>Chilton: In the past, there was no archiving of older data. So while we have the capability of doing that now, and in more recent years when we make changes we can ‘version’ the data, we didn’t have that back in 2004. And so as data changed, we effectively lost that stuff to history. And so we would have to go back and try to reverse-engineer it ourselves.
Legacy servers fags are literally BTFO
>>341026268
All I am seeing is "We're too fucking lazy"
http://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44218
>First, they DO have the source code for Vanilla WoW. Code version control systems are not something new, as it has been a standard in the industry for a long time. With these systems, they can retrieve the code at any given previous backup date.
>However, in order to generate the server (and the client), a complex build system is being used. It is not just about generating the “WoW.exe” and “Server.exe” files. The build process takes data, models, maps, etc. created by Blizzard and also generates client and server specific files. The client only has the information it needs and the server only has the information that it needs.
>This means that before re-launching vanilla realms, all of the data needed for the build processes has to be gathered in one place with the code. Not all of this information was under a version control system. In the end, whichever of these parts were lost at any point, they will have to be recreated: this is likely to take a lot of resources through a long development process.
The difficulty of such a task depends on what exactly "the data" is and at which point they introduced "the data" to the version control system. For example, in one of the interviews they mentioned they have the source code but are missing the data required by build environment that would build both the client and the server (it's >>341026681 actually) and while they can't just run make or whatever build tool they used at the time, it's not difficult to accurately reconstruct things like server-side movement maps from client-side data, as evidenced by it already having been done.
If "the data" goes beyond such things and includes things like mob databases (even the mob AI and other "scripting", if Blizzard implemented it similarly to how SmartAI works in Trinitycore), it would certainly be a non-trivial task, but it's worth remembering that up until Cataclysm pre-patch almost every mob was there unchanged and it wouldn't be too difficult to make a list of changes, ranging from Defias Pillagers being nerfed to the addition of House of Edune event and NPCs in 2.3 patch (http://wow.gamepedia.com/House_of_Edune), and reverse those changes. Hell, some of the most critical aspects of the game (such as raid boss scripting and values) are even in retail, and unchanged with few exceptions. Also, some of the details that have been lost in time for the rest of us, should be easy for Blizzard to re-implement (for example, Blizzard had a formula, one that no one has reverse-engineered, to assign stats to mobs based on their level and class, and aside from some individual mobs having a percentage-based modifier, Blizzard could get the correct stats and attributes to the lot of them).
Depending on what those ambiguous statements actually mean, it might be a good bit of work, but it's far from insurmountable.
>>341026681
>Words of biased criminal against words of respectable developer
Isn't WoWs damage and stuff dependent on a mathematical equation that scales with levels or some shit like that
>>341028882
>respectable developer
>>341028978
It is an RPG, yes.
>>341027627
Problem is that if they barely can crank out content for the current game without there being a drought then how do they have the time to work on legacy?
I think that's he problem because they can't pull anyone off the current game and its not like they have teams sitting around with their thumbs up their ass.
They gotta pull time and resources off of something to make these. And right now I can see why they are not jumping at it since they struggle with the game now.
>>341027627
>>341026268
Remember, we are talking about the same people who previously claimed they had lost the source code (while, just like they themselves mention is the interview, was almost unthinkable because version control systems were a thing). Maybe it's because Nostalrius sent their community managers and admins and other non-technical people who don't know shit and as such can't make a proper summary of what Blizzard said in their interview, but to me it sounds like a stalling tactic. If, for example, Blizzard had had mob "scripting" and other such details in now-lost database and their earliest backups available are from MoP (so no pre-Cata Azeroth databases for you), they probably would have said "the data" is outright unrecoverable, so I can't help but to read that statement as "we don't have the databases as-is, but we do have the means to accurately reproduce their state in any given patch with moderate amount of work"
>>341028978
It's (or, was) an RPG so of course the combat resolution is based on numbers. The functionality of player abilities would have been in the server software and (as anyone with sense could already knew) it's now been confirmed the source code for the server software is there in version control system and they could trivially restore any state it has ever been in.
As for mob damage, I've been researching this and I have a very strong reason to believe Blizzard had a formula for assigning stats (including str/agi/sta/int attributes) for mobs (makes sense, there's thousands of them), apparently based on their class, level and optional modifier. Almost every mob appears to have used the formula as-is but there are some definite exceptions, like Kadak Kodobane hitting for several times more than his level 14 peers (http://www.wowhead.com/npc=3394/barak-kodobane#comments:id=227917) and if pre-Cata mob databases were lost, those modifiers would be difficult to figure out (most of the mobs have their values in WoW Bestiary, tho).
>>341028978
There's still constants in the "equations" and all their constants are in a database. So a fireball might deal x + s*y damage where x and y are constants in a database and s is the character's intellect or some shit like that. The x and y is what's lost.
The database also contains all the skill cooldowns, all NPC healths, etc.
Putting these values in databases is what allows them to hotfix stuff without rebooting the servers. If Onyxia suddenly deep breaths more they can just raise the cooldown in the database and the next time Onyxia checks to see if her deep breath is off cooldown it'll have a longer cooldown, no rebooting or patching required.
>>341026268
>In the past, there was no archiving of older data
This is the biggest lie I've ever read in my life. No company in the world for the past 25+ years hasn't used some forms of version control.
Blizzard is a company of constant damage control.
>>341031473
Version controlling databases isn't nearly as common as version controlling code. The article specifically said they had VCS of their code but nothing for their database when they were starting out.
>>341026268
>Chilton: In the past, there was no archiving of older data
>>341031473
Version control for source goes for granted, despite their previous lies they've now confirmed the source is still there, but databases might be a bit iffier, and binary data more so (think of 1GB "KalimdorMovementMaps.map" blob)
Of course, since they say "data", we don't have a clue about what exactly they are missing and from when their earliest point of recoverable "data" is (for example, if databases were lost but they had them from 3.3.5a, it wouldn't be a major hurdle to reverse changes such as pre-instance mobs being turned to non-elites in 2.3).
>>341031865
They shut down private servers before, they shut down nostalrius. Then they had a meeting with nost, they know they don't have to do jack shit. They will now lord this petty string over until WoW drops shy of a million people. Which they don't have to do diddly shit now, because the warcraft movie succeeded in the sense that it will bring back people. People will buy legion. They will play it, 6 month rise and fall. The cycle repeats. Everyone goes back to their lives. Blizzard sheds another million down and preps the next expansion. Soon as they get under that million they will begin to sweat slightly then pose legacy servers absolute bare min last minute and be the new runescape.
