, precise and simply the best tools to get the job done, otherwise it's subpar.
Look at the dudes that make drawings in sand, some of them are fucking amazing although there are face better ways to make a drawing. Art is after all subjective. Hotline Miami is pixel art and it did its job as far as I'm concerned
holy shit i used that trip for shiposting and forgot to take it off, my apologies
Hooooooooly shit I'm at work trying to shit and the turd is made of STEEL
The only good pixelshit game is Cave Story. You cannot prove me wrong.
Everything else is decent or garbage.
>>285992469
ahem
>>285992612
Shovel Knight is decent, not good.
>>285990601
>anything by Konjak
That nigga needs to give us an update already.
>>285992880
>being this wrong
Here's another good one.
>>285993310
The work of one who consorts with beasts!
>>285992880
You're a fucking retard.
La Mulana?
Hotline Miami?
Risk of Rain?
All just decent eh?
>>285991028
It's its own unique style, making it non pixelated would kill it
>>285993310
Literally garbage on a plate.
There's no game that comes to how good Cave Story is, fag.
>>285989570
it is a good art style but it should not be used as an excuse to put out uninspired, half-assed "retro" looking games
>>285993503
It honestly sounds like you never even played a single "pixleshit" game in your live. You only say that Cave Story is the only good one to fit in on /v/.
>>285993409
Yiffe.
>>285992203
You can't be serious
>>285993497
Hotline Miami has the worst attempt at pixel art I've ever seen. I can't think of a single game that's uglier.
>>285989570
I did pixel art for my rpg maker projects/pokémon hack roms back then. It was like 9 years ago.
Tried it again recently, pic related
>>285993747
Except it is good, the only other game that I can think of that comes close to how good it was was Iji.
>>285993919
Like I said you're a fucking retard.
>>285990190
>No, chiptune is a genre.
Chiptune isn't actually a genre in the strict sense. You can make various genres (from dubstep to reggae) with chiptune.
In other words, a technique works if it's used properly. Shocking, eh?
>>285994114
But that was my first post in this thread.
>>285993926
Are you the guy who posted that back in August or something? I swear I remember seeing that before.
>>285993982
I never said Cave Story wasn't good, just that it's not the only indie game using pixel art that's good. If you honestly believe otherwise you come off as a complete sheep.
>>285994219
Probably, I'm here since late 2007.
>>285990906
Dragon's Crown looks like ass in motion.
All those tweening sprites. Bleh.
>>285994396
Well it looks damn nice, the effort put into it was great. You drew King great too.
>>285994183
Then you're a fucking retard as well.
>>285994570
Sony Trinitrons are what you really want.
>pixel art roguelike
>>285994616
Thanks m8. It was a pain in the ass to do, it's easier without the pixel limitations
>>285991556
Hipster shit
>>285992226
>>285992310
FUCK
YOU
traditional animation was here, pixel art is for losers
stop making this fucking thread, you've been doing it all day for 2 days
>>285995959
>pixel art is for losers
>posts pixel art
Great job, retard.
>>285995995
>stop making this fucking thread
Never.
>>285996573
EWJ was traditionally animated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fPl5PNiHkg
>>285996994
The final product is still pixel art. Doesn't matter how they made it.
>>285996994
>B-BUT MUH TRADITION
>>285990362
>>285989570
>>285991856
>>285992612
how do I learn and git gud in pixel art?
>>285993502
Exactly, it'd be like looking at at Van Gough and saying "It'd look better if it wasn't post-impressionist." Just because not everything is true to life doesn't make it any less beautiful
>>285997704
Amazing post.
>>285997748
Like with anything really. Just practise, practise, practise.
>>285994114
he's right you know
hotline miami is an amazing game, but the art is nothing good to look at
and it's okay, because it would be a worse game in any other style
>>285997748
it's just like anything else, ya got to practice it and find your own unique style later on
>>285997287
well then all pixel art is handdrawn.
>>285997748
Get good at art first.
Then move on to doing art with certain set of rules at low resolution.
>>285997748
So I can't speak to the quality of this guys guides or anything because I don't back kickstarters or patreons or whatever. However this dude does some good stuff from what I can tell and he does the pixel art for JonTrons videos. They might be worth checking out. Like I said though it could be shit I have no clue.
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/pixel-logic-a-visual-pixelart-guide
>>285998239
Well they are using their hands to make that pixel art.
>>285995679
Please elaborate.
>>285997287
It's not pixel art, it's literally a drawing on a piece of paper that was scanned into a computer.
>>285991028
>wow imagine if this painting was a photograph, wouldn't it look much more realistic like that?
>Imagine if this game had a more realistic artstyle instead of this cellshaded shit, wouldn't it be so much better
This is the stupidest excuse ITT. Pixel art is still a thing for the same reason low-poly models are still a thing for the same reason pointillism is still a thing. Thriving through limitations of a medium, whether self-imposed or not, is how good works are made.
Pixel art has gotten a bad name over the years for lazy indieshits using it as a copout for shitty, uninspired art/ games, but immediately disregarding it as a whole is fucking ludicrous; Good art can come in any medium, just not everyone can make good art
Only thing I dedicated myself to draw with symmetry and pixelated lines on ms paint.
I should draw more.
SM4SH Cast.
At its best, it can be infinitely more charming than even the best 3D models. However, too many indie and low-budget devs use it as a crutch, assuming that they can use the "retro" aesthetic as an excuse for mediocre art.
>>285998743
That's true of almost all sprites.
>>286001201
>>285991028
You're a fucking idiot dawg. The kind of guy who looks at a stippled drawing saying WOULDN'T THIS LOOK BETTER IF IT WERE DRAWN NORMALLY
No, it wouldn't. Pixel art is basically art where each pixel is placed on the piece purposely. That's what gives it such a sharp, beautiful look.
Y'all are talking about pixel art being objectively worse art-styles than hand-drawn stuff, like how 1080p images are superior to 720p images. But that's not true, they're just different styles.
>>285990906
>less effort
Something like Dragon's Crown probably takes less effort than 90s era sprites because of fewer limitations to work within. People who actually made sprites back in the 90s say that things are much easier now.
>>286002467
That post was about modern sprite work.
>>285991447
No, no it's not. Pixel Art animation is many times harder than traditional animation when they're at the same quality.
I don't get the point of pixel art. It apparently takes more effort and looks worse. What is added by making things pixellated?
>>285989570
It can be really really cool. Ever play Teleglitch? It's like the scariest game I have ever played.
>>286003319
>and looks worse
This is the rub, others think it looks good.
>>286003319
You can make it really tiny.
>>285989570
>that knight and snow crab
gib game
>>285998713
You don't want your games to all look photorealistic so you are a hipster.
>>286003393
I just don't see how making things obviously blocky makes it better.
>>286003456
That doesn't seem like a very big boon nowadays.
>>286003698
Okay, that's because it's an opinion. You don't have to like it.
>>285995113
>not liking Nuclear Throne
>Not liking Dungeon of the Endless
0/10
>>286003698
>That doesn't seem like a very big boon nowadays.
That's why it's just a style now. Pixel Art isn't necessary anymore. You either use it for the artistry, or to be a lazy game dev.
Can be great if done correctly
>>286003698
It has particular charm.
>>285996994
And it is still pixel art, I don't get your point. What do you idiots think pixel art is?
>>286003834
>Lazy
You know that it took about 7 months of work per character to animate characters in KoFXIII?
>>285998743
And then it was retouched on the computer, and it is now pixel art. How is this a hard concept for you to understand.
>>286003903
>>286003831
Fuck me I wish /v/ talked about this game more, I've started a couple threads about it but they all died on post 1.
It's so damn gorgeous and fun.
>>286003903
How is this game? I've been thinking about picking it up.
>>286004062
>Completely missing the point.
I'm not saying all Pixel Art is lazy, I'm just referencing modern "8-bit-style games"
>>286003698
It's not making things "blocky" but sharper and can be far more detailed, it's just that making big resolution pixel art it's very expensive
I like working with the limitations.
Also, stylistically, there are things much easier to achieve with pixels rather than with traditional/digital drawing. The limitations can have advantages in that regard.
>>285998743
>>286004129
Hey, guys. Did you know you can make PIxel Art using Blender 3D software now? Make of this what you will.
http://www.cgchannel.com/2015/02/this-free-blender-shader-turns-3d-models-into-pixel-art/
>>286003806
Why so defensive?
>>286003834
But if it takes more work like proponents of it seem to be saying, why is it the hallmark of a lazy game dev? Note, I have no idea which takes more effort.
>>286003987
But why? What's the charm of it? That they're small and hard to see images? The difference in color palette?
>>286004062
My guess would be those go in the artistry category.
>>286004258
You're going to have to explain that one. What about pixel art makes it more detailed?
>>285989570
is gud
I hope this ends up good.
>>286003108
So much this. When you are drawing you can easily fix the form if you know how to draw and make the animation flow how you want it to. With pixel art, every god damn pixel moves major masses so it's really hard to get the animation to flow the way you want it to.
Unless you are doing those indie shit "retro" games, animating something like megaman x while trying to capture the movement you would see in something like disney is really hard.
>>286004332
It's not defensive, what are you trying to do here man? It's just an opinion. You don't have to like pixel art, I'm just explaining why it's done. People like it.
would /v/ play a game with this sort of style?
>>286004309
what's talent anyways?
>>286003319
>more effort
It really depends on the things we're comparing. Art like Metal Slug or King of Fighters would definitely be way more effort than just making 3D models, but most games now don't even approach that level of mastery. The kind of art you see in your average indie game like Fez is pretty damn easy to do, provided you're already decent at art.
>>285989570
I like it
But 8-bit hipsters need to GTFO of the game market with their shillling and pretedning to be retro cuz that's the cool thing to do.
>>286004426
What this.
I hearing about a dark souls pixely game (had souls in the title actually, can't remember what it was), but it was top down, not a side scroller like this.
>>286004309
That looks like ass, just like how when they put 3d models into anime.
>>286004524
plz elaborate
Do you mean something like Limbo?
Or with that specific artstyle, Hindu(?) imagery and all? Because that sounds totally rad
>>286004524
I think two games like this already exist. Maybe three. One with weird blobs and one with spartans or something.
>>286004332
>But if it takes more work like proponents of it seem to be saying, why is it the hallmark of a lazy game dev? Note, I have no idea which takes more effort.
It only takes more effort if the pixel art is the same quality as high quality sprites. What modern devs do is use what they call "8-bit sprites" that mimic really old games. They use the "retro look" excuse to use very basic and uninspired pixel art.
>>286004309
I've been experimenting with this method, myself.
http://danfessler.com/blog/hd-index-painting-in-photoshop
It works pretty well. Pic related.
>>286004516
I'm asking why to understand the draw. Your post just said people like it and that no ones forcing me. Needlessly defensive and completely unhelpful.
>>286004598
So its easier to make art that doesn't look like utter shit with minimal effort with pixel, but to make the high quality pixel art takes much more time? So pixel art's time to quality graph would be kind of an inverse of regular art?
>>286004848
And adding on to that, the minimal effort pixel art hides behind the retro aesthetic to excuse the laziness? That about right?
>>286004730
looks more african influenced, but i agree it looks really cool
>>286004982
I don't think there's a way to explain the aesthetic to you in a way that you'll appreciate it. You either like it or you don't. That's not defensive, it's honest.
>>286004982
>And adding on to that, the minimal effort pixel art hides behind the retro aesthetic to excuse the laziness? That about right?
Yeah, that's what I'm saying. I'm not talking about all pixel games, obviously. Shovel Knight was true to its choice in aesthetics, and I commend them for their work. Same with a few other retro looking games.
>>286004163
Pretty damn good, great variety in characters, tower defense part is pretty basic but the locations are awesome and detailed.
>>286004524
Like this?
>>286004332
>But why? What's the charm of it?
Sometimes just the fact you can it look nice or similar to characters/things with minimal amount of pixels.
>>286004871
are you dan?
>>286004871
>That spoiler
THIS IS DELICIOUS.jpg
>>286004382
those are rixels
just like
>>286004426
The animations are not done by hand and look kinda cheap.
>>286003474
is this a game or not /v/ dont hold out on me now
>>286005439
I always thought metal slug used Tweening.
Most modern pixel art also does the animation by hand. Almost no one uses a mouse anymore.
>>286005159
That sounds like the lazy response to it. Its perfectly possible to explain, it just requires thought and reflection. Other people in this very thread are doing it.
>>286005172
Makes sense.
>>286005265
I can kind of get that. The smallest amount of art necessary to convey an image. But that doesn't seem to cover the more detailed pixel art like
>>285990362
>>286004382
>>286005371
No, I am not. I'm some pleb who pirated CS6 to try this out.
>>286005386Someday I want to make a gritty side-scrolling RTS game involving WW1 style combat, so I'm working on sprites for it. Glad you like it!
>>286005202
yeah, dark silhouettes on colorful backgrounds.
>>286005628
>side-scrolling RTS
how does that even work? cs6 huh. I really need to learn a lot of shit.
>>286005559
>But that doesn't seem to cover the more detailed pixel art like
That's really just appreciating the aesthetic. Pixelation has existed longer than Pixel art has, and was appreciated as an art form long before computers, as people just enjoyed the aesthetics created by blending thousands of small dots together to create a larger image. Pixel Art is the same, in that it's simply a medium used to create visually pleasing pieces. It's really just an acquired taste, the blocky appearance of the pixels appeals to a lot of us, and the art created in low and high resolutions with it is attractive.
>>286005747
Imagine Metal Slug, but instead of being the guy slaughtering all the goons, you're the one pushing the cannon fodder around.
>>286005747
Grimgrimoire is a side scrolling rts.
>>286006001
>as people just enjoyed the aesthetics created by blending thousands of small dots together to create a larger image
So a kind of modern, digital evolution of Pointillism? My only issue with that is that the inherent size limitations of pixel art seems counterproductive to that form of appreciation.
>Used to sprite a bunch in high school
>Made friends with a professional who helped me improve through strict teaching
>made me want to go into gamedev
>drive for spriting disappeared after one semester of college
Fuck I haven't made anything new in two years. This is probably one of the last things I remember making. Why does college just suck the life out of everything I do?
>>286006076
So something like Cartoon Wars/Arel Wars? Or Castle Fight from Warcraft 3? I'm not sure if the exact genre definition exists for those, some call it tug of war I think.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdJ-OR_HwmY
>>286004426
What game is this?
>>286006532
for some its going from doing something for yourself to doing it for a grade. It isntfunanymore because your expected to meet a certain standard, instead of improve yourself for yourself. If you really do enjoy it/miss it, try picking it back up, maybe ull find that you still enjoy it
>>286006532
I used to love spriting since middle school. But I discovered a very unwelcoming spriting forum that killed my love for sprites. It was pretty sad.
>>286006449
What inherent size limitations?
>wake up
>check /v/
>a thread with my pixels as OP
Weird.
>>286007062
Oh no, I wasn't doing it for classes, College just killed any energy I had for anything.
>>286007270
The ones that have been discussed in this thread. That the amount of effort required of high quality pixel art inherently kills the possibility of creating large resolution art.
See
>>285990923
>>286006449
I wouldn't totally call Pixel Art the evolution of Pointillism. In a way it is, but it would require the art to be a very specific size. The thing about Pixel Art is that it is in part a celebration of limitation. Pixel artists often employ rules unto themselves to create Pixel Art using a small number of colors, or small resolutions. That said, Pixel art is still a medium, and doesn't really require those limitations to exist. That's why large pieces like Elk's Deathwing are considered Pixel Art, despite being so highly detailed to the point it borderline doesn't look Pixelated. In this case though, it's really hard to say why anyone would choose to use Pixel Art to draw it. The most likely thing, is that the artist wanted to create something massive with only a few colors. Elk in this piece uses only 64 colors total.
>want to start pixel art
>you need to be able to draw to jump into
Well..
>>286007693
Rev up that Loomis.
>>285989570
I was in this thread yesterday, I posted the Waluigi sprite. Here's Melee's BF that I'll finish one day.
>>286007693
You can start by editing sprites
>>286007693
Just draw the fucking owl.
>>286007614
>The thing about Pixel Art is that it is in part a celebration of limitation. Pixel artists often employ rules unto themselves to create Pixel Art using a small number of colors, or small resolutions
So part of the appreciation of pixel art is in the appreciation of the work of the artist, not necessarily wholly the finished product? Knowing that they accomplished the image with those restrictions in mind?
>>286004426
>>286004643
>>286006920
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_PTjN5t9XQ
Death's Gambit
It literally looks like 2D souls.
>>286007531
There's nothing inherent about that. Would it be crazy and take a long time to make a really big piece with pixel art? It certainly would, but there's nothing that stops it from being possible or from being pixel art, as long as the attention to the detail is at a pixel level.
>>286008121
I guess I'm retarded because every drawing tutorial or book that I try to read is basically the owl all over again.
>>286008145
It would depend on whether the individual appreciates the aesthetic, or the work. Personally, I don't think art should be appreciated for the method, and enjoy pixel art simply for its aesthetic. Sometimes though that is the case, and it's very possible Pixel Art is appreciated as much for the method as the finished product.
>>286008424
That looks fucking cool
>>286008450
>Would it be crazy and take a long time to make a really big piece with pixel art? It certainly would
Then pixel art is inherently difficult to scale. I don't see what hair you're trying to split here.
>>286008668
>Personally, I don't think art should be appreciated for the method, and enjoy pixel art simply for its aesthetic
How do you feel about >>286007614 then? It would strike me that you would not be a particular fan, at least not for its pixel aspects. It lacks the aesthetic more than most and the effort does not impact you.
>>286008632
Read Loomis.
>>286007693
You really don't. The big difference is that you don't need to know how to draw good lines in pixel art, but you need to know how, for example, make a smooth curve at a pixel level. The other concepts, such as shading and colors, are mostly shared between any visual medium, even if there are some exclusive quirks for each of them (such as dithering for pixel art).
>>286004524
Makes me think of Apotheon but with blue.
>>286007693
Coloring and shading are probably the most important point of pixel art, since you have to be sure that everything is distinct, even at a small size.
>>286009104
>How do you feel about...
You're completely right. I show that image often to display either the effort given, or the resolution flexibility. But, aesthetically, it doesn't appeal to me. As much as I can appreciate the effort, I think it would have been a much better idea to just paint it regularly.
>>285989694
I hate people who just learned how to string together the most basic in a mildly rythmic fashion and impress people with it.
>>286008424
>Moving stages that is a fucking giant
>Combat like castlevania with Souls flavour.
Hoping for Higher pixel art detail and 60 fps.
>MSpaint "pixel art"
>all this extremely detailed still image pixel art
Yeah that's cool and all but when you're making art for vidya it all comes down to animation. I'd be REALLY impressed if you could maintain that detail over a hundred frames of animation.
Slick animation can even save otherwise simplistic pixel art, like in pic related
It's probably traced from 3D isn't it
>>286009943I think it is. But this isn't.
>>285991028
while were at it, lets imagine its a photograph, or s still from a movie. In fact, let's disregard this video game thing all together.
>>285999160
Pretty good. Use something other than Paint though.
>>286010129
Gorgeous. Good pixel animation is delicious.
>>286010129
I would have loved a fire emblem with this kind of detail for attacks, but I have a feeling that this detail only comes from hobbyists nowadays.
>>286009943
I think so its rotoscoping since they just trace over real life motions capture in pictures. But Im not sure since there's no dev source interview anywhere since this game is criminally underrated
>>286003585
Would you like me to call you an autist?
I know you shitposters like it.
>>286009914
>That webm
>>286009914
I couldn't make it through that webm, too nerve wracking.
>>286009914
I love this Webm. The ending is funny.
>>286008632
Because drawfags are shitty teachers, most time they don't even know WHY they draw something like that. It's half intuitive.
Believe me, I am a drawfag.
Friend of mine made this when he was really interested in pixel art. Can you give any pointers about how to improve?
>>286011579
>friend of mine
>>286011579
Tell "him" not to use so much dithering in the shadows. Dithering's better for smoothening between similar colors, not for something as sharp as shading.
>>286011579
If you're going to mkae such a lazy animation you might as well not animate at all.
Whoever posted about Death gambit damn this game looks pretty cool.
>>286009104
I assumed you were thinking there was a point where pixel art stoped being pixel art, due to the sheer size of the picture.
While we're at that, I do think the pixel art you linked to, >>286007614 , retains some level of pixel aesthetics. The background is filled with anti-aliasing and could very well be done in a more traditional digital way and have the same look, but some parts of the dragon have pixel clusters and all that jazz that's part of the pixel art aesthetics.
>>286007221
What was its name?
>>286009943
>>286010360
To show how quirky these characters are we put a lot of effort into the animation. We spent time in making full body character models. What’s interesting is we made them in 3D first. Usually, people would use motion capture, but we didn’t want them to be super realistic so we didn’t go through the whole motion capture process. We made each of the 3D models by hand and hand animated to them. This gave them an element of quirkiness, weirdness, that bit of individual style. Once we had them in 3D we rendered them into the 2D sprites you’ve seen.
Read more at http://www.siliconera.com/2010/08/16/ghost-trick-director-explains-why-he-made-the-lead-character-a-ghost/#wdQFG6iW7dt5yJZZ.99
>>286009147
Would it be wise to read Loomis first then get into gesture drawing, or gesture drawing first and Loomis later on?
>>286015654
I think Loomis is a pretty great starting point, so the first option.
Gesture drawing is very important, but its main function within a detailed figure drawing is to remove the stiffness that naturally comes from drawing something complex.
Keep in mind, I'm very far from good at this, so it's probably better to ask /ic/ for a better answer to your question.
Since unreal engine 4 is free now i really hope someone is working on a low poly high texture game.
>>286008424
The moving stages with large bosses reminds me of a 2d shadow of the colossus
