http://www.techpowerup.com/223385/microsoft-xbox-scorpio-soc-powered-by-polaris-and-zen
>It looks like Microsoft will overpower Sony in the next round of the console wars, with a more powerful SoC
>The combined compute power is expected to be close to 10 TFLOP/s.
>The silicon muscle of this console should power 4K Ultra HD, 1080p @ 60 Hz HDR, and "good VR" solutions such as the Oculus Rift and HTC Vive.
>Xbox Scorpio
>significantly more powerful than Sony's next console
>full support for Oculus (Vive tbc)
>DirectX support between multiple systems making VR ports easy as sin
How can Sony even compete? Are we witnessing Microsoft bringing high quality VR and midrange pc gaming to the masses?
I'm actually going to admit it, MS have already won the refresh gen.
>>341260294
How have they won this? Why would you want to use the Scorpio for VR gaming when the full repertoire's through PC? The Xbox library will be available on Win10 PC as well, and if you want full VR library, you might as well as to buy a Win10 PC, install Steam and get your games that way.
Get Vive/Oculus Rift on PC instead of getting the Scorpio is far more logical.
>>341260756
It's not about me. It's about the average Joe that buys a console because all his friends have one.
This right here has the potential to be a massive success if they get their pricing right. The fact that they're aiming for a higher quality target than sony and their sony vr may prove to be the killer move here. We've already seen how something as simple as the ps4 having a higher native resolution can way sales massively in sonys favour. If MS get the pricing and marketing right by showing off "the most powerful VR console" we might already be looking at the dominant console come 2018.
>>341261380
Can sway*
but how much will it cost?
>>341261380
>It's about the average Joe
Avergae Joes never buy these small upgrades in mass and also won't be buying an expensive vr headset to go with it
>>341261504
500-700 USD by next E3
>>341261504
They didn't say, but if that shit is going to run stuff at legit 4k and 60fps it can't be below 800-900$ by next year, and I think I'm being quite generous.
>>341261504
Probably around the $400 range. It's using budget pc components from the new amd line up so even though it's impressive, it's still bottom of the line shit.
>>341261504
Scorpio is not going to be $400. Current estimate is closer to $600. You are asking a lot for a consumer to go and step up for the VR experience. Hopefully it's not that expensive.
>>341261620
You can buy it for the low price of [spoiler ]$999[/spoiler]
They finally have the best hardware again, just like with the original. It will even be better than a PC. Xbox is back boys.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfGdMfO8CEg
>>341261620
The option is there for them though. If I'm an average Joe and I'm looking for a console to play VR (because I don't know about pc gaming) I'll be looking at the PS neo or xbox scorpio. One is much weaker and is locked into a specific headset and the other is much more powerful and is compatible with multiple headsets. Ultimately though it's about the price. MS aren't stupid enough to sell it for like $300 more than a PS neo because it'll be worthless to little timmys mom who is a cheap bitch. I've been predicting for a long time that MS will take a hit in profits just to gain some market share over sony.
>>341260294
It's how the Sony cycle goes.
They did the PS2 and everyone loved it.
Then they did the PS3 and everyone loved their 360.
Then they did the PS4 and everyone loved it.
Then they'll do the PS5 and release it withTalladega Nights 2
>>341260294
>How can Sony even compete?
With exclusives. :^)
>>341262218
>The option is there for them though
they aren't going to take it, like always
> If I'm an average Joe and I'm looking for a console to play VR
they aren't, and they would be spending around $800 to get both which the average joe casual isn't going to care enough about video games to do
>>341261681
4K media (i.e blu-ray), not 4K gaming you cretin.
>Console kiddies actually believe they're getting 4K 60FPS
>>341262687
I thought that was the Xbone Slim
Scorpio is the actual upgrade
>>341262687
>source: my ass
Read the news again.
>>341261504
Probably expensive, but then again, Polaris GPUs are already cheap as shit on release.
Considering it won't be released for another 1.5 years, I wouldn't be suprised if it was in the 500 $, if not in the magical 400$ range.
The stats might sound impressive now, but they will be signifcantly less impressive at the time of release.
>>341261681
>>341262687
Now now, given that Xbox is just a win10 box, he can ask for such things. We can actually spec out a 1070 build easily at 700 dollar range.
>>341262687
Phil Spencer : "Because as we saw 4K gaming and really high-end VR taking off in the PC space, we wanted to be able to bring that to console. Project Scorpio is actually an Xbox One that can natively run games in 4K and is built with the hardware capabilities to support the high-end VR that you see happening in the PC space today... when it ships it will be the most powerful console ever built."
>>341262687
Phil explicitly stated Scorpio will display NATIVE 4K.
>>341262515
>they aren't going to take it, like always
We don't know that yet. This is the first major mid life refresh of a console.
>they aren't
You underestimate the potential of VR. There are a lot of companies pouring money into the VR scene because they know of the potential sucess. Two of the biggest companies on the plant, Sony and MS, won't be investing all this money into new "VR capable" consoles if they think no one is going to buy it.
>>341260294
>believing this lie machine
Even if it was real it would have to be constructed from paper clips and chewing gum to not be $600.
Will the average console-buying public go for what is basically just gonna be a fancier, more power Xbone? After the PS4 has dominated this gen so adamantly?
There has to be some kind of draw. There's no draw for anyone with actual brains since all the games are on PC, but what draw is there for normies? THE POWER only gets you so far.
>>341262687
>>Console kiddies actually believe they're getting 4K 60FPS
They'll probably get 4K, but be stuck on 30 FPS and gimped graphics for the sake of resolution yet again. You should know the drill already.
>>341263265
Virtual reality obviously. Kids will eat this shit up and beg their parents for it.
>>341260294
>"good VR" solutions such as the Oculus Rift
>>341261984
But it's already worse than the best PC. GPU output is 6 teraflops and a 1080 beats it . It's gonna be a mid range. PC by the time it comes out but it'll be way to expensive to justify not building your own PC
>Thinkining that a CONSOLE next year will push 4K gaming when even current gen FLAGSHIP cards don't manage it very well
Every time they fucking play you like clockwork, its so amazing to see it happening again.
>>341263332
>They'll probably get 4K, but be stuck on 30 FPS and gimped graphics for the sake of resolution yet again.
Not really. 10TFLOPS is pretty damn powerful. That's more powerful than a single Fury X and the Fury X can run quite a few games at 4k ~30fps. Don't forget about the additional optimization efforts consoles get as well.
>>341263416
>VR
But they can get VR way sooner than the Scorpio, for most likely less money than the Scorpio, since most of them own PS4s already.
PSVR would have to fail spectacularly for people to jump ship and buy both a $500-600 console and a VR headset, whatever that might cost at the time of the Scorpio's launch.
It'll still be stuck with MS's shitty franchises, so it really doesn't matter.
>>341262687
Phil spencer said 4k gaming , idk if he meant 1080p up scaled or legitimate 4k gaming. If the latter this thing will cost too much and be DOA
>>341260294
>all those TFLOPs
>and still no games
>>341263732
>these fuckers forced me to go on stage again fucking assholes
>>341263197
>This is the first major mid life refresh of a console.
No we have seen companies try this type of thing with addons that were cheaper than buying a whole new console and people didn't do it. We saw with the dsi and new 3ds they didn't sell as much as their predecessors and fucking no one took advantage of their new hardware
It doesn't work
>You underestimate the potential of VR
But potential isn't an argument here. A casual fan of video games will not be putting down $800 to play a few tech demos
You know what had potential and MS poured money in? Begins with K ends with T
>>341264006
With the 3ds it practically nothing new to offer except a more stable fps in some games and maybe better visuals. The difference between the refresh consoles and the current consoles is massive. It would be a worthwhile upgrade for anyone willing to spend the money, just like a new graphics card will be a worth while upgrade if you where previously running a gpu that could barely hit 30 fps at 900p but you upgrade to one which gets you a nice locked 1080p60.
>kinect
That was MS own thing. They tried to sell their own product but it flopped. The fact that all the major developers in partnership with VR hardware producers and console manufacturers are all targeting a VR future proves it has some potential.
Where can i buy a Scorpio? When will it be available?
>>341260294
you cant even do 4k properly on PC with single graphics card
this is going to be a huge disaster
>>341260756
>Steam
>>341262296
I own all of the ps2 gen consoles and hate my ps2, literally a sly/ratchet machine.
It won't play games in 4K unless the visuals are PS3 quality or like some Xbox One games that are the equivalent of low settings on PC.
320GB/s of memory bandwidth is the same amount the R9 290X had in 2013
Undisclosed 8 core processor which means it's not Zen, they would have said stuff about the CPU upgrade if it was Zen, meaning it's Jaguar again, probably at 2GHz to 2.5GHz. Still shit compared to an i5 or i7.
The board they showed in their mockup had a memory memory configuration that suggested 12GB of RAM. By the end of 2017 we'll have HBM2 cards with 8GB and beyond at 1TB/s of memory bandwidth.
The Scorpio will be more outdated when it launches than the PS4 was in fall of 2013.
>>341260294
>how to kill the scorpio:
>maker a cheaper playstation like what happened with ps2
So hard, sony got brand recognition and a won generation all they need to do is not repeat the ps3 Blunder
>>341260294
Good move from Microsoft DESU,
Poorfaggots can stick to their Xbox One and enjoy terrible resolutions and framerates while people with jobs can sail through the silky smooth VR waves.
>>341260294
>6 teraflops
>0 exclusives
#OnlyOnXbox
>>341266632
>I'm a sonygger pulling shit out of my ass
Yeah I'm going to trust Microsoft more on the specifications of computing hardware since they basically rely on computers to produce money.
>>341267007
>not addressing anything I said
Nice deflection
The GTX 1180 Ti will be on the market before the Xbox One Scorpio is, will probably be close to 20 Teraflops.
>>341267769
>will be out
>next year 2007 fall
>1180 ti will be out
Nope
>close to 20 tflops
So how many does PS Neo have?
>>341263615
To be fair, when the 7th gen launched they were on par with top of the line PCs. But then again, if they go that route again we can expect to see
>$599
The best quality pixels, guys.
>>341260294
>How can Sony even compete?
With even moresmoke
>>341263332
>probably
Just shut the fuck up.
>>341260294
Microsoft wants to be peerless but I can't imagine 4K that isn't compromised in some fashion. Shit's just not that powerful.
Can you build a PC with the same graphical power of current gen consoles with the same budget as they cost? honest question now
This whole refresh thing made me uneasy about console gaming and i might just jump the ship to PC because spending another few hundred obamas for a mid-gen upgrade seems like a bad idea.
>>341268003
The GTX 1080Ti will be out this fall, and the regular GTX 1080. The Fury X was rated at 8.6TFOPs by AMD, so the Scorpio is 50% weaker than a video card that is already a year old.
>>341268018
lmao
no they weren't
>>341260756
vr porn in the living room.
>>341266632
>320GB/s of memory bandwidth is the same amount the R9 290X had in 2013
Bandwidth isn't as big of a deal as it was some years ago due to memory compression and delta color compression improvements. We can take nothing out of the bandwidth figures because we don't know what kind of technologies amd or microsoft will be using.
>Undisclosed 8 core processor which means it's not Zen
That precisely means it is Zen. It's not realised yet so they can't publicly announced they're using it. If it was still jaguar cores they'd straight up say it instead of keeping it quiet.
>The board they showed in their mockup had a memory memory configuration that suggested 12GB of RAM. By the end of 2017 we'll have HBM2 cards with 8GB and beyond at 1TB/s of memory bandwidth.
Again, you can't take anything from this. Bandwidth only really comes into play at very high resolutions and settings which use up a lot of bandwidth like anti aliasing or ambient occlusion. Consoles always use custom settings for games so there will probably never be a time where a game is bandwidth limited on console.
>The Scorpio will be more outdated when it launches
Its using at least an 480x which is a midrange mainstream card right now. There won't be any new cards to replace the 480x till the 580x comes out in another 2/3 years time. It'll be a midrange console at release unlike the ps4 which was way outdated.
>>341267769
Are you thick? The 1180 ti won't be out for like 4 years.
Need some clarification.
There was something mentioned about playing xbox games on PC. Now do i still need to own the console to play xbox game on the PC? How does it work?
>>341269464
The fury x is outdated garbage. A gtx 980 ti is 6.1 tflops and if amd have fixed up their cards with polaris then the 480x should be way more efficient than the 9 tflop fury x.
>>341261876
$600 will kill them. Sony is launching ata lower cost. xbox one was dead before because it was underpowered and more expensive. sony can get away with a win if its underpowered if it's at least the cheaper option.
They have no choice but to sell it at a loss if they plan to best sony
>>341269592
>Expecting to run an overclocked 480 in an enclosed shitty-airflow case
>Expecting a 480x to push 4K
Console kiddies, everyone
>>341269592
>That precisely means it is Zen. It's not realised yet so they can't publicly announced they're using it
What? Zen is already announced and its features have been disclosed. If the Scorpio had a CPU upgrade they would definitely have mentioned it.
>Bandwidth only really comes into play at very high resolutions and settings
And they're targeting 4K gaming dumbass
>It'll be a midrange console at release unlike the ps4 which was way outdated.
Every video card will be on HBM2 when the Scorpio comes out. When the PS4 released the most powerful GPU on the market was the R9 290X which was maybe 2-3x faster than the PS4 GPU. A year and a half is a long time in the GPU world.
In a year and a half everyone on PC will be laughing at the supposed power of the Scorpio just as they did with the PS4 when it was 50% more powerful than the Xbox One.
>>341270334
>sell at a loss
>budget tier components
>$600
Spotted the retard
>>341269958
You buy the game once and play it on both xbox one and pc without having to buy a 2nd copy
>>341269464
>The gtx 1080ti will be out this fall
No, It will be out next fall, 1080/1070 production hasn't even reached the state where there's actual supply. Please stop being this retarded, 980ti's only launched last year in June, 980's have been out for 2 years. Nvidia follow a schedule for releasing hardware that's pretty consistent. They aren't going to push the schedule forward just because you're a delusional sonygger.
>>341270875
>Fury X is already a year old
>8.6TFLOPs
>Scorpio comes out in 2 years
>6TFLOPs
nuff said
>>341270696
>Catalog
Awesome thanks.
>>341271341
>2 years
2017 is next year you fucktard.
>>341261620
>Avergae Joes never buy these small upgrades in mass
Tell that to all those people buying the latest hip new phones.
>>341271539
Q4 2017, which will probably slip to 2018.
>Latest GPUs are in excess of 6TFLOPs
>Can't push 4K reliably
>definately can't push 4K at reliable FPS required for VR
>Scorpio is somehow meant to do this
>>341271539
It is going to have a November release, so it's closer to 2 years than 1 year, dumbass.
It's going to be very amusing seeing all the new Nvidia marketing dumping on this "high-end console"
>>341270478
>What? Zen is already announced and its features have been disclosed. If the Scorpio had a CPU upgrade they would definitely have mentioned it.
if it didn't have a cpu upgrade why wouldn't they mention it? sony mentioned they're keeping the jaguar cores. also its pretty much confirmed via amd's own representatives that it's using the new zen cpu
>And they're targeting 4K gaming dumbass
and if you read the rest of my post i explained why, retard. a gtx 980 ti can run most games at 4k 30 fps with no anti aliasing and it has a similar amount of bandwidth as the scorpio. there will be no bandwith bottlenecks for the scorpio.
>Every video card will be on HBM2 when the Scorpio comes out. When the PS4 released the most powerful GPU on the market was the R9 290X which was maybe 2-3x faster than the PS4 GPU. A year and a half is a long time in the GPU world.
no it won't. only the very high end rx rage and the gtx 1080 ti will have hbm 2 come holiday next year. the 1080 will still have its gddr5x, the 1070 will still have gddr5 and so will the 480x. your statement is completely false.
>>341263148
>natively run """""games""""" in 4K
I imagine it will run some non-demanding indie games in 4k and that will be the catch
Im actually intrigued as to what kind of technological wizzardy they are planning to come up with to make 4K games run natively on the Scorpio when high end GPUs cant even do it effectively all alone.
>>341271341
a 980 ti is 6 tflops, a gtx 1070 is 6.5 tflops and the xbox scorpio is 6.2 tflops. what's your point?
>>341271341
>Fury X
>8.6 tflops
>>341271672
>Q4 2017
By your logic the Fury X is brand new because it just released 6 months ago. Because time passes by just they way you want.
Also even if that is true,
>>341271959
>It's closer to 2 years than one year
Novermber is fucking 5 months away though, and considering a year has 12 months it's a factual fallacy to pretend that 1 year and 5 months is equal to 2 years.
>>341272718
That none of those can push 4K reliably unless they're meme pixelart games.
>>341272667
Its more marketing wizardry than technological.
4K native pixelshit games, upscaled dynamic resolutions for everything else that ends up being ~1080p/1440p for gameplay.
Watch RROD come back haha
>>341262687
They'll get the highest quality pixels. No compression
>>341272667
It can be easily achieved by changing the way they develop games since all console '''optimization''' is basically just juggling various shit around
Now
>next gen consoles run things at pretty low resolution and framerate, barely any anti aliasing
>layer on lots of effects like blur to hide the ugliness of the the core textures
Scorpio/Neo
>focus on having 4k resolution
>just have less post processing effects and basically just lower everything else instead
>>341272957
The xbox scorpio isn't pushing 4K, it's pushing VR. There's a difference.
It says it's CAPABLE OF OUTPUTTING 4K VIDEO, not that it's capable of outputting 4K for gaming. There's a difference.
>>341272807
Fury X launched July of 2015.
>>341274129
It's June right now,
365 days have not passed since the release of the Fury X in June 24, 2015.
Lets play fast and loose with figures, 2017 was 5 years ago.
>should power 4K Ultra HD, 1080p @ 60 Hz HDR
>should
>muh TFLOPS
lel, is this the new bits? fuck off
>>341272957
look at the green line for both of the cards. they get well over 30 fps which is what the xbox scorpio will be targeting at 4k.
>>341275349
what do you know about TFLOP?
>>341275547
>"fifteen game average"
wew friend
there isn't a single GPU that can run games like Witcher 3 or GTA in 4k@30 with high settings and AA
also it's a retarded gimmick resolution that's useless unless you own a fucking cinema or something. 1080p is completely fine for anything under 60"
>>341275547
Yeah because they get 60fps in source engine games, and 10fps on any game with a modern engine, os that averages out to 30 over fifteen games
>>341276993
Wrong
>>341263149
Native 4K on the menus wohoooo!
>>341276993
Wrong,
>>341276993
Wrong again
>>341273723
Nope, they literally said 4K gaming.
>>341276993
2160p is 4K moron,
There are 9 cards there that can handle 4K @ 30fps
>>341275547
Thats with an excellent CPU, just so you know.
Not an extremely poorly cooled console-tier AMD cpu.
>>341278816
They didn't say 60fps, a 390x can handle 30fps @ 4K and that card is more than 2 years old. I expect with new architecture this won't even be debatable that it can hold a steady 40-50fps @4k
>>341278912
bump that gtx 970 to 1500 mhz and you'll gain those 5 fps and even more.
>>341279038
>I know the future
What if they put in Intel Xeons?
They didn't announce any manufacturers did they?
Been going with Sony since they sold VCRs. However these recent moves, and the shift to "every game has to be Uncharted" is making me question this. If the Xbone gets some decent games and all of this stuff is true, I may end up getting an Xbox, something that I've never done before.
>>341279125
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PglwxGCibn4
This is with an i7.
>>341279347
>What if they put in Intel Xeons?
Console delusion
AT ITS FINEST
>>341260294
>4k console gaming when the current gen cant even play native 1080 at a stable rate of 30 fps let alone 60 fps.
Seriously the best option is to just play on PC mainly and buy a second hand PS4 for the Exclusives and Weebshit that doesnt end up on PC
>>341260294
>How can Sony even compete?
How could Nes even compete?
How could Psone even compete?
How could Ps2 even compete?
>>341279621
>>4k console gaming when the current gen cant even play native 1080 at a stable rate of 30 fps let alone 60 fps.
Are you retarded? So just because 6th gen couldn't even manage 720p they shouldn't have made the jump to 1080p?
>>341276993
>People this stupid exist
wew
>>341279509
see
>>341278446
Those benchmarks are old before mature drivers.
>>341279509
>They must be the SAME CPU REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE NO ADVANCEMENT ALLOWED
Even if it was AMD it doesn't make sense to go for an antiquated more expensive node just to satisfy your sonyggery.
>>341279038
>excellent cpu
the xbox is using a zen cpu which is speculated to be around sandy bridge levels of performance. if this is true you're effectively getting i5 2500 performance with 8 cores. that's like 10x more powerful than the jaguar shit they have now.
also
>xbox one
>poorly cooled
the fan takes up a quarter of the whole case
>>341279405
They somehow turned god of war into a last of us spin off.
>>341280273
I find it hilarious that you think thats a good cooling solution.
Its like a slightly enlarged stock cooler you get thrown in with your CPU.
>>341260294
> How can Sony even compete?
Because devs have to develop the same games for the piece of shit hardware of the current Xbone
>>341280539
Well with 14 nm process the TDP will be laughably low considering the RX 480 doesn't even consume 100w
>>341280229
>sonyggery
Hardly, friend. Got to slap down the console tards when they get too upitty and claim they can run all kinds of shit they won't be able to.
>>341280539
you forget that the consoles are using underclocked (see:underclocked) variants of the jaguar cpu which naturally means it will be cooler.
>>341281035
Any advancement would only allow PC to pull further ahead.
>>341281176
Meaning they'll run even worse than claimed. Nice argument.
>>341263732
Exactly. What do I want this for? Another Gears of War? Forza? Some exclusive sports game? KI?
All thi power and not a single game I care for. Is all brotastic interactive movies.
>>341281372
>Meaning they'll run even worse than claimed
no one said otherwise, retard. why do you think the equivalent pc hardware of the ps4 runs way better in a desktop system? it's because both the gpu and cpu are underclocked. with the neo they'll be increasing the jaguar cpu to 2.1 ghz.
>>341281372
>PC will pull further ahead
Nobody is saying PC won't be further ahead. You can buy a 9tflop card right now off the shelf for $600, but it puts VR and 4K in the hands of console plebs, and that can only be good for PC gamers considering everything PC gamers get is basically a console port.
>>341277867
You think a 400 dollar console will have a GPU stronger than the 980 ti / Titan X?
Also by the time it comes out GTA V will be what, fucking 5 years old?
>>341281838
If you're claiming it'll push 4K then you're saying otherwise.
Current cards can't run 4K @ 60, so why will an underclocked version pull it off?
Christ, you console tards really are something else.
>>341260294
>muh teraflops
I really wish console kiddies would stop. You kids have absolutely no idea what you are talking about and are falling for obvious marketing ploys.
>>341260294
Still weaker than pc.
>>341282087
It will by next year.
The $200 RX 480 is already here. A RX 490 will easily be 30-40% faster.
>GTA V will be 5 years old?
GTA V was first released on the previous gen of consoles, there hasn't been that much graphical advancement and will probably be less than that,
I don't think you understand the concept of diminishing returns when it comes to Graphics.
>>341282171
Why does it have to be 60fps?
9-10 current cards run games at 4K at over 30fps
60fps is a PC luxury and always has been. The 60 fps games will just use 1080 or 1440p instead.
>>341282171
i was talking about the current consoles you spastic. they were all underclocked because of amd's shit housefire tech and they had to meet a specific power consumption and heat output target. the new consoles using the new tech which are on a smaller node will allow the console manufacturers to achieve that same power consumption and heat output target with better hardware because of the increased efficiency of the new hardware. also going by the specs it looks like the xbox will be using an overclocked 480x.
>console tards
i bet i have a better pc than you, faggot.
